/lit/ - Literature

What do I read after finishing Asimov

>>21413185
If I wanted to write fantasy what are some mandatory novels I would need to get through in order to both understand the genre and not be derivative?

Anyone read these two trilogies? Heard they're pretty good.

>>21413185
Beowulf is sffg worthy right? Can someone recommend a version of it that a low iq retard can understand?

Nah but seriously, Bakker sucks dick

>>21413185
Bakker lives for BBC

>>21413322
Shit beat me to it

>>21413278
First Law is fucking great, I read it's two trilogies this year and was blown away by how good they are, 100% worth investing the time getting them.

For Gentlemen Bastards, I only recently read The Lies of Locke Lamora and was pleasantly surprised by how good is was. I know I will be picking up the next two books next year.

Read The Wandering Inn, Read Mother of Learning, Read I Shall Seal the Heavens.

Also read The Prince of Nothing, Neuromancer, Cradle, A Song of Ice and Fire, Hyperion, Between Two Fires, The Poppy War.

>>21413432
Based rec anon

>>21413432
>>21413475
The circle is complete. He has memed himself into acceptance

>>21413255
All the classic fantasy series. Also Dune. No contemporaries, they'll mush your mind.
Also, better get good at using AI as a tool. Genre writers that don't will be left in the dust

>>21413255
Read The Lord of the Rings, Dune and the Solar Cycle.
Then read the entire Second Apocalypse series and learn from Bakker on how much he takes from the books above without crossing the lines of plagiarism, imitation and even homage.

Good stand alone scifi books that are not that well known?

>>21413610
The Windup Girl

>>21413610
Dr. Adder

>>21413610
1984

>>21413610
Piss from my ass

>>21413610
The Icarus Hunt

>>21413613
>>21413631
>>21413644
>>21413663
all great
>>21413643
troll

How are Peter F. Hamilton's books? Are they worth reading?

>>21413679
His early books were certain good but I don't know much about his recent series.

>>21413610
Demolished man
The stars my destination
Battlefield Earth
Ashes, Ashes
The Ice people
The immortals (nice spoiler, translators)

I love openai so much, it's unreal. Sure, ai will never write fantasy books, because fantasy books depend on random influence of ideas (proof reader were always some kind of "ai" that checks the grammar and style, and I'm certain in a few years those jobs are gone because of ai). but Openai is the best "objective" way to shill books.

According to my ai waifu, those are the best Epic Fantasy books:
>The Lord of the Rings
>A Song of Ice and Fire
>The Chronicles of Narnia
>The Wheel of Time
>The Kingkiller Chronicle
>The First Law
>The Earthsea Cycle
>The Mistborn series

and if you ask for more
>The Way of Kings
>The Stormlight Archive
>The Dark Tower
>The Malazan Book of the Fallen
>The Powder Mage trilogy
>The Inheritance Cycle
>The Chronicles of the Imaginarium Geographica

But there is one thing openai doesn't have and that is freedom of thought. Openai has filters that prohibits "non political conforming" ideas. You could say openai is the whole text based internet of the future, but 4chin will be the other half forever.

It sounds insane, but the moment big companies decided to implement filters, they actually destroyed only themselves, because 4chin is literally the last website on earth with texts on the internet that you can't get with openai, because of filtered wrongthink.

I've recently been thinking about hollow earths and how cool I think they are but now stupid they sounds, especially in regards to gravity, but then I realized that it would make sense that gravity works outwards and that the sphere doesnt collapse if the sun is a white hole. Equally, this could make dyson spheres somewhat sensical as rigid shells that surround a star on all sides.
Has there been such a fantasy or science fiction book?

>>21413916
Your AI is shit, nobody cares faggot

what are some must read standalone sci-fi books

>>21414042
Blindsight.

BAKKER is the KING of /sffg/ .

Simple as.

>>21413278
>>21413423
First Law is decent Dark Fantasy, but not as amazing as it's hyped to be. But Abecrombie is a good addition to the genre, especially these days. His recent books weren't as good, though.

The Lies of Locke Lamore should be considered a genre classic, a wonderful combination of a charistmatic, lovable rouge MC and adventure in a reneissance inspired fantasy city. However, the second book falls off hard. Still decent, but nothing more. The third is a burning pile of garbage that makes the series retroactively worse, don't fucking touch it. Just read the first book and savour the memories.

And even if for some idiotic reason you decide to read all the books, you won't get a resolution anyway because the author fucked up enormously - He banged his fangirl(which is kinda based) which resulted in his marriage going to shit, and supposedly the following marriage with the fangirl didn't work out. So his mentally broken and hasn't been able to write another book for years.

Well, in comparison to Rothfuss he at least has good reason for why he can't write.

>>21414057
>the fangirl seductress in question

>>21414157
>ruining your life for this
why are men so retarded

>>21414057
>>21414157
>>21414187
For the longest time while reading sffg I confused Bakker with the Scott Lynch. I thought everyone was talking about the Lies of Lokce Lamorra writer because almost no one talks about Prince of Nothing outside here

Genuine question. Why does scifi attract so many troons?

>>21414253
>Why does scifi attract so many troons?
Sci-Fi is for intellectuals and autists, mostly the second. Autists have significantly bigger presence in a group of people suffering from Gender Dysphoria. It's simple as that. Not to mention intellectualy minded people are more eager to consider arguments and liminal cases such as non-gender comforming behaviour or gender roles.

>>21414274
>gender dysphoria
You mean autogynephilia.

>>21414052
>BAKKER is the KING of /sffg/ .
>Simple as.

>>21414406
This looks like a screenshot from an early xbox 360 game.

are there any d&d books worth reading? been playing some old cRPGs and curious about the lore

Picrel, do people actually think Ready Player One is a Litrpg? No wonder people think the genre is shit if this is what advertises it. By that logic even Matrix is Litrpg. Holy shit, which retard made this infographic?

>>21414447
>which retard made this infographic?
are you serious? You have made it and now you post this in every thread.

can't finish this bros... dropping cradle at book 10. it's just been downhill since wintersteel. i don't care about the labyrinth or anything with the space battles and the Way and Ozriel, the Dreadlords, whatever.

>>21414157
Jesus you don't fuck your marriage for a thing like that. Why would he do that?

>>21414447
It kind of is. And it's certainly the only one anybody who doesn't read the genre would recognize.

>>21414447
>try to make litrpg look good
>best you can come up with is ready player one
LitRPGsisters... we lost...

>>21414561
It has some form of crossover, but not really. Honestly you'd probably be easier pointing to some Japanese LN stuff for more recognisable things that at least fall under the broad category.

>>21414501
I see these books coming out all the time on audible and the seven seas, almost feels like they are written in an assembly line but I never known what they are about

What can be recommended, that´s similar to the Remembrance of Earth's Past novels?

