/lit/ - Literature

Which one of you is this?

Worth noting also that the guy is a midwit. "Lin" is not a Japanese name. Come laugh at this dumb fucking retard.

Gotten in late on the last thread, so here it is. I hope you like it.

> micz.substack.com/p/the-sum

Criticism is appreciated.

>>22112187
It's up on /writing and the comments are as pozzed as you would expect. But anyway, my take, the guy shot himself in the foot. what agent would ever work with this guy now after seeing how shady and dishonest he is? his career is over. and if he's making youtube videos and a known name, he can't even change his pen name and try again, his reputation is ruined forever. one look at his face and even if he does get an agents, they'll slam the door in his face once they find out. his career is over.

this was really fucking stupid. he's also opened the door to lawsuits, people are going to leave pissy amazon reviews and request refunds, and that actress's agency is going to pursue him for legal action for stealing her photo. what a dumb fucking retard.

That other thread was a literal nightmare. Hoping for some calm water
Also how do you people get in so early. I can never be a successful author, i don't refresh lit fast enough lol

>>22112194
Not bad honestly. Actual effort, my god.

>>22112221
Heh, I saw the thread was speeding to conclusion and just stuck around.

Anyway thank you for reading I'm glad you liked it. For what it's worth there's more effort there if you want to look through the other posts.

>>22112221
>>22112247
What happened?

>>22112187
That's hilarious.

I'm going to set up my own fake publishing house to release my books, and on the site the author list will just be me and 79 fictional women called like 'Bipi Zango' with JAV actresses for their photos, jugs fully out.

>>22112194
Hey anon, I've been subscribed to you for a while but I'd rather ask this here than on substack. I remember you saying you send your work out to publishers, and I know you got some positive responses, can you share some of the emails cuz I've been having no luck myself.

Thanks love the work.

>>22112180
When do I get my phone call?

>>22112194
Dreadful

Royal road is funny.

Sure I got a huge drop from 500 to 176, but that's not what weirds me out. Why in the world would a random ass chapter get 120 views while another gets 58? Or the low one gets 58, then the following chapter jumps back up to 100 views.

>>22112216
Or no one will give a shit, because who cares.

Basically my introduction, I am currently completing my first major developmental edit. I'm at 130k words. I'm expecting that to grow to ~165 - 170k once I introduce story elements, and provide greater characterizations, all of which I realized would be gud after doing my first read-through/partial first edit. This character is non-binary, because they will be raised in a very genderless and alien environment. I'm going to reveal them as biologically female about 1/3 of the way through, but that tidbit won't actually change their characterization, as I think it's important to have the characters be who they are free of sex or gender. The other two antagonists are a mentally disable man and a very capable woman.

>>22112736
Is it still fairly early in the book? People get tired of bullshit prologues and first chapters so they skip ahead to see a more representative example of the writing.

>>22112763
protagonists*

>>22112764
It's almost done. It's not a litrpg, don't know if that affects anything.

would a story be considered anti-semitic if the main character is a jew, and the antagonist is an ancient monster that is called a goy, but most of the story is the orthodox jew teaming up with goys to destroy it?

>>22112763

anyone else like how webnovels has made it acceptable and expected that paragraphs are now blocked off with a space instead of an indent?

>>22112763
"their"

God it sounds awful. God help us if this is where the Englih language is going.

>>22112953
I don't know if it would be anti-semitic but it certainly would be retarded.

>>22113017
That's the default formatting on RoyalRoad.
I copy my text from a Google Docs document (from an uploaded LibreOffice ODT) and the paragraphs in both were set up with first-line indent, but RoyalRoad has other ideas.
It's possible to do first-line-indent on RoyalRoad, but it's labor-intensive, i.e. post as HTML, with all <p> elements replaced with a trailing <br />, and all first-line indents done by repeated &nbsp; insertion.
I don't bother.

>>22113030
>Englih
God help us if this is where the English language is going.

How do I know if my idea is sufficiently fleshed out? For example, I have a vague idea for one chapter where the protag and his friends are introduced and they hang out and bump into his love interest but I have no idea how to get from point A to B. Ane ideas on how to better flesh out ideas?

>>22113111
There's a difference between you and him in that his typo is clearly not deliberate.

>>22113151
if you don't tell us the idea we can't help
>the protag and his friends are introduced and they hang out and bump into his love interest
okay. so what plot related development does the chance encounter with the love interest set off?

>>22113017
I don't like it at all

>>22113176
Its not actually the protags interest but one of his friends, my mistake. It's just to set the tone and establish loyalties. I'm not looking for someone to give me an idea but more whetger there are good methods or questions which can help with brainstorming and fleshing out ideas.

>>22113189
Just write it, doofus. The fleshing out happens in the writing. Writing is non-stop brainstorming.

The start of a campy erotic horror story, inspired by reading a bunch of Junji Ito comics this weekend.

>>22113154
>i can read minds
lel

I am once again back with an update. I smoked about two ounces of bud over 3 days and wrote this narrative poem from a previous rough draft.

https://gaslightchronicles.com/stories/thephantomofnewgaslight

I also wrote this on the 3rd day, very drunk and depressed.

https://gaslightchronicles.com/lore/locations/thesunflowerfields

Every post, the imposter feeling strengths, a cruel irony.

I made the male lead of my novel so devastatingly handsome, several women in the story comment on how good looking and heroic he is. Even though he's humble, shy and awkward around women, they find it endearing and sweet. Ultimately, he falls in the love with and marries the beauitful princess that can't stand him at first. That's what I love about writing. I can do whatever I want and no one can stop me.

>>22113363
Should probably spell check my posts but it's late and I'm exhausted

>>22113298
>two ounces of bud over 3 days
jesus, that's a gigantic bag. your poor lungs. what a waste of money. what a worthless waste of life.

How do you reconcile between the scene you want to write and having a lack of skill to describe it properly? Or, in other words, how can you reconcile being able to have a scene in your head, and be able to see how everything fits together, only to be unable, through words, to describe what’s going on. For example, it’d be like trying to describe a house without knowing what a door, wall, or roof are.

>>22113434
>lack of skill to describe it properly
you're probably approaching it wrong. remember, you're not putting together a movie shot, and having an autistic description of everything is fuckawful
as far as description less is more. focus on character motivations and dialogue.

Story about some girl who hangs out at bus stops i've been playing around with.

'The number 11 bus arrives at varying lateness around noon. The typical driver would be one of three people depending on the day; One whom she learned the name of at some point, the other two, some other man and a middle aged woman she absolutely despised and only made conclusions based on her barren appearance. She only came to understanding the formers name overhearing a caustic elderly woman, the self important village elder type who would eagerly make a point to address the slovenly disgusting driver. He was a man well into his 30's, was atrociously fat and had that certain look of a filthy and rank odour; she intensely hated him. She hated all fat people. The lack of self control and absolute abandonment of any sort of decency was pathetic and lower than beasts. It's astonishing that they were afforded the same rights as her, she concluded. '

My main character is the most recent of a line of clone monarchs that is itself a stealth eugenic payload sent by the moon-dwellers to help the population of earth deal with their war-ravaged environment.
As such, he's got a new bullshit genetic trait or ability brought up in almost every single chapter and I'll not apologize for it.

>>22113525
Hey, it worked for "Quantum Leap".
No, wait...no it didn't.

I got an idea for a very personal horror story. I feel the creative juices flowing, I can see the entire story unfold in my head, and I know this is a good one.

>>22112180
I've just started writing the second draft of my novel. I'm trying to nail down an opening that introduces my themes. Feedback, please. Do you want to keep reading?

>>22113638
(Most of) my original opening. I like the new one a lot more.

>>22113638
no because i have no clue what's going on. Is this the beginning or somewhere in the middle of chapter 1? Give me the actual beginning.

Is five pages too long for a masturbation scene?

>>22113646
I failed to specify that this is happening in the parking lot on the walk in to work. That helps a lot.

