/lit/ - Literature

BAKKER is KING of /sffg/

Simple as.

Bakker is a fucking faggot who writes faggoty faggotry for faggots. All of his characters are literally faggots and faggot around with each other.

>>21391224
I just started reading the Wandering Inn. Have I been memed?

>>21391282
Yeah you should've read I Shall Seal The Heavens instead

>>21391282
The people who love it, love it. It's worth trying to see if you're one. For myself, can't say I dropped it, but I'm two volumes behind on the audiobook and every time I finish something I choose something else rather than go back to it.

Facts about R. Scott Bakker:
1. King of fantasy
2. Tall, blond, and handsome
3. Not a virgin
4. Would destroy Sandersnoy in a fight
5. Greatest philosopher since Plato
6. Considers gay sex repulsive, wrote 7 books just to prove it
7. Doesn't tell anyone but agrees with Kellhus (pbuh)

>>21391282
If you hate interesting characters and are into women drama and c**ming then continue reading it.

>>21380743
read harry potter

Read The Wandering Inn, Read Mother of Learning, Read I Shall Seal the Heavens.

Also read The Prince of Nothing, Neuromancer, Cradle, A Song of Ice and Fire, Hyperion, Between Two Fires, The Poppy War.

I will probably read this Bakker guy that you guys seem to obsess about.

I hope it’s worth it.

>>21391296
If Bakker is a tall blond, why is his self insert a short, fat, balding, swarthy, whiny beta who gets cucked by a tall blond gigachad? Am I the only one who finds it very funny?

>>21391564
Bajker said that he didn't put self-inserts in the story but he feels closest to Proyas

>>21391253
>>21391296
>>21391637
>>21391514

>>21391261
>t. curved phalluslet

>>21391224
I desperately need middle-eastern inspired fantasy. Can you guys rec me anything?

>>21392102
vathek

>redemption's blade
>Nedlam is a simple but sometimes surprisingly insightful brute
>salvation's fire
>me big dumb orc me only know how smash with me club hurrr

>>21392214
Found your issue.

>>21392214
>redemption's blade
>soulless hodgepodge where nobody and nothing is truly unique. every man and woman can function on the same level.

>salvation's fire
>realistic views on species, race. people truly are different from each other, it isn't something to be ashamed about, it's simply the way things are. people find their way in life according to their ability, are able to find satisfaction because the author isn't forcing the characters into incongruent roles just for the sake of appeasing critics on the internet.

what the fuck is the point of creating a different species/race in a fantasy story if they're just humans but... green. humans but... they have horns on their head? humans but... they've got pointy tails? fuck off with that shit already.

>>21392102
R. Scott Bakker - The Second Apocalypse

well I'm glad that anon recommended to read past Red Rising which felt like a lidl hunger games
this might have been the best middle book in a trilogy I've read so far, very good
I'm afraid I don't know my Roman history all that well but I suppose this is all supposed to eventually lead to the equivalent of a successful Servile War?

>>21392381
oops forgot picture

Has there ever been an inverted "Left Hand of Darkness", where a humanoid (not necessarily) alien diplomat arrives alone on Earth (with good intentions)?

>>21392320
No.
>>21392199
Yes.

Longshot but can anyone help me remember a megastructure novel, all I remembred its that it had a b&w cover and was about some sort of overgrown urban sprawl sort of like Kowloon/Blame! I read about it like 10 years ago and it suddenly popped in my head to search for it. Goodreads didnt cough up shit.

>>21391224
>hmm I’m nearing the end of my story. What endings should I give the most likeable secondary characters with the best chemistry in a series?
>oh, I know! I’ll kill off all four of them in two pages for no reason at all.
>how does the character where it’s emphasized multiple times that he’s immune to fire die? Burned to death! Fuck you!
>and then I’ll kill off everyone else too!
>fuck you for reading this! I hate you, reader! You have been Punk’d!
I hate Slavs so much what the fuck

>>21391224
City of Last Chances - Adrian Tchaikovsky (2022)

City of Last Chances was nominally a fantasy novel, but it obscured that so often that at times it seemed like anything fantastical could almost be considered as metaphorical instead. There were gods, demons, curses, possession, magic, interdimensional traveling, and other stuff, but it's not what the novel is about. There's a lot about how the Pallesand Archipelago is conquering and oppressing everyone in their quest to establish what they believe to be utopian socialism. It didn't explicitly say that, but it was heavily implied. The name may or may not have been a reference to Solzhenitsyn's Gulag Archipelago, and/or the British Isles and Empire, especially as depicted in Orwell's 1984. They're all about controlling every aspect of behavior to come closer to their arbitrary ideal of perfection.

The novel had an unusual narrative structure where the viewpoint moved from one character to another from chapter to chapter. Some characters only had a single chapter and others had several. It began by establishing the primary viewpoints which were often included in the other viewpoints. A minor character in one viewpoint became the viewpoint in the next chapter and so on. I wanted to call this a mosaic novel but the paths of the characters are too overlapping for that to seem accurate. A few chapters were explicitly called mosaic because the narrator is the viewpoint in them, which was odd because there wasn't a frame story. The author simply described what happened as an omniscient narrator. The chapters open with similar narration.

The narrative was also different in its neutrality, as it's more an exploration of ongoing events through the lives of the characters rather than being about the characters themselves. So, in a way, the city could be considered a character, which is something I've seen in several books published in 2022. The downside was that because of the constantly changing perspective the characters were underdeveloped. I also disliked them. They're almost all stock characters with nothing to particularly distinguish them. The most egregious to me were the overeager and blindly idealistic college students eager to be martyrs for the revolution.

I don't know what this novel was meant to be about. To be entirely reductive, it's about the consequences following the theft of a magical item that leads to the death of one of the most important government officials. Everyone then wanted wanted to know who had the magical item and where it was. There were also various factions that worked towards revolution, but each had their own methods and incompatible end goals. I wouldn't be so concerned about what it meant if it weren't that it seemed like it was constantly trying to say something meaningful. Maybe that was intended or I read too much into it, but it left me unsatisfied.

Rating: 2.5/5

>>21392882
I've now read a book that was published in each month of 2022 in the month that it was published. I don't think I'll try doing so again. I tried briefly looking at many of the SFF books that came out each month, mostly from traditional publishers. I read 21 books that were published in 2022.

