/lit/ - Literature

>>22421461
It’s an annoying way to say what he wants to say but I don’t think it’s wrong exactly.

>>22421461
A thread died for this

>>22421461
reddit is where the most annoying faggot midwits go to be contained

>>22421461
It's true, it does feel like shonen garbage, which is why it's carthur's worst character, and book.

>>22421461

nigga why you even on Reddit then?

people who think the Judge is some magical supervillain or whatever should be banned from discussing this work.

You will live to see horrific interpretations of literature beyond your comprehension.

>>22421468
Yeah legitimately though, it's why the parallel can be made to joe Christmas hes like the archetype, its also all hinged on the introduction of the character. Like no matter the situation they're the enigma in Christmas' case it's at a job and in the judges case its among the raping and scalping. On another note fuck a reddit mccarthy thread

>>22421475
If they are contained how come OP is posting here

>>22421495
My nigga don quixote de la mancha could be called the beginning of that archetype i guess

why the fuck do we have so many threads about this book? there are so many better and more high art literature out there. must be americans forcing their shitty culture down the world's throat.

>>22421507
>there are so many better and more high art literature out there.
Not really. Joyce is pretty much the only author who mogs mccarthy.

>>22421515
The Classics and pretty much all cultural heroic tales are so far above all post-Enlightenment "literature" its like the difference between Heaven and Earth.

>>22421461
Why don't you ever ask the redditors why they are the way they are? You come here and ask us like we care and then probably wonder why you were told to go back. Let me see if I can answer in redditor for you "this is my opinion on x, le post to internet and response y, hope no one Screencaps it and goes to 4chan to ask other randoms about my opinion" and yet that is what you did.

>>22421507
most people who post here haven't read that much, so there's not too many books you can expect to generate a lot of discussion. It's fine IMO as long as people are still reading other stuff, everybody has to start somewhere

>>22421571
Yeah that’s what I thought, you are a retard

>>22421495
>brings up corncobby trash cuckner in an unrelated context.
Enough internet for you, hillbilly.

>>22421515
>Joyce is the only author who mogs McCarthy
Imagine being this ill-read.

>>22421480
If you're going to read Blood Meridian without a deep background in literature, this NYT interview with McCarthy is 100% required: https://archive.is/my0w1.. This extensive obituary from the Santa Fe institute might also help: https://www.santafe.edu/news-center/news/memoriam-cormac-mccarthy

Two key points here are that 1. The judge's "unrealistic" super-intellect is based on McCarthy's own genius, and is not even that much exaggerated. 2. This also seems to be true of the judge's views on war, there's a strong similarity:
>"There's no such thing as life without bloodshed," McCarthy says philosophically. "I think the notion that the species can be improved in some way, that everyone could live in harmony, is a really dangerous idea. Those who are afflicted with this notion are the first ones to give up their souls, their freedom. Your desire that it be that way will enslave you and make your life vacuous."

I don't think it's reasonable to say we're Judge's perspective is the book's "message", like we're just supposed to agree with him in some straightforward way, but he is a very personal character. I see him as a sort of self-deprecating self portrait, maybe of an earlier time in McCarthy's life, when he had reasoned himself into that kind of amoral, sort of Nietzschean (but not quite) perspective and had to slap himself out of it. The Judge says the world is infinitely beyond human understanding, so human beliefs can't be true and human values can't really matter, but what matters is just that people with their opposing wills come into conflict, and someone wins. The winner is crowned by "the larger will that selects". War creates meaning, war is God. And to that the kid just says, "you're crazy." "What's he the judge of." Which could mean basically, the judge's perspective can't be the whole picture because it's contradictory, if it's "true" then the judge isn't above it either. He's not God, if the fight is what matters maybe we'll just fight him.

>>22421495
Cuckner couldn't polish McCarthy's boots. Also pic related Cucknerfag.