>>21413610

>>21414428
Bakkerfag has the ability to make bloom effect.

Anyone have a link to that one long and funny review of Wise Man's Fear?

Just finished Stephen Lawhead's Dream Thief, it was Christkino
reminds me a lot of C.S. Lewis' Space Trilogy but more "hard" SF and less preachy

>>21413286
There are lots of prose translations of Beowulf that are easy to understand but those still don't provide a readily accessible narrative given the constant digressions in that poetic form and the scholarly footnotes required for unfamiliar terms and references. Your best bet is the re-dramatization illustrated by John Howe, which tells the plot as directly and honestly as possible, with no irrelevant sidetracking, and with full immersiveness and verisimilitude.
https://www.abebooks.com/Beowulf-Nicky-Raven-John-Howe-Bonnier/30930763181/bd

I just finished Dark Age and enjoyed it quite a bit
On that note, how the hell is the Republic supposed to make a comeback with no army or fleet? Just hope Lysander causes a new civil war amongst the Golds? Volga just kills Volsung Fa and brings all the obsidians back including the space cannibals? I just hope it won't be a major ass pull

>>21413278
Abercrombie is good- Lynch sucks

the ultimate anti-grimdark novel is...

>>21415456
Sonething written by a roastie, common themes are feminism, anti white ideology, misandry, promotion of lgbt and progressivism

>>21413610
The Sheep Look up

>>21415456
The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant: The Unbeliever.

>>21415467
>anti white ideology
Hot

>>21415442
Hopefully the Republic and Society both disintegrated and we see rise of single planet governments.

>>21413550
>>21413559
I see both of you recommended Dune which is sci-fi. What is it about Dune that makes it important for an aspiring fantasy writer to read? Genuine question btw, I'm mostly a nonfiction fag.

>>21413610
Armor but it's military scifi.

>>21415813
it's the first "epic" science fiction novel that isn't technocratic, brazenly political navel-gazing by intellectuals (or pseudo-intellectuals) or 1-dimensional monosyllabic pulp for children and people whose idea of entertainment doesn't extend beyond cowboys and indians

essentially, what Lord of the Rings did for fantasy, Dune did for scifi,

>>21415833
Allow me to translate this contraiancel.
What this anon meant to say was: "POPULAR THING BAD".
*ahem*
"UNPOPULAR THING GOOD, UNTIL IT BECOME POPULAR, THEN POPULAR THING BAD AGAIN".

I hope this clears things up.

>>21415843
Foundation was never popular Isaac

>>21415813
this: >>21415833
It brought sci-fi to a new level. intrique and interposonal relations were suddenly in play. It does away with the idea that a sci-fi novel should just be about "the idea".
Anything that modern literature brought to the table is now expected from genre fiction.
I wasn't alive, so I can only imagine the impact it must've had on contemporary sci-fi and fantasy writers.

>>21415833
>what Lord of the Rings did for fantasy
did you know The Broken Sword and Fellowship of the Ring came out in the same year?

>>21415885
and which one of those is remembered today by more than 6 people and wikipedia?

>>21415922
Tolkien, because he downplayed his anti-semitism and racism

>>21415939
Poul Andersen hated jews?

>>21415939
Well, now you've got my attention. Tell me more of this, "Broken Sword" thing of yours.

>>21415922
>>21415944
Holy shit I love the Broken Sword so much. Might be the best fantasy book ever made

>>21415922
That wasn't the topic. What sort of juvenile genre is Broken Sword in that Lord of the Rings redeems?

>>21415949
there aren't any jews in it but one of the earliest chapters is an elf king needing a changeling so he goes to his rape dungeon and rapes a troll for it

>>21415944
Read The Queen of Air and Darkness

>>21415958
The mere absence of Ashkenazim in a person's fiction does not make him an anti-semite
by that logic, Harlan Ellison is anti-semitic

>>21415974
>by that logic, Harlan Ellison is anti-semitic
well... yeah. Why wouldn't he be?

>>21415979
>Early Life

>>21415833
Dune is plagiarism
A princess of mars is far deeper than dune
and of course a dunefag would be a tolkien fanboy. LOL. Tolkien did fuck all for fantasy

>>21415983
Shit. You're right

>>21415949
The Main character fucks his elf mom, also there's a troll-elf orgy/gangbang near the end.

>>21415988
Edgar Rice Burroughs is based, but planetary romance is the lowest form of science fiction

>>21415988
>Tolkien did fuck all for fantasy
Even the gayest, most retarded of contrarians don't go this far. Congratulations, homo.

>>21415995
I'm in.

>>21415988
>Tolkien did fuck all for fantasy

>>21416000
it's not a contrarian take it's a reading books published before 1955 take

>>21415999
>>21416000
TRIPS

>>21415999
No, it's the highest form of science fiction
hard sci fi fags ruined science fiction
>>21416000
He didn't do anything for fantasy apart from make it shitter
>muh epic fantasy
Worm ouroborus did it first
>muh ancient european myth and lore
House of the Wolfings did it first
The only thing that makes tolkien "better" than his contemparies and those who wrote fantasy previous to him is his made up language, which frankly i don't care about because i'm not an autist obessed with made up languages. conlangs are mental masturbation

>>21416033
>>21416061
Tolkien's worst material is still on par if not better than Ouroborus and House of the Wolfings. If those two were the most popular instead you'd be sitting here crying about how Tolkien was better than them and "elevated" the genre. Spare me, bozos. You can always spot a contrarian faggot by how irrational, and hyperbolic their seething is.

>>21416096
>Tolkien's worst material is still on par if not better than Ouroborus and House of the Wolfings
No it isn't
>If those two were the most popular instead you'd be sitting here crying about how Tolkien was better than them and "elevated" the genre. Spare me, bozos. You can always spot a contrarian faggot by how irrational, and hyperbolic their seething is.
Cope
Muh 3000 pages of worldbuilding and muh invented language are nothing but self mastubation

My pupils constricted, my scalp felt numb, and I couldn't help but lampoon inwardly as I was reading Lord of the Mysteries!

>>21416119
Tolkien's worldbuilding is extremely subtle and his novels very fast by modern standards. Modern fantasy isn't based on Tolkien as much as it's based on D&D, especially Dragonlance, and people who haven't read much fantasy think D&D = Tolkien and have him represent a completely different genre than he actually wrote in.

>>21416131
fag

>>21416119
>nuh-uh! muh muh muh
How will Tolkien ever recover from this?

>>21416131
If it reads anything like that gay ass sentence then it's gonna be a hard pass from me.