>>22113638
>>22113644
>most sentences start with "I"

>>22113661
Is this that NPC girlfriend girl?

>>22113652
Is 50 pages too long for a speech? Worked for Ayn Rand. Anything can work if you do it right.

How much do you outline antagonists?
I tried writing and I realized I didn't have a single antagonist prepared...

>>22113661
My use of "I" is worse in the first draft.

My count is 10/46 here... though I hope it can be forgiven in that initial "peer in my head for a brief second" part.

Is it a bigger offense because it's the opening?

>>22113667
I outline every single detail of the story, before I start writing.

>>22113686
Can I get a screencap of one page?

>>22113741
I'm on phone in a train right now, so I don't have them. But they are just notes. I write out the entire plot, I write a separate section for each character, that includes their character development, history, personality and etc. Basically I have every single thing planned out. I can't start, before I know exactly where I'm going with it.

>>22112194
7/10
Not your best not your worst

>>22113749
Even notes sound nice. Like I said, doesn't have to be everything, just something like one page of the outline and one page of the character. I'm trying to figure out the best method for me because I keep writing myself into a ditch and it's clear that I need some planning.

>>22113765
Have you tried the 7 point method yet? Dan Wells gave a really good talk about it: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLzfRuHa21NIzQFrQ6FAq8Pj2IA_SXiwrN

I wrote up a 7 point plot for each of my major characters and it helped me a lot to generate some plot points that later became my outline.

Why, yes, I did write 2,000 words today. In fact, I wrote 3,000. And if I didn't post yesterday, just know that I wrote 3,000 yesterday.

>>22113644
you know, this ain't bad.

Is it okay to approach my horror/thriller story with a sense of humor/irony, and to have a positive message at the end, despite how bad things got at some points?

>>22113787
Proof? I barely wrote anything even in my outlines.

I'm working on this story - let me know what you think, I have the moments I want it to get to planned out for the most part.

The storm walked along with the city like a nonchalant bomb. Ely’s quiet gaze located with the corner of a roof. The fall of the rain seemed to be speaking into a shadow that has already been spread across the world. A cat shouted at the air where the lightning hung. Ely breathed in the incense smoke coming from the ember that spread at its flicker. He fidgeted with his thought. To inhabit change you must always relive the spark. He wasn’t sure what that thought was worth but he let it go into his body and spread it into his skin until he was satisfied with it reaching heaven. A series of irregularities came from his vinyl record machine and he considered the meditation over.

>can't figure out my MC's name
I know everyone else's name...

I have an idea but I can't help but think the premise works better as a comic book than in writing

It's about a vigilante hero that grew up bullied because he was born with abnormally short and wide proportions like a fridge, but then he takes up martial arts and becomes a tiny bulldozer that defends the weak but is still held back by his small size and short reach. I was thinking about Baki the Grapper and Ninja Turtles (+ Casey Jones) as inspiration, but there isn't really anything like it in writing form outside of maybe some pulp. What do you guys think?

>>22112736
I assume that the one with a jump in viewers is from it appearing on the front page in the recently posted section and people just reading it from there.

>>22113815
Does the name really matter? If it has meaning to it, then that makes it easier to pick one; if it has no meaning, then just find something that sounds fine.
My MC's name is Harlan, coming from his adoptive father, Harlow, but there is no meaning behind it.

>>22113368
i will be published and you will be forgotten

>>22113850
yeah he will be forgotten, along with everything else, after all that short term memory loss you subjected yourself to

>>22113853
what are we talking about?

>>22113815
Roger

>>22113030
Op here. I don't like it either. But they're non-binary. Gender is a social construct and they will grow up in a genderless alien society.

>>22113092
>>22113017
>>22113185
I've never explored any other software to write than Microsoft Word. I don't even read. I found that what matters most is that I put finger to key and work on the book.

Went outside today and you know what I found?
No one was reading or writing.
The end cannot come soon enough.

>>22112221
It is an effort. Thank you. Even when aiming for something light know i didn't just scribble it down an hour before posting.

>>22112405
God, sure. It's nothing special though.
Email me Through substack i'll send you a copy.
To be honest I put more effort into the PDF then in the email, trying to give it an old Faber paperback feel.

>>22112650
=( i tried

>>22113751
That's also how i feel. I really like some things about it though im not sure how fits together.

>>22112194
I'll second the other anon 7/10 seemed fair. I liked it though. Fast better then most things posted here.

My only advice is to make the ending less obvious. It feels too cute .

>>22113805
>The storm walked across the city like a nonchalant bomb.
Lemme stop you right there, chief. What's nonchalant about either of those things in any context?

>>22113289
It doesn't take a psychic to know a typo when you see it. Or do you mean that you didn't actually mean to use the plural pronoun?

>>22113885
Consider neopronouns. Not necessarily worth it but they don't mess with the grammar and immediately inject some unfamiliarity. Greg Egan likes to use ve/ver/vis.

>>22113787
You smug bitch!

>>22113652
If they're female, one page is too long. If they're male, one paragraph is.

>>22112180
My book has devolved so much to the point where it's structurally an edgier saturday morning cartoon, with a villain of the week formula and all. It's so over..

Im writing about a friendless neet incel who obsesses over self-image and how other people perceive him. His thoughts become more and more deranged as the book goes on as he has no attachment to reality

>>22114554
Just like my diary desu

Everything I write ends up being sexual, and I can't help myself. This wouldn't be a problem if it were genuine smut and had an erotic component. I find myself always coming back to this really fucking weird, dispassionate depiction of sex or masturbation that's wholly joyless and always just strange. There is zero erotic value to any of it. I have no interest in it, and no interest in creating erotic material for anyone to actually get off to. It's what I'll always end up with unless I consciously force myself to write something without a sexual element to it. I'm so fucking tired of it, bros.

>>22114355
Tried it last night and it sounds even worse. I think I'll juat use synonyms for child until their name is revealed as Sam

>>22114596
Have you tried fapping first to purge yourself of the horniness?

>>22114749
IME that's even worse than they/them, last time I tried I barely lasted a few hundred words. In the end singular they isn't that bad.

>>22113805
horrific writing. all the metaphors are weird as fuck and "vinyl record machine"? come on man

>>22112180
>Wattys 2023 doesn't accept essays
>Wattys 2023 doesn't accept general narrative about Christian minorities
>Wattys 2023 doesn't even accept general narrative about Christian minorities in Italian
Bros, what should I do with my enciphered collection of essays on Satan written in Italian? Am I going to die unbeknown to everyone?

>>22114915
unironically i'm entering a novel to the wattys. if i don't win i'm going to kill myself. i've read the past winners and they're lower quality than most of what is posted here. they've got to give it to me.

ironically wattshit has a lot of programs and contests and even publishing deals but all the talent left the site

It's been a while since I last posted but If any of you guys are willing to give this a read I'd appreciate the criticism.
I've thought about throwing this whole thing out at some point but decided to finish it and I've got about 10k more words to go before I wrap it up.
I've gone over it many times trying to touch up words and other things here and there, but right now I would really like some hard criticism or advice based on how It's going.
I'm starting to see the appeal of an editor, but I'm obviously not going to get one for my very first book.
I have a bunch of other ideas I want to make books on but I really want to finish this story first. Hopefully I can fix some of my biggest mistakes or bad habits before getting started on that, though.

https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/67519/corvid
Royal road seems to be mostly LitRPG and Isekai stuff. Is there another site I can try to get feedback?

>>22113661
I gotta work on that.
I honestly think it's a problem.
I don't know where to start, though.
I'm just not sure.

Keen for any feedback on this descriptive passage. Are you able to picture the room?

>>22115158
it's good

>>22115143
I clicked on the prologue, saw the "awoooo", then went back thinking I had mistakenly clicked an advertisement for furry porn (having misread your username as Terrier Toes). Just being honest with you, anon, when I say that I can't read it. Is your intended audience children, perhaps ages 8 to 13? If not then please, I beg of you: write normally.
Have you actually read any books that spell out "awooo" and "caw, caw"?
Why the different spelling of caw/kaw in the same line?

