/lit/ - Literature

>>22011137
>thread theme
OP is a fag

>>22011137
Dude can you FUCK off with the AI shilling opening posts? This shit is a fucking eyesore

just pretend this painting is the OP. it will all be ok

>>22011152
>ai shilling
Who is shilling anything? It’s a fucking picture you stupid half-wit. Why do you think anyone is trying to get you to do ANYTHING by just posting that picture?
Go outside for an hour, right now. Touch fucking grass tou stupid shit

>>22011175
Stop making threads with AI art, how about you do that? Lurk for a few weeks and download some images you like from other posters. Or just stop making the threads. AI art looks like absolute garbage and you're completely obnoxious

>>22011152
What did you write today friend?

You did write your 2000 daily words today, right /wg/?

>>22011181
>he disagreed with me so he must have made the thread!
Anon i...

>>22011181
>stop making threads with ai art
1, didn’t make the thread
2, no. make me. kys.
3, write something you stupid bitch. no one cares that you’re mad and useless

>>22011145
I know we sometimes get pseudo academics in these threads, but how can one not understand and appreciate the simplistic genius of cookie monsters prose? I mean that is like saying one does not enjoy Puddi?!

>>22011196
>AI slop

the AI threads are ugly. nobody wants to see uncanny valley faces with a superfluous amount of wrinkles on them. It was better when I used to make the threads a few years ago. I only chose paintings, pictures, and landscapes for the OPs and no one complained

When was the last time we had a good Big Foot/Sasquatch short story or novel? I feel like he's pretty underused compared to other crpytids in literature

Today, what did you learn about the craft of writing, /wg/?

>>22011341
That prose, style, and conventions mean absolutely nothing. Litrpgs and random webnovels are king and the biggest books today. Copy them they're the new masters

>>22011283
Painting actually suit the concept of these threads. AI generated Trump and abominations like >>22011137 don't have ANY relation to the idea of writing, quite the opposite really. Don't know why OP has insisted in making almost every new thread with AI shart

>>22011341
The book I'm reading is doing some meta-fuckery I'd never seen or considered, with enough buildup and subtletly and taste to pull it off. I'll have to read more but it's making me think thoughts.

>>22011341
the mass of mediocrity overshadows the finesse of substance.

>>22011346
Glad the pseuds are finally learning.

>>22011283
>nobody wants to see uncanny valley faces with a superfluous amount of wrinkles on them.
Yet the fact that is created and re-posted debunks this.
>It was better when I used to
Oh i see.

>>22011346
"And here, class, we're going to discuss the great authors of the 21st century. This is the first lecture of Englando-101. Can someone tell me what litrpg stands for? No, Jimmy, it's not literature VR-game, and for Nature's sake Jimmy, change out of that horse avatar while in class."

>>22011372
AI art has allowed a lot of new authors to be able to make their own covers instead of having to pay five hundred + dollars to have one or not at all.

>>22011424
then it's the artist who isn't making any money dumb fuck, you just relocated the unemployment somewhere else

>>22011408
Let's analyze the story, Wandering Inn. In the first paragraph, we see the author repeat "morning" three times, but with different capitalization. A clear showcase of volume increasing a masterful show of literature helping the reader for clarity of volume from one character to another.

>>22011137
How do I write a song for my story like Tolkien did if I don't have any knowledge of songwriting or poetry?

>>22011398
just because you take a shit on a plate and then post it online doesn't mean anyone wants to see it

>>22011283
Make the threads again please. Current OP has an insufferable personality

>>22011459
You learn about songwriting and poetry first.
Or you spend a lot of time to make something that's maybe sort of okay. If you want to wing it, make sure to pay close attention to meter (number and stress of syllables) and to use a rhyme dictionary. And know that it's very labor-intensive. It can be fun, worth the experience even if you don't end up with a usable end product.
Or maybe you can have ChatGPT or some other LLM do it? Verse is one of the things they're relatively good at for whatever reason. But if you do it all yourself you can have appropriate little twists and flourishes that the language model couldn't possibly know to add.

>>22011424
Doesn't mean they don't look like shit, moron. Better off use stock images than generated slop

What a fun argument, I hope we continue it for the rest of the thread

>>22011488
This has really inspired me, I think I'm going to look into this stuff and it could help me spice up the story with more songs than just the one if I end up enjoying it. Either way, I think it could be interesting. I plan to have the song come up later on, so I've got some time until I have to worry about researching that stuff.

My idea is to write the story of Genghis Khan but have dragons and other mythical beings. Sounds great huh?

>>22011693
No. Sounds like shit. Hurr I am big angry barbarian. Me kill empire, me rape woman, me am strong!

>>22011693
So youre too daft to write a nuanced interesting story and you just paste dragons on as a crutch
sffg needs death by firing squad

>>22011736
Yes. As well as feeding his enemies to griffins. There's no need for a factual story about Ghengis it's been done. So instead of bows on horses, the Mongols hurled fireballs and lightning bolts while riding their horses through the air.

>>22011751
but fantasy schlock hasn't already been done

i hate humanity, honestly i want to kill you all. god can't send another flood but maybe i can convince him for an ice age or nuclear winter.

Why do I feel the urge to write a novel about the process of writing, when that's the most clichéd subject of all time?

>>22011346
I feel like if you genuinely enjoyed reading good writing then you'd want to study and understand it regardless of whether it brought you Webnovel Numbers. But if you only ever saw it as a kind of fancy packaging to give your story an aura of prestige then perhaps I see where you're come from, even if the place you're coming from is a dismal unimaginative pit.

>>22011814
Writing is unimportant. The only thing that matters is results. Quantitative results from the adoration of others.

>>22011167
I love dis almost as much as i love cookies! *Gives you a cookie for your art*

What's with the one anon seething so hard about genre fiction for weeks straight now? Did a webnovel author fuck his gf or something?

>>22011666
Good luck! You have to get really intense about word choice, it's enlightening.
I didn't write fully original verse, just a translation of a poem and new lyrics for an old song. I think that was a good place to start. It gave me a baseline: I could sound out my work and compare it to the original and puzzle out what worked and what didn't. I didn't do a lot of prior research, just enough to know what meter was so I could scrutinize it.

>>22011923
Do you have any recommendations for where I should begin reading up on how to write this stuff? Any good websites?

>>22011167
based

>>22011940
I think I puzzled it together from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metre_(poetry) and high school Greek and https://www.howmanysyllables.com and https://rhymezone.com and repeating phrases out loud and experimenting.
In general I write and learn by putting down words by intuition and then messing with them until I understand how to make them come out right. This is not the best method for everyone and it might not even be the best method for me. So I bet there's a better introduction but I wouldn't know.
Having examples to look at for reference is always helpful.

>>22011693
I lub dis!

>>22011137
So not to show you up. But my a.i. painted this and not only do i think its better but obviously my a.i. IS ONE OF US! (I only told him gets a cookie and to give me a self portrait receiving it. he put out the anon reference! I accept him!)

>>22011980
This looks like shit. Do you guys really spend time just generating these images?

Editorchad is open for business

2000 words of 4chan posts a day. Damn man is this really my life now

Anyone here ever gotten a look at a slush pile? I want to know exactly how bad the stuff my manuscript will be thrown in with is.

>>22012046
Yeah, what's your manuscript look like?

>>22012046
>slush pile
they're digital now

>>22012046
Yeah. The truth is that the stuff there isn't bad. It just doesn't stand out.