>>22422041
The judge is a personification of the self deluding ideology used to justify American manifest destiny. I don't see that Cormac believes that stuff or expects the reader to find it convincing, anymore than we believe Humbert Humbert. We're supposed to see the evasions, and notice how eager the gang are to go along with it

>>22421461
He's just so over the top, it's unbelievable. He's more cartoony than a Dickens character.

>>22422048
Faulker is a much better writer. Only redditors would disagree.

>>22421480
Not really. McCarthy didn’t set out to explicitly make it a fantasy/magical realist work, but shades of it inevitably bled through. By the end, it’s suggested the Judge is immortal (not having aged at all over decades), he’s inhumanly strong, and there’s also the “prestidigitation” (magic trick) scene with the coin where it’s suggested he somehow did something impossible with it. I believe McCarthy even said something like, “He could be” when asked either by an interviewer or a correspondent if the Judge is indeed immortal.

McCarthy's last book/s were awful. Piles and piles of them just abandoned on bookstore tables begging for somebody with shit taste to please buy them.

>>22422131
>The judge is a personification of the self deluding ideology used to justify American manifest destiny
To some extent, maybe, but if you think McCarthy is some lib-left moralist crying over the poor natives you've totally misread the book. The guy avoided public statements and basically never talked about his views on anything, so it's pretty notable that the one thing he felt he had to clarify is that he's firmly pro-war.

>>22422048
picrel is actually hilarious, regardless of context. thanks for the gem

this is the same board that says dostoevsky is anime writing and the characters blush and emote like anime characters

>>22421497
Since he’s an upper midwit and thinks it distinguishes him as a truewit.

>>22421461
>redditor confronted with the literary personification of the devil
>wow this is just like my animu

Then again, it's not like any of you is any better when you're trying to make him about America, colonialism, capitalism or whatever other self-hating mental masturbation the spiteful mutants across the oceans poured into your minds for decades.

The moral of the story is simple, you cuckolds. You see it time and time again, even as late as three days ago in that AIDS ridden shithole you keep fantasizing about. If you're lukewarm, neither hot nor cold, neither evil enough to play with the big boys without remorse, nor righteous enough to fight them, you eventually get swallowed up by evil. Simple as. It's literally the very ending of the novel.

>>22422164
>McCarthy's last book/s were awful.
the ones from last year with the tranny and the incest?

>>22422142
Only Cucknerfags would agree. But Cucknerfags are idiots. Cuckner couldn't write out of a wet paper bag with his mile long strings of adjectives lol.

>>22422164
Filtered.

>>22422269
>Le evil is the only way to interpret the novel
The pale nigger’s likeness is figuratively minted into a coin with a bunch of invocations of law and economy. You’re telling me that you can only ascribe to the novel a primordial interpretation?

>>22422313
I'm begging you to be less of a retard. McCarthy loved Faulkner and was heavily influenced by him, he considered Sound and the Fury one of the five "great novels". You should obviously read both authors.

>>22422003
Name 5 authors unequivocally better than mccarthy

>>22422362
McCarthy was an 89 year old man who was being generous to a hillbilly soap opera writer. Whatever his influence, McCarthy never wrote hillbilly soap operas nor his prose was as amateurishly written as Faulkner's.

>>22421507
> I bet the Americans did this!

>>22422313
>>22422529
filtered that hard, were you?

>>22422638
He probably hasn’t even read a lick of Faulkner. He’s a turboautist who spergs out the second anyone mentions Faulkner or Melville in relation to McCarthy.

>>22422687
He mightn't have even read much McCarthy. He just watched the movies and decided it was based because it has based dialogue and a bit of violence.

>>22422169
Either that, or he's anti anti-war sentiments

>>22422351
The primordial is always the only interpretation worth having. A topical and relevant interpretation today is naive and dated tomorrow to someone in a different cultural context, but anyone at any time can boil any story down to its timeless essentials, and reach the same conclusions as a man from another century.

>>22422837
probably a better way to put it

>>22421461
I feel that way about some characters desu. Especially girls who are too cute and girly and seem to love the main character for no reason.

