/lit/ - Literature

>>22295827
Probably Pynchon

"Right wing" authors are rarely trying to sell you something beyond whatever the current social mores and norms are, and if they are trying to sell you something it is only a past and more traditionalist way of doing something. Due to this mentality there is much less imperative on their part to pepper their texts with political pitches.

>>22295827
the right wing equivalent to the catholic fascist author thomas pynchon? i think you fried your brain by accident

>>22295827
Pomo is inherently a leftist movement

>>22296164
I know 30 postmodern fascist and other right wingers but in nonfiction

>>22295827
OP SUCKS NIGGERS!

Conservatives can't make art

>>22296385
Ever heard of Bach?

>>22296164
It's not a movement and it's not politics

>>22296385
>dante
>joyce
>beethoven
>shakespeare
>milton
>dickey
>mccarthy
>pynchon
>stevens
>cellini
>mishima
>ellis
>conrad
>shaw
on and on and on
who are some leftoid artists...?

>>22295827
Alexander Theroux

>>22296562
Googled him. Is this entire family just famous respected artists. It's kinda crazy.

I'm a little bit worried to type in Shondo's chat in case my oshi is watching. My oshi would find out that I've been subbed to Shondo longer than I've been subbed to her.

>>22296955
sorry wrong please disregard

>>22296495
not one "conservative" in that list

>>22296961
That's true, by today's standards they're beyond conservative and are extremists—which doesn't make a difference to boiled up brains such as yours =^) cope harder

>>22296992
>today’s standards

This is retarded. Someone should be judged by their own time, you know, the time they were living and formulating their beliefs. No great artist is a conservative. They all push the boundaries and use innovation

>>22297018
Woah, you really have no response.

>>22295827
>yanks talk about politics
pynchon is leftie by american standards but centrist or right wing in the context of basically anywhere else in the world

>>22297038
>self proclaimed fascist
>pynchon is a leftie
lol this board rules

>>22296164
LOL you're so wrong and like >>22296473 said, it's not a movement.

>>22297062
>>22296159
Where did he ever claim to be a fascist?

>>22297036
Nice argument

>>22296495
>shakespeare
we know absolutely nothing about Shakespeare's opinions except that he probably liked theatre

>>22297084
>marxist doesn't read
imagine my shock
>marxist is totally unfamiliar with whatever he's babbling about
8^O WOAH WOW
>>22297091
>responding to the mocking of your non argument with 'nice argument'
lol nice

>>22297114
>marxist doesn't read
Huh? I didn't say I'm a Marxist or that I'm even opposed to Pynchon identifying as a fascist. How did you get all that from so little? Anyway, where did he say he's a fascist? I want to know out of curiosity, not so I can write him off goddammit.

>>22297219
He is not fascist, he is the classic small government hippy. His take on fascism in GR and Vineland is scathing.

>>22297305
I would say he seemed just as critical of the British and allies in general as he did of the Nazis/Axis powers in GR, but then again I'm only about 550 pages in. God I don't know if I can finish that book.

>>22296495
James Joyce? Do you have any fucking clue what you're talking about?

>>22295827
Huysmans i guess

>>22297114
>allegations
Nigger, you were challenged on your allegations, follow through.
Pynchon is not a fascist, anticurrent-version-of-capitalism at most.
If you feel otherwise, substantiate your claims, you don't get to use the muh marxism bogeyman here, you're not on pol

>>22297527
THANK you, please help hold this liar accountable for his bizarre, leftfield claims.
Honestly though, he's probably just having a top kek.

>>22297541
I personally would love for Pynchon to be a fascist, since I am one myself, but anyone who read either Gravity's Rainbow or Vineland and thinks he is a fascist is delusional.
Even Crying of Lot takes jabs at fascists, if you manage to get what Yoyoydyne etc are referring to

>>22295827
Pynchon is clearly of the hippie mold. If you don’t realize that you’ve never read him

>>22295827
how are the leftist besides average californian political views in that time

>invade board with hundreds or politics threads, leading to everyone who knew anything leaving
>now spend threads arguing over stuff the old posters liked that you personally don't understand
current lit is hilarious

>>22296955
the fuck

>>22298015
Grim

>>22296385
Conservatives make most of the art, retard. Sorry the first thing that comes to your mind upon hearing the word 'art' is some shitty Kendrick Lamar album

>>22296164
the people that make this claim are often more post modern than any leftist.

>>22298299
That’s bullshit. Bootlickers can’t make art. Maybe they can entertain, but the conservative worldview in 2023 is so thoroughly bankrupt of substance that it’s barely an ideology beyond “lol libs triggered”

>>22295827
Ayn Rand

>>22295827
>basic bitch boomer neoliberal canards peppering text with moralizing platitudes

The opposite will have the same defects Houellebecq probably

>>22296495
>>22297108
Shakespeare would be wearing a MAGA cap if he were alive today.

>>22298299
what art are contemporary conservatives making?
not rejecting the fact that lots of art came from historical conservatives but i don't see a whole lot of art from contemporary conservatives.
closest you can get is maybe cormac mccarthy.
i can only conceive contemporary artistic conservatism as unnoteworthy recreations of prior art periods, rather than making something new and beautiful.

>>22296385
What a stupid fucking comment

Weak thread so far: in Wyndham Lewis, Ezra Pound, Thomas Carlyle (he wrote fiction) are probably closest, then you have Gabriel D Annunzio, GK Chesterton, TS Eliot.

There are more but I don’t want to get too far afield.

Marinetti, Ezra Pound, and Wyndham Lewis were probably the closest we got to seeing modernism/post-modernism with a completely different aesthetic. Look up Italian futurist art and you can see a different path the 20th century may have taken.