Why are you using the present tense? Is it to be literary and different? I've never read LitRPG and have no clue what it's like but your writing sounds close enough. It's CYOA, choose-your-own-adventure style. Again, if your audience is the late elementary school child then please, continue.

If you really want to be different, rewrite this in metrical verse, as poetry, and make sure it rhymes too. I'd read this shit out of that.

>>22115158
Kino tbqhfamalam. Yeah I can picture it. What's this part of?

>>22115062
Has there ever been a good novel on there?
Good luck nonetheless, anon

>>22115062
I wish wattpad had, I don't even want to say better discoverability mechanics, but discovery mechanics at all. I'd like to be able to use the site but it's such fucking dogshit.

>>22115143
I read the prolouge and chapter 1. This reads like it was generated by a chatbot.

>>22115143
Okay, so right off the bat, I think you could use a better cover and you definitely need a better description. You should analyze what other authors do and go a bit more in depth with yours, because right now the last line is the only vaguely interesting part. This wouldn't really grab me if I just ran into in passing.

I read the prologue and part of the first chapter, and the present tense is just distracting the shit out of me to be honest. That's up to you, though. What stood out more to me was the punctuation for the dialogue tags.
>“So by now you should be familiar with what Voltaire meant.” A monotone voice says.
should be
>“So by now you should be familiar with what Voltaire meant,” a monotone voice says.

>“Hold your horses!” A girl says as my belt is pulled slightly back, making me stop in my tracks.
should be
>“Hold your horses!” a girl says as my belt is pulled slightly back, making me stop in my tracks.

Basically, the way you have it makes it look like two different sentences, which works for action beats, but not dialogue tags.

Also, remember that when you have one character directly addressing another to put a comma before their name or nickname. You did it correctly in some instances, but not others.
>”... Hey Cordelia.” I greet flatly.
should be
>”... Hey, Cordelia,” I greet flatly.

>>22115178
>>22115245
Thank you - it's part of a novel - can you picture the room? Is there anything missing?

There was a memory of his childhood. In the private resort that his family used to own, a window that gave view to the lake. An island had been there in this memory and he recalled that it had fit perfectly within the window, both horizontal ends of the island had just barely touched the window frames. It had seemed like a painting. In hindsight it would appear as if this memory should not have been one and not one that he had felt melancholy about. For whatever reason this small yet inconsequential moment had stuck in him for so long. But, this little memory had begun to crumble like an old photo. Not very long ago he would have been able to recall it with striking detail, now all he could picture was some vague idea of an island placed within a white frame. This memory has been corrupted.

>>22115303
Damn this is the most constructive feed back I've ever gotten. Thanks I think you've made some good points. This actually helps out, but unfortunately It looks like I've got a field day ahead of me if I want to fix these kind of instances. It'll be worth it though, I always felt like my way of writing conversation was somehow bad.

>>22115315
mostly I can feel what the room says about the men
the only thing that's a little awkward to me is "my father's chesterfield has been returned to its rightful place"—just because "had been" implies something happened to it and that's not obvious in context. If it's been established outside of this snippet, it's fine.
also I'm not sure I'd describe burgundy and ochre as "real colors" or at least colors that contrast against a gloomy room. They're definitely gloomy colors.
for some reason I initially thought a chesterfield was a type of gun, but on looking it up it seems I was wrong
but these are just nitpicks, it's a good description of a smoky, old money drawing room

>>22115197
Woof, relax man, I'm not trying to be the next Shakespeare. I know my writing sucks ass, that's why I'm making a book. To improve and learn how to do it better. I've never made a book before go easy on me holy shit hahahaha

>>22115297
I really want to start over and actually add depth to it, but at this point I feel like I should just finish it the way I've started. It does kind of irk me how I write, but I won't improve if I don't try new things, and I'm planning on doing just that with my next attempt. I know this shit is not very good.

The night was steamy like a grandma's hot milk fresh out of the microwave - I pulled at my collar and blew the cigarette smoke that had been building up within the dark, primeval lair that was my mouth - pillowy white smoke passed over the jagged arctic plateaus of my teeth and into the dark, polluted night air of central Los Angeles. I knew it was time, like a dead man who died staring at a clock. By instinct I stroked the handle of my holstered revolver beneath my overcoat, holding onto its enameled grip like it was an imaginary friend from childhood who'd come back for a final goodbye. It was time to see the Puppet Master.

>>22113017
Indented paragraphs belong in printed books. Digital texts must be spaced, or it fucking destroys your eyes, literally impossible to read

I'm writing a fantasy story on royal road, with almost 140k words published, and I was wondering if it's worth opening a substack account to increase my exposure. Can anyone weigh in?

So I'm almost halfway through writing my sexual memoir idea I had called "Sex Life of an Incel." Some anon here probably was in the thread where I talked about it. It's basically just a rundown of all the seedy sex shit I did that's all outside of a normal, healthy relationship. Here's the intro.

>>22115357
Glad I could help. We've all got to start somewhere, man. I don't use RR, but I know I look back at earlier drafts of my own work and cringe half the time. You could always just consider this a first draft and focus on finishing the story, then take it down and reupload it at a later date after you've made all the changes you want to.

>>22115379
It's okay bro. Keep trying. We'll read it and then you'll try again. That's how you improve. I didn't mean to sound so mean

>started chapter 2 today
>wrote another 1000~ words
>if I write a 5000-6000 word chapter a week, I should finish by mid-September
Fuck, it seems so far away.

>>22113631
what is a "personal" horror story?

>>22115427
Nobody cares when or where your first orgasm was or what you were looking at. If you're going to write about dumb sex shit, at least make it interesting to fucking read. It's like I'm reading a laundry list where all the items are related to cum instead of anything about which I care even the slightest.

>>22115427
This gave me second-hand depression.
Not too shabby.

>>22115143
I know that stories often begin with the protagonist at a low point, but you're starting off with nagging, whining, stress, and real world problems. For at least three chapters. It's a drag to read. Your average RR reader will probably not make it much further than that.

>>22115812
Good, well at least it's provocative.
>>22115784
Fair point, and I was worried when I looked at it again that it came off as full of myself. I might re-word. It was my hopes that the rest of it, as a series of descriptions of visiting prostitutes, massage parlors, and sex clubs, might be interesting or enlightening to sum.

>>22115826
Considering your average RR reader is into Isekai shit, maybe that's not such a bad thing.

>>22115650
One that deals with themes that I personally find important.

>>22116013
Royal Road readers also really hate it when you have a chapter that's nothing but the letter A. Maybe try that next

>>22116013
I assume that if he's posting there, he wants views from RR readers.

>>22116032
Isn't that every story

I should try ao3, Wattpad or something else?

>>22116135
What are you writing?

>>22115290
the search feature is garbage is the main problem. they also strongly use an algorithm, which results in some books randomly skyrocketing and others going totally unnoticed.
>>22115251
i mean, maybe, some of their books are paywalled and i haven't read those. but to date i've not found anything i would call "good". even their past winners are just sort of mediocre at best, and the average quality is trash. which is a shame, and the fault of the userbase, who tend to be younger. in theory it's a good site. in practice it just didn't quite work out.
thanks man.

>>22116135
depends on your target audience and what you want to accomplish. original fiction doesn't really do well on ao3 because it's designed for fanfiction. wattpad and similar sites all have certain niches they focus on.

>>22113638
>>22113644
Rewrite it in third person. If the novel isn't about his psyche and mental state, there's absolutely no reason to read this whiny kid voice.

>>22116209
Thanks for confirming my choice to go first person. He is immature and the book is about his mental state.