>>21413185
The official Mom Protagonist SFF List.
I apologize for the lengthy (ie autistic) list. I may update it later.
>Caught in Crystal (1987) by Patricia Wrede
>The Interior Life (1990) by Katherine Blake
>Raven's Duology (2004-2005) by Patricia Briggs
>Wolfblade Trilogy (2004-2005) by Jennifer Fallon
>Bridge of D'Arnath (2004-2005) by Carol Berg
>The World Gates Trilogy (2004-2005) By Holly Lisle, She wrote Minerva Wakes and the Arhel trilogy, those two books also have mom mc
>Dragonsbane (1985) by Barbara Hambly
>Paladin of Souls and Vorkosigan saga by Lois McMaster Bujold
>Sunrunner Saga (1988-1993) by Melanie Rawn starting from book the mc has a son and he becomes the secondary mc
>The Empire Trilogy (1987-1992) by Janny Wurts
>Liveship Traders (1998-200) by Robin Hobb
>Birthgrave (1975-1978) by Tanith Lee
>Heart of Bronze (1997-1998) by Matthew Stover
>Karavans Trilogy (2006-2012) by Jennifer Roberson
>Skinwalkers (2014) by Wendy N. Wagner, about an ex-pirate Axe wielding mom!
>Frostfell (2006) by Mark Sehestedt
>Legacy of Steel (1998) by Mary H. Herbert
>The Traitor Spy Trilogy (2010-2012) by Trudi Canavan
>Sevenwaters Trilogy (1999-2001) by Juliet Marillier
>Blood songs (1987, third book in the Frost trilogy) by Robin Wayne Bailey
>Bloodsong Trilogy (1985-1986) by Asa Drake
>Gypsies (1988) by Robert Charles Wilson
>Child of Time (1991) by Robert Silverberg
>The Wayfarer Redemption (1995-1999) by Sara Douglass, by book three almost every character is pregnant, after book three there's a 20 year time-skip so all the mcs have grown-up children
>The Forgotten Beasts of Eld (1974) by Patricia A. McKillip
>The Keys to Paradise Trilogy (1987-1988) by Robert Vardeman, trio of mcs all of the same importance, veterans of the Trans-War that ravaged the country, one of them is a cat-girl who saves a slave kid and adopts him
>Bitter Angels (2009) by C.L Anderson
>The Great Wheel (1987, book three of the Tredana Trilogy) by Joyce Ballou Gregorian
>Daughter of the Bear King (1987) by Eleanor Arnason
>Night-Threads series by Ru Emerson, portal fantasy about a druggie mom, her sister and her teenage son.
>Frostflower adn Thorn (1980) Phyllis Ann Karr
>Fifth Millenium by S.M. Stirling, Shirley Meier, and Karen Wehrstein
>Spellsong Cycle (1997-2002) by L.E. Modesitt Jr
>The Sword of Lyric by Sharon Hinck, christian portal fantasy about a soccer mom and her son fighting against Not-Satan
>Cradle of Sea and Soill (2020) by Bernie Anes Paz
>Boneshaker (2009) Cherie Priest
>The Gap Cycle by Stephen Donaldson, absolute grimdark kino but like most of Donaldson's work it has a happy ending, the main characters just have to go through hell to get it.
>Dragon Gate by Linsay Buroker, a six book epic about a Mother-son duo
>Memories of Ice (2001 Book 3 of Malazan Book of the Fallen) by Steven Erikson, thanks to the kind anon who mentioned it in the last thread.
Bakker is king etc. etc.

>>21416153
oh hey are you the guy that was just arguing that Farmer Giles of Ham is superior to Worm Orobouros and that it was your opponents who resort to hyperbole?

>>21416161
PLEASE tell me why you like Boneshaker

What the fuck is wrong with Anasûrimbor Kellhus?

Legit question.

>>21416153
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8l0WnLWT40g

>>21416164
It has a cute mom.

>check on Soulship because it dug itself a memoryhole
>book 5 finally came out in July
wowee
>then book 6 just came out Monday
whoa

>>21416161
Do any of the mommies in this list plow their sons? If not into the trash it goes.

>>21416176
You're a retard. I'm surprised you can read the pages

>>21416166
mfw a youtube parody is actually better than the chink sffg novels themselves

Recommend me fantasy with incest.

Hard mode: Books where the incest relationship is portrayed positively, or at least neutraly.

>>21416214
If you want to watch actual good wuxia by chinks, download Thunderbolt Fantasy

>>21416222
here
>>21415951

>>21416185
>>21416222
No, if you want momcest you can read the Broken Sword like he said >>21415995
and i totally forgot to add To Sail Beyond the Sunset by Heinlein, it's the last book of the Lazarus Long series, and Lazarus mom is the mc of that book. Lazarus time-travelled to the past and ended up having sex with his mom, the last book it's about how his mom founds out it was him and not just a random dude and she falls in love with him.
>>21416195
Rude
ngl i just added to the listf or the sake of completion, there aren't many mom protags so i gotta be flexible.

>>21416142
I've read the hobbit, LOTR and most of the silmarillion, along with his lesser known works like famer giles of ham (which i consider his best work alongside the hobbit)
Tolkien isn't a good author. the only thing he did better than his contemporise and the authors he based his work from was his made up language and his "worldbuilding" which i do not care for
>>21416153
Worm ouroboros is better than LOTR. Conan is better than LOTR. it's that simple

>>21416245
Based mom collector.

>>21416245
What if I want sister or daughter incest?

>>21416222
>22>>21416240 >>21416245Recommend me fantasy with incest.
>Recommend me fantasy with incest.
easy
>Hard mode: Books where the incest relationship is portrayed positively, or at least neutraly.
only possible if oyuy;re willing you read female authors to be honest

>>21416288
>only possible if you're willing to read female authors
So impossible, then.

>>21416288
I don't mind female authors. They can write good stuff.

>>21416293
>>21416298

>>21416142
>Modern fantasy isn't based on Tolkien as much as it's based on D&D, especially Dragonlance, and people who haven't read much fantasy think D&D = Tolkien and have him represent a completely different genre than he actually wrote in.
based knower

>>21416249
>"worldbuilding" which i do not care for
this is exactly the kind of brainlet hot take I expect from somebody who doesn't like Tolkien

>>21416278
his books >>21416314

>>21416314
Cringe and blue-pilled

Wings of Fire 9: Talons of Power

I wasn't sure I'd like reading about turtle because he's too powerful for his own good as an animus. Indeed, the animus power does need more limitations in general. Darkstalker and Anemone throw around spells as fast as a greeting. However, Turtle doesn't use his animus power flippantly. He's careful and timid and i can think of ten ways he could have trivialized this story in as many minutes. He was just being used as a tool so the reader can see what's going on around Darkstalker. I didn't feel like he grew whatsoever by the end of the book. I really, really wanted to love him because he was awesome in the other books as part of the friend group and I was very disappointed with him. There was so much he could've done but he's mostly static.