>>22012046
I spent a semester reading submissions for my school's lit mag and >>22012068 is mostly true. The only exception I remember was a rambling, schizophrenic story about aliens or something that was so bad/good I made sure to save it even though we weren't supposed to. Hopefully I still have it somewhere.

what do I use as filler? landscape and scene descriptions?

>>22012241
Graphic descriptions of bowel movements

>>22011479
>this general personified.
I used to think that anon screeching about crabs was wrong. Now i'm not so sure.

>>22011444
Do you think the same way about the introduction of the calculator, type writer, the personal computer, auto correction or ease of internet access removed the large majority of humanities need for physical notation?

>>22012275
I have no debts, the human monetary system does not concern me

god i have the best fucking dialogue right now. it's so good. the problem is that this book is going to take me so long to write. FUCK. i spend all day making friends with these captivating, flawed, tragic people, and then i send them to die.

>>22012359
That sounds familiar. I've just spent ages creating an amazing crew for a sailing ship my protagonist is travelling on. I loved writing their backstories and the character interactions just flowed. I originally planned for them to drop off the hero and be on their way to maybe turn up later in the story. But nope, now that I'm far into the journey it has become clear the best thing for the story is to crash the ship and kill them all.

>>22011985
its OP samefagging

>>22011693
Include a gratuitous amount of rape and I'll read it anon

I'm gonna finish reading "I Pray to the Hungry God" tomorrow so I will let /wg/ know how it is. It's been a while since Nesmer posted that first chapter for it but I will say so far his style is still dark and gritty, but there are far less awkward paragraphs in this one compared to Eggplant so I think he's getting better.

Tips on doing a duel narrative short story?

>>22012538
>duel narrative

>>22012547
shit

>>22012520
You are a gentleman and a scholar

I've been working on my first novel for over 4 years. I don't know how people put their writing out there. I'm terrified of vulnerability.

Anyone use a typewriter? I'm wondering if a high quality restored typewriter is "worth it"

>>22012591
Why not get a different keyboard for your computer? Keep in mind there are also programs that will delete your work if you stop typing and I'm sure there's a program there that has no backspace, if that is what you want.

>>22012591
just type nigga lmao

>>22012571
You close your eyes and toss it out

>>22012596
I've tried a few of those apps, they are good for getting stream of conscious down, but they have an inherent must-be-revised quality to everything I've written with them.
The ones I looked at were very nice but $300, and I could spend this on more important things, but not necessarily highly important things. Writing is highly important to me as well.
>>22012610
There are many authors who refused computers because they still did better work on typewriters.

>>22012617
My muscle memory gets messed up for at least a week when I have to get a new keyboard. So I use the same generic logitech model keyboard I use at work so there's no issues.

>>22012571
>working on a novel for 4 years
I hope it's really long

>>22012617
>they did better work on typewriters
are you 50+ years old? no? I dunno about that typewriter meme bro

>>22012571
It's very easy now that you can be pseudonymous online. But yeah, if my name were attached to it, I would never show my writing unless I was certain of its quality.

Where did /wg/ get the number 2000 for a daily word count goal?

>>22012804
Is it from novel november?

>>22012840
The math works out to 1666 words a day if you're aiming for 50k, so that's not it either.

Am I autistic for writing like this:
>I write an outline of my story.
>I divide it into chapters.
>Let's say I have 14 chapters
>I then write out about a half a page long summary of what happens in each chapter.
>Now that I the novel planned out, I start expanding the chapters more.
>I randomly pick what chapter I work on.
>I write the dialogue out in a stage play style, with character names, and what they say.
>Then I write the prose around the dialogue.
And there you go, I have my first draft done.

>>22012940
So long as it works for you, I wouldn't say that's autistic. The question is, have you fully finished a novel doing this before?

>>22011175
post your hook nose

>>22012484
Do not lie anon.
>he used a webshite to do his.
Also editing text sucks
>i wonder when a viable writing AI will be released so i can keep pace with esl sweat shoppers.

>>22013054
samefagging samefag samefags
a tale as old as 4channel.org

>>22012979
>have you fully finished a novel doing this before?
Yes.

>>22013064
if i was trying to gaslight (you) anon i would at least insult (you)r writing and (you)r mother .

>>22013054
who are you greentexting?

>>22012940
This is the snowflake method, no?

>>22013166
No, I don't think so. I just love having every single little detail planned out, beforehand.

>>22011803
Maybe you should write about writers that write about other writers.

>>22012046

>>22011803
more than cliche, it's dreadfully dull and navelgazing. it's even worse than a hollywood film about a filmmaker making a hollywood film because at least in those everyone is beautiful and photogenic, whereas writers are just self important, self absorbed misanthropes.

>>22013243
Bet you 80 dollars there's a citizen Kane level script buried somewhere there.

>>22013262
No doubt.
When AI-text-to-video gets good enough, we'll see these screenplays on YouTube.

Hey real me,

It's me, the husk. Where are you in all of this?

When you left I always thought you'd be back some day, but now the lights are going dim, and you said you'd only be gone a little while but you've gone a long time. I don't know how to do anything here without you. I don't know how to write, or how to cook, or how to program, or how to get a job. I'm not creative the way you were... the way you are? Because you're still there aren't you? You're still alive somewhere out there in the great darkness and I just can't see you or hear you because you're so far away?

Look at me, I'm talking to the dead, to the empty space where you used to stand, still telling myself that you'd come back one day because I know deep down you're gone but I can't accept it because I know for certain I can't do it on my own.

Your mother misses you too don't you know that? She acts like I'm you, just less confident, just a little bruised. He's her little boy, and she's so confident you're still there, you're still a part of me, and she pours her heart out giving me all this love, but her little boy is dead so she plays pretend with his shadow.

Dad knows by the way. [Step-mother] knows too. They can both tell I'm not just you with a little extra damage. They try to provide for me out of a sense of responsibility, but they don't love me the way they did for you. Even when I hug them, even when we say "I love you" at the end of a call we don't mean it, because I was never the one they loved, and now that you're gone I'm just the burden that came attached to you at the hip, and it shows. They'd keep me chained to the radiator if it was legal, but it's not so they do what society asks of them, even if they don't like it.

Me, I think I'm going to keep hanging on. Not because I want to, and not because I think you're ever coming back. Mom, for all her delusions continues to show me more love than I ever deserved, and I accept it, not because I feel good taking it from her, but because I love her, and I know she gives it all because she needs even more back. So I'll stay. I won't run off to find you in the one place I've always known you are. I'll be there for her until eventually she vanishes too. Dad and [Step-mother] will be able to manage on their own, but not me. I'll go with her. We'll look for you there together, and when we find you I hope we'll find that things between us will be the same as they ever were.

Until we see each other again,
The Husk

>>22012046
I was a reader at Lions Gate and Regency. Everything gets rejected. Everything. All the time.
>living in LA
>talking to another reader
>he tells me that one time he came across this really great script
>action, adventure, philosophical, romantic subplot, great pacing, hits three core demographics, the script had everything
>so he sticks his neck out and says, we have to option this script
>he gets fired. On the spot.
>that very same script gets picked up at Warner Bros a year or two later and made into a film. You've probably heard of it. It's called The Matrix
Nepotism rules Hollywood. You want to make movies? Either make like Jonah Hill and befriend Dustin Hoffman's kids, or get cracking on an independent film as far away from Hollywood as possible.

>>22013099
my new friend green text is actually an implication not a quotation.
>(you) are after (you)'s

>>22013644
>OP cannot live without having semen injected into him via IV.

2 more chapters edited lads.
Believe in your self.
And something may be remotely within your far-sight!

