/lit/ - Literature

>>22847577
Now go to the gay sex feelings version and look at the reviews.
Tldr;
Women be gay

Homer is the most based

>>22847577
>Hamlet
>Demons
>Faust
>The Sailor who fell from Grace with the Sea

>>22847577

"Before Otto left for Italy that summer, he told me that no woman could ever understand his work."

-Leopold Weininger (father of Otto)

>>22848331
Based. Based beyond belief. If my father ever quotes me, even once, saying something this based, I will consider myself to have been a good son.

The Age of Reason; Sartre
Venus in Furs; Sacher-Masoch

>>22847577
Reading this book now but it's hard to read. Is it possible i'm a woman? Or have i not gotten to the good part? (i'm on chapter 1 still)

Funny, some women love the silmarillion though its written in the same format as this.

>>22848900
What translation?

>>22848900
Don't ask for other people's approval. Men don't. Learn from that

>>22847577
Catcher in the Rye, for some fucking reason

>>22848900
If it's Lattimore and you're having trouble then yes you're a woman

>>22847577
>"X will never understand Y."
>Evidence: "Some X fail to understand Y."

If that's valid, then I'll throw out there that both men and women seem unable to understand introductory logic texts.

>>22849588
Anon knows it, yeah Lattimore made the best english translation, his attempt to mimic the ancient meter is decent.

>>22847577
Storm of Steel

>>22847577
Everything Melville wrote

>>22847580
>11 pages listing soilders names
He's actually listing their geneologies, ethnic heritage, and familial histories. Not to mention what those cultures are most known and renowned for, especially in war. Their names take up a very small part of it. I guess it depends on which translation you're reading, too. For an English speaker, the only acceptable translation is Cowper's.

>>22847577
Homer was a woman.

>>22847577
Could someone recommend me an Odyssey translation?
Something with impact, beautifully written, and maybe a little lesser known.
Or should I just go with Fagles or Fitzgerald?

>>22850386
Actually, Samuel Butler’s theory was that the Odyssey was written by a woman not the Iliad. Generally no one contests the Iliad was the work of a man.

>>22850423
Chapman is S-Tier. Lang, Leaf, and Myers is the most accurate, using the idiom of the KJV, but does suffer from some awkward word order in some places. Both are public domain.

>>22850350
it's hard for women to relate to gay sailors

>>22850772
That’s why Querrelle is another piece of art no woman could ever truly appreciate.

>>22847577
Homer is funny because out of all the men who are "inspired" by him, 99% just end up the same moralfag niggercattle as anyone else, except also with librarian attitude
It's crasy that 100% of womenand 99% of men get filtered by Homer

>>22847577

>>22848970
Emily Wilson’s

>>22850883
NO
Worst of the worst

Otto Weininger's Sex and Character

>>22850772
Is the book actually gay? Or is it like Achilles where it's just up to people's opinion

>>22851669
>Achilles
huh? is he was gay why then did he chimp out when Agamemnon took Briseis from him?

>>22850423
Fagles is as solid as it gets. All the other niche picks aren't worth your time.

>>22851693
From what I remember it was basically bacause A) she was his property and B) he was tired of Agamemnon's shit

>>22851693
Is EYSL?

>>22850423
pope. english and ancient greek are different enough that you cant create an accurate translation so you might as well go with somebody who keeps the story and themes the same and adapts it to modern english verse in the best way possible.

>>22850883
kys

meanwhile in the Odyssey...

>Penelope keeps a retinue of beta orbiters at her house
>strings them along using her dead husband's food & wine ("muh xenia")
>promises to marry one when she's done weaving, every night she undoes the weaving she did during the day
>holds out not in case Odysseus shows up, but because she's a woman and literally can't decide between the top 3 suitors
>scores points by painting herself as the victim while basking in the attention of ancient Greece's 100 most eligible bachelors
>not surprisingly, 20 centuries of kissless incel Homeric Greek translators & commentators miss the true story

I haven't started the Illiad yet, but I hear Helen only talks about herself every chance she gets. Women read this stuff and they know exactly whats going on, they understand it perfectly.