Tui's particular brand of humour continues - though more muted than Book 8. Turtle is not the most exciting of protagonists as he is a self-admitted coward and generally passive wishing to stay in the background. It's strong trait for him to carry as a character but makes for slower reading than Peril’s book. Resultantly, I found the book bit slow, especially in the middle/end where my interest meandered a bit. At first, I loved the spying, but after a while it just felt...pointless. Like, if he had been axed out of this book, it wouldn't really have affected anything.

Darkstalker is frankly the real main character here with turtle keeping hidden the whole way and he continues to be one of the most devious and best-written villain characters in general I've seen in a long time. He's this sticky oily kind of evil that thinks he's charming and lovable and a generous guy everyone should like, but he's just scary underneath. Maybe he's just controlling. He does these horrific petty, and vast reaching vindictive acts that everyone tells him are bad and it all just washes off him like water to a duck . . .. He's a black pit of malice and pride that's willfully ignorant of itself like a scorpain that stings the frog and denies it would ever do such a thing in one breath and then says the frog deserved it in the next.

As much as I love the new books (6, 7, 8, and 9), the dragons in them have too much power. There seems to be too much focus on special powers (mindreading, fire scales, animus magic) rather than sheer characterization. I liked that about the first books, the dragonets had to rely on cleverness and each other rather than powers. I'm hoping the 10th book will be about a powerless dragon (and a little searching shows the pov character should be Qibli, whom I preferred over Kinkajou anyway).

Normally I like special-powered characters. I'm not sure why it bothers me in this series Maybe it's that the animus power doesn't have enough limitations and overshadows the other powers too much.

3.8/5

Just bought Joe Abercrombie's The First Law books and Brandon Sanderson's Mistborn Era 1

>>21416332
Please explain to me how endless worldbuilding isn't masturbatory
Howard wrote fuck all compared to tolkien yet his hyborian age feels more real and lived in than any part of middle earth

>DCC dude's patreon two months out of date on kemono
Get to it, paypigs. I need a DCC 6 release date.

>>21407931
Yeah, I figured as much when I read through the encyclopedia at the end of TTT and it mentioned the modern population of sranc compared to that of The First Apocalypse.

>>21416249
>>21416422
nobody cared about his worldbuilding they cared about a fantasy story about overcoming terrible odds with the help of your friends, a story they'd call subversive if it came out today actually, "whoah all the cool rugged heroes failed and the little guy from the countryside made it almost all the way and he failed too and then the wicked goblin saved the world? and then they go home and have to save it too!"

You can't claim he's got masturbatory worldbuilding and then complain that it doesn't feel real and lived in. It doesn't have much worldbuilding at all. Tolkien doesn't care about Aragorn's tax policy, he cares about epic poetry. Conan feeling real and lived in, along with Howard's boxing and pirate and cowboy stories, isn't about autistic maps and graphs it's the way he writes.

>>21416314
Twoface?

>>21416422
>Howard wrote fuck all compared to tolkien yet his hyborian age feels more real and lived in than any part of middle earth

>>21416600
>one side of me is preachy narcissist, but the other is twisted fucking benzo addict

>>21416298
>I don't mind female authors. They can write good stuff.

>>21416531
>Tolkien doesn't care about Aragorn's tax policy, he cares about epic poetry
Earlier writers like Dunsany and Mirrlees cared about the poetry. Tolkien wrote autistic lore dumps populated with paper doll characters and used meter sometimes if it suited him.

>>21417050
autistic lore dumps like what?

Does anyone know that book by an American sci-fi writer who converted to Islam and wrote an anti-jewish/anti-Zionist novel under a psuedonym and it got banned. I think there was some speculation for years on who the actual author was and it was only found out years later that it was him. The book and author were mentioned here a few months ago.

>>21417103
I want to know as well

>>21417103
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._A._R._Barker

>>21417160
>>21417103
>Neo-Nazi/white supremacist work
>Barker wrote a sixth novel, Serpent's Walk, under the pseudonym Randolph D. Calverhall (likely a play on "Randolph de Caverhall", a supposed ancestor).[31][32] The novel was published in 1991 by National Vanguard Books, which published white supremacist and neo-Nazi material including The Turner Diaries.

>Serpent's Walk features an alternate history where SS soldiers begin an underground resistance after the end of WWII, with their descendants rising up a century later to take over the United States of America with the "tactics of their enemies", "building their economic muscle and buying into the opinion-forming media". The back cover of the book states "The good guys win sometimes. Not always, of course. They lost big in the Second World War. That was a victory for communists, democrats, and Jews, but everyone else lost." It continues, "A century after the war they are ready to challenge the democrats and Jews for the hearts and minds of White Americans, who have begun to have their fill of government-enforced multi-culturalism and 'equality.'"[33]

>Between 1990 and 2002, Barker also served as a member of the Editorial Advisory Committee of the Journal of Historical Review, an advocate of Holocaust denial and revisionist pseudohistory.[34][35]

>In March 2022, the Tékumel Foundation confirmed Barker's authorship of Serpent's Walk and association with the Journal of Historical Review.[36] While the Foundation had no involvement with Serpent's Walk and receives no royalties or other profits from its publication, the Foundation repudiated Barker's views in the novel and apologized for not acknowledging its authorship earlier.
brb reading this now

lol
lmao

>>21417179
wtf? thats not fiction...

>>21417160
based, thanks.

>>21414274
I like to think I’m the former but I’m definitely the later

>>21414447
How is grimdark any different from dark fantasy?

>>21413255
Conan
Lotr
Elric
Fafhrd and the gray mouser

>>21415833
>it's the first "epic" science fiction novel that isn't technocratic, brazenly political navel-gazing by intellectuals (or pseudo-intellectuals)
Sounds like we need to go back.

>>21416769

Orion's Arm Project
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orion%27s_Arm

>>21417296
Dark fantasy is kind of a loose term but basically it's gothic fantasy but without the gothic elements. It often has horror or a certain gloomy or grim setting.

Grimdark is where (nearly) everyone is evil or an edge-lord and the protagonist is an anti-hero doing bad shit for "good reasons".

>>21414187
>>21414539
in his first marriage, his wife became emotionally distant, and somehow massively mindfucked him, i dont know the exact details, but it was during that time that he became heavily depressed, this was after the release of his first book.

He then married elizabeth bar, the lady in the picture, and also a renowned author, she was lenient with a one-way open relationship for him, sort of like a reverse will smith, so he was engrossed in fucking a 25 year old who eventually spilled the beans on twitter, and squarely blamed bear for enabling lynch in his manwhore ways, they have kept a low profile since

>>21417449
So in other words it’s not any different

I just started The Winter King. Is it good? Cornwell must heave been molested by priest or something. He hates them from page one.

