/lit/ - Literature

>>21057382
Just reformist economics stuff. He's relevant, but the Leninist cult isn't
So Cockshott, others.

>>21057382

Its so funny seeing the same retards talk about revolution. Who are they trying to convince to die for their awful and failed ideas? They come to 4chan to organize fucking revolution and propagate it. I swear, there needs to be a mass doxxing campaign of communists. Just dox and shame all of them. They're so retarded.

>>21057402
>Tranny lit
He's not known for his writing

Modern Marxism is just turning capitalism and rich people into boogeymen to scapegoat for peoples' personal problems. These people fail in college, fail at the workplace, fail with their family, and need some excuse to shift the blame from themselves.

>>21057382
Modern marxism is sponsored by das Kapital kek
it's over. only national socialism will win now
>marxists: neutralized, 200 year old obsolete
>capitalist: dying
embrace the coming change

>>21057429
Modern marxism is actually just seething at men and having children. Only 10% of their hate is directed at capitalism, they use it more like a buzzword than anything
most are middle class aspiring to become petty boug

>>21057437
>most are middle class aspiring to become petty boug
Its more like they are petty bourgeois thinking communism is a ticket to being a party elite member

>>21057446
True, in actuality its Judaism, not communism. Understandable mistake to make though : )

communism is now consoomed as a cool and edge symbol by dozens of "i'm not like other boys/girls" libtard kids who are obsessed with cultural meme wars and even hate basic works. if communism had won, gulag would have been firstly for them. it's totally over.

>>21057382
Just reformist economics stuff. He's relevant, but the Leninist cult isn't

>>21057512
unironically this, stalin sent faggots like them to siberia

>>21057512
Same with fascism

>>21057432
sure thing buddy

>>21057382
Solidarity (UK) As we Don't See It
Composition studies
Eagleton.

>>21057432
>National socialism will win
>the only ideology to loose the only war it’s ever fought, ruining Europe in 12 years, and only being promoted by alcoholic trash and 14 y.o.
Good joke

>>21057382
I liked this book.

>Winner of the first Paul A. Baran—Paul M. Sweezy Memorial Award for an original monograph concerned with the political economy of imperialism, John Smith’s Imperialism in the Twenty-First Century is a seminal examination of the relationship between the core capitalist countries and the rest of the world in the age of neoliberal globalization. Deploying a sophisticated Marxist methodology, Smith begins by tracing the production of certain iconic commodities—the T-shirt, the cup of coffee, and the iPhone—and demonstrates how these generate enormous outflows of money from the countries of the Global South to transnational corporations headquartered in the core capitalist nations of the Global North. From there, Smith draws on his empirical findings to powerfully theorize the current shape of imperialism. He argues that the core capitalist countries need no longer rely on military force and colonialism (although these still occur) but increasingly are able to extract profits from workers in the Global South through market mechanisms and, by aggressively favoring places with lower wages, the phenomenon of labor arbitrage.

...

>"Analysis of contemporary imperialism must proceed from, and attempt to explain, a fact of transcendental importance: the systematic international divergence in the rate of exploitation between nations. Wage arbitrage-driven globalization of production corresponds neither to absolute surplus-value—long hours are endemic in low-wage countries, but the length of the working day is not the outsourcing firm’s main attraction—nor to relative surplus-value: necessary labor is not reduced through the application of new technology. Indeed, outsourcing is an alternative to investment in new technology. Raising surplus-value through expanding the exploitation of Southern low-wage labor therefore cannot be reduced to the two forms of surplus-value extraction analyzed in Capital—absolute and relative surplus-value. Global labor arbitrage-driven outsourcing is driven by lust for cheaper labor, and corresponds most directly to the 'reduction of wages below their value.' In other words, global labor arbitrage, the driver of the global shift of production to low-wage nations, is the third form of surplus value recognized by Marx as a most important factor, yet excluded, as we have seen, from his theory of value" (p.238).

Also "Superimperialism" by Michael Hudson. He's also Leon Trotsky's godson.

>This highly respected study of U.S. financial diplomacy explores the faults built into the core of the World Bank and the IMF at their inception. Forensic detail reveals how the world’s core economic functions were sculpted to preserve US financial hegemony. Difficult to detect at the time, these problems have since become explicit as the failure of the international economic order has become apparent; the IMF and World Bank were set up to give aid to developing countries, but instead many of the world’s poorest countries have been plunged into insurmountable debt crises.

>The book became famous for detailing how the removal of the gold standard left the world’s central banks with only one alternative vehicle: to hold their international reserves in U.S. Treasury securities. The result was a self-financing circular flow of U.S. military spending and the investment takeover of foreign economies. The larger America’s balance-of-payments deficit grew, the more dollars ended up in the hands of central banks and sovereign wealth funds. Machiavelli could not have planned it better. By participating in this circular flow, nations in effect financed their own economic and military encirclement. Hudson’s critique of the destructive course of the international economic system provides important insights into the real motivations at the heart of these institutions – and the increasing tide of opposition that they face around the world.

Sold more books in China though.

https://youtu.be/1BkgaRXFqR4

>>21057446
This is exactly it. It's become a status game for, very ironically: The bourgeoisie.
Not just in familial status/wealth - they are bourgeoisie in birth, mind and spirit. The eternal middle class mediocre midwit.
Communism has become a vehicle for the revenge of the mediocre; lashing out at their own mediocrity externalized and scapegoated.
The mistake we have made as a society is making everyone feel special and glorifying those who are different. Now, the people who are naturally conformist and average, feel as though they must become special, however, they are not. Our culture is one of a paradox. The mediocre preach the doctrine of being special. Since they have not, cannot, and will not live up to this doctrine they are doomed to cope, seethe and dilate. We are suffering the consequences of this inversion.

>>21057406
No one's going to kill them lol capitalists promote marxism because it's an impotent joke.

>>21057952
In the West it's just a few college professors. Marxism is centered around trying to establish human socioeconomic development as an objective science. That's ultimately for the purpose of using this science to inform policy, in order to come up with the policies necessary to encourage this development, but it's not like a big threat or anything. It's mostly this:

https://youtu.be/rkh7QZoS25Y

>Why, we have no final goal. We are evolutionaries, we have no intention of dictating definitive laws to mankind.
>— Engels, Le Figaro Interviews Engels

>>21057398
I guess Wolff qualifies (he is from my city) but I'm not a huge fan of him or Cockshott at all. not really a Marxist but I get the need for socialism. been going more anarchist as time goes on.

>>21057941
>Trotskyist
America today practices Trotskyism already just without the socialism.

>>21057406
>I swear, there needs to be a mass doxxing campaign of communists. Just dox and shame all of them. They're so retarded
Brilliant idea you retard. No wonder you're all neo nazis. Communism is a boogeyman in the western world anyways. The lines in the world have been drawn already, there are more pressing things to worry about.

>>21057976
That's a lot of words to say they're promoting brain poison and trannydom

>>21057986
Hudson's dad knew Trotsky and visited him in Mexico City and his wife was pregnant when they were down there so Trotsky became Hudson's godfather then Stalin iced him. They were from Minneapolis which was probably the center for Trotskyists in the world in the 1930s (oddly enough).

>>21057991
You can watch the video but it's like three hours long. This guy is in it.

>>21057382
>Is there anything about Marxism written in the last 50 years that actually matters?
Kolakowskis Main Currents of Marxism

>>21057976
>Marxism is centered around trying to establish human socioeconomic development as an objective science.
Says the bourgeois marxist.

Marxism is a suitcased shiv in class war shoved up handle first so they can't search you.

>>21057976
>Burnham has entered the chat

I dont get a 21st century's communist endgame. Do you not realize just how impossible your goals are? A worker revolution in 21st century would genocide 99% of society.

Allow me to elaborate. When was the last time you worked with a hammer? Or a sickle? That's right, 99% of society doesnt even know which side of the hammer to hold!
Back in the day more than half of the population worked agriculture, now John Deere (tm) satellite navigated harvesters and combines do ALL of our agriculture.
Back in the day average mine used to spawn a 50k population mining cities, modern heavy industry employs less than 1% of the population.
You have NEVER dug out coal. All the factories are in China. You are not a worker. You are simply not. Simple as. You are NOT an industrial worker. You have a pseudo job. A welfare job. You dont build anything, 99% of society doesnt.

This is why I say, an ideologically pure communist revolution in the 21st century, would let 2 or 3 corporations own everything.
If you are a 20 something faggot seething about poverty, you are poor because you dont know how to build jet engines and nuclear reactors, not because you are oppressed. You are poor because YOU choose art degree over engineering degree. You are poor because you are unskilled, unmarketable retard investing your early 20ies capital into felonies, narcotics, gucci lattes instead of ability to do triple bypass heart surgeries in your 30ies.

>>21058000
>Kolakowskis Main Currents of Marxism
Kołakowski's work fails to deal with tendencies generated in response to the Fordist decomposition, and so fails to account for post-war developments in Trotskyism of real merit (J-F, SouB's UK reinterpretation), or for anti-Stalinisms (Hungary, Italy, Czechia). Kołakowski utterly fails in dealing with Chinese anti-Fordist attempts to prevent decomposition by a composed pre-Fordist revolutionary working class.

