/lit/ - Literature

First for Sanso. Say nice things for the most industrious writer in fantasy!

>>22627732
>50 books
>0 examples of good prose

>>22627734
What do you mean? He is as pro as it gets.

I'm in book 3 of Cixin Liu's trilogy and I do like it a lot.

>>22627814
Who asked?

>>22627822
leave him alone, cocksucker

>>22627822
You're right. I should not have come here. Time to enjoy my books alone.

>humans can do le bad things? that means humans lost their le humanity!!
>robots are the REAL le humans now because they still do nice things even doe they're oppressed!!!
Anyone else tired of this meme?

true freedom splits time and space into infinite parts
endless possibilities
each true as the other
existing in chaos
standing in front on front of the jury of past
where the past rules over the future

>read people of the black circle
>yasmina goes through a hentai trainer arc over the course of the story
I did not expect to be so aroused reading Conan

>>22627822
I did

>>22627860
i hate it too, mainly because i keep thinking that it's the author's actual view and he's one of the seemingly millions of faggots who unironically carry the belief of "humans suck, bro (not me though :) )"

What's your hottest take concerning science fiction and fantasy?

>>22627983
It's playing pretend by people who are too lazy to imagine true ways to reveal or change the problems they see today.

>>22627734
I don't think his audience or his bank balance care about good prose.

>>22627724
Are male protagonists nearly dead in prose fiction? I'm looking at many books and the /lit/ good reads section and many books are written by women and mostly have female protagonists.

>>22627983
The label 'science fiction' has done nothing but stunt the genre

>>22628005
>Be an individual!'“ Conroy contrived to make the slogan sound obscene. “And what's this been twisted into? The biggest Big Lie in history! It's no use making your life so private you refuse to learn from other people's experience—you just get stuck in a groove of mistakes you need never have made.
>We have more knowledge available at the turn of a switch than ever before, we can bring any part of the world into our own homes, and what do we do with it? Half the time We advertise goods people can't afford, and anyhow they've got the color and hold controls adrift because the pretty patterns are fun to look at when you've bolted and barred your mind with drugs. Split! Divide! Separate! Shut your eyes and maybe it'll go away!
>“We mine our gardens, we close our frontiers, we barricade our cities with Macnamara lines to shut off black from white, we divide, divide, divide!” A stamp emphasized each repetition of the word. “It gets into our families, goddamn it, it gets into our very lovemaking!
>Christ, do you know I had a girl student last year who thought she was having an affair with a boy back home and all they'd ever done was sit in front of the comweb and masturbate at each other? Twenty miles apart! They'd never even kissed! We're going insane, our whole blasted species—we're heading for screaming ochlophobia! Another couple of generations and husbands will be afraid to be alone in the same room with their wives, mothers will be afraid of their babies, if there are any babies!
>“And for what purpose? Why are we encouraging the spread of this lunacy? I mean we here, in North America. I don't mean the Afrikaners sitting smug on top of their pullulating heap of poor black devils hungry, half-naked and diseased, the richest people in the world battening on the poorest. That's just greed, which is a comparatively clean kind of vice. I'm talking about perversion, horrible, disgusting, systematic, deliberate perversion of the power of Reason to destroy people without killing them, to strip them of their initiative, their joy in life, their hope, for Christ's sake, their last ultimate irreducible human resource, hope.
>Out of sheer desperation millions of people are abandoning the use of reason, bankrupting themselves to buy mass-produced Plastic idols, in a last puerile attempt to outdo the bastards who've made 'Reason' a dirty word.
haha do you imagine living in a future like this? thank god it's just a twisted future from the mind of a whacky scifi writer from 1969, the world will never turn into something like that right? right?

>>22628027
you afraid of women chud?

>>22627732
i wanna fuck sylph

>>22628045
terrible cover

TWoK was so much better than the next three books, it's honestly depressing

>>22627734
The fuck is a good prose, nigga? It's just words.

Post the
>last book you read
>current book you're reading
>next book you plan to read

>>22628096
read a book nigga

>>22627860
>robots are the REAL le humans
That's not biology....

>>22627962
Virgin "humanity sucks" vs Chad "Universe and existence sucks".

Matt/Rand going on random tangents about refusing to fight women after living several months with Aiel is so fucking weird

>>22628134
>have lived their entire lives around egwene and nynaeve
>still have a problem with killing women

>>22627888
But she wasn't actually fucked, they sort of attempted to brainwash her instead.
>>22628045
Look at that bimbo showing off.

Any books with an early modern setting, scifi or fantasy?

>>22628027
men are dead

>>22628178
What is early modern

>>22627724
The cinder spires series any good?

>>22628258
Period between 1500 to 1800 or there about.

>>22628260
Are you more into something like Jonathan Strange or Powder Mage?

>>22628264
I'm not that >>22628178 anon. Ask him.

Why are his sci-fi books so bleak?
I finished this and by reading the plot summary for the Burning/Crystal world I can tell they are gonna be filled with despair.

against my better judgement i will add tchaikovski to my reading list. i feel a sense of dread before i pick up any modern fiction but fuck it, blindsight was good, maybe this will be too.

>>22628264
I would say more toward Jonathan Strange, but don't mind the if it is more to the latter if it really sells you on the setting.

Any Malazan readers here? Are the Ian C. Esselmont books important for a first time read or should I not bother with them??

Most influential modern fantasy/scifi writer?

>>22628499
joss whedon seems to have influenced many modern sff authors unfortunately

>>22628481
you shouldn't bother with any malazan at all, but even if you do like it, i promise you you won't feel like reading any more books in that world after you're done with the main series, trust me.

>>22628102
>last book you read
The Odyssey (Lattimore). First time reading it, it was great but nowhere near The Iliad. I might reread them both next year, will probably do the Pope translation.
>current book you're reading
The White-Luck Warrior. About 300 pages in, a good read without a massive amount of plot yet. No other 21st century fantasy author can really come close to Bakker in basically every facet.
>next book you plan to read
The Aeneid (Fagles translation).

>>22627724
What are actually good steampunk books? Including short stories. Are there any genuine steampunk classics like with other genres?

>>22628102
>last book
The Fall of Gondolin
>now
Time and the gods
>next
Heliopolis by Ernst Junger or Elantris.

>>22628515
>it was great but nowhere near The Iliad
Nigger what?

>>22627724
Hey guys, havent been there for two months or so. I lived in a university dorm and 4chan was IP blocked (kek).

Any funny developements recently? Is Bakkerfag still posting? Has TWI finally achieved its rightful supremacy?

>>22628560
>I lived in a university dorm and 4chan was IP blocked (kek).
lol
lmao even

Thoughts on Ryan Cahill's The Bound and the Broken?
Thoughts on Chris Wooding's The Ember Blade?
Thoughts on the Suneater series by Christopher Rococooachoochachanuugachacha?

>>22628537
What? The Iliad was a much better read, imho.

>>22628560
>Any funny developements recently?
Anon's copypasta is funny although he may have first posted it more than two months ago.
>Bakkerfag still posting?
Of course.
>Has TWI finally achieved its rightful supremacy?
I don't read webshit and neither should you, fag

>Eskeles is such a fat cunt he is literally killing horses under his weight
In awe of this absolute schoolman unit

>>22628580
>Thoughts on the Suneater series by Christopher Rococooachoochachanuugachacha?
it's meh with no pop or pizazz
the (first) book is also twice as long as it needs to be. pretty sure the other ones are just as long so shan't be reading

>>22627576

>>22628624
Seems like it
Cheers mate

>>22628580
>Thoughts on the Suneater
meandering, depressing pozz

>>22628102
>Last
In Green's Jungles by Gene Wolfe, 6/6 stars. The subversion of expectations by focusing mostly on "present" Horn was unexpected and highly enjoyable. It really helps you get a grasp on his character
>Current
Return to the Whorl by Gene Wolfe. Finds a balance between present Horn's journal and someone else describing Horn's time looking for Silk on the Long Sun Whorl. Don't know who's writing that part yet, my guess is Pig.
>Next
The Lessons Never Learned by Rob J. Hayes. Book 2 of The War Eternal. Looking forward to taking a break from books that are tough to read with some edgy schlock. I enjoyed the first one a lot and it was quick.