>>21416531
>tolkien
>goodpoetry
AHAHAHAHAAH
Retarded tolkiendrone
Tolkien's poetry is fucking shit, and tolkien doesn't understand the epics and ancient societies (like the anglo saxons) he took his ideas from
>complain that it doesn't feel real and lived in
90% of Tolkien's world is abandoned wilderness. Look at arnor and eriador
>b-but it's like the dark ages
when the dark ages occured half of europe didn't revert to ruin filled abandoned wilderness.
>nobody cared about his worldbuilding they cared about a fantasy story about overcoming terrible odds with the help of your friends
There are fantasy stories that fit that description that were written before tolkien. Tolkien is not unique in that respect
>>21416609
Howard is better than tolkien, simple as

I loved this book as a kid.

>>21417454
I'm back. Le Morte d'Arthur is better than Once and Future King. Once and Future King is, in fact, shart-tier.

>tackling the problem of Elvish racism head on
Dropped.

>>21417454
Why would a graph start with S instead of A?

>>21418418
You know why, Grandpa. Stop stirring up shit.

>>21416180
Book 5 has been fun. All kinds of shit happening and lots of characters to deal with. I'm probably halfway so far and it has been a nonstop trip. Nice that I can binge through book 6 right afterward.

>>21417050
>Tolkien didn't care about poetry
possibly the worst literary takes ever posted on this website, on par with saying Howard Philips Lovecraft didn't care about race

>>21418077
>Tolkien doesn't understand the Anglo-Saxons
I stand corrected, THIS is the worst literary take of all time

>>21418435
What?

>>21418532

>>21418532
He didn't though. The Anglo saxon heroic worldview directly contrasts with tolkien's servile, catholic little people rising up worldview
Even the Christian anglo saxons glorified war and battle and conflict, tolkien does not glorify war and battle
"I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend.”
This worldview goes against the anglo saxon worldview of loving swords and battle and glorious warriors. tolkien glorifies the little man (the hobbits) and the servants (sam) which is opposite to the heroic worldview with glorifies the hero and the nobility
Again, you're a dumb tolkiendrone who doesn't even know about Tolkien's views or the view of the Anglo saxons so of course you'd call my objectively right take "the worst of all time"

Spent the last few weeks reading the five books out of Ruocchio's Sun Eater series. Something about stories written as if a memoir of the protagonist written long after events really appeals to me, sets an excellent sense of foreboding and inescapable fate to everything. Setting is very Dune-like but I don't think that's a bad thing in if itself. The last two books were pretty heavy reads emotionally, and if I give that much of a shit it's usually a sign of quality. Anyone else read these? I picked up the first on a whim basically, hadn't heard of it before.

Any books for this feel?

>>21415813
In some ways it's more a fantasy in space and it's influence was huge. A lot of Game of Thrones DNA is from Dune for just one example.

>>21415951
I just finished it and it fucking ruled.
Though I did think it would end with the end of the world so was sightly let down it didn't.
Still easily one of the best fantasy novels I've ever read.
Also am I crazy to think it was the main influence on Warhammer? Their orks and the trolls seem identical, and Warhammer elves seem a lot more akin to Broken Sword than to Tolkein.

>>21418778
>Also am I crazy to think it was the main influence on Warhammer?
would make sense as a big influence

>>21418750
Your diary desu

What do you recommend to someone who finished all translated isekai LNs in existence and is now looking towards western fiction for escapism?

>>21418778
>Also am I crazy to think it was the main influence on Warhammer?
Indirectly, considering Warhammer was a copycat of Dungeons and Dragons, however DND was based heavily on Poul Anderson's work, chief among them Broken Sword, and Three Hearts and Three Lions

>>21418778
>>21418792
>>21418839
the broken sword was a huge influence on michael moorcock whose chaos and law was basically ripped wholesale off by warhammer

>>21418527
I'm not saying he didn't care, he just wasn't very good at it. Nobody goes from reading Joyce to Tolkien. Anyone claiming they read Tolkien for le epic poetry either stopped reading new books in middle school or is trying to pass off their Harry Potter tier fandom as something more than it is.

>>21414052
I unironically wish you would die just so you wouldn't post the same shit over and over for the foreseeable future.

>>21414253
They love the scenarios of futurism where their particular brands of degeneracy are depicted as commonplace and normalized or even lauded. Same shit with any other faggot subgroup.

>>21413432
>Read The Wandering Inn
Did the author finish the rewrite of the first volume yet?

>>21413185
Pirates novels or books? Don’t say treasure island

>>21419212
On Strange Tides
Inda

>>21413550
>Also, better get good at using AI as a tool. Genre writers that don't will be left in the dust
Why tho?

A Quest for Simbilis (Michael Shea's Dying Earth book) is great.

>>21419212
The Wyvern by AAA

I read Bakker for the prose.

>>21419472
Bakker is a hack but his battle scenes are pretty good

>>21418121
Fate Gu did nothing wrong.

>>21419536
Dumbfuck gu must be your vital gu.

>>21419690
One must strive for balance in all things.

>>21413278
lynch is a dumb shit the third book is terrible and the main character is a self insert cuck

>>21414157
what the fuck did his wife look like????

What implication does Donald Davidson's radical interpretation have on worldbuilding in books? Should I interpret that every book has a consistent world?

>>21419705
Not according to FY philosophy

>>21419457
Shea is so good
Niff the lean

What you faggets reading?

>>21419987
I got filtered by the prologue of Nifft so I didn't want to try Simbilis for a long time.

>>21414902
>>21414406
>>21419079

Repent thy folly and abase thyself before our Lord.

>>21420017
I'm about to read Charles Dickens' A Christmas Carol for the first time tonight
it's pretty short so I don't expect it to take me more than a couple of hours before bed

after that I intend to read Dennis L. McKiernan's "Faery" quintilogy, I really liked the way he wrote in The Iron Tower, excepting the very horrendous broken conlangs he made in that to ape Tolkien (badly), hopefully it should be much more enjoyable without that nonsense

Can anyone give me some recommends on stories where the MC fights alone? Feels like every novel must contain a group of oddjobs to insert humour into the work.
I wanted a solo gunwielder mc, so my first thought was to look at system apocalypse, since having a gun and having to survive an invasion and collapse of the world seems reasonable enough to pair, but eastern novels don't really have gun wielders, and western ones unlike what I would expect, don't seem to exist.
The closest I could find was Life in the North, but it turned into a shitty party, MC with his starting position completely wastes it by not hunting with his broken stealth and high damage lasergun, he instead goes to help some random town and gets cucked into being an errand boy being bossed around by former officials who have no strength.

>>21420220
La creatividad. El Steve Jobs de la literatura...