>>22423290
Undeniably true of love interests in Tolstoy novels. Tolstoy would have had a Natasha body pillow if he'd thought of it

>>22423631
Natasha was kind of a cunt. Her trying to run off was very 3DPD. Now Kitty, that's a waifu.

>>22422687
Coping Cucknerfag. Kill yourself. I have wasted time reading trash like Light in August and As I Lay Dying, even a bit of Absalom bullshit. Keep coping. Cuckner can't write for shit. All you insecure Cuckner fags also know that deep down.

>>22422131
>Those who are afflicted with this notion are the first ones to give up their souls, their freedom. Your desire that it be that way will enslave you and make your life vacuous."

We went to space without you and will soon leave you to rot on this husk of a planet 'in peace'.

>>22422402
Shakespeare
Melville
Faulkner
Doestoevesky
Tolstoy

Cope & seethe

>>22424535
Cuckner isn't half the writer McCarthy is. Kys.

>>22421571
yep, all the books written today are obfuscations of the extremely strong narratives and meaning of the ancient classics. Why fill your bucket at the dripping tap when you can go upstream where the water is abundant?

>>22422313
Based color search graph

How many adjectives until the writer has
moved into le purple prose
>>22424535
>>22424547
>>22424574
>>22422003
>>22421461
>>22421473

Currently re-reading it as I do once or twice a year. Each every time I’m confused by the part where they sleep in the horse shed in the Mexican village get naked and start glowing and scaring the animals. What the fuck is happening here? Is it gay sex?

>>22424618
>How many adjectives until the writer has moved into le purple prose
anymore than one adjective and I just headcanon the scene.

>>22422048
Yeah nah. You’ve lost your mind somewhere. Love McCarthy read everything of his. He isn’t half as good as Faulkner. McCarthy is just a step above YA fiction and truth be told it would be YA fiction if normie youth were into westerns and occasional use of the N word and weren’t turned off by two paragraph long descriptions of a prairie with zero punctuation. You sound like the worlds biggest midwit putting a very middling writer so high on a pedestal he was only considered the worlds greatest living writer because contemporary writers set the bar so low, and I say that as someone who genuinely loved McCarthy. If it weren’t for The Old Man and the Sea existing I would take McCarthy over Hemingway but it blows the fuck out of anything McCarthy’s done in a much shorter story so he doesn’t even get the nod there. Any real writer will tell you themself that poetry > short stories > novels > books in that order and they only choose to write what they write because they’re hacks who couldn’t into poetry or short stories

>>22421461
A friend and I came to this realization when we read it years ago.

>>22424487
>a bit of Absalom bullshit
kek so that's what filtered you? LMAO

>>22421461
Oh please this is literally the exact same kinda shit that would be a thread-opener on /lit/

>>22424710
>Love McCarthy read everything of his. He isn’t half as good as Faulkner. McCarthy is just a step above YA fiction and truth be told it would be YA fiction if normie youth were into westerns and occasional use of the N word and weren’t turned off by two paragraph long descriptions of a prairie with zero punctuation.
The butthurt Cuckner fag begins with a false statement and then goes on shitting up with retarded false statements.

>>22424710
Look the butthurt retard lost his marbles. If McCarthy is YA than trashner and troonmingway are children's lit for retarded children. Stop being so emotionally invested in garbage pike Faulkner. Your butthurt is leaking everywhere.

Are there bigger insecure posters than Cuckner fags? Everytime McCarthy or Joyce get mentioned on /lit/ they come running trying to convince people that their hillbilly soap opera garbage, which isn't even literature, is even comparable to those two. This nigger got so buttblasted he thinks McCarthy is YA lol. All because Cuckner can't write for shit and smart people already realized this. This nigger also thinks anybody believes he has read anything of McCarthy.

>>22422180
Do you enjoy dril's tweets as well?