>>22116190
>>22116135
Original fantasy fiction

>>22116279
There's not much of an online audience for traditional 'fantasy fiction'. Amazon selfpub or tradpub is your best bet.
It's pretty obvious why, too. 99.9% of 'traditional fantasy fiction' is awful and boring. At least amateur gamelit, romance, erotica, or other big online fiction sites are dopamine-focused. Kinda like amateur porn. That's just the reality of the situation. If you want to write 'real' fiction and be noticed, then you have to be one of the absolute best.

>>22116310
As someone writing traditional fantasy, this anon is correct. I do get comments saying htings like "You're better than 99.9% of the writing on this site" but I also get readers who think including a descriptive clause to a sentence is purple prose that just confuses the reader and should be treated like a bad habit and deleted.

Thus, my stats are not impressive.

>>22116310
>>22116323
Oh no... What do I do with my story then? I honestly have zero desire to make this into a 3 book trilogy

>>22116323
i hear a lot of things described as "purple prose" now that are basic writing, the meaning of the phrase has been diluted by adhd zoomers who are accustomed to reading phone novels (garbage that other zoomers wrote on literally their phone, sparse and meme-ridden prose, usually almost entirely dialogue.) the millennial generation is the most bookish since the 1800s, but zoomers are going to destroy literature for all of time. these broccoli haired creatures are barely literate, and the women are morbidly obese by age 20. the future is bleak.

>>22116333
>The boy drew the bow taut, until the wood cried in his hand for the tension, and emerged from his cover.

>>22116331
>depends on what you want to accomplish

>>22116349
Sell 10 copies

>>22116341
that isn't purple. the descriptor is crap but that doesn't make it purple.
>the tender young boy crouched behind the verdant foliage of the barberry shrubs, with their sage-magenta leaves, shrouded in the tangy fragrance reminiscent of so many nostalgic meals once shared with his family, and remembered the tang of the berries scattered through the rice platter under a sprinkle of saffron and harissa his grandmother smiled over. a trace of the same vibrant hue lit through the grain of the bow's wood as he drew the string back, his sweat glistening like the glow of orion's belt, he and the mythical hunter uniting in form.

>>22116368
10 copies? Well, almost anything can do that. Do you mean 'staying true to my literary standards and selling at least a few copies while doing so'?
Or do you mean, 'reaching as wide an audience as possible'?
Or to a higher degree, 'the easiest way to make a living writing'?
There's a pretty obvious split between 'literary merit' and 'fiction that sells'. Personally I don't have an issue with either, though this thread is divided and will seethe about both parties. Please be more clear in your goals? What kind of writer are you aiming to be?

>>22116388
I want to write the best book I can and hopefully 10 other people outside my immediate family would purchase it just from reading the blurb.

>>22116388
I want to have my book shilled on 4chan by another random anon without me lifting a finger

>>22116405
'Best' in what way? Normies (98% of population) want to be entertained, which means dopamine-focused sales/clicks/etc. Most people don't care about 'literature', or profound writing. That said, you can write 'real literature' and get 10 sales. It's a low bar to clear. Is your ultimate goal really 10 sales, though?
If so, just write well. Anything can hit that benchmark.

>>22116412
This actually happened to me, and the answer is writing niche erotica, LMAO

>>22116374
It's not crap, it's being narrated by a millenia old wizard. It's style.

>>22112763
>>22113030
>>22113885
>>22114355
Just use "it" for a singular non-specified gender person. Keep "they" and "their" when talking about multiple people otherwise people will think the person is a crowd or has a multiple identity disorder.
Don't make up crap like "ver" unless you want to spend a couple of pages of worldbuilding explaining why they use that word for that meaning.
>social construct
language is a social construct and if you don't use it properly everyone will think you are retarded.

>>22116552
This. I use they/their for a character because they are literally two people.

>>22114355
>Consider neopronouns
>ve/ver/vis

>>22113885
>Gender is a social construct
maybe you should consider that he/she pronouns are based on sex, and always have been

>>22116603
>always
Always? Nigga doesn't know English used to have grammatical gender

>>22116629
>grammatical gender
nouns have a gender. living beings have a sex. but here you are trying to change the topic from pronouns to grammatical gender
I wonder why

trans rights are human rights

>>22116648
In languages with grammatical gender, pronouns are differentiated according to noun class. In languages with natural gender, they refer to the gender of the person or lack thereof in the case of a thing. There are no sex pronouns in English.
My theory is that you're too dumb to understand any of the concepts adumbrated above so you muddy the waters to hide the blushing of your face, whether due to rage at your own incompetence or embarrassment that you have been outed as categorically mistaken.

>>22116656
Troons aren't even human, let alone women

>>22116677
retard.
he/she are pronouns that refer to the sex of the person. that is the entirety of their basis. dilate and then 41% yourself.

>>22116696

>>22116435
Yes my goal is for 10 sales. I haven't reached that goal yet

>>22116689
No, I actually agree that trans women are real women. And it is time to end womans suffrage.

>>22116719
Then write better. 10 sales is less than amateur standard. Not trying to be a crab, but sounds like you're a beginner. No point in real discussion.

>>22116656
trans rights are (exactly as irrelevant as) human rights

Editorchad needs more money for two bottles of Johnnie Walker and a shovel. Anyone else have a manuscript ready?

>>22112763
Redeemable. You are doing a decent job of setting a mood, but you are using way too many words and getting lost in abstract, over-complex sentences. You could probably cut a third of these words without losing anything, and my gut says an ideal version would be 25-40% the currently length.

Stop over-narrating the scene and write with simpler, more intimate language which pulls us into the perspective of the characters. Don't be afraid to just say what's happening. You are only hurting yourself with the constant explanations and summary.

>>22113815
Call him "the Chosen One"!

>>22114333
It's just amusing that someone that decries other people's lack of skill with the language commits an error of zis own.

>>22115391
pretentious

>>22116656
I remember when it was illegal to surgically sterilize the mentally ill.
Now it's "stunning and brave".
Go figure!

>>22114554
>>22114596
>>22115427
Seems like you're severely limiting your audience.

>>22116374
I like this.

Got a chapter of a new WIP done and planning to write more. I want to post this serially somewhere. What site is the best to do so?

>want to write a dark, violent story
>like all my characters too much to kill off any of them

After six months of nothing, I've finally put out another chapter of The Kill List. For those who were into it before, here's a link. As always, thanks for any feedback. It really is encouraging to know that someone takes the time to read my fiction.

https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/54622/the-kill-list

>>22113799
Not him but just write whatever comes to mind, how you would do writing sprints. The story will flow out. I can do 4k+ plus words in a sitting. But my downside is that I'm a pantster who can't adhere to any outline.

My draft is going along okay, better progress than usual. I don't know how but it just all made sense one day. I forget what writers block is now.

>>22117201
The dialogue is very akward

>>22117154
Can a story be dark and violent without death? Are there other things people can lose that matter in a story, like a relationship or honor or sanity or a capability? I think sometimes it is not just pain or death that is dark, there are other things that cast a shadow on life that often incite violence. When you have powerful ideas cause violence, or some other kind of wrongdoing, you don't have to kill a character. But sometimes you do have to kill the character knowing that you and everyone else likes. It doesnt just explore the reaction of death, it shows how different the story can become when there is no hope of a character's return.

>>22117280
Mind providing examples? I appreciate it.

>>22117201
I actually really like this. Reminds me of the early Witcher stories.

>>22117078
How so? I'm the third one you quoted.

>>22113819
Maybe he should play American football.

>>22117442
Can you imagine normies wanting to read about the sadcringe life of an incel?
I understand the aphorism "write what you know", but I think you're taking that way too far.

>>22117451
hey thanks for replying
no thanks, American football is boring

Should I write a screenplay or a novel?

>>22117462
I figured maybe it would be interesting for someone similar but who has no experience, or morbidly fascinating to a normie. Maybe not?

>>22117570
I would guess that normies want to think about nerds or incels as little as possible.