Some of the novels relevant to /sffg/ were:
Jan: Engines of Empire, The Age of Uprising #1 - Richard S. Ford
Feb: The Justice of Kings, Empire of the Wolf #1 - Richard Swan
Mar: The Kaiju Preservation Society - John Scalzi
Apr: Sea of Tranquility - Emily St. John Mandel
May: Eversion - Alastair Reynolds
Jun: Speaking Bones, The Dandelion Dynasty #4 - Ken Liu
Jul: Dreadgod, Cradle #11 - Will Wight
Aug: Priest of Crowns, War for the Rose Throne #4 - Peter McLean
Sep: Nona The Ninth, Locked Tomb #3 - Tamsyn Muir
Oct: Station Eternity, The Midsolar Murders #1 - Muir Lafferty
Nov: The Lost Metal, Wax & Wayne #4 / Mistborn #7 - Brandon Sanderson
Dec: City of Last Chances - Adrian Tchaikovsky

>>21392882
>tchaikovsky
Children of Memory was also a letdown.

First animated adaptation of award-winning sci-fi trilogy ‘The Three-Body Problem’ debuts to rave reviews

>>21392938
How unfortunate.

>>21393013
is it in Chinese or English?

>>21393013
I saw something about this on /tv/. It looks like utter shit.

>>21393044
There are english subs if you know where to get your anime from.

>>21392882
>>21392891
your """reviews""" are shit
FUCK OFF

>>21391224
Faustering Fost is just utter shit. For a "smut" novel it has one sex scene in the first 20% of the book. You'd think that for such a dirth os smut in a smut book the story would make up for it. But no, the plot is basically some isekai shit with some annoying asshole of a protag who spends his time making stupid deals repeating the same words again and again.

>>21393352
I'd rather have effortposts than shitposts

>>21392882
you're reviews are cute fuck on!

>>21393352
>>21393776
the duality of man

>>21393364
Just stick to Literotica retard. You shouldn't expect a fixed level of smut content from Amazon trash writers not should they feel compelled to deliver such.

When does Lord of the Mysteries get bad ?

I'm looking for some fantasy or sci-fi novels that heavily feature casinos, games of chance that have been created for the book are a big bonus. I've already read Red Seas Under Red Skies.

>>21394172
nta
I prefer asstr myself.

>>21394211
First page

>>21394481
filtered

Wings of fire 8: Escaping Peril.

I never thought I could enjoy a mass murderer this much.

Escaping Peril was character story first and foremost, completely deserving of the excitement I had going into it. It was more of a side quest than the previous books and probably could have been reworked into a solo novel with minimal changes, it does tie into the story nicely at the end and I had a great time with it. This book felt different. It felt like it was written for little children- and children only . There were many caps, too much emphasis, and Peril is an extremely childish character who largely acts like she was born yesterday and is a hair-trigger away from mass murder multiple times. Tui absolutely nailed Peril as a point of view. Every word mirrored Peril’s possessive, childish, bloodthirsty and and altogether very unstable personality. Some of it was over-exaggerated, but it is very clear that Peril is a completely different dragon than others, with her unique one tracked mind because she has been killing since she was a dragonet (baby dragon), when someone is hostile or irritable to her, she hopes that they attack her so she can freely murder them.

Peril to other dragons is a weird, crazy sociopathic dragon who can kill effortlessly and that's exactly how I felt when I first read Escaping Peril. across the story I realized that she changed. From the beginning she always obsessed over Clay, Scarlet and her Killing potential, but near the end, she thought less about aproval and more as a normal-ish sane pov, completing her arc. Peril is hilarious. Honestly, the author's writing style ensures that all her books are humorous, She has no filter, and says whatever she's thinking regardless of how awkward that makes other dragons feel. Which leads to some pretty damn funny conversations.

The plot moves at a fast clip and lot happens in this story both to Peril and dragon society as a whole desu, You wouldn't expect it from the more personalized stakes involved here but there were actually a large number of twists happened throughout. The third act involves a lot of twists, which frankly, I should have seen coming after the magic seen in the last book.

4.8/5: The best thing in the series since darkstalker's standalone book.

>>21394385
It's that still around? .org was in pretty sad shape last time I looked.

>>21394614
your """reviews""" are shit
fuck off

The Judging Eye was like a breath of fresh air. Hardly any Kellhus. Akka getting some young pussy. Delving into the depths of Eärwa and learning more about the Nonmen. Watching the little zoomer go full chaos mode.

>here's your fantasy map bro

>>21395005
mfw the kingdom of uncivilized barbarians is canada

>>21395016
australia became the abyss and is now home to demons

>>21395016
Huh. I never knew it had a map.

>>21395016
Do you still get skulled entering the abyss?

I just finished The Last Wish (Andrzej Sapkowski), decent short stories, should I continue The Witcher series? Please don't meme me like you did with Hyperion.

>>21395281
>The Last Wish
>Sword of Destiny
These two are equally good, and maybe the best the series gets. The writer is way better at short stories than full books.
>Blood of Elves
Starts getting a bit dull; Ciri is unlikeable
>Time of Contempt
Oh my god it’s so boring and stupid. This guy cannot write political intrigue. Fuck me.
>Baptism of Fire
This is awesome! My favorite book in the series! Compelling and interesting characters/dialogue/events!
>The Tower of the Swallow
I do not remember anything about this book.
>The Lady of the Lake
Fuck you. Fuck you you old bastard. You just fucking killed everyone and did nothing with the prophecy? The entire series feels like a waste of my time now.
>Season of Storms
Haven’t read

>>21395281
Read Sword of Destiny and call it quits, unless you intend to play the game trilogy. The main saga is awful compared to the short stories. Baptism of Fire is mostly banter between Geralt and his bros, which is fun. The rest are mostly shit.

>>21394854
Glad you're enjoyig nonmen cause you're in for some nonmen on top of nonmen nonmenning the nonmen. Bakker is going to carefully lead you through each one of 1040602007744 stone carvings these albino faggots created while going mad and having gay sex cause all their women got deleted

>>21395296
I honestly don’t understand how the person that wrote Baptism of Fire also wrote all that other crap. Like brother you hit gold, why do you need to keep going back to entire chapters of random foot soldiers and political stuff that no one cares about or wants? Why do we need another random person madly in love with Ciri? He’s really, really good at writing quirky sentient magical creatures, but he kept trying to write GoT-type human intrigue and it was awful.

I finished reading The Stars My Destination a week ago. I thought it was mediocre after finishing it, but its memory grew on me and I began to miss it.
Book recs similar to it?

>>21395281
Read the source he ripped off (Elric) instead

the absolute state

>>21395459
Lol, christcucks are such snowflakes.

>>21395459
What the fuck is action books?