I'm also reading Moby Dick, which is amazing so far.

>>22628096

>>22628591
>reach the ship catalogue
>immediately sent into a centuries-long slumber

>>22628727
So how are you finding Book of the Short Sun as a whole?

>I'm the author's thinly veiled degenerate fantasy

>>22627724
essential incel white male kino?
i am feeling something like BR2049

>>22629151
I liked it better in general than New Sun and Long Sun. Having finished it minutes ago, the ending was really good. I can't wait to reread the entire series with more context.

>>22629209
Bakker
>every male is a rapist looking to ravage women and men alike

>>22629554
should i read The Aspect-Emperor if i got spoiled that the Great Ordeal ultimately fails?

>>22629541
I'm looking forward to it. I've been steadily falling in love with Gene Wolfe.

/SFFG/ Recommendations:

Read Reverend Insanity, Lord of The Mysteries, Neuromancer, Hyperion, The Prince of Nothing

Also read The Wandering Inn, Between Two Fires, Mother of Learning, Cradle, I Shall Seal the Heavens, A Song of Ice and Fire, The Poppy War.

The Michael Kramer audiobook reading of Wheel of Time is so fucking bad. Why is this guy heralded as a great narrator? Is the standard really that low?

>weak newspaper journalist voice, completely indistinctive and unmemorable
>does not understand pacing at all, rushes through the book and doesn't let certain passages breathe
>makes Rand sound like a 10 year old instead of a young adult
>gives Mat a weird guido Jersey accent mixed with California surfer dude
>makes Perrin sound mildly retarded
>makes all female characters bitchy and shrewy with no depth (I mean they are written that way but still)

Rosamund Pike is exponentially better as a narrator, and it shows because of her acting background. Shame she probably won't finish narrating her version the series though.

>>22629183
I would have liked this book if it weren't for Donaldson insisting that this was a character study of the interplay between hero/victim/villain. You've posted the summary to save others from my struggle, and for that you have my thanks. The Real Story has entered into that unfortunate canon of works where every time I air my issues people just assume that I'm upset over the rape and insist that it means something. I'm left convinced that Donaldson thinks that a woman having any agency at all is the real actual twist of a story.

/SFFG/ Recommendations: LITRPG Edition

Read Azarinth Healer, Primal Hunter, He Who Fights with Monsters, Dungeon Crawler Carl

Also read System Universe, Dissonance, Defiance of the Fall, Iron Prince.

>>22628267
The man sincerely wanted to fuck Ronald Reagan. I had a theory once that the area of ones studies or interests could be used as if not a divining of someone's personality then at the very least a dowsing rod. If you get interested in psychology and the interactions with the burgeoning mass media of the post-war midcentury then you're going to go dark places. This was a man who spent most of WWII in an internment camp in China and then was faced with the rapid changes in society that the West undertook. You won't find jeremiads anymore in Western literature, the battle's lost now, but there was a great wailing and gnashing of teeth at how television especially was creating a top-down pseudoculture and a progressive enabling of sexuality.

If you want a book that's not SF&F but I think encompasses his worldview and maybe helps one understand the workings of Ballard, read Crash. Psychosexual car crash fetishism is the sort of technocratic masochisty that he was drawn darkly towards.

>>22629570
Sure, ultimately it's about the friends we rape along the way.

I've read New Sun a few times. Should I read Long Sun or Short Sun next?

>>22627734
its not just the prose. the books are full of generic mary sues and boring magic "systems". I dont know much about the stories, my friend who has read a series and another of his books can barely remember them, and is fed up with the characters and dialogue. said it was a waste of time, trying to give them a chance.

>>22629730
I assume you included Urth in New Sun so Long Sun obviously.

>>22629766
>I dont know much about the stories,

>>22628102
>last book you read
Asimov's Foundation. the overall idea was interesting but the writing was beat and the whole thing was just a slog. I won't be reading any more.
>current book you're reading
Wagner's Death Angel's Shadow (Kane books). 3 short stories. Kane kicks ass, what's not the love
>next book you plan to read
either Buddhism as Philosophy or Denial of Death or Lord of Light. I need some non-fiction and/or religious/spiritual/psychological related.

>>22628530
The Difference Engine by Bruce Sterling and William Gibson is the only acknowledged "classic" of the genre, I believe. I remember thinking it was OK.
Others that I think are well-regarded are Boneshaker and The Iron Dragon's Daughter

>>22628863
"He's one of the best Smokers in the city," Kelsier said, "so it'd be good to have him along, especially since I have a hunch that this job is right in his wheelhouse."
"I hope you're right. I've been told he can be difficult to work with."
"Well, he has his quirks, same as anyone else. Maybe moreso. But I'm confident he'll suit just fine. By the way, didn't you say you knew his cousin, the Tineye? Might be good to get him along too."
"Sure, I'll talk to the both of them, and I want to make sure Yeden is still willing to put up the funds."
"He will be." Kelsier said with finality.

>>22629643
>translations
no
>Lord of Mysteries
double no, overrated trash
>hyperion
based
>bakker
based
>wandering inn
author is their own biggest enemy and the story is getting worse with every volume
>mother of learning
weak prose but great premise, so great it birthed an whole sub genre
>poppy war
just no, complete trash, copies name of the wind in the first half and then takes a hard turn into grim dark for no real reason other than because it was all the rage around the time it was being written.

>>22629651
>azarinth
decent, very unpretentious and sticks to what it's good at.
>primal hunter
bad writing with cringe characters, even by webnovel standards. that said I didn't get very far, due to aforementioned reasons.
>he who fights with monsters
it's good when the mc is not being a "woe be me" emo shitstain, which is a lot of the time so it's not really good most of the time.
>dungeon crawler carl
based, funny af
>defiance of the fall
decent, would put it on the same level as Azarinth healer
>Iron Prince
it's great but that one female character pisses me off. mc's supposed best friend and she starts dating his bully. fuck her and fuck the writer. Book two is also taking way too long to be released, so i've lost interest.

>>22629647
I feel the same, the voice acting I can overlook but the pacing issue is a glaring issue for me.
Both him and Kate Reading narrate everything on the same monotone voice - when a fight suddenly breaks out, or someone bursts through a door they maintain the same conversational tone they had a moment before and it's weird.

It's a stark difference from Rosamund Pike that fills her voice, changes the pacing and often even fucking screams (which is kind of annoying but alright).

The scene when Mat is sneaking through the Stone of Tear and Rosamund narrates the entire thing whispering made it really memorable for me.

>people discussing audiobook actors instead of the book.

>>22630206
>people discussing the text instead of the pictures in the author's mind

>>22627724
Is Fractal Noise worth a read? I read TSIASOS and loved it, haven't had time for the prequel yet though

>>22629964
I dont know what was the goal with your rewrite, but the original conversation highlights the back and forth discussion the two were having, with Dockson being uncertain and casual while Kelsier is confident and a leader.
The back and forth, and Dockson suggesting and considering is particularly important because Vin was watching and she never knew a crew leader to discuss, accept suggestions and generally treat the members as equals.