So while he's quite good, especially for an anti-Marxist, his account of theory ends in 1949.

>>21057997
Also his book

>The fifth point: the future socialist economy will develop better in the process of countering Western hegemony. Lenin’s conclusion that “imperialism is war” is not outdated. Global and regional hegemonism also easily leads to war. The Russo-Ukrainian war is a conflict triggered by the five illegal eastward expansions of NATO as an aggressive military group headed by the United States, and is the result of Russia’s being forced to counter the U.S.-Western hegemony, which will negatively affect the entire world economy and people’s livelihood, except for the U.S. military-industrial complex, which has greatly profited. Since the U.S. and Western monopoly capitalist economy cannot compete with China’s socialist economy, in recent years the U.S. and the West have intensified their ganging up around China, cobbled together the Indo-Pacific version of NATO, established the Indo-Pacific economic framework organization against China, and tried to provoke China’s civil war for the unification of Taiwan through political and military provocations in order to impose comprehensive sanctions against China and hinder China’s socialist modernization process. However, bad things can also become good things. China has implemented a new development pattern based on domestic circulation and dual (domestic and international) circulation, enhancing the degree of self-reliance, autonomy, self-sufficiency and self-improvement of the national economy, and continuously establishing and improving new scientific and technological chains, industrial chains, supply chains and economic and trade chains, which leads to better development of China’s socialist national economy and people’s livelihood.

https://youtu.be/4Mp2zVnPaJY

>>21058001
I don't know what you're talking about

The Kolakowski poster is already here, now we are waiting for the other anon that calls him a fed each time and the greentexter.

The people who support Marxism here are supporting an ideology known for killing its followers. You're just mentally ill, and you only have "theories" since nothing you say is applicable to reality.

>>21058007
>I don't know what you're talking about
So you've managed to avoid reading any praxis centric proletarian marxism? Are you some kind of butt boy daddy bought you a degree bourgeois structuralist? OH LOOK POULANTZAS IN THE HOUSE. ALÞUßER IN THE HOUSE.

Marxism is not a "science" or wirtshaft.
Marxism is the range finder of how many of the children of the rich you can kidnap and mail back in weekly segments.

Marxism is not ideology. It is the drill manual to allow for proletarian autogestation in history. See Foucault on whether the working class can be wrong in Foucault/chomsky.

>>21058018
>So you've managed to avoid reading any praxis centric proletarian marxism? Are you some kind of butt boy daddy bought you a degree bourgeois structuralist?
Yeah I haven't read any of that stuff. I'm just a friendly ordinary guy who is concerned about the economy and thinks we need to find a different way.

>>21058025
Would you like to "change" "the economy" yourself on the basis of "ideas" you have? To command all people to dance to the beat of your drum like a liberal parliament commanding a levee en mass?

That's Leninism mate.

>>21058018
Nowadays the left hates the working class so they do anything nowadays not to appear like a Redneck, in addition to being le heckin intersectional and antiracist and feminist they also support mask mandates, mass vaccinations, disarming one's self and fucking children in addition to bashing organized religion. They're about as anti working class as you can get.

Eclipse and Re-emergence of the Communist Movement

>>21058035
>the left
New Bruce, are you a sep cunt or a Uni Trot?

>>21058035
>the working class is just white dudes in kansas
lmfao, my mexican gardener fucks my wife to jokes like these

>>21058163
>my mexican gardener fucks my wife
He does it for free.

>>21057382
Everyday you use math that was invented by ancient peoples. Philosophy rests on the work of extremely old traditions. Marxism describes very basic relationships between Capitalism. Das Kapital still holds everything it said as true and is scientifically verified. Bourgeois economists need to reinvent new systems every week to account for the fact that they need to disguise the self-destructive nature of Capitalism with sleight of hand.

You can't change a simple fact. Capitalism is a game where profits are inevitably reduced to zero via competition thus killing most companies. When that happens on a large scale there's an inevitable recession/depression crisis. As we get better at the game these will get more dramatic and more frequent over time until either the Capitalists destroy competition with racketeering and cartels (hello modern industries) thus recreating a barbaric neo-feudalism or we develop an economic system that doesn't require the profit motive. It's just that simple.

>>21058005
You mean 99% of white people and yes, it's very sad that we rely on slaves to live.

The bourgeois society is based on protestation against christianity as a legal social system, but once christians are not in power, the bourgeois uprising has no fuel.
The trick of the bourgeois to stay relevant is to craft an unorganic enemy and the cleverness of those rats is to make themselves the enemy: everything invented by bourgeois, all the science they made up is the new power to be fought.
So a bourgeois nowadays no longer fight christian kings, because those kings accepted their defeat, but to fight the bourgeois power itself.
This permits the bourgeois to control what and when the plebeans are meant to fight bogusly.
This is how bourgeois win on both sides: no matter what is the result of this fake fight, they will win. This has been happening since the creation of marxism and all the hundreds -isms you heard of, like anarchism, communism, liberal socialism, and so on, exactly what happened in WW2 too, in cold war too.

>>21057382
>Is there anything about Marxism written in the last 50 years that actually matters?
Disco Elysium and Bacurau

https://youtu.be/LKTejyk9ZIA

Roger Waters. His dad was in the Communist Party of Britain.

https://youtu.be/PtTzX_XsjYs

https://youtu.be/XdvPV8Xth-k

But seriously we've got to stop this war before the whole planet blows up

>>21058042
Neither. I'm closer to anarcho syndicalist than anything else unless you parse my social/cultural views. That's pretty vague still

>>21058163
Sounds like a self own to me

>>21058316
The only and central point of interest is if ideology is useful to bodies of workers who create immediate power to reduce the extent to which they are workers, increase solidarity, dismantle the value form, and produce a proletariat. Such an ideology can only be developed as a recuperative moment in learning through collective action: the shit left in the toilet to flush if you will, or the blasting of it with piss.

Did you read that idea in a book, or did youse earn it in struggle?

>>21058264
>white people
ahhh yes, whatever would we do without all those african precision machining, african audis and bmw and volkswagens, oh wait, no, africans cant export a single fucking car
and those arab pharmaceutical companies such as erm.. ughh... uuum... right, these people also cant produce anything, 90% of their 'economy' is rents from american and euro oil companies
this brings me to the aerospace industries, electronics, over-horizon radars built by the slum people of brazil and bangladesh.. wait a minute, nope, wrong population, slum people have exactly 0 satellite makers

whites and asians are the only industrial workers, half of africa isnt even fucking electrified, the most advanced piece of infrastructure on that continent is 18th century rail built by euros for steam locomotives

>>21058342
The slum people I'm Brazil make plenty of stuff. Brazil is industrialized. Your clothing is probably made in Banglidesh or central America. You're right about Africa and Arab countries though. They make cement and that's about it.

Anyways these threads are annoying because people with a 'critique' of Marx have never read them and usually think Marxism has something to do with US liberals. Neoliberalism is just about the complete opposite of Marxism.

Marx gets many thing correct but what he offers is essentially a good critique of capitalism. His alternative is overly simplistic and unworkable. Which is why people tend to critique like the Soviet Union and not the ideology behind it.

>>21057382
>The Myth of "Socialist Planning" in Russia (1978)
http://www.sinistra.net/lib/upt/compro/lipo/lipoebubie.html
>National Revolution and Downfall of Cambodia (1980)
https://libriincogniti.wordpress.com/2021/02/25/kommunistisches-programm-national-revolution-and-downfall-of-cambodia/
>The Formation of the Vietnamese Nation-State (1980)
https://libriincogniti.wordpress.com/2021/02/18/kommunistisches-programm-the-formation-of-the-vietnamese-national-state/
>Inflation, or Capital’s Flight Forward (1980)
https://libriincogniti.wordpress.com/2020/12/01/kommunistisches-programm-inflation-or-capitals-flight-forward/
>The Democratic State (1993)
https://en.gegenstandpunkt.com/books/democratic-state
>Against the Decadence of Revolutionary Theory (1994)
https://libriincogniti.wordpress.com/2020/01/26/kommunistische-politik-against-the-decadence-of-revolutionary-theory/
>Where does racism come from and how does it work? (1995)
http://www.ruthlesscriticism.com/where_does_racism_come_from.htm
>The Comintern and the United Front (1996)
http://www.sinistra.net/lib/upt/comlef/cote/cotesdacoe.html
>Polemic against "Auschwitz or the Great Alibi": The Crusaders of Democratic Antifascism in the Assault of Marxism (1997)
https://libriincogniti.wordpress.com/2019/01/21/le-proletaire-polemic-against-auschwitz-or-the-great-alibi-the-crusaders-of-democratic-antifascism-in-the-assault-of-marxism/
>New Attacks against “Auschwitz or the Great Alibi” (2000)
https://libriincogniti.wordpress.com/2019/01/27/le-proletaire-new-attacks-against-auschwitz-or-the-great-alibi/
>Since you mentioned “us” — Nationalism by example of Scottish independence (2016)
https://antinational.org/en/since-you-mentioned-us/
>What is Imperialism? (2019)
https://antinational.org/en/what-is-imperialism-talk/
>Women in Capitalism (2019)
http://www.ruthlesscriticism.com/women_capitalism.htm

>>21058316
>I'm a bronylist. I believe that ponies will rule us one day and you can't tell me I'm wrong.
What's that about the trannies you keep whining about, about how they're not something just because they say they are?