>>21395492
Patterson, King, et al

>>21395459
>romance
ask your dad to get you a chuck tingle book for shits and giggles lmao

>>21391224
Daily reminder that Fostering faust is shit

>>21394633
.xyz (kind of) works

>nobody wants to read about a noble savage trapising across a sword & sorcery setting who is strong because he was injected with nanomachines, son
feels bad man
great to see another day of wot, asoiaf, twi discussion, bspam, and blatant underage shitposting fuck yeah seaking

>>21391224
It’s a bit sad when only /sffg/ reads…
Hyperion Cantos lecture incoming
https://youtu.be/2dbg9CWfYYs

I just finished the forever war
An absolutely dismal future but luckily a good ending for the heterosexuals
I would have killed myself if I didn't die in the first battle

>>21395168
yea

>>21396069
It's a special kind of kino that triggers woke and /pol/fags alike.

>>21396081
lmfao

>>21394854
I should reread this. I liked PON so much that I went right into The Judging Eye and White Luck Warrior and found they sort of dragged.

Story picks up significantly at The Great Ordeal. I honestly felt Bakker needed a better editor. The story felt even more on rails than the first three, and could have easily been two books for the main plot points.

But they actually do have a ton of good stuff and since it is unclear if we will ever get more Bakker I am very thankful for them. It isn't bad, it's just less relevant.

I think the series would be tighter if a bunch of this material was kicked out to stand alone books, sort of what Alistair Reynolds did with Chasm City and The Prefect, which are my favorite Revelation Space books despite being stand alones. The non-man shit in general would be better delivered all at once, separate from the main story as its own fulfilling arc, and then the intersection with the main story could be a mystery until you read the tie in.

Sort of like how it seems like Bakker is writing prequels for the No God, which must be a way to explain the ending in various ways since you know where the story ends up in the future when you write prequels in any series.

But you're in for a treat with the Survivor, the climax, etc. There is almost no Kellhus POVs in the whole series. They are few and far between but some of the best parts. He knows too much now so Bakker has to narrate around his supernatural reasoning about future events, etc.

>>21392381
>>21392391
Unfortunately, what the editors did to Red Rising is a huge filter for the series. Golden Son and Dark Age are some of the most riveting, edge of your seat fiction I've read, and it sustains it for the entire book each time. Brown is very good at introducing lots of threads and places a story can go and then surprising you. It does not feel on rails at all.

The premise of the story is kind of silly. It was made even more silly by the editing of Book I, and while it is neat how you keep thinking you're reading one kind of book, and then it totally "shifts the paradigm," the suspension of belief is a little hard. This goes away significantly in Golden Son and on, as he fleshes out the world and culture way more, and you realize the color scheme is just a way to get to classical Greece/Rome worshiping genetically engineered, honor obsessed super humans fighting for control of the solar system.

The third book isn't quite as good as the second because the end comes in a bit of a rush, and there is a somewhat hackneyed part near the end that you'll know when you see it, but book five is potentially even better than Golden Son and holds it for all 800 pages.

Great series. We're getting two new books over 800 pages in 2023. There is apparently a show coming out. I don't know how they will handle that decently, but it will at least blow up the spotlight on a very good series and make it more likely we get a game out of it. The world could make for a great RPG/adventure or RTS that has a space combat fleet mode, tactical squad mode, and big battle mode for Iron Rains.

>>21391637
Bakker clearly has self inserts lol. Akka is Bible in Neuropath and Kellhus is Niel. He has two inserts, a Dr. Jekyll and a Mr. Hyde.

What is hilarious is how he has the smart, penetrating philosopher he can be in writing constantly cuckold the doubting scholar side of himself. Some issues going on?

Is Disciple of the Dog any good? I did really like everything else he has written. Didn't know how he'd do detective fiction though.

Fuuuuck I'm late on my goodreads. Recommend novellas

>>21396273
Helmet of Horror, surrealist take on the Theseus myth. Written as a chat log so it is very fast.

Crying of Lot 49 - more fantastical than fantasy. The prose is sense but it is short. For more literary short works there is The Stranger and Notes From The Underground.

Red Rising is as quick as a novela and getting through the first book gets you to the better stuff. They are very quick reads.

Bakker has Neuropath which has airport book style thriller page turning prose but is a neat look at epiphenomenalism and eliminative materialism as horror.

The Hellbound Heart, the Hell raider story, is very short too.

>author makes character that shares literally any of his own interests
>LOOK LOOK, IT'S A HECKIN SELF-INSERT BROS!
>AKKA AND BAKKER BOTH GET PHILOSOPHICAL AND ARE SCHOLARS A SO IT'S SELF-INSERT SELF-INSERT LOOK HOW SMART I AM GUYS I'M LIKE THE ONLY PERSON TO HAVE EVER MADE THIS CONNECTION

>>21396442
his self insert is kelhus because they're both 2nihilistic4u fedora incel losers

>>21396430
How was Crying of Lot 49 fantastical? It's pretty much a proto City of Glass

>>21396273

>>21395492
Boomers had a whole market for low brow westerns and stuff, that basically doesn't exist now, because everyone can watch action movies on demand.

>>21396442
The entire idea of self insert is weird.
All of the characters are self insert.
Same as in dreams.

>>21396663
>All of the characters are self insert.
idk about that, anon...

>>21396430
>>21396550

Thanks frens

>>21396479
The entire medieval mail conspiracy driving politics around the globe for centuries is what I was thinking of.

Why does he make /sffg/ seethe so much?

>>21397160
He's unique, successful, prolific and his down to earth and simple prose is poison to the pseuds that browse here

Are there any other books with main characters like Cugel?

>>21397386
most books have main characters

>>21397421
Most books are text books and instructional booklets, in which case the main characters used are in the English alphabet and Arabic numerals

>>21397160
He's popular and successful

Any fiction like this? Lovecraftian conspiracy fiction???

>>21397386
It's a whole genre.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picaresque_novel
>William S. Burroughs was a devoted fan of picaresque novels, and gave a series of lectures involving the topic in 1979 at Naropa University in Colorado. He says it is impossible to separate the anti-hero from the picaresque novel, that most of these are funny, and they all have protagonist who are outsiders by their nature. His list of picaresque novels includes Petronius' novel Satyricon (54–68 AD), The Unfortunate Traveller (1594) by Thomas Nashe, both Maiden Voyage (1943) and A Voice Through a Cloud (1950) by Denton Welch, Two Serious Ladies (1943) by Jane Bowles, Death on Credit (1936) by Louis-Ferdinand Céline, and even himself.
Eyes of the Overworld Cugel is really good though. Probably the best from any English speaking writer full stop.

>>21392102
Rose of the Prophet
Dread Empire
Sword-Dancer

My local book store has a first edition copy Ubik listed for $200. It's been there for a couple of years now. The current blue hair manager only cares about SJW lit and had no idea who PKD was. She often gives me discounts "to move old stock". Do you guys think it would be worth it if I could pick it up for $100?

>>21397713
Yeah great book half the new paperback books are almost 25 bucks lol

>>21397713
No.