Any comedy fantasy or sci fi released that's any good recently?

>>22627822
I asked him

>>22630255
"Comedy" hasn't existed since 2014 (I'm using 22 Jump Street as the cutoff in case you were wondering)

>>22630255
DCC 5 had its moments.

>>22630232
Significantly more bleak, but I enjoyed it.

There's nothing good to read that panders to my fetishes (old man and barely legal elfgirl breeding and having a family)

>>22627989
Sup Jaden Smith

>>22628178
Minimegas - Voltaire

>>22627935
>>22630265
Thank you for asking

>>22629647
>Is the standard really that low?
Yes, but that's also how attachements to favorite media works. He's "great" according to people who think WoT is the best story ever told and only those people.

>>22628560
Your country doesn't have unlimited data packages? Surely university was free at least?

>It's a "we learn the profundity of Ren Zu" chapter

>>22628102
>>last book you read
Foundation by Asimov. This anon described my feelings perfectly >>22629825
The Apple series is not exactly a high brow adaptation but the Empire's plotline makes it so much more interesting to follow.
>>current book you're reading
The Three-body Problem by Liu Cixin. I'm at the beginning, and find the backdrop of the Cultural revolution for a sci-fi book very refreshing.
>>next book you plan to read
Rendezvous with Rama by Arthur C Clark. I'm a sucker for first contact novels (like Lem's Fiasco or Eden).

>>22628530
>What are actually good steampunk books? Including short stories. Are there any genuine steampunk classics like with other genres?
The 3 books the guy who named the genre referenced are Anubis Gates, Infernal Devices and Lord Kelvin's Machine. I've not read any but you can trust Tim Powers no idea about the other 2 writers.
Perdido Street Station and The Iron Dragon's Daughter are the two big really well regarded ones and they don't entirely fit in the genre.
I really like Bullet Catcher's Daughter which is a proper traditional steampunk world but about 4/6 books take place in locations where the steampunk stuff isn't that important. But that's not a genre classic they're just good mystery/heist fantasy novels.
I also like Merchant Princes which is a portal world series with the 3 worlds being normal earth, earth where the vikings settle america and are kinda trapped in fuedalism and a fairly traditional steampunk version of the world.
Mortal Engines is YA but I really liked that at the time. It's probably the most imaginative anyone's been with steampunk without going over into weird fiction

>>22628102
>>last book you read
sauron defeated
>>current book you're reading
morgoth's ring
>>next book you plan to read
war of the jewels, then peoples of middle earth and then probably the gotrek and felix books

*ahem*
R Scott Bakker.

>>22630702
>I'm a sucker for first contact novels
You've read blindsight then right?

>>22628102
>Hedge Wizard
Okay but the author cannot write action which is a death sentence for a series which is basically just DnD adventures. I do applaud them for writing a normal fantasy book and labelling it as "Litrpg progression" even though it isn't to rip off some people though
>The Apothecary Diaries
Found a light novel I actually like. Nothing world shattering but this is a pretty good attempt at doing historical fiction with mysteries/courtly intrigue. Has some standard genre tropes which make it pull some punches but despite that it does a pretty good job of conveying how brutal chinese courtly life could be with deaths, eunuchs and maimings all over what I've read so far.
>Twelve Kingdoms, some mystery/detective novel or something else entirely
In a bit of a rut which is why I've ended up reading on the trashier end of things so I dunno where I go next. Might end up looking for more serious historical fiction so GGK, Q by Luther Blissett or The Kingdom of This World could be options too.

>>22628102
>last book
Neuromancer. It was okay and I can appreciate how influential it was, but I found the pacing a bit abrupt and frantic.
>Current
I'm trying my hand at writing a fantasy novel, so I've been focusing on that.
>Next
Gonna finally crack open the Darkness that Comes Before soon because I think it'll be a good point of reference for the story I'm trying to write.

>>22628481
> Ian C. Esslemont
His Path to Ascendancy series is good and retcon many events from the main series. His other books are mostly average goyslops.

>>22630702
>I'm a sucker for first contact novels
The 1898 novel On Two Planets by Lasswitz is pretty fun. The English translation is trash since it's abridged but you might have luck that there is a Russian one.

>>22628102
>>last book you read
The Dark Forest
>>current book you're reading
Death's End
>>next book you plan to read
Ready Player One or Too Like Lightning, I guess

>>22624006
I read it. Had me thinking about it that night and the next morning. I'm an atheist who used to go to church so I keep trying to identify the connection between the themes of the story and IRL religious concepts. I'm low IQ but let me know what you think:

>"Miracles" in the story seem to be an obvious reference to the arbitrary nature of god's punishments/rewards.
>"Heaven's light" seems to be a reference to the unfairness of "the parable of the worker's wages," where some people can work all their lives to try to enter heaven while others can live a life of sin and then repent at the last minute to make it to heaven.
>"Light-chasers" seemed to me to refer to people who try to achieve salvation by faith alone, rather than going the conventional way of living a godly life and do works. It's possible, but most will fail.
>I didn't understand the ending of the story where Neil was sent to hell. Is it a metaphor for how god doesn't have to follow his own rules and can just fuck you over at any time?
Overall I thought the story captured religious uncertainty well. I've spoken to Christians who grew up never feeling like they could be certain where they would go after they died, and it caused a kind of mental trauma from religious ptsd. When my wife, who is a pastor's daughter, was a child, every time she heard a thunderstorm she was worried the rapture might be starting and she would be sent to hell.

>>22630702
> Rendezvous with Rama
Great book but do yourself a favor and do NOT read the the sequels.

> I'm a sucker for first contact novels
fwiw I'd recommend Forge of God and the follow-up Anvil of Stars.

Am I the only one who’s back gets massively put up by the Tuatha’an? They SO smug, and yet their philosophy is so blatantly contradictory. Jordan is great at writing infuriating characters, but these guys take the cake for me,

>>22631059
why is everyone brown?

>>22631070
21st century casting director has been here. Tracks still fresh.

>>22631031
>Rapture

>>22631059
There's a tendency to romanticize any travelling people in fantasy. I remember the first time this really stuck out to me being with the His Dark Materials trilogy and how the travellers were truly free compared to Churchbound Oxford. Then you have the Edema Ruh in Kingkiller. I think part of it matches real life where you have to be overly defensive about transience. If you're giving up all the benefits stability brings as well as entering into the self-imposed alienation from staid society then you're going to have to back it up with a very strongly cohesive culture. This gets reflected in a sort of smugness because they're all in on the culture, they have to be to survive.

>>22631059
they get fucked up enough to show pacifism is big-dumb

and they’re a neat set up for the whole big spear spoiler later

So magic in my story's setting works like cyberpunk hacking. Most magic has to be performed by channeling the ethereal plane through meditation, sort of like how hackers in cyberpunk settings have to jack into the matrix.
Hacking CCTV or somebody's cyber-eyes? Scrying.
Surfing the matrix? Astral projection.
Programming AI? Constructing a tulpa.
It goes on, but this is what I keep in mind when making boundaries to what magic can and cannot do. So a wizard can't cast a fireball in the heat of a fight, but he could meditate in his chamber and attack someone's soul.
Aesthetically, it has nothing to do with cyberpunk and is more or less identifiable as medieval/early gunpowder fantasy.
Good or nah?

>>22627724
The author of Eragon? Didn't know he continued writing.

>>22631178
Computer circuits are just magic circles.

>>22631183
And he shouldn't have.

>>22631189
I think he's fine in an advanced-10-year-old's-first-chapter book kind of way. But no I would never read that as an adult.

