/lit/ - Literature

Magic IS real. Schizo theories of signatures and demonology is correct. Gematria is true. I am retarded.

>>22981160
You're right!

retroactively refuted by Ἀμμώνιος

>>22981187
wut u mean??

>>22981170
nothing of which has to do with Platonism. Are you drunk or expressing your truth?

>>22981198
No, he's the schizo and I'm drunk. Drunks believe in Plato, schizos believe in gematria.

(drunks know gematria is a ripoff of Greco-Egyptian numerology)

symposium = drunk = Greek thinking

It's in the rules don't blame me.

>>22981198
>Theory of signatures
>nothing to do with platonism
sure.

>>22981160
>Plato
BTFO by neuroscience

>>22981160
If platonic forms are real what is the platonic form of ejaculate?

>>22981160
>forms are reeeeal
whooa tell me more! like things actually exist? noway!

>>22981205
but Socrates never got drunk in the Symposium

I liked the various dialogues but then I started reading The Republic and he's kinda retarded
>kids should be raised communally and parenthood should be abolished
>kids should be robots that have no autonomy outside of serving state
>no one should have any rights at all unless they are for the express purpose of building and maintaining the state
>all sex and procreation must by necessity be eugenic, for the good of the state of course
What good is the state if it doesn't actually foster an enjoyable life?

Lol. Lmao even.

>>22981315
>Plato is dogshit when he's not repeating socrates
Who wouldve thunk

>>22981315
The Republic is an autist's wet dream

>>22981452
imagine being able to mog fucking Plato of all people like it's nothing.

>>22981315
He literally just copied sparta

>>22981315
people always focus on the points that were meant to filter retards. the aim of the dialogue is made clear in the first two books. read it again.

>>22981452
>>22981479
That second paragraph isn't in Diogenes Laertius' book. It's literally made up by some butthurt redditor.
Also:
>...and one day when Plato had invited to his house friends coming from Dionysius, Diogenes trampled upon his carpets and said, "I trample upon Plato's vainglory." Plato's reply was, "How much pride you expose to view, Diogenes, by seeming not to be proud." Others tell us that what Diogenes said was, "I trample upon the pride of Plato," who retorted, "Yes, Diogenes, with pride of another sort."

>>22981504
There are a lot of good criticisms to be made of cynicism.
That they make a show of their poverty while pretending to renounce distinction seems to be the gist of Plato's critique.
Cynics are somewhat similar to hippies and can be critiqued similarly for being hypocritical using the renunciation of distinction as a way to gain it...
Another critique I find compelling is that they really are not self sufficient. I can't remember the author, but he critiqued them on the grounds that they were dependent on begging and more abstractly that no one is really self-sufficient. As everyone in a civil society is dependent on other's work in one way or another.

>>22981205
>symposium
>"drunk"
>Socrates gives a toast at the beginning of Symposium imploring all those present to drink to moderation and NOT get drunk

You never read it, did you?
>>22981218
in what way does neuroscience btfo Plato?

>>22981561
>accuses people of not reading it
>later on they are definitely at the very least tipsy while alcibiades is super drunk
Very impressive anon.

>>22981561
Usually, people who say "neuroscience refuted this" have no idea about neuroscience or at most have something they have read in a Malcom Gladwell-style book.

>>22981567
>>alcibiades is super drunk
this just confirms you haven't read it.

Since when did /lit/ become /x/
>B-b-bbuttt it's in a book
Fuck off

>>22981160
Imma analytical method the shit outta your bitch-ass propositions.
>The Forms ARE real
Define "forms". Define "being". Define "realness".
>Essence precedes existence
Define "essence". Define "preceding". Define "existence".
> the highest level of reality is perceivable only by the intellect
Define "highness". Define "level". Define "reality". Define "percievability". Define "intellect".

>>22981595
define "imma". Define "analytical". Define "method". Define "propositions".

>>22981578
Alcibiades is very drunk but also he is a latecomer and he was already drunk before he showed up at the gathering. FYI that’s like basic Platonist dialogue stuff.

>>22981627
exactly. he wasn't a part of the symposium. the only person with any deep philosophical insight in the dialogue is socrates who wasn't drunk.
>FYI that’s like basic Platonist dialogue stuff
now this is just embarassing

>>22981170
>>22981198
>>22981204

peak 4channel

>>22981600
Define "define".

>>22981170
>Magic IS real
Yes. Computer programs.
>signatures
Chemical bonds, logic gates.
>demonology
Abstract memes.
>Gematria is true
Jews are retarded.
>I am retarded
Yes.

>>22981315
Well? How is he wrong?

>>22981197
Probably referring to Ammonius Saccas for some indiscernible reason.
>>22981452
>Diogenes got brutally filtered by Parmenides
Not the first, nor the last smug retard to endure this fate.

hardly anybody knows what the forms are, what it means to participate in them, or what they imply. most people who like Plato, especially on this board, have been conned into embracing a philosophical creole behind which there is no substance, explanatory power, or commensurability with modern thinking. metapolitics is certainly behind the shell-game enthusiasm. the remaining few who study Plato seriously are desperate scholars who are unlikely to find a satisfying answers.

>>22981922
t. desperate aristotelian thomist

>>22981160
No colours without light, no light without darkness, no darkness without space, no space without time. Space and time are these Forms. Anything else is not knowable.

>>22981930
Neither space nor time mean anything in isolation. If nothing else is knowable, then those two things would not be knowable either since space and time only have meaning in the context of particular objects.

How are the Forms related to the instances, that is, how does the actual relates to the potential? How does the former cause the latter?

Are the platonism forms a type of theism?

>>22981943
>Neither space nor time mean anything in isolation.
>in isolation
In themselves, yes, because they're not things in themselves, but they can be examined individually, as did Kant.

>>22981928
Aristotle was a Platonist though

>>22981780
he did say women were just as capable to be soldiers as men so yeah he was wrong

>>22981315
The Republic is an analogy, retard.

>>22981489
>>22983160
This is such cope. Imagining the perfect city is a crucial step in Socrates/Plato's attempt to discover the nature of justice. If he's wrong about what a perfect city would be, then he's probably also wrong about justice, and he knows this. Therefore he must have thought that his idea of a perfect city was actually perfect. And that's retarded.

>inb4 he was describing an ideal but wasn't trying to make it actually practical or something that could exist in reality
No, Socrates explicitly objects to this idea. He thinks it could and should be achieved in reality.

>>22982130
Hence why they cannot be forms.
>>22982763
Aristotle was a midwit pseud (the best one to ever live).

>>22982763
No

>>22981160
Aristotle demolished the doctrine of the forms and we’re just going to pretend like it didn’t happen? Feel like you’re in a high caste yet?

>>22983218
yeah the dialogues defenitely wasn't about the tripartite soul

>>22981227

>>22983234
Do you think platonic Ideas are things in themselves? That's what Schopenhauer believed, and I agree with him. Maybe there ought to be a distinction between the kantian Forms and the platonic Ideas.

>>22982116
According to orthodox Jewish, Christian, and Muslim interpretation? Yes, absolutely.

>>22981568
>>22981561
The Churchlands have their fedoras on so tight that they're reviving Platonism, you should go check them out.

>>22981556
maybe this is my personal bias or lack of knowledge but as much of a shit poster Diogenes was he didn't actually have anything to replace the systems and ideas he shit on. the best he could come up with is going "that's stupid" but most things end up "stupid" if you put too much thought into them, but most of the time they still work on some level or have value.

there is no way to build a culture off being a cynic only to critique the one you're already in.