Everytime i read fantasy/scifi books i imagine that all of the female characters have big butts. Should i be worried?

>>21397740
>>21397739

>>21397713
What's the book shop name? If it's in a good condish, I will steal it before you get it.

>>21397386
Why are you asking this question here when you could just google it?

>>21397794
Some people here just get dopamine from (you)s.

>>21397799
its true, thats why I keep asking if I should read books I already read

>>21397814
first time false flagging?
>>21397799
>>21397794
perhaps they just want to... discuss books?

>>21397824
If you haven't realised this entire website is a place to complain and bitch about the state of your hobby, and to never discuss the actual content, then you are probably a blind redditor.

>>21397829
the coomer boards seem to stay on topic just fine, and you never see anyone yelling at each other on /pol/ to stay on topic. it's ironically ONLY the people who act like they're better than the rest of the site for having "actual hobbies" that can't actually discuss anything. absolute laugh that 2016 election tourists have better attention spans than you retards.

>>21397869
Yeah. I go on /tg/ a lot and it's hard to stay on topic despite having the same generals like this for games. Maybe it's just ego, like you say.

>>21397869
Seriously just go back to goodreads/r*ddit. You have been on this site for a while and you still can't accept the culture here, just move on because this site will not change just to suit your r*dditor needs.

>>21397160
I read Warbreaker and will never touch anything written by this faggot ever again.

>>21391224
I love the stormlight archives and /lit/ can seethe about it :)

>>21397968
Warbreaker is probably his worst cosmere novel lmfao. Why would you pick THAT one out of all of them? Did you intentionally want to hate him?

>>21397794
Good point, why post or comment anything here when you can just Google it?

>>21398012
>book 5 comes out in fall 2024
damn, I was hoping it came out next year so /sffg/ could be swamped in Stormlight discussion about best sword

>>21397869
pretty much ego

last cradle book release some anons was talking about the new book and someone got called a incel for being mad at them, then the said incel started reposting every reply from the book discussion but without the spoiler covering the text just for spite

someone talks about litrpg and boomer have a meltie

anon posts his review and boomer have a meltie

someone say they finished X book and boomer have a meltie

anon ask something about book and boomer tell him too use google instead

is always the same people crying about the quality of the thread that ruins the thread starting pointless discussion

>>21398014
it's his best novel period. everything else is literally just marvel capeshit for r*ddit fantasy nerds. crazy how he honestly could've been a great author if he kept writing stuff like warbreaker. i dont know why that anon didn't like it, but if didn't like warbreaker, then he certainly wouldn't like the rest considering how shit it at all is.

Read Night Land

>>21398085
I already did

>>21398085
I got part way through and found the voice really lovely, but I just moved into a new house and left all my old shit at my mother's. I will have to go pick it up come Xmas. Thanks for reminding me of this.

Im too stupid to understand what good prose looks like

>>21392938
>Children of Memory was also a letdown.
Isn't that scheduled for 2023?

>>21398144
Mervyn Peake

Thoughts on The Expanse?

>>21398179
based and bluepilled

>>21391224
Why is every OP image on this general some AI-generated, creatively bereft digital horseshit? It must be a janny conspiracy

the moment they posted that bakker fan face the supreme spammer disappears, make you think

>>21391564
Getting mad about an author's perceived self-insert is retarded. A) every author self-inserts, it's impossible not to and B) if you like the story so much and found the characters compelling, why are you shitting on Bakker for it?

>It was said about the inn that Otter Gimpknee's whores were being fucked bowlegged by beardless boys in the sashes."
Might be the craziest sentence I've read in a book. Goddamn GRRM is horny.

>>21398216
GRRM is honest

I'm becoming a webnovel degenerate. It all started with Mother of Learning, now I'm reading erotica and haremshit whenever I'm free.

>>21398144
This depends on the type. On one end is the more elementary, and straightforward brand of prose; on the other lie the more poetic, stylized varieties (and everything in-between, of course). Normies who have the vocabulary of a middle schooler, a shoddy imagination, and the attention span of a zoomer tend to enjoy the former. Neither is truly "wrong", and it largely depends on the age group you're writing for.

>>21398221
Sounds good. I'm horny, like GRRM-level horny. Anything you can rec?

>>21394854
I'm waiting twenty years to read the second series, just like it is in the timeline.

>>21398221
>erotica and haremshit
like...?

>>21396069
It sounds extremely hard to read, from the summary. What would you rate the difficulty on a scale out of 10?

>>21398179
Literally got of science fiction (in other words not real scifi but more of action in space), also liberal/antiwhite, full of progressive tropes, first few books were barely ok later it turned to shit, tv show has nice effects and space setting but everything else about it is shit.

>>21398254
It's really easy

>>21398221
>started with Mother of Learning
I am so sorry anon

>>21398269
>ERROR 422 (Unproccesible Entity):"It's really easy" is not an integer.

Read em

>>21398280
I tried. It's dumpster juice.

>>21398281
Racist and sexist!!!1

Bakker bros how do I find the Shortest Path in my life?

Snow crash reads like it was written by a neet autist.

>bro this gun shoots so fast it's like a SR-71 Blackbird but 5x

>>21398417
if you couldn't pick up on the tone of the book upon seeing the name of the protag literally being Hero Protagonist then reading might not be the hobby for you anon

>>21398533
I posted as far as I read precisely because I didn't like the tone, brainlet.

>>21398417
Webnovel haters did we get too cocky...

>>21398558
I don't think you understand but that's okay

>>21398242
based

>>21398417
people shit on chinese webnovels and mtls but what is this garbage?

>it's another lit user fails to pick up on context based on a short passage from a book then gets mad about it episode

>>21398417
Is it wrong that I think this is kinda well written? Seems pretty tongue in cheek but not in an annoying way

>>21398640
Only the activated charcoal filtering the light was little funny, everything else is garbage

>>21398640
You could do far worse nowadays, but that doesn't mean it's good. I might read that if my flight got delayed or I was sick and had to stay home. The only line that kind of stood out to me was, "When they gave him the job, they gave him a gun."

>>21398640
The joke is that there's an entire page dedicated to this over the top edgy description and then it's revealed that it's for a pizza delivery driver. If people in this general had even an ounce of reading comprehension nobody would be entertaining this discussion at all.

>>21398700
>The joke

>>21398179
Hard-ish sci-fi for midwits

>>21398085
Shill it to me in one sentence.

>>21398818
Hey I made that.

