/lit/ - Literature

I have created the /wg/ anathema.
Do take a steaming shit on it.

https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/76148/revenge-of-the-slop-king-litrpg-cheat-power-harem

>>22659388
>only 3 chapters
I snooze.
Wake me up when it's got at least 30.

>>22659408
Understandable. Next one drops tomorrow.

No one in this thread will make it.

>>22659443
I will make sure others will fail and fail myself.
I shall become the snibbiest crab in the bucket.

>>22659447
Based.
It's not enough for me to fail - I must drag everyone down to hell with me.

>>22659388
I'm astonished it doesn't have over 4000 views yet. How did you fumble the guaranteed winning formula like this? Then again, your cover is butt-ugly. AI should produce better than that.

>>22659388
want to be added on the pastebin?

>>22659517
>your cover is butt-ugly
Thanks, I made sure it's hard- to-look-at slop.
>>22659541
I don't really care, but go ahead if you feel like it.

>>22659388
There's nothing sadder than high effort shit posting.

Have any of you integrated computer generated text into your workflow? You know, to supplement your writing? Are there any genres that computers handle easier than others?

how the fuck do I keep a fiction novel going for so many pages? I can usually get about a chapter or two then can't figure what to do next and can't figure out a series of connected events that can keep going for like 100k words.

>>22659713
Try writing. I find that helps. Before I was in your position, now I have no fucking clue how I can cram this novel into 100k words.

>>22659707
To be fair this is also my vent.

>>22659388
>REVENGE OF HE SLOP KING

Got another excerpt if anybody wants to check it out.
https://pastes.io/hqilmo7azb
I did some clean-up with the dialogue punctuation based on the feedback from the other chapter.

>>22659753
>Cisereal
Cut this shit out.

>>22659765
Oh, and nix the homos while you're at it.

>>22659765
>so mindbroken you cannot see the letters c, i, and s in succession without seething
You really hate to see it.

>>22659813
TZD for the CIS.

Didn't get any feedback last thread. This chapter was originally a book idea of vignettes over one night at a degenerate punk bar, jumping between all the different patrons and bands.

https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/36209/burgerpunk-pizza-time/chapter/1388149/the-blonde

If anyone is interested in reading a free book, here's a PDF.

https://litter.catbox.moe/2g0j97.pdf

if you want to support here's an amazon link
https://www.amazon.com/Knight-Valora-Serenity/dp/B0CCCNBQ3M

God knows I'm not getting any traction anywhere. Oh well free book.

>>22659869
you should change the typography on the cover, can't barely even read what it says at a glance. raise the price to at least 2.99 to get full royalty rate and not look desperate. turn it into a series, most people in Kindle Unlimited won't read standalones. tweak it and run some cheap ads to it to get traction. no one is just going to find it out of the random billions of books on Amazon if you don't put real effort into promoting it properly.

>>22659388
It's fine, but these things don't get traction regardless of quality until you build a backlog of chapters and post reliably multiple times per week.

>>22659907
Already on it, boss.

>>22659863
Didn't read the whole thing, reeks of amateur because it lacks propulsion or direction. You seem to believe you are intelligent, but you don't display it here. Lacks mood, lacks characterization, lacks plot, lacks lots. Keep working, but don't make it like this.
Also
>a shorter mid drift.

>>22659927
I mean scores of chapters. It's a numbers game, these things take months to get a readership if they ever do.

>>22659931
drift finna mid fr fr

>>22659935
Well in any case, as long as schizophrenia doesn't just randomly get better, I will always have some material on hand.

>>22659753
sorry but ur not gonna make, i can already tell

>>22659896
I'll probably do another book based on the setting some other day. I'll probably run another ad on amazon. What I think will work is tiktok

>>22659981
Are you the Portuguese guy?

>>22659971
By all means, elaborate.

>>22659999
Sure.

>>22659981
>tiktok
what? no it won't. that shit is for zoomers. it's only going to work if you start shitting out multiple book series in genres like paranormal romance or YA dystopian or whatever the new trendy flavor of the year genre is. some vague cross-genre standalone is not going to work

>>22660053
then that is what I must do.

>>22660016
You seem too excited (making charts, character art and all that) about your amateur fantasy slop. You have no means to advertise and shill your work properly. I predict that you will receive little to no attention upon publishing. Now, that doesn't necessarily mean you're NGMI as you can continue working, slowly building your fanbase and making connections. But again, seeing as how enthusiastic you are about your book right now, I don't think you'll be able to deal with the disappointment and unmet expectations.

>>22660138
by amateur slop I don't mean that your work is bad btw. Sanderson writes fantasy slop too

>>22660138
>>22660146
Buddy, I just made a fun little primer for a story I'm only like 120 pages into. I have no illusions about launching the next big pop fantasy epic and I haven't even thought of publishing yet because I'm not even positive I'll even finish it. But these funny little graphic tl;drs of what I'm working on keep me motivated to keep writing.

>>22659931
Interesting. Thanks, anon. Trying to fight against the need to cope and explain, but I’ll take it to heart. Even something without change needs change I suppose. A mildly interesting thing isn’t very interesting if it stays mildly interesting. I suppose in a situation where real character growth can’t actually happen the interest would be between opposing characters. No one likes a podcast where everyone agrees with each other. Thanks. Hopefully I’ve had some life experience since I wrote that a while back.

>>22660160
ok good luck then. I personally still find it cringe when new authors make these 'primers' like anyone cares

>>22659753
pretty cool actually. I might do something like this for some ideas I have. do you use AI to generate the character images or just steal them from existing art? can I make that style using Stable Diffusion or something like that?

>>22660272
Slopped 'em out on bing.

>pretty cool actually. I might do something like this for some ideas I have.

>this uncreative angry tranny mad at others for having fun making stuff
lol lmao kek haha

>>22660279
Care to explain this?

my protag has reached his lowest point and I don't know how to have him climb out from it

>>22659296
So I wanted to write a scene similar to the Elf scene where Walter gets pissed and tells Buddy to leave

Basic essence is annoying childhood friend causes character to lose bet with rival, and inadvertently embarrasses them whenever they appear.