Eye light 4

The reward of telepathic tears
is like a surviving potion
that blazons on your chin
with limited relief. Once I thought
nobody was paying any attention
and suddenly everybody plugged into
their electronic mist.
The love in the heart
grappled with love in the air
so I apply the gall to my own eyes—
fountains are streaming globs
of touchable deliverance
and the taxis are making limitless
effort, effortlessly in a city full of blinking.

I’ve read a lot more than I’ve written, and it’s very jarring. My writing is noticeably worse than anything I’ve read, save for maybe the one-line Oriental webnovel style, but the more I write, nevermind the content nor the purpose of my writing, I’ve noticed the quality of my work has been rapidly increasing. Was it really so simple as putting in the hours to write?

>>22115158
I enjoyed reading this. But there was one sentence that I felt was very bad within the context of the piece.
>Amidst the hubbub I slank like a liquid shadow.
I didn’t like this sentence for a few reasons. Examining it in isolation, the ‘liquid’ part seems cliché and unnecessary and also weird. Why a ‘liquid shadow’ instead of a shadow? Also, 'slank' is an atypical use where I think slunk would be more typical. But the main problem is that the sudden simile in what is your shortest sentence is jarring and feels out of place with how movement of characters is otherwise described.
>Everyone rose from their seats and began to shuffle out in groups,…
>I broke free from the trail and darted ahead…
>Waiters from dinner bobbed and weaved…
>I positioned myself quietly in the corner.
These are more effective descriptions of movement that do the job without any distracting figures. They are consistent in relation to each other, they occur in sentences that are more typical in length, and they do a better job of positioning your characters and conveying the nature of their movement in relation to the surroundings. The shadow sentence is more poetic, sure, but its poetic character is out of place and feels like you suddenly remembered that you needed to write something figuratively. I would cut it out or change it. If you want to change it, perhaps make it less jarring and make the sentence longer and not so sudden and dense with the figure. Give more information about how they are shadowlike. Are they a shadow in the crowd, or outside of the crowd? You attempt to convey the character being indiscreet, the figure instead stands out, which might work if you are going for an ironic representation of the character thinking they are more discreet then they are. I don’t know, just rambling a bit there. Essentially, just compare that sentence to this one you wrote.
>I positioned myself quietly in the corner.
This pretty much does the same you were trying to do with your simile. But where the simile makes the character stand out when we should get the sense they are blending in, here they seem to fit into the surrounding language and by extension the smoking room. Similarly, although not describing movement, compare it to the metaphor of ‘a spindly creature’. This metaphor does a better job than your simile because it doesn’t feel it out of place and draw attention to itself.
Also, is Mr Tod lounging on the chesterfield or another sofa? I am unsure.

>>22116552
>Just use "it" for a singular non-specified gender person.
How often have you seen this done? It's an option but it gets real confusing or annoying when you start using more personal language. Sure it's singular and third-person, but animacy has both semantics and grammar.
There's a reason only avant garde online gender people use this one.
>Keep "they" and "their" when talking about multiple people otherwise people will think the person is a crowd or has a multiple identity disorder.
Definite singular they is becoming standard enough to work. Maybe depending a little on your target audience.
It helps that it piggybacks off indefinite singular they, which is not new.
>Don't make up crap like "ver" unless you want to spend a couple of pages of worldbuilding explaining why they use that word for that meaning.
If I were already writing an alien society I'd trust the reader to pick up what the deal is. You don't have to coddle them.
Again, maybe depending a little on target audience, but at worst you can get it over with in a sentence or two.
>language is a social construct and if you don't use it properly everyone will think you are retarded.
Your own suggestion is really no more proper than the others.
If you're portraying an alien society there's some obvious leeway.

>>22117768
no matter what you do delete the first line
>story starts waking up and rolling out of bed
delete everything before "Sit down," she said

What's the general consensus on inventing new words by taking old words and swapping a letter? I just don't want readers to think I misspelled easy words.

>>22118217
What do your new words mean?

>>22118239
One is the opposite of "nightmare", like sure we have "dream" but that's an overgeneralization of that concept, there's no word for "really good dream" but there is for "really bad dream".

Bros I'm actually considering writing an erotica novel to learn how to make a more engaging setting and improve at setting a scene.
I don't even like porn I just think it might be a good exercise. Have any of you done that or how else did you improve at your story-telling? I feel like most of what I write just gets to the point while skipping the opportunity to create substantial depth to my chapters. Last erotica novel I read actually made me feel things and visualize stuff. Reading Twilight was like trying to lick sandpaper, though.
What the fuck is going on here

>>22118256
Dreams are good if they're not bad. Stop overthinking pointless things and write.

>>22118272
That's what I did and exactly how I learnt about the writing process, dialogue construction, describing actions in autistic detail, etc. Was any of it good? Only if you consider violent lesbian femdom with aftercare good, otherwise it's cringey as fuck reading it now.
Also stick to fanmade ero stuff instead of your usual bargain bin Milk & Honey shit. There's still some shitty ones but a few have stayed rent free in my head since reading it X amount of years ago.

>>22118272
Reading Twilight to learn how to tell a story is the equivalent of eating fast food to learn gourmet cooking. Its value is limited and strictly apophatic in nature. If you want to become a better storyteller you MUST read, and read widely, and read the best of what's available. Tackle Anna Karenina, Dubliners, Heart of Darkness, Mrs Dalloway, The Sound and The Fury, Lolita, The Remains of the Day, and 2666. That's a wide selection of a variety of styles from a variety of periods, all very good, each innovative in its own way, or at least technically proficient. Read analytically and continuously write while reading and you will improve exponentially as a writer.

The problem is that people don't want to put in the effort. They just expect it to happen through inconsistent solitary practice. A bodybuilder lifts weights and disciplined himself through the cumulative daily effort of months and years before even thinking of competing with the best. Why on earth should writing, an art form far higher and far more complex than lifting weights, be treated any differently? If you want to be a novelist you will be going up against people who read voraciously from childhood, studied English at school, perhaps did a degree in English, which, if nothing else, means being forced to read selections from the canon and analyse their merit through essays, and continue writing and reading and honing their craft fot years.

This isn't to put you, or anyone else, off of writing. But people really need to assess whether this is something they want to take seriously, and, if they truly want to improve, take concrete steps to do so.

The wind blew cold through the Milwaukee project. All across the block the homies was partying. And boy was they partying. The year was 1973 and the Milwaukee night was cold but the cold didn't stop the homies partying or George Floyd mama from being pregnant. She was fitting to pop that night and she did and the cold didn't stop her from doing it. And George Floyd was born on that cold Milwaukee night even though his mama said it were far too cold to be pregnant and she was happy to be done with the business. When George come out he was crying loud and nobody could stop him almost as if God and the angels knew already and was ready from that moment to take him up back into heaven even though he weren't but just born and he was. But it weren't Milwaukee it were somewhere else.

When we was fifteen my butt got big and I started getting that booty even though my tits wasn't grown yet. But my pussy was pink and it stay pink. But I knew that boy was special even if he weren't special enough to let him fuck he were special. For example he alway had top loud. Off top best on the block. So even though I ain't let him fuck I'm a still smoke up, you dig? Out here we get fucked up and stay that way I know you dig.

But I gotta say as we get older and George keep getting bigger I'm a get curious what he got going on. It was 1989 and I was knocked up with my third son and hurting for a pick me up so I call George up and let him think I'm fitting to fuck because I knew he still wanted the pussy after all this time. I'm a guess he never stop wanting it that pink pink pussy of mine even though he got pussy from other bitches and a couple baby mama too. Niggers always telling me the way my booty jiggle when they on me from behind and that were definitely on my mind at that time as I gone over to smoke up a little but definitely not to fuck because I was already pregnant and didn't need to add no more on top of it. I ain't even want the one I got and sure enough don't need another on top but the doctors says I was third trimester by time I come in fitting to get that nigger out of me and couldn't do it they says with some cold hard look on they face like it they baby or something. Anyway that ain't the point.