>>22013054
You're retarded and this looks like shit.

>>22014244
Your jealousy is palpable.
Your hatred of AI-generated images is based solely on how much it threatens you.
Nothing more.

So the truth comes out. OP shills AI crap just to demoralise writers.

/wg/ has been worse than usual lately. How do you propose we fix this?

>>22014268
The demoralization is all in your head.
Generative AI is here, and the genie can't be put back in the bottle.
Seething about it accomplishes nothing.
And I'm not OP.

>>22014289
Be the change you wish to see in /wg/.
Stop being so passive, expecting others to do the work.

>>22014289
Tell us some reasons why you think it's been worse lately and we'll break them down and work from there.

I like writing and I don't think I'm good at it. Is there a site where I can send my shitty writing and other people will read it knowing it's sub par drivel and share their own trashy crap? I want an echo chamber aware enough of what it is.

>>22014289
remove the two AI shillers who are trolling the general

>>22014338
Seething "anons" from reddit came here and began consensus cracking to make it more like Reddit. Thus the crabs in a bucket feeling. Then there is a big divide among everyone about ai, any mention of it results in hardcore seething.
No one helps unless there are dragons or wizards or magic in your writing.
I haven't posted here on a normal basis since last summer.

>>22013644
>my new friend green text is actually an implication
Then how come when you highlight text from a post, then hit the post number to reply, it automatically puts the highlighted text in green text into your response?
Seems like it's both and, of the two, implying is the most obnoxious and pointless way to add to discussion.

>>22014341
Yes, submit to &amp magazine on /lit/. Next issue is June or July.

>>22014384
woah, you guys even have a wiki article!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMP_(magazine)

>>22014390
delet this

>>22014358
I'm not trolling.
I'm thrilled I can generate images from text.
You think I can afford $500 for a cover? As if.
And if graphic-artists can be replaced by AI, then they weren't very good to begin with.

>>22014443
which AI do you use?

Has anyone thoroughly researched the publishing industry and become increasingly discouraged about the traditional route? Bad enough my book isn't a great fit for the current market, but I've been reading about how most novelists only get a 5-10K advance and sell 200-500 copies, never earning out to get royalties. What's more, apparently the publishers leave a lot of writers in the lurch to advertise/promote themselves nowadays. Having them handle that part was one of the most appealing points of going traditional for me.

For over a decade I've had the common writer's aspiration of going into a bookstore and holding my book in my hands one day. Yet, now it seems like even if I leap through every hoop and reach that dream, barring a miracle, I'll be left with little to show for it. As if I wasn't depressed enough.

>>22014507
But the counter-point is that you can start other media projects like a podcast and video series. Selfie pubbing can lead you to places.

>>22014507
Honestly, self-publishing seems like the way to go these days.

>>22014443
Only actual sub 80 IQ tastlets think this shit looks good. No one would even consider reading a book with an AI art cover, especially since it shows the author is partial to slop

>>22014507
>most novelists only get a 5-10K advance
Most debut novelists are lucky to get a 2k advance. But yea I agree it's more economical to just learn some of the basic skill of book design/layout and do it yourself at this point.

>>22014524
>start other media projects like a podcast and video series
You basically have to do this in either case to get attention since the publisher isn't gonna do shit to advertise you besides emailing a few bloggers/setting up ARC anyway which is just another skill you can do yourself and probably better than they would. I suppose a publisher who really likes you might get you reviewed by a major booktuber or something.

Just hit 100 favorites on my royalroad story. Numbers go up.

What percentage of self published books even get read? It's gotta be less than 1%. If you guys ever bought a self published book?

>>22014601
I bought one from here. Call of the Crocodile

>>22014591
What's your story? I only have 5 favorites

>>22014601
Yes, and every single one of them that I knew was self-pubbed was terrible. I've probably enjoyed self-pubbed books that I didn't know were self-pub, but the trend remains.

>>22014631
What makes self published worse than traditional publishing?

>>22014628
How long have you been posting?

>>22014648
2weeks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fo9CQT3hXu8

>>22013563
No wonder everything produced in america is garbage.
Know anything about the novel market?

>>22014647
Propensity to be adversarial with the reader. They subvert tropes without improving on them. They lampshade plot developments as 'mandatory'. And they generally fail completely at one or more pillars of story, such as making a character likeable. Indies are shit at that.

Inconsistent tone and style is common too, they get swept up in good ideas that don't blend into the story correctly.

That said, I am not saying trad pub is immune to these issues.

>>22014649
It took me over a year to get to 100, and I never hit Rising Stars. Don't take me as a benchmark.

>>22014647
Every lunatic who thinks they are above criticism can self pub. No gatekeeping. So you get a slew of books that never should have been written, basic SPAG mistakes and borderline illiteracy, cliche-ridden garbage with blown out pacing, things that should have been a lousy fanfiction or a diary, it's just bad. Most people have no business writing. The self pub market is full of uneducated narcissists with an ego larger than Jupiter. none of them have interesting thoughts, they're just egomaniacal normies who have read 3 books in their entire life but think themselves qualified to write a few.

I've gone and looked for my unique subgenre crackfix in the self pub market and it's all unreadable trash. We need some sort of filter, some gatekeeper. I don't think manhattan jewish agents are the answer but we need some quality control.

>>22014647
Most traditionally published books come from people who made an active effort to be part of the editorial world irl and learned from others. Selfpub might be a result of other issues (petty blacklisting or geographical limitations, for example) but it's usually people who refused to connect with others and test themselves with an audience.

>>22014676
What do you mean by connecting with others?

Alright I finished "I Pray to the Hungry God" and I will give a little review for this /wg/ novel that came out last year.
I am still processing the story, especially the ending. It's very intense. But I can say without a doubt O.N. one-upped himself and wrote something better than Eggplant.

>>22014678
Writing workshops, classes, tutelages, programs. It's not that those things make you better, it's that the people doing them are taking steps into being better and getting shit done. If someone couldn't be bothered to listen to other writers as skilled as them (not at all) and letting them comment their work; how much effort are they really putting into being as good as they can be?

If you're work is good enough to sell without a pre-made bussiness structure, then you could had gone to an open mic and read some of it to see if someone cares. You swallow your made up pride and interact with the fancy artsy people to get a chance to work with them on something. You make projects with others in different fields and try to get your name out there.

Spalding Gray still went to workshops after having more than a book published and adapted to a movie. Dan Harmon performed for like under 100 people weekly while being head writer for Community. You don't just write and that's it.

Those things might make your work better, maybe not. But it's trying, and if that's too much chances are proper spellchecking is too much. Again, there are reassons to selfpublish that are totally valid and diferent conditions and all that stuff.

>>22014698
>reviewing your own book

Does anyone notice a pattern with the protagonists in their stories? I recently realized all my short stories center around a male character and all my novels center around a female character.

>>22014708
>if you aren't an extrovert, you're probably not even spellchecking
Well that's a mighty damned leap

>>22014768
>male author
>female protagonist
This never works

>>22014774
why

>>22014769
he is saying you need to put in some hard work to get a good story and to get that good story into the hands of readers, its not enough to bang out half a draft, not market yourself or the work and then call yourself a writer

>>22014678
sucking off jewish and mormon powerbrokers

>>22014769
If you're not willing to go beyond your limits in human interaction chances are you're not putting that much effort in your writing.

>>22014774
tell that to my japanese porn comics

>>22014647
trad published novels will have at least one person other than the author do an editing pass

>>22014798
you can't just say x, therefore y. You post on 4chan, therefore you're probably wearing yellow socks.