>>22295827
https://twitter.com/annakhachiyan/status/1209595838953140224

>>22295827
>>22296385
>Right-wing / fascist / nationalist / traditionalist / conservative:

Dante
Machiavelli
Leopardi
Baudelaire
Dostoevsky
Tolstoy
Stendhal
Manzoni
Flaubert
D'Annunzio
Brasillach
Sorel
De Martino
Papini
Gentile
Spengler
Evola
Guenon
Zolla
Eliade
Ellul
Kerenyi
Frazer
Sorokin
Huizinga
Berdjaev
Anders
Malaparte
Mishima
Lampedusa
Meyrink
Tolkien
Lewis
Poe
Lovecraft
Machen
Beckett
Pirandello
Céline
Roth
Zweig
Yeats
Eliot
Pound
Gadda
Musil
Nabokov
Pessoa
Borges
Buzzati
Jünger
Schmitt
Heidegger
Cioran
Michelstaedter
Gomez Davila
Caraco
Houellebecq
Krasznahorkai
Gaddis
Gass
Ratzinger

>>22295827
We have enough threads whining about muh fictitious left v.s right dichotomy.
Can you fags talk about something else. Anything please other than "is X left or right wing"
It's vacuous and uninteresting. If you wish to discuss the political views of an author or a novel, then just do that instead of endlessly going back and forth whether or not something is left or right. It doesn't matter. Say something, anything substantive I'm begging you.

>>22298849
Tolstoy was an anarchist

>>22298861
Kek, mere label. He never preached any revolution. Read his story "Candle". It was disgustingly pro-christcuck and anti-rebellion.

>>22298849
So we’re calling Stendhal, Dostoyevsky, Dante, and co fascists now? What is with hers politics today and trying to co-opt someone from the past?

>>22298881
Read with open eyes, whore

>Right-wing / fascist / nationalist / traditionalist / conservative:

>>22298881
>hers
*herd

>>22298885
So would /pol/ have supported the Bourbons or the Orleans? Seems retarded to me to correlate modern day politics to the past

>>22298907
>muh /pol/
Kek, you don't get this moaning when leftists shit up threads with retarded shite like this >>22296385

>>22298915
More /pol/tards fucking the board up than leftists. You didn’t answer the question either

>>22298919
>More /pol/tards fucking the board up than leftists
That's utter bullshit. Threads like this prove that both leftists from plebbit and twitter are equally as annoying as /pol/tards.

>>22296495
Joyce wasn't all that right-wing even if he did have some fascist sympathies. Milton DEFINITELY was not a conservative, though, and you're crazy for even thinking so.

>>22298933
Cope harder troon

>>22296495
Nice meltie Hitler is proud

>>22298925
cry harder electionshitter

>>22298015
I wish I could back to the early '10s.

>>22298849
And not a single one of those comes even close to Proust.

How can you read Gravitys Rainbow and come to the conclusion that it's author is somehow a "Catholic fascist"? In what reading of the work does that viewpoint become apparent? It's almost explicitly left wing. Am I being baited?

>>22296468
he was a protestant retard

>>22295827
What a sad existence, forever bogged by the leftwing/rightwing spooks in your head, unable to process text without classifying it according to your preconceived ideologies

>>22295827
It’s hard to find an artist—or writer in this case but they really fall under the umbrella of creative neet—that isn’t left leaning and or even remotely classically liberal.
They, by definition, must look to create something new or be doomed to just follow modern sensibilities and tastes.

>>22300458
>christcuck lutheran
Your point was?

>>22300513
>that isn’t left leaning
Rand? This statement is actually retarded.
>and or even remotely classically liberal.
I'm going to choose to believe you meant exclusive rather than inclusive or in this part of your word salad, so that you can just lump everyone who doesn't fall in group a into group b. Yeah, the vast majority of artists are either a. leftist or b. some flavor of "classical liberalism." Thanks for finding a way to include >99% of the western world's population. Congrats on saying nothing.

>>22296385
I don't know what started this stale meme but I can only imagine it gets parroted under the assumption that it gives lefties legitimacy for their dumbfuck worldview.
>>22298314
This ain't the 60s anymore grandpa, it's lefties that are the militant conformists now.

>>22298841
None of those writers are close to post-modernism, retard

>>22298849
>Beckett
>Zola
>Roth
>Zweig
>Ellul
You’re genuinely retarded and have no read a single work by these writers

>>22300791
Yeah we're upending the establishment with Ben Shapiro and some disgraced Faux news anchor who treats me like a retard

>>22300807
Yeah. Especially Zola. Why would anyone include him on that list?

>>22298314
lol

>>22300815
If you're going to attribute necons to The Right then I'm going to say that The Left claims neolibs. You voted for and actively support Joe Biden and watch MSNBC, now that is embarrassing.

>>22300807
The issue here is what the list maker considers right/left. Roth for example is solidly "right" from a Euroview (Not these retards should be the basis for any intellectual conversation after 1800, ever), certainly not in his own home country, he was just a self-deprecating centrist-left dem-voting Jew.

>>22300815
If people like that are representative of "conservatism" or the "right", then people like Rachel Maddow and Contrapoints are representative of "progressivism" and the "left".

>>22300825
Yeah basically what I was thinking too. Some of these people, when they hear "conservative" or "right wing" they just automatically think "American Republican"

>>22300815
>There is token controlled opposition therefore I'm actually rebellious
you got brainworms bro

>>22300825
I agree the left is shit, though neolib is not left lol you need to stop treating politics like team sports

>>22300855
Yeah you just cry about joos on /pol/

>>22300904
his point went completely over your head. Read the bad faith, ignorant comment that he was responding to and you'll get it.