>>22118350
Anyway after I popped out that little nigger who still living with my mama I remember how George Floyd always have the best doja and I remember how that other cold night I came over to George place and we smoke up but don't fuck and I get to feeling like I'm fitting to do that again but it don't go like I planned because we do end up fucking in like 2015 because George was in Milwaukee and I ain't have no nothing or another but the clothes I'm wearing and those nigger living at my mama house she always bitch at me that I gotta come and see but that night I just want to smoke. So I go over and we smoke a little and fuck and my booty he says jiggle thick while he fuck me from behind which make me happy. And I don't get pregnant and I don't cum on that niggers dick because even though he about seven foot tall like LeBron be tall his dick ain't nowhere near that big neither. And he don't even know how to use it and don't eat pussy but at least I get high.

By that time George was doing good. He had these pills he was selling and they make him that cash. When I see his Mercedes I sort of wish he did get me pregnant but he didn't. Now I don't fuck around with no tweak or no skag but them pills was fire off top. Now these days after George dead and shit I'm fitting to spread the word about what kind of nigger George Floyd was. I want yall to know that he had the best doja on the block. I want yall know that even if he couldn't make a bitch cum with his little baby dick he still smoke up with her before and after because that's how he was. That's who they stole from us. He a fucking Saint. A modern day Black Saint straight outta Zion or the Bible or some shit and even if he die murdered by the police in Milwaukee that who he is. Best doja on the block off top and I'm sure in my heart as I cry and write this that he up in heaven sharing his weed with God even if he can't make him cum neither.

>>22118345
>you will be going up against people
Art isn't a competition, fren. It's art. Granted, the "art market" is very much a competition, but it has much more to do with the market than it does anything about art itself. You can choose to pursue market success, artistic success, or some degree of both; but you don't HAVE to "compete" against others in the market. You always have the option to just pursue your idea of excellence in art and allow the rest to sort itself out of its own accord... which, ultimately, it's going to do anyway.

>>22118256
Why does your story need a word for that? What's wrong with writing out "good dream"?

How many fiction books have you read?

>>22118375
Fuck if I know. Hundreds? A thousand? I've been reading since I was like five.

>>22118363
Excise that sentence, then, which is true if you have any intention of being traditionally published, or acquire a readership if self-published. An artist strives to hone their craft, and they do this through long exposure to masterwork in the manner I described - just as in painting, sculpture, music, architecture, and so on

>>22118370
It's integral to the story and I'd rather not have characters say "good dream" every couple of sentences. It's about as unimaginative as having a race of skeleton people called "skellies".

Final time I'm posting this here, (I'm a goddamn /x/ poster too.) just doesn't seem to resonate or have the desired effect.

Will come back with something updated and evolved and catered to selling to retards quickly online.

Unless...that's not the play.

If you have any input or criticism regarding what I'm trying to do, please feel free to. It doesn't seem as though it has had the intended effect in regards to government and religion that I had had.
>fucking charlatans.

Anyway...The Game.

>>22118625
Is this supposed to be a poem?

>>22118626
It's supposed to be effective.

There are poems written into it, songs.

do you know how to subtext schizo read?
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5UF6ashzkw
Follow along with how eerily it coincides with what is written.

or don't, I take meds because I'm an angry psychopath now schizo so whatever.
>Birds talked to me, don't fail.

>>22118625
Write a story first. The other ideas you've listed can go into them where appropriate, but you will need a lot more. Hundreds to possibly thousands of things, some will work and some won't so you could save those for another project. Also try to reimagine these quotes, but some might stay as they are. Deconstruct why you like them and maybe they can be better or suit your story.

STAY CLEAR. GET OUT OF THE WAY. DANGEROUSLY CLOSE TO ACTUALLY (ACTUALLY) WRITING.
NEARLY INSPIRED

any ideas for what i should write though?

>>22118699
Tell me you something you give a shit about. Something you care the world for, but most people you feel take it for granite. Maybe it's a blindspot that you feel contemporary society has, or some timeless lesson that people have forgotten. That thing that burns you up and wrenches your heart. Write about that and don't only write your perspective. Write about more than one side. And you don't necessaril have to write litetally about it but getting close thematically could be just a great.

>>22118774
this is sort of where my head is at. but i'm cycling through concepts and trying to pair them up with something relatable.

anyone have any advice for formatting paragraphs and dialouge etc?
I write a lot but they are mostly just long walls of text like this because I just don't really get formatting lol, any advice would be appreciated.

is this good? or should i take less breaks, do i need a line between every line of dialogue or is it a bit excessive. For context this short story takes place during a house party and Jez is out buying mixers halfway through it at a servo. Sry for the dumb names i just couldn't think of any so i did random ones. More concerned about the formatting really than the prose which ik isn't that great rn because i haven't edited it at all lol.

>>22118807
Open a book. That's how you fix formatting. Your problem is that you read too much reddit and this you're used to online paragraph blocks. If you're doing a webnovel then fine, but it's jarring to read on a book.

>>22118800
That's okay to still try to understand it. But doing writing exercises can help clarify your ideas. Ask yourself questions about what you care about and why. Your answers may surprise you, they often do for me once they are out of my head and on to a page. From there it is refining what things you need to express yourself.

>>22118811
i read a lot and I understand but I can't really figure out how to replicate it + i feel as though word isn't really that great for it either, should i try longhanding stuff?

>>22118820
my only problem is that im a terrible handwriter and seem to be able to concentrate and write for longer on word etc. need to make a writing space or whatever

>>22118820
It's called an indent. What did they teach you I'm grade school? New paragraph, indent

>>22118862
they taught me line breaks lol

>>22118820
>I can't really figure out how to replicate it
just look at it and parse the information for patterns like your brain was designed to do

I love morphine and its derivatives but I don't want to be one of those writers. Thoughts?

>>22118871
alright i'll study more novels formatting then, just figured someone would have experienced similar problems

>>22118883
you could also google "US novel formatting guide" or similar for authoritative sources

>>22118892
yeah i've been reading them and they are pretty helpful. Don't know why i never learned any of this

>post new chapter on Royal Road
>Wake up this morning
>Only 12 views
>Failure failure failure!
RR isn't good for my mental health.

>>22117201
Awful title, good prose.

>>22118892
think this was a productive use of /lit/, this formatting is a lot better

Why shouldn’t I open with a character waking up is there something intrinsically bad about it or is it just that it’s cliche is there anything specific about waking up that should be avoided I love nigger dick

>>22119082
No reason just over done. But I also think random action scenes, sword fight, finding a corpse are over done, but people still use it.

The best opening is clearly an action where the hero does something we all can relate to. My MC is taking a massive shit.
>Action
>Relatable
>Unique

It's a girl too so it also checks the fetish box.

I am laughing at my own jokes as I write

>>22119169
Same. I am frequently amazed at my middling level genius.

>>22112194
Subscribed.
Love it

>>22116341
The wood emerged from cover huh? He drew it taut? Bows are already taut.

>>22117201
yknow this aint too bad. punchy and OK hook

>>22117201
That's awesome you're able to get reviews at 6 chapters. I posted 20 and haven't gotten a single one

>>22112180
11500 words in 3 days, I am slowly making it

Why is my writing at its freest and most soulful whenever I’ve only 5 or maybe 6 hours of sleep, or are otherwise tired? How can I access the same level of tired-focus and a lack of judgement without reducing my lifespan?

>>22119355
Samefake here, 2900-3000 words in an hour, I was quickly making it.

>>22118883
'Novel' means 'new': It is up to you to format in a new way.

>>22119638
Brainstorm in small sessions throughout the day and by the time you are ready to write, you will have a lot to say. Also some of that feeling just comes with experience and confidence.

>>22118345
>perhaps did a degree in English
I'm buying a couple books over the summer. I'd got myself down on what were popular or the obvious choices, but it sounds fun to expand my knowledge even if I have no greater ambitions.