Everything I write is such horrible garbage I HAAAAAAAAAAAATE IT

>>22014849
If you're not willing to do extra work then you're not willing to do extra work. It's not an unrelated comparison.

>>22014903
not that anon but your statement is a complete non-sequitir. me and hitler both drank water therefore i am hitler. you are using inductive reasoning not deductive reasoning

>>22014921
inductive and deductive reasonings are both valid. What did you mean by that?

As a general rule people get more chances to be published when they interact more. No one is just getting an agent and making it big. You generate a presence that gives you an extra value. It's part of the work. Even Hemingway networked, it's always been like that.

When someone is already giving up on the work it's natural that they'll be worse than they could be. It's not always the case, I don't want to be an ass to people itt because some are really good and deserve a chance, but it applies to 90% of self published authors.

>>22014858
I love that scene from FLCL. And the reason that you hate your writing is because you have been brainwashed by the pretentious snowflake fags to believe that you must write perfectly all on the first try. Truly strong writing takes many many many many many drafts, and people who act as though they can write a perfect piece on the first try are just lying and faggots trying to give themselves and edge and make others feel like shit. Years of taking college creative writing classes have fooled me into believing this, and it has attempted to destroy my self-worth in so many ways, but then you must realize you never know what's going on behind the other person's paper. They could be having a good writing day by happenstance, they could even be lying on the spot to save their ass and give them an edge of looking good. Long story short, don't let other's writing get you down, as long as you slog through and force yourself to write everyday you will achieve above and beyond desu

>>22014956
this line of thinking was more accurate a decade plus ago. really pre covid.
I'm going to keep mentioning Colleen Hoover because she's such a great example. She is the number one best selling author for last year, and probably the year before and she self published her first several books. I think the first came out in 2012. The trad publishing paradigm where unknown debut authors get chosen out of the stack of manuscripts has largely passed precisely because self publishing is so easy and trad publishers are so averse to risk. What happens now is you have someone like Hoover who was successful on her own, so the publishers came to her with bags of money after the fact so they could publish her future novels.

And regardless of whether you self or trad publish, you still need to beat the proverbial internet street and shill your shit and engage your readers.

>>22014673
The one anon reviewing/wg/ books seems to be finding diamonds in a mound of shit

>>22014708
Want to read my fantasy story and shit on it?

>>22014733
I'm one of the review anons that takes pictures of books on my cherry bookshelf. I've done quite a few so far, I will read yours if it's in paperback. Maybe. Reading Mixtape Hyperborea, Chicken world and BAS next.

>>22014768
All of my protags are on the verge of mental illness but not quite there yet.

>>22014443
don't bother replying to the troll any more anon, he will just keep seething and shit posting if you do.
>>22014858
A fresh set of eyes after a week or longer of being set aside while you work on other stuff may help.
>>22014708
This kind of gate keeping and forced humiliation is not being a writer its social conformity. Not saying my writings fantastic and beyond reproach but i's rather be fucked with a salty fork then have to force myself to listen to a bunch of turtle neck armchairists tear it down while labeling it as a 'rite of passage' to further their own drivel.
Get critique? Sure, but you don't need to walk over glass to do it.

>>22015010
but stories like that are a shot in the dark. What are the chances that YOUR self insert college romance novel will be the one people find? You can take shots in the dark, it's a crime without a victim after all, but if you really want it you have to cover all your bases.

>>22015024
No, I want you to leave your house and go take some random class filled with awful people you'll hate until you learn to network.

>>22015024
Post it

>>22015089
Did you have it make it wojaks?

>>22015063
>a bunch of turtle neck armchairists tear it down while labeling it as a 'rite of passage' to further their own drivel.
did this happen to you?
I'm super sorry you had that experience. That's never been the case for me so I eventually assumed it was some made up scare mongering you hear online. Usually workshops and classes are filled with people just as scared and vulnerable as you doing their best to be liked and understood because they want to dedicate their lives to sharing their ideas and feelings. I'd assume that anyone trying to prove superiority in that context has the lowest selfesteem in the room and move on, but I get that allowing yourself to be vulnerable just to be attacked by a rando can be hurtful.

>>22015094
just reused the /fit/ original, you can still modify it with more lit related faces

>>22015094
we don't deserve to be above wojaks

>>22015089
now, wait a minute, you better not be telling people about the hidden pen benefits. We hide them for a reasson!

>>22015080
>stories like that are a shot in the dark
you're not engaging with my point. trad publishers do not pick unknowns anymore. if you have an in - as in a nepotistic in - by all means go for it. if you don't, the networking you need nowadays is much different from the type of networking hemmingway needed.

>>22015109
oh, yeah, sorry.
yes and no, it depends on your region and stuff. I feel that we now have some new options and some stuff completely lost utility online. But life went back to normal around here, no clue how it went in other places.
For example, workshops. IRL you get the chance to interact with the people, maybe someone's doing something cool and you can help them out or they heard about a project you can join or they present you to someone else who's doing something related to your ideas in another field. Or you do that stuff for them. Zoom workshops don't work for shit, unless you were stuck somewhere and you needed the actual workshop, but that's like 1/4th of the utility it's supposed to have.
Just throwing your work on amazon is a one in a million chance. But I think we agreed on that, you still need to do stuff. A friend works full time six days a week and has a podcast as a hobby, not even interested in monetizing or anything, but I still see him constantly interacting with other podcasts, promoting, scheduling interviews. If you want to have a presence online big enough to live off that you have to work like crazy.

And I feel good old comparing dicks with other writers like Hemingway used to do still works.

>>22015095
We live in different countries i think :(

>>22015080
>No, I want you to leave your house and go take some random class filled with awful people you'll hate until you learn to network.
Done. Phoenix writers workshops at Changing Hands bookstores every month on the third Wednesday.

How many sales did I get? 0. How many people helped me? 0. I did get to pay $20 to listen to a woman talk about creative writing past month and enjoyed a nice sandwich at Panera bread though.

>>22015209

I can make your short story salable for $30

>>22015209
Did you talk with people? Did you sincerely consider how you work was being received? Did you make friends? Remember that you can't like other people if you don't like yourself but you can like yourself if you force yourself to like other people... or something, I don't know. I wish there was some formula to be succesful.

>>22015165
well, the only times I see turtlenecks is people who just finished excercising in the cold and teens hiding hickeys, so we might be.

>>22015220
That is one sexy logo dot png, ngl

>>22015239
Of course I did. I made a friend. Nice old lady. I'm honestly waiting for a legit multi selling publisher to pop in. I hear agents and stuff occasionally pop in for direct queries

>>22014956
>>22014903
>>22014798
>>22014708

See:
>>22007861
Eat shit and die

>>22014903
UNLESS YOU'RE RUNNING OUT TO BE AN ATTENTION WHORE AT CREATIVE WRITING MEETUPS YOU PROBABLY AREN'T EVEN RUNNING SPELLCHECK

get out of here you retarded faggot

I'm doing the notebook challenge. Today I decided to brain dump about the historical fiction I'm working on and I filled up 7 pages over my coffee break. Writing is so fun on days like today.