I was thinking of:
>"I don't care that you think we're friends, I thought you were a bother ever since I met you but mother made me tolerate you, get out
More or less, but I also wanted the angry rant to clearly be a loss of temper. I feel them saying they always disliked the childhood friend seems too cold and calculated, but I really wanted to include the line of "we were never friends, you were always a bother" because it drives a massive wedge between them that causes its own issues further down the line.

>OP forgot that NaNo is in 1 day and the server is about to reveal the prize

Guess this means another NaNo spin-off general. Please include the invite next time

>>22660800

https://discord.gg/XTEKPUH5

>>22659388
I like it but you should proofread before posting.

Explain the phrase "Read like a writer."

>>22660891
"Reading like a writer" involves analyzing texts not just for content but also for style, structure, and techniques used by the author. It means observing how authors craft their sentences, develop characters, create settings, and manage pacing. It requires a deep examination of narrative choices, dialogue, and the use of literary devices to understand how they contribute to the overall story. This approach involves paying attention to the subtleties of language, like word choice, sentence structure, and rhythm. It often includes questioning why certain writing decisions were made and how they influence the reader's experience. "Reading like a writer" cultivates a critical eye for elements such as plot development, foreshadowing, and the way information is revealed. By scrutinizing the mechanics behind a text, one can learn to enhance their own writing by applying successful techniques gleaned from the works they read. It's a process of dissecting and learning from the craft of others to improve one's own writing skills. This method encourages aspiring writers to be more attentive and analytical readers, fostering an understanding of the artistry behind a piece of writing.

>>22660891
consider the craft and reasoning of what you are reading instead of just the story or info

>>22660818
Or maybe you could just not be a thread splitting attention whore that gets deleted for baking a duplicate /wg/ with invite links to your dicksuck only to then blame the baker of this thread (not me) for not including your garbage that has nothing to do with /wg/ in the OP.
The more power to you guys for organizing stuff but kindly fuck off with the condescending attitude. No one owes you a bake that shills your shit but you're free to make a reply or thread about it. You know, like a normal person that doesn't try to make everyone go along with your bullshit because they shouldn't have to be forced to.
Also I don't get the point of your dumbass thread, you're just advertising your dicksuck, there's nothing to discuss that warrants your thread. 4chan can be daunting as a first time user but learning from lurking is a great way to get up to speed with how not to be a massive bellend.
Cheerio!

>>22659443
>>22659447
>>22659456
Don't give up.
Don't allow sadness to crush your spirit.
Strive to make the art that will change it all.
Push back against the failure of culture to maintain its strength.
Drag it kicking and screaming with you, if you have to.
Feel pity if you must. Feel sadness, feel rage, feel hopeless, and feel fury. Then write.

>>22659713
Your attention span has atrophied thanks to the Internet, television, and video games. Depending on how young you were when you started doing all that, you may be as good as developmentally disabled.

>>22660918
>>22660921
In you opinion is it better to reader as a reader the first time, then reread as a writer? Or read as a writer the first time?

>>22660465
That's unfortunate, because that's usually the part the readers like the best.

>>22661011
read as a reader first and just try to enjoy reading. then if it's something you find good, go back and analyze it and try to figure out why you like it

How to stop distracting myself with DOTA and get to work?

>>22661035
Substitute it with ERP.

I hate to write\rewrite, but I feel good to read my finish text. How to make a process of writing\rewriting more pleasant?

>>22661041
Do not follow this anon's advice, it caused me to give up on writing for years.

>>22661041
Erotic role play? Why?

>Please ensure your first 500 words compel the reader to want to go further.
lmao what a fucking useless piece of advice

>>22661286
Yet your story is boring all the way through.

>>22661293
"Yet?" That doesn't make any sense anon. My story is boring because the world is filled with useless stupid advice, not despite it.

>>22661298
Oh, so no talent after all. If nobody else does it for you, you just can't.

>>22661319
Are you drunk?

Hey lads what’s F Gardner up to?

>>22661438

>>22661444

>>22661456

>>22661462

>writing a scene in some alien ruins
>want characters to walk down some stairs before arriving in their destination
>begin wondering if the species that built the now ruined structure would have ever invented stairs

>>22661781
If they had legs they had stairs.

>>22661475
i hate that i knew this was supposed to be f gardner (when scrolling up from the bottom of the thread)

>writing a fantasy story
>follows a group of anti heroes who try to defeat a greater evil
>80% of the book is dialogue between the group
>often about philosophical questions such as things like slavery but because theyre anti heroes they come up with arguments that arent just our modern "slavery LE BAD" views
anyway how do I market this to intellectuals and psuedo intellectuals, I have a feeling those people dont read fantasy novels after they mature

>>22662040
Just call it dark fantasy

>>22660832
What did he mean by this?

>>22662040
>80% of the book is dialogue between the group
>often about philosophical questions such as things like slavery
Who do you imagine is going to want to read this? I can spoil you: no one.

>>22662130
Yes, I thought so.
but people enjoy Tarantino movies in large part because of the dialogue, and this is somewhat similar, but at a higher level.

anyway you are absolutely right, you should pander to a large group not a niche one Especially one thats hard to reach.

But I already wrote it, it just happened on its own. Maybe its redeeming factor is that the characters have fun personalities, regardless of what they discuss, so even if it all goes over your head you could enjoy their banter

>>22662133
Do you have no ideas that don't rely on you being the second coming of Tarantino?

>>22662130
>90% of my story is just dialogue between the MC and the heroine and trying to get her to live for something
It's over isn't it.

>>22662137
thought about writing a generic story about a ladiesman that goes to asia based on my life experience. it panders to the male fantasy and women who like romance if I change the ending so the MC settles down with a generic white woman instead of chasing asian hotties till he dies

anyway, all my ideas suck in terms of success. I hate cliches, but they work for a reason.
RR is 95% litRPG and isekai and every story is the same tropes over and over lacking any semblance of originality, but it works

>>22662141
>i can fix her
lmao
actually?
how many words

>>22662150
I don't think not having enough cliches is the reason to your lack of success.