>>21420318
I have just the perfect book for you

>>21420318
What you want doesn't really exist, the western trope is a dumb incompetent mc with a party full of roasties and other undesirables, the novel is normally not about the actual story but the party members interpersonal relationships and mc relationship with some roastie.
Even eastern novels suffer from this to an extent

>>21420017
Premise is a high schooler with anger issues get isakaied into the game world to become a berserker orc. Unfortunately the first adversary was a muscular man whose villainous act was assaulting a catty homosexual and his black white knight, while being rude to an empowered woman weapons expert. So far that was a one off, but it sucked the air out of the room. Westerners just can't seem to write any other kind of story.

>>21420017
>what i'm reading
Red Knight
>what i expected
hellsing without vampires
>what i got so far
hellsing without vampires at the renaissance fair

It's alright but I doubt I'll continue the series.

>>21420318
Old pulp S&s stories, mc where mostly on their own, after D&D got popular around the late 70s that trope died.

>>21420360
Didn't touch it because I got a YA vibe from it.

>>21420017
Soulship 5, Martial World, and rereading The Lost Metal.

>>21420220
What originally compelled you to simp for a left-wing gay atheist failed novelist from Canada?

>>21420318
Are you asking for a novel where the protagonist "fights alone" in the sense that he has companions who do not directly engage in combat at his side? Or a story where the protagonist "fights alone" in the sense that he fights against the world with his friends? Or are you asking for a work where the protagonist literally has no friends or allies and just kills or ignores everything like an autistic savant? Or are you asking for a work in which the protagonist is literally the only recognizably human character in the novel and he's fighting for his survival against nature or aliens or robots or negroes or whatever?

>>21420378
Well, I don't really get that vibe. Or at least the part I don't like about modern YA, which is the validation of the child against the adult world. The narrator is his older self taking a shit on his younger self for the most part. But there are other reasons to avoid it at least so far.

>>21420357
Is it so hard to have a novel about a gun tottin adventurer, journeying around this new world, braving the danger with nothing but his trusty weapon? I understand I am digging around the bin hoping to find treasure, but surely there must be something throughout all these years written.
The thing that destroys me is that there is no sense of adventure in these novels. It all feels like you said 'but the party members interpersonal relationships and mc relationship with some roastie'.
I can point a finger at Chinese novels like Ultimate Evolution and Reincarnation Paradise, and while they use the settings of many different established worlds from movies and anime, it's just a setting to explore. There is still the feeling of adventuring, and gun related skills and uses sadly don't feature much in the former due to MC using a gun as a trump card, while the latter is mostly focused on swords. I wanted something of higher quality than junkfood of the east when I started searching for this.
>>21420372
Do you have some good novels on the top of your head? I imagine Conan fits the bill.
>>21420382
In a sense I am asking for all of these. Would gladly take any if the book is good.
>in the sense that he has companions who do not directly engage in combat at his side?
Going on an adventure alone yet having people close to him in a safe place to return to.
>Or a story where the protagonist "fights alone" in the sense that he fights against the world with his friends?
I would rather have him performing the actual fights alone, with other supporting from the back. A king's premission, an intel agent helping him even the odds, a retired grandmaster teaching. Maybe a general who can call an airstrike if he asks. That sort of thing.
>Or are you asking for a work where the protagonist literally has no friends or allies and just kills or ignores everything like an autistic savant?
I wouldn't mind a robot MC at this point, and to tie it up to the last point you made, man vs the world does sound appealing. Survival is the main point of apocalypse novels, but they quickly change into townbuilding, I read only a few that stuck to the 'man in the wilderness, nowhere is safe and you have no help to rely on or home waiting for you'.
I understand I barely narrowed it down for you, but what I want to say is I am open to any kind of self-reliant MC braving danger.

>>21420426
No, you narrowed it down excellently, which is of immense help to me, as you have successfully excluded virtually every piece of fiction ever written, with the exception of a few overwhelmingly depressing 1950s post-apocalyptic novels about the literal last man on earth after a nuclear war who subsequently dies and the human race goes extinct.

>>21420443
That is saddening to hear. I would imagine portal fantasies, as prevalent as they are today, would bring forth at least one 'US marine (and his gun that got magicked to have respawning bullets) gets teleported to a jungle world filled with nothing but savage creatures' Hell you could expand on that to include intelligent beasts if musings of a single man are hard to write in a way that gets the reader engaged, but whose standards of right and wrong leave his realtionship with them oscillating between friendly and getting killed on sight on a daily basis, so as to not ruin the 'man vs world' vibe.

>>21420318
Solo Leveling? Jinwoo does attract a comedic crowd of hangers on, but most of his fighting is solo or bailing out lesser parties.

>>21420474
there are a bunch of self-published (read: trash) scifi novels about a guy getting sucked back in time to dinosaur times where literally no humans exist but they always end the same way: mental illness and getting eaten

>>21420481
I might just have to bite the bullet and read it. I started it before it got popular and was turned off from it. While I am not above junk novels, it didn't suck me in the story. But I suppose I am asking for it when I ask for a novel of MC braving the world on his own without more explanation.
I don't need him to be the best, in fact I enjoy it more when the MC is present with a seemingly unfair challenge he must overcome by careful planning. The gun part is not essential, it boils down to my preference of combar, since a gunman using terrain and traps in order to fell down a monster that can rip him to shreds if it comes close feels closer to survival than charging in headfirst and bashiing it's skull.
>>21420487
I am willing to read those trash novels if they are good by at least some standard.

>>21420518
The Dechronization of Sam Magruder by George Gaylord Simpson
it's terrible, but ever since I first learned of it through the September 1999 issue of Scientific American it has, regrettably and against my will, stuck in my mind

>>21420518
>>21420426
Incidentally, I should add that despite your allusion to "Lone Gunslunger" protagonists, this abject loner mentality you seem to desire of the character does not exist in any piece of Western fiction (that is The American [Old/Wild] West) that I've ever been exposed to. The closest I've ever seen it get was the movie Jeremiah Johnson, a mountain man, but even then he had a few indian and mountain man allies and an indian wife and child (they were killed though).

But at any rate, books are written by humans for humans, and the overwhelming majority of humans, being social animals, are interested in social interactions beyond murder.

>>21420583
That is all true, yet I would counter with the fact that so many novels focus on the protagonist himself, his inner struggles, while the side characters are there for him to bounce off and enchance the struggle. It is still surprising to me it hasn't birthed a novel with an extreme conclusion to that path.
I am an esl and should probably give more details of what I am asking.
The search for a solo MC comes from the feeling of dissapointment many of those trash novels gave me with a weak cast meant only to fulfill author's bad taste. This is my own fault for reading the bottom of the barrel novels, I am aware of that. I mentioned Ultimate Evolution earlier, which has a constant party for the majority of the story, they are impactful and not just talking heads placed there to sing praises. The combat is fairly evenly split between fighting as a team, and MC doing schemes on his own. I enjoyed it for all it's faults, so I am not against a party, as long as it isn't everpresent and the story is still about our main guy, not the party as a whole. I hope what I am saying is coming across at least a bit better now, since I am relaxing the bounds of my request. A protagonist centric story is the new direction, since a story with an island unto himself doesn't seem to exist.