>>21058447
>libri incogniti
I know which subreddit you're from, Marsoup.

>>21058423
>his alternative
Wherein? Your eisegetic fapcave?

Have any lefties ever dealt seriously with the fact that you can buy a hammer and sickle t-shirt at hot topic, be a Stalinboo, be a declared Marxist and all you will get is scoffs and laughs? Or how neoliberal elites apparently view "reactionary" politics as being far more threatening to the world system than Marxism? As in, why are internet Nazis marginalized when they should be getting shadow money from shell organizations as a bulwark against The Revolution?

>>21058447
Left Communists are just Trotskyists who spam wordpresses instead of blogs, not gonna waste my time

>>21058576
Because Stalinist parties historically have supported liberals. New Deal, popular frontism, the CPUSA endorsing Biden and Clinton, PSL endorsing Bernie, FRSO endorsing Obama etc cetera. They're on the same side.

>>21058576
Only fools care about ad hominems, otherwise I would point out to you how the average fat right extremist is viewed

>>21057559
Not a single fucking american understands to this day what fascism means

>>21058605
They don’t understand Marxism as well

>>21058605
Fascism is when you're racist and the more Fascist you are the more racism there is.

>>21058605
>>21058617

I don't know if it is like this beyond the Anglosphere, but I have noticed that at least in English speaking countries there is this phenomenon where each of the big three political ideologies, Liberalism, Marxism/Communism, and Fascism don't believe in this three way split but see the other two ideologies as two sides of the same coin. Marxists see Fascism as just a harder form of Liberalism. Fascists see Communism/Marxism as a more honest, mask off, variety of Liberalism. Liberals see Fascism as 'Communism with racist characteristics'.

Three groups each denying (on some level) the existence of three groups.

It makes for an absolute clusterfuck when it comes to establishing consistent and shared terminology. Half the time when one group does enter conversation with another the conversation simply turns into a battle over whose semantics take priority if they were to discuss something other than semantics.

>>21058035
The working class is lumpenprole niggers.

Paulo Freire's writings on pedagogy. Like it or not, it is relevant to your life, particularly if you are from California where his ideas have become an official part of the state's curriculum.

>>21058654
No
Read Marx

>>21057382
John Roemer is a good choice if you into econ

>>21058584
half of those texts are from people unrelated to the Communist Left

>>21058654
anarchists and trannies are lubenprole, retard

>>21057919
>loose

>>21057919
>he thinks german aryanism peppered with some NS is national socialism
absolute state. It's mutted national socialism at best and wasn't even socialism
I hate westoids so much it's unreal

>>21059178
>inb4 "B B B BUT THIS IS LIKE SAYING REAL NS HAS NEVER BEEN TRIIIIIEEEEEEEEEEEEEED"
it has, and it has worked great. A great modern example is china

>>21058604
>meanwhile in reality
That's a cool cherry pick anon, but anyone can immediately look up real studies on the matter and they all clearly demonstrate that ring wingers are physically healthier and more attractive. It makes intuitive sense, if you are an individualist you would go to the gym more.

>>21057382
>Is there anything about Marxism written in the last 50 years that actually matters?
No, because it never mattered in the first place as anything more than changing how people viewed history. Marx's actual view of history is hilariously distorted and has been proven wrong by modern science (there are no universal laws dictating history or society; society does not naturally move towards socialism and socialism does not move towards communism; his entire economic theory is wrong for the same reason every economic theory that presumed people always make rational decisions that necessarily benefit them was shown to be wrong by the 1960's, etc. etc. etc.).
It's wild to me that we can know, from the natural sciences and mathematics, how the philosophy driving the sciences was ultimately paradoxical - the foundational thinking of the mid-to-late 19th century was, in so many ways, incomplete and wildly inaccurate, which is precisely what caused the physicalism/scientism chasm in the early 20th century. Mathematics, without a strict need to work with the actual world, was late to the game and was completely filled with paradoxes by the late 19th century because of 19th century philosophical failings; physics and chemistry had mostly worked themselves out by product of requiring direct interaction with the real world, that doesn't give a shit what any of us think about how it works.
Everyone in the sciences by the end of the 19th century, and everyone in mathematics by the early 20th century, fully understood how erroneous much of the 19th century philosophy was, because it either didn't work out in real-world experimentation or it caused extensive paradoxes in formal systems.

Only those fields which sit wholly external to physical reality refuse to yield that basically everything from the 19th century was, at best, woefully incomplete. To everyone but communists, it is immediately obvious by simply observing the outcomes of attempted communist societies. There's a reason most modern leftists are not communists, and instead preach French socialism or - at most - Hegelianism. Everyone moved on, because no one stayed stuck in the 1850's except the communists.

Like >>21057949 mostly gets right here (there are no special people how you're suggesting, the evidence is incredibly clear on this, but the rest is accurate) by the 21st century, communists aren't interested in class struggle anymore. They are interested in social laddering and revenge against a system that has deprived them of their unearned sense of superiority.

>>21057932
This shit is from 2016, acting like a talking point from the 1980's is new. Everyone understood that the empire mode of the late 20th century forward was going to be economic, and that conventional warfare was largely off the table. Why do you think the entire fucking world shat on Russia when it broke the mold?

>>21059240
>It makes intuitive sense, if you are an individualist you would go to the gym more
Your conclusion in no way follows from your premise. I could just as easily say individualists are much more likely to be fat lazy retards who smoke crack because their personal pleasure would be a priority over others

>>21059323
>Marx's actual view of history is hilariously distorted and has been proven wrong by modern science
where can I read the scientific refutation?
>There's a reason most modern leftists are not communists, and instead preach French socialism or - at most - Hegelianism
the reason is they're political representatives of the bourgeoisie and the middle classes, which have grown to dominate Western countries
>Everyone moved on, because no one stayed stuck in the 1850's except the communists.
they never moved on, leftists always defended the bourgeois world, even in 1850 (Proudhon)
>by the 21st century, communists aren't interested in class struggle anymore
yes they are. and that's not even considering that "communists not interested in class struggle" is an oxymoron, since communists are defined entirely by their position in the class struggle:
>The Communists are distinguished from the other working-class parties by this only: 1. In the national struggles of the proletarians of the different countries, they point out and bring to the front the common interests of the entire proletariat, independently of all nationality. 2. In the various stages of development which the struggle of the working class against the bourgeoisie has to pass through, they always and everywhere represent the interests of the movement as a whole.

>They are interested in social laddering
you're talking about middle-class leftists, not communists. communists dedicate their lives to thankless work with zero appeal to society dominated by bourgeois ideology, while leftists make careers in academia and write articles for popular bourgeois outlets targeted at middle class urbanites

>>21059371
>you're talking about middle-class leftists, not communists. communists dedicate their lives to thankless work with zero appeal to society dominated by bourgeois ideology, while leftists make careers in academia and write articles for popular bourgeois outlets targeted at middle class urbanites

They're the same. Just accept it.

>>21059363
You could, if you were deeply stupid.
>hurr durr why would individuals try to strengthen their individual selves? IT MAKES NO SENSE
Meanwhile all the fat lazy retards who do smoke crack do so because the government unironically subsidizes their living, they're called white trash and hood rats.

>>21059371
>where can I read the scientific refutation?
Literally every economic discussion since the end of the 19th century. Every bit of sociology since the early 20th.
>the reason is they're political representatives of the bourgeoisie and the middle classes, which have grown to dominate Western countries
>they never moved on, leftists always defended the bourgeois world, even in 1850 (Proudhon)
Ahh, more conspiracy theory leftism - it's not that communism is a bullshit, unattractive idea that can't work, it's that the entire world is has conspired against it to make it fail.
>you're talking about middle-class leftists, not communist
And there's the No True Communist® assertion. You love to see it - the trifecta of the braindead commie. (1) pretend economic, political, and social discourse hasn't advanced since 1867 (2) claim there is an intentional movement to keep communists down just for being communists, and not because it's a horrible idea that doesn't work (3) always claim there are, simultaneously, communists everywhere but that no one who has ever claimed to be a communist was actually one of them

>>21059384
One started the october revolution, the other was murdered by it. When push comes to shove the divisions are immutable and on full display

>>21059394
>Literally every economic discussion since the end of the 19th century. Every bit of sociology since the early 20th.
like what?
>Ahh, more conspiracy theory leftism
it's not a conspiracy theory. it was proven by Marx
>In fact he does what all good bourgeois do. They all maintain that competition, monopoly, etc., are, in principle—i.e. regarded as abstract thoughts—the only basis for existence, but leave a great deal to be desired in practice. What they all want is competition without the pernicious consequences of competition. They all want the impossible, i.e. the conditions of bourgeois existence without the necessary consequences of those conditions. They all fail to understand that the bourgeois form of production is an historical and transitory form, just as was the feudal form. This mistake is due to the fact that, to them, bourgeois man is the only possible basis for any society, and that they cannot envisage a state of society in which man will have ceased to be bourgeois.
>Hence Mr Proudhon is necessarily doctrinaire. The historical movement by which the present world is convulsed resolves itself, so far as he is concerned, into the problem of discovering the right balance, the synthesis of two bourgeois thoughts.

