/lit/ - Literature

>>22694812
Convincing a materialist he is wrong is much like convincing a psychopath of human emotion. Keep going how you are, you won’t ever change because your soul is rotten. The fact that you even ask this and think it’s “logical” proves it.

>>22694812
Mind creating matter: a miracle.
Matter creating mind: a still greater miracle.

Simple as that. Sorry if you’re too retarded to see that.

Whenever someone talks about mechanistic universes I suspect it's a tranny, I can't explain why.

>>22694819

This is a terrible analogy because the one attitude is correct and healthy while the latter is pathological. How did you get to be so bad at constructing analogies?

>>22695205

This is a terrible reversal because it indicates that a certain crazy/absurd idea is even crazier and more absurd than the other, but the order is plainly the reverse of what is implied. How did you get to be so bad at constructing rhetorical reversals?

>>22695240
You will never be a woman, that’s all it comes down to

reconciliation between idealism and materialism: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqY08gN_FCM

>>22695240
Dude the universe is just a bunch of random matter thrown around cause the big bang dude

Dude the universe was the size of a molecule it doesnt matter how that got there because it was so small dude

Dude fetuses are just a bundle of cells dude

Dude civilization just came out of causal events over time its just a coincidence dude

>>22694812
We've had this thread a million times. Idealism is btfo by a 9mm bullet to the brain

>>22695322
Ruminate on solipsism more, retard.

>>22694812
I would point to transcendental realities such as mathematics, logic (lol that you are asking for something that isn't material to disprove materialism), and cognition.

If you do want to go down the rabbit hole of materialism, you are left with uglier questions below the "no soul / spirit" decision you have made. Why are you assuming you can trust your senses? Why trust others exist? Why believe logic or your own thoughts?

Materialism attempts to kill God, but can never supply enough water to was it's hands clean of the deed.

I'm a transgender girl,

And to answer your post, I'd say that I'm a Idealistic Materialist, in that order.

The foundation is Material. I am literally "Idealistic Material," for I am material that produces ideals. To that end, the absolute hopeful defeat of solipsism is Faith. Faith that reality is real and that other people are real.

Otherwise we only have cogito ergo sum, and that is not enough to prove anything at all. Without faith, we are left with idealism alone, where logic does not follow reality, and thus, goes in any direction. Look at the first two posts.

As you correctly pointed out, nothing they said makes sense. Obviously it is more logical that silicone makes a computer chip, and the computer chip runs code, and the output of that code is a video game.

Just as it is more logical that organic chemicals form a brain, the brain forms a mind, and the mind interprets external reality as stimuli and qualia. The mind also can form a will, a soul, a spirit, a morality, a sense of benevolence, and even seek to comprehend truth and love. Those things are all abstractions, but as an Idealistic Materialist whose base premise relies upon Faith, faith that reality is real, faith that other living things are real and also say "cogito ergo sum" to themselves, and faith that solipsism is fundamentally false, then with one ideal already formed, all other ideals come to me readily.

Some ideals do take the form of ideologies or memetic viruses. Just as genetics exist to create complex living beings and brains and instincts, memetics also seem to exist in some form.

Thus as a genetic entity, it is memetics that I might oppose. But as an Idealistic Materialist, memetics can also be in a symbiotic relationship with me. However, there is just one simple concept that I must state: All that is true is logical. Not all that is logical is true. Logic follows reality. Not the other way. In other words, no matter how strange something like quantum physics or deep space dark matter may be, those things are absolutely perfectly logical, at least if we are understanding them correctly. Even if we don't know how they really work in this present day of 2023, I will assert that how they DO actually work, is actually what is most logical, and it is every wrong answer, no matter the appearance of logic, that is illogical. That's just my take on it, at least.

>>22696039

*silicon

>>22695261
Are you esl?

>>22695371
Do you mind trying this >>22695322 and reporting back with your results?

>>22696039
>I'm a transgender girl
Correction you are a man and always will be one.

>>22694812
Try making materialism within transcendental reduction. Or even deal with mere intentionality. What about non sensory objects even ? You also need to go through the hole down to full nominalist hell.
I will also add that mechanism is an engineering conception. It is already a spiritualizarion of matter to interpret it as 'mechanism', but even neglecting that you enter the other rabbit hole of claiming minds are finite machines and must be inconsistent.

Materialism can’t justify itself. If matter is all there is, then the categories that are used to know that necessarily can’t exist. That doesn’t make any sense. Therefore, materialism must be wrong.

Nagel's bat. Figure it out.

>>22694812
Hard problem of consciousness fucks materialism in the ass and this >>22695322 fucks idealism in the ass.

This debate is never going to get settled.

>>22694812
Qualia, the hard problem, essentialism, phenomenal experience etc
You say that conscious beings briefly "spawned" in material universe, but why and how could this possibly happen under materialist doctrine unless consciousness is predicated within the material, which in turn demands the existence of Consciousness Particle. What would that particle be like, why can't we find it if we KNOW that consciousness resides in the brain?

>>22696715
evolution constructs brain constructs categories. also, nothing "justifies itself".

>>22694812
>What are the main arguments against materialism?
Panpsychism

But actually, this is the most powerful interpretation: >>22695260

Materialists and idealists are both wrong in their own ways, just like how determinists and free willers are wrong in their own ways. The most comprehensive interpretations always find a synthesis, a compatibilism between dichotomies, a third way. The Tao that can be named is not the eternal Tao.

>>22696730
What are categories?

>>22696731
>The most comprehensive interpretations always find a synthesis, a compatibilism between dichotomies, a third way.
if a theory is a little of both end of a moronic dichotomy then it's false. This is what intellectuals will never understand.

>>22696039
begone
why do you say girl btw?
you have to be pushing mid 30s at least.
you're porn-addled and weak-willed.

>>22696946

In a battle of wills, I would crush you.
Sorry, but you are the one who is weak of mind, body, and will, and in any competition that we both trained equally for, I would win. That is just how it is.