>>21398834
It's a good image

On Stornlight -
Is it ever explained why suddenly Kal, Shallan, Dalinar, and Renarin all get their radiant powers in a very short timespan? Is there some kind of event that triggers the ability for people to become radiants again, or is it just coincidence

>>21398834
soul

>>21398846
Play this in the background to up the feels.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tss37GZxQ3M

>>21398879
Got it on kindle for free, and blew through the first chapter. Can confirm it doth have soul. Thanks for the rec

>>21396241
Thanks for the thought out response. I certainly noticed a tonal shift, and I even mentioned the editing in the thread a couple weeks back, I'm glad to see that I'm not alone there.
Can I get your opinion on when to read The Atrocity Tales? I've just been going through everything as published so far, including saving the glossaries and appendices for the ends of their respective books.

Every time I look at the recommendations mega, I am even more surprised by how utterly useless it is. Why even bother linking it at this point?

It's pretty cool

>>21399358
racist book

>>21399363
silly

>>21399348
I agree. There should be anything in the OP at all. Preferably not even really an image. The subject line is all that is needed. No anon should be looking at the OP in a general anyway.

What do I read after finishing the foundation series
Also are the prequels any good

>>21399363
why is racist

O, /sffg/. Shield me from the rest of this board

>>21399768
No.

>>21398145
In the US. November release in the rest of the world. Most of his books get delayed in the US.

>>21398640
Nope. The entire opening is hilarious. It's great. Shame the rest of the novel is so much worse.

>>21398858
How far are you into the books? It's explained but it's a pretty huge spoiler

>>21398585
sick reference dude

>>21399689
>What do I read after finishing the foundation series
>Also are the prequels any good
Which prequels. The trillogy prequel? I read it, decent. Didn't hear anything about Earth series, probably very mid if people didn't even bother talking about it.

Loved that part in Shadow of the Torturer where he talks about how simply experiencing the physical world diminishes your idealistic version of what it could be in your imagination.
Idk why people hate on New Sun here

>>21400060
I was talking about prelude to foundation and forward to foundation
Foundations edge and foundation and earth aren’t prequels

>>21400063
It’s the pushback from years of people who have only read one or two books hyping it up as the greatest thing ever written

>>21400063
Am I the only who was reminded of Kafka while reading Shadow of the Torturer, The Castle particularly? Underwhelmingly, the other BotNS books weren't as farcical and surreal

>>21400091
*except the House Absolute chapters, but I don't remember which book that was

>>21399689
> Also are the prequels any good
Not really. Anything after the original trilogy is simply a cash grab and he made the common mistake of trying to link all his earlier book series together (Foundation + Robots). So if you do plan to read them, at least read the Robot + R. Daneel Olivaw books first.

Is there any book like Azarinth Healer but with a guy mc

>>21400063
>Idk why people hate on New Sun here
because its trash

>>21400124
You could make the mc in Azarinth Healer a man and nothing in the story would change.

>>21400124
Why would you want to read anything like Azarinth Healer anyway? It's trash.

>>21400067
>I was talking about prelude to foundation and forward to foundation
>Foundations edge and foundation and earth aren’t prequels
Got 'Prelude' and 'Forward' on my bookshelf, but read them many years ago. as I recall, there are three books that make for a prequel trillogy. I remember liking it as a teenager (and I had a better taste in books back then, these days I read erotica and Litrgps), mostly due to the worldbuilding though, the story and the characters were so-so.

Funny thing, one comment written by Asimov stuck with me, I don't where did I read it. He said that once, long after writing the original trilogy, he was asked in an elevator by a young person whether he would write what happened before the original trillogy, as that would be interesting to him and other readers. To which Asimov replied...that he barely even remembers what the entire foundation was about, because it was THAT long ago. But he went and wrote the trilogy anyway. Hilarious.

>>21400190
Wait does the mc in azarinth healer not even fuck anyone? What's the point?

>>21400190
>You could make the mc in Azarinth Healer a man
No I could not, because editing entire novel to do that is just too much work,

I hope they can improve AI to the point where it can edit/rewrite a novel to remove all references to females and progressive nonsense.

>>21400421
She fucks at least two characters in the first book. One's a married guy. The other's a waitress.

>>21400461
>the other's a waitress
but girls cant make love to girls....

>>21400461
Trash

>>21400421
>>21400461
>She fucks at least two characters in the first book. One's a married guy. The other's a waitress.
After reading dozens of Litrpgs, I think that the fact that the author straight up had a female MC have sex with a man is one of the boldest artistic choices I've seen in webnovels.

The entire webnovel reader community is a bunch of petulant children that seethes any time they see something they don't like (like a woman that has normal, heterosexual sex). It was an inconsequential thing, but the fact the author gave zero fucks made me respect the shit out of him.

Rhaegar just writes what he wants, and it worked for him perfectly. I wonder what he will write after AH concludes in a few weeks. He isn't a grea-- amazi-- significantly talented writer, but knows how to entertain.

>>21400562
Hi Rhaegar

>>21400562
>the author makes the feMC a whore
>this is a good thing

Was the Damned?

>>21400438
litrpg/xianxia/webnovel shite may as well have been written by an AI

>>21398858
Yeah it's explained. And if you know about those 3, you know about a few other people with powers too. I think it was explained in Oathbringer

>>21399961
NTA but can you guys spoiler it? I've read the novels a while ago and I feel like I should know the answer but just want to make sure I remember it right. Something about their hardships and character depending on whatever Order they're on? Like if you're already able to speak certain words you can just powerlevel yourself as soon as you find a Spren partner.

>>21400499
>>21400499
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20aLCyE30wg

Recommend me sci fi romance that's just like my animes

>>21400709
Book of the New Sun, it's a harem novel

>>21400709
>romance that's just like my animes
Lolita.

>>21398239
Read anything by Fel. Firestaff or Subjugation series.

>>21400720
Not in that way.
>>21400719
I hate harem.

>>21400562
>A female character in fiction is having sex, I'm literally being cucked right now help me self insertman!!!

>>21399961
I read the series just before RoW came out but I'm blanking on some details

>>21394251
>sci-fi novels that heavily feature casinos, games of chance
Player of Games by Iain M. Banks maybe? The whole book is literally about the most complex competitive strategy game in the known universe.

Have you ever read a book just because you heard it had your fetish in it?

>>21400091

I got more of a Gormenghast vibe when Severin was exploring the tunnels/cave beneath the towers and finds the dog. Reminds me of when Steerpike was climbing over the castle rooftops but I can see where the Kafka comparions would come from

A good book with
-a great plot
- believable character
- realistic/neutral viewpoint (won't say that something is good/bad I couldn't care less about the opinion of the author about what is good or bad)

>>21401083
No, I'm not a women so I don't read books for sexual gratification. But given how popular 50 Shades was, I imagine it's pretty common

>>21401138
If you think you've ever read a book that didn't have a point of view, you were just too stupid to get it.