>pretend economic, political, and social discourse hasn't advanced since 1867
what's the advancement?
>claim there is an intentional movement to keep communists down
there are undeniably people and institutions safeguarding private property, which is the same thing, since communists are the representatives of the movement for the abolition of private property
>always claim there are, simultaneously, communists everywhere but that no one who has ever claimed to be a communist was actually one of them
where have I claimed that "communists are everywhere"? I pretty explicitly said that they're at the margins, whereas the people who are "everywhere", making careers and writing for the masses are leftists, not communists

>>21059394
>it's that the entire world is has conspired against it to make it fail.
What was the white army, the cold war, the red scare, coups and colour revolutions in latam and asia, the vietnam war, neoliberalism and no other interpretation of socioeconomics becoming the singular dominant force of a unipolar world?

>>21059323
Perhaps special isn't the right word. "Non-conformist" is more accurate, or neurodivergent. But, even among the 'true' non-conformists and neurodivergents there is conformity and similarity.
There are always people who will go against the grain, but, usually they will conform to the 'non-conformist' side. They are those who are simply habitually contrarian and edgy. Then there are the neurodivergents. The neurodivergents are the closest thing to 'special', but, still, there are always similarities.
The contrarians and neurodivergents are the natural left, whereas the current left are the manufactured 'left'. This is one of the main issues with the current left. They exist in a state of paradox. They are supposed to be the atypical underdog contrarian deconstructionist critics, yet they find themselves in the position of establishment. They don't seem to know what the fuck to do, and since most who have adopted the doctrine are naturally conformist and neurotypical (conform to the dominant ideology and are motivated by status within the dominant group) they're completely mind-raped and lost in a sea of absurd contradiction. They have to be different, but the same. Don't you dare rock the boat or be controversial, but also be rebellious and stand out.
Shit's comically fucked.
When speaking of contrarian neurodivergents I'm mostly talking about the schizos and autists. The psychopathic/NPD/BPD etc. neurodivergents will be attracted to status and are likely more similar to the neurotypicals ideologically, though their motivations will be heightened to an unhealthy degree (pyshcopaths/NPD seeking status, BPD seeking attention). I would only really consider schizos and autists to be 'truly neurodivergent' (in this context in particular) since the motivations in other personality disorders are usually just heightened motivations that are the same as a 'normal' person's, whereas schizos and autists can often be a little peculiar in that regard - and also personality disorders are a bit of a meme, a useful meme, but a bit of a meme, but that's a whole other rant.

tl;dr: Special as defined by great success through non-conformity and neurodivergence. The very successful creatives. They are the great heroes of the day and will be emulated. Monke see, monke do.

>>21059240
Thank you for proving my point
And funny that you mention studies, there are also studies that show children with lower than average IQ lean more towards racist and homophobic ideas later in life btw
Oh and as a last point, don’t you see the irony in calling yourself an individualist while adhering to one of probably the most collectivistic ideology after socialism?

>>21057382
Fredric Jameson, Baudrillard, Adorno, Althusser. It really depends on what you mean by "written about Marxism.

>>21059935
>And funny that you mention studies, there are also studies that show children with lower than average IQ lean more towards racist and homophobic ideas later in life btw
Your irrelevant whataboutism is...well, irrelevant? And yes, what you say while irrelevant is true...because racism and "homophobia" (hilarious word) when expressed in terms of IQ is a bell curve, obviously. It's so obvious that it's a meme with dozens of permutations, pic related.
>Oh and as a last point, don’t you see the irony in calling yourself an individualist while adhering to one of probably the most collectivistic ideology after socialism?
Never called myself an individualist. You're making this oddly personal....which is very suggestive.

Also while I can guess you are conflating American republicanism with actual right wing thought here ( though the two have almost nothing in common) this would be a conjecture I won't give you the charity of. Logically what you've sad is a total non sequitur, these thoughts you share are so retarded as to almost appear random, as though you are incapable of parsing the actual argument in front of you and can only default to familiar baselines "answers" that deal with the neighborhood you associate the uncomfortable questions before you with. In not so many words, you are an idiot, lol.

You're on the board of Scorates, you should lurk for a few more years before trying to "talk", because all you've accomplished is to make noise.

>>21059935
>>21059935
>And funny that you mention studies, there are also studies that show children with lower than average IQ lean more towards racist and homophobic ideas later in life btw
Your irrelevant whataboutism is...well, irrelevant? And yes, what you say while irrelevant is true...because racism and "homophobia" (hilarious word) when expressed in terms of IQ is a bell curve, obviously. It's so obvious that it's a meme with dozens of permutations, pic related.
>Oh and as a last point, don’t you see the irony in calling yourself an individualist while adhering to one of probably the most collectivistic ideology after socialism?
Never called myself an individualist. You're making this oddly personal....which is very suggestive.

Also while I can guess you are conflating American republicanism with actual right wing thought here ( though the two have almost nothing in common) this would be a conjecture I won't give you the charity of. Logically what you've sad is a total non sequitur, these thoughts you share are so retarded as to almost appear random, as though you are incapable of parsing the actual argument in front of you and can only default to familiar baselines "answers" that deal with the neighborhood you associate the uncomfortable questions before you with. In not so many words, you are an idiot, lol.

You're on the board of Socrates, you should lurk for a few more years before trying to "talk", because all you've accomplished is to make noise. If I didn't know better I'd say this was a bot.

>>21060193
>Never called myself an individualist. You're making this oddly personal....which is very suggestive.
the moment one brings up attractiveness and personal agency the basedboy incels reflexivel become defensive as is their nature

>>21057382
>Is there anything about [Classical] Marxism written in the last 50 years that actually matters?
Unlikely, the ideology itself is irrelevant. Befitting the odd rogue state or two. It's run its course.

>>21059391
>not realizing that the true individualist course of action is to scam the government for a living while you do nothing but impulsively do whatever you want with no regard for criminality and indulge in the most wasteful hedonism imaginable

>>21058584
>Left Communists
As opposed to Right Communists???

>>21060270
"Left" and "Right" communism is how leftists differentiate each other between the half that are too retarded to ever run society and the half that are amoral sociopaths who just want make the world ugly.

>>21060231
It's weird how often one encounters this retarded take on this website, is it because of all the NEETs?

Protip: responsibility is liberating anon. You have far more possibilities once you commit yourself to real work like an actual adult, that's individualism. You aren't scamming the government. The government prints money to drip feed you and millions of other placated morons without a second thought. It costs them nothing. In return you are domesticated, enslaved, and curtailed of your potential and future.

>>21060364
>get paid by society to do drugs and commit crimes all day
>"UHHH UR A SLAVE DURRR U NEED TO LIBERATE URSELF WITH A JOB DURRRR MATCHING OTHER PEOPLE'S EXPECTATION OF WHAT CONSTITUTES AN ADULT IS LIBERATION DURRR

>>21060364
arbeit macht frei, as they say

when you watch your next video of basketball american youths rampaging through a mcdonalds filling their backpacks with french fries and coca cola remember that you are watching true individualism unhindered by the shackles of society

>>21060364
astounding

>>21058604
At least he chose to walk instead of opting for the wheelchair like his obese leftist counterparts.

>>21060270
as opposed to Stalinists

>>21060396
nice strawman
individualism is decidedly counter to what you describe, it means doing what others aren't, it means doing what isn't easy
low crimes like this are about as general and conforming as is possible, the state of California literally doesn't even prosecute or police against criminal offenses under a certain cash value amount, it's that quotidian, and will soon become an absolute norm everywhere in the west I expect

it's fucking amazing to me how complete the victory is over communism, before it used to be the domain of critical thinkers but it has since been completely subsumed and negated by the prevailing culture of consumerism

>>21057382
michael heinrich's commentary on the first three chapters of capital is goated

>>21057382
>It doesn't make any sense to go to Marx when the guy lived before the invention of electricity let alone computers.
What does this have to do with anything? Odd sentiment to share on /lit/

>>21060270
Average anticommunist /lit/ poster doesn't even know lenin wrote a book literally called
>left communism: an infantile disorder

>>21060364
>LTV deboonk which is thoroughly addressed within the first 20 pages of kapital

>>21060807
>it's fucking amazing to me how complete the victory is over communism
*blocks your path*

>>21060807
Marx believed the revolution/ socialism will arise after capitalism collapses on it's own contradictions. It wasn't really something a society just up and decides to do, rather it's the logical progression or evolution of an industrialized society. Socialist revolution was never going to happen within the Imperial core. It's for peasants in miserable shithole countries who come out of the jungle to machete their landlords.

I can explain the exact mechanism socialism will likely come about. Marxists talk about the tendency for profits to decline and modern economists talk about a race to the bottom to mean the same thing.

