/lit/ - Literature

>>23198309
Asia isn't a subcontinent; India is. India is literally on a tectonic plate that's getting shoved into Asia.

I broke out the backup word processor and she needs a bath on the inside. I did not plan on doing this tomorrow.

Flensing a lady you know is a tedious endeavor. I don't think I have my best drivers upstairs. She's worth cash value now so I have to do it right. Keep that skin clean and the little buttons from burning in the face of God and brak-kleen, miraculous though it is. It also smells like fernet branca and a lot of goddamn work next to the mint patch. I should just fix the clutch on the selectric, that's one of gods own prototypes right there. Throws me a random dash every now and then, the hateful clattering bitch I love her.

What could be some things a highly competent person (like Azula) would do that would make superiors uncomfortable with giving them command?

I wanted the sort of psycho firebender vibe with a person but they don't have nepotism to get them ahead despite their immense firepower and skill

>>23199691
They make other psycho friends. There are layers to that shit, don't ask me how I know.

>>23199656
Looks cleaner than the ones I see in the antique stores.

>>23199703
Sticky keys everywhere. They even hang mid travel. It needs a bath in brake cleaner.

>>23199696
but what if there are no other psycho buddies?

>>23199725
You imagined someone who is unable to make "friends" or get command. Figure it out yourself. Even Azula had "friends".

>>23199730
Guess there will always be one or two suckers to intimidate

>>23199718
i guess looks can be deceiving

EW WRITING IS EXHAUSTING AND NOT ALWAYS FUN

>>23199743
then you need a different hobby

>>23199691
That depends. Are the people above them in command also pricks? Because the first thought that comes to mind is someone willing to make sacrifice plays that win battles.
One can argue about if sending 5 guys to their deaths is justified by the fact that the plan would otherwise risk the deaths of 50, but people hate that sort of cruel calculus, regardless of right and wrong.

>>23199765
People in command of the unit he helps are not pricks and are actually sort of a paladin order.

The Psycho fire kid is not given command at first, and they actually actively dislike sacrifice plays.

An idea came to me recently that they'd be ferocious in combat but are not as realizing that others can't keep up the ferocity.

Or maybe people might be concerned about his blood lust. That might be a good thing too.

can i talk to Travis?

need a free writing course that's not just teaching common sense

How do your characters develop?
>Two protagonists
>One starts the story as a withdrawn and wandering martial artist focused solely on revenge for having his left hand ripped off, as well as held back by his extremely restrictive childhood that damaged his sense of self worth.
>Ends the story in a weird way as he's rediscovered the spark that drove him to fight once more.
>The other starts out as what amounts to a child soldier. A genetic freak, forged into a terrifying martial artist by monstrous parents who have mysterious motivations. Wants to enjoy her life but is so god damn paranoid she can't
>Ends up breaking out of her mindset and even grows her hair out to show she isn't afraid anymore
Two broken individuals finding a master-student relationship that helps them both grow as people

>>23200207
My favorite of my character arcs is the girl who gets over her hatred of candy

>have hundreds of pages of a story drafted in my head
>I really like it and want to explore it more
>no time to write it because I'm busy posting a web novel that's nowhere near finished
This is torture.

>>23199796
I think that them being too good at their job and others being unable to keep up so they push them too hard is a good way to write it.
And with that, the reasoning could be anything, but be seen as just zealous fervor which some in the order see as a positive.

I am keeping a record of every magazine that discriminates against me (women only, Blacks submit free, etc.) There is no place for this shit in literature.

How the fuck do you come up with names? I can't stand naming characters. I'm writing fantasy and everything sounds too plain or too try hard. I can do titles, nicknames, even things like races or countries but actual people names? Impossible. I've been writing for the last two hundred pages with placeholder names that I stole from whoever inspired the character or I just happened to think of at the time. I can't stand the names. I need to come up with proper names or I'll lose my mind but all the names I come up with are cringe to the max.

>>23200847
That depends on where they are from.
The main kingdom? I go with normal names, sometimes mixed up, but generally try to avoid biblical names because those are more associated with the theocracy next door.
So for instance I have Jaramis, coming from Jeremiah, but changed out the Es for As, and swapped the AH with an S.
For the goatmen it's basically all made up.
Ar for men, Ur for women.
So, Ar'Kass, which is the shortform of Ar'Kassivirum is one of them, and another is Ur'Kel, which is just the name Urkel.
One dogman is named Jakel, which is just Jackel.
Another race has French names, the Minotaurs have Greek names, Tau, Archon, etc.
I think my favorite would be the desert people, who I used either direct Hispanic or Middle Eastern names, or I mix the two.
Del is a common name, or at least one that I've heard, so I just stuck Met at the end from Bahamut, an Arabic dragon, same with Rosamet. And yes, I know that it is Mut not Met, but Rosamut doesn't sound as nice.
Have some confidence in what you call your characters, and find a theme based on their culture.

How hard would w*stoids seethe over the inclusion of slavery in anything but an absolutely negative light? I want to use it as a gatekeeper for the isekai story I'm writing.

I'm thinking early on, there's a revolutionary bandit group that's rebeling against the nobility and the status quo. One of their leaders is (reincarnate or native) basically a parody of the "always right" Stong Female Character taken to its most sociopathic extremes. After the MC crushes the revolutionary plot (there are bigger fish to fry than some bad practices among the nobility), rather than prison she becomes the MC's slave. And, in due time, part of the harem.

>>23200847

Trying using a naming convention to add more symbolism. Rebirth is a theme in my novel so I'm using names connected with being reborn/rebirth.

>>23200966
>How hard would w*stoids seethe over the inclusion of slavery in anything but an absolutely negative light?
It's an interesting topic though not something you need consider for a fucking isekai.

If anyone needs cheap editing or punch ups, reply to this post. We just finished polishing a great sci-fi short story, but someone is taking a while to finish writing his horror novel and send it back

>>23201045
So basically, just DO IT and who gives a fuck about w*stoid morals?

>>23200966
Slavery is a thing of beauty compared to your "ironic" incel wish-fulfillment slop.

>>23201060
>incel
Woman brained w*stoid right here. Always comes down to holes and access to them when they can't actually form a coherent and consistent opinion.

>>23201049
Who is 'we'? That's what a lone gunman says when the hostage negotiator calls the office phone.

>>23201071
my coffee and I

>>23201055
Yeah, go for it.

>>23201069
>aarrgghh I hate women so much but they owe me sex
Touch grass, sad little man

>>23201154
>aarrgghh I hate women so much but they owe me sex
This but uniroincally

>>23201154
How many times are you going to bring up your holes, that? Is that all you're able to think about?

Does anyone here have any information about children's books? I wrote a short story that I think could be adapted, but I have no art experience, and from what I read as a child, illustration are important.

>>23201240
If you don't know an illustrator nor are one, then aim for an age range where illustrations are no longer necessary.

>>23201334
I guess I could toss it up on Amazon now.
The story is probably more suited for the 10 to 13 audience, since the basis is a Goldfish swimming up stream to get a wish to revive her dead son.

I love writing in every way (besides documents), but I don't have something specific I want to write about. Is there a suitable job for this other than ghost writer?

>>23201240
Git gud with AI prompts and you're done.

>>23201546
Maybe I'll try to put up two versions of it. One for younger kids with a slightly modified story (healing her son rather than needing to revive him) and AI art.
Guess I'll need to set up image generation on my PC, since I've only ever done it through online sources.

>>23200021
is there even a paid course that does this? and so much of it is subjective anyway.
writing schools should be run like dojos or something, where it's just THEIR style. that was pseuds can't argue (unless they walk in and break the sign and challenge the founder to a duel)

How would you rewrite this description to make someone want to read it?

Gilbert Vergo is a typical minimum wage working man living in Eugene, Oregon, who’s down on his luck, and trying to find his own path in the world. Then one day the world literally comes to smash down his door, and pull him outside to an insane Circus where he is center stage due to the fact that he is the only follower on the internet of Ultra-tripleX, the perpetrator behind the mass shooting at a Fraternity’s Halloween party in the college town Shaker Krista in California. Gilbert is accused for being an accessory, having foreknowledge of the events, and did nothing about it. With the help of his ex-girlfriend and a group calling themselves the League of Liberty, Gilbert attempts to fight and prove his innocence. But in an era where society desperately needs to point a finger at who is to blame for horrific acts of violence, it will be harder for Gilbert to do so.

>>23201540
Editor?

>>23201922
Way too many nouns and way too forward. As Voltaire said, the easiest way to bore someone is to explain everything.

Here, allow me.

>In the city of Eugene, there lives an ordinary man with an ordinary life. When he finally attempts to carve his own path into the world, his efforts are met only with vitriol. Accused of a crime that he did not commit, Gilbert is violently ripped from his path and forced to face the angry mob head on. Only then will Gilbert see that when the finger of society points and shouts 'kill!', there almost nothing anyone can stop it. *Almost* nothing.

Not perfect, as I whipped it up in 5 mins, but you get the idea.

>>23201540
If you like writing anything why don't you just pick something? Why do you need someone to tell you what (ghost writer) if it doesn't matter?
Since you specifically said 'suitable job', just research the market and pick something highly salable (romance, erotica, litrpg are the easiest to break into as self pub)
Or do you mean you're bad at coming up with ideas? Otherwise I don't get it

>>23201922
most don't want to read about some passive schmuck. is that all he is? 'it could happen to anyone' doesn't need to be the main theme, does it?

Talked to my sister. She's against me killing off the protagonist at the end even though it completes the arc because she's completely obsessed with wholesome sibling relationships.

>>23200847
It took me 3 years to finally decide on a name for my main character that I found acceptable.

The name is Punch.

I don't know how to come up with good names either.