>>22424710
>Cuckner cuck got so butthurt he is trying to completely turn around history
Absolutely embarrassing. McCarthy is infinitely better than Hemingway. Hemingway is another writer who didn't even know how to write. Wrote like an 8th grader abd only 8th graders worship hin because they can't read anything else. Child of God is an example of Sparse prose written by an actually talented writer. Garbage like Old man and the sea is for 19th century idiots still caught up in mond numbingly simple allegories. It makes sense some retard who is putting these infantile mediocrities on a pedestal is as insecure as them. Lmao at that opinion of McCarthy. Imagine trying to convince people of this. It's possible that you are already ashamed of what you wrote out of immense butthurt. If you have read even one McCarthy and hold this opinion then it's time to try something else. Books are not for you.

>>22422048
I see this sort of thing a lot but specifically they will relate what they're seeing to what they've seen recently. Which ends up being a way of referencing trending popular culture and relating it to another thing. I wonder if they're just trying to talk about something they're enjoying in a social sense with others, and assume that's the easiest most accessible path, the natural way. Or they're goldfish.

>>22421571
McCarthy fans are retards and so are you.
No "cultural heroic tale" that I know of is above Proust, Stendhal, or Goethe, unless by "tale" you mean something like the Iliad.

>>22425984
>proust
Not literature

>>22421480
Is it true that Judge was originally named

Juan Reyes at his baptism ?>>22422041
>>22422131
>>22422269
>>22424840

>>22421461
It's an accurate observation - he will remind anyone familiar with cringy anime of cringy anime. Consider these choice quotes:
>The man who believes that the secrets of the world are forever hidden lives in mystery and fear. Superstition will drag him down.
*lowers fedora*
>There is no God and we are his prophets.
*unsheathes katana*
>It makes no difference what men think of war. War endures. War was always here. Before man was, war waited for him. The ultimate trade awaiting its ultimate practitioner.
*teleports behind you*
>Whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent.
*exhales sharply*
>Men of God and men of war have strange affinities.
*slices you in two with a single stroke*
>This is the nature of war, whose stake is at once the game and the authority and the justification. Seen so, war is the truest form of divination. It is the testing of one's will and the will of another within that larger will which because it binds them is therefore forced to select. War is the ultimate game because war is at last a forcing of the unity of existence.War is god.
*leaves a single rose on your corpse*
>Nothing personel, The Kid

>>22421515
Tone it down a bit, this is too obvious.

>>22426760
>still butthurt after months
Hope you have atleast tried reading the book you hate so much, retard.

>>22426868
Of course I read it, it is mediocre thesaurus-humping worshipped by undergrads who've read less than 60 books in their entire lives.

>>22426890
We believe you like you proved in the last thread. Lol. Back to mental asylum.

>>22426899
No idea what you're talking about retard, haven't posted the pasta or been here since april or so

>>22426913
You are the mentally ill butthurt retard from the UK.

>>22426890
60 books in a lifetime is too much
That's just consuming ?

>>22426913
Aren't you the assblasted retard who pretended to have read Hobbes' Leviathan and then completely embarrassed himself when discussing it? I don't know why but not a single well read person has been in the ranks among the McCarthy-hate troon brigade on here.

>>22426919
Næh, jeg er dansker, din overdådige spasser der trækker vejret med munden.

>>22426945
Stop posting in apespeak. Oh wait that's all you know lol.

>>22426913
So where have you been ?

Get anything meaningful accomplished during
your absence, some kind of sabbatical ?

You think you can simply pop in and out of /lit/
as you please?

Think yourself to be the prodigal son of /lit/?
Expecting a fine robe and a roasted meat feast?

>>22426940
I've no idea what the fuck you are talking about. Are you in every McCarthy thread getting angry that people think he sucks?

>>22426957
Travelled Europe. Visited friends throughout central Europe, in Prague and Vienna, then moved on to Italy, staying for a month, visiting Venice, Florence and Rome.