>>22662186
dont really give a shit about your luke-warm piss tier take to be desu famalam

>>22662152
A lot.
Also it's more like >I can fix him!

>>22662150
>RR is 95% litRPG and isekai and every story is the same tropes over and over lacking any semblance of originality, but it works
I hope it works out for the Slop King™ too. The sloppiest and least original isekai in existence™.

>>22661475

>>22662150
Your ideas all suck for success because you're not even trying to tell a story, you're just navelgazing. There's no real narrative undercurrent to "some passport bro goes to asia to bang hotties" it's just a canvas for you to project wish fulfillment onto.

>>22662530
You're acting like there isnt an entire genre that been at peak popularity for like 4 years now which does exactly that, nevermind the overall historic popularity of wish-fulfilledment genres
sometimes I feel like 70% of the replies I get here are from people who have absolutely no idea of what they're talking about, they feel the need to share anyway.
Besides, there's room for a romantic subplot as I alluded to in my post.

Sorry for the other 30% though. Theres a lot of good posts worth reading here too, such as the the critique from earlier

>>22662530
Wish fulfillment sells, thats guaranteed. I actually hate writing that crap, but I have experience I can draw from
There's a subplot too as I alluded to in my post, so it would also be wish fulfillment for a female audience

my other ideas suck most hard because I usually write what I like, and what I like is extremely niche, most people want the same generic "slop" over and over. Thats why its all capeshit and generic isekai now

but at least Japan still has a lot of niche stories do well, besides the garbage shounen and isekai, you cant really say the same about the west afaik

My main character kicks the shit out of the villains, most named after people I hate, has his dead father tell him he's awesome, gets over his crippling shyness around girls, and hooks up with the beautiful girl he has been in love with for years. She's also rich and has been in love with him as well but was too nervous to admit it. There was a time I wanted to avoid wish fulfillment, but I've concluded it's my story and I can do what I want with it

How do I come up with ideas like the ones Kafka came up with?

>>22662196
Ooh, tough guy. Maybe you should fuck off back to buying sex from vietnamese boys because writing is clearly not your thing.

>>22662655
Schizophrenia. Meth. Excess caffeine, night terrors and insomnia.

Pick and choose one or all three.

>>22662628
Unironically based but my story is my culmination of hatred towards bad writing.

>>22660996
Thanks, anon!

>>22662707
I’ll try inducing night terrors and insomnia. Is this an unironic hack to becoming a legendary writer?

>>22662816
Seemed to work for Lovecraft. Buying a cat and naming him some funny slur might help.

>>22662827
How much sleep deprivation should I aim for?

>>22662864
Yes.

>>22662876
I’m actually gonna try this. No sleep for me tonight.

>>22662878
No sleep, only writing.
Make your night even more terrible by editing.

So I read Aspects of The Novel by EM Forster and I gotta say it's just a wordcel book

Only book really worth reading on here is The Art of Fiction by John Gardner

There are gems hidden in some of these but overall not worth reading

Hello anons! I'm trying to get back into writing after ~10 years of not writing anything seriously (plus it's my first time doing it in english).
It's just a little story where I make fun of japanese romcoms. Do you guys have any criticism?: https://sebsauvage.net/paste/?7455d86985ad9bd4#qw1/nHhI1Wz5qDJFKW6p16U3unpcoJAiUgEa9TvvFNU=

>>22662908
>https://sebsauvage.net/
Damn nigger put it up on some normal site.

>>22662911
Are there any websites that would accept this submission without getting me banned? I'm not too knowledgable about that sorry...

>>22662919
Pastebin. People are very paranoid about anything that is not plaintext.

Is it normal to read classical literature such as Melville, Joyce, Dostoevsky, etc., before writing smut?

>>22662933
Ok thanks anon!
>>22662908
Reuploaded here: https://pastebin.com/Bta0kCZN

>>22662946
I'll give it a read once I'm done writing my shit.

Is this formulation correct?

"Social policy once again had to take a back seat"

I want to say that during the financial crisis, EU social policy was given less weight and economic and financial policy were given more attention. I am not sure whether my formulation is correct English though.

>>22662884
You’ve convinced me. Though I may descend slowly into psychosis, I will get my stories right first.

>>22662986
> Social policy once again had to take a back seat

Grammatically correct but trite and poorly phrased.

>>22662986
>the back seat
Sounds better.

cool guy

>>22659443
I already have a publisher, WAGMI

>>22659388
This is great, I'm gonna shout it out

Where's a good place to make a website?

>>22663234
This is /wg/ - writing general

>>22663248
Is this /wanking grounds/?

>>22663234
if you don't have any clue as to what youre doing, try wix or look up wix alternatives (there must be something better by now)

>mfw even the meme twitter account with 0 posts I made just to follow anime porn artists is gaining followers more and faster than the account on which I shared my writings for 8 years
Why are my stories so cursed?

>>22663409
share your rr and i follow + favorite + 5 star

>>22663234
Wordpress. It's easy at first but can get complex if you want.
>>22663409
Post a story!

>>22663409
Those are bots following you. Readership is down anyways, especially in the young crowd.

>>22663455
Ratings mean nothing to me. What I want to see are comments and discussion, not necessarily involving me.

>>22659713
have you ever read fiction?

>>22663490
How can we have a discussion if you don't share it? Why do you think there is purity in the algorithm? Or do you mean discussion in this thread on writing?

Do you guys think I could roleplay about someone and make a story based off of that? Isn't that how people write, anyway?

>>22663521
Yes, you build mental models of characters and environments in your mind and hit play. You write down what happens in that mental scene. The more fleshed out the characters and environment are the less mental pushback there is of 'what happens next' because your mind starts riding the lightning. You can also imagine how a conversation happens and write it down and flesh out the supplemental writing later. You can write descriptions of things and plug them in later.

>>22663524
I think I can get into character but I don't know how the character would be specifically. There's some things I want to write about but I don't know what the difference between actually writing something and fanfics or other types of more amateur writing. I think that the first step would probably be writing something I find interesting which I could get back to on and off. I'm not really sure it'd be the best since it'd be my first try at doing it but I think it'd make me better at it if I just sat down and took the time to do it.