>>23201922
>But in an era where society desperately needs to point a finger at who is to blame for horrific acts of violence
Sounds like it could be good if to expose how crooked blue city DAs/prosecutors are, shitty otherwise. Also a bunch of nerds on the Internet could never influence a trial legitimately unless they were countering not-Antifa trying to intimidate the jury.

>>23200207
Everyone except my main protagonist develops.
>>23200460
Sounds fun.

>>23202182
>Everyone except my main protagonist develops.
Is character development really necessary? My story does involve a wagie and a boss who hates him, but nothing is as it seems and something terrible happens to the protagonist about 60% of the way through.

What would be some good negatives to modified super soldier kids?

I was thinking the flaws would be more in their personality traits as that is something the creator neglected and didn't care much about

>>23202203
>Is character development really necessary?
It depends.

>>23200847
I just think of what sounds good.
Lape Agit is the protagonist of my story.

>>23202066

What’s a good place to go to get an idea for a story to write?

>>23201984
Yeah, I mean I'm bad at coming up with ideas. The best I've done came from requests "I want a story like this, with characters like that." or writing with scenarios/characters that already exist (IRL or in fiction).
I really don't have a clue (nor the will) on how to start something from scratch, for some reason.

>>23202403
your head

>>23202403
read many books, remember/note aspects you've enjoyed, then come up with your own stuff to utilize those aspects

gonna give up any ounce of respect in myself and pen a genre romance. pen em like pulp, grinding them out one by one. romance alone on KU has like 1.2 billion readers, mixing with the 600m fantasy/sci-fi makes sense. i don't want to be broke anymore bros

Can i talk to Travis?

Got the itch to start writing again after a year-long hiatus... just staring at a blank screen not knowing what I want to write or how. It used to come so easily to me but now I feel very lost. I have a rough idea of the story and some surface-level characters in my head but I don't know where to start writing. By fleshing out character concepts, building the world, laying out the plot, just jumping in and writing a scene? I just keep coming up with more and more questions about my characters and plot that I don't have answers to and feel very stuck.

Why do you guys mostly write genre fiction? Why are there only like three niggas writing literary fiction? And even if you're going to write genre fiction, why do you put so little care into the prose, the language? You act like it's some burdensome requirement to tell your story but in many ways it IS the story. It IS the medium.

Basically, if you don't care about writing, why are you writing? Make a radio play or something.

>>23202389
Let me explain.
>Starts out as a withdrawn, one-track minded revenge seeking martial artist with a ton of unresolved issues
>Comes into contact with abused martial arts prodigy
>Slowly starts forging bond with kid as they both fight through a 32-man tournament, get a really good big brother/little sister dynamic
>Slowly starts to rediscover his spirit
>Semifinals, he's ready to take revenge on the guy who maimed him 2 years ago
>Still loses and is in critical condition despite nearly having it in the bag
>The truth comes to light while he's on the hospital bed, realizes that this was all so this monk motherfucker could gaslight the kid into his apprentice
>Despite his heavy injuries, he confronts the guy just as he's about to finish his gaslighting
>Proceeds to flat-out kill the motherfucker but dies from said injuries shortly afterwards
She hated it because she said it didn't "Serve the story"

>>23202205
What's the rationale behind having them be kids? Are you writing to appeal to a young target audience or is there a in-narrative justification for it?

>>23202754
I don't think it fits either. I'm not really sure about anything after the protagonist loses his second fight with his adversary. Throw the reveal in, sure, but the ending seems a bit weak. Almost pointless.

Any advice for building up a work ethic/discipline for writing? Getting to the point where I can separate writing and editing always fills my mouth with the taste of vomit, and I can’t seem to get into a flow whenever I write and leave it as is. Am I supposed to leave the flow state for when I edit?

Is there a method to getting over your intense disappointment with your prose so that you can focus on writing?

Any good resources to help with planning and writing complex mysteries? Thinking of writing a Danganronpa fanfic.

>>23202782
A first draft is a first draft. As shit as it may be, it's a work in process and nobody else will see it. Go back and edit little sections here and there if the inspiration arises, otherwise wait until the draft is done. It's easier to work with words when there's lot to move around, cut and re-write. Editing while your writing is too slow, for me at least. It's the second draft which drags, editing scene by scene. Though you know where you're at when you're going through chronologically and being forced to reread everything is useful. After that, the third draft should just be tinkering.

>>23202205
they are mentally unstable, they go crazy

>>23202700
I always struggle with where to start a story if I do too much work on the setting. You create a whole world and could drop the narrative with any character at any point in the timeline. How do you choose?

>>23199599
I heard the bones are their money

>>23202742
youre surprised resentful writers aren't happy to have to churn out crap to pander in sales? of course people are writing, there's a gold rush still happening at Kindle Unlimited and authors making crazy figures. people want a slice of the pie and they want to do it with the skills they already got

>>23202835
This has so little to do with my post that I'm actually frightened for you.

>>23202066
I know I'm probably going to get some shit for it, but there can be no ending to my story that fits the themes of both the story and my MC that don't end up with him dead.
He's lived much of his life wanting a good death, to redeem himself for all of the lives he has taken, to finally wash away the guilt by saving everyone.

>>23202205
To add to the classic mental instability, explain why. To say that the process made them that way is one thing, and it isn't bad on it's face, but I have more interest in nurture than nature.
If someone realizes at a young age that they are strong enough that only a few people can actually make them do what they are told, they turn into monsters.
Within my own story my MC is saved from this by the morals given to him by his family before he had any understanding of what he was.
This is a good conversation between an older Vampire and the MC who is still only about 14 at the time; I cringe a little at my earlier writing, but bear with it.

>>23202848
How does a "good" death result in redemption, whatever "good" may mean? If a murderer killed someone I knew, and decided to die on their own terms, I frankly would be pissed and not at all feeling like the murderer has redeemed themselves for their actions.

>>23202742
Look at the questions people ask in these threads. They unironically believe that writing is just worldbuilding.

>>23202886
His work led to the ending of a war that had gone on for centuries, but the push ended up killing millions before a truce was finally called. Then much later in a revenge plot he directly caused a city to be destroyed. At present in the story, he is waging a conquering war against an empire that he considers to be evil, but things are going to take a turn for the worse and he is going to unleash a race based virus on his enemies right after finding out a way to cure some of their sociopathy.
He is a soft person, he doesn't want to hurt anyone, but he also believes that letting bad things happen when he knows he could stop them is almost as bad as doing those things himself.
Most people in his world see his actions as objective good, he's revolutionized warfare and raised the quality of life for many people, but he sees the cost of human life in what he has done.

>>23202780
It's about conviction. He's prepared to die for his beliefs

>>23202742
I don't think I've really put any thought into trying to be one or the other, and I never actually looked into the difference until now.
I suppose I fit more into literary fiction than genre fiction because I don't care about tropes and my stuff is character and theme driven more than plot driven.
I have gotten complaints on RR about not explaining things, but that's just because I don't lore dump everything the second that I introduce it. There are parts of my world that exist only in my mind because I feel that there has yet to be a good spot to explain it and ultimately those things don't matter to the story itself.
I've also never really cared much about getting into the argument about litfic or genrefic, and I had mostly written litfic anons as being fart sniffers, but now I think they might be right. Unless of course you or them believe that anything fantasy can't be literary.

>>23202935
>He's prepared to die for his beliefs
Doesn't mean he has to. Maybe your summary is missing something, but it seems like he attacks the antagonist out of anger and fustration, not as a solution. Why does the angaonist need to die in the protagonist's mind? Wouldn't humiliation be enough? If this is all about the kid, then all he needs to do is talk to her about it? How is both him and the antagonist dying going to solve anything for him or the kid?

>it's not that i can't figure out storytelling/structure, it's that i'm an artist

>>23202959
you probably should care, because managing expectations is everything.

>>23202959
Okay but how's your prose?

>>23202959
Other than fantasy being a ghetto of the most formulaic bullshit and the autistic obsession with worldbuilding to the detriment of everything else, I don't think anyone hates genre fiction, and that's coming from a literary writer who enjoys fantasy but laments what it became. The real hate is for webnovel shitters who are intentionally trying to make low effort garbage in order to "make it" in a market that is already oversaturated and rapidly cooling. They don't even want to admit that they're writing YA, while pushing out the most juvenile bullshit imaginable, trying to hook literal teenagers. But I don't think that's the real problem here, at least not the whole of it.

The real problem are all the faggots who woke up one day and decided they wanted to be a writer, but don't read, put no effort into learning the craft, and don't have anything at all to say. Most of them happen to want to write webnovels, currently.

>>23202968
Let me explain the greater context of the story here
>Protagonist, a man named Lape Agit. 23 years old, 6,2, 178 pounds
>Raised in Ipoh, Malaysia.
>His family primarily consisted of marital artists
>However, Lape's great (Great?) grandfather/mother (Not sure on that part) was a monstrous, power hungry jackass who was effectively Akuma if he used Muay Thai instead of Karate magic
>This lead to his family getting REALLY paranoid about "Getting too strong" to the point that they refused to train past a certain extent to prevent any more monsters like that. Mostly competing in amateur competitions and stuff
>Lape, on the other hand, wanted to push his limits and get stronger, which boiled over when he ran away from home 8 years prior to the start of the story
>He wandered the world establishing something of a reputation in several circles as an ever-improving journeyman martial artist
>Then he attracted the attention of this Pankration-using lunatic who tore off his left hand and ate it in front of him
>2 years later, Lape goes to a tournament to re-confront the man, having trained like a beast to compensate for his hand
>Story starts

>>23202916
Cool, but what does that have to do with him dying? What changes if he dies? What does his death resolve? What happens if he doesn't die?
This protagonist's death just comes off as feeling really self satisfying, in that the protagonist can pat themselves on the back for dying "nobly" instead of actually having to deal with the consequences of their actions.