>>22295827
>book contains weird idiosyncratic views that could be interpreted as leftist in some contexts.
>UH WHY CAN'T I HAVE A VERSION OF THIS BOOK THAT CONFORMS TO MY PRECONCEIVED POLITICAL BIASES.
honestly you shouldn't be seeking out a right wing version of gravity's rainbow. You are too stupid to be reading. There is a whole media industry created to cater to whatever kind of thing you already want before you get it, it's called hollywood.
>>22296495
bro this is fucking embarrassing. You have obviously never read any of these authors or much of anything in general.

>>22300906
lol I'm Jewish myself and I don't go on /pol/. Keep erecting your strawmen so you can keep fighting a fake war though, that only hurts you

>>22300911
Cry harder bootlick

>>22300917
I agree. It really is just more direction brained nonsense. Pynchon is a fascinating and powerful writer despite and because of his politics. I don't necessarily agree with them, but it doesn't really matter.

>>22300919
Keep crying about joos on pol like anybody cares

>>22300923
I'm trying to help you understand something so that you can be a part of the conversation. It seems like you just want to be an irrational, memeposting little man though.

>>22300931
You don't understand dick though

>>22300923
>I endorse proxy wars, unprecedented wealth transfer from lower to upper classes, enriching pharmaceutical corporations via mass rushed vaccination and promotion of dangerous and unnecessary sexual surgeries, importing millions for slave labor, and I believe that anyone that criticizes these ideas ought to be ostracized, censored, jailed, or otherwise punished, either by a mob or the government.
Yeah, you're definitely not a bootlicker.

>>22300928
What exactly do you get out of this? Is this your "praxis" or something? It's very Quixotic. You should waste your time actually dealing with /pol/ posters instead of doing this.

>>22300944
>politics is a team sport upon which I draw my entire identity

just go back to plebbit already

>>22300951
I accept your consneedsion.

>>22300947
I just can't stand you weenies taking your last stand on 4chan and pissing your pants when someone tells you to fuck off

>>22300958
You showed me

>>22300959
Huh, interesting idea

>>22295827
If I was mod everyone who even hinted at modern day politics would get a 30 day ban. Any thread created would need to have 500 characters, pages to reference, quotes, and sources.

If you want to engage in herd politics take it to /pol/

>>22300963
I can smell your tears

>>22300958
I accept your transition

>>22300966
/pol/ isn't even political anymore it's just bbc spam, trump reddit refugees, 40 incel threads a day and porn

>>22300969
And yet, it is you that is crying. Curious!

>>22300980
I'm not the one going out frantically looking for books to affirm my chud beliefs

>>22297321
Is it that hard? I am a hundred pages into V. and loving it, was thinking to myself that GR might not be terrible after this. I get the sense that he is gonna talk about math more in GR and jump between peoples perspectives and time a lot more, the latter of which I can handle.

>>22300987
Except you are.

>>22300988
First 300 pages or so of GR were unbearably sloggy for me, finished the other 600 in about half the time it took me to read the first third

>>22300976
Be the change you want to see

>>22300995
the board moves so fast that even if you make an effortpost it's immediately drowned out by amerimutts posting irrelevant shit but it has a hot woman in the picture in OP, no use trying really

It’s extremely silly to try to gauge a historical person’s perspective on today’s political climate. To say Dante or so-and-so from the Middle Ages would be a chud is just funny. These people are products of their time. Judge them by their eras. Their eras were full of events happening which required a different kind of thinking. As are ours. We will never see eye to eye with ancients fully on things, because we lack communication on things neither of us will experience. We won’t experience what they lived, and they won’t experience what we live through. Don’t try to lump them in with you to give your terrible opinions some foundation. It’s also silly to think “He said the word nigger in 1839, so he’s just like me!” Odds are whoever you’re talking about is nothing like you and would form different opinions about politics.

Also, most people alive before say 1900 would absolutely be 100% hateful and confused towards the modern world, regardless of political affiliation. This doesn’t make them a chud or conservative, because both those two groups contribute heavily to how shitty our modern world is.

The truth is there are really no great conservative authors nowadays. It’s not to say they lack creativity. It’s just that they haven’t learned to co-exist with our era, so they will never flourish in our era.

>>22300991
no I like GR as it is

>>22300969
Interesting take, I'd like to know more!

>>22301002
Similar to /lit/

>>22295827
you can't have a right wing pynchon because he's a funny writer

>>22301019
Not even close, yeah there's a lot of shit spam here but the amount of threads made per day is nowhere near as close

>>22300938
>you aren't a faggot, therefore you may not engage
Just because most professors are closeted fags doesn't mean we all have to be

>>22301023
Although right people are funny just look at Jeff Dunham or Greg Gutfeld!

>>22300988
V. is a much lighter read, but GR isn't nearly as difficult as it's made out to be, either.

>>22301028
Take your closet faggotry to pol where it belongs

>>22300988
It's hard for me because I just don't have the attention span for one, the other thing is yes there is a lot of technical, scientific jargon that is freely interspersed throughout the text, and yes there are so many characters and weird little asides and the writing is so psychedelic sometimes it's hard to follow. Also, the book just affects me deeply because of the paranoid, conspiratorial themes and the existential questions, I can't read too much at a time anymore or it makes me feel anxious and almost panicky sometimes. The tone gets very cynical and black at times, and I have a hard time stomaching it. I have too much going on my life for that shit right now. If that sounds like it's up your alley though, definitely go for it. But yeah, it's a challenging book in more ways than one.