>>21401114
Great, I was just thinking what to read after I finish the Short Sun and Gormenghast was on my list.

>>21401083
30+ book series of military scifi that scratches quite a few itches. If I want something actually blatantly sexual, I'll just write it myself. I'm a picky little shithead and a lot of the mass marketed erotica is absolute meh

>>21401210
??? I didn't say no point of view, I said not an overly biased point of view (regarding "good" and "evil")
Did I misspeak or did you misread?

>>21401155
> I'm not a women so I don't read books for sexual gratification.
half of /sffg/ is obsessed with smut and harem (litrpg) erotica.

>>21399358
i've read it for the hot asian tiger mom. It's kind of like what if Pearl S Buck wrote fantasy.

>>21400709
Tomorrow and Tomorrow: A Love Story at the Edge off Time (1997) by Charles Sheffield
Vorkosigan Saga
Chanur Saga by C J Cherryh, she writes a Lot of Space opera and most of them have a romance sub-plot

>>21401354
Which implies that the other half is not. So what in the hell is the point you are trying to make?

>>21401282
What series?

Do you think Brandon Sanderson deserve the fame or was he just lucky?

>>21401488
Galaxy's Edge by Jason Anspoch and Nick Cole. There's 18 books in the mainline story. And then a ton of books that fill in a lot of back story and what not. Between 'season 1' and 'season 2' they took time and wrote a trilogy on the Savage Wars since it was something a lot of people wanted to know more about. It's been around since 2017 and the 18th book got released back on Thursday. It's a fun read.
I'm a degenerate because I want to both fuck Chhun and hug/comfort him. And fuck Crometheus. But savages really do scratch some itches.

>>21401581
First book was alright, but didn't the cringe put you off afterwards? The author absolutely does not describe 'ultra black ops' soldiers as anything but annoying cringe.

I didn't end up reading after that so it may have improved.

Are there any books that read like the martian, but set in more distant, or more fantastical future settings?

>>21401518
Well he wouldn't have been as successful if he hadn't been chosen to complete WoT, so that part was luck. But he also nailed the ending (in most people's opinion) and kept writing books that were popular so some of it is also earned. So without WoT he would still have been a successful author but not one that dominated the market.

>>21401518
I wish he stopped writing books with female MCs.

>>21401581
Thanks, I am looking at the reviews and there is several based ratings and quite few liberal seethes. Sounds like a good read, will definitely give it a go.

>>21401623
Do you dislike his female MCs or just female MCs in general?

>>21401588
>but didn't the cringe put you off afterwards?
Because its the only thing I've found that hits a lot of what I've been looking for. For me it's like a movie but doesn't overtly read like its a movie. Fast paced,interesting enough characters and a lot of stuff that fires off weird parts of my brain. Plus with how many books there are, it eats up a lot of my time.

Admittedly the potshots at certain things are incredibly cathartic

>>21401684
a little bit of both
I dislike female MCs, but I also, apparently, only read books written by dudes, so at this point I don't care anymore, I'd rather have no female MCs at all.

>>21401711 meant for>>21401683

My friend told me that HP is better than TLoTR even though he has never read TLoTR (only watched the movies).
Now I'm fucking mad but he refuses to read TLoTR.

>>21391253
>>21391261
Just finished the UC. Inverse Fire is just a TV showing CNN 24/7 right?

>>21401581
Savage Wars and Gods and Legionnaires are great, didn't feel the same for The Hundred, but that's probably because I didn't know anything about the series before reading Savage Wars adn thought the legion was far less interesting than the savages.

>>21401713
Too bad

>>21401855
The first part of God's and Legionnaires is my favorite. I genuinely enjoy reading anything involving savages. The Hundred I find endering and get a little teary eyed everytime at the end

>>21401864
sucks, but it is what it is

>>21401602
The key element of The Martian was its use of accurate science. Survivor(s) on alien world stories, at least the ones from the early 1900's onwards, tend to be about fighting space monsters or whatever, there's no realism.

>>21401847
I watched both trilogies, and now I'm about half way through The Hobbit. It's so comfy bros.

>>21401083
Are Glen Cook waifus a fetish?

>>21401888
Oh absolutely, I'm on book 6 on the series but I got introduce and hook thanks to savage wars, and the savage in particular.

>>21402058
Woo! Whenever I suggest the series I ask if they want to read it the recommended way or timeline wise. Also who's you're favorite character so far?

Recommend me a book about some kind of wizard where you get a sense of what it actually feels like using magic

>>21402079
Bakker

>>21402071
Crometheus, Goth Sullus and Tom Delo/Kael Maydoon. I just like the bad guys and villains, expect Devers, fuck Devers.

What do you think she sells?

>>21402093
>Crometheus
He is a god damned delight. I love him
>Goth Sullus
Definitely interesting
>Tom
You can be Tom now
Everybody loves Tom
>Devers
Fuck that scum sucking kelhorn. Its been a long time since a character made me rage.

>>21402131
Good thought, good thought.

Do you think the chat bots will ever be good enough to write you a scifi novels (or at least a few chapters) just by a few ideas?
If that happens, would you use it? What if an author uses it to sell a book? Would you consider that a real book or just AI written garbage?
AI has been dominating the digital illustration and painting industry in the past few months so I feel like it's going to affect writing soon.
The new ChatGPT is neat but sometimes it still gets your prompts wrong.

>>21402149
Miss Cyber Saigon will be sent directly to you in the Casanova Suite at Sin City when the match is over! Congratulations,Crometheus. Game on player!

>>21402104
She's an armsdealer

>>21402090
He said magic not penises.

>>21402104
I miss this lil nigga like you wouldn't believe.

>>21400232
No there are only 2 prequel books dumb coomer

>>21402172
Let's face it, most WN/LN/chinkshit might as well already be AI, being literally written by a computer would probably improve them. As for it's effects, there's going to have to be an entirely new market system to deal with it once it gets above fodder level, but until that point it'll be drowned out by the firehose of crap that's already spewing out. Once it gets to parity with the imagegen ai(really impressive on a technical level aside from some noticeable flaws and somewhat weak composition) there's going to be an upheaval since at the very least it'd be able to transform a few hundred words of summary into full 5k chapters of purple prose. Assuming it advances in lock step with the imagegen, it'll probably be able to turn those stories into comics as well, and while sound and video seem to be lagging behind it's not unimaginable that they'll suddenly leap forward and allow the production of entire movies and tv shows. At that point death of the author won't be a thought experiment, it'll be reality, and I expect the common consumer won't actually know or care about the origins.
Market saturation will be reached, some prominent old creators will stay afloat on their names but everyone else will be swept away and people will either get sick of infinite entertainment media and fall further into the youtube react content hole(until AI can make fake streamers) or AI subscriptions will be the new netflix and traditional media will die.