>>23202997
I despise people like you. You didn't take up writing out of any love or passion for the craft, you took up writing because you were too stupid and lazy to make a movie so you opened Microsoft Word. Your "writing" is napkin scribbled daydreams that will never amount to anything because you have no talent, drive, or discipline. You don't care about literature. You don't care about language. You treat writing like a whore. I spit on your family.

>>23203012
Here is part of a more recent chapter with a more serious tone, since my MC was forced to kill a friend due to differences in ideals, though these ideals his friend had came from the MC in the first place, but interpreted in a more extreme way.
>>23203052
I must admit that I started writing suddenly one day, and that I am writing a webnovel, but I never want it to be said that my work is low effort. I can accept being called bad, or amateur, but I am trying to make a work that has meaning to myself and hopefully to others, and I refuse to put out a chapter that I don't feel is worthy of the time that I put into it. Probably the worst was when I erased several chapters, totaling 9,000 or more words.
I also want to go back over my entire webnovel once it is finished to edit it since I want it to be of a more consistent quality, even though I think most would consider it a good use of time.
>>23203074
>what does his death resolve
It will prevent a situation which would end with his world being conquered.
>comes off as feeling really self satisfying
Yes, it is. Sure, he is doing the right thing, he is saving lives, but he is also doing it because he is a man driven by guilt over the lives he has taken directly or otherwise. There is a passage where he is teaching younger mages and he asks them why they are helping people, and he says that their reasons as selfish because they do what they do to feel good. They don't understand the difference between selfish and bad, and become upset, but he explains that he does it to avoid feeling bad.
My MC tries and fails to be a virtuous hero, because the reality of his world is that the fastest track to setting some things right involves a mountain of corpses, but he takes that sin onto himself, and it is constantly wearing down his mind.

Tips to improve/critique?

The mystical is an important aspect of humanity that seems to be losing its once affirmed and rejoiced status in society at large. All to be replaced by seemingly nothing. This nothing, as described by Nietzsche as Nihilism, has so sinisterly infected every orifice of the contemporary man, exemplified to an optimal degree by the contemporary American man. This disease has infected contemporary man to the point of transformation. There is barely any resemblance to the lives of our fathers and forefathers, a life with meaning replaced by nothing. Our current meaningless existence can be seen through many lenses of fault, but their is one lens that precedes all others, the original sin, the point of no return. This can only be known as life in absence of excellence, life in absence of beauty, life in absence of the mystical, life in absence of god. There is a reddit aphorism "God has died, and we killed him." that has infected pop science and atheism circles on the internet, strikingly exuding less and less of Nietzsche's essence with each new iteration. In truth God has not died, but in an attempt at a grand manumission of the human race through dogmatic science, logical positivism, falsification, and any other of man's hubrises we have severed gods graceful extended hand of life, and we have progressively inched ourselves towards a whimpering and gruesome decay. All that will be left of man in his final moments is a puny memento mori of a once great race of beings slain not by an external unwavering foe, but by his own arrogance. We so graciously traded positions with our god sneering in his eyes as if the gnostic myths of Yaldabaoth were true, and in this new coronation humanity sits on the divine throne having traded the divine beauty of tradition and order for cheap mechanical conveniences of our own creation. We once sneered as if god were Yaldabaoth, just for humanity to turn into the spitting image of the blind god.

>>23203117
That's not literature.

>>23203123
But why not?

>>23202742
what's even the difference these days? boomers tell me anything set in the real world is literary fiction and anything set in a constructed world is genre fiction.

personally i think thats a completely arbitrary and pointless distinction to make

>>23203131
>>23203130
The answer to both is the same: there needs to be an appreciation of the beauty of language.

>>23203137
That is just a vague and flowery way to say that you subjectively don't agree that is it literature.

>>23203131
What are the last 10 books you read and how many of them weren't SFF?

>>23200700
to what end? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dawR-dPdkY

>>23202403
Read. Talk to people. Live life. It blows my mind how the incel NEET shutins here miss the painfully obvious.

>>23202205
Lack of mature wisdom leading to them committing atrocities. The transition from being powerless children to powerful supersoldiers without "earning" it, i.e. it was just imposed on them, leading to projected revenge for what they suffered when powerless.

Is it normal to learn the craft through reading the books of authors: good as to see how the fundamentals may be used, and bad as to figure out what should not be done?

>>23203152
botns series three times in a row so that's 12
and it mogs litfic

>>23202885
>If someone realizes at a young age that they are strong enough that only a few people can actually make them do what they are told, they turn into monsters.
You ever read about Emperor Puyi of China? Kid was fucking Joffrey Baratheon levels of sadistic.

Also yeah, that's a good point about turning monstrous from realizing people can't really fuck with you

>>23203197
Yeah. I notice that there is an obsession with the superlative, that is trying to seek out "the best" books, that infects people these days and it's just not how readers or writers read. We read widely and almost tastelessly, going outside our comfort zones and struggling through a bunch of shit as well as more difficult works. You see that among film buffs, who like watching a flick, any flick, and develop nuanced tastes and opinions that approach objectivity.

Once you push out a large amount of your own work, you have a better sense of the craft. I wrote like 30 really shitty short stories before I got a handle on what worked and what was merely me emulating what worked, nevermind all the objectively terrible shit.

>>23203212
No, but I recall the wife of an emperor, and she was so evil that she would enter into myth with people saying that she was really a Kitsune, or whatever the Chinese name for it is.
I recall something about drowning a pregnant woman in a frozen lake and a torture method where people were tied to a copper or brass cylinder, then a fire would be lit inside of it. A reverse brass bull in a sense.

>>23203110
>dunningkrugermaxxing
i care about what language can do for my story.
not only does storytelling predate whatever YOUR idea of writing is by a good 40 thousand years, but people would rather read my stories than your poems.

>>23203245
oh yeah, Da Ji and King Zhou of Shang

there's a manhua that reimagines the guy's son as the protagonist

do any of you NOT read books?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glwYurrthcc

what's a good metaphor for the sound of this guy's leg breaking?

>>23203314
Like a branch in a storm. The sheering of steel as a driver drunkenly cuts his way through a guardrail. The snapping of green beans.

>>23203314
what's the story about?

This is the opener of my novel.

Be honest, tell me if you'd be interested in reading it or have any critical feedback on the writing.

https://pastebin.com/g1A3YDsH

>>23203399
>Novel about some retard who masturbates and watches anime
Seriously?

>>23203399
first sentence is out of tune with the rest of this excerpt.

>>23203399
Need more to really judge.

FYI if you guys start with The you're NGMI

>>23202205
You know that class of wild children run by a teacher who has given up and basically has no choice but to weakly scold them until the kids tire out to actually be taught anything? Think of that only your kids can brutally murder each other and the teacher without really caring. Alternatively crib the early Halo books on Spartans growing up.

>>23203412
how so?

like, I'm not disagreeing, I sort of get what you mean but I can't really say how and therefore unsure how to keep a consistent style.

>>23203407
>>Novel about some retard who masturbates and watches anime
>>Seriously?

do you think it's overdone? essentially it's the story of an incel sort of loser, except for the fact he is socially well adjusted. He's a teacher in real life and is loved by his students and his fellow teachers, even the stacy ones.

The thing is, he is nobody outside his place in society as a teacher. a 30+ kissless virgin loser (hence the opener). people treat him nice enough but behind their eyes he can sense that people see him as a bit off. He is having an existential crisis. He hates the crowd but still cares what they think of him

the beginning, which comes straight after that opening goes into his life as a teacher because it contrasts heavily with this image of a loser looking for hookers.

>>23203414
First couple of chapters are still unedited. What are your thoughts on the story, are you curious what happens next? Waht do you think of the writing?

if it's so short that you can't really say, I understand.

>>23203459
Reads a little manic, may want to work on that.

>>23202968
Why not?

>>23203468
Killing your protagonist is cheap and while not a sign of bad writing on its own, is a sign of bad writing when in tandem with a few other signs of bad writing. Tragedy is earned and the person who dies is seldom, if ever, the main protagonist.

>>23203459
>It's almost all one sentence.

Is there a word for something which is given (possibly god-given) both a duty and a right? I swear it exists. A few words I'm thinking which don't quite fit for various reasons: prerogative, grant, birthright, destiny.

>>23203558
calling, especially sacred calling?

>>23203484
It’s not meant to be a tragedy though.
You’re not supposed to mourn him, you’re supposed to see it as a warrior’s death for the greater good of another person’s future.
How is that a tragedy?

>>23203110
>Thinks making words sound pretty is the older, purer art compared to storytelling
Christ. Pseuds, get control of this one, he's embarrassing you

>>23203588
dislike the typical societal angst found in most 4chan excerpts, personally cant stand it and would never read a novel about it, but putting that preference aside, found the writing and flow quite good. You actually know how to write. Keep it going anon

asfd

So I'm writing a short story about a guy dealing with the bad aftereffects of steroids, particularly the back acne

>Text begins
His tender back bristled under the chill of his home's air. Shirts chafed the boils in an agonizing manner, and the heat made him sweat easily, which burned his wounds with the salt.

Even worse was his need for sleep. Every time he would lie down, the pimples on his back burst like overripe grapes on his bed, jabbing a thousand needles into his back. And the next morning, when he sat up, the hardened blood and pus would peel off, flaying his back anew.

>>23203690
thanks, anon!