>>22301002
>amerimutts
Fuck off back to r*ddit eurofag, no one cares about your constant need for attention. Your continent has only been internationally relevant at any point in the last three centuries when one of your dictators decides its time to take up the European mantle of Chief Genocider and off a couple million civilians.

>>22301036
Make me.

>>22301048
I'll just keep laughing at your

>>22298849
Nabokov?

>>22301046
ooooo we bagged a live one
now kneel, boy

>>22301027
/lit/ is a smaller, slower community so when the board is swamped by political threads, book about why women are the way they are, was he based threads, and all the bait threads, legitimate threads die quickly. Very few threads survive longer than a day. It also compounds the problem because many anons have been driven away

>>22301031
Greg Gutfeld single handedly carries an entire network. I unironically watch the five a couple times a week just for his antics.

>>22301063
And then? Is that all you got?

>>22301079
Looks like it's working :)

>>22301074
>my daughter is being brutally raped by an Iraqi
>my nephew's name is Mohamed

>>22298015
>Waahhhh new /lit/ everyone's just fighting
>Doesn't participate
Pynchon's novels were looking at themes critical of authoritarianism, power structures, and oppressive systems. Many of his works exhibit a strong sense of anti-establishment sentiment. These outlooks were commonly held by writers in the middle of the 20th century, who seemingly were able to think through a variety of political lenses. An issue I have with the current year is that people, such as OP, want to shoehorn everything into a left right dichotomy but it is fun to look at an authors works without mincing political relevance. Anyone past college age should be able to discuss culture with their friends without it being a political argument, which makes me agree with you the board is full of young people. Anyway,
>Gravity's Rainbow: Does not promote fascist ideals. Explores human nature, technology, and the consequences of war. Critical and often satirical portrayal of various political and ideological systems, including fascism and socialism in the same vein as Vonnegut
>V.: Anti-authoritarian stance, as it critiques the oppressive nature of bureaucracy and the hollow pursuits of modern life.
However, Pynchon identifies modern life as structured around a pseudo cabal bloat which is literally represented by the journeys or investigations of various characters. He is critical of this bloat, an example of this being when in Bleeding Edge a patrol boat is eluded by Maxine who finds herself at a landfill. Observations are made at this time about the way the landfill connects to the structure of New York City. Now, Pynchon includes religious elements in his novels that can go against the "Pynchon's a leftist" argument, as he praises traditionalism.
>Gravity's Rainbow: Byron the Bulb, a lightbulb with a divine glow that seems to possess miraculous properties. Byron's light is described as "imago Dei," meaning "image of God," a reference to the Christian belief that humans are made in the image of God. The presence of Byron's divine light raises questions about the nature of divinity, technology, and the relationship between the sacred and the profane.
>V.: Stencil's quest to find V. mirrors a religious pilgrimage, with elements of spiritual seeking and revelation. The novel also draws on other Christian concepts to add depth to its narrative.
>The Crying of Lot 49: The religious painting "The Courier's Tragedy," depicting a scene of betrayal and violence reminiscent of religious martyrdom. It serves as a recurring motif throughout the story, symbolizing themes of mystery, hidden truths, and the search for meaning
TL;DR: The point of postmodern is to structure the fairy tale in a new way because it was being overdone. The only issue is all the self serving references in them. These are stories, not political treatises. You and left wing university professors that treat them as such are in the wrong. Just read it and enjoy.

>>22298314
>Bootlickers
>uses “bootlickers” in the now 175-year-old sense of the term and used by countless authoritarian leftists during and after their blatant power grabs in suppressing any and all dissent against themselves and their movement and anon does so with extraordinary willingness to make himself look cool on a Cambodian basket weaving image board
Shut the fuck up you fucking bootlicker.

>>22301104
>London is full of muslims, you can tell by visiting Paris or something

>>22298669
>but i don't see a whole lot of art from contemporary conservatives.
Oh wow look we have a real genius on our hands…golly gee I wonder why he doesn’t see a whole lot of contemporary conservatives making art? where could they possibly be? I’m sure his next question to his own mind will be, “boy that kinda doesn’t make sense that I don’t see any? I wonder why that is? Maybe I should look into that…”

>>22301101
Are you sure? I'm still here, and I'm gonna be in other threads, too.

>>22300938
Not the guy you are arguing with but I would put my house on you not being old enough to drink

>>22301110
>The point of postmodern is to structure the fairy tale in a new way because it was being overdone
this is just blatantly incorrect

>>22301128
Yeah I'm still laughing at you

>>22301133
>he doesn't follow the cool kids on pol like me so he must be a dork!!

>>22301110
Great effortpost. I've always thought that people who try to "claim" the Pynch for their pet political cause are either willfully retarded or just very, very bad readers. I can't imagine reading TCoL49 or the strand wolf scene in V. or the Chums chapters in AtD or countless other scenes and come to the conclusion that Pynchon's motifs and themes can fit in any kind of rigid political critique or material analysis.
Personally I've always had him cozied up to PKD as far as what the "point" is: how technology and Mass Life scrambles the mystical, leaving one's mind a broken mess of paranoia, gasping for something more.

>>22301002
Ah yes Americans make no good posts, as opposed to the Yurpoors who do nothing but make posts like this
And post images like this>>22301113

Please go back to /int/

>>22301159
How about we make a game of it? You try to figure out which posts in other threads are mine, and you tell me to go back to /pol/. I still wont go back, but I think it'd be fun. I'll give you a hint, I've posted in five other threads today that are still active in the catalogue.