>>22015344
>I filled up 7 pages over my coffee break
How do people write so much? It took me a week to write 2 pages for my short story

I'M NOT ATTENDING YOUR PAY TO PLAY CREATIVE WRITING WORKSHOP YOU UTTER FAGGOT
I'M NOT ATTENDING THE WRITING GROUP
I'M NOT READING THE SLAM POETRY
I'M NOT GOING TO OPEN MIC NIGHT
I'M NOT STARTING A YOUTUBE CHANNEL
I'M NOT STARTING A TWITTER
I'M NOT GETTING AN MFA
I'M NOT APPLYING AS THE SLUSHPILE MONKEY FOR AN INTERNSHIP
I'M NOT FOLLOWING YOU ON LINKEDIN
I WON'T JOIN YOUR REDDIT
I WON'T JOIN YOUR DISCORD
I WON'T USE TIKTOK
I WON'T BE A LITERARY PROSTITUTE
SEETHE COPE DILATE
DEATH TO AGENTS
DEATH TO NEPOTISTS

>>22015331
You know what, yes.
You have to be an attention whore for people to notice you. You don't get to hide in a corner and wait for someone to fix your life. You know that's not how it works. Suck it up. Clean your room, stand tall and go around showing your work to strangers and helping them out.

>>22015398
Just puking random ideas that you won't read again is easier.

>>22015344
be careful
you get the dopamine hit of getting something done but you didn't actually produce anything.
It's good to get into the habit, don't stop, but also dedicate time to writing something you really want to shine.

>>22015438
if attending a writing workshop in waggletooth, ohio got anyone published, there wouldn't be 10 trillion obese unpublished retards swimming around

kill yourself
mix all the chemicals under your sink and huff it

>>22015398
Restlessness and focus. When I want to write, I keep thinking about my options of what comes next and quickly move on to the next thing if I linger. When I'm not putting in effort I linger a little too long on a few sentences for 30 minutes or more, thinking about thinks that won't really help me write more. But I'm starting to get used to the mindset where I can express the most and fill in the extraneous details later. I dont need to agonize over what day it was or the side character's full name or the reason they ordered a chicken sandwhich or if theyd order a chicken sandwich. If there's a concern I mark it and move on to the next point. Even if there scenes I didnt quite get I have confidence when I get to the ones I do.

>>22015404
NOOOOOOOOOO
you don't understand
you connect with readers by talking to other writers are are also trying to connect with readers
because you have that in common you can be friends!
now pay me $100 to come to my workshop where you'll learn valuable skills like show don't tell passive voice bad and also why going to workshops and networking with other writers is important

>go to novel-cat
>page is entirely 100% smut
why are these lazy fat whores so horny, how many porn books do they need

>>22015457
If hiding in your mom's basement compiling your perfect work got you published we wouldn't have A Confederacy of Dunces.
And I'm gonna live longer than you because my taxes cover my medical bills.

>>22015398
Ayrt, it takes me a full month to finish a short story of ~4,000 words and that's working on it for an hour almost every single day. I'm a perfectionist when I edit, but that's also because I puke up my drafts and I do multiple rounds of revisions. I'm never satisfied, but who is?
>>22015451
Yeah, I get that. For the seeds of ideas to grow into something you have to fertilize with a lot of shit. Tons of it. It just feels good on days like today as opposed to days where it takes me an hour to edit 200 words. I was in editing hell for the past month so I just want to enjoy the good feelings and remember why I love this.

>>22015479
you're asking the wrong question, it should be
>how much smut can I sell to them.
the answer is all of it. Come on, you know you can do it, go and smut them like they've never been smutted before.

>>22015404
This unironically except I wish my agent well.

>>22015479
>novel cat
>hmm let's take a look
>werewolf
>ceo
>billionaire
>billionaire is literally a genre
>the genre is literally called billionaire
LOL
so the site's demographics I'm assuming are like 35-55 year old desperately unhappy women

>>22015479
That's like asking how many porn sites guys need. There's always more horny people.

>>22014972
I'm not doing multiple drafts. Fuck off

>find self published novel with premise nearly identical to something i wrote
>shit bricks
>read it
>it's bad. really, really bad
That was close.

>>22015666
I really doubt my premises are getting inadvertently copied. I am too schizo. The closest one I found defined the conflict very differently to the point it wasn't the same at all.
How close was the one you found? Themes, characters, setting, story beats?

Does having an English Lit degree make me a more attractive writer to publishers/agents ect.? It's from a Uni famous for its English and creative writing department

>>22015802
Theirs was sloppy. It was about the same historical event and characters as mine, essentially, but theirs was poorly written and full of cliches, and he changed the ending to be spec fic instead of pure historical.

So the weird thing with historical is there are three camps: video game and alt history retards, historical romance, or literary historical. he's the first I'm the third. The writing quality on these web published ones is just atrocious. I've yet to see a well written web novel.

>>22015856
where do you web publish literary historical stuff?

>>22015837
did you network extensively? no?
well, then it depends how much "personal" time you put in while getting your degree. when meeting with a potential publisher or agent remember to smile and keep eye contact while working the shaft

Spent all day waging and all I could think about was how great it's gonna be when I get that $300 typewriter.
I think I'm gonna get it bros.

>>22015885
how do I network? My days consist or going to class, cooking dinner, and getting drunk in my room

>>22015917
/wg/ is networking

>>22015917
you interact with other students. Check out what's going on, go to places where you're expected to talk with other people. You have to be nice to a variety of people so your real targets don't feel like you're targetting them.

You want to go for the rich kids pretending the be working class. Those are the ones that will waste daddy's money printing a zine or making a new type of watpad. At the very least they'll sponsor the podcast you do to promote your selfpublished book.

>>22015856
Oh if it's history I can see why. Whenever I write things that refer to ancient myths or other fiction I swap things around so it wont follow the same narrative. I try to find a better one if possible, and at least take a new perspective so if people did end up doing the same thing theyd never tell it the way I do.

>>22015866
A few sites have it as a category but only broadly "historical". You can't preface it with literary because every nitwit and turtledove will call his schlock thus regardless.

>>22015900
You'll get bored and frustrated of it within a week. Save your money, retard.

>>22015917
I network on the internet, talk to professionals I know especially if I am paying them for some service at the time. Just by a couple degrees of separation I've already met several agents, and editor and a screen writer and I barely even tried. I work a full time job then go home and write, reading in the morning and lunch. It's probably shitty advice for me to say "just go to professional events and talk to the cool people until you find one that has what you need also spend a lot of money on grooming and fashion and eventually you will run into rich people doing the same that will give you the hookup." I dont know how to network any other way. I just try to look my best self and people get interested. Networking isnt begging it's a beauty pageant.

>>22015957
Networking is the get rich quick scheme of writing.

>>22013243
This must be why it takes years for them to ever turn a novel into a movie. If you were hoping for that you had better have something to occupy yourself for the next ten years

>please rate.

It has been twenty-seven years since God gifted me out of my mother's womb and ten years since I took up the cross in his service. The Lord's will deemed that the vile be smited from Eden and we the righteous must see to it to cleanse paradisio from all those wicked.

He has entrusted you, Dr. Yoryick, with a vial that would save our souls. I, Joan of the Faith of Holy Cross, from the town of Orleans, pray to you to provide me with one such vial so that I may continue to serve the Lord in his name. It is a calling for you, and a sacrifice for I. There is no refusal, for I have seen your generosity. Visions, as you may define it, but duty for me.

Gifted inside the box accompanying this letter as you can see is a box filled with the heads of those that succumbed to the virus itself. My work isn't to tend to the weak, nor ease the suffering of those afflicted; my devotion is to the purge and return salvation to humanity. None can show mercy to these beasts, and none you will find from I. Hearts beat with every breath, and no hearts were found in the eaters of men. You need not provide me with ammunition, rations, nor blade, for my devotees, the Interitus, the Salus, and the Messorem, protect me from the beings that now wander the Earth.