>>23200207
>story is a rescue mission/roadtrip
>main character starts off cowardly and powerless, but if he doesn't go to find his sister, no-one will
>finds that he has a knack for magic with a little barebones tutelage, and as he gets a free ridealong into a high society event, he scores a couple of cheap wins and earns the fleeting fancy of a noblegirl
>she convinces him to take an unnecessary risk and bombs hard because his fundamentals were always nonexistent
>when it comes time for the big bad he gets the chance to wield a big magic sword and be the hero he's wanted to be
>gives it to his more experienced friend so he can pick up a shield instead
>friend, who derided him as weak and cowardly, gets a minor lesson in humility as she needed him to activate the sword's magic in the first place

>>23203725
breddy gud anon, keep us updated. I like the emphasis on the bacne, it's visceral without being too over the top.

>Story is a countdown to the apocalypse
>Core cast is trying to prevent it with a government that won't cooperate immediately
>Lead is a mage and former salaryman who slowly becomes a muscle wizard over the course of the story.
>Romantic interest is a reserved holy knight who is strong but lacks confidence in herself.
>Best Bro is super buff muscle man, actually a lot more contemplative and thoughtful than his gregarious nature would make you think
>Then there's the lovey dovey normie couple that can fuck right off and explode. One's a Ranger type, one's a Rogue type, they are super in sync.
>Last party member is a sentient bee who knows things and can heal people.
Are they bad enough dudes to rescue Ron- I mean, prevent the King of Ashes from drowning the world in a tide of the dead?

>>23201049
Thanks for the brief. If anyone else is interested in an editor, shoot us a message at https://www.fiverr.com/matthewg42

>about to finish writing my novel
>didn't bother looking up where to sell it
anyone got some tips and where i should bother selling? currently looking at amazon and google play

>>23203588
Was gonna put you down for being a blackpilled remote work tech chud but yea this actually reads real well. You got fancy at the end without sounding like an idiot too. Not too bad boss man

>>23204511
What's the point of an editor when the future is mass produced genre slop, esp. web fiction?

>>23204530
Amazon is basically 99% of online book sales, so yeah
There's other solid options depending on your genre but you're vague posting so fuck you

>>23204530
kindle, kindle unlimited specifically. forces an exclusive 90 day period which is a good thing for a dumbass like you who didnt do any market research beforehand. plug and play

>>23204731
thanks!

>>23204843
>>23204757
you're both right, just was wondering while making my research. i'm just an anon getting for the first time in this sort of business and don't want to get fucked sideways

>>23204926
Don't worry, you won't get fucked sideways, you'll just be ignored like the 99.99% of other creators

>>23202742
Litfic anon here, just finished a 4k word short story yesterday. As in finished finshed, the editing is over. I had to make a lot of perspective changes to fix it.

>finish first draft
>feel happy
>read first draft
>feel miserable
I'll need at least a year to fix it all.

>>23205044
What do you plan to do with the story?

Cross-posting this from poetry general, as I'm not sure if one would call this just prose or prose poetry.

Thoughts? No education in poetry or prose writing. Only more professional newswriting.
Does it come across as too purple?

Onerous Offal

He took the measuring plate from the hook on the balance. No man can expect an offering to be enough.

Lifting at his steely hood, whose hinges squeal a cantankerous moan of petition, a truly pitiful sight was laid bare.

A mass of pulsative flesh. Having borne slashing, bruising, and chemical burn alike, it was shown for all to see.

"Oh, did he play ball with that precious spark," taunted a toothy-mouthed hoblin as it feigned the swing of a sporting bat?

"I would say he rode it like the jockey splashing through the slum streets of Adbyu Cheer" laughed another voice.

A last voice gasped out with words like grating wheels. "You are too imaginative. All can be explained by indifference."

Before the beast could further berate his fellow buffoons, it's eyes realized they missed the crucial motion.

The automaton's abdominal cavity was empty. In its crude hands held high to the sky over its lifeless eyes was the gross viscera.

No man can expect an offering to be enough.

The three surmised it was the wind which pushed the machine man over. The meat fell from his clasped clutches onto the plate.

In silence, a door opened. Light entered the room followed by a figure .

The jeering monsters would scream obscenities if their voices were not constrained by painful muzzles.

The figure picked up the plate, oblivious to the offal splayed upon it. Reaching out, the plate hooked to the scale.

The being then glided to the opposite side of the scale. There hung a ghastly meathook.

The figure produces a small object from a smaller pocket. A purple grape.

Dutifully, the grape rolls from the being's grasp and drops to the floor. It climbs the scale. It rises the vertical climb of the body of the measuring device. The little fruit bounces once and twice down the chain, meeting the hook. There, it is embedded.

The flesh on its plate lifts as the three seething hoblins tear at their faces and scar their bones.

decided to sell on amazon kindle, gonna make a ton of money, bros!

>>23203311
Does manga count?

>>23205160
Good luck trying to do anything without doing another draft of that draft

>>23205193
Kek. I don't have time for that, or I would yes. My plan is to write everything that needs fixing on a notebook and then, after reading it all with the structure in mind, I'll edit the .docx. The prose is not bad, and at the end the pace is good. But in the beginning the pace is hrrible, everything happens too fast. I took one year writign this, so I think I've improved from starting to finishing. Any tips?

>>23205211
you may have dislexia

>>23205193
If you need to do more than just 1 draft + revisions you’ve failed. Jim Butcher only does one draft.

>>23205223
glad to hear you will make it with your writings

>>23205183
Temper your expectations, friend. Most self-published books sell less than a few copies. Even the stats for published books are pretty sad

>>23205216
Come on, I don't wnt to spellcheck everything I write on a imgeboard.

>>23205173
Submit it to a magazine of course. Also shout outs to the editoranon here who gave some great advice on tension. It was difficult for me to apply that to more introspective stories, but I am starting to understand how to push a story along with things to worry about.

Although I love the process of writing, I feel like it's a waste if no one reads it. Is this some sort of vanity or is it normal? I don't feel the same with music.

>>23205223
>Jim Butcher only does one draft
>Jim Butcher is a contemporary fantasy author
Inconceivable!

>>23205458
which magazines?

>>23205517
There's a regional mag that publishes authors from my state a few times a year. I think I will throw stuff their way, but I will weigh my options. I used to have a more comprehensive list which I left in my desk somewhere.

>>23205580
please share if you find it.

>>23205618
I think the last time I did some anon had a meltdown because I included a few mainstream mags on it. But yeah sure, I will try to categorize them or something so you can tell.

>can’t tell if i’m good at writing
>dont want to share it because schizoid and i mostly write fanfaction (cringe)
wat do? are there any ai’s that evaluate writing quality yet?

I like to avoid typical marital arts clichés not because I think it's good storytelling but because I think they're offensive to actually good fighters.
Like, name how many things where some secret ancient no resistance chi bullshit easily defeats a heavyweight boxer.

>>23205701
Just gotta look at what people consider good writing

>>23205701
'Good at writing' is too vague to mean anything. Just post on fanfiction sites and see if people like it.

Why ask someone who isn't your audience in the first place? Anons here will call everything shit, including esteemed works (bait threads pop up all the time presenting famous work as their own which anons then shit on) and especially genre fiction (pseuds will call it shit on principle)

>>23205831
I only shit on animewriters because none of them, at least that I've seen, write anything worth a damn. I'm sure some of them could, but they lean to heavily into a cringeworthy style that I can't help but roll my eyes at. How anyone can take them seriously is a mystery to me, and I quite like some anime. Genre fiction is fine but the vast majority of it feels uninspired and often contrived.

>>23205701
Don't share a first draft, but once you're somewhere half decent flash it about a bit and get some feedback. You won't improve in a vaccum.

>>23205883
What even counts as anime writing? I just like to write stories about people beating each other senseless

>>23205883
So when you say anime writing what do you mean? Because cultivation and litrpg (the popular web serial genres in the West) aren't really anime writing. Anime writing to me is Light Novel-style writing, with emphasis on Japanese anime tropes (which really isn't that big in Western web serials).
LitRPG has its own distinct brand of cringe, but I wouldn't call it 'anime'
Or do you mean dramatic action sequences with 'anime moments'? Because that's kind of fair; that's definitely found in litrpg/other slop.

>>23205908
NTA but I avoid this by only having characters talk in fights if it's safe.
No talking mid-punches or throws. They talk if they're getting ready or the fight was already won

>>23205908
NTA, I'm going to go out on a very short limb and say that he means the prose is breezy and writes to an audience in a not quite self aware way, as if to say "Please excuse how bad this is, it's totally supposed to be bad lol" which is a confused message. It's the literary equivalent of looking at a fuccboi with a side hustle, they're concerned with image in the utmost but present as a fucking fuckboi, completely unaware that they're perceived as clowns to anyone who isn't another preening fuckboy acting like doordash is good money.

>>23205957
Okay ... why do you call that 'anime writing'?

>>23205992
Take an intellectually honest guess.

>>23206022
Dude I literally defined anime writing in a sensical way, as in, Light-Novel-ish with Japanese tropes.

what the fuck does 'prose is breezy and says "please excuse how bad this is, it's supposed to be bad"' have to do with ANIME?

Are you just saying anime=shit and webserial=shit therefore anime=webserial? Because if so ... yikes. Aren't you the pseud? Shouldn't your logical standards be higher?

I've been writing for a week ago, and, I have barely read any fiction in my whole life. How bad am I as a writer, judging from this alone? I wrote this today. https://pastes.io/fyfjs81qgh . IK it's pretentious but please give me tips for how to improve. One of the few fictional books I've read has been The Consumer by Michael Gira.

>>23206129
Same poster here. I overlooked some obvious errors, ignore me saying sky three times in the same paragraph, please.

>>23206146
i'm barely literate.

>>23206129
Too many analogies, like a gooner trying to sort through his million fetishes

Jakob sent me here, physics is fragile

Ardennes when he gets paid gif

At that moment I could see small white dots forming in each connecting section on the ruins. Corner on corner, curve on fit. I lay down on the grass facing the spotted edifice and began to drift.