>>22301169
No ill just laugh at you

>>22301170
I'm on the bus

Holy shit, none of you in this thread know anything at all about Pynchon. It’s like you haven’t even read his personal letters to his sister.

>>22301158
You should check out the book "Morphology of the Folktale by Vladimir Propp. He basically went in depth about the way fairy tales are set up with certain plot points and characters that he referred to as "dramatis personae". He was a Structuralist, which is a movement that included people such as Foucalt who you may have heard about in the time you spend on this board disagreeing with people without providing an argument. This movement sought/seeks to frame what makes up (a narrative/culture/society). Fairy tales and postmodern literature share common narrative functions or roles that characters fulfill within the story. Just as our Propp identified a finite set of functions in folktales, postmodern narratives highlight the enduring nature of certain narrative elements. These had in fact been overdone, which is why these works stretched into the bizarre. However, Postmodern works contain archetypal characters that represent universal human traits and motivations. These characters transcend specific cultural contexts. Sound familiar? Fairy tales and postmodern literature might feature differing themes, the underlying structural elements that give rise to these symbols and themes could be seen as part of the same human storytelling impulse. I also want to draw attention to the intertextual nature of postmodern literature, where authors borrow and reference earlier works, including folktales, to create new narratives. They build upon the cultural reservoir of folktales and rework them in innovative ways, showcasing how the folktale tradition continues to influence storytelling. The fragmented and remixing nature of postmodern narratives, which mirror the way folktales have evolved and changed over time, also should be mentioned. Just as folktales have been reshaped by various cultures and storytellers, postmodern literature may be seen as an extension of this tradition, literally reflecting complexities of the current years.

>>22301264
I also want to add that I find these references quite self serving and they are just meant to make the reader think they are intellectual. I never said I liked postmodern novels more than any other works, just making an argument here

>>22300966
So you want this board to have 3 posters lol

>>22301121
are you alluding to the idea that conservatives are oppressed by MSM and the art world?
even so, there should be some counter movement lead by conservatives who value traditional beauty standards.
with all the boycotting of wokeshit, theres tons of conservative counterculture brands that get recognition even from liberals.
i haven't seen that with art, only non-artist conservatives complaining about contemporary art without putting forth any art of their own.
with all the conservative pearl clutching about traditional beauty, you'd think there would be some kind of conservative art thinktank thats pushing for the revival of romanticism.
memeing aside, can you seriously name any contemporary conservative artists? i don't think most people could without googling.

>>22301121
>>22301335
even with googling, i couldn't find any conservative movements. only individual artists who do political art.
if conservative artists do exist and are simply oppressed, where are they?
you can find a million niche subgenres of contemporary art, yet the closest to any kind of "preservation of conservative beauty" is contemporary realism.
the most i could find is a website called "imaginative conservative" that has any ties to conservatives, meanwhile most contemporary art has an assumedly at least milquetoast liberal slant.

>>22301264
nope
try again and this time reference a theory of literature that came about after postmodernism started instead of someone else talking an entirely different thing

>>22301335
These counter movements do exist, but they're all grassroots garage operations, no thinktanks. Boomer conservatives or fags like Thiel are too dumb to invest in the arts, so instead you've got small groups doing their own thing.
For lit, off the top of my head there's Arktos, Antelope Hill, Counter Currents, Underworld Amusements, Passage Publishing, Nine Banded Books. Granted, much of these are republishing older works, but they've started to get new content published too.

>>22301397
something like the Passage Prize definitely counts, I think.
https://passage.press/passage-prize/
It's a book of all the winning submissions in a poetry, visual art, and fiction contest held by Curtis Yarvin and others. Also, I would argue Million Dollar Extreme's Adult Swim show World Peace qualifies as art even though it's a satirical, absurdist comedy show.

>>22301401
I am too lazy to reply to your phoneposts so I'm drawing off Wikipedia. While I'm doing this, could you tell me what exactly you are arguing?:
Structuralism in Europe developed in the early 20th century, mainly in France and the Russian Empire, in the structural linguistics of Ferdinand de Saussure and the subsequent Prague,[3] Moscow,[3] and Copenhagen schools of linguistics. As an intellectual movement, structuralism became the heir to existentialism.[4] After World War II, an array of scholars in the humanities borrowed Saussure's concepts for use in their respective fields. French anthropologist Claude Lévi-Strauss was arguably the first such scholar, sparking a widespread interest in structuralism.[2]

Now, here's a sample argument you could use if you want to continue this. Also from wikipedia:
First described in ancient times by Greek philosophers (such as Aristotle and Plato), the notion of narrative structure saw renewed popularity as a critical concept in the mid-to-late-20th century, when structuralist literary theorists including Roland Barthes, Vladimir Propp, Joseph Campbell, and Northrop Frye attempted to argue that all human narratives have certain universal, deep structural elements in common. This argument fell out of fashion when advocates of poststructuralism such as Michel Foucault and Jacques Derrida asserted that such universally shared, deep structures were logically impossible.

>>22301445
>>22301401
You could say Beckett or Burroughs came out with the first postmodern novel in the second half of the aforementioned 20th century

>>22301417
>>22301427
thanks for the actual answers. i'd hope there would be more visual art, but it does seem like the political right at least makes a substantial amount of lit and philosophy.
sam hyde and moldbug are probably the most 'notable artists' but even neocons would probably have some hangups with them.
i guess it's a weird balancing act of being transgressive while also arguing for some kind of niche right-wing ideology.
there should be more neocon visual media foundations, theres enough ugliness in contemporary art for there to be a more substantial "traditional beauty" revival.

