/lit/ - Literature

>>22746115
doesn't matter

He was prison straight

>>22746115
Only fags show their nipples.

>>22746115
elton john also married a woman, do you think that nigga is straight? Mishima never lived in an era where it was socially permissible to come out, and he also had a very high and demanding social position. of COURSE he married and had children, just like every gay in a similar position had done for many years prior. his relations with men are well documented. Confessions of a Mask is an obviously autobiographical work with a gay protagonist. Forbidden Colors contains detailed information about the mid 20th century japanese gay scene that he could not have known without personal experience. he collaborated extensively with known homo Akihiro Miwa who he was also fucking. yes, he was gay

>>22746115
what's your point?

Three hours passed since I returned home.
The temperatural situation has improved from 14' Celsius to 15' Celsius. Yayy!

>>22746115
He had gay sex with teen boys in Brazil

most people are fluid

>>22746115
Currently reading this, already ordered the last three books of this tetralogy, Kokoro by Natsume Soseki and The Makioka Sisters by Jun'ichirō Tanizaki to start my japanese /lit/ journey. What more books should I read? No meme answers plox.

>>22746297
no we aren't you stupid pedofaggot

>>22746396
I enjoyed Akutagawa Ryunosuke's stuff. Read Kappa and his short story collection.

>>22746511
Thanks anon. Is this a good place to start?

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/15834476-rash-mon-and-seventeen-other-stories

>>22746297
I can’t even tell if men are attractive or not let alone actually be attracted to them.

>>22746297
No.

>>22746430
>>22746577
>>22746604
your repression is showing

>>22746293
this is based according to e-rightists

>>22746617
He's right though. Porn and faggotry will save western civilization.

>>22746115
Am I gay? Are you? What's happening in this thread?

>>22746554
Yeah, that's the story collection I read. It has a wide range of genres and the titular Rashmon is often taught in Japanese schools, if I remember correctly (and is a retelling of a classic).

>>22746732
Thanks, it's been added to my wish list now.

>>22746297
Historically, in japan they didn't perceive gay and straight the same way as westerners. Many prominent figures had sex with men and boys as well as women. These men would be married to women, have children with them, and even have extramarital concubines. To them, it was simply a matter of sex, which was considered private and natural and even fundamental.

>>22746293
And? So did I and I'm straight

>>22746115
We can make matters simple and rephrase the question:
>If he were alive today would he identify as such?
Almost certainly not.

>>22747262
Not only is that not a simplification, you're needlessly complicating it. Here's a better one: did he fuck men? And the answer is yes

>>22747279
You don't seem to understand what constitutes simplicity. My answer is clear. Yours is invented and sourced from ambiguous third parties.

>>22746115
He was probably bi. The evidence of him being exclusively gay is flimsy.

>>22747294
Do you even believe what you're saying?

>>22746115
he also had a gay lover.

>>22746396
A Personal Matter by Kenzaburō Ōe and The Wind up Bird Chronicle by Haruki Murakami

>>22748386
>A Personal Matter by Kenzaburō Ōe
Thanks Anon, will check this one out

>Murakami
I said no meme answers desu

>>22746115
>>22746121
Was he gay? Was he bi? Was he pan? Was he bicurious? Was lgtbtq+++? Who fucking knows, but he definitely is not straight. He's the type who tries so hard to be masculine and straight because he is neither.

>>22746297
>>22746609
I genuinely feel like I am completely straight. As straight as humanely possible.

>>22747262
Doesn't matter if he woukd identify or not. The truth is he wasn't straight, which means he is a faggot.

>>22746115
I've heard that all of his gay lobers stated, they did some strange stuff but never actually peepee in the poopoo or whatever. But I don't care enough to fact check this

>>22746115
Hetero conservatives and right wingers literally don't exist. The need for hypermasculinity order is just their suppressed homo thoughts cope.

>>22748832
yeah u need help bro

>>22748832
and honestly, it sounds like your homo thoughts cope is that everyone who denies having them is homo. very circular of you.

I am a hyper masculine tradlarping reactionary and I AM a closet homo

>>22746164
Yes he was fucking him but he only topped. I'm tired of people trying to smear mishima by calling him gay

>>22749214
topping is actually gayer than bottoming

>>22748832
This. It's no coincidence that many right wingers are incels aka repressed gays.

>>22748832
>>22749251
>Admiring another mans discipline and strength and invigorating you to do the same is considered gay

I hope the parasites inside you finally kill you.

>>22746115
He could've been bi, but moreover, homosexuals have been living as heterosexuals and carrying on affairs in secret (or just writing angsty homoerotic poetry to cope) for centuries.
I mean shit, my next door neighbors are a married gay boomer couple and both of them have kids from previous marriages to women because they spent most of their lives in the closet.