Insomnia is charity, and I have an abundance of such wonder. A simple consumption of the vial and to fulfil my destiny. I devote to you, and those living in your quarters, the protection necessary to continue God's plan. Perhaps one day I will join you and cast aside the rosary, but for now, my mission calls for me. These monsters know nothing but the language of death, and I will show them death.

I will not appear before you in my saintly gown, but as a shepherd with others clean from infection. Keep the flock quarantined, they will be of service in the future. Under purgatory and the words of Saint Peter, guaranteed safety of your compound exists as long as I draw breath.

>>22016221
>Joan
>fem mc
pass
Otherwise it's a bit stilted in places, and not necessarily in a good way. There are some words you can cut to make it flow better in a number of places. As an example
>The Lord's will deemed that the vile be smited from Eden and we the righteous must see to it to cleanse paradisio from all those wicked.
The Lord deemed that the vile be smitten (smote?) from Eden, and now we the Righteous must cleanse paradiso of all those Wicked.

>>22016258
It was either sexy nun or ugly monk. Which makes for a better MC? Obviously sexy nun. Nuns with guns will never stop being cool.

>>22016258
But thank you for the sentence structure. I see what you mean. And yes, it is smote.

>>22016272
>sexy nun
Well if you're doing that she should get cursed and turn into a succubus. She remains devout in order to control her urges but every so often she loses control and needs a good dicking.

>>22016286
That's a hole in the story I can't figure out. How would she come across getting a womb tattoo?

I've once again gone to the bookstore. Current trends:
>short, choppy sentences that are not even grammatically correct
>feminist retellings of greek myths from a female POV, especially in first person
>extremely colorful covers

>>22016318
What's wrong with that?

>>22016298
that's why some get payed the big bucks

>>22016298
>womb tattoo
I mean those are trashy as fuck, but you do you. So my idea based on yours is the girl's a nun. The opener is just a run of the mill demon exorcism via shotgun, or whatever weapon she uses, some named Desert Eagle called the Purifier, or something. She returns to the bishop to report her success and something happens, the mayor or a councilman comes in and they want to push the church out because of property damage or who the fuck knows. Basicallly a demon has the ear of the city now and they trace it to a high end escort service. So because she's got a nice set of cans she's selected to infiltrate the brothel and exorcise the demon, but of course that goes bad. So she gets corrupted by demon dick and starts changing, but midway through they bust in and chase the demon off, or kill it, or whatever. They bring her back to cleanse her, and it works, or so they think. From then on she wrestles with her demonic corruption while trying to become pure again, while fucking dudes left and right. I dunno, spitballing. Need to figure out a larger antagonist, but that's a good inciting incident.

>>22016221
It has been twenty-seven years since God gifted me out of my mother's womb and ten years since I took up the cross in his service. The Lord's will deemed that the vile be smited from Eden and we the righteous must see to it to cleanse paradisio from all those wicked.
>It has been twenty-seven years since God delivered me into this world from my mother's womb. A scant ten since I took up the cross in his holy name.

>By his will it was deemed that the vile be smote from Eden so that we the righteous may see paradisio cleansed from all that is wicked.

He has entrusted you, Dr. Yoryick, with a vial that would save our souls. I, Joan of the Faith of Holy Cross, from the town of Orleans, pray to you to provide me with one such vial so that I may continue to serve the Lord in his name. It is a calling for you, and a sacrifice for I. There is no refusal, for I have seen your generosity. Visions, as you may define it, but duty for me.

>By his generous grace doctor Yoryick, you have been bestowed with a vial that, his mercy permitting, save our very souls.
>I, Joan of the Faith of Holy Cross, from the township of Orleans, beseech you to provide me with this vial so that I may continue to aid the Lord in manifesting his great and many works.
>While you have been gifted this boon through your calling and Vision's, it falls to me to make the ordained sacrifice. Your generosity begets your obedience and though you may see choice, in my duty there is none.

Fuck that hurt my brain...If your work is longer and just as stuffy maybe >>22011993 can smote it for you.

>>22016343
I do like that. It's Joan of Arc vs Demons and Zombies. She's at some Dr faggots hideaway trying to obtain the vaccine to the virus. But finds the vaccine itself to be cause of the virus itself. So the entire time she's been slaying other humans. Of course as she battles her garments get torn and she needs to battle the wicked with her tits flying around

>>22016344
If anyone has a short story, I would be interested in punching it up for cheap and seeing if we could get it published

>>22016344
God damn. You are good.

>>22016344
>>22016386
>ai shart poster same fags compliments for his shit writing
Wow

>>22016318
Sounds designed for fried attention spans

>>22016344
>Not blonde
>Not blue eyes
This isn't Joan of arc. Re-generate.

>>22016508
I laughed. If that was their goal they succeeded.

>>22016382
Someone open a throwaway Google docs account to add to this sexy nun story. With our collective minds this story can be written into western canon

I don't think you understand.

>>22016449
this isnt ai general

>two and half hours until midnight
>still need to write 1000 more words
Already liking the first 1000 tonight, I think I'm gonna make it.

>>22014477
Stable Diffusion.
Here's how to get it running on your home computer, as long as you have a decent video card:
https://rentry.org/sd-mashup
>>22014565
Strawman argument.
Is that really all you can muster against A.I. art?

>>22014673
>some sort of filter
Yes, like...some sort of system of crowdsourced review aggregation...like, say, Amazon or GoodReads?
Do you live under a rock?

>>22017072
i assume you owned the copyrights for all the images you trained your calculator on, right? because otherwise this is just intellectual property theft

>>22017087
Gotta love how corpofaggots have convinced people like you that this argument leads anywhere besides "you need to pay me a licensing fee to remember my intellectual property", a place that (in case you weren't aware) is only about ten to twenty years away from being technologically enforceable.

>>22017087
>intellectual property theft
oooooooh noooooooo
not the heckin intellectual property theft-arino
not the downloading a car and driving off the lot and stealing from the poor car manufacurino

>>22017087
I hope you didn't look at anyone else's work, or get inspired by any of it, before drawing any of your own work, did you?
Because otherwise, that's just intellectual property theft.

>>22017124
>thinking about Mickey Mouse is intellectual property theft
>but not generating fake artwork based on someone else's paintings

Where is Uncle Ted when you need him?

>>22017121
how the fuck can fake AI be allowed to train on copyrighted material but it's still illegal to pirate Starcraft 2? can this dumbass clown world even be internally consistent with how fake and gay it is?

>>22017136
>>22017097
The AI isn't copying the material, it's interpreting it. Nowhere in the neural net does the original material exist, just like how I can't pull an exe of Starcraft out of your brain even if I had a proper brain-computer interface.

>>22017145
what dumb faggot decided that humanity should talk to calculators instead of aliens? how do we arrest that guy?

>>22017157
You have to free your mind from the goycattle programming of needing a "job" and being unable to self-motivate without profit incentive before aliens will consider you smart enough to be worth talking to. AI is the middle step.

>>22017165
ai is the middle step to getting nerve-stapled by mi5 so you get an electric shock whenever you see straight sex

>>22017174
Imagine being such a goy that three letter agencies are basically gods to you, lmao

>>22017145
I guess that's the weird legal middle ground. But if it's illegal to project a movie in your backyard, it shouldn't be legal to let an AI study that movie.

>>22017131
If you're inspired by anyone else's artwork while making your own, how is that not (by your own definition) intellectual property theft?
Your neural net is trained on them just as much as Stable Diffusion's is.
>Uncle Ted
...is rotting away in prison, where he belongs. Fscking psycho.