Connected to each part is how I describe the feeling to under persons. A feeling of both weightlessness and pressed together at the seams. The woodmen were correct with their map, I felt the tendrils throughout myself. Ancient wires on each of my sections lead me to the cold objects. Bulbous sphere for light, a machination for bake, and a washing box. Noting all of these is important for the study report for if something was amiss; it would end in another loss. Coming to is more pleasurable than coming from. Shaking and sweating I feel pats on my back.

>>23205183
good luck anon, i really mean that

I think I'm writing a literal children's book, I don't know how this happened. I put a project on the backburner for a few months and it turned all, fantasy.

I haven't read YA in decades, what do I need to know?

>>23206764
Let me rephrase, is moonshining an acceptable topic?

>>23200547
Honestly this is why I'm trying to finish a whole work before posting it. The serialization style common online just isn't for me. Plus I'm ADHD as fuck so I keep writing by flitting between 2-3 different projects depending on my mood to keep up motivation.

>write 1,000 words
>its like pulling teeth
>get stuck
>come back to it after not writing for a while
>want to adopt a new writing style
its been like this for 10 years. i wish i could be a writer

>>23200547
Dude unless you're somehow relying on that serial (it's your primary income) just fucking stop writing it lmao

droped

>>23179449
The ending turned out a fair bit shorter than I thought it would be, but I'm finished. I did it. I have written an entire fucking novel.
I'm not entirely sure how to feel. Accomplished, mostly, but at the same time a little sad. I will of course go back and make edits, as well as start on the next book in due time. but it's an odd feeling to cap off the last three months of work just like that.
Will this get published? Almost certainly not traditionally, and probably not self-pubbed either. It's...not that great, but I learned a lot, and I mean A LOT, about this whole "writing" thing. These are lessons I will be taking into my next book - one I intend on having see the light of day.

>>23200847
Keep it to 4 syllables or less, likely 3 or less. Anything longer and readers won't remember. There's no real need for exact linguistic science here - go based off vibes. A good resource to use is fantasynamegenerator, but you'll have to splice multiple names together to make something that doesn't sound stupid.

>>23200966
Doesn't matter, readers on RoyalRoad don't care. I may think Isekai is repetitive, soulless wish fulfilment, but there's a plenty big audience for it.

>>23202205
Easy to emotionally manipulate by enemy operatives. Unstable, short attention spans. Massive long term developmental and health issues.

>>23206022
>>23206100
Answer me bitch

How will the allegations of grooming by mods and abusive nature of its management affect your participation with NaNoWriMo this year?

>>23207018
nanowrimo was never a group activity

>>23207018
I do ""nanowrimo"" every month. If you aren't writing 2k a day you don't care about making writing a career

>>23207018
Nanowrimo is an organized thing? I always just figured it was something people just did.

Why is dialogue so difficult to write? Every time I hit a scene where the characters have to talk my progress screeches to a halt. Maybe I should just write poetry instead

>>23207095
dialogue is the easiest part of a novel
yall autistic or smth?

>>23207105
>yall autistic or smth?
Take a wild guess

How the fuck do you all outline your novels? I struggle to write without first making myself a guidebook, but I've yet to find one I don't hate.

god what the fuck am i saying anymore im just fucking saying sentences that barley link together

I wanna write a book that covers a long period of time. Like 10 years if not more. People are always complaining that they don't get to see what happens next. They always say they stopped caring the moment I jump a year ahead even if I believe there's nothing that important that happens. People just don't care. I've been trying to do the skips in a hundred different ways but the feedback never changes and I'm starting to resent the changes I've made. I genuinely think my first idea of hard skips work the best. No flashbacks, no lingering thoughts on stuff from 6 months ago, none of that. Just skip and then let the reader fill in the blanks. Now the reason I'm conflicted is that I wanna go against the readers and it's hard for me to tell if that's arrogance or if I just understand my story well enough to make that call. People complained about House of the Dragon too. Vikings got shitted on for making Ragnar old and letting the kids take the lead and I loved those shows.

Does anyone have any advice on how to handle time skips so they don't feel jarring? Where do you draw the line between listening to the readers and what you want?

>>23206884
>this is why I'm trying to finish a whole work before posting it.
I do this too, but hell, there's always room for improvement. I keep checking every chapter until it goes up and always find ways to do things better. It's not really over until the whole thing is posted.

>>23207008
I have no real stake in it, sure, but I hate to betray what I've promised and leave things unfinished.

>>23197634
>>23205616
>>23207473
Feedback on any one of these posts (not necessarily all three)? I know the prose is not good (I had to cut off most of the imagery and description for word count) and some of the paragraphs are condensened into a sentence or removed entirely; I am more interested in how well it interests the reader, and what sort of impression it makes.

>>23207379
The readers are always right when they point out problems, but usually not on how to fix them. If they're complaining about losing interest after a time skip, its because you haven't spent the necessary time rebuilding empathy for the characters, not because of the time skip itself. Vikings didn't get shit on for making Ragnar old, so much as not making the kids as interesting or compelling to watch as their father.

Any time you switch protagonists or do a time skip (which is effectively the same thing) you have to see it as you resetting the connection the reader has built with the character. You also have to make sure you have an adequate resolution before the time skip, so it feels like one part of the story has come to satisfactory end.

Dickens is the author that comes to mind for handling this kind of this. Nearly all his books, because they deal with characters growing from children to adulthood (two in particular do this quite literally, and are worth studying: Great Expectations and David Copperfield), use time skips.

>>23207811
Congratulations, you wrote gay misery porn while aping the style of the 19th century Russian realists. A simple setting change to an upper class boarding school (and further depictions of nonsensical cruelty and depression) should win you lots of fans among the same demographic that consume tortureslop like Yanagihara and Dazai.

To me this is the worst sort of literature. But yours is not only meaningless, but uninspired as well. It's as if you couldn't even muster the creativity and imagination to come up with novel torments but simply regressed to the mean. What sort of an impression does it make? An impression of dishonesty and inauthenticity.

>>23207844
Thank you. Your view is more or less what I expected based on the content.
Is my aping limited to narrative or manner of writing?

>>23207027
There are forums and discord servers and meetups to write with others. Sorry you’re too much of a loser to have taken adtvsntage of any of those options.
>>23207036
Not everybody is looking to quit their day job. But hey, you do you.
>>23207046
If you had ever bothered to visit the site you would know this. Obviously, you choose to revel in your ignorance.

How to action?

Boom! Boom! Boom! Those horrible footsteps echoed like thunder.
Boom! Boom! Boom! The sound was growing louder . . .
Frightfully, Fat Dalton dashed through the jungle, awkwardly pushing his way past the thick foliage. His lungs were burning and his stubby legs were begging for reprieve, but he had to keep going. The sharp twigs clawed at him, tearing his clothes and drawing blood from his pink flesh.
More than once, he stumbled over the thick tree roots that slithered beneath the underbrush like a den of anacondas. He fell toward the rotten mud. Despite that, he crawled up to his feet and pushed forward.
Fat Dalton ran and ran like a pig fleeing from the butcher. He broke through the wall of dark greenery and suddenly emerged in a bright clearing.
“Shit!” he cried as the ground before him plunged into a cliff. Muddy river coursed below, crashing violently against the rocky shores.
He turned to the side and saw only a steep rock side that ascended toward elevated grounds. Fat Dalton reached for it and tried to climb up, but rainwater made the stone surface slippery. His chubby fingers couldn’t grab hold and he fell down again, and again. Frustrated, he searched for another escape route. But when he spun around, his blood froze and his pink face lost all colors.
A colossal shadow loomed within the darkness of the jungle. Boom! Boom! Boom! The ancient trees shook as a monster emerged from pre-historic depths. Standing forty feet tall on hind legs, the Tyrannosaurus rex came into the light. Its green scales gleamed with a ghostly luminescence in the silver sunlight, as two yellow orbs burned in its square face. Within those evil eyes reflected the ashen face of Fat Dalton.
“No . . . Go . . . Go away . . . Go away!”
Fat Dalton stepped back, but his back hit the hard mountainside. Seeing its prey cornered, the T-Rex moved in slowly with the grace of a true tyrant. It opened its massive jaws, displaying a row of deadly teeth. A foul stench leaked from its breath, smelling of rot and decay.
Fat Dalton’s eyes shifted from side to side, desperately searching for an escape. That’s when he saw a narrow slit in the mountain’s side. It might just be big enough. He swallowed hard. There was only one change.
As the T-Rex lifted its foot, Fat Dalton dashed for the crevice.

>>23199656
Hey anon what a coincidence, I have just dug up this Antares compact 81 from my father's garage, bought ink and all, but was wondering how to clean the insides, what products to use etc. It works quite fine but the keys could use some inside cleaning for rust, dust and stickiness.

DO NOT USE WD-40. Or most oils. Or alcohol.They aren't cleaners, gunk up parts when they dry, and melt plastic and rubber because they're petroleum based or rust because alcohol is mostly water.

Mineral spirits in a squeeze bottle, naptha, brake cleaner, and even PB Blaster are okay if you keep away from plastic parts and paint. Try to remove the case if you can. I used naptha and contact cleaner because I couldn't find my brake cleaner and it was safe on the one plastic wheel. Hit it with q-tips to get out dust and gunk that's everywhere. Compressed air from an air compressor will also blow out gunk. The cans don't have enough pressure. Just keep it away from plastic and rubber parts to be safe.

Running mineral spirits through everything and cleaning the typeface with naptha and a tooth or brass brush will take care of most of it and get it running. My 1 key is still sticky but the exclamation mark works so it's not a major issue. Portable machines don't need oil other than a few spots.

Here's a before picture.