>>22301455

>>22301417
Just got my most recent Antelope Hill purchase in the mail today.
Everyone on 4chan should read The Transgender Industrial Complex, it's mostly confirming my biases but I imagine for someone who just laughs at trannies, it might make them realize something a bit deeper. That it's a symptom, and not the disease.

>>22301476
hitomi would be a conservative
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bI9hgp32-f0

>>22301455
That's assuming that neocons are into traditional (natural is a better word for it imo) beauty.
They are just as anti-nature as neolibs are, same as radlibs and modern """conservatives"""
I would like to tell you that the whole "left vs right" dichotomy is very antiquated. Useless in the postmodern age. Not trying to deride you, it's just that I myself got caught in that trap and it really caused me to have ideological arrested development

>>22301501
no i know its 100% bullshit but i am moreso referring to laymen cultural neolibs and neocons that get all their opinions from cable news.
even if they are ideologically garbage, there is a definite culture that has superseded any kind of ideology.
neocons would definitely appreciate natural beauty over contemporary ideas of beauty, i just think they don't produce many artists. might be related to how neocons consider humanities to be frivolous and concede art in general to neolibs.

>>22301501
>That's assuming that neocons are into traditional (natural is a better word for it imo) beauty.
Yeah I agree, neocons' idea of conservatism seems to be "export American pop culture and, evangelicalism, and political process", or at least that's what it looks like without reading any neocon thinkers or anything. I'm conservative on things (relative to 2023 standards) like sex, race, some financial questions, and I feel I share very little with a Bush or a Reagan. The idea that conservative or even traditionalist=Republican is absolutely absurd.

>>22301494
Ya no shit

>>22301162
Just saw this, thank you for an insightful reply. It's impossible to draw political opinion out of Dick either and his fiction was great

>>22301521
Thank God you have bought out of the current paradigm.
Would you really classify Fox News viewers as functional neocons? I usually tend to classify them as """conservatives""" (read as conservatives who conserve nothing). I think most of them are people that mean well, but are guided by the neocons like a shepard guides lambs to slaughter.
As far as expecting beautiful art to be produced, I am sure that it is being produced, but is any amplification of it? I don't see it.
I am not really interested in visual arts at the moment (probably due to the degradation of the last eighty years to be honest) so I don't see it.
I think that the """far-right""" has a lot of artists, and we are just in the beginning stages of that realization.
Genuinely interested in your response anon

>>22301526
The Republican party is in no way conservative. At it's core is a fundamental rejection and hatred of the American people. Slavery to capital is not conservative, capitalism is the most destructive force on Earth in regards to tradition.
I find it funny that """conservatives""" shittalk Marxism as much as they do. At least Marxist/post-Marxist countries are not dealing with the destruction of the core community (i.e. family, church, etc.) or partaking in the replacement of the native populations.
What are they conserving?

>>22301572
i do like your differentiation of republican and conservative.
sadly its not really pragmatic because most other people are going to assume the colloquial if you were to mention conservative or liberal.
in an ideal world, modern republicans and democrats would have no colloquial attachment to conservatism or liberalism.
i guess its why terms like "classical liberal" exist.
something else to consider is that culture has moved away from art and onto consumerism.
there is no conservative art, only conservative brands (even if conservative art technically exists).
conservatives conserve nothing, liberals liberate nothing.
republicans don't give a shit about the environment, even ignoring climate change.
they'd probably call public parks socialist tax sinks.
'far-right' and 'far-left' are the only interesting art producers because they are the only ones with anything interesting to say. contemporary art focuses more on transgressiveness rather than beauty.

How can you read Vineland or Inherent Vice (let alone GR or M&D) and take away that he supported fascism (or even "conservativism" or traditionalism) in any form lol.

All of his works emphasize his (meticulous) observations that the world is too eclectic to be controlled by any central metanarrative, let alone a "traditional" one. Love ya Tommy Pinecone.

>>22301455
>i'd hope there would be more visual art
There is some, but it's harder to categorize visual art the same way as you would any kind of art that gets featured at the MoMA, for example. Upper echelon connections and all that. I know there's Graman, Gio Penn, and Miles Mathis, as well as someone that sculpts vorticist-adjacent busts, though his name's escaping me atm.
>theres enough ugliness in contemporary art for there to be a more substantial "traditional beauty" revival
I don't think that would really be able to take hold. The world's in such a weird and distorted place that any movement going for baroque or raphaelite would just be kitsch. I think that whatever Vorticism, Futurism, Suprematism -would- have become/evolved into before being squashed would be a more compelling movement.

>>22301594
>i do like your differentiation of republican and conservative.
Thanks man
>sadly its not really pragmatic because most other people are going to assume the colloquial if you were to mention conservative or liberal.
>in an ideal world, modern republicans and democrats would have no colloquial attachment to conservatism or liberalism.
>i guess its why terms like "classical liberal" exist.
For me, posting anonymously on 4chan is an escape from pragmatism. I wholeheartedly agree with your view of what's happening on the ground, so to speak. But nothing moves forward mired in pragmatism. I think this is, for better or worse, why 4chan is as popular as it is. We have found a part of the void that we can scream unto and not be met (just by) derision.
And classical liberalism is really just libertarianism without the fedora
>something else to consider is that culture has moved away from art and onto consumerism.
>there is no conservative art, only conservative brands (even if conservative art technically exists).
I agree. Capital has captured the fundamental expression of ideas and emotion. Very fucking evil, if you ask me.
As far as conservative=traditional, I'd say we may be on the cusp of a renaissance of traditional/natural art. But we must break through post-modernist irony to get to that imo. And the only way out is through.
>conservatives conserve nothing, liberals liberate nothing.
Being tuned into the white nationalist media sphere, I have heard the former, but hadn't heard or put words to the latter. Fuck if it isn't poignant. Thank you for that
>republicans don't give a shit about the environment, even ignoring climate change.
>they'd probably call public parks socialist tax sinks.
Don't get me started on the right's/conservative's disregard for the environment. Complete stupidity.
>>OH BOY LET'S FUCK UP THE RURAL AREAS WE WANT EVERYONE TO MOVE TO
>>THIS IS TOTALLY COHERENT!
I fucking hate that shit. I grew up in the woods, and I want them to be as pristine as they can be.
>'far-right' and 'far-left' are the only interesting art producers because they are the only ones with anything interesting to say. contemporary art focuses more on transgressiveness rather than beauty.
I would differentiate the two. Far-right art is transgressive to the current system, but progressive in terms of historical progression.
Current """far-left art""" (I would personally classify myself as being far-left, but within societal context I am effectively far-right) is harmonious with the status quo, but transgressive in the long run.
I pray it is a temporary status