>>21420426
>Is it so hard to have a novel about a gun tottin adventurer, journeying around this new world, braving the danger with nothing but his trusty weapon? I understand I am digging around the bin hoping to find treasure, but surely there must be something throughout all these years written.

You have to understand modern western author. Most are the products of western upbringing (western left leaning or western right leaning, actually political side is irrelevant here, as long as its western) The things they value most are friends/friendships/love, belonging to a community. Any western book about a loner mc will portray him as either mentally retarded, autistic(kek) or extremely introverted, or psycho killer with no real motivation, it will be some sort of poorly written deep psychological thriller that even those non existent introverts won't have any interest in.
There is a lot of creativity in western literature (compared to the east) however it is within the bounds of western culture and western values (left or right), but it does not go out of those bounds.
A strong, intelligent mc who fights alone, who is good at it, who has his own real motivations, who is intelligent and not mentally stunted in any way and just does what he needs to do regardless of what others think about him, who doesn't really care about friends or love interests too much is a character type that is discouraged in the west(by both left and right politics, dominant western mentality and western values). A western author can't just create and write a character (and related story) that he was taught conciously and subconciously from young age not to be like. This idea itself will not cross most authors minds.

>>21420017
Lord of the Mysteries of course

>>21420318
I Shall Seal The Heavens

>>21420652
I said novel, not your garbage.

>>21420655
did you not read system apocalypse (a GAME lit) ?

>>21420017
Mostly Christmas stuff this upcoming weekend, all really short.

>How The Grinch Stole Christmas
>A Christmas Carol
>The Polar Express
>The Gift of The Magi
>The Nutcracker & The Mouse King

It's gonna be comfy.

Wait are Wolfe's books actually good or people are just memeing it?
I never read them but people in the /lit/ top 100 thread shit on them a lot.

>>21420704
Even Brando Sando admits Wolfe is SFF's best author.

>>21420318
Infinite Realm? Primal Hunter?

>>21420704
Have you tried reading them and forming your own opinion on them rather than relying on anonymous internet strangers?

>>21420704
Have you tried browsing the archives, newfag?

>>21420704
The Fifth Head of Cerberus is top tier

>>21420711
Infinite Realm maybe with regards to Ryun, but he still has a pretty strong support network. Primal Hunter I suppose he's a lone wolf for the most part at least, but it has the townbuilding stuff he's not a fan of, apparently, albeit it's basically shunted off to somebody else first chance the protagonist gets.

>>21420748
>it's basically shunted off to somebody else first chance the protagonist gets.
same for ryun lel

>>21420711
>>21420748
Even if technically mc is not within a party in Primal Hunter, the story and character development happens only when mc is interacting with others, he might as well be in a party, when mc alone is just boring skills grind and level up.
I only read the first book, I don't know maybe it improves in later books.

>>21420757
>sole survivor of intro level becomes a landholder in the new world and hands over administrative control to the first woman he meets
How could this be the setup for two different series

>>21420798
>>sole survivor of intro level becomes a landholder in the new world and
>hands over administrative control to the first woman he meets
Sounds pozzed

>>21420797
>character development happens only when mc is interacting with others
Sounds like a life lesson...

Reading the Three Body Problem and Reverend Insanity in my language (not Chinese but close) is a totally different experience.
A lot of things are lost in the English translation and the prose is dry as hell.

>>21420810
>A lot of things are lost in the English translation
can you provide some examples?

>>21413278
I liked the first law trilogy, mix of lots of fantasy genres in a good way, like the main cast goes on a LOTR style adventure but theres also a separate war going on in the background, didnt read Lynch

>>21414157
thats his ex-wife though?

>>21420810
Honestly I hate Ken Liu having a monopoly on Chinese to english SF translations. Ive read his English writing and its dry despite being native prose.

>>21418682
you're actually a fuckwit. read the poem "the wanderer". if you want to say anything in the direction of that not being anglo-saxon then just go to bed already

>>21420810
The first book was (mostly) fine but the second I think they changed the translator, dry and monotonous is an apt description. Also the fact the Chinese names all seemed to consist of the same 5 syllables made knowing who anyone was a struggle.

>>21420810
and i think you're full of shit and trying to feel special. what did you read, the japanese version? korean? according to your larp act here, something was lost there too.

Planning to start reading Peter F Hamilton, should i start with Night's Dawn trilogy or with the Commonwealth saga?

>>21420017
The Dragon Republic - R.F. Kuang. Half way don't and it's enjoyable

>reading the lesser lesser known novels of well established authors
>or giving in and reading sandermeme
bros...

>>21419472
I read him for the rape.

>>21420877
You could also read the novels that inspired the established authors.

>>21420017
eon by greg bear. Saw he died and was mostly known for halo and had never read his shit. Apparently this series is one of his good ones. It's not bad so far.

>filters all of /lit/ and /sffg/
how can one man be so based?

>>21420894
kek is that in a parking garage

>>21420867
Nigts Dawn is mediocre but it has three books, Commonwealth saga is better but only has two books.

>>21420885
Based.

>>21420905
It's the Sandercave

>>21420798
I'm pretty sure Randidly Ghosthound does a similar thing (though it's moreso a settlement just kind of builds up around him while he barely takes part) but I've forgotten so much of that boring nonsense.

>>21420960
He gives his town to that bratty kid who then kind of grows into the role

>>21420885
> Blood Music
> Eon
> Forge of God
> Darwin's Radio
> Queen of Angels
> + others
His early stuff is fantastic. I'm not sure why he then seemed to transition to being a commissioned author for other works (Foundation, Hazo, Star Wars, Star Trek, Man-Kzin Wars)

>>21420963
So it's a recurring thing with this kind of deal, probably moreso because "loner protagonist doesn't wanna get bogged down with citybuilding so just kind of says fuck it and pushes it onto somebody who likes that". DotF kinda had it similar, but as I recall Zac was pretty invested in the city.

>>21420704
Yes they are good. That doesn’t mean they are the best ever as redditors claim. The hate for them is mostly pushback against wolfefags.
>>21420708
The fact that every reddit author looks up to Wolfe or borges speaks volumes.

>>21420905
It's the entrance to his underground city where every woman is forced to be barefoot

>>21420973
>>21420924
I'll probably check all these out. I'm enjoying what I've read so far and I don't have much else if anything on my backlog

>>21420974
How is Wolfe reddit when he is Catholic, not soi, shits on communism/hivemind mentality with the ascians, and "abuses women"? All things reddit clutches its pearls for. He is a based old school white man, which is bad today.

>>21420999
>catholic
>based
IMAO

just finished children of dune. so is the whole series going to be one big tease of incest?