Globalized neoliberalism has functionally tied the world into a single market or economic entity. This will have the effect of trending all nations toward a mean, as labor arbitrage and foriegn competition erodes at the comparative advantages of the 1st world/ Imperial core. Brazilification they call it, as Brazil is seen as this perfectly average mean compared to other countries. So while the shittiest countries in the global economy will improve, the Imperial core will decline. Avenues for growth will vanish as every market becomes saturated. The quality of life will continue to decline as capitalism runs out of avenues to grow, it will turn into a sort of rent-seeking cannibalizing form of government that people sure won't like one bit. The elites will practically push for slavery, to extract everything they can from a diminishing economy. You'll own nothing and expect to like it. It's already happening.

So in that case, that may lead to revolution. It might lead to socialism, which is great at managing stagnation, or might lead to something else even worse.

>>21060908
Finally, some good fucking dialectics

>>21060807
>individualism is when everybody acts like me
every anarchist is a baffled dictator

>>21057994
that's pretty bizarre

>>21058605
I dunno, I'm from Ohio and know it comes from a reinterpretation of the anarcho-syndicalist theories of Sorel

>>21060908
>Marx believed the revolution/ socialism will arise after capitalism collapses on it's own contradictions. It wasn't really something a society just up and decides to do

>>21059178
you're not much different than a jew. both hate the west, you're just more honest about it.

>>21060908
>Avenues for growth will vanish as every market becomes saturated. The quality of life will continue to decline as capitalism runs out of avenues to grow, it will turn into a sort of rent-seeking cannibalizing form of government that people sure won't like one bit.
you faggots have been saying this for over a century now lol

meanwhile in reality

>>21060231

You're now completely dependent on the government, congrats. That's why the "eat the bugs" wing of managerial capitalism is so obsessed with instituting universal basic income.

>>21060908
>Marx believed the revolution/ socialism will arise after capitalism collapses on it's own contradictions
no he didn't. he believed it will be abolished by the revolution/socialism
>Socialist revolution was never going to happen within the Imperial core. It's for peasants in miserable shithole countries who come out of the jungle to machete their landlords.
that's not socialist revolution, but bourgeois revolution. like the French peasants coming out of the woods and epeeing the aristocratic landowners in 1789

>>21060974
It may take some prodding to dislodge the elites in such a dystopian form of end stage capitalism but it would be possible because there would be enough desperate people to pull it off.

>>21060980
It will happen, it's predicted on a pretty conventional understanding of economics. I've yet to see anyone refute it.

Furthermore you understand how fake and gay the US economy is? 20% of GDP is advertisement. Another 42% is the FIRE sector. About 40% of GDP government spending, with some overlap.

In the future, commodities will increase in price due to scarcity and other factors and will reduce the comparative value of this type of advertisement-consoomer economy. We're gonna be Brazil.

>>21061182
>no he didn't. he believed it will be abolished by the revolution/socialism
read the last line of his post you fucking retard

>>21060848
What does he know, the USSR wasn't real Communism, or so I'm told.

>>21060231
>end up dead with your genes not propagated
lol

>>21060873
>china
national socialism

>>21060908
national socialism will, yes
trannies and any other untermenschen will be swiftly executed and cremated

Democrats are the real communists

>>21060908
I kneel before thee

>>21061269
>China is natsoc
Cope. You and your ideology are irrelevant genetic dead ends.

>>21061318
>They can't be natsoc, look, they're soc!
k
I'm NTA and I don't even genuinely think they're natsoc, that's just a useless fucking argument.

>>21061322
Based on what might I ask anon? I'm very interested to know what over 90 million self proclaimed marxists apparently don't.

>>21061212
I don't intend to. but you surely already read the first
>>21061228
except Lenin knew
>Nor, I think, has any Communist denied that the term Soviet Socialist Republic implies the determination of the Soviet power to achieve the transition to socialism, and not that the existing economic system is recognised as a socialist order. https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1921/apr/21.htm
>the class distinction between workers and peasants should be abolished. That is exactly our object. A society in which the class distinction between workers and peasants still exists is neither a communist society nor a socialist society. https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1919/may/06.htm

>>21061327
Basic logic? Why are you arguing that being Marxist precludes them from being anything else?

>>21061276
I don't really perceive Hilary Clinton to be communist

>>21061337
>You can be two ideologically opposed things at once

>>21061269
National Socialism got BTFO instantly and did nothing get their people slaughtered in the millions and cucked for decades. It had a run about 15 years long and did more damage to those nations than Communism ever could have.

I don't think that's coming back. You can't substitute class warfare with actual warfare for very long. Fascists put their economic Imperialism to task and got absolutely fucking clobbered. The model of Rome as prosperity by conquer is way obsolete. There are waaay too many people and they're all fucking armed with rifles.

>>21057382
>Is there anything about Marxism written in the last 50 years that actually matters?
Yes.

>>21057382
The Autonomists are pretty interesting.

>>21061336
>I'm not retarded as long as I don't acknowledge I'm retarded
Yeah, good one

>>21061183
>It may take some prodding to dislodge the elites in such a dystopian form of end stage capitalism but it would be possible because there would be enough desperate people to pull it off.
You should read Max Weber. The position of the elite echelon of society is completely beyond dislodging at this point through the power of bureaucratic domination. The average person not only lacks the technical and legal and financial knowledge required to engage against these groups, but they don't even want to have it anymore thanks to the efforts and total dominance of bureaucrats in education and mass media.


>It will happen, it's predicted on a pretty conventional understanding of economics. I've yet to see anyone refute it.
You just saw that post do it.

>Furthermore you understand how fake and gay the US economy is? 20% of GDP is advertisement. Another 42% is the FIRE sector. About 40% of GDP government spending, with some overlap.
>In the future, commodities will increase in price due to scarcity and other factors and will reduce the comparative value of this type of advertisement-consoomer economy. We're gonna be Brazil.
This literally (the literal kind) made me laugh out loud. It's 2022 bud, how the fuck do Malthusians still exist? Lmao. On average commodity prices are overwhelmingly going DOWN and there is ZERO reason to think that will reverse especially after the complete debacle that was the world wide covid lockdown destroying supply structures intentionally and still being unable to generate significant shortages.

The world is genuinely revolution proof at this point. Marx is wrong, but everyone already knows that.

Why is everyone off topic?
What's in the last 50 years that actually matters?

>>21061276
Then why did Obama do a better job policing the border and deporting wetbacks than any other president in recent history?

>>21061416
>history is immutable ere its end
>we are the penultimate last men
spooky thought desu

>>21061451
only slightly less spooky than believing sweet-sounding posturing on 4chan instead of breaking your wrists picking up a book for the first time

>>21061318
you just posted by ideology though?
thanks I guess lol
here have it from the boss himself and keep seething tranny

>>21061374
that's just german natsoc and they weren't even socialists lmao. Do you think natsoc is like a religion that applies universally? every country has its own

>I don't think that's coming back.
NSDAP? yeah they're done and germs are going extinct anyway which means it's over forever. but why are you telling me about germs?

>There are waaay too many people and they're all fucking armed with rifles.
lol you're american aren't you? MUH GUNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNS
nobody will do shit, cope

>>21061388
I tried looking into Bifo and Negri. I liked a bit of Bifo but there was so muh feminism and muh sexism in Negri's writing I dropped him hard.

>>21061318
>DPRK is calling itself democratic therefore they have a democracy
Lol

>>21061474
I'm American and own rifles, that is true. Also any country anywhere can produce such weapons and hand them out if the circumstances call for it.

Thing about modern organized society is a large majority are engaged in useless work. You could totally arm 20% of a country and still maintain a wartime economy. Has nothing to do with rights, everything to do with war.

>>21061492
the issue isn't weapons, but that nobody's actually using them. You have it as a hobby and not as a tool

>>21061497
My whole point is the race to the bottom making life in the Imperial Core no different than Brazil. With Poverty, inequality, corruption and economic stagnation rife, 400k guns I private hands means the form of government isn't set in stone lol.

>>21061502
maybe, wake me up when that happens

>>21061474
>Socialism with Chinese characteristics is Socialism. It is not any other sort of 'ism.
>is Socialism
>not any other sort of 'ism.
Do you want to try again?
>>21061480
Hello anon, may I begin by asking if you have ever read Marx in your life?

>>21057382

Yes. Just post. OP here. This is no joke.

>>886484244
>>886484244
>>886484244

Cheers, and have fun learning.

>>21061509
Give it, 5-50 years. It will only be recognized in retrospect. There will be a economic collapse of FIRE/ tech/ bullshit and decline into a recession that never actually ends.

Look up pharmaceuticals or other major industries. R&D is already at negative ROI. This shit isn't sustainable it's gonna collapse, all of it, and be replaced by something else.

>>21061519
When you like like this to others you lie first to yourself.

>>21061416
Woo boy you're dumb. Commodities will go UP. Your bargaining power for wages will go DOWN.

I have no Malthusian argument, I have a degree in economics and this is a very uncontroversial take of mine. Literally nobody who is intellectually honest thinks this retarded shit is sustainable. It's evidently not, based off everything we understand about economics.

You know how fake the economy is and didn't even flinch? You should maybe work for the government. The US economy is a tenuous, mostly fake fucking thing based off the utility of the USD to buy bonds with. It won't be like that forever bro. You can't have a whole country based off government bonds.