>>21402172
>Do you think the chat bots will ever be good enough to write you a scifi novels (or at least a few chapters) just by a few ideas?
No. If there is ever a competent AGI then it might but the a bot will never do it.
Though it could be used probably even now in some ways as a tool to help an actual author to write but a bot will never be able write a real story that is coherent and does not have logical errors.

>>21401083
Yes, i'm >>21401363
and i have a Older Woman/Milf/Mom fetish (hi Freud) and i have read entire book series just because the MC was a Mom or the protag's mom was a relevant character etc. i've found some great books and series because of it so i don't regret it.

>>21402291
Come play with /vm/.

>>21401083
No

no_

>>21401616
>But he also nailed the ending
That was Jordan. Jordan was the one who wrote the ending/epilogue before he died. Sanderson even mentions in the forward of the Gathering Storm.

>>21402370
By ending I meant the final book.

>>21401518
He is a consistent and prolific writer, luck and skill for that matter aren't nearly as important

>>21402380
>author dies
>"surprise I had the final book completed all along!"
I could see Sanderson of all people actually doing this.

>>21398417
It's supposed to a goofy rip on cyberpunk weapons dumbass. Read more than the first half page, he's a pizza delivery man...

This was such a clean read. What are some similar fantasy books I can jump into next? I was thinking of giving Jack Vance's Lyonesse a try.

>>21392381
>>21392391
>>21396261
Gory damned right my goodmen. But have you seen the characters rendered as tarot cards? It's absolutely prime.


Except the Reaper of Mars sort of looks like a Twink for some reason.

>>21402312
>the MC was a Mom
give me titles

>>21402291
he cute

>>21402473
Pretty sure it's:

Nero au Augustus, Servo Au Barca, Victoria au Julii/Antonia au Severus
Ragnar Volarus, Cassius au Bellona, Virginia au Augustus
Romulus au Raa, The Reaper, and Aja Grimace

World has good lore. Olympic Knights are a cool concept; I just can't imagine getting a shot and you're thinking Morning Knight, Rage Knight, Fear Knight, Storm Knight or even Truth or Love... and you end up the Protean Knight.

>>21392391
>>21396261
I've been reading this series and it made me realise you guys are retarded children for recommending it. It has some good qualities but they rarely show up. Mostly it's incredibly silly and regurgitative YA shit. Like what the author clearly reads. He won't shut the fuck up with dropping references and inserting pop culture as well. The only reason I'm reading it is because I like the themes. I am a bitter man. And MC needs to stop pretending, embrace his revenge and ruthlessness.

>>21402461
I'm not sure what you mean by clean but Lyonesse is very meandering

>>21392381
>>21392391
>>21396261
I like red rising, but I can't help but to dislike Darrow and how his plans work because his opponents are being really stupid despite having first hand knowledge of his deviousness or just plain incompetence. The battle with the MoonBreaker is particularly stupid with Roque falling for the obvious trap while dividing his fleet and the guards in the bridge being distracted while the pink opens the door.

>>21402461
The first Lyonesse book is pretty tight, but the rest of the series just meanders in an affable sort of way. Vance is best in standalone short story form. Also I found The Once and Future King totally insufferable, so take from that what you will.

fantasy books with good prose?

>>21402664
Leave it to me.

>>21402664
Google pre-Tolkien fantasy

>>21402664
prose is a spook

>>21402325
Oh really? I always forget about the new boards.
>>21402493
very very cute

>>21397160
Nobody hates authors. They might think they do even, but in reality people just hate their faggot fans.

>>21402481
I apologize for the lengthy (ie autistic) list
>Caught in Crystal (1987) by Patricia Wrede
>The Interior Life (1990) by Katherine Blake
>Raven's Duology (2004-2005) by Patricia Briggs
>Wolfblade Trilogy (2004-2005) by Jennifer Fallon
>Bridge of D'Arnath (2004-2005) by Carol Berg
>The World Gates Trilogy (2004-2005) By Holly Lisle, She wrote Minerva Wakes and the Arhel trilogy, those two books also have mom mc
>Dragonsbane (1985) by Barbara Hambly
>Paladin of Souls and Vorkosigan saga by Lois McMaster Bujold
>Sunrunner Saga (1988-1993) by Melanie Rawn starting from book the mc has a son and he becomes the secondary mc
>The Empire Trilogy (1987-1992) by Janny Wurts
>Liveship Traders (1998-200) by Robin Hobb
>Birthgrave (1975-1978) by Tanith Lee
>Heart of Bronze (1997-1998) by Matthew Stover
>Karavans Trilogy (2006-2012) by Jennifer Roberson
>Skinwalkers (2014) by Wendy N. Wagner, about an ex-pirate Axe wielding mom!
>Frostfell (2006) by Mark Sehestedt
>Legacy of Steel (1998) by Mary H. Herbert
>The Traitor Spy Trilogy (2010-2012) by Trudi Canavan
>Sevenwaters Trilogy (1999-2001) by Juliet Marillier
>Blood songs (1987, third book in the Frost trilogy) by Robin Wayne Bailey
>Bloodsong Trilogy (1985-1986) by Asa Drake
>Gypsies (1988) by Robert Charles Wilson
>Child of Time (1991) by Robert Silverberg
>The Wayfarer Redemption (1995-1999) by Sara Douglass, by book three almost every character is pregnant, after book three there's a 20 year time-skip so all the mcs have grown-up children
>The Forgotten Beasts of Eld (1974) by Patricia A. McKillip
>The Keys to Paradise Trilogy (1987-1988) by Robert Vardeman, trio of mcs all of the same importance, one of them is a cat-girl who saves a slave kid and adopts him
>Bitter Angels (2009) by C.L Anderson
>The Great Wheel (1987, book three of the Tredana Trilogy) by Joyce Ballou Gregorian
>Daughter of the Bear King (1987) by Eleanor Arnason
>Night-Threads series by Ru Emerson, portal fantasy about a druggie mom, her sister and her teenage son.
>Frostflower adn Thorn (1980) Phyllis Ann Karr
>Fifth Millenium by S.M. Stirling, Shirley Meier, and Karen Wehrstein
>Spellsong Cycle (1997-2002) by L.E. Modesitt Jr
>The Sword of Lyric by Sharon Hinck, christian portal fantasy about a soccer mom and her son fighting against Not-Satan
>Cradle of Sea and Soill (2020) by Bernie Anes Paz
>Boneshaker (2009) Cherie Priest
>The Gap Cycle by Stephen Donaldson, absolute grimdark kino but like most of Donaldson's work it has a happy ending, the main characters just have to go through hell to get it.
>Dragon Gate by Linsay Buroker, a six book epic about a Mother-son duo

>>21397160
supremacy of Bakker forever true

>>21402796
Jesus h christ, what fucking garbage list is this

>>21402802
Liveship is kino

>>21402802
>Coomerfaggot with mommy issues has a shit list that’s nothing coomer shit
Why are you shock by this revelation?