>>23207811
It's way too short for it to have enough depth to be interesting and you're fundamentally falling into the trapping of "my story is interesting because interesting things happen in it". This is to say, because there's not enough depth to the characters to make the reader emotionally invested there really isn't anything you could do to them that would make anyone care.
The psychological aspects of the story, while there, are also lacking in that they're relayed with a degree of separation that is clearly not a result of later introspection but rather the author impersonally narrating a character's very personal story. Suicide would also be a good example of this since it's chalked up as a side note and a obvious consequence of being raped or being pushed to the limit yet the feelings behind it are not elaborated upon whatsoever which demonstrates a fundamental lack of understanding about what suicide is even in its most mundane of forms: suicidal ideation. The second story is much more personal in its psychological retelling but that only exacerbated the deficiencies of the first being ascribed to the author's writing skills and not the character trying to compartmentalize the trauma in some way by acting as if it happened to someone else.
There's no real meaning to any of this. You're merely telling a story for the sake of relaying events and emotions, you're fundamentally not telling what any of this meant to the character or even what you're trying to pass along by writing this work. This is somewhat common with genre sloppa where cool things need to happen but fundamentally there's no higher value to it besides the entertainment it provides to the author and/or the reader, resulting in said sloppa being written absentmindedly; given the nature of your work that's only a disservice to the themes you're working with. Introspection is the pillar of experiences no matter if they were good or bad, your character was raped, he conveyed felling raped but he never ascribed meaning to being raped or came to any conclusions (conscious or not) as to how that affects him or his actions moving forward. He was raped only because you said he was, he never actually went through the motions of feeling raped besides the immediate surface level aftermath. He never went through the motions of feeling suicidal either. Without researching and breaking down how humans deal with trauma and incorporating that into your writing you're not going to get past merely retelling bad things that happened to other people even if you're writing in first person.

>>23207816
Never bothered to read Dickens. Will check these out. Thanks based anon

>>23208284
Thanks for the high effort response, anon.

It's unusually short because I'm writing for 4chan (and thus I want to make each post a sort of self-contained story)— I did have a lot more written that was cut. For example, I wanted to dedicate a lot more than 3000 characters to his slow bonding with the "friend," (and a few other people at the shelter) and I felt that his attempt to maintain appearances during church was important but would take more than 3000 characters as well.

There was another post that was supposed to go before my arrival to the shelter, which detailed him being sent to a psychiatric facility not mentioned in the story and discharged to the shelter; During his stay, he would meet a few women and have his first experiences in the real world, but it would have taken several posts to describe this even to the barest degree.
Aside from that, it is supposed to be a retelling as a letter many years down the line.
I wrote a fourth post before reading yours, but it has a problem with being more than 3000 characters, and I can't show the narrator bonding with his counsellor without sacrificing the other events in the hospital, etc., or drawing it out in multiple posts.

I know it seems like I'm trying to deflect from the flaws in the writing (it seems that way to me too) but this is how it is. If I'm understanding you correctly, your primary issue is just that a lot of this is very surface level and shallow. In that case (I suppose) I can take it well, since my intent is to be convey the events in a sort of clinical manner.

Thanks again for the feedback. :-)

>>23207379
>I genuinely think my first idea of hard skips work the best. No flashbacks, no lingering thoughts on stuff from 6 months ago, none of that. Just skip and then let the reader fill in the blanks.
It has to serve a purpose, which I'm assuming is to present characters and the formal events that shaped what they will do in the later acts. >>23207816
>its because you haven't spent the necessary time rebuilding empathy for the characters, not because of the time skip itself.
is correct about one issue that plagues time skips, that you get a changed character that you have no empathy for, usually because they're older and a miserable sack of shit. He's right that it's a continuity issue; you have to make the relationship between the past and the present make sense and either build a sort of mystery, or outright explain any missing events that play into the current ones as they happen. Resistance on the part of the reader usually means that something is unclear and incongruent in a way that wants for an explanation, which either has to be expressly implied as part of the 'mystery' or given outright and quickly.

I've got a similar issue. The protagonists have come back to their hometown after college and the lingering echoes of changing relationships are right on the surface. I could write about it and do a timeskip, write flashbacks to key events that caused the current situation, or be forced to find other ways of building a case and some small amount of pathos for how poorly the protagonists handle the situations presented.

I chose the last one as there is a kind of 'mystery' that needs to be revealed, and showing the past would be either incongruent or too telling. And writing about teenagers blows. The only advice I can give based on this side of the problem is to decide how smart your intended audience is and what they would reasonably be able to figure out, then back that down a notch or two because, while they aren't retarded, it's hard for (You) to contend with the paradox of knowledge, where you can't accurately imagine not knowing what you know.

>>23208241
I'm the other typewriter guy from above. Many thanks for advice anon! I have already cleaned the key stamps with a toothbrush from the outside, planning on doing what you said with air compressor and remove the plastic parts to clean the insides if possible. Thanks again

>>23208433
Yo, a questie!?

Which one do you write? I write The Lady Knight's Quest

Is it satisfying to have a stoic-faced humble dude get obliterated by a guy who actually has passion?
Like this
>You're quite impressive. Genuinely love seeing how far you've co-
>Shut the fuck up
I've always hated humblebragging stories where the more humble/stoic/small guy wins. The guy who should win is the guy who's both stronger and more interesting.

>>23208500
I was surprised how easy to clean and low maintenance most of them are. We probably come across as anachronistic hipsters to other anons, but using a typewriter does have a noticeable effect on how you write and edit, and I think it's mostly beneficial.

"Insert phrase here." Said X

Why do people write this way? Wouldn't it be better for X says "Insert phrase here." so you can imagine the voice correctly instead of rereading the line in another voice?

Entered his house, the man did.

Crush my cock with a rock, I must

>>23208433
You don't have to write within the constraints of /lit/'s character limits, plenty of people upload their works to pastebin like websites and then link to those in their posts.

>>23208572
IMO both ways are fine as long as it's almost impossible to misunderstand who is speaking. I've seen people cut out X says altogether and just do a series of quotations.

>>23208572
It's used for pacing and clarity.

>>23208572
>Why do people write this way?
"He said, she said" bullshit is just standard English slop, whether it comes before or after the dialog makes no difference and is mostly an aesthetic choice. If you make distinctive characters the readers should be able to pick up who is speaking from either context, personality or mannerisms without having to explicitly enunciate it.
>so you can imagine the voice correctly instead of rereading the line in another voice?
Are you fucking 12?

>>23208576
Yoda? What are you doing here?

>>23208439
My story is about exploring long term effects of war on society. There's a long civil war that happens and I wanna explore what that does to people. I'm trying showcase how the very culture itself changes. Values are lost and transformed because of necessity. Places of importance seize to exist, people become hardened and more suspicious of others. More fanatic for their own while unforgiving to "traitors." I'm trying to showcase large scale effects of wars on people and I think I focus too much on large scale events. I focus a lot on small side characters and the little stories. I wanna have an oppressive atmosphere. One where it feels like the horror never ends. An endless marathon of death
I think the biggest problem is pacing. The text is relentless which is what I want because that's what war feels like. It's really hard to make the reader stay engaged though. It's not misery porn but it is miserable. I'm trying to inject more humor and moments of levity where I can so the humanity can shine through even during the darkest times. The other thing is that I am creating a large cast and while I think the protagonist and his gf works, it's probably a lot to remember all these people and keep track of their stories when everything changes periodically. The book is a 4-act-story with 5 jumps. I'm currently removing one jump and I'm trying to find a way to make them fully correlate with the acts. Originally act 2 had two jumps and act 1 one minor jump. This allowed for me to showcase the parts that I feel like mattered the most but I'll try to change it up so it's easier to "be with the characters." Hopefully it works out.

>TIME TO SUBMIT MY MAGNUM OPU--
>We are grateful to be a part of a literary community that is taking action against systemic racism. We will also be donating submission fees from our current reading period towards Black-led organizations and anti-racist collectives. In the next year, 25% of our submission fees will be donated, as well.
>Please address your submission to the appropriate genre editor, and be mindful of correct pronoun usage in your cover letter.
>look up the editors
>you already know

And do you know what's really sad? These are the magazines that pay. These are the types of people you have to grovel for. And where do they get this money, you ask? Government grants, i.e. your taxes.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>23208572
>writing general
>anon has clearly just cracked a novel open for the first time in his life
>"what are the numbers in the corner for? am i supposed to be adding them up?"
i love you people, you are so fucking hopeless i feel better about myself every time i look at these threads

>>23208771
As much as you may hate it, self-publishing and small publishing houses are only way forward.

>>23208771
>donations goes directly to some guy laughing at the retards thinking they'll make a difference
every times

>>23208819
There's a lot of small publishers that are even worse than the big ones about that. If anything you have to find a professional that knows how to identify partners that can publish you for art's sake. There are still agents and publishers that request that, but increasingly you see editors and the rest engaging in this editorial mindset in which their views matter more than authors. That view is definitely dominant.
>>23208771
>you already know
Sadly, I do. Ironically enough one of the most respectful editors I ever worked with was of the tribe. Despite us having polar opposite views he didn't try to censor my work in any way.

>>23207095

I wonder if extroverted people find it easier to write dialogue it's always been a pain for me.

>>23208796
One of the hallmarks of bad writing is making you read an entire line of dialogue without making it clear who is speaking (through context, character voice, rhythm, etc.) until the very end, sometimes causing you to replay the line with a different character. When this is done unintentionally it's terrible writing, and beginner or not, that anon has a much better grasp of it than you.

>>23208900
>one of the most respectful editors I ever worked with was of the tribe
Tribesmen only really gets bad when they're in positions of great authority and have the opportunity to be nepotistic, and that's from a toxic culture that began when Charlemagne gave them the exclusive right to collect interest from Christians in his kingdom more than anything else. To be fair, most groups do they, theyve just done it to the point that no one can call them out on it. Most tribesmen I know are actually great people, and frankly it's disgusting how the ones at the top use them as a shield.