And no, I was really hoping that I would leave this place for longer this time, but I start my full-ride and handsomely-stipended doctoral studies in just a few days, and am hoping very much that that'll keep me away. Only back because I'm bedridden with the flu, and let me tell you, this place is just as unpleassant and poisonous as it has always been.

>>22426961
Why are you in every McCarthy thread when you don't even like him? Why are any of you troons in his thread when you prove time and time again that you don't even know the first thing about the book themselves. A bad attempt at cribbling a dumb opinion after plagiarizing all the effortposts. Don't even have the intelligence to work a facade well.

I think I hit the nail on the head as far as your identity is concerned.

>>22426974
What are you going to study ?

Get well, Fren

>>22426974
Massive insecurity vibes from this post.

>>22422169
Who said anything about muh natives?
But if you find the Judge convincing, if you think his nonsense is an accurate analysis of life or conflict, that he's telling some truths the libs can't handle, you've also misread the book

>>22426974
You are the poison yourself.
>>22426992
Hope he dies.

>>22426978
Judge's Parents are,
Manuelita and Diego Fragua?

>>22426978
>Why are you in every McCarthy thread when you don't even like him?
I post the pasta, I get the delicious (You)s, simple enough. Sometimes a simple "ctrl+c + ctrl+v" can actually cause some guy on the other side of the world to completely lose his shit and nearly have a stroke - case in point -, and I find this immensely enjoyable. Makes me feel powerful, makes me realize the pen is indeed mightier than the sword - and in the best of cases, it has a pedagogical effect as well, and becomes a teachable moment.

>Why are any of you troons in his thread when you prove time and time again that you don't even know the first thing about the book themselves.
Mediocre thesaurus-humping is a very apt characterization of his work, as is the characterization of Holden as a cringy anime villain. I have read it. I see no reason to lie about this. It was not the worst thing I have ever read: as I said, mediocre.
>A bad attempt at cribbling a dumb opinion after plagiarizing all the effortposts
Uh, what?
>Don't even have the intelligence to work a facade well.
Don't need to, my goal is actually accomplished even better if I'm stupid about it.
>I think I hit the nail on the head as far as your identity is concerned.
Good for you. Must give a sense of meaningfulness and continuity to wilfully spending your life getting irate at shitposts.

>>22427012
>redditspacing
>more ESL trash
>gets kick out of falseflagging on /lit/
>thinks the place is poisonous
>wasting his parents money on """""well stipended"""" doctoral studies while bei g this much of a manchild
I hope the flu kills you lol.
>I have read it.
Like you did Leviathan, we all saw your mental ability then. The fact that you are still mad over a book you likely never read just goes to prove my point.

>>22426992
Philosophy - and thanks man!

>>22426996
Don't know what to tell ya, I had a blast and am looking forward to starting my research.

>>22427005
>You are the poison yourself.
I know. This place fosters a very poisonous attitude and I do embody it after staying for just a little while.
>Hope he dies.
Pretty rude anon, but I'm much better now than I was a few days ago, my fever has mostly broken already.

>>22427026
No. The place is poisonous because of vermin like you.

>>22427024
Can you decide whether I'm the UK guy or ESL trash? Maybe it's time for some meds, or some breathing exercises to calm down?
Not my parents money actually, it's funded half by by a private corporation and half by the university.
I've only read excerpts of Leviathan by the way, but I've no idea why you keep raving about it. What does it have to do with anything?
Try and get your feelings under control, hypertension is unhealthy.

>>22427032
My God you are unpleasant. I quite simply dislike Blood Meridian and consider the Judge to be a cartoonish cardboard character with a lot of cringy opinions. Does this really fill you with such untameable rage?

>>22427026
What are your thoughts on the bar scene, the exchange between Will Hunting ( Matt Damon)
and Clark (Scott Winters), in the movie Good Will Hunting. Specifically about the dollar fifty in late charges paid for an education ?