>>22663572
The reason fanfics are so much easier than normal writing is because the character and world are so fleshed out it comes easy.

/lit/ Top 10 Update! F Gardner has shattered every single record! All 16 of his books are in the top 3K ranks of Amazon right now!

>>22663649
Woo hoo!!!!

>the discord server was gardner's project all along
Played like a damn fiddle!

>>22663649
I've seen what gets top sales spots on jewazon. That's not impressive.

1h32min until nanowrimo starts

>>22663649
are you guys going to try to win f gardner's f prize?

I haven't even figured out a genesis of an idea for nanowrimo...
It's joever...

>>22663718
Me neither... make that a double mocha joever...

>>22663718
>>22663857
Just talk about the weather until a character shows up

Should I put this at the beginning of my novel to give the reader a taste of the tone and themes or does it sound too cringe:

In Jinria, the land where spirits dwell,
Monsters roam and secrets swell.
Warlords rule with savage might,
In the shadow of the worm god's blight.

Beneath the sunken city's veil,
The worm god sleeps, his power frail.
But be aware, for he may wake,
And bring the world to a deathly quake.

>>22663718
Write the story of a man who makes the perfect spreadsheet and his slow dissent into madness from the power it grants him.
>>22663857
Write the story of a man who crashes different conventions every weekend and how the convention center has to expand it's budget to pay for the investigation and hunt for him.

>>22663894
Buddy, it's not even proper meter. Give the reader something to care about, like a character.

>>22663894
If you're gonna open with poetry it better be decent. Like other Anon says, it lacks proper meter. Also, AABB is the laziest, most boring rhyme scheme. At least do ABAB.

Keep working on it, Anon.

>>22659713
It helps to have a plot outline written

>>22663971
this, if you don't have a scene list with every single scene in your story pre-written then you are handy-capping and sabotaging yourself

So how does one actually get published in a newspaper or magazine? I prefer to write short essays, around 1000 words. Do I just find publications I like and send samples?

>>22664018
>send samples?
They will send them back or run them through the shredder.
Ask first.

https://youtu.be/2GuzBkmVp2k
If you ever think your book idea is bad, watch this bit and you'll feel better about your idea

>>22664053
Idea's are never the problem. Executing and producing results is.

Can someone give me a writing prompt? Any random configuration of words will do. Thanks.

>>22662133
>but people enjoy Tarantino movies in large part because of the dialogue, and this is somewhat similar, but at a higher level.
If you are actually a better writer than Tarantino, you should have no problem getting published anywhere.

I'm going to assume you are not, and your book is the edgelord rantings of a schizoid. Post an excerpt for us.

>>22664116
see
>>22663904

>>22664116
a story about a time traveling stage magician

>>22662946
I read it anon, could use better punctuation.

Anons, pls enjoy my short spoop narrations:

https://audio.com/alexbeyman/collections/alex-beyman-audio-horror

>>22663904
>>22664140
>Write the story of a man who makes the perfect spreadsheet and his slow dissent into madness from the power it grants him.

Game on, thanks. Will post results later tonight.

>>22664133
look, we all know that I could post literary gold (I probably wont) and you guys would shit on it regardless. Ive tested it with respected excerpts and such.

Here's an earlier draft of the later part of the slave dialogue, its missing some of the indicators

>Context: theyre a group of professional saboteurs, hitmen and a tactician from an alliance of very different empires with a quest, and theyre talking as theyre traveling. Prior to this part theyre talking about their home regions and how they deal with slavery

I care mostly about the content and the arguments. But I tried not to go too serious so I fizzle it out later on, although theres another page of dialogue prior to this

>>22664063
Dumbest post ITT

>>22664240
Why would you not use quote marks?

>>22664153
Thanks fren anon! Do you have an example for a case of bad punctuation in my text?
I used to never use full stops but now I'm afraid that I use too many of them. Is that what you meant?

>>22664240
Malapropisms and missing punctuation aside, pretty decent. It's definitely not publication worthy, though.

From this limited sample, the discussion of ideas seems trite. If you're going to make dialogues about ideas the backbone of your work, you better make sure you have some interesting things to say.

I'm guessing you are pretty young and have plenty of room to grow intellectually. If you haven't read The Brothers Karamazov, I'd give that a swing. That is THE book where charismatic characters have compelling discussions about higher ideas.

Keep writing, keep thinking. Seems like you have potential, but you're nowhere near ready for publication. These topics deserve depth beyond pithy retorts.

>>22664275
>Thanks imaginary dad!
Could use a comma there.
Additionally,
>a strand of golden hair entered the classroom
I *get* this line, but it really, really could have been better.

Overall I give it it's alright/shitpost rating.

anyone else doing NaNoWriMo?

https://discord.gg/fhaFbVEFc

>>22664308
>malapropisms
where?

>not enough depth
I specifically wanted to avoid going in depth. Everyone makes a point, I think Xenia's is one that's unheard. I don't care to expand on the specifics and the details, most of those are obvious if you think about it, which I dont want to force on the reader. they can dwell if they want to.

> but you're nowhere near ready for publication.
yeah totally. have you ever read whats out there?
you have no idea how low the bar for publication is, get of your high horse

I was in jail for a few weeks and I had nothing to do but read popular bestsellers that they had available. A lot of it is seriously dogshit. If you posted it on an amateur writing forum they'd rightfully tell you to go retake elementary writing classes


also final note, the reason we abolished slavery in the real world is because capitalism allows the slavery of everyone to varrying degrees. but that has no place in my book

>>22664308
anyway thanks though for the feedback
perhaps I should reconsider actually going in depth then.

either way I think this just isnt a crowd pleaser that's going to draw in a large audience.

>>22664240
No quote marks, blocks of texts, awful formatting.

Fix that before I even attempt to give it a read.

>>22664333
I like that your seethe at slavery is inspired by your own but,
>get of your high horse
Lose the shit attitude criminal faggot.

>>22664116
One cannot raise walls against what has been forgotten.