>t. knows

>>22847584
I can’t believe the gay fanfiction is higher rated than the classic. Where did society go wrong

>>22847580
/lit/ always shits on the bible for having genealogies, though

>>22854804
This. It always makes me scratch my head when I see people complain about it not being accurate enough. Pope's translation was a massive achievement, and to see people trash it for not being 100% literal is really sad.
>inb4 "It is a pretty poem, Mr. Pope, but you must not call it Homer."

>>22850819
Half the people who rave about this book today are all natural cabin-in-the-woods pumpkin spice latte women.

>>22855694
Does that make it a bad book

>>22855721
No, but women can understand it.

>>22850536
The Odyssey was translated by Lang and Butcher. Lang, Leaf and Myers translated the Iliad.

>>22848331
>>22848342
I have to amend my statement. As based as it seems, this man met a completely unbased end and ran along the periphery of the lowliest of circles. Intelligent though he may be, without even reading the work I can tell you his intelligence will have been grossly distorted by his spiritual issues.

>>22850883
I unironically want to read her translation - even though it will probably be a distortion.

>>22855733
Liking and understanding are not the same thing, but I'm not taking a side, as I haven't read the book.

>>22856298
His spiritual issue was he was born a jew

>>22857371
Thanks for that worthless /pol/ answer to a question I wasn't asking. There's no way I could have thought of something so original, so insightful, and so deep on my own.

Where the fuck do I go for book reviews? Every book I check out on Goodreads has reviews that shoehorn goyslop politics into it

>>22847577

>>22847577
>the one that started it all
>one star, pretty boring, cliche
boy oh boy

>>22847920
Hamlet is one of Shakespeare's best plays, I can appreciate that. Or what about it do you think women can't understand?

>>22850819
Wasn't his mom still doing his laundry while he was living "in the wilderness"

>>22848353
>Sartre

>>22858885
Because she loved him and he suffered from mental illness. Living in the woods made him better however.

>>22858879
He's saying that because it's about the son's responsibility to the father to oppose a traitorous mother - seems like the story must originally be derived from the Oresteia which ends up being explicitly about the need for the masculine to exert control over the feminine in order to direct and channel its mysterious, uncontrolled power. Much of Aeschylus seems to draw on this sort of alchemical interaction between masculine and feminine, perhaps having something to do with his status as an Eleusinian initiate.
Hamlet is inimitable. I sometimes feel like Caesar is a bit more "solid", but in addition to all the wild variety of impressions it offers, Hamlet is extremely well put together too.

>>22858860
/lit/ says shit like this all the time tbf. It's not hard to fall into that mentality, it takes time to come around to fully appreciating how immense Homer was.
One of the reviews I actually found a bit thought-provoking was a woman talking about how she and her son decided that, while Homer is Important, tragedy is the strictly better version of Greek mythological poetry. I can sympathize, I certainly have a taste for the extremes of tragedy, but I do think their reaction is a good case study of degeneration - the true, unadulterated form of myth is too impassive, too heavy, too much like the gods themselves in its incontrovertibility, so we create instead the popular form which shows us the reaction to the story rather than the story itself. It's a Perseus' mirror in which we can bear to look at the truth because it is distorted into something that looks like us.

>>22858890
Have you read it? Didn't think so. Fucking pseuds...

>>22859438
French Existentialism is incredibly shallow. I had my Sartre/Camus phase in secondary school, have you graduated yet anon?

>>22856298
Every translation is, necessarily, a distortion.

>>22858977
Yes, of course your gender is the one that needs to be in control, how very convenient.

>>22855642
Most people don't make it through them. Ever notice that a lot of reviews are based on the first 10-20 pages of a book?

>>22858977
>tbf
Stopped reading there.

>>22859971
Assume you're just trolling but either way I was not trying to put forth my own position on the matter, I was just talking about Hamlet.

>>22859597
Ah, not only a pseud - a tranny pseud. Fascinating...

>>22859962
You know what I mean, retard. A distortion beyond the typical. What is with you people and your need for attention?

>>22850883
>emily
into the trash

if i learn koine greek, will i be able to read homer without looking up every second word or will it be too arcaic?

>>22850386
>>22850429
homer was a guild of poets

>>22855680
"Accurate" translations are neither pretty nor Homer.