>>22296385
Right wingers are too busy trying to retvrn to make art

>>22301680
Excellent analysis. Clear eyed and nuanced. Very refreshing to see this kind of mature socio-political discussion on here. I think we've all had these kind of thoughts, these kinds of observations, but you just put them to good word. Trust your gut and keep on the path, you sound smart.

>>22301999
Thank you anon. I appreciate you
All I want is for our people to stop what is happening to us. But, barring that, I'd like to have others that are like me to be happy in the hellscape that we seem to be stuck in.
Thank you again

>>22302074
>All I want is for our people to stop what is happening to us. But, barring that, I'd like to have others that are like me to be happy in the hellscape that we seem to be stuck in.

I hear you, and I want that too, my friend, but I have a kind of "these historical trends have to take their course" kind of perspective on the whole thing. It's not that I think it's IMPOSSIBLE to turn back from where we are or push forward into the "next era", but I think it must take absolutely monumental effort on the part of a few very dedicated individuals who can amass followers and social capital by whatever means. I certainly don't feel I'm strong or intelligent enough to be one of those monumental persons, but maybe the cream will rise somewhere.

Personally, I'm trying to come to terms with the idea that things are, for the most part, on the downturn for the duration of our lives, and to accept that that happiness you mentioned is getting further away. I'm trying to accept a kind of cautious optimism that our future generations will pick up the pieces and carry the fire. OUR job is to leave them enough to do that, not to pursue happiness for happiness' sake, although if we find it in the midst of our duties then that is a beautiful thing that should be celebrated.

I think living in the shadow of the boomers' philosophy of living has given us the idea that the way they lived is 1) worth striving for, and 2) still possible; I think neither are true. Pursuing individual gratification and happiness is not feasible for us like it might have been for the boomers, I think we have to temper that and bring back the idea of long-term, multi-generational thinking, bring back uplifting the people, not giving them what they want. I believe that, unfortunately, we are bounded by our possibilities-our historical horizons, both materially and politically, so we are in a tough spot that demands hard work, rationality, and a spirit of community.

The last thing I want to add to these mad ravings is that if we want to go forward in history it is useful to follow the Akan idea of "Sankofa" and mine the past for good and useful ideas and things that could help us in the present (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sankofa).). I think Hegel (not that I've read him) has a very similar perspective to this, that historical "progress" is not a straight line, but sometimes actually goes backwards as time goes on, and in order to move forwards you have to "retrieve" things from the past that maybe were given up on too soon or were just not useful in that specific historical horizon. Anyway, thanks for reading if you read this, and please try to look beyond the narrow corridor of your own lifetime, I know it's difficult and it's counterintuitive, but I think that it's necessary in times like these, and it can even be strangely therapeutic because it forces you to see that the world does not end or begin with you.

>>22295827
Big retards itt

>>22296495
>>22298620
Terrible bait

>>22302139
>I hear you, and I want that too, my friend, but I have a kind of "these historical trends have to take their course" kind of perspective on the whole thing. It's not that I think it's IMPOSSIBLE to turn back from where we are or push forward into the "next era", but I think it must take absolutely monumental effort on the part of a few very dedicated individuals who can amass followers and social capital by whatever means. I certainly don't feel I'm strong or intelligent enough to be one of those monumental persons, but maybe the cream will rise somewhere.
>Personally, I'm trying to come to terms with the idea that things are, for the most part, on the downturn for the duration of our lives, and to accept that that happiness you mentioned is getting further away. I'm trying to accept a kind of cautious optimism that our future generations will pick up the pieces and carry the fire. OUR job is to leave them enough to do that, not to pursue happiness for happiness' sake, although if we find it in the midst of our duties then that is a beautiful thing that should be celebrated.
Me and you are on a very similar wavelength. Suffice it to say
>I think living in the shadow of the boomers' philosophy of living has given us the idea that the way they lived is 1) worth striving for, and 2) still possible; I think neither are true. Pursuing individual gratification and happiness is not feasible for us like it might have been for the boomers, I think we have to temper that and bring back the idea of long-term, multi-generational thinking, bring back uplifting the people, not giving them what they want.
I believe that is a huge problem for us: we (as Europeans, whether we are in Europe or not) have thrown away our long-term agency. Why we have done so, I have my theories, but what matters is that we did and have done so.
>I believe that, unfortunately, we are bounded by our possibilities-our historical horizons, both materially and politically, so we are in a tough spot that demands hard work, rationality, and a spirit of community.
And that lack of community, which I attribute to capital and those who control it (I'm post-Marxist, so don't think that I think that there's a 150 year old theory that explains everything!)
>"Sankofa"
I will look into it. Might illuminate some things.
>Hegel
Yeah, who's read Hegel, really? kek
>Anyway, thanks for reading if you read this, and please try to look beyond the narrow corridor of your own lifetime, I know it's difficult and it's counterintuitive, but I think that it's necessary in times like these, and it can even be strangely therapeutic because it forces you to see that the world does not end or begin with you.
Thank you anon.