>>22664116
story on a criminal empire (think the Italian mob, Columbian drugtrade) but set in a fantasy setting

Wrote
>...the impression of the full story is still apparent which is all that really matters.
Word wants to correct it to
>...the impression of the full story is still apparent which all that really matters is.

>>22664313
Got it, thanks again! I'll rewrite this chapter using your criticism and Cambridge's punctuation guide. I'll make a new post once I get a few chapters in.
>Overall I give it it's alright/shitpost rating.
Perfect! This story is meant to be something stupid to make people laugh so this is the ideal rating for this!

Thanks again for your help and good luck with whatever you're writing fren anon!

>>22664397
it probably actually wants a comma

I have two projects I want to finish by the end of this year, and I want to do nanowrimo as well. How do I balance my priorities?

>>22664397
Add comma. Unrestricted clause.

>>22664438
>>22664425
Thought so. Thanks

>>22664433
By choosing something to actually prioritize. Imo go with nanowrimo first and build some internal momentum to actually get shit done, then try and roll it over into your other projects later.

Halloween poem. Thoughts?

I was thinking of using an arc idea in the outline of one of my novels and making it a standalone story to test the waters.
How do I write this so that it's actually different, and when I end up writing the original story people will stay invested when that plot arc comes around?

?

>>22664696
if the words and events are slightly different, the average reader isn't going to be able to tell that two different characters are following the same arc

>>22664696
I am outright stealing elements of my better story and putting it in the joke one.
I am literally parodying myself before the original can even exist.

I average 5,000 finished, fully edited words a week and have maintained this for a year. step 1 to getting published is to actually write.

>>22664799
I did 63k words in last 4 days. More if you count my other work too.

>>22664799
Yeah but how many of those words were worth reading? Do the math on that dummy

>>22661438
Wow, that really looks like him...apart from the weak chin...the thinning hair...the sunken chest...the pale, fish-like pallor...the bovine eyes...but except for ALL THAT, yeah, looks just like him. Believe me, Francis, I understand why you'd want to be someone other than who you are. We all wish you were someone else, too.

>>22664796
You too, huh? What's your plan?

>>22664821
My plan is to make vague references to my shit so I can laugh at it later when people claim I ripped off the ripoff.

>>22663649
He was giving the e-books away for free. Once that's over, the BSRs will plummet like a rock, because there's no organic interest. The YouTube followers that his rich, permissive daddy pays for will clap and bark like trained seals and download his crappy books if they get paid to do so. Isn't it amazing? With all the effort he puts into stroking himself in public, he might have accomplished something if he used that effort to git gud. This is his admission that he's peaked. Too sad for words.

>>22664383
So, the Green Bone saga by Fonda Lee?

>>22664332
Not since the seething pseud was revealed as the ringmaster of that Discord. Now I have no interest.

>>22664853
F. Gardner is the person that made this post. He confessed to it on the discord. This man is a master marketer playing both sides of the aisle! He is the biggest fan and worst critic of his own work! How can I achieve this level of power?

>>22664869
Be born to rich, permissive parents with no ethics and no concern for the legacy they leave the world? Bonus for having absolutely no self awareness, no memory, and no discernible talent.

sup /lit/ how do you write? what programs do you use to write? word, obsidian, scrivener, apple notes, etc?

I mostly do academic research but really want to find a nicer system of writing notes for myself that will turn into an essay or chapter. word suck,but wondering of the other options will made it smoother?

>>22663649
Gardner's first 16 books are unedited pre-kindergarten gibberish & aren't worth the electrons it takes to store them on Amazon's servers.
But somehow, his 17th book is a vast improvement! Vastly fewer spelling/grammar/punctuation errors!
The MC is the usual self-insert, and the plot is the usual meandering dream-like incoherent babble, but you can't have everything.
So skip the first 16 garbage-tier books, and read Call Of United Airlines instead.
Even better, you can download it for free! https://files.catbox.moe/aw9gz2.pdf
And until Frank decides, once again, to commit abusive lawfare, you can buy a copy at https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CKB7QZ3B

>>22664923
I've been using scrivener but I don't really use any of the features. I was just tired of being a slave to google and microsoft.

Sometimes I worry I'll start to get well known in this general but lads like the poster two posts above are nice enough to remind me there's no way in hell that's happening unless I force myself like a cock into a roofied date.

>>22664240
There has to be a better way to present this. I think it could use some subtelty. Have the characters not be so overt, it comes off as stilted. It doesn't feel like a conversation between people but more like the author is trying to "say something" if you get what I mean.

Should I use first or third person?

>>22664986
Fourth person like All Tommorrows

>>22664962
If you're that thin-skinned. you have no business being on 4chan. Maybe you'd find Reddit a more affirming experience. Heck, maybe you should resort to the Hello Kitty Island Adventure MMORPG. But you don't belong here.

>>22665009
Why the hate Mr. Gardner? I was thanking you

>he plays to the gallery
lol ngmi
https://youtu.be/cNbnef_eXBM?si=OjF4zivOtoYfAvEG

>>22665046
I agree with this sentiment

>>22661781
I have spent several hours over many days trying to decide what kind of inexpensive fixer-upper pony car my badboy werewolf character is going to be driving because a Corvette or Camaro or whatever is too generic and doesn't fit a poor kid in rural Arizona, but somehow the whole concept of a badboy werewolf driving a sports car in the first place is acceptable to my "this is too generic" sense.

I settled on an RX-7 with an LS swap.

>>22665086
He's a CEO too right?

>>22665092
He's got CEO energy.

I actually started out trying to write an anti-cliche story and elements of that still survive, but... the cliches are just too good. Writing this dreck has given me a much better understanding of why it's so common. The story goes together like you're playing with Lego.

>>22665119
it's fun being able to write a single-sentence detail and communicate everything you ever need to know about a character
>he flicked his cigarette butt at a passing mother duck
>he pulled out his laptop and a calculator and with it, clattering onto the table, a gun
>she blindfolded Suzy, spun her around three times, and set her walking off away from the pinata and right into the pool
it's just all the fun with none of the hard work

if you don't help me i might start taking it out on the people around me!