>>22427041
>Can you decide whether I'm the UK guy or ESL trash?
Different people, illiterate donkey.
You need the meds right now. Not for the flu though. For someone who says he does it because it is low effort you are investing way too much time trying to work this pretense and on a book you don't even like, and honestly didn't even read. I know this is the literature board but atleast I am not the one getting worked up over a writer I don't even like, or am not familiar with. It's not difficult to tell people by the way they write so there's that.
>I've only read excerpts of Leviathan by the way, but I've no idea why you keep raving about it
Now suddenly you have only read excerpts when the manchild was acting all high and mighty last time. Even this calm demeanor about not giving a shit is a pretense lol. I can smell how butthurt you are feeling already for being told off once again. If you were mentally well adjusted, with no dog in the game, you'd have stopped already.

>>22427051
You are raging because people aren't nice on 4chan while being a pretentious teenager about a book you didn't read the last time and surely haven't read since. Lol. Talk about your untameable rage, kid.

>>22424710
Any real writer will tell you themselves...?
SOURCE ?

>>22427026
>((research)) in philosophy while being this dumb and gullibly emotional
The jokes write themselves.

>>22427109
Would it be better to incur late charges on
a library card or pay a pile of money to research
philosophy ?

>>22427146
Philosophy is not done in institutions. It is for people who amounted to nothing. Real philosophy is done in the head. The Teachers are the philosophers themselves. No real person of any worth has come out of any philosophy institution, because they sure as hell aren't becoming any relevant philosophers in the future.

~

>>22427001
>But if you find the Judge convincing, if you think his nonsense is an accurate analysis of life or conflict, that he's telling some truths the libs can't handle, you've also misread the book
He's the villain, we don't want to side with him, but what The Libs ignore is that he's a formidable villain. He's not supposed to be easily dismissed.

In his final speech he talks about "dancing" (art), and how conflict binds people together. The "dance" celebrates victory, and only someone who's given themselves up to something, one of those (false) ideals forced onto reality by the human will, is able to dance. Go back to the beginnings of western literature and you get stuff like The Iliad and Beowulf, obviously exactly what he's talking about, but even before that any ancient art has this association of being of and for a particular group, whatever you say of its meaning it always at least a little bit means "we're the best, our gods are real, look what we can do". And the judge says that people are starting to forget all of this, and "deny the Warrior his rightful place at the dance" (probably not a direct quote but it's something like that).
>"There's no such thing as life without bloodshed," McCarthy says philosophically. "I think the notion that the species can be improved in some way, that everyone could live in harmony, is a really dangerous idea. Those who are afflicted with this notion are the first ones to give up their souls, their freedom. Your desire that it be that way will enslave you and make your life vacuous."

This is all very close to one of Nietzsche's major points, that if we were to truly embrace universalism and abandon the individual will, it would be be an end to art, genius, passion, humanity. We would be the "Last Man". Francis Fukuyama saw this as the most serious objection to liberalism, Mark Fisher took the idea seriously too. So what's the alternative? We could listen to Judge, and go back to butchering each other for the sake of lies that we now know are lies, or else what, what's the answer? It's not easy if you understand the question.

>>22427258
When The Judge said the Dance he meant the aesthetic. Judge sees the vacuity of moral and artificial systems; he also sees the inability to gaze at the absolute.

>>22421461
>anime character
there's so many different kinds of anime that this is hardly descriptive. It's like saying "doesn't he feel like a movie character?"
despite my criticism, I know what he's talking about, even if it doesn't fit the reality of the medium

>>22421475
Reddit and Twitter/X*

>>22422169
>>22422041
If you believe he’s pro-war you haven’t read the novel, or that interview, carefully enough. Just because he believes war will exist forever doesn’t mean he endorses it, he’s saying that it’s an evil aspect of humanity that demonstrates our own failings. If he did believe war was good, he wouldn’t make the “soldiers” in his novel a band of disloyal outlaws.

.

>>22428741
Bumpfagging should be punishable by flogging and cockcages.

½£