Should I read assassin's apprentice? I found the collection dirty cheap in the bookstore

>>22631059
They are influenced heavily by his time in Vietnam and the Hippie movement. He came to hate war and violence but also understood it was sometimes necessary, which is why he also hated those that would refuse to fight to protect others. It's pretty clear all those ideas came to be represented by Perrin.

>>22628178
A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court

I never really got Kellhus until I watched JJK. This is how you actually write a semi-omniscient OP hero...

>>22631225
Hobb has a strong claim to being the best fantasy writer alive. There's also like a 40% chance you'll hate her.

>>22631326
Why would I hate her? Is she a hack?

What SFF would you recommend to literary "snobs"?

>>22631344
She makes her characters suffer

>>22631348
I wouldn't, the amount of those that actually exist is absolutely trivial (guys on /lit/ who haven't read anything they talk about don't count) and if they've managed to develop that personality whilst somehow avoiding speculative fiction entirely (it's basically impossible to do this if you're doing a reasonable survery of 19th-21st century writing) they're not going to be receptive to anything.
Much funnier way of arguing is to just claim that everything and anything is SFF, it preempts the usual approach of saying that anything good isn't part of the genre.

>>22631348
Niels Klimm's Subterranean Voyage

Book of the new sun questions, what happened to agia besides being a pokemon spamming rebel leader? May have missed it in new urff. Is long/short sun worth reading? Are they a continuation?

>>22631369
I'm just trying to get a friend who mainly reads literary fiction to try SFF. He's pretty resistant to it because the only two he tried were Mistborn and The Expanse and he disliked both.

>>22631378
>"I pushed her away - not into a chair this time but against the wall. Her head struck the stone, and though it must have been padded by her abundant hair, the sound was as sharp as the tap of a mason's hammer."
She's a robot that somehow broke free from Hethor

>>22631388
Tigana then

>>22629678
>read Crash
I really liked the Grace Jones song based on that.

>>22631388
Hyperion then

>>22631388
What does he normally read?

>read through BotNS
>read through Too Like the Lightning
>read through Bakker
>pedestrian fantasy prose feels fucking horrible to read through now
Bros, I've spoiled myself. I can't enjoy generic slop anymore what do?

>>22631409
Culture/ the algrebraist?

>>22628267
imo crystal world isn't that bleak

>>22631407
A lot of old European novels. Last modern book he told me he liked was called "The Overstory" or something.

>>22631409
It's even worse when you come from flowery literary classics and decide to freshen up your experience and broaden your horizon by reading scifi classics. A lot of fun ideas are out there but most of it is written terrible.

>>22631415
He should read some Verne and Poe then. And then Lovecraft. Afterwards he will be ready.

>>22631409
Viriconium

>>22631422
I don't know if he's read Lovecraft but he loves Poe. He'd probably just say it's not Fantasy though.

>>22631424
It's an entry drug.

>>22631412
>>22631421
Are these of a similar caliber?

>>22631418
Nah, I've read a lot of classics. I've always kept "literature" and sci-fantasy schlock separate in my head until the last few years. The enjoyment I've received from either has always been something distinct, so this recent bingeing has left me reeling.

>>22631344
She's a woman and everything she writes revolves around making men miserable. Als Gitz is never, EVER allowed to have a real win for the entire series, he just gets shit on relentlessly.

>>22631431
Viriconium is kinda weird since you have to read it in its entirety and every single story becomes more meta and depressing. If you want heroic and weird Dying Earth fantasy just read the first two and call it quits. If you want a feels ride into melancholy, finish the sequence in its entirety. Last story is a huge gut punch after everything else and I must've reread it a dozen times.

>>22630255
>comedy fantasy
Don't know anything new like that, in fact, only comedy fantasy I know is Robert Asprin's Myth books.

>>22631099
>There's a tendency to romanticize any travelling
true
Way too much.

>>22630255
Dying Earth and the Lankhmar novels are pretty goofy, even if humor isn't their main focus.

>>22631099
Isn't that the core of nautical fiction? Although that's more trapped by environment and obligation than outright choosing to be a vagrant

>>22630255
The Zamonia novels by Walter Moers

>>22631348
PKD and Leguin are quite popular among literary circles

>>22630180
Yeah, I was listening to the Kramer version and right off the bat I knew it was gonna be dogshit because he just blazes through the famous "The Wheel of Time turns..." opening monologue at lightning speed in a boring monotone, not letting the words breathe, not giving it the atmosphere it needs or deserves. It's comically bad. I could only make it a few chapters.

>>22631409
The first Hyperion novel is pretty damn good.

>>22631579
Read those too, though they were kinda more on the self-aware sci-fi schlocky side.

>>22631583
Nothing about Hyperion is self-aware but you only read the first book and any more would be pain so that's okay.

>>22631409
The Night Land? Prolly one of the most influential books on sci-fi and horror just because it inspired so many authors afterwards. It is a major pain to read though and I think House on the Borderland was a lot better.

>>22630811
>>22630879
Thanks for recommendations, but I'm already waiting for A Fire Upon the Deep dilogy to arrive next. It's been a long time on my to do list since I found it recommended by Brian Reynolds in the manual for SMAC among his list of inspiration.

Looking for a recommendation, not sure how to articulate it. I'm thinking of a fantasy setting, where large cities may or may not exist, but the plot rarely if ever takes place in them, and when they do it's more decadent than majestic. Maybe similar to Book of the New Sun, but full fantasy with little to no sci-fi. I kind of want to say Dungeons and Dragons, but I have zero experience with it and don't really know what they're like. Pic related kind of gives me the feeling I'm looking for, somehow. It's from a Tolkien book. Honestly, the Silmarillion might fit the bill, which I read like 20 years ago, but don't remember much of.

>>22631409
>read wolfe
>read TLTL
>eh that was kind of like wolfe, at least they tried
>read some other shit
>realize it all sucks
>realize nobody is even trying to make it not suck
you are here
>realize there's no hidden endless trove of good genre lit
>start trying to write it yourself
>fail
>give up
>reread wolfe
>repeat

>>22631624
The original Conan books? The first Black Company trilogy sorta, since most of the stories take place on campaign.

>>22631633
I WILL write good fantasy/scifi shit!

I love Tolkien
I love Lovecraft
I'm reading HG Wells and I want to read Verne

>>22631639
you will but you'll also get hung up on the 1001 details that have to go into a story for it to be something that people will put up with in novel form. eventually you will say, fuck all those details, and you'll just plow ahead and write a novel where you don't think about them. and it'll suck because you didn't worry over them, and you'll put it away. go back to the top of the chart and try again. i'm on my fourth run through of it. unlike quality genre fiction, misery is infinite.

>>22631633
What’s TLTL?

>>22631526
There's still a stability there, but its different. They often have an "at-home" to go back to, someone to send money to. Even then the travelling isn't necessarily the romanticized part so much as the toughness and masculine solidarity of the ship's crew. Ships of wood and men of iron, tall masts and all that.

>>22631687
Transformative Learning Technologies Lab

>>22631645
this post made me wish for "Lord of the Mysteries but with prose that isn't ass"

>cucks himself

>>22631348
Yellow Blue Tibia by Adam Roberts

I love Smith
I love Jordan
I'm reading Sanderson and I want to read Pratchett

>>22631947
Smith? Clark Ashton?

>>22631965
Yes.

>>22631623
>I found it recommended by Brian Reynolds in the manual for SMAC among his list of inspiration.
I'd be interested to know what else were his inspirations.