I wish I had writing ideas

>>22661097
Opposite for me. I like writing and editing but reading it afterwards is like being sprinkled with acid.

>>22665086
is it even a question? a GT Cruiser

forgot what i was supposed to write for nanowrimo

My manuscript blew up in editing from 90k words to 110k words, meaning I just did double-nanowrimo in two months, but nobody cares about my efforts because I didn't do it during the meme month

>>22665692
what's it about?

>>22665714
Perspective.

>>22665731
i am obsessed with perspective

>>22665758
For me it's point of view

As I reach the riverbank in the clearing, the roar of the water fills my ears, and a strong breeze crashes into me and remains constant. I walk over the pebbly shore; the rocks make a pleasant scraping and clacking sound beneath my feet.

Those that I've travelled with have already begun to enter and wade through the currents.

I make a last step towards the water. The perpetual winds force me to squint as I survey the crossing.

A woman losing her footing plunges into the river and is swept away by the rapids. The man she was with now carefully moves over where she once was, continuing onwards.

To whom it may concern (aka. nobody):
New Slop in 2 hours.

How do you deal with technical information, that is known to all characters, but might not be known to the reader?
I'm not sure if will become a problem, but I'm planning to write a short-story that takes place on a steam locomotive. In preparation I did some research on how they worked and found out there are a lot of details that I didn't know/had misconceptions about, so I'm assuming some readers might as well.
But it wouldn't make much sense for the characters to talk about stuff that they all know. As I said, maybe it won't even be a problem, because the intricate ins and outs of the water injector, probably won't matter to the story, but I think I'd ask just in case.

>>22664923
I use FocusWriter for real writing, or just Notepad++/qq for everything else

Just got my first rejection of presumably many from an agent. Feels bad bros.

>>22666031
This is why many stories have an idiot, child, or man who lived under a rock. They are the surrogate for the reader to be explained to. Just write someone who’s never been on a train.

>>22666066
I'm waiting on 4 right now, I'll feel a lot better once I get my rejections.

>>22666066
Publisher rejections are exactly the same as rejections from women.

Never forget you can just rape them.

>>22666031
>As you may know, we are on a STEAM LOCOMOTIVE which is powered by a STEAM BOILER, that operates on the basis of combustible fuels heating water until it evaporates...

>>22665926
how much time have you put into your rubbish story, anon?

>>22666150
Far too much.

>>22666154
really? well I have spent a few years writing my own piece of trash that I am certain will never grace anyone's eyes
not until it's finished at least
if that's any consolation. you're already releasing yours to the public and it seems like you have a decent reception
>mfw

>>22666159
>you have a decent reception
That's because I cleverly disguised my piece of shit as a LitRPG piece of shit. They'll never see it coming.

>>22666067
Makes sense, I'll see what I can do
>>22666081
Yeah exactly that is what I'm talking about

what can a princess do to save the life of a dragon

>>22666553
Healing vaginal fluids

>>22666555
wasted digits

>>22666566
doesn't look wasted to me

>Manage nearly two thousand words every day for the past week.
>Have only managed one hundred today.
>If I try to force it, the words come out shit.
Don't tell me to take a break you savages.

>>22666641
Write dialogue only.
Write descriptions of things and places only.
Develop background history to your characters.
Flesh out their fatal flaw.
You got this, bud.

I'm gonna make it bros

>>22666661
What does it mean to have made it?

>>22666883
whatever I want it to mean

>>22666883
Figure that out and you've taken the first step

Dialogue>description

>>22666912
Whatever you say Gaddis

>>22666912
rolling

Why bother writing when nobody reads your crap anyways

>>22666954
my wife reads my crap and that's fine for me

>>22666954
What do you mean?

>>22666954
I only write for myself, my stuff is too good to get defiled by others

>>22666912
If you could do both, it's a win-win but otherwise you're right. Dialogue is more interesting

>>22666912
wrong and gay
real men describe
chatting is for women

Oh man, I'm remembering something I read through /wg/. It had to do with an ancient play that was rewritten and released to the modern world to huge popularity. This professor becomes obsessed with it, discovers the mistranslation, and destroys his career trying to get the original play as popular as the rewrite.
Whoever wrote that done good

>>22666912
>he isn't skilled at both

Help me with the use of "former + possessive s"

"Optimists and pessimists make arguments. The former's arguments..." or "The formers' arguments"? It's plural so it should be formers', right? But also, I've never seen it, so maybe "former" combines all the optimists already and I can say "former's"?

>>22667188
Try "the arguments of the former"

>>22667188
I'd write former's because it syntactically refers to items in the earlier list, and not pessimists/optimists in plural. I could be wrong, but at least I have an excuse.

Marketing is a real skill and j don't have a clue how to market.

>>22667188
it would read fine in this context just to repeat optimist with "The optimist's arguments"

I finished writing a fantasy novel.
Should I write another fantasy story, or make it urban instead?

>>22667314
Post it

>>22667302
Do this if you want to appeal to clarityfags

>>22667188
It unequivocally should be 'the former's arguments'. It's not plural. Saying 'the former' or 'the latter' is short for saying 'the first/last of those things so named'. Whether the things so named are plural or singular is irrelevant.

Hypothetically, if I was writing a series of short books that happened to be erotica, where and how could I publish it in a way that would be easy to read, and also be able to sell copies instead of having a link to some third party hosting site

>>22659296
When should someone include an epilogue?

>>22667739
Whenever you feel like it.
I included an epilogue in my short story because while I felt story was completed, it would be a good idea to let reader know what ultimately happened.

>>22667739
Right now

Wells Fargo

>>22667314
More fantasy
Make it even more fantastical

>>22666954
Well for me it's cathartic to write, it's the only time in my life where I'm not stressed the fuck out (I have a really bad anxiety disorder).
But also a lot of my old coworkers read some of my sci-fi short stories and said I'm really talented and want me to get back into it, which is nice since my parents and brother don't give a fuck.

>>22659296
How does /wg/ feel about starting a story after the events, i.e. recounting the events of the story from a future date? Could it work for horror writing or does it completely remove the tension because you know the protagonist survives?