>>21057382
>>21061519

Sorry OP. Here:

>>21061557
>>21061557
>>21061557

Cheers.

>>21061571

He was an excellent economist too and it's end to end Marxist. Marx did it better with the tools of his time.

>>21061011
>he thinks he's not dependent on the government

>>21061257
>he thinks impulsive low iq trash has a lower fertility rate than his le based middle class individualists

so...this....is....the....power.....of.......individualism!

>>21061479
I much prefer Bifo. Check out Tronti, too. Early Negri (pre Empire) is pretty good, especially his book on Lenin.

>>21061276
>>21060908
related

>>21060908
>Marx believed
This is why 4chan is rotting your brain. You're having conversations 18 year olds have between each other when they're trying to hide their simplistic cock-tugging exercises.
It's not a matter of belief. These actual adults who write this material aren't proposing something to you to read into. It's a fucking compilation of information and derivations from that information.
You are too used to "buying into" "beliefs." You are never going to make it.

>>21061730

All Iti commie faggot life unworthy of life. There is nothing so execrable as their gleeful descriptions of their doings in the volume Autonomia (although Piperno gave a joke interview which was actually funny, about how Negri never shuts the fuck up). I am delighted that Italy has returned to tradition (for a moment, never trust an Italian government to sustain for more than a year) and I wish you painful death.

Read Marx, Engels, Lenin, and Trotsky

>>21061761
My comrade in Christ I thank you for your concern I have been lurking here since 2006 and I'm now on my 6th Reddit ban. I can't go back the algorithm knows my mannerisms and shadow bans my attempts to get updoots.

I don't buy any believes. I say I'm Marxist but truthfully I don't believe ideology can solve our problems. I don't believe in utopia. I think the world is too complex for ideology.

Make me dictator of the world. I will solve lots of problems and also create many more novel problems nobody has had to think about.

>>21057382
In his defense, that's some pretty good word working and I hope he stuck with that hobby.

>>21061963
He probably bought it somewhere and made up some bullshit story on reddit for boat points.

>>21061972
Would be disappointed if that were true. Redditors have an obsession with their updoots. And neurotic lefties have no shame.

>>21061183
>end stage capitalism
>Brazilification
Oh a PhillipCunliffe fag. Keep naming capitalist eras and declaring their end, it works greatly.

>>21060848
You obviously haven't read the book or have any idea what the fuck you're talking about

>>21061972
Just like you the around a completely baseless accusation for good-boy points on /pollit/?

>>21058018
Do you cretins ever wonder why you fail?
>praxis centric
gobbledygook
>proletarian autogestation
retarded

>>21061388
I read that book and I found it to be boring.

>>21062600
There's a pussy in your motorcycle's seat.
And I am going to fuck it.

>>21061963
I'm surprised the drawing is so bad.

>>21057382
Look into Autonomia.

>>21059429
Bad bait

>>21062928
which part is incorrect?

>>21057919
You gonna pay off that loan yet?

>>21057432
I think there's even less popular taste, and certainly less elite taste, for national socialism than there is for communism.

>>21058642
>Liberals see Fascism as 'Communism with racist characteristics'.

Not really, libs see communism as the immature and rowdy little brother of liberalism (that you're supposed to grow out of with time and become a good little lib while keeping the sentiment of things - "social justice", "fighting against fascism", etc. - alive) while fascism is seen as this demonic, irrational, abyssal faustian force that you're seduced by, an alien and malignant force of evil lodged into the body of the nation by both commies and libs.

>>21063365
We can probably split things even more than my original post. I don't disagree with you, but I have seen both. What I described is the mindset of boomertards operating off of cold war propaganda "socialism is when the government does stuff" that sees Fascism as necessarily leftwing because it isn't the Free Market.

What you described is more a university phenomenon, so it probably tracks to class and education. You know, the cliche socialist activist in college becomes a lawyer and puts away childish things mentality.

>>21057382
modern marxism = lumpenproles

>>21063324
2+ billion national socialists would beg to differ. It's not just china but also many african nations
in the west there certainly isn't. But who cares about the west?

>>21063473
None of that is national socialism. Stop trying to claim the success of communists, you're just pathetic.

>>21058041
In this same vein, the Strange Death of Marxism: The European Left in the New Millenium

>>21061571
>>21061577

>>21063852
>>21063852
>>21063852

>>21062269
>ESL retard is so fucking stupid they think "points" exist on an anonymous mongolian basketweaving forum
for all anyone knows I'm samefagging

>>21057382
The only actual Communists are a Stalinists or a Hoxhaists. Everyone else is a falseflagging class traitor.

>>21060980
Said it many times, it will be said many more, but communism in common Marxist ideology is the kingdom of heaven. The kind of Marxists who believe in that story structure (which appears is most of them) will deny it strictly because they think their big event at the end of history is real and the Christian one is fake, but the history of the Marxist tradition is so similar even to the history of the Christian church that it is almost an open embarrassment for Marxists that they constantly have to cope with. Marx and Engels were very convinced that communist revolution was near at hand, and the followers of Jesus also believed the end times were very close. When it became incredibly delayed, both created more organized orthodoxies to better define the boundaries of the faith and keep it secure for the now longer term view of the big event. But you can only delay the event for so long, and eventually the organized orthodoxy starts hemorrhaging legitimacy. Communism collapsed a lot harder because it fell to its enemies where Christianity resisted Islam and basically relinquished its more earthly authority in order to maintain itself in the face of the schisms that were strongly tied to political changes in Europe. The church just receded from politics and became a spiritual club, which it has managed to do remarkable well as given the circumstances. But communist belief is fundamentally tied to politics because it's political theology is atheistic, it doesn't have a theology splitting the spiritual from the earthly (beyond small elements like "no ethical consumption"), so its orthodox organized elements were significantly destroyed in geo-political conflict with the fall of the USSR. The remnant in China, which was already the product of a schism, majorly reformed to defend itself through greater cooperation with its ideological enemies.

>>21061431
nta but probably because he didn't have a giant group of politicians trying to stop him

>>21064530
I think you're right for what it's worth.

I'd say Communism collapsed independent of it's enemies though. With the Soviets the nomeklatura dismantled the country for personal gain. Basically they realized they would personally be better off so they sold the country off for it's scrap metal value to themselves and their cronies. So you have a state run by the mafia now feasting on the corpse of the Soviet Union.

It wasn't really Reagan or whoever that just used meme magic to make his enemies collapse.

>>21064559
I wouldn't say it was Reagan or anything, but I think the coup and the selling off of the state were probably more severe than what the church had to endure in its decline at least partially because the communists didn't really have a spiritual fallback from their failures here on earth. The inner circles of the state and party were increasingly rife with cynicism about the communist project, they began to directly understand it as propaganda for security of the state rather than the entire point of the state. But once you understand that, there is a question of why you are loyal to the state anymore. Much of the old guard believed in communism, by most evidence even ruthlessly "pragmatic" leaders like Stalin believed in communism, but the seemingly aborted realization of communism for the new party officials left plenty of room for ambiguity on what was happening anymore, what they were even doing. The increasingly cynical but still loyal ones were more like patriots of the USSR as the successor to the Russian empire, and they just sought high positions out of a desire for status and glory as well as possibly a genuine desire to secure the state. But the less loyal ones saw opportunity for personal gain if they managed to gnaw at the tensions created by the failure of the party to achieve communism, and basically sell out to the ideological enemies in the west. The party just couldn't seem to police or appease these people, which I don't necessarily think was an inevitability or anything but just the way things shook out. China managed to maintain legitimacy, but at the cost of some of the purity of the party's line, which was fraught with danger for those who sought to reform if they were defeated by their own enemies in the party.

But I contrast that spiritual and earthly element because I think communism struggles with the fact that it is basically selling something fairly tangible, in the sense that if the party declares communism is here it better really feel like what i thought communism was supposed to be or I'm going to be passed. Whereas to an extent the church can defer the end times indefinitely because they have an immaterial story about the fate of your soul. The end times are in the book, they're canon, but they've been successfully made kind of a floaty nearly mythological thing. They feel like they could happen at any time or effectively never, but if you find redemption you will witness them because you'll get to go to heaven and wait around until the horns are sounded and Jesus returns to Earth. So no anxieties about this life, just worry about having a seat at the show in the next one. I think that helps to diffuse some of the tensions in expectations by the faithful that otherwise severely damaged the legitimacy of communism.

>>21057382
Marxism is a tool of capitalism
Capitalism doesn't lead to marxism. Other way around

>>21064698
You have good points but that cynicism also extended to common people. Some people believed socialism was good and others thought it was limiting or dysfunctional. The Soviet Union also collapsed at its absolute peak, with high standards of living and relatively liberal society. Which opened up a lot of nationalism and divisiveness.

I think critically, it was that the working class simply didn't have a say in government, or any agency whatsoever neither did they really desire it, being fatalistic slavs and all.

With all power entrusted to the pinnacle of the party apparatus it was serious design flaw. Or happy design flaw depending on how you feel about Communism. The people didn't have much of a choice about it.