>>22628267
I hate them too fren

>>22631421
good recommendation

>>22629919
The Difference Engine is fucking terrible

>>22631431
Viriconium is borderline unreadable. If you have taste you'll be ready to drop it before the first chapter.

>>22631409
You need to go back to the dino-times. Start with Dunsany's The King of Elfland's Daughter, then read Anderson's The Broken Sword. Then come back and I'll give you more to read.

>>22632113
I had the misfortune of reading it too

Have you ever met anybody IRL with similar taste in fantasy to you? Feels like everybody I know who actually reads (probably 2 out of every 10) doesn't read fantasy at all, let alone anything good. I want more recommendations as I've basically run out of fantasy to read at this point.
If anybody can recommend me something obscure similar to Dunsany, that would be great.

Anyone here read Zelazny's Chronicles of Amber? I loved Lord of Light, and Night in Lonesome October was nice, but a long series might be kinda not his ballpark

> Emperor held court from his Iron Throne, made from the personal weapons of all those monarchs the Emperors of the past had conquered and deposed, each glazed and guarded against rust. The throne itself was over six feet tall and four feet in width; a monolithic piece of furniture, it was so heavy that it had not been moved so much as a finger-length in centuries. Anyone looking at it could only be struck by its sheer mass—and must begin calculating just how many sword blades, axes, and lance points must have gone into the making of it.... None
>this was published years before Game of Thrones
Erm... GRRMsisters?

>>22631976
THE JESUS INCIDENT Frank Herbert
>A speculative and philosophical tour de force by my favorite science fiction author. You’ll probably have to search used bookstores for this one, but it’s well worth it. My favorite science fiction novel ever. A clear inspiration for the story of Planet.
DUNE Frank Herbert
>Herbert’s more famous masterpiece. If you enjoy stories of human factions tearing at each others’ throats, you’ll love this.
A FIRE UPON THE DEEP Vernor Vinge
>A far future epic which includes one of the more interesting alien races I’ve encountered as well as some really original future concepts and a surprise ending which brings it all together. Also includes some pretty hilarious parodies of internet newsgroups.
ANVIL OF STARS Greg Bear
>What if the universe is filled with alien races sometimes even more sinister and diabolical than humanity at its worst? To what depths of deception and atrocity will a species descend in order to secure its survival?
SLANT Greg Bear
>A near future earth where information technology has continued to make quantum advances. I find suspension of disbelief very easy with Greg Bear, because his worlds are coherent and his characters’ motives are so plausible.
THE MOTE IN GOD’S EYE Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle
>The best book I’ve read on the classic “first contact” concept. A really in-depth study of what makes an alien race tick.
THE REAL STORY Stephen R. Donaldson
>The first in a series of five. Mostly notable for the amount of sleep I lost reading it. Donaldson is the only author I know who can keep me addicted and on the edge of my seat through five straight books.
RED MARS Kim Stanley Robinson
>The characters can get a little thin, but this is the story on terraforming another world. Extremely well-researched. Hard science fiction at its hardest.
THE YEAR’S BEST SCIENCE FICTION Ed. Gardner Dozois
>An annual collection. Extremely well-chosen and well-edited. My favorite source of science fiction short stories. I take one with me on summer vacation.

>>22632220
Maan shut yo goofy ass up

>>22632221
Ain't you a feisty buck, are you?

>>22632174
There are 2 story archs 5 books each. The 1st one is good, 2nd one read only if you get invested as the quality drops due to main character changing.
1st book is very much introductory so maybe give 2 books a try before you drop it.

Nigga I don't know what the fuck "time-debt" is.
Every big sci-fi book that's trying to be massive and immersive with all these goofy made up concepts and terms needs a fucking glossary at the back like Dune.

What started as "oh I've heard of Heinlein, I'll read one or two of his before moving on" has turned into some kind of obsession. At this point, I have plans to read nearly every book he published.

I finally cured my webnovel slop disease by reading wolfe

>>22632344
Which did you read first?

I liked Starship Troopers and tried Stranger in a Strange Land but bounced super hard.

>>22632472
The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress -> Stranger in a Strange Land -> Lazarus Long books -> jumping around between earlier novels and short stories

TMIAHM is probably my favorite science fiction novel of all time, so picking that as my first Heinlein really energized me to read more books. I enjoyed Stranger in a Strange Land for its weirdness, but understand why it's rough for a lot of people. I've recommended and gifted Heinlein books to friends; I always tell them to wait on Stranger in a Strange Land, even though it's one of his most well known. TMIAHM and The Green Hills of Earth (collection) are two easy entry points. If they don't mind YA sci-fi, then Double Star or Farmer in the Sky work as well.

>>22631947
Had to put down Jordan after starting first WoT book, had to put down Sanderson after starting Mistborn.
>>22632174
I have read some of the Amber books years ago, didn't really grip me that much, but it had some good moments. Dara...

>humans get utterly BTFO by the Spiders at the end and the entire species is under viral mind control to be docile around said Spiders
what a creepy fucking ending
>next book immediately gets back to humans being humans where one mega-autist obsessed with octopods is responsible for an entire race of super smart sentient space faring octopod people
hell yeah im back in

>>22632559
the hell are you talking about

>>22632587
Children of Time / Children of Ruin.

tfw no Soulcatcher gf....

>>22632559
>>22632587
I was about to say maybe Collin Willson (and Russian or whatever bootleg version by Net Pirckley) Spiderworld.

>>22632677

>>22632677
That said, later Black Company books in the South are kind of cringe.

>>22632689
>>22632677

>>22632797
“I don’t know. Depends on how well your healing, spells work. I didn’t
know you were vain.”
“I’m human. I’m a woman. I want to look nice.” Same voice but less merry.
“You do look nice.” He did not think before he spoke. Just making a
statement of fact. She looked nice in the sense that she was a beautiful
woman. Like her sister. He had become very conscious of that since she had
changed her style of dress. That left him nagged by low-grade guilt.
She laughed. “I’m reading your mind, Croaker.”

....
Fifteen minutes after the lamp went out Soulcatcher asked, “Are you
awake?”
“Yeah.”
“It’s cold in here.”
“Uhm.” It always was. Most nights he fell asleep shivering.
“Why don’t you come over here?”
The shivering worsened. “I don’t think so.”
She laughed. “Some other time.”


luv her

>>22632797
>>22632808
>>22632689
>>22632677
where is this from

>>22632859
Black Company books by Glen Cook.

Just started Black Company What am I in for /lit/bros???

>>22628178
my book im almost done with

>>22632867
A company of black people

Any recommendations for novels that manage to interweave light-heartedness and drama well n a relatively dark or gritty setting?

>>22632687
>Collin Willson
> Spiderworld.

Currently reading this. Surprisingly good. Also knowing that the novel is meant to be somewhat didactic because the powers presented in the series match Wilson's own occult/newage beliefs about human potential is hilarious.

>>22632867
Wizards pulling pranks on each other
Playing cards
Croaker mooning over women like the shy boy he is
Flying mantas

>>22632869
let me know when you finish it

>>22632889
>because the powers presented in the series match Wilson's own occult/newage beliefs about human potential is hilarious.
Didn't know that.

>>22627734
It's not just the prose that sucks, it's the writing in general. Horrendous dialogue and thus terrible characterization, some of the worst pacing, constant and repetitive info dumping and way too much telling vs showing. Even the power systems every retard circle jerks about are super generic and unimaginative.

>>22632559
It's been a while but I don't remember the ending being particularly creepy. They're infected essentially with an empathy virus so that the spiders can become part of their in-group.

>>22632986

>>22632867
Nothing good and an awful self-insert lusting after a bland "vilainess"

>>22632986
>>22632994
This should be seen as morally the same as flooding the thread with gore.