I despise agents.
I despise editors.
Parasitic middle-men leeching off others' art.

>>23208572
“It’s a matter of style,” Anon said.
“It’s a matter of style,” said Anon.
Anon said, “It’s a matter of style.”
“It’s,” Anon said, “a matter of style.”
“It’s a matter of style,” Anon said simply.
“It’s a matter of style,” Anon explained.
“It’s a matter of style,” Anon said, typing down the words.
“It’s a matter of—”
“Style!” said another person.
“It’s”—Anon coughed—“a matter of style.”
Anon told him: “It’s a matter of style.”
Anon wrecked his brain. “It’s . . . a matter of style?”
“It’s . . .” Anon believed he should end with something clever, but being a retard, he could only say, “It’s a matter—of style!”

>>23209074
Anon cried, “Dammit!” and slapped his forehead. “I misspelled ‘racked his brain.’ I really am a drooling retard,” he said defeatedly.

>>23209117
It was a stylistic choice.

How’s my writing please be gentle

>>23209251
it should be
>How's my writing, please be gentle.

>>23209251
How’s my writing? Please be gentle.

>>23208966
thanks for explaining something i didn't ask about in the most patronizing way possible. you sound like a real expert and you're definitely going to make it (to the unemployment office)

>>23209251
oy vey! how dare you-- oh, "gentle," never mind

The old man peered down into the sewer, all he saw was meddling...

>>23209117
>defeatedly

>>23209328
The tranny writhed masculinely under his lustful gaze. "Suck my cock," it suggested innocently, breasts protruding siliconously, makeup running waterfallishly down its angular features, testosterone olfactive in its sweat's every droplet. "Make it erupt geyserously the product of my female testicles."

Recommend me /lit/ that use video games as a setting or plot device, preferably written by an author who understands how video games work

Please no sword art online-tier litRPG

>>23209656
Nigga this is writing general go ask the fantasyfags.

>>23209401
A Kek to you.

The reason why people beg for advice but refuse to post work is because they're writing fanfiction

>>23210027

>>23210027
True and real.
Source: me

>>23210027
Almost all writing in the premodern era seems to have been fanfiction anyways. Like half of the Arthur canon and most Greek myths are just storytellers going "Ohshit, what if I told this story about Hercules going apeshit."

>Fantasy slice of life where a farmer finds a treasure in a local cave and uses it to pay off his debts and bring his family out of poverty

Good idea or garbage?

>>23210143
Literally every idea ever depends entirely on execution.

>>23209656
go watch log horizon

>>23207018
This is the 3rd time I've come across nanowrimo drama today, didn't it all get revealed last November?
not that it matters, I was completely out of the loop until today

pausing another story wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo i love not finishing shiiiiiiiitttttttttttttttt

>>23207894
>Not everybody is looking to quit their day job.
I don't have quite enough equity to make that move but I'm considering it because of how underhanded they treat me now. Tired of the bullshit even if it is a fairly comfy job.

>>23210154
I get that, but some ideas are naturally just explicitly and intrinsically bad

>>23207894
>joiner
people who need people are the cringiest people in the world

>>23208617
Replaced me with a child, Disney did.

>>23209261
no, that's a comma splice

What are some things a mountain dwelling farming community could trade with a fishing community?

All I could think of was them trading salt pork for smoked fish. I suppose they could also trade things like lumber from the mountains for sea salt?

>>23210269
In my own defense, I was drinking at the time, and the second I hit post I realized that I fucked it up.
>>23210268
Were they molesting you just because you were small?
>>23210281
Mountains and mines go together like... something else that's clever and alliterated.

>>23210285
I was actually thinking that the mountainfolk are a sort of mystical people that don't mine, like fantasy elves and their nature focus.

What about the fishing town? What could they offer?

Have you ever looked at a character other than the MC and thought "what is she/he?"
That feeling when trying to decipher what a character was?
I wrikte very much in affect, so maybe my characters just crop up as emanations of my mind, but sometimes I do get that feeling.
Maybe that's why I prefer observing main characters that just witness the world that springs up around them.

>>23210293
Perhaps medicinal herbs for the mountain folk?Normal people would have a hard time getting the stuff that grows in the more perilous areas.
The fishing town offering salt for food storage is reasonable, but are they also a port town?
If they are, then perhaps traders stop by now and then, giving a chance for the mountain folk to get random odds and ends, not even useful stuff, but something slightly nice, like a nutcracker or a spice grinder, or glass jars.

>>23210285
a space-goblin i am. chewed his dick off, i did.

>>23210318
It is a port town, albeit a bit small, but yeah those sound like good ideas, thanks!

>>23208705
I don't even know how to approach something with that kind of scale, other than setting the status quo of skipping ahead early and doing it mercilessly. Many novels with that kind of scale and number of characters will intercut across time, so that time moves forward when looking at another character and has already passed when returning to the first one.

Others also have some kind of signifier for the passage of time; a newspaper headline, a repeated description of the state of something, someone's morning routine. They tend to use it to show that nothing much happened or that something should be expected to have happened that the reader will find out.

Readers aren't stupid but we have only so much attention and notice a time skip more than a montage or a cut to something else that has the same effect.

>>23208900
>mfw most of the people who were genuinely invested in my future success, i respected most and they respected me in turn, could talk normally and agree to disagree, were open-minded, were all tribes people
>the people i’ve met who had negative traits associated with the tribe were either italian-american, irish, or anglo-saxon

>>23199599
Do you guys remember any other words that end with -lust, that aren't bloodlust and wanderlust?
I've been searching but I haven't found any.
Would be valid to just make up a neo-logism?

>>23210664
Would it*
>>23210586
Can you please elaborate? it sounds interesting.

I don't have enough characters for the plot I've envisioned. There's a big blank space between two plot developments I've outlined. Should I stuff in mindless filler like an underground fighting tournament or a new character who was the MC's hiretho unseen childhood friend that disappears as soon as the plot resumes?

My editor/cowriter critiqued my protagonists motivation as not being good enough.
>Martial arts guy
>Constantly suffocated by his parents not letting him get any stronger or train as much due to familial traditions
>Runs away, blah blah blah
She said that it just felt kinda boring and didn’t have any power behind it.
What do you think?

Pop in this general every half year or so. Shame it's just the same questions over and over again.
>>23210143
>>23210228
Is it something you'd read? Write what you'd read. Just write.
>>23210774
You too. Just write, shit out the words and figure it out in the writing process later. Drink, crossfade, whatever helps. Just write.

>>23210840
What is talent in writing? How does one spot it?

>>23210856
hard to say. Just read more books is what I can suggest. I just finished reading the original Dune trilogy between September to Feburary and I felt like I improved a little bit. Reading the last Tanya the Evil Slop novels before I tackle God Emperor of Dunc and beyond (stopping at Chapterhouse ofc if NATO doesn't war Russia before then). Good luck anonmoose, you can do it.

>>23210863
Personally speaking I think the early 20th to late 19th century is the sweet spot for learning to write by reading. The language exists in a recognizeable and non-archaic form but the field was still prestigious enough to possess certain quality, at least when it comes to classics.
Plus, the timeframe means the wheat has been separated from the chaff pretty well. Unlike newer generations of writer.

>>23210886
That won't help you write like a contemporary. You do need to put in the effort to read what's recent, even the stuff that's kinda sloppy.

>>23210817
She's right. He needs to have a deep personal motivation for training and getting stronger, otherwise he'll seem like a really basic shonen character. (I wanna be... le king of the pirates!!1) It's up to you to work with your co-writer to find a reason for the marital arts guy to care so deeply about training that he'd throw away his traditions and run away from his family.

>>23210817
>My editor/cowriter
Who?
>she
One of your discord friends?

>>23210856
hang out on writer forums/look up writers on youtube and you will see people who truly have writing as their passion, and dedicate all their free time to the craft but after 10+ years can write about as well as an competent fanfic author.

>>23210889
I don't care to write like a contemporary, I care to write well while not being overly archaistic.

how to self publish? preferably a webnovel

which is somewhat tied hard for fire dumpsters of topics such as religion and political bullshit?

How do I be LESS "inspired" when writing? When I look at my favorite authors I see that they managed to make most of what they did with (mostly) individual creativity. And their tropes and cliches only become tropes and cliches because they were the first to come up with and popularize it. How do you be like that? I understand it's impossible not to be at least a bit derivative, I just want to minimize it.

>>23210856
I think it's consistency, humility, imagination and a lifelong pursuit of further learning and improvement.

>>23210856
It's a level of innate skill above what many can accomplish with years of training. You can spot it by first recognizing that talented people, by virtue of their innate abilities, have spent less time being vulnerable to being beaten down by conventional wisdom. Talented writers have quirks and eccentricities within their work which never would have gotten past an English teacher. There is a certain arrogance intrinsic to talent that doesn't take instruction well, because instructors are not usually themselves talented — those who can do; those who can't teach — and because they want to explore the subject on their own.

>>23211496
turn abstract things unrelated to your favorite authors into ideas,
beat as well the uneasiness of logical plot threads that don't have "that feel", engineer them in your mind until it feels good

it's also my personal thing so take it with caution,
but I go to internet places, especially threads on 4chins, that make me mad, read so much and get so involved to the point of inner mental breakdown and turn that tipping point into a plot idea,
essentially turning artificial mental illness into story ideas

>>23211500
except two guys will match your description and one will be amazing after two years of practice and the other still awful after twenty, and that difference is what talent is. people are not equal.

>>23211496
You have to take a core idea or theme that you understand innately and find solutions for how to implement it effectively. Or you take an old Greek myth or drama and adapt it, which presents problems that need solving and leads to different outcomes. Barely disguised Shakespeare plays are pretty common. It's something you can only talk about through example.