>>22302145
I crown you the biggest retard of all of us. Congratulations

>>22296385
What do you even want to see in conservative art? People are calling things that are non-woke (no queer stuff or race bait) but politically 2012 things "conservative."

GRRM or Frank milar

>>22300057
Firstly, nobody seriously believes this. Secondly, Proust and basically every liberal/dreyfusard liberal of his era would be considered a right-wing colonialist and a racist today. Thirdly, if you actually had any literary awareness you would know that In Search of Lost Time is one of the most poignant attacks on the homosexual lifestyle ever written, made even more impactful by the fact that it's author was a sodomite.

>>22298849
>>Right-wing / fascist / nationalist / traditionalist / conservative
>including all of those under "conservative"
holy shit

>>22302175
Do you have a discord or anything I can connect with you on? You seem like a kindred spirit, and I don't want to just let this opportunity disappear back into the schizophrenic ether of interdigital space

>>22301572
>Marxist/post-Marxist countries are not dealing with the destruction of the core community (i.e. family, church, etc.) or partaking in the replacement of the native populations.
The cold war is over there aren't really Marxist countries.
In any case I find it funny that you say Marxist countries don't destroy traditional communities (the family or church), as that was exactly what the USSR did dismantling and using state power to suppress religion.

>>22301526
Interesting painting who is the artist?

>>22295827
I love the guy, but anyone coping that Pynchon is secretly right wing needs to read Bleeding Edge

>>22302583
I mean he ain't left wing either

>>22302587
True but I’d say he leans more left than right. Maybe just because he’s a pot smoking hippie

>>22301076
He's painfully unfunny.

>>22295827
Daily /lit/ reminder that Thomas Pynchon literally said that he was so fucked up writing this book that even he doesn't understand a lot of the sentences that are in there and yet hipster after hipster after hipster will make this book their entire personality in the hopes that one random lonely manic pixie dreamgirl they meet will want to kiss their peepee because they've memorized some autistic critique of it from some no name fucking professor at pomono in the 1970's. I mean jesus fucking christ, anons. Grow up.

Remember that.

>>22302784
>n the hopes that one random lonely manic pixie dreamgirl they meet will want to kiss their peepee
I mean, she ought to.

>>22302587
He's left wing alright, he just doesn't fall into the trap of bipartisanship.

>>22295827
>YOU MUST PICK TEAM A OR TEAM B!!!

>>22302784
It's a fun book, you should try it

>>22302784
>Thomas Pynchon literally said that he was so fucked up writing this book that even he doesn't understand a lot of the sentences that are in there
(not true, by the way)

>>22295827
Dugin

>>22303414
>dugin
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA kys

>>22296495
>>22298849
Morons

>>22296385
The left can't meme

>>22295827
Orlando Furioso
Carlo Emilio Gadda
Tres Tristes Tigres

>>22296495
>>22298849
can't figure out why you expel La Rochelle and Merezhkovsky on the rightwing list.

>>22303613
but it's he wrong, though?

>>22302598
Sounds like you are painfully unfunny, or your judgement is just clouded by your stupid partisan politics.

>>22303878
Now that's comedy

i remember the board before /leftypol/ election tourists came to shit it up
unfortunate what happened

>>22303896
No but i remember when a bunch of butthurt alt right faggots immigrated and started throwing a conniption fits at anything left of Hitler

>>22303939
this so much this
i remember when we would the marxist theory and sing kumbaya before the hecking chuds came to our little paradise known as 4chan

>>22303953
Trump lost.

>>22302580
Sorry, I was sleeping. I don't know man, I just have it saved on my PC. Wish I could tell you.

>>22304038
as i said election tourist

>>22303871
naturally, Vatnig vatnigovici

>>22302580
google says Dino Buzzati

>>22304038
Yeah, because of fraud.

>>22302784
>i am reading gravity's rainbow to get pussy
nigga are you crazy? where the GR pussy?

>>22303725
>classic old thing
>must be right wing
>carlo gadda
>heavily critical of fascism
>tres tristes tigres, endorsed by castro and supported tehe cuban revolution
tell me you just read a piece of a wikipedia article without reading the book.

>>22295827
Right wing or conservative authors are more focused on philosophy. I would say look into philosophy and you are bound to hit a author is a chud(Nietzsche).

>>22296495
>>22298849
Pretty good list. I don't understand why people are saying none of the authors listed are right wing, I mean the list has Lovecraft and Evola on the list lmao

>>22295827
Right wing or conservative authors are more focused on philosophy. I would say if you dabble in philosophy you are bound to hit a chud-like author(Nietzsche).

>>22296495
>>22298849
Pretty good list. I don't understand why people are saying none of the authors listed are right wing, I mean the list has Lovecraft and Evola on the list lmao

>>22296955
I completely agree

>>22304621
Nietzsche is not "right wing", stop being a direction brain simpleton
same with Evola. he is not "right wing"
the list is also terrible because it equates fascism with traditionalism and conservativism. they are not the same, and nationalism can be liberal like 1848 or 1789

>>22303896
Stop giving attention to /leftypol/troons.

>>22300906
>yeah B-BUT DA /pol/
>>>/leftypol/

>>22301023
Leftoids don't understand comedy.

>>22305591
lol