>>22633022
First book is good, later ones not so much, but they do have their moments as well.
It would have been better if Croaker lusted for Soulcatcher, but then you would have to rewrite all the later books and Cook was a waifufag for Lady, for some reason. I guess he's as sentimental as he makes out Croaker to be.
>>22633037
Sorry, but I had to.

>>22632994
why do we tolerate conferences that require talks on modern-day race and sexual identity issues in "fantasy" novels?

>>22630702
Read the first two Rama books if you feel so inclined and then drop the series. You'll thank me later.

>>22633084
Muh freedoms

>>22628102
>Martial World: Divine Rune City
>Martial World: Final Asura Trial
>probably get caught up on the last ~7 months of Infinite Realm or read a free halloween-y mystery VN on Steam

>>22629825
I enjoyed the Kane books but sometimes the edginess is laid on so thick it turns into unintentional black comedy.

>>22632994
Haha! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAA!!

>>22633162
>VNigger
Subhuman. VNs are not video games.

>>22632994
I'm writing a fantasy novel with an ensemble cast and a couple LGBT characters and reading this made me almost want to delete the whole thing out of spite. I'm gonna go take a walk and get some fresh air.

>>22633208
why are you writing fags

>>22628102
>last book you read
Heir to the Empire by Timothy Zahn, I hear so much praise for this book that I was left disappointed by how average and bland it was. Thrawn was interesting but there isn't enough of him while Luke and the gang are so boring.

>current book you're reading
The Saga of Tanya the Evil Vol 8, it's fine even good sometimes but there's some aspect of the author's style I don't like that I can't exactly put into words.

>next book you plan to read
The Gathering Storm by Robert Jordan and Brandon Sanderson. Dunno how to feel about Robert dying and Brandon getting pick up to finish the story since I picked up the series on January of this year and all the drama was already a done deal.

>>22633261
Helps him get published

>>22633084
not like you were fucking attending either way is it

>>22633261
I'm a fan of the Venture Bros and was inspired by Shore Leave to write a campy gay badass. A middle aged ex-adventurer with the speech and mannerisms of a southern dandy who is also a cocky and fearless swashbuckler with a hint of Cool Wine Aunt sadness and regret. I feel very good about him as a character.
Two other main characters of the same sex will end up together, have a falling out, get separated by a major plot event, end up on opposite sides of a conflict, grow as people, and reconcile under a healthier relationship dynamic. I feel pretty good about the path I have laid out for them.

>>22632174
Read the first one and hated it.

>>22633154
what freedoms?

>>22627724
Just read Redliners by David Drake. Good stuff. Anyone have any recs for more Military SF?

>>22633356
It's your right to sit around with a bunch of troons and talk about make believe modern liberal ideals in classic works, if that's what you want to do.

>>22633195
Videogames can be art.

>>22633371
I'm out shopping atm, but I like to spread this list because in general I like it and I used to identify as a Baen's Man for milscifi.

https://www.worldswithoutend.com/lists_baen_milsf.asp

But as a quick trilogy of recommendations: Hammer's Slammers for good mercenary work, Vorkosigan for a long spanning saga, Armor for a deeply personal look at a bug war

>>22633431
Cheers

>>22632986
This is the same shit for all literature and media criticism, not unique to Tolkien. Took a class last semester on horror fiction and had to read an article about how Invasion of the Body Snatchers is actually about fears of Mexican immigration.

>>22632867
Goth evil ladies and croaker killing his daughter and turning into a golem at the end

>>22627983
It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing (gratuitous sex andor rape)

>>22632986
BUT WHAT ABOUT THE TAXES?

>>22633279
Zhan is hyped because of hindsight. People compare them to the Disney Sequels and they're a lot better than those. On theirnown they're solid adventure books at best. The continuity trajectory he establishes is also pretty important lore-wise for most everything post-ROTJ so people read them.
The same is true of Jedi Academy but they're worse books. I read like 30 Star Wars books last year and none of them were notably good until the New Jedi Order series started.

>>22633371
Death's Head by David Gunn and Brigador by Bradley Buckmaster

Jordan has a thing where he starts a scene on the aftermath of some event (ie Mat sitting down cleaning blood), and then he says what happened by the way of memories or flashbacks (ie Mat tells us who he fought)
i hate it

>>22633655
It's a cool way to start a book/pov but it drives you insane if it happens enough
I've seen longer form stories like webnovels try it mid story and it just annoys me instead of intriguing me lol

>>22633535
>solid adventure books at best
I think this is my issue, I got into it thinking it was going to be something else, the wars part of star wars
with a competent villain that most be fought through a long campaign and just not blowing up a death star. I guess I built up an image of these books through snip bits and hearsay different from reality.

>>22633371
Maybe those goober libertarian mil SF writers for baen like john ringo? Idk

Anyone read any good monastic-themed fiction? I've read Canticle for Leibowitz, Glass Bead Game(debatably included), and Anathem. It feels like an underutilized setting

>>22633854
Name of the Rose, that has to be where you go immediately

>>22633708
If that's what you want just skip to Vector Prime and continue with the New Jedi Order. They're not all great, but a lot of them are and very few are bad. The entire series is about a years-long galaxy-spanning war and there are like 19 books. They do a good job of including context from previous series.

>>22633854
Canticle for Leibowitz was so good, it's still one of my to-go books if someone asks me about my favourites.

>>22633870
Interesting, thanks for the rec. Surprised I've never heard of it.

>>22631687
>What’s TLT
Too Like the Lightning
Not sure how it's you could characterize it as similar to Wolfe, I tried reading it and barely made it 50 pages before putting it down and never opening it again. Excruciating

>>22627724
Anyone read it?

>>22633952
Not that one but Kingfisher is alright depending on how much patience/interest you have for fairy tell retellings

>>22633854
based. yes what >>22633870 said. also Eifelheim by Michael Flynn ; and to a lesser extent The Sparrow by Russell (in that it's got a Jesuit priest as a main character and focuses a bit on the Catholic church and how they'd deal with a first contact situation; yet the setting is basically modern day)

its the supremacy of those who rule, not the misery of those who drool

>>22627983
Fantasy needs more books with men raping and breeding barely legal girls
Science fiction should fucking stop being about humans fucking each other up and focus on the goddamned aliens

>>22634128
Get off 4chan and go finish Winds of Winter, you slovenly old coomer

>>22628259
I loved the first book and the recent novella and I'm eagerly awaiting book 2. Great characters and better naval action scenes, though there were not enough of the latter imo. I've seen other Jim Butcher fans say they hated Aeronaut's Windlass, however.

>>22634140
Dany being bred at 13 was so hot...

>>22634128
>Science fiction should fucking stop being about humans fucking each other up and focus on the goddamned aliens
Read Lesabendio. It's nothing but aliens.

Can you guys recommend some Fantasy bestselling debuts in the past few years that aren't YA or if they are YA at least unconventional YA? I'm trying to get an idea of what sort of story is popular right now.

>>22634233
Chasing the market isn't a good idea.

>>22634233
The Locked Tomb is what immediately comes to mind when I think of unconventional bestselling YA.

>>22634294
That's more SF than fantasy, which is what anon asked for. Also I'd argue that it's the new convention, which is women who grew up writing fanfiction are now writing novels.