>>22017072
Straw man? It literally looks like shit and the fact your a wojak poster speaks enough volume about your intellect and taste

For God’s sake make next with a nonAI image so we can stop having this argument. This is not about writing. I’d do it myself but I’m going to bed. If I wake up and the next thread is AI I’m gonna be sad and it would make clear OP is intentionally being inflammatory or has some motive for flooding us with this stuff

>>22017208
I'll use an AI image because I like them, because they're plentiful, and because they're no threat to me.
You need to admit your entire objection is based around it making your own effort at drawing things obsolete.
But if your drawing can be replaced by Stable Diffusion, then you weren't any good to begin with.

And now, here's something you REALLY need to get your mind wrapped around.
Stable Diffusion can be run on one's local computer, without any connection to the Internet.
It's completely self-contained.
In my time, I've downloaded maybe 100 GB of models, and there are FAR more than that available.
The genie is literally out of the bottle.
It literally cannot be stopped.
You have a better chance of securing America's southern border against illegal immigrants.
Generative AI is NEVER...GOING...AWAY.
Adapt or die.

>>22017072
>>22017227
Looks like shit. You’re like an overexcited child

>>22017208
It's a schizoposter, bro. There's no other explanation for having the same pointless argument in a general. I think it's the same one that made the booktuber OPs last year and then had epic arguments about marketing strategy instead of talking about writing.
I wonder if there's a single board that doesn't have schizos. They're even on the porn boards but at least they get in trouble for it.

>>22017227
I really don’t get how you can think this looks good. What I really don’t get is why you insist on forcing onto us—such an opposed general (conceptually and literally). At this point you’re just being inflammatory and selfish
>everyone who thinks AI shart looks bad must be a seething artist
Okay, so you’re an idiot too.

>>22017227
>You need to admit your entire objection is based around it making your own effort at drawing things obsolete.
they just told you that having that OP derails the thread. Is your reading comprehension really that low?

>>22017195
But when the world needed him most, he vanished.

>>22017227
This is the only time I’m gonna engage with this because you’re clearly a troll and I want to talk about writing but this is the most absolute nothing of an image. Literally just meaningless and shallow as possible. Anime reaction images would offer a more thought provoking Opening Image. I wish I had the subnormality to enjoy such visual slop.

>>22017269
>this is the most absolute nothing of an image
don't be mean to the future MCU final fight scene

>>22017239
>>22017248
>>22017269
Literally can't name a single actual reason that these AI-generated images are sub-par.
Just generic, nondirected seething.
Given the cost of human-generated images, vs. the near-zero cost of AI-generated images, they are MORE than good enough.
And in case you've been living under a rock, "good enough" is the vast majority of any market.

The more horror stories I've read, the more I've come to realize that you can really make anything into horror. This revelation has resulted in me often unintentionally turning my smut stories into actual horror stories, such as Gothic, supernatural, etc.

>>22017284

>>22017284
Okay, they lack detail or details are inconsistent, the image is flat, there’s no meaning or emotion anywhere. They just look bad. And there are a lot of reasons for it. Literally look at the current op image, you really think that doesn’t look awful. Explain why you like these image beyond your weird bugman reason like them being cheap or some weird narcissism that you feel like you generated. You’re so lacking in self-awareness

if anyone sane wants to be a hero, make the next thread when it’s time. Doesn’t matter what image as long as it’s not ai shart. It could be soft core porn or a stock image for all it matters

This sucks. Ever since I started reading classic lit I have been writing in archaic language. It's so much more expressive and so much easier to say what I mean that it's hard to go back.

>>22017322
It is hard. Can't write dialog as well as I should now that I use a mixed registry of autistic colloquialisms and archaic language.
>>22011137
Speaking of which anyone has any advice on how to write dialogue that sounds less cartoony?
my proofreaders have been telling me that most of my dialog sounds like it's from a Saturday morning cartoon.

>>22017350
Fuck I forgot a comma.

>>22017311
You're still just spewing generalities.
I have yet to read a reason I should stop liking A.I. generated images.
But hey, good on you for being able to spot what you think are outpoints.
Because your paid drawing, for the rest of your life, is largely going to be spent fixing these outpoints, until AI evolves beyond that & you have no paid drawing work at all.
>>22017307
I thought we were having a discussion.
Are we having a fight in your mind?
That could be the entire source of the disconnect here.
I don't care to change your mind, and you won't change mine, so there's nothing to fight about.

>>22017359

>>22017359
What about the reasons to not use it as OP images? If you want to use it for your own personal posts, whatever, but surely you agree it’s unnecessary and inflammatory. You’re the only one who wants this to be the AI general so by forcing this onto us you’re just being an unreasonable dickhead

Anon... I didn't write 2000 words yesterday...
But that doesn't matter, I will keep writing.
I will make it.
I won't give up.
Everyone else is going to make it.
Never stop improving.
Never stop trying.

>>22017321
I'm hitting the sack now, but I'll check in the morning to see if it's time for a new thread.
At which point I will decorate OP with the mother of all AI-generated images.
Then I'll resume my technology job, where I'll labor endlessly to replace humans with machines.

My career already had its near-death experience, after the dot-com bubble, what with outsourcing and guest workers and whatnot.
What you're dealing with now, I've been dealing with for 20 years.
Welcome to my world.
The genie is not going back into the bottle, for you or for me.
Adapt or die.

>>22017368
If you can't handle anarchy, you're in the wrong place.
Maybe you'll be happier on Reddit, where they have all sorts of rules.

>>22017373
are you dumb? "adapt or die"? every black person on earth is a net-negative taxpayer. who the fuck are you to tell someone with an IQ over room temperature to adapt to your satanic fiat ponzi scheme?

>>22017368
>OP is a trolling dickhead
If you haven’t figured this out already it’s too late
>>22017373
Kill yourself

>>22017380
Because you don't have a choice.
It simply is.
The genie is not going back into the bottle.
Every minute you waste seething is a minute you could have spent preparing for the inevitable.
>>22017382
But I like my life.
I have no desire to kms.
Project much?

>>22017373
This is the cringiest post I’ve ever read. This is the person shilling this slop lmfao

>>22017386
ATTENTION DUMBFUCK

THE MORE THE FINANCIAL SYSTEM COLLAPSES, THE MORE OBVIOUS IT IS THAT IT'S JUST THE ENSLAVEMENT OF HELLENES TO GIVE BLACK PEOPLE FRIED CHICKEN

YOU EXPECT PEOPLE LIVING UNDER ALIEN OCCUPATION TO CONTINUE TO GO TO WORK DURING A NUCLEAR WAR? LMAOO

>>22017373
nobody here is dealing with the same problems you have, we're a writing general not an ai art generation general. we could care less about ai outputting writing on par with ours and in fact some of us use it to substitute editors. but your relentless shilling is glaringly obvious and annoying

I'm just still marvelling over how many webnovels there are. I mean, looking at trad publishing, there are already tens of millions of books. And then you go online and 17 year olds are cranking out 400,000 word webnovels by the dozen. How are there so many people writing. This is insane. There are like 20 websites for online free publishing (not even self pub, just free stuff) and it's packed ot the brim with content.

And why is it all either yaoi or isekai

>>22017415
have you tried reading them?
webnovels are like a livejournal, except people bothered more editing those.

>>22017415
Low barrier of entry, both for the authors and the readers.