>>22660818
>>22661438
>>22661444
>>22661462
>>22661475
Such a fine day today.

>>22666954
I write as a sub-hobby to gamedev
If I'm gonna draw to work on my art chops, I'd also better write to work on my narrative chops, right?
>>22668169
In the case of horror you can easily keep the fates of the rest of the non-narrator characters in question. Retrospective stories also kind of beg for a twist but that's up to you

>>22668132
More fantastically fantastical with fantabulous uniponycorns prancing among rainbow clouds of dreams and joy?

>>22668213
I was thinking of telling the story through a series of interviewing the protagonist at a police deposition about the events that occurred. The more I ideate, the whole thing is schlocky, would be better in a visual medium, and has very obvious inspirations, but I think it will be fun. I don't know if spoilers work on this board but it's my first story since high school and will likely be terrible and the outline so far is just one long mental shitpost

>>22668215
More crazy shit. More weird shit. Fantasy doesn't just have to be DnD McTolkien, make more races and more weird magic with different rules and strange technology and odd rules of nature and strange societies etc etc etc

nigger nigger (fried) chicken dinner read my shit

>>22668220
Schlocky isn't necessarily bad. Get your schlock good enough and start calling it pulp

>>22668132
fuck it
I combined both ideas I had

>>22668220
Y'know I learned recently that Florida law allows for depositions in criminal cases and I found that so fucking wild. Insane. Absolutely insane.

>>22668426
>>22668220
Wow that's so crazZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz (that's me snoring because i've fallen asleep).

>>22668446
Have a good sleep anon. Hope you have comfy dreams.

>>22668491
ill have comfy dreams of raping your dickfaggot

>>22668530
why would you be mean

>>22668530
That wasn’t me, how dare he respond as if it were
This board has some real sick puppies

Ok a story where a single human ambassador is sent to a xenophobic city-state of elves in preparation for a coming calamity and ends up in a forbidden romance with the elven queen
The ambassador is a man who can be characterized as pragmatic and short-tempered but otherwise unflappable
The queen is a woman who can be characterized as a visionary possessing wisdom, but with a childish streak
What's a name for this?

>>22668588
>What's a name for this?
The author's fetish on display for God and everyone to cringe at

>>22668596
Is "forbidden love between classes" a fetish now? I thought it was just a subset of romance in general

>>22668601
It is when you described your thinly veiled self-insert protag and blatant waifu romance target.

>>22668588
slop quest

>>22668602
No self insert, I'm basing it on a couple of my favorite Henry Fonda roles.

>>22668614
>he identifies as Henry Fonda
What are you 80?

>>22668616
I just like him, he's cool

>>22668588
Titles don't actually have to do anything but sound cool
Pick something tangentially related to your setting that's memorable

I spend so much time being apathetic and shitty, that I'm almost embarrassed while trying to create and get inside the heads of characters for my fantasy story. I need to actually be observant, in all regards, now.

>>22668853
I had a lot of trouble with this. I'm personally pretty unemotional, never sad or excited, nothing surprises or shocks me. So it was really difficult to write characters who are emotional and react spontaneously. I tried to process it logically, but the result never felt very natural. Finally I had to go and actually act out the scene in reality, put myself in the character's shoes and squeeze the emotion out. But that really helped.

>>22669155
>>22668853
Couldn't be me. I don't self insert so writing characters becomes very easy for me.

I just think about what stuff is the character made of and if the next action would be out of character or not.

>>22669165
>I just think
That's whole problem.

>>22669176
Just download more IQ.

>>22669165
It has nothing to do with self-insert, but trying to think through their processes or keep them in character. I'm sure I will have all these things down to a process in time, but for now I have to really empathize with these imaginary fags
>>22669155
>Finally I had to go and actually act out the scene in reality, put myself in the character's shoes and squeeze the emotion out.
neat. probably not for me, but not a bad idea.

https://youtu.be/Pb5oIIPO62g?si=51eYccqxD7cAaANW
TL;DW: Creativity and intelligence are not linked. You're not a better writer just because you're smart.

>>22669219
>You're not a better writer just because you're smart.
I wouldn't go that far, as convenient as that would be (for me as well).

>>22669219
So you’re saying everyone in this thread is really smart.

>>22669255
I'm both

>>22669266
I am smart and creative, unfortunately, this doesn't produce books that sell.

>>22669276
Luck produces books that sell.

>>22669278
Unfortunately I am destined to go the way of Melville and Lovecraft.

>>22669219
great vid

>>22667915
keepers of the end times

>>22668853
>I need to actually be observant, in all regards, now.
I had a similar realization. Would going out people watching help? I was thinking of sitting down in an area with a lot of pedestrian traffic and just observing people and things as a regular thing to try and help with this.

>>22669806
it helps, yes. i am a neet, but i spent last weekend downtown in the big city brushing elbows with rich young people as some sort of scuffed gatsby. i came away with lots of experience/material.
either way, there are plenty of no-life writers churning out stories and making the big bucks. almost nothing really beats just reading more

>>22666903
You are wise beyond your years, grasshopper.

how many books do i need to write before im no longer shit? how many years?

>>22670222
0.5~ and depends how fast you write.

I'm so bad at imagining how characters would interact with eachother, I've done a little world building so far but now that I need to flesh out a character and make even more of them to interact with eachother I've reached a complete standstill as I have absolutely no clue in the world as to how I'd imagine these characters to interact.

>>22670240
How about you write a bit about them trying to figure out what to get to eat.

If you can't write that much, your characters aren't characters, they're some ethereal vague shapes that have no real thought put into them.

I could write up a scene like this in 5 minutes.

fantasy is hard to write bros

>>22669297
>Lovecraft
Shunned by the people you praise and adored by the people you hate? As expected of an *ngl*.

>>22670255
I know you're trying to make me feel stupid but I'm feeling like I might end up actually making some characters with real personalities that could actually interact with eachother in a meaningful and thoughtful way, I'm just having a tough time right now but the longer I spend thinking about it the more feasible it seems. I go from thinking that each individual character should have a large and important presence in the story and that the interactions should convey something meaningful all of the time, but the longer I think about interactions in real life the more I realize that meaningless things add up to the story as well and make them more believable as humans. Should they affect the plot point in a crucial way? Not really, but contribute to a scenario that might eventually lead to it.