>>22634233
Vampire romances are still in

>>22634128
>focus on the goddamned aliens
xeelee sequence does this but nobody reads because it's a collection of ~30 novels and short stories, and not a convenient whopping 3 book long 'space opera'
>humanity gets enslaved two separate times by two separate alien species
>breaks out and says fuck this, conquers every single alien race in the Milky Way
>can't conquer the Xeelee but seemingly convince them to fuck off from the galactic black hole core
>then tries to go after the Xeelee using things like neutron stars as projectile weapons until the Xeelee come back and Dyson sphere every Sun in the Milky Way
And this entire plot is just a blip in the overall narrative. Baxter likes to imagine life everywhere and some of the shit he crafts is kooky. It can all be very hit or miss.

>>22634233
There are very few bestselling debuts unless the author has a large pre-existing audience, usually through social media, and the book is well-received and shared a lot. As a result BookTok, part of TikTok, is the most influential space with the largest customer base, which are young women. So, unless you plan to write as if you were a woman, or are one, I don't know how much help that would be. As far I'm aware most of the most successful fantasy debuts from men in recent years have been self-published. After having proved their value they're offered a book deal from a major publisher. There probably are some but I can't think of a single successful fantasy debut from a man that was traditionally published in recent years other than possibly one from nepotism.

>>22634307
qrd on the locked tomb

>>22634356
Possibly the most recent best selling fantasy debut by a male author was last year's Legends & Lattes by Travis Baldree which was self-published and then he got a deal with TOR.

>>22634395
Homestuck fanfic writer wrote stories about characters not actually doing much and yet feeling like they did too much.

>>22634395
1st book: students vs students solving a mystery as part of a test and several dying. They are attempting to become superpowered to serve their God emperor.

2nd book: experimental 2nd person narrative with a lot of meta and fanfictional elements.

3rd book: complete self-indulgence filled with digressions and infodumps. Once again very different than the previous books.

4th: idk, it's not out.

I could link to what I wrote about them, but nah.

>>22632540
Cool I'll give Moon a shot

>>22634233
This is a popularity contest which is often a proxy for sales. Just look at the nominees of the last several years to get an idea of what's popular. Spoiler: it has very little overlap with what's read in /sffg/
https://www.goodreads.com/choiceawards/best-fantasy-books-2022

>>22634452
Who makes these covers

>>22634495
Interns

>>22634495
Cover artists are done for.

>>22634278
I'm not necessarily trying to chase the market but you have to be realistic. I only really read Fantasy and Sci-fi all from random time periods. I thought maybe it would be a good idea to try to read some modern popular fiction and have it become part of my reference pool. I just asked for debuts because established writers generally have a lot more leeway.

>>22634356
>>22634452
Okay so... what do adult Fantasy authors debut with? All I ever seem to see recommended anywhere is either YA slop, something from decades ago, or something new by a guy who's already well established. I've written a decent amount of short stories and a bunch of aborted novels and I'm just trying to write something simple and effective tbqh.

>>22634541
I don't understand what you're asking by "what do adult fantasy authors debut with". Are you asking if their first published book isn't fantasy? That happens, though that isn't what I said. I said they are rarely best sellers. The vast majority of authors never find any success, let alone being able to live in their book income. Most debut authors are dropped after their contract goes up because they weren't sufficiently commerical successful. I could look what debut authors I've read from recent years and how they've done because I read current year fiction. Most don't seem to, for various reasons.

>>22634422
>1st book: students vs students solving a mystery as part of a test and several dying. They are attempting to become superpowered to serve their God emperor.
So "The Will of the Many"?

>>22634608
They're superficially similar, sure.

>>22628045
>>22628079
Julian May is seriously one of the most intelligent writers I've ever read, Her verbosity and depth of knowledge is only exceeded by her ability to weave a complex tale that spans 9 books, with each book having relevance to the others (all this including time travel too).
>>22628102
>Finished one of the Animorphs books. Some of them are pretty meh
>Sabriel
>Probably Lireal
>>22631623
You're going to read Children of the Sky too, right?
>>22633854
Be sure and read the sequel too

>>22634586
I was sort of asking about what are the common ideas of the genre right now but I realize it's kind of a weird question. Instead I'll just go try to find recent adult Fantasy debuts.

Give me your top 3 scifi books and your top 3 fantasy books right now and i will read them before the year ends.

>>22634651
Jackie Chan

>>22634651
Up to how many anons? Just the first anon that replies? That's 6 books right there. There's also a good chance the they're intentionally bad books and memes.

>>22634651
Fantasy
A Game of Thrones
A Shadow in Summer
The Grace of Kings

SciFi
Dune
Hyperion
Permutation City

>>22631579
That severian art is interesting, wheres it from?

Also what does everyone think of BotNS? I read it early this year and was blown away by the prose and how uniquely the story was told. pic rel

>>22634696
botpost

>>22634710
My thoughts. You can find a ton of thoughts if you search the archive with the right terms. There's an absurd amounts of thoughts if you search the Internet for them.
>>/lit/?task=search2&ghost=false&search_text=New+Sun+wolfe&search_tripcode=sffg&search_ord=old

>>22632217
>author's name is mercedes lackey

Are there any good fantasy books with complex fights like JoJo or HxH?
Please, I need some.

39 year old Paolini is somewhat better at writing than 16 year old Paolini
>Murtagh walked along Thorn's glittering length to where the saddlebags hung. He opened them and removed in order, Zar'roc, his arming cap and helm, his greaves and vambraces, his iron-rimmed kite shield from which he'd scraped the Empire's emblem, his padded undershirt, and his breastplate. When not marching into open battle, he preferred to wear a mail shirt for the mobility it provided. But it wasn't mobility, nor even protection, he was after. It was intimidation. So, for the first time since Galbatorix had died and the Empire had fallen, Murtagh decided to substitute spectacle for subterfuge.
>As he donned the armor, its familiar weight settled onto his frame, with cold, forbidding constraint. Piece by piece, he assembled himself. Or rather, a version of himself he had hoped to abandon. Murtagh son of Morzan, Murtagh the dread servant of Galbatorix, Murtagh the betrayer. There was a circlet of gold about the helm, reminiscent of a minor crown. Galbatorix's idea of humor. He'd introduced Murtagh as his right-hand man in the Empire, a new rider, descendant of the Forsworn, sworn to the king and devoted to his cause.
>Before the crowds, Galbatorix had treated Murtagh as all but his son. But in private chambers where the truth could not hide, Murtagh had been nothing more than a slave.
>He placed the helm upon his head and then walked to a marshy pond lined in cattails and studied his reflection. He resembled a princeling sent to war. With the added harshness of his visage had acquired during the past year, he found himself thinking he would not want to fight himself.
>He nodded. "That'll do." Then he eyed Thorn, "A pity we don't have armor for you."
>Thorn sniffed. I need none. Besides, it would have to be made anew each year.
>It was true. Like all dragons, Thorn would continue to grow his entire life. The rate of growth slowed in proportion to overall mass, but it never entirely stopped. Some of the ancient dragons, such as the wild dragon Belgabad, had been truly enormous.
>Murtagh belted on Zar'roc, and then closed the saddlebags and climbed back onto Thorn.

>>22634755
I haven't read it but The Combat Codes is supposed to be mostly highly detailed fights. As to what you've specifically asked for, I don't know.

>>22634710
Just a joke drawing I did of an /a/ meme

>>22634778
I am not sure how to describe them, desu.
Here's an example.
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_U5sAFYo-7M&ab_channel=NEWJoJoSupercutsandMore
Lots of outsmarting and fight location really matter.

>The Combat Codes
I will check that out.

>>22634755

>>22634903
No. Bad anon.

>>22634651
The City of Dreaming Books
The Tartar Steppe
Titus Alone

The Star Diaries
The Dark Forest
On Two Planets

>>22634920
pseudposting

>>22634651
>Give me your top 3 scifi books and your top 3 fantasy books right now
The King of Elfland's Daughter
Lyonesse
The Broken Sword

Blindsight
Dune
BotNS

>>22634934
Dunsany+Vance = Dunce

What is a good prose? Explain.