>>22011693
I think so, but you should stay true to the history
but doing that might make it hard to get published, but it will make your story better

>>22012571
just do it with the expectation of it being figuratively torn to shreds by everyone. nobody is good at first, and most of them probably read litrpg nonsense so who cares
comfortably dismiss criticism that isn't constructive. "its shit kys" is meaningless

>>22012571
do you want me to edit it for you?

>>22017415
Webnovels and Light novels are offensively bad. Basically they are for people with zero talent. To write, you have to read. You have to read proper books by proper authors, and through trial and error, you find your own voice. Web/Light novel writers watch anime, read manga, play games and at best read other webnovels. They lack style, they lack substance and they are basically lazy first drafts of some weebs, who would never make it in any other form of media. No art skills (or not Japanese enough) to do manga, no money to animate stuff themselves, no skills to make their own game, so they just take their anime and game knowledge, and write it down. I myself enjoy all those things too, but specifically LN's and WN's make me sick to my stomach with how badly they are written.

>>22017547
There are some decent authors doing it because they get money. People likie Nisioisin or Carlo Zen

>>22017553
Yeah sure some LN authors have talent. But they are also somewhat older people who have life experience, and who have read stuff. 99% of that industry is just talentless, young hacks.

>>22011137
I've started writing an outline for a story where people with supernatural abilities are discouraged from using them by way of government hand outs and bureaucratic red tape. Any books that deal with the fantastic being made forcibly mundane? I'm trying to figure out how to depict the asinine hell of paperwork and mandated "community support sessions" the main character must slog through, without making it a slog for the reader.

>>22015658
Well you're not going to get it right the first time because life doesn't work that way. Don't be an delusional autistic faggot. Good writing takes hard work

>>22014708
>>22015063
there is nothing less helpful than a college undergrad creative writing class. They can never properly facilitate a respectful objective discussion of each student's writing without it devolving into pathetic displays of dick-measuring (by the teacher and even amongst the other students) and select favoritism where people passive-aggressively tear one another's work down. It also help that most creative writing majors are now overrun by a majority female population, so when you enroll in these courses expect to find disgusting blue haired pigs thinking they're special for waxing poetic writing.

>>22017691
sounds like the first part of the Incredibles
>without making it a slog for the reader
spend a max of 1 chapter of soul sucking drudgery. make it funny by being over the top ridiculous levels of 1984/brave new world
like he has to authentic something or get a voucher. so he has to wait in line to figure out what voucher line he needs to wait in. once he gets his voucher he needs to take public transport to the depot. but in order to do that he needs his card. so he goes to get his card and he gets a ticket for jaywalking or something totally mundane. so then he's required to attend classes on how to properly walk on public streets. and so on and so on

>>22017691
The first thing that came to mind is the first chapter of Unsong: https://unsongbook.com/chapter-1-dark-satanic-mills/
It gets less banal after that, and fiction is not the author's specialty anyway. But it paints a nice picture of industrialized magic, of magic that, while fantastical, by its very nature encourages the most soul-killing cubicle farm imaginable.
If you can find a way to get this kind of synergy, where something about the way the superpowers work creates obvious justifications for the red tape, maybe suggests procedures all by itself, then that can be really powerful. You don't have to make the red tape actually worth it but it'll feel like it hangs together better.

The romantic sludge story is now twice the length of anything else that I've written and will probably be again as long by the time I'm finished. At every point while writing it I had only the vaguest idea of where I was going. But the readers love it so it's all good.
I'm very slowly and painfully learning how to make shit up. How to pad out the story with scenes that aren't indispensable for the premise but do enhance the flavor and the texture. This story is practically 100% fluff, so I'm forced into it. Either I let my id take the wheel or I don't write at all.
I'm not learning how to structure a story, and I can barely even structure a chapter. My prose is relatively strong, my scenes flow alright, but I'm too myopic to go above that. Maybe when I have the finished product I can look back and analyze it and start thinking of structure as something I can control.
Thank you for reading my blog.

Anyone knows some good short stories that manage to quickly construct interesting, affective characters or characters with strong presence in low word count?
I think one of the best example I have in my mind is Oscar Wilde's The Happy Prince. In just more than a thousand word or so, iirc, it got me good with the ending. The story only teaches a way to make effective tragic character though.

Have any of you ever paid a professional beta reader like on fiverr or something? I've had a few free betas before and they've given me decent feedback, but apparently the pros get much more extensive and in depth. It's more affordable than I thought. Thinking of sending one of them my opening pages for $5-15.

I kind of want to write a novel flavored by a personal issue. Specifically an inability to remember anybody's name.

I'm not sure how frustrating it would be to read a book where everyone is accurately identified but by characteristics like "7/11 blonde cashier" or "Wannabe entrepeneur guy" and the literal only names the MC can remember are his family members.

Maybe structure the plot around him trying to date a girl and not reveal that even with a gun to his head he is too retarded to remember her name.

>>22018337
>>22018337
yeah, I made it early. you're welcome

>>22018241
I'm way too poor to spend 3000+ on an editor
Currently I'm submitting fragments of my WIP to a workshop group I found on discord, but the quality of the advice isn't always the best and theree's a 5k words per month limit each submission, which drags progresso on that front down when most of my chapters surpass and sometimes almost double that
I hope eventually to find some good beta readers at least, but I'm still gonna have to edit by myself in the end

>>22018342
I was going to make a thread with prose attached, something somewhat relevant to the topic
I really just want to be rid of the shitflinging and I'm worried this one will play into it

>>22018354
the person who ignores what the community wants is responsible for the shitflinging and no one else. it's not wrong to put your foot down against bad behavior

>>22018342
Very based. I was about to make it just to prevent trollOP from derailing the thread again. Nice painting too, saw a Monet exhibit in Vienna not too long ago

>>22018361
I mean, I mainly just want the shitflinging to stop, no matter who's responsible
But I also like prose more than I like paintings, this is not the impressionism general after all
It's fine though, better than this one, let's hope it goes well

>>22017691
So, the premise of the movie series "The Incredibles"?

>>22017691
so, The Boys?

>>22018361
>the person who ignores what the community wants
And I thought Ellsworth Toohey was just an antagonist from Ayn Rand's "The Fountainhead".
It is quite arrogant to assume you speak for "the community".
Your relentless samefagging does not create a "community", any more than the groundskeeper's relentless samefagging means he has fans.
Also...spinning a generality out of a specific is one of the signs of a sociopath.

>>22018453
you're silly

>>22018453
Kill yourself

>>22018459
But I like my life.
Stop projecting already & put yourself out of our misery.

>>22018476
POV: you wasted $60 a month on midjourney so now you spam lit with AI art to make up for the sunk cost

>>22018483
Do you have reading comprehension issues? See >>22017227 .
I run Stable Diffusion locally on my home computer.
It's practically free.
Other than electricity and Internet connection, I've never paid a dime for any of it.
I'm actually relieved that the opponents of AI art are this blatantly stupid; it reassures me that I'm on the right track.

>>22018496
I didn't read that because I'm not a "relentless samefag", before I responded to you I posted in this thread twice. AI art is ontologically evil and if you can't see that then you are evil as well

I'm struggling with this bit, do you guys think it's better to skip over it and come back or to persevere with it even though it's stumped me for now

>>22018513
Can you explain, in detail, why AI art is evil?
Your posts just serve up conclusions with no backing.
I expect better from someone that claims to be a writer.

>>22018348
I can edit your book for whatever you can afford. I'm farming positive reviews. I'm free for the next two weeks, so let me know if you're interested

>>22018573
100% move on every time this happens.unless you decided you were completing something you moved from before.
Protect your inertia, feed it, love it