>>22119638
I do most of my writing when I'm tired, but it has to be end of the day tired. When my nephew wakes me up after only four hours of sleep so he can play on my PC I'm fucked for the rest of the day.

>>22119701
Despite that comic it is staggering how illiterate my friends and coworkers and bosses are.

>>22119730
Are you familiar with this thing called irony?

>>22119803
Ironically, no.

>>22119803
It's the stuff they put in spinach

>>22117201
Honestly was a more than ready to read a pile of shit, but you're about as enjoyable a read as Sanderson (and I like him.) Your characters are fleshed out and the plot is intriguing. Feel like the gay stuff at the end may be shoehorned but also it feels natural at the same time.

My story sucks ass and now I need to rewrite everything. Even reddit hates it.

How much criticism do you guys take into consideration? Seems like the more criticism I consider, the more the story becomes cookie cutting

>>22120018
>posts on reddit
what, /lit/ ain't good enough for you?

>>22120022
take everything with a grain of salt

>>22120026
Lit and reddit are the same users

>>22120022
I dunno, I wrote a fantasy story about a bunch of cops and the complaint just baffles me
>Bunch of cops get a case to investigate
>Nothing is happening!
Then they suggest cops needed to immediately find a dead body, be in a shootout, someone dies etc. Aren't all cop stories better with some set up? Or do people now want immediately thrust into the crime?

>>22120096
yes. drop them immediately into the crime scene and then introduce the members of the investigation later

>>22120022
4chan's useful in that it teaches you how to filter feedback. You should try greentexting what they're saying and see if it helps in parsing what their damage is and if it is indeed useful. Pic unrelated.

>>22120022
I'll never take a suggestion I get from a reader
in fact, I knee-jerk to assume that whatever they suggest is wrong and I should do the opposite

>>22120110
>>22120157
Welp time to delete an entire chapter. And fill things in with shit loads of flashbacks

>>22120173
>flashbacks
Have some dignity

>>22120179
No can do. Readers want to know about dead characters and anime writing such as Demon slayer uses shitloads of flashbacks to world build. And people eat it up. I need good reviews and readers that'll praise and adore me.

>>22120173
just repurpose the scenes/dialogue to a future chapter

>>22120022
I don't get a lot of criticism to begin with (probably because of the etiquette of where I post) but people say you should pay attention to people's reactions while ignoring their suggestions.
If people complain that's a sign that something went wrong but they're probably too clueless about the craft of writing and your intentions to figure out what the real problem is and how best to solve it. It could be a matter of managing their expectations better. (And sometimes there's nothing you can do.)

>>22120096
The way you present the case in the first chapter doesn't really inspire curiosity. The knights treat it as run-of-the-mill unremarkable, with a few oddities that'll surely sort themselves out. And intellectually I know that they're wrong because this is the start of a story, but emotionally I have little reason to doubt them.
It could use more foreboding, a nagging sense that something is off. (The knights don't even have to experience this, though it's fine if they do.) You can do this by adding a poignant detail, or by juxtaposing the case with something that the knights talk about but don't think is related, or maybe even by magnifying what you already have, lingering on some part of the description and pulling out your best prose to discomfort the reader and make it stick.
Watch out if the hook is supernatural because this is a supernatural world that the reader doesn't know very well yet. You have to somehow make sure the reader understands on a gut level that it doesn't belong, even though they don't know the limits of the consensus world yet.

>>22120173
You can go that route, it might be the easiest way to hook the reader. (Easy is good.)
But all you really need is a hook and there are multiple ways to go about that. It's best to avoid flashbacks if you can.

>>22120022
I look at what people say, and then I see if it actually means anything.
Sometimes people can make suggestions that do actually make sense, but sometimes someone is too stupid to give good suggestions or they are someone who fails to differentiate between what they like and what is good.

>>22120096
>>22120197
(Mind though that I haven't read the rest of your story, I'm just making assumptions based on the first chapter.)

>>22120197
>I don't get a lot of criticism to begin with (probably because of the etiquette of where I post)
Where is this? I must know...

>>22120173
a lotta flashbacks aint good either -- whats in them thats so important

>>22120199
The first chapter is clearly a problem. I may do what the other anon said and cannibalize the first chapter into different parts of other chapters. There's another anon that suggested it's best to write to market. Especially in a genre that encourages expectations and norms of a genre.

>>22120222
I think I figured it out.thanks anons. Enough bitching and complaining really activates those almonds

>>22120211
AO3, fan fiction, probably majority-female.
I haven't studied other communities so take this with a grain of salt. But I can think of a few explanations:
- "Don't like, don't read" is in the water supply. The etiquette was built up over multiple decades and now it's an implicit understanding.
- Because the standard organization is by fandom and not by genre and the website is ultra-permissive, even in a single page of stories there's variety along every axis. There's rape porn and cutesy fluff, there's self-serious pondering and overdone shitposts, there's unreasonable crossovers, comics, stories in Italian, finished stories under 500 words and unfinished ones over 100,000. And most of them are bad. It's hard to be picky under those conditions.

>>22112180
test

https://www.foxnews.com/world/scantily-clad-witches-caught-munching-deer-carcass-bizarre-security-cam-footage


This can be turned into a novel

>>22119082
>Why shouldn’t I open with a character waking up

Because that's not a normal time for things to be happening. If you start taht early, what else are you going to do? Talk about him brushing his teeth, taking a shit, taking a shower? Do you think people care about that?

Surely the story does not begin when the guy wakes up. It begins when smoething happens.

>>22120173
Deleting is always good, but you don't necessarily need flashbacks. You can just use allusions and rely on teh reader to make assumptions (allusions in dialogue work especially well). Sometimes you can even leave things mysterious and unexplained

>>22112736
Every time you post a new chapter it'll be visible to everyone who visits the frontpage of the site until it gets "bumped" off. It's one of the easier ways to find stuff to read there if you really like LitRPG/Isekai/Reincarnation/Time Loop gloop.

>>22112180
I'm writing a book with three main characters (already changed the format a few times, briefly the main character was a police detective, then basically Batman/Mike Haggar, then finally a P.I.).

The problem is I want to introduce the three main characters early on and its just a long prose of worldbuilding for the three of them. The first is the main character (independently wealthy private investigator), the secondary main character, basically a 4chan shitposter with no friends, and an attractive, autistic shut-in woman whose life dramatically changed after a car accident.

I'm thinking about opening the novel with vignettes of them so you can tell what their character traits are like. Is that a bad idea or good one?

>>22112180

>>22112736
>>22120509
I'm not totally sure what's going on here...
>cue the seething brainlet anon who takes this as proof that I claim to be totally sure what's going on
>because "everyone knows", and ChatGPT agreed with him
...but it seems that many people read the new chapter when it shows up on the "recent" list, instead of starting at the beginning.
This suggests that anything posted on RoyalRoad has to follow the "serial" format, i.e. the one that was popular in American theaters in the 1910s through 1950s.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_film_serials
For one thing, it was possible to miss earlier episodes and still find enough reasons to be interested in the current episode.
The content tended to be thrilling and action-packed.
And, of course, each episode ended with a cliffhanger, to motivate the viewers to come back next week.
Seems like it's worth studying this older form of popular fiction if one wants to write stories that'll be popular on RoyalRoad.
Picrel is available on LibGen.

Like Stories, Want to Write Story.
>No Motivation
>Infinite Outlining
>Outlines of Outlines
>No Plot Ideas
>Struggle to even write a character
>Cant finish one sentence
>Throw away weeks of work, only 3 fucking sentences and 5 pages of character templates
Its been 5 years of this, Writer bros how do you do it?

>>22121038
what does your outline look like?

>>22121038
fill out a character questionnaire that requires an internal misunderstanding of the world, a fear, a goal they can't yet reach, and all that shit. you'll come up with something.