>>22634960
>Here, Lopen finally found his Reshi visitors. Storms! How’d they gotten so far inside in such a short time? “Nice work, naco,” he said to Rua, then Lashed himself downward so he landed near the visitors.
>He strode toward them, hands out. “Greetings! And I am the Lopen, Windrunner, poet, and your most humble servant. You must be King Ral-na!”
>He’d been warned the king would be the one in the robes. He was a short man with greying hair, though his robes parted down the front to show firm pectoral muscles. He was attended by a group of fierce men in wraps, carrying spears.
>“I speak for the king,” one of them said in pretty good Alethi. The tall figure wore his hair in two long braids. “You may call me Talik.”
>“Sure, Talik!” Lopen said. “Do you like to fly?”
>“I wouldn’t be able to say,” Talik replied. “Were you the one who was supposed to—”
>“We can talk,” Lopen said, “later.” He grabbed Talik by the arm, infused him, waved to the others, then launched the two of them high into the air.
>They shot up along the window, passing story after story. Lopen hung on tight. This Talik fellow was an important official, and it wouldn’t do to drop him or something. He was surrounded by shockspren in the shape of pale yellow triangles. So he seemed to be enjoying the ride.
>“Now see, I figure that you live on a giant crab out in the ocean, right?” Lopen said as they flew. “One of the really big ones. A bigger-than-a-town type crab.
>“I had a cousin once, sure, who had a crab he swore had bred with chulls, but I didn’t think that was possible, even if it came up to my knees. So it was a big storming crab. But we couldn’t build a house on its back. That’s wild, velo. You deserve respect for living on a giant crab. Who lives on a crab? No regular people. Just people like you.”

>>22634930
>"Please give me only pleb books!"
No.

>>22634651
Reverend Insanity

>>22634128
Sci fi recs for you:Mission of Gravity,Dragon's Egg and Mote in God's Eye.

>>22627724
Is Children of Time and its sequels worth it?

>>22635222
Yes.

>>22634155
thanks for the response lad. I will check them out

I'm re-reading The Shadow Rising. And I just got to the part where Rand is in Rhuidean. And I an ending theory just came to me.(note, I haven't read the ending in a long time, and forgot most of it)

As Rand goes through the flashback sequence, I noticed a few details that I overlooked before. And that is the importance of trees and songs. It's something I never really understood before. I just assumed Robert Jordan was inserting some hippie environmentalist peace&love sentiment here and there. But the more I think on it, the more I believe he was actually building up to something. I believe that the ending to the whole series, was going to conclude with the planting of a new world tree. Directly into the dark one's bore. It would be like how the first book ended, with the death of the green man. And then Loial singing to give strength to the tree left behind. That tree remaining as a beacon of light within the darkness of the Blight. The green man himself was an example of what Rand could be. This life giving figure that maintained harmony and beauty among darkness. The green tells the others that it wouldn't harm his garden if they can take a few flowers here and there. This is a lesson that Rand needed to learn about being Ta'veren. That he can't preserve everything and everyone one. That in order to create harmony, he had to let some flowers go.

But anyway, I think that a song was supposed to be found. And it would have been sung likely by Ogier, in order to restore a great tree, filling the dark one's prison. Or perhaps, Rand would have played the song on his flute. The last battle probably would have involved the flute. Either way, it would be poetic that the tactic that failed so pathetically in the past, would be the tactic that ultimately destroys the dark one.

I'm probably completely wrong about this. But I feel like an ending like that would pay off a lot of symbolism.

>>22635755
>But anyway, I think that a song was supposed to be found. And it would have been sung likely by Ogier, in order to restore a great tree

This literally happened at the end, you've just blanked on it. It happens at the signing of the Peace.

>>22635785
I guess I did blank on it. The ending is pretty much a blur now. Or maybe you're doing that autist thing, where you're stating a technical fact, but missing the point. In any case, I will figure it out myself in another 6 months when I finally get through the whole series again.

>>22635796
Rand rediscovers the song when he has his epiphany atop Dragonmount. He shares it with the Ogier at the signing of the Dragon's Peace and they grow a huge grove of new world trees with it. It isn't used at the bore, but it is a large point before that.
Sanderson also bungles part of it because he at one point describes Rand using it to make a peach tree flower in the palace gardens, because Sanderson didn't know that Peach trees were incredibly poisonous in the series and having one in the palace garden makes no sense.

>>22635807
>>22635796
A shame he didn't use that song on Min's barren womb.

>>22635807
THE song is never found, nor will it ever, because it doesn't exist as per Jordan. Rand sings A song that the Aiel and Ogier used to sing to grow plants but it isn't actually a mystical peace bringing song like the gypsies want.

>>22635894
The Travellers are just the worst of the worst.

>abandon the actually important oath in favour of the bullshit one that no one would have expected them to keep
>spread their retarded ideology that would doom the world if any substantial amount of people followed it
>abandon their traveling ways to settle in the authoritarian police state despite it being founded on blood, conquest, and slavery, because it's "safe"

>>22634920
Are you a Deutsch speaker? If so, are the Moer translations really a good localization. I've heard that the original language has Moer be a modern classic in terms of word play

>>22635939
They're smug, hypocritical peaceniks. I don't think Jordan was ever trying to glorify them.

>>22635939
There's a reason the Aiel hate them all. And since the Aiel are completely based it's clear who Jordan thought was right.

>>22636030
>>22635960
>>22635939
I'm at the end of the flashblacks now. And it's implied that the Aiel are either non-human creatures, or artificially created beings. Because even back during the age of legends, they all have distinct Aiel features, suggesting no genetic diversity. They also all work the fields with Ogier and Nyms. A particular Aiel thinks to himself that "he was born for this work", and when he looks at a soldier he thinks "I'm glade I didn't get to choose [my job]". He is thinking about his life choices, or rather his lack of choices. And how lucky he's been despite that. But I believe the implication here, is that he doesn't truly have agency in his life, despite the contentment he feels.

I can pity the traveling people, because they are almost programmed to think the way they do. It took a heavy amount of trauma over generations in order to get the Aiel to exercise self preservation. And even then, they continue to perform a bastardized version of their programming.

>>22636075
The Age of Legends was high tech so it's feasible. For what it's worth the series heavily implies that the Age before the Age of legends was present day Earth, and the Age ended when "Mosk and Merk" (Moscow and America) fought each other with "Lances of fire that reached the skies and destroyed entire cities", ie Nukes.

Then there's Nynaeve spotting an Icon in the Tanchican museum, a three pointed star inside a circle, made out of something shiny, but too soft to be metal, that gave her the impression of decadence and greed.

>>22636075
I've always liked this theory but I've never felt there was enough evidence to make it more feasible than the Aiel simply being an extremely peculiar ethnic group with a pseudo-religion that puts outsiders off so effectively that intermingling is rare. We know that genetic modification was illegal in the AoL and it'd be weird if they only made it illegal after creating the Aiel but still have them work the fields like slaves and keep them apart from others.

>>22636129
Maybe they're Super Mormons.

I find very amusing that Demandred hesitates in using balefire even when the Lord of the Dark is asking him to straight to his face, meanwhile Rand is throwing the thing around to kill trollocs

>>22636159
Fuck off Sanderson don't you have 4 more novels to write today?

>>22636269
Because Rand is basically a monkey with a gun at that point. He's got no idea how catastrophic it could be.

New!!!
>>22636318
>>22636318
>>22636318