>>21060980
>you faggots have been saying this for over a century now
And it came true eventually.
>meanwhile in reality
Central bankers had to print trillions to prevent capitalism from shitting the bed again, the capitalists are now brazenly telling people to live in pods eat bugs and import brown people instead of reproducing and the idea of buying your own house becomes more and more of a scifi to young people.

>>21065210
The US barely has 10% inflation during a worldwide crisis where places like Turkey or Argentina are hitting 100%. You're delusional if you think Capitalism is failing.

>>21064720
explain

>>21065421
Turkey and Argentina are solidly neoliberal capitalist countries dumbass.

>>21062263
I don't know how you have arrived at this conclusion anon, please tell

>>21063473
Natsocs really taking this manifestation thing a bit too far. I feel bad for them

>>21065554
I think almost every ideology is guilty of this though. They will attribute their successes to their ideology and ascribe their rival ideology to it if or it's failures.

Commies call it socialism until you talk about human rights then they're suddenly awful capitalists.

Liberals will point to their rapid growth and call them capitalists then they're commies when they sell them poisonous dog food and baby formula.

I don't blame fash for trying to see themselves in that society either.

>>21065519
>Turkey are solidly neoliberal capitalist countries dumbass.

>>21065421
the US isn't true capitalism though, it's some weird form of protoglobalist corporate socialism with a "disinterested" central bank agency that was established in the US. but corporatism implies that it takes little effort to sever ties with whichever nation you're currently in business with, so the US and the greenback are currently the house favorite, probably because of the modernized culture prone to overconsumption and the cartoonish level of destructive/moneymaking power behind the MIC that rarely stops churning. add drones into the equation? man, fuck that

>>21065624
It's capitalism, because the economy is privately owned. The boring take every economist says is every country in the world is a "mixed economy". Neither free market nor a full command economy.

The exact flavor of capitalism is pretty much aimed at giving large corporations and elites whatever they want. Private profits but public risk. Uncle Suger bails out any corporation that stumbles and designs laws to benefit them to everyone else's expense.

Free market capitalism has never existed and never would. You can't actually seperate business and the state, they're essentially two sides of the same coin. That said, Americans benefit from this arrangement. They get paid in USD which has enormous purchasing power everywhere else. So cheap food, fuel, imports. Why there isn't a real socialist movement cause socialism would directly undermine this paradigm and fuck up the country just like the libertarians say it would.

>>21065421
If you havent noticed, USD is worlds reserve currency. USA has this kind of economic superpower that they can print cash everyone else is paying with so their inflation is shared with the rest of the world. Problem here is that the fruits of the printing spree were hoarded mainly by speculative capital (with cryptobubble being its most internet-famous manifestation) and the toll for printing will be paid mainly by the working class; key here is that the fruits WERE harvested and the toll WILL be paid. Makes no sense to pretend that the damage is over, we are just in the first phase.

But to be honest, it makes little sense to talk about capitalism ATM, because our current situation is deeply geopolitical, hence we can say that capitalism is America and fate of capitalism rests on American ability to maintain their reins over Germany and Taiwan. If they hold Germany in their sphere of influence, they can cannibalize German industry and save American economy.

>>21065624
True capitalism exists only in platonic realm. "globalist corporate socialism" is still capitalism, because the people in power are private bankers (capitalists). Its just that they no longer can sustain themselves on what was the "free market", because rate of profit declined so much.

>>21065583
What that guy and other natsocs are doing though is the inversion this, which is even more brain damaged. It would be like a communist claiming McCarthy era USA as communist in the wake of FDRs legacy. Look at this fucking retard for instance >>21061474 he actually thought that Xi Jinping quote was an epic btfo. Like really, that quote is at explicit odds with the natsoc and he still--somehow--bent it to suit him. Ignoring this, then what does he make of all the red flags, hammers and sickles, the enormous likenesses of Marx and other prominent Leninist commies in their official buildings, and the universities dedicated to the instruction of Marxism? Do they know that Marxism is at odds with national socialism? Xi Jinping reveres Stalin ffs - the man who was at the helm of annihilating the only actually existing incidence of national socialism in history. How many more clues do natsocs in current year need that China is not natsoc?

>>21065678
This guy is correct. The inflation here and everywhere is directly related to the covid bail-out bucks the Fed printed out along with all the QE and 0% interest loans.

Hyperinflation is a deliberate central bank policy. It is not like normal inflation. They do it to get debt off their books and recessions happen to be the best time to do it as it forces people to spend. Weimar, Argentina, Zimbabwe all do it to screw foreigners holding debt in their currency. It's not a dysfunction it's deliberate.

The US never ever does this which is one reason why the USD is a reserve currency. You can buy anything in the US which helps too. Unlike say, the ruble you can buy oil or titanium or the shittiest cars in the world and not much else.

>>21065708
Yes that guy is horribly smooth brained but I see the appeal. China pogroms Muslims, refuses immigrants, attempts a unified culture, is militarily robust, nationalistic and the government intervenes in the economy to suit national interests. All very fashy kinda things which in themselves aren't contradictory to socialism or capitalism either. The problem with natsocs is their ideology isn't coherant, never has been. China's shit isn't ideologically coherant either, so even though that anon is a moron I can sympathize with viewpoint even though the ridiculousness of ignoring all the hammers and sickles and universities named after commies. He may consider it window dressing like many commies do North Korea.

>>21059240
based fellow jimmer

>>21058604
>>21058594
Any communists going to hazard a real answer as to why liberal capitalists are far more scared of ethnonationalism than they are of leftism? If leftist anthropology is correct, shouldn't racist chuds be getting deep state support to defend the property structure in the case of a crisis?

>>21065768
I'm something of a commie and it's because like, 2% of the population are socialists and fractured into 100 tendencies that all hate each other. Also half of us are useless trannies and NEETs.

The rightoid MAGA Qanon masses are retarded but broadly unified and they're all armed and unreasonable.

Socialism in the US is an intellectual exercise, or an excuse to meet and fuck weird people. It is not a real political movement, socialism in the US died 100 years ago with the death of the labor movement. The only real lefty influence is some tiny fraction of Democrats who are democratic socialists that strictly reject violence as a means. Harmless.

>>21065758
Honestly, you're just as stupid as he is

>>21058014
Funny that capitalism needs no follower to kill people. Actually it can actually be undesirable by the majority and still kill and enslave people

>>21059323
I love how you take your scarce experiences from your developed nanny state and extrapolate to all the world. What do you know about paraguayan socialism? Or african? You are just retarded if you think people being benefited by the exploitation will do anything against it. But what is the most fun is that you and your people will be silently replaced by cheap third world labor and you will do nothing because of your inebriation caused by your condition of life

>>21065768
Because PRC is willing to let them invest and profit, but those capitalists that have time to develop philosophy and class-consciousness still consider PRC to be their greatest enemy. You may not connect it to the ideology of communism much because PRC is not evangelically Marxist like USSR was, but it is still a major fucking thorn in the ass of liberal utopists because they succesfully integrated in global capitalism while maintaing Marxist-Leninist political system.

Ethnonationalists are a threat, because due to declining standards of living and declining moral standards capitalist countries no longer maintain sufficient fertility rate. Hence capitalists need to import slave class of "inferiour races", which is obviously making native people angry and rayciss. There is also a divide in capitalist class between the high tech/service "onions-capital" and traditional industrial/agricultural capital where the onions-capital controls most of media. Onions-capital is leaning towards "inclusivity" because urban leisure-bourgeiose were always fags like that, plus there are numerous subtle economic factors at play as well like niggers blowing their welfare checks on netflix will make netflix more supportive of niggers getting welfare checks.

>>21065788
How so? NatSoc is a retarded ideology I'm putting myself in his shoes here. China has a cool flag, nazis fucking love cool flags.

>>21065844
>China pogroms Muslims, refuses immigrants, attempts a unified culture, is militarily robust, nationalistic and the government intervenes in the economy to suit national interests. All very fashy kinda things
This, and
>China's shit isn't ideologically coherant either so even though that anon is a moron I can sympathize with viewpoint
are stupid and if you knew that you wouldn't sympathise with the natsoc. Go back.

>>21065873
All of that is true though. I really hope you're not a commie that sincerely believes what the CCP says it is then it might be you in fact who is retarded and bamboozled because their flag is red with yellow trim.

>>21065889
Just go back please

>>21065678
America is literally on the verge of turning all of Europe into a mercantile vassal state. And the European majority are completely on board with this.

You have to fucking hand it to them, who could have dreamed this would be the direction of the west 50 or even 20 years ago? I'm so fucking glad I learned Mandarin.

>>21065906
Europoors are already psyopped into woke American bullshit, at least at the upper class level. What will be interesting is seeing how populism arises across the western world. If anything kills the GAE it will be that.

>>21065898
I'm a commie and on my 6th ban from Reddit I can't go back. The algorithm detects my mannerisms and shadowbans me. Refute me. You can't because I'm right.

>>21065984
Try twitter :)

>>21066041
I'd be banned after the first thing I write. There is bunkerchan but you know how we commies all hate each other that place is full of left coms and degen neets also slow as fuck.

I guess only the entertainment of the afterlife where I can go to heaven or hell and shitpost where I belong

>>21065954
Populism is the closest thing the modern man has to blasphemy, to call it a fringe taboo belief would be an understatement.