>>22746115
I think he was like a 5 out 6 on the kinsey scale. Reading some of his books he definitely had some kind of attraction to women. Anyway, he was one a sexy mf.

>>22746115
>He was married to a woman and had 2 children
So was Wilde.

>>22750264
Gide was also married and had a child. anyone can get it up for a woman if they focus hard enough. doesn't mean it's what they prefer

A lot of men and women are bi but don't act on it. They should tho, it's quite open minding.

>>22750264
That makes them bi.
Because a gay man wouldnt be able to have an erection and cum inside a woman, I think !

>>22750292
Being gay opens something alright, but it isnt your mind.

>>22746115
>urrAAAAAAAR AY'Muh COOMINGUGAAAARG

>>22746396
Temple of the Golden Pavilion as well

>>22750379
Being gay and being bi is different, and experimenting in sexuality is open minding, as well as ass opening.

>>22746164
If you can get it up without chemical help to impregnate a women, you are by definition at least bi not "gay".

>>22750332
>Because a gay man wouldnt be able to have an erection and cum inside a woman, I think !
Are you gay for jerking off your own cock?

>>22750332
i can get a hard on and cum without thinking about anything, male or female

>>22750452
This one seems to get mentioned quite a lot so I guess I'll check it out. Thanks anon!

>>22750332
>>22750474
>fapping is an intrinsically homosexual enterprise
Ah this old chestnut.

>>22746115
No. He just had a fetish for masculinity.

>>22746115
Then I'd say no, at most he could've been bisexual.

>>22750488
wat lmao

>>22750544
i can just rub my dick and not think any kind of sexual thoughts or look at any sexual material and get hard and nut. are you saying you can't?

>>22750547
you're not allowed here unless you're over the age of 18

>>22750583
i'm 25. i'm sorry that you suffer from ED bro. you should lead a more active lifestyle, it's probably a circulatory problem

>>22746115
Gay :(
Japan gay :)

He was completely gay or almost completely gay, because he thought not having kids was degenerate and life-denying. That's what I gleaned from reading Confessions, Forbidden Colors, TTOTGP and After the Banquet.

>>22750990
He has kids because...

>>22750993
Forbidden Colors contains a very detailed passage about the explicitly gay protagonist having sex with his wife by imagining she's a man

>>22746115
Mishima was straight. It's called cognitive dissonance.

>>22751043
look me in my eyes and tell me this is a heterosexual man

>>2274611
Mishima was an aesthetic pervert who without a doubt had such a flourishing fantasy that he could indulge and enjoy sex with both men and women, he was too intoxicated with beauty to not be attracted to the male form and masculinity, as he shows again and again in his novels, but he also shows and it is proven by statements of family and friends, that he found great joy and fulfillment in his family life and as a husband of a women. You will not get far trying to label him.

>>22751064
just artsy

>>22751170
mishima homo deniers will really latch on to any amount of plausible deniability rather than accept the obvious

>>22751064
>>22751170
>>22751174
I have no dog in this fight, but I think the Japanese are just so fucked up that he might not be gay, just Japanese (fucked up)

>>22746115
As he died he came.

>>22751191
as soon as the blade tore open his flesh, the bright disk of the sun rose up and he nutted in his pants

>>22751191
This is hilarious

>>22748832
>>22748690
Indeed

>>22746115
>>22746293
>>22750292


Marlon Brando also fucked plenty of guys, admitted it to the press and nobody ever called him gay or even bi, so who you fuck has nothing at all to do with "bi" or "gay" it's about how you carry yourself and choose to identify. If you're going to be a faggot twerking on a float then yes you're gay. If not, then you are just a normal person.

>>22751457
The general consensus is that Brando was a dirty bislut.

>>22748638
Murakami is ok but wind up bird is bad. Read Norweegian Wood, it's his best book.

>>22751064
I look like this

>>22752625
east coast US?

>>22752638
No, Eastern European man in his early 20s

>>22752639
please be in wraclow PLEASE

M A C H O C A L A D O
A
C
H
O

C
A
L
A
D
O

>>22752639
>in his early 20s

That's not a man, that's a twink

>>22753661
once u can grow a beard (western men) u should transition to a man who fucks twinks and has a family

>>22746115
Like most bisexual men, he loved men more than he loved women. That being said, there is something to be said about how Mishima desperately wanted to be taken seriously as a man and wanting to be a part of the masculine imperial tradition despite loving gay sex. It's actually kinda sad.

>>22753730
Samurai and Buddhist monks practiced pederasty in the feudal age and their descendants would go into fuck the traps who played women in Edo period kabuki plays. Western christian sexual taboos have no bearing on the samurai mind.