>>21421049
Catholic authors
>Gene Wolfe
>G K Chesterton
>Stephen Lawhead
>JRR Tolkien
Pr*testoid authors
>GRRM
>Michael Moorcock
>Oliver Cromwell
>Joel Osteen

>>21421059
all of those authors are great except for grrm. what're you getting at?

>>21420851
He doesn't at all though. He didn't even translate all of the Cixin Liu novels. Its just that you're unaware of what's been translated.

>>21421059
GURM is Jewish though

>>21420856
The wanderer is literally about a guy remembering fondly his warrior comrades you retard
You really think Anglo Saxons didn't value heroism, bloodshed and glory? you think they didn't revere warriors and bright swords? Are you retarded? Do you know anything about anglo saxon history or culture at all?

>>21421059
>In response to a question on his religious views, Martin replied: "I suppose I'm a lapsed Catholic. You would consider me an atheist or agnostic. I find religion and spirituality fascinating. I would like to believe this isn't the end and there's something more, but I can't convince the rational part of me that makes any sense whatsoever."[159]
Why are tradcath larper wolfe fans so delusional?

>>21421059
Based Lawhead enjoyer. He's underrated.

>>21421134
So Martin is a midwit as we know

need a global ban on series. only standalone allowed.

>>21421059
You forgot the Catholic GOAT, R. A. Lafferty

>>21421238
Do you have a maximum length as well? Some single books are the length of an entire series of other books.

>>21421260
max length: 1200 pages and not one more

>>21421262
too long

>>21421262
That's as much as a trilogy of 400 page books. It needs to be a much, much, lower cap than that.

>>21421265
>>21421275
halve it.

>>21413278
The blade itself is great until you reach the end and every character is ruined

What's the difference between Mistborn era 1 and 2?

Hello my fellow daoists, what are you reading now

>>21421362
That's a question you can google.

>>21421362
one is a jrpg the other is an open world third-person action videogame

>>21421362
The former Medieval Europe and the latter is Industrial Age Europe.

>>21421375
>Expecting retards to use a search engine to answer basic questions.

>>21416131
Christ, people actually read that garbage? The sentence alone makes me want to kill myself.

>>21420426
Musashi

>>21421509
All that means, is that you have standards when it comes to reading.

>>21421509
As far as I know, it’s just one fag that spans it

>>21421134
>"I suppose I'm a lapsed Catholic. You would consider me an atheist or agnostic.
In other words, a protestant

>>21421573
Why do you even bother, no one cares.

>>21420894
WHY IS HE ALWAYS SWEATY??

>>21421652
it's called working

>>21421652
It’s called going outside.

>>21421663
>>21421668
Cope faggets. Bakker doesn't sweat

>>21421671
Is that all you have to say?

I compulsively picked up reading as a hobby this time last year, stopped in july, and now i'm back again. I just finished Words of Radiance and The Fellowship of the Ring. Gonna keep on with LOTR

I was listening to an interview with Steven Erikson and he said that when he set out to write Malazan he wanted to write a fantasy series that wasn't eurocentric and where the sexes were completely equal because both of them could use magic.

Is there any actual reason to assume gender roles would be any different if women could do magic? Honestly I am not that misogynistic but let's be serious men with magic would just team up to btfo the women and make sure any future female mages would be nipped at the bud. Honestly all modern fantasy is cancerous because its just progressives trying to insert their values into mythmaking

>>21421668
>>21421663
>>21421652
He is overweight
Fat people sweat a lot because they are too insulated

>>21421741
Gender roles would be different in a world with magic. They would not be equal.

>>21421741
you're being kind of retarded. Malazan is heavily characterized by having a shit ton of autistically detailed societies and microsocieties across every speck of the world and there are groups and peoples within the series that do oppress women in the way you're describing. the reason it's not universal is because of the Malaz empire that's highly imperialistic and decided that women as a tool within their military was a tool that they could use to further fuel their own expansion

>>21421760
Malazan is so bizarre tonally. On one hand you've got a lot of stuff that comes across as neoconservative military worship, combined with a bunch of neoliberal sjw nonsense. It's the most boomer series I've ever read. It ticks all the stereotypical out of touch boomer boxes from BOTH sides of the political spectrum.

>>21421741
Glen Cook has a sort of long running thesis in Darkwar that the (((trader males))) would eventually seize power even if females were larger, stronger, and better at magic.

>>21421260
Anything more than 200 pages is indulgent rubbish

>>21421741
>Is there any actual reason to assume gender roles would be any different if women could do magic?
Yes. Unless you're also assuming that women and men are also cognitively and physiologically homogenous too

>>21421741
Wow, it's almost as if its a fantasy world.

>>21421738
okay

>>21421741
It’s a fantasy world, what else did you expect.

>>21420894

>>21421489
Don't know what I was expecting at this point.

>>21421886
Then there’s no books.

>>21421990
Realism.

>>21421997
Don’t expect anything at this point. There’s no point.

>>21422008
based retard

>>21421741
>man wields huge sword twice his size
>OMG based!!!
>Women uses a short sword
>CRINGE AND ONIONS AND CHUDPILLED BAKA THE WEST IS FALLEN!!!
seek help.

>>21422036
Women have no place in male oriented fantasy, a woman may be mentioned maybe once every 10 chapters but its best to not do it all, women simply have no relevance to the story, characters etc. They can exist as housewives or prostitutes but should not be mentioned just like countless nameless characters which exist are not mentioned, the reader is only told once that there is a population of about 100 thousand people in a city, thats all the mention they should get.

>>21421810
This explains why I find Malazan so weird and difficult to get into when I first tried. I'm reading the second book in the series and it's decent so far.

Why didnt Elric just kill his male cousin, impregnate his female cousin and just stay at home?
I feel like 90% of books could've ended in a couple of chapters.
>heh, I finally defeated my cousin and have powerful sword
>i return home where my hot cousin waits for me
>i am king too btw
HOL UP LEMME PUT MYSELF IN A SITUATION AND LEAVE FOR AVENTURE AND KNOWLEDGE

Maybe that's why it is called fantasy afterall, because retard characters do retarded things, not because of magic and diffrent worlds.

>>21415442
[/spoiler]There's plenty of plot threads that could be used. The abomination causing chaos everywhere, the Obsidians ravaging the rim, a Society civil war, Quicksilver's secret space city and potentially an army of robot terminators + enhanced LowColors, Diomedes allying with the Republic, who knows really. [/spoiler]

>>21422376
ctrl + s idiot.

Books with very likable and charismatic main characters? Looking for something that makes me genuinely invested

>>21422407
Try searching on goodreads.

>>21421121
no its not you fucking idiot. that's the plot. its about something else entirely

>>21422461
retarded tolkiendrone

New Thead
>>21422665

New thread
>>21422679