>>21402796
thanks...

>>21402815
I am surprised by the amount of literary progressive crap that exists out there and people who collect and compile such garbage.

>>21402815
>coomer shit
it isn't tho? not a single one of those books is self-published amazon smut

>>21402796
>The Keys to Paradise
>Giles Grimsmate, world-wandering survivor of the Trans wars
lol

>>21402855
It was a different time

sublime sublime sublime sublime sublime
supreme supreme supreme supreme supreme
deluxe deluxe deluxe deluxe deluxe
exquisite exquisite exquisite exquisite exquisite

>>21402918
>implying that's not the shit cover

>>21402796
oedipus-sama, i kneel

>>21402802
Birthgrave was alright.

>>21402836
4chan might not be for you if something so incredibly basic and trite shocks you.

Do you think it's disgusting for a God to hide itself behind created beings that do It's will despite that God ultimately having full power over everything?

>>21402802
>>21402815
i'm gonna post it in every thread just for you
bakker is king et al

>>21403104
Don't know, don't care, pretty sure this isn't even /lit/. Ask your local priest or something if you actually care.

>>21403107
Yes, anon, make this general even more unuseable by doing stupid shit like this.

>>21403114
>Ask your local priest or something if you actually care
What?

J.V. Jones is the female GRRM.

>>21403119
He says to ask a local priest, from your local church, about your pretentious religious question. How mentally stunted are you to not get that?

>>21403124
I'm not asking a religious question I'm asking a question about fantasy writing

>>21403128
Good lord, nobody cares about your dumb fuck religious question. Fuck off.

>>21403123
book of wonders was kino desuuuuuuuu
bakker is not based

>>21403128
>I'm asking a question about fantasy writing
There's a general for that, the writing general. Go there >>21402691

>>21403131
My bad I didn't know that asking questions about fantasy world building in a thread for the discussion of fantasy literature would be such a problem

>>21403137
>My bad
That's okay, anon, people asking questions about fantasy world building are usually attention-whores who don't care about the questions or don't know about the writing general. Glad I could help.

>>21403137
world building is for retards, anon that's why
just make a story and the world will build itself around it

>>21403130
Her books have parts that really make me angry and that makes me like them more. The way her writing is light hearted and simultaneously grim and unapologetically illiberal at times is really swell.

>>21403137
We’ll know you know better.

webnovel authors know how to get you coming back for more

>>21403278
name some

>>21403285
lord of the mysteries

>>21402796
impressive

>>21403278
yes yes yes fuck this currently reading Ecdysis and Shipcore and the wait is fucking awful.

Has anyone here read the The Spiral War war series i"m looking for books involving Ai.

>>21401083
No but if someone recommends me a book with a lot of romantic futa on male action in it I will read it

>>21403406
Anon have you tried not having brain problems.

>>21403419
What does wanting to be loved by an amazonian woman with a 10‘‘ dick have to do with brain issues?

>>21403357
Firefall.

Hate myself and just want to die.

>>21403592
real

>>21403592
Just kill yourself.

>>21403592
Sadly you probably won't isekai if you do

dropped WoT last week, picked up The First Law.
reading about Glokta shitting himself is unironically more enjoyable than the "climax"s in WoT 1-3. didn't finish 4.

New thread
>>21403719

>>21401847
Who the hell writes TLotR. It’s LotR

>>21402512
Anon, you're still reading Red Rising because despite the first series being intentionally dumbed down to reach the YA crowd too (or at least not totally lose them in the sequels), and despite having a goofy premise that sounds like a comic book plot, it still manages to somehow be less hackneyed than a huge swath of serious adult sci-fi and the world still ends up feeling more filled in than plenty of serious attempts.

That might be more an indictment of the genre than praise of Brown, but I have never seen anyone claim Red Rising is great literature, only that it is fun lit, would make good vidya, etc. It's in the same vein as Warhammer 40K, except more explicitly classical Rome/Greece LARP focused and IMO more compelling plots.

Let's compare to serious sci-fi. Is Dan Simons the better writer? Sure. Hyperion is a classic of the genre. The themes are much more complex, the prose better.

But Endymion ends up feeling more hackneyed than Golden Son (the power of love conquers all) because it goes from a serious book into predictable ending. As for Ilium, that clearly has a way more interesting story and interesting setting than anything Brown makes. However it also rambles with no clear direction for 1,700 pages before Simons ends it out of nowhere because the plot has clearly gotten away from him. Cryptonomicon has this problem too; Snow Crash doesn't, despite arguably being written at a YA level. (Ender's Game is another book that is good despite being at a YA level).

Brown makes the world more compelling and filled in over time, you get past the goofy premise and what is left of the YA appeal gets totally dropped at book 4, while most YA the holes in to world become yawning chasms as the story goes on (e.g., Hunger Games).

Even good sci-fi tends to get hackneyed (Revelation Space became standard space opera by book 3, despite book 1 and the stand alone's being wonderfully different). There is plenty of shit genre fiction that never goes beyond that place despite adult content (e.g., Prince of Thorne's, although I didn't think it was terrible, just ok). It's rare for a series to get better anyhow.

I don't need all my sci-fi to be literature. There is a place for stuff like the Zahn Star Wars trilogy of Red Rising.

>>21403592
This is because you are ruled by the darkness that comes before you. Become an Absolute Soul, self moving. Seek the Absolute. Study your Hegel and your Bakker. Become a Bakkerite, pledge to defend him and his honor with your life, force the enemies of Bakker to yield onto you the honey of their anuses. Only in this absolute servitude can you find absolute emancipation.

>>21404031
There's a phenomenon on /a/ called "exit level anime", where highly experienced/jaded people are fans of deeply flawed or mediocre shows simply because they go against the grain and aren't as predictable. It's what happens when you've seen enough actually well made stuff and start getting bored of the patterns.
Obviously there's way more books than anime, but for scifi/fantasy I'd wager there's less than 100 truly high quality original works, and everything else is somewhere between an homage and a ripoff. To a certain extent the formula is so effective that you need an amateur author to make serious mistakes to get a different story because the "correct" way or writing all ends up the same. I'd rather read some middle of the road webnovel or YA trash that has a semi-original interesting setting or premise than another instance of template #45. Irrational? Probably. But what's rational about subjective enjoyment of fiction?

>>21402796
based