>>22746577
Bullshit. Just glimpse at picrel. Pure, heartthrobbing male beauty

>>22754061
Peak male beauty.

>>22753728

This is easier said than done, innit?

>>22753730
>>22753749

This is actually true. The samurai had no problem with it.

>>22754061

eeww. That's a face that only a woman can love. and mostly likey it would be his mother

>>22754126
I just have no taste on what handsomeness truly is.

I am straight as it come, but if you an´t recognize a handsome man when you see him, you are simply out of you mind. Look at this guy

>>22753730
>That being said, there is something to be said about how Mishima desperately wanted to be taken seriously as a man and wanting to be a part of the masculine imperial tradition despite loving gay sex. It's actually kinda sad.
Despite popular westoid belief, Christcuckery does not have a monopoly on masculinity.

>>22754126
>That's a face that only a woman can love
What the fuck do you want, pervert? A male face only a man could love you faggot?

He wasn't gay in the Western sense. The concept of flying colors in Japan isn't the same

>>22754272
>He wasn't gay in the Western sense.
He literally found men sexually attractive and had sex with them. I don't know what "sense" that's not gay, unless you're arguing he could've just been bisexual.

>>22754281
Because you are viewing it through a western lens. There is nothing "gay" about the art of 男色

>>22754291
>there's nothing homosexual about explicitly homosexual activity
Bro, it's not a matter of cultural difference, it's the definition of the fucking word.

He dated women too

>>22754302
Homosexuality didn't exist in Japan at the time, it wasn't a real concept to them. Its like saying Rome fell because of Communism or something

>>22754308
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_Japan
You're a fucking retard.

>>22754333
>Western scholars have identified these as evidence
You are just proving my point, stop trying to understand it from a western lens. Japanese traditions are not something you can try to understand by simply comparing them to concepts that exist in America

>>22754343
Bro it's a man putting his cock in another man's ass. It's not that esoteric.
>M-muh eastern mysticism!
The fact that you can't even define it our actually counter my posts is telling.
>B-buh-but muh SPECIAL ASIAN BRAIN!
Gargle my cum. Non-sexually, of course.

When I look at this man, I can see pure male beauty. It is a respectful, humbling feeling of acknowledging my inferiority. Nothing much.

Mishima would immediately write about licking his smelly hairy armpits, like he did in The Mask.

>>22754367
It's late, go to sleep, Gloria Menezes.

>>22754359
They didn't do it for the same reasons

>>22754393
Shut the fuck up.

>>22754359
Then why is a cartoon suddenly an anime when its made in Japan?

>>22754401
Anime is a style of cartoon.

>>22754401
It´s still a fuckin cartoon. A cartoon, no further elaboration needed.

>>22746396
Read Botchan if you like Kokoro. It's also by Soseki. It's a great story about a main character who's pretty much a grown-up Bling Bling Boy becoming a teacher and getting bullied by a gay power couple couple at the school

>>22754393
there is an equivalent to bushido homosex in almost every culture of antiquity everywhere. regardless, if you're having gay sex, it's ultimately because you like it

>>22754359
its only gay if you act like a faggot, like yourself for example

>>22754269

Everybody can agree for example that Robert Redford is a handsome man. No homo. It has to do with proportions and things like that.

>>22746396
all the previous examples, plus "The Sailor Who Fell from Grace with the Sea" and "Patriotism" (about 20? pages long) by Mishima are absolutely necessary (not even mentioning "Confessions of the Mask", it's obvious)
Yasunari Kawabata can be tough for a foreigner, and his style has some... troubles regarding pacing, but if you're actually interested in history of Japanese literature, the "Snow Country" and "The Sound of the Mountain" are mandatory.
Sei Sonagon and her contemporary Murasaki Shikibu. Don't be discouraged it's 10th/11th century, it's like a fairy tale almost how magical to modern reader it is. "Genji Monogatari" is a classic, but start with "The Pillow Book", it's truly beautiful.
Of other things: Jun'ichirō Tanizaki has this book "In Praise of Shadow" (or however is it translated), he was interested and in early years had obsession with the West (which he dropped later), and in this essay he makes comparisons which will help you understand how they think and their aesthetic sensitivity rather well.
Some other things would be Osamu Dazai's "The Setting Sun", about post-war era, similar to "The Sound of the Mountain" by Kawabata, "The Schoolgirl" and his magnum opus "No Longer Human" (he also wrote great short stories. Most of them actually did, vide: Akutagawa). There's also Kobo Abe's "Woman of Dunes" which is one of these "books you're ought to know". "Kitchen" by Banana (kek) Yoshimoto was a huge success when it came out (about shojo and being kawaii, but it's also just a good book).
But really, all these things should help you then navigate on your own, but it's never a bad thing to also read something about history. And I'm not even a weeb.