>>22670269
take the japanese WNpill
stop obsessing over having the most unique worldbuilding and focus on characters in fantastical circumstances
bam, that's fantasy

>>22670283
>I know you're trying to make me feel stupid
He's not.
You are literally reinventing the wheel for why so many stories have characters screwing around and not actually doing anything that immediately advances the plot, but advances their relationship, even if it's simply confirming to the reader what they already know.

>>22670222
Roughly 1 million words

>>22670269
No it isn't, even the most primitive of cultures had their own fantasy stories

>>22670286
I am focusing on the characters, but it's hard to find those strongly characterizing details if you have to invent everything about them.
>>22670309
have you read any of them? I've read a great deal of them and very few are really all that good. They're interesting, but not good stories.

>>22670290
Should the different characters have personalities that act out a specific way all of the time or would that make them too shallow?

>>22670283
>I know you're trying to make me feel stupid
I'm not. I'm telling you to literally write a scene where your cast is trying to agree on what meal to have for the time being.

If you can't make them all act believably and in-character, you need to work on your characters more.

Is this good advice?:


I learned from him the secret which several young French literati employ in order to make certain of the perfection of their prose, when they want to write anything requiring as perfect a style as they can obtain, such as panegyrics, funeral orations, eulogies, dedications, etc. It was by surprise that I wrested that secret from Patu.
Being at his house one morning, I observed on his table several sheets of paper covered with dode-casyllabic blank verse.
I read a dozen of them, and I told him that, although the verses were very fine, the reading caused me more pain than pleasure.
“They express the same ideas as the panegyric of the Marechal de Saxe, but I confess that your prose pleases me a great deal more.”
“My prose would not have pleased you so much, if it had not been at first composed in blank verse.”
“Then you take very great trouble for nothing.”
“No trouble at all, for I have not the slightest difficulty in writing that sort of poetry. I write it as easily as prose.”
“Do you think that your prose is better when you compose it from your own poetry?”
“No doubt of it, it is much better, and I also secure the advantage that my prose is not full of half verses which flow from the pen of the writer without his being aware of it.”
“Is that a fault?”
“A great one and not to be forgiven. Prose intermixed with occasional verses is worse than prosaic poetry.”
“Is it true that the verses which, like parasites, steal into a funeral oration, must be sadly out of place?”
“Certainly. Take the example of Tacitus, who begins his history of Rome by these words: ‘Urbem Romam a principio reges habuere’. They form a very poor Latin hexameter, which the great historian certainly never made on purpose, and which he never remarked when he revised his work, for there is no doubt that, if he had observed it, he would have altered that sentence. Are not such verses considered a blemish in Italian prose?”
“Decidedly. But I must say that a great many poor writers have purposely inserted such verses into their prose, believing that they would make it more euphonious. Hence the tawdriness which is justly alleged against much Italian literature. But I suppose you are the only writer who takes so much pains.”
“The only one? Certainly not. All the authors who can compose blank verses very easily, as I can, employ them when they intend to make a fair copy of their prose. Ask Crebillon, the Abby de Voisenon, La Harpe, anyone you like, and they will all tell you the same thing. Voltaire was the first to have recourse to that art in the small pieces in which his prose is truly charming. For instance, the epistle to Madame du Chatelet, which is magnificent. Read it, and if you find a single hemistich in it I will confess myself in the wrong.”

>>22670323
Whoah there! Slow down, sparky. You said it's hard to write fantasy, not that you wanted to write GOOD stories.

>>22670340
kind of starting to feel like they're mutually exclusive 2bh

>>22670324
Have you never interacted with a human being in your life? People have personalities, and they do tend to act in certain ways. Plus, there are some universal traits. For example, if you put someone in a shitty dead end job where it's clear the boss is trying to make money off of them, and they can afford to walk away, they'll do so. The personality determines how they leave, but it's a certainty that they'll leave.

>>22670323
>it's hard to find those strongly characterizing details if you have to invent everything about them.
Who says you have to invent everything about them? Just steal their personality from other characters you like.

>>22670350
>People have personalities, and they do tend to act in certain ways. Plus, there are some universal traits.
You've made a statement and a followup statement which nullifies the first statement. That's very helpful.

>>22670356
As an example, I might write this in a contemporary story:
>Danny sank the 8-ball.
>“I win.” He smirked.
>“No,” Rob said, “you lose.”
>“How?”
>Danny studied the velvet table.
>“Pool sucks," Rob said, "I'll take my five bucks, though.”

if I want to translate this to fantasy, it'd need to be something like
>Rubian released his drawstring and loosed an arrow down-range. It sank into the wooden target, neatly clustered among his other arrows.
>"I win." He smirked.
>"No," Og said, "the point of the game is to hit each target once."
>"Why didn't you say anything?"
>"It's a stupid game. I'll take my five copper, though."

having to integrate all these explanations just ruins everything

>>22670385
It doesn't. I'm telling you it's fine to have characters act a certain way because people generally act a certain way.

>>22670389
Why wouldn't you include an explanation for pool? I don't play that.

>>22670437
Personality and what you referred two as universal traits are two things that cancel eachother out, if you have a character that is used too much in different situations, you can't make the character have that much personality because the character would be reacting to things in the way anybody would. I'm trying to figure out how to have a character that has personality that isn't lost through usage unless the character is fleshed out to a point where he or she retains the personality no matter what happens.

>>22670464
do you have autism?

>>22670487
I'm right, though.

Why is my writing so much better in general after I’ve gone on a short walk?

>>22670584
Post nut clarity.
I’ve seen what you do on your “walks,” you sick fuck.

>>22670584
Exercise gets the brain flowing, with even as something as simple as a walk

>>22659753
This is pretty good. I like it and I'd read more of it.

>>22662150
Write it. I'll read it.

New
>>22670791
>>22670791
>>22670791