>>22121038
you need clear goals and confidence. how? let me know when you figure it out

>>22121047
It changes each time i rewrite it, but most of the time its the 7 point story structure
>Hook, Plot Point, Pinch, Mid Point, Pinch, Plot Point. Resolution

>>22121048
I do have one, but it just feels like im filling out bullet points instead of making a functonal story character. Then again I suppose it wouldn't be a character until you write a scene with them eh?
>>22121049
Yeah I know but its hard to get those

>>22121057
if you can't fill it out and get something functional that you want to write about, you need to read more and talk to more people.

>>22121069
Oh I can fill it out with most characters. the issue is actually taking it and putting it to a draft really

>>22120971
Oh, and inb4 "but muh art":
Ian Fleming (author of the "James Bond" series) once described how to write a thriller.
>I have a charming relative who is an angry young littérateur of renown. He is maddened by the fact that more people read my books than his. [...] I asked him how he described himself on his passport. “I bet you call yourself an Author,” I said. He agreed. [...] “Well, I describe myself as a Writer. There are authors and artists, and then again there are writers and painters.”
>[...] [I]f you decide to become a professional writer, you must, broadly speaking, decide whether you wish to write for fame, for pleasure or for money. I write, unashamedly, for pleasure and money.
Read more here:
https://lithub.com/ian-fleming-explains-how-to-write-a-thriller/

>>22121053
try this for an outline: one chapter, one page.

>Chapter 1:
>Bella is in the car with her mom going to the airport. She's going to live with her dad in Forks, Oregon. She's not happy about it.
>In Forks, her dad picks her up in an old red pickup and gives it to her. Bella is such a stuck up bitch she sarcastically thanks him for gifting her a goddamn car. Her dad is a loveable idiot and thinks she's genuinely thankful.
>Forks is a rainy depressing fucking town. Bella goes to school and all her classmates are idiots who talk about stupid bullshit and she doesn't connect with any of them.
>Blah blah blah blah blah...

When you finish an outline this style, you finish your first draft. Don't think about prose, don't worry about the dialog, just get down how each chapter starts and ends and whatever's in the middle.

>>22121083
Alright Ill give it a go

>>22119169
>write "jokes" as I write
>think its comedy gold
>rereading its just discount gintama
>cringe
>start over

>>22120022
Most people lack fundamental knowledge of writing and storycraft, so they give a review based if their exceptions are met. If you meet theirs, they praise it, if not they shit on it and point out what upset them. Then you have those people who make the review about their ego and how they are smart or moral. Or the guy who takes your idea then make their own story out of it. In my opinion the internet, speacily youtube has destroyed the value of reviews, as everyone thinks they are the "expert".

I think you should only care what your target audience wants and provide it, as most will like it and not comment. Unless you really fucked up.

Characters A and E are friends in the first half of the story, then become enemies in the second half, how should I break up the exposition for each in the second half

>start with A, lead up to the final confrontation, go back to E, lead up to the finale confrontation and then depict it
That is ÆÆÆÆÆ AAAF EEEF

Or
>a bit of A a bit of E a bit of A a bit of E etc
That is ÆÆÆÆÆ AEAEAE F

I feel like people hate when something big like the finale is telegraphed and then the story goes back in time to give context to something else and taking a while to get back to the finale, but that also helps keeps twists under wraps and maintain mystery about the second character for longer

>>22121038
I go sentence by sentence. The turtle aint got shit on me.

>>22121141
The first one works way better for a written story, the second is cumbersome and annoying. Either way, stop caring what people think. The finale is yours and yours alone

>1.2ktoday.
>side character narrative just came from nowhere.
We are all gonna make it.

Hey, I got my first bot post on my fiction. So that is cool.
Anyway, I've written over 2000 words, and I've started on another chapter. I went back on royalroad to get ready to upload my chapter for tomorrow after I edit it.

>>22120971
Nothing wrong with learning from film serials but you're talking as if they invented the concept. Serializing literature is an old tradition. Even works by greats like Dickens and Melville and Nabokov were originally published serially.
Maybe try The Pickwick Papers first.

>>22120760
>3 main characters
>1 actual main character with a job that makes him go out into the world
>2 shut ins
what value do the other 2 bring? even if there is value, it seems like they'd have a bunch of overlap
>I'm thinking about opening the novel with vignettes of them so you can tell what their character traits are like. Is that a bad idea or good one?
this is a bad idea because it doesn't advance the plot, nor does it show them interacting with each other. you can flesh out your characters while advancing the story.

How do you write an intense scene without being edgy? I want the character to show the audience that he is accustomed to a high pain threshold but don't want it to sound like I'm trying to flaunt it. The characters in the scene are also assholes to each other, so there's no way to lighten the scene there.

>>22115391
https://youtube.com/watch?v=4c1sgug6prw&feature=share8

>>22121354
Film serials seemed closer in spirit to how RoyalRoad readers consume writing, so I thought they'd be most relevant.
Having said that...The Pickwick Papers looks relevant, too.

>>22121732
On first approximation there's nothing new under the sun. There are limits, but they're further out than you might think—the first gamelit I read was published in 1981 (Dream Park), and I bet you could find a lot of resonance between isekai escapism and the escapism Cervantes (~1600) poked at. Modern fujo fangirls recap debates held in ancient Athens.
People haven't changed very much. If something appeals to people now they were probably already doing it way back when it first became logistically feasible. Particularly popular art, snobby art has self-conscious dynamics that produce more change over time.
It's good to look outside your medium but it's vital to look inside it.

Guys ... Writing a gamelit story that takes off on RR really isn't that hard.

Oh god I haven't written in days and I have no motivation to do more I'm so fucked I'm so fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucked

>>22120971
I think it's mostly people clicking on the latest chapter when they meant to click on the title. And no, I don't think that serial formats are popular on Royal Road but you would benefit the most by shitting out chapters very regularly and thus gaining the most exposure possible from the "Latest Updates" page.

>>22120293
honestly i'm doing fanfiction too and it's pretty wild. part 1 of my story is pretty much LotR. part 2 is a murder mystery. you can do anything and I don't have to worry about what agents think.

meanwhile if you can string a paragraph together coherently everyone is grateful and you'll be beloved just for good SPAG.

>Have no motivation
>Take brain sups
>Suddenly start writing
huh

>>22122084
>Take brain sups
like wut

>>22121891
tfw realizing that I wasted my 20s by being addicted to fast food which killed all my motivation

>haven't written or read anything in three weeks
>"I'll do it tomorrow for sure"

>>22122089
The usual stuff, Fish oil, lion mane, theanine, choline, tyrosine, caffeine(unironically) Vit d b, bacopa. If it's them or good ol' place-elbow is irrelevant. It works for me

>>22122109
>lion mane
I've been taking that. I can't tell if it's working or not. Also I've seen people bashing fish oil now

>>22122094
>addicted to fast food
wut

>>22122121
my eye doctor recommended fish oil. it actually works. idk if it's neurotropic but it's good for what ails you.

>>22122127
>feel depressed
>go get a cheeseburger
>lie down on the couch and watch tv
>non-alcoholic fatty liver disease by 25
I'm fixing it, though

>>22122161
I could go for a big mac right now, but fast food gives me acne

>>22122127
I assume stress eating, it's not specifically the fast food part that's damaging. Though I can't imagine it helps.

Unbaked Bread
>>22122196
>>22122196
>>22122196
>>22122196

>>22122097
you cannot build a writing habit by not writing

>>22121554
>Have him no-sell the pain, better have a good reason why physically the blow wouldn't have stopped him, due to armor etc
>adrenaline so after whatever happen he then takes stock
>have the assholeness of the characters play into it and have him internally go over pain while struggling(?) to keep a straight face

>>22121827
Then please share your secrets, O Learned One.
After all, you're not a pseud, are you?

>>22121438
>what value do the other 2 bring? even if there is value, it seems like they'd have a bunch of overlap
They start out as shut-ins, by the end they're out saving the city.