>>22847577
Pic rel. Women might enjoy it, but they will never understand it.

>>22850883

>>22850772
what's gay about any Melville character? Most of his characters are strong emodients of legitimate masculinity. Men can care for one another without sticking their dicks in eachothers ass. You sound insecure.

>>22855733
Women don't understand it. Women don't understand solitude, they are incapable of it. They cease to exist when they are alone

>>22857430
Calm down faggot

>>22848353
Finally someone else mentions Age of Reason. It's probably my favourite book. I used to do coke with this 40 year old korean lady when I was like 20 something. The book really resonated with me.

>>22861190
The DeShawn translation unironically captures the spirit of Homer better than Lattimore

>>22855733
Doesn't the fact that they are " all natural cabin-in-the-woods pumpkin spice latte women" already prove that they misinterpret it?

>>22861200
>frothing at the mouth over gay sailors and calling other people insecure
Lol.

>>22860913
What's the saying? Si elle est belle elle n'est pas fidele et si elle est fidele elle n'est pas belle?

>>22861477
You kid, but but a lot of translations do seem to miss the fundamental orality of Homer. A lot of translations of the Airs of the States from the Classic of Poetry don't really feel like folk songs, either.

>>22860385
Grow up, please.

>>22861190
I took an odyssey class in college last year and it was based on the Wilson translation. It completely sterilized and took any of the enjoyment out of the text. I had to drop it two weeks in. Fuck academia

>>22861303
>I used to do coke with this 40 year old korean lady when I was like 20 something
why

>>22861917
>being a man is like not caring about anything
die in a fire

>>22849590
>both men and women seem unable to understand introductory logic texts
Unironically yes, just like how the Iliad falls into the category "women will never understand" logic generally tends to fall into the category "humans will never understand."

>>22858787
Why do you even want to read book reviews?

>>22850811
Explain Homer then

>>22862778
I think it speaks for itself.

>>22862888
is she supposed to be an escort? am I missing something here?

>>22862873
Just kind of a habit I guess. The synopsis never goes into enough detail, but the reviews can't really capture how the book is written.

>>22862881
Homer is easy to get, hard to emulate. You can superficially approve of him but you won't be him and you won't be Achilles
Homer physically filters almost everyone who reads him.

>>22862938
You got filtered. While I agree that Homer is about a masculine ideal that transcends mere letters or ars gratia artis, the focal point of the Iliad is Achilles and Priam's relationship.

>>22862952
holy based...

>>22862952
>someone on /lit/ understands the Iliad
Uhm, wtf??!?!

>>22860822
just learn attic; youll be able to read koine and homer

has all discourse on this forum devolved into women and homosexuals fighting for attention

>>22847577
White women seem to hate classic books. Non-white women usually have good reviews

>>22862952
>While I agree
Well that was my point. 99% of men who read about it don't emulate it, regardless of the focal point in the plot (please elaborate btw)

>>22857430
>Thanks for that worthless /pol/ answer
You say that as if it invalidates what the other anon said. Stay triggered

>>22863241
It was never valid to begin with, brainlet. Stay retarded.

>>22862409
Oh, DO shut up already, la mature non-reader, scoffertard pseud. Your uneducated opinion, which amounted to nothing more than a brainless scoffer's cackling, is as worthless as your estimation of the maturity of a man you do not know. Eviscerate yourself tranny - not just your loins.

>>22861303
It is an excellent work. I consider even were women to read it and enjoy themselves, it would be for the vague atmosphere French works manage to carry; the flaws of the characters run too close to the nature of man for women to understand it. Indeed, I've yet to meet a woman who does.

I actually think some Murakami novels would qualify. Most who read Murakami, with the exception perhaps of Norwegian Wood (which was awful) are young men, and I think this is because the particular neuroticisms of his protagonists are distinctive of male psychology. Then again, I haven't read Murakami in more than 10 years.

>>22863714
What do you think of KotS?

>>22861978
mais si elle n'est pas belle, elle n'est pas non plus fidèle

>>22863853
I remember liking it - I romanticize the Mazda Miata precisely as a result of that novel, but my favorites were HBWatEotW and SotBWotS.

>>22863697
a very embarrassing post