I've heard the novel in its higher forms described as a nearly plotless series of events that revolve around a central moment of enlightenment or tragedy. I don't think that's a conscious process but it does build something new. At the core, it's about what a character does in a given situation and the consequences of it. Situations are never the same, characters are unique, and I think that even if you presented the same story, old versions can be shown to be wrong, or at least different reactions and solutions can come from them. With the Greek play examples, remove the direct intervention of the gods and you have a different story.

Tropes are formed through time because they are effective drama and subversion (hi tvtropes) is more an act of applying a different lens to the situation than looking for a way to subvert them. The method yields a different result, not the problem.

>>23211578
Nice story.

>>23210908
What's so wrong about seeking strength?

>>23211621
Why does he seek strength? It's not impossible for someone to one day wake up and decide that they want to be strong above all else, but it's not as interesting in a story if the protagonist has no real reason for wanting that.
You don't even need a particularly strong reason in my opinion, he could've just been bullied once or he was helping someone and he couldn't lift something so he was asked to go somewhere else so he doesn't get in the way.

>>23210889
Why would you want to write like the authors of today when the authors of today are shit and won't be read ten years from now, let alone a hundred?

You fuckers need to decide right now what it is you want. Either you want to play the game of modern literature, like that anon in one of these threads who studied modern writing like a good boy and wrote in unremarkable environmental prose like a good boy and got himself a dozen publications like a good boy... or you want to be a great writer. You want to create unique art that stays with people their whole lives. You want to be read a hundred years from now.

Fair warning: they're mutually exclusive, because despite claiming otherwise there's nothing the literary industry hates more than someone who stands out. So your choices for contemporary literary fiction are:

>I am a brooding, pilled-up woman who regrets her life choices
>white kids made fun of my name/clothes/lunch/I just don't like them
>I am a tranny and ths is a tranny allegory
>this is a two page description of the wallpaper in a room not because it's thematically significant, but because that's what people told me literary fiction is

Make your choice.

>>23211614
i don't understand how you could be this sheltered. were you homeschooled or something? people are not equal in ability and they will never be, it's a basic fact of life. they don't have the same brains or bodies.

I have the opposite of writers block. Too many ideas, too many characters, plots, settings, and iterations thereof. It is crippling.
I am trying to chart them all out and create a system where I can rank them by interest, ease, and marketability to figure out what is worth pursuing but it feels like an impossible task and I can never settle on anything for long.

I wish I could be the type who becomes enamoured with a singular vision.

>>23211751
You don't have to do all that. Just write it all down, forget about it, and come back to it after a week. Most of it will look like shit, because it was shit.

>>23211685
nothing you write in 2024 is ever going to be great immortal literature because the medium has lost all social relevance, you might as well become a mime. men don't read fiction, women only read slop, you can't alter anybody's life with your writing because nobody will read it and if they do they will only understand it through the lens of social media politics anyway, you'd rationally have a better chance of making a difference pontificating on youtube. the only rational reason to write literature in 2024 is essentially hedonistic personal amusement, ie if it brings you joy to compose nice sentences and don't care if nobody reads them, if you actually write as part of some deranged narcissistic larp about posthumous fame then you're the saddest faggot on earth

>>23211759
Literally one of the ideas I had was about sentient turds living on a planet inside a giant cosmic toilet bowl. I don't care if it's shit, I embrace the shit life, let the shits fall where they may. I don't need to neurotically fret over quality I need focus, direction.

>>23211685
Man stop sucking your own dick so hard, it's embarrassing. It's admirable to want to create great art but thinking you're oh so special for it is cringe inducing. Especially when you're probably one of the biggest begs in the thread

>>23211751
Just put everything in a tl;dr greentext formula and then work from there by writing that shit.

...you are doing your own editings, self-publishing and everything else to avoid giving out money, yes?

>>23211797
Insurance won't cover the necessary child labor, even if it's for "educational purposes".

>>23211765
My goal is to sell the TV/movie rights to any of my stories. That's where the real money is, and has long been.

>>23211838
it also requires pretty massive success to begin with lol

>>23211838
My goal is to win the lottery. That's where the real money is, and has long been.

>>23212007
Sadly, winning the lottery is more likely that succeeding as an author. Off to buy my Powerball & Mega Millions tickets myself.

>>23211685
Because I like what I read from the authors of today. I'm not going to write in an antiquated style because it's more pleasing, and retarded advice like yours is why /lit/ struggles to get anywhere.

>>23212018
Succeeding as an author? By what metric? Because that's definitely not true if you're just trying to make normal wages. Selling TV rights and becoming a multi millionaire? Yeah, lol. Lottery is probably more likely

>>23199599
Just got this rejection letter for my short story to Narrative magazine

>Thank you very much for sending your work to Narrative. We are always grateful for the opportunity to review new material, and we have given [STORY NAME] close attention and careful consideration. We found many strengths to recommend your work and, overall, much to admire. We regret, however, that [STORY NAME] is not quite right for us. We encourage you to try us again soon, and we hope that you will. Sincerely, The Editors

I'm wondering what kind of rejection is this. Is this the "shit story that didn't even make it past the junior readers to they editors and they just said 'not quite right for us' just to be polite" rejection, or is it a "the story is based and quality that the main editors liked but genuinely could not find place for in their magazine for a myriad of subjective reasons" rejection?

>>23212110
It's a very typical template answer. "We don't want your piece of shit, but we can't say that because it'd be bad press, so here's something roundabout and vaguely complimentary to make you feel better, pls don't reply or start anything awkward".

>>23212164
>rejectionwiki dot com slash index dot php?title=Narrative
According to this, this was slightly higher tier- which probably means that it reached the editors who then read and decided against it. Tbh I'm totally fine with that

How do you create a complex (bordering on convoluted) mystery?

>>23211651
He fights to find out WHY he wants to fight so much. That's part of his core motivation

>>23212414
Okay, so as the author, you should already know why your character wants to fight so much, even if your character doesn't. What is that reason?

>>23212440
Well, I workshopped the backstory with my cowriter.
>Guy is born to martial artist family and whatnot
>Huge familial tradition to do martial arts shit blah blah blah
>Now, here’s the thing.
>He’s a bit strange when it comes to fighting as he tends to take it far more seriously than his family does. This makes them kind of look down on him for not paying attention to the art part of martial arts.
>This all kind of comes to a head when he starts reading about his great grandparent (No idea if it should be a mother or father.) What he found out so throughly sickened him that he flat out started to despise his family.
>He related immensely to his great grandparent and felt like said ancestor was pretty much the only one who he feels would’ve understood his mindset.
>His ancestor is the reason this family is even alive today, and yet they not only refuse to honor the glorious sonuvabitch’s memory, but actively look down on them because all they see is “An obsessive dumbass who got killed over their desire to fight”
>This is why he leaves home.

>>23212262
>>23212164
>junior readers
Doesn't it bother you that retarded 18-year-old SSRI zoomers are put in charge of judging your story's quality.

>>23212642
Why are you focusing on plot minutiae instead of the actual writing? Why are you even writing if you don't care about it and it's your lowest priority? This isn't a book, it's a screenplay.

>>23212642
Cool, but that doesn't explain at all why he wants to fight. This backstory is a consequence of his desire to fight, not an explanation of it.
As you've said before, he fights to find out WHY he wants to fight so much. So WHY does he want to fight so much?
Given that this is part of his core motivation, I would assume the reasons for his desire to fight will be discovered over the course of the story. As the author who wrote the story and presumably wrote developments in which the protagonists discovers the WHYs behind his desire to fight, tell me what these WHYs are.

>>23212642
I refuse to belive you speak to female humans on a regular basis

>>23212683
Don't be a cunt

>>23212381
Chandler covers it somewhere in the first 10 pages of his treatise, talking about Christie and Milne and the other britbongs. In about a paragraph. You make it depend on obnoxious minutiae of planning and detail that are probably dumb and impossible to implement.

Or you bury the lead and obfuscate the case with false suspects and red herrings that are layered to the point the reader can't reasonably keep up because it's boring. Lord Chuzzlewit had many enemies who all had reason to kill him: his meddling in India attracted the ire of some government who would prefer he not buy the mines, his wife hated him because he slapped her around, his mistress was promised a fat diamond necklace she could sell, his brother wants to inherit, he pissed off the gardener who is his bastard and could be easily recognized by the parish priest who is the brother of the woman he knocked up, a rival lord doesn't want him voting w certain way next election, and he said the wrong thing to his doctor last visit for his weekly laudanum. Wrestling with newfangled technology a la Rising Sun is the third.

Lesser mysteries usually follow the same lines. Novel mysteries that aren't straight detective fiction are a slightly different beast and we'd have to pull out the Diana Wynne Jones to discuss.

>finally finish the story
>ctrl+f suddenly
>160 results
how the fuck did it happen to me

>>23213102
how did it end up like this? it was only a kiss
it was only a kiss

>>23212678
It's a combination of wanting to honor his grandparent's memory and stick it to his family, because it's the among the only things that he's comfortable doing, and how it's because he wants to prove people wrong
People constantly doubt him over the course of the story, asking why he doesn't do something more "Healthy" for himself, such as art or writing or raising a family or dancing or taking up some other hobby. Every time someone calls what he does a hobby, he takes great offense because to him, fighting isn't a hobby or a game or a job or even a lifestyle, but something he NEEDS to do. Not even because he likes it or dislikes it, but because he knows he must in order to prove to himself and others. To paraphrase someone
>Athletes fight for a career
>Fighters live to fight
>Warriors fight to live
He's none of these things. He's not aiming for money, power, survival, because someone told him to, or entertainment. He fights to prove a point through his actions.

>>23213313
>It was only some piss