>>21066057
Populism is literally just people asking for a government that benefits them lmao.

Why Trump captivated half the USA.

>>21065906
>America is literally on the verge of turning all of Europe into a mercantile vassal state. And the European majority are completely on board with this.
That is not the correct way to word it. Germany already is a vassal state, but its on a verge of snapping after American blew up their pipes. And shits just about to get more funky as Russian druids once again summoned harsh winter upon Europe.

>>21066065
Ever read From Household to Nation by Samuel Francis? It's short

He predicted it all in the 90s

>>21065516
Shut up, you stupid fuck. Stop egging on those who can't elucidate.

>>21058243
>scientifically verified
?

>>21057382
I would suppose so. Marxism is adaptable to newer times and conditions because its core tenets are timeless. Apathetic atheism, dialectical materialism, sanctity of the oppressed, toxicity of capitalism, communism as a possible heaven on earth, and socialism as a means to pursue communism. None of these are tied to the 1800s.
>>21057432
>Modern marxism is sponsored by das Kapital kek
Upper class families convinced of Marxism aspire to become vanguard elites "when socialism comes", for which they use their ties and influence to present themselves as social justice saints to win the trust of the movement.
>>marxists: neutralized, 200 year old obsolete
Outside of China and developing countries, Marxism survived by shifting its demographic from the international proletary to brown people, unmanly people, and environmentalists. Brown people because European imperialism can be framed as a "dialectic" between whites as oppressors and browns as oppressees, unmanly people because patriarchal society can be framed as a dialectic between tyrannical men and a majority of unmen (children, women, and fags), and environmentalists because corporate pollution can be spun as capitalism poisoning the world and being in need of replacement by socialism.

>>21066153
Why is Jesus black here

>>21060873
if Germany didn't domain squat the term "natsoc" then it would be a completely uncontroversial label to apply to contemporary Chinese politics / economics

>>21066085
Thanks anon. I know I'm fuckin right.

The closest thing to revolutionary counter culture to oppose the elites are like 80 IQ Republicans like Buchanan and Trump who plainly observe how fucked things are and just work to make things right by common sense metrics. I hope they win bigly I will vote for them.

>>21066165
see >>21065708 then fill yourself

>>21066170
re read my post carefully

>>21066182
Marxists are internationalists. NEXT.

>>21066192
china is not marxist in any sense of the word
you've never actually read about China, have you?

>>21066196
You've never read Marx.

>>21066207
I have, and I've also studied (and lived in) China for a long time.
You don't know what you're talking about. Why are you even arguing? Just to play some weird ideology game for your team? Fuck off.

>>21066230
>Sexpat who read the manifesto when he was teenager
Sorry, I truly kneel

>>21058576
They are? Peter Thiel throws money at any reactionary.

>>21066240
It's okay to retreat without the cope. You can always just stop replying, or leave the thread altogether.

>>21065768
Thé international elite are not just jews. It’s now, more than ever, filled with non-whites. Ethnonationalsim is unpalatable to the elite because non white countries despite the memes are more powerful than ever before, with elites that swing their dick around.

Commies are so quick to denounce each other as Red Fascists and crypto-reactionaries when arguing amongst themselves but as soon as a Nazi enters the chat and calls the group in question based all the commies suddenly realize that that group is actually the purest form of Marxism. The predictability of this is so funny kek

>>21066247
>What we have to deal with here [in analyzing the programme of the workers' party] is a communist society, not as it has developed on its own foundations, but, on the contrary, just as it emerges from capitalist society; which is thus in every respect, economically, morally, and intellectually, still stamped with the birthmarks of the old society from whose womb it comes.
>And the modern state, again, is only the organisation that bourgeois society takes on in order to support the general external conditions of the capitalist mode of production against the encroachments as well of the workers as of individual capitalists. The modern state, no matter what its form, is essentially a capitalist machine, the state of the capitalists, the ideal personification of the total national capital. The more it proceeds to the taking over of productive forces, the more does it actually become the national capitalist, the more citizens does it exploit. The workers remain wage-workers — proletarians. The capitalist relation is not done away with. It is rather brought to a head. But, brought to a head, it topples over. State ownership of the productive forces is not the solution of the conflict, but concealed within it are the technical conditions that form the elements of that solution.
>This solution can only consist in the practical recognition of the social nature of the modern forces of production, and therefore in the harmonising of the modes of production, appropriation, and exchange with the socialised character of the means of production And this can only come about by society openly and directly taking possession of the productive forces which have outgrown all control except that of society as a whole. The social character of the means of production and of the products today reacts against the producers, periodically disrupts all production and exchange, acts only like a law of nature working blindly, forcibly, destructively. But with the taking over by society of the productive forces, the social character of the means of production and of the products will be utilised by the producers with a perfect understanding of its nature, and instead of being a source of disturbance and periodical collapse, will become the most powerful lever of production itself.
Seethe sexpat. You are a loser.

>>21066251
You sure about that? It really seems like Manhattan, DC-Nova, Boston, Los Angeles and London set the tone for everything and the rest of the """global community"""" falls in line behind them. That's all anglo-saxons and jews. Nobody looks for the Indian, Saudi, Chinese, Russian take on anything, they're basically viewed as backwards savages to be sneered at or potential for their children to be amalgamated in through the ivy league

>>21066283
Do you have an argument? If pressed, would you be able to apply these arguments to modern China instead of simply copy+pasting them? I don't think you can, and I see this as continued cope until you demonstrate otherwise.

>>21066306
You have no answer. You lose.

>>21066313
>If pressed, would you be able to apply these arguments to modern China instead of simply copy+pasting them? I don't think you can
Thanks for playing.

>>21058423
Not him but the average Brazilian is 80 percent white, and especially in the south there are millions of whites with no admixture, and the pardos down there have very little aswell

>>21065666
>Free market capitalism has never existed and never would. You can't actually seperate business and the state, they're essentially two sides of the same coin
that's true, the main point i was making was the status of the fed though, the US (israel and GB too probably) are the few who benefit from the policies they claim are neutral, though that's mostly due to the way power consolidates. either way, it's a new style of capitalism where the capitalist is now the middle man and banking regulations have the capability to completely decouple market realities from economic realities

I would like to take a moment to observe and unpack what I believe to be a completely typical online interaction with a "Marxist" (or, at the least, someone attempting to argue through a Marxist lens).

>>21066192
A tautological statement that presupposes correctness of an underlying assumption. (China is Marxist, Marxists are internationalists, internationalists are not nationalists, therefore, China is not nationalist).
>>21066207
Immediate ad hominem stating that the opponent has never read Marx. This is not meant to genuinely discredit (or even attack) the opponent- it is an attempt to re-enforce the arguer's faith in their own argument, as well as signal the obvious truth of their argument to any potential allies. After all, anyone who has read Marx agrees with me, because it is certainly true!
>>21066240
Immediate follow-up ad hominem. This concedes the previous point (okay, you actually have read Marx, but not the ~correct~ Marx, and certainly not with a fully functioning brain) while maintaining an attack on credibility. Again, this is meant more to shield the arguer and his (likely imaginary) allies from reflection on their arguments / assumptions. "Sexpat' is also used to signal that the arguee is the oppressor, immoral, dirty, etc.
>>21066283
The climax of any argument with a Marxist. A wall of text written 150 prior is dumped without context and without attempt to apply it in any way to the current discussion. The burden is on the arguee to extrapolate a framework from this text and apply it on their own to the context, magically reaching the same conclusion as the arguer.
>>21066313
Claim victory, abandon thread.

Arguing with Marxists is a truly fruitless endeavor. When I argue with a fascist, they will sometimes come up with a clever way to call me a Jew or a nigger. But a Marxist will never find an interesting and humorous way to resolve an argument. It will always be the same boring tropes. Don't argue with these people, just laugh at them.

>>21060848
Left communism isn't a ideology or it's own "strain" of communism, it's a political tendency that refers to different things in different contexts, the text you brought up is lenin talking about the dutch-german council communists while when people talk about "leftcoms" they're almost always talking about those who are apart or at least derive from the italian and french left communists who had people like Bordiga and Gilles Dauve. The text you brought up isn't about them, in a 100 page text, lenin talks about bordiga and the italian left communists for literally two sentences

>>21066384
You didn't quote me and I've been shitting this thread up with Marxist talking points for like 2 days solid.

I am the superior strain of Marxist and above your pitiful critque. My flavor of socialism would prevail if any of us had any power or opportunity to affect government whatsoever.

>>21060396
God I hate niggers so much

>>21066384
Holy shit you did NOT need to prove again that you are a fucking loser

>>21061870
christ you're a fucking loser

>>21065758
It’s an aesthetic, the same reason why Belarus holds soviet style parades and statues of Lenin even when they’re capitalist. Having a hammer and sickle flag doesn’t mean you’re not fascist, just means you’re trying to convince the university girl to fuck you

>>21066392
I didn't bother interacting with the thread outside of my personal involvement with it. What you described also sounds uninteresting, so I will not make an effort to read through it.

Another aspect of arguing with Marxist that I find odd is their tacit acceptance of their midwit status. This is simply an expansion of the point made in response to 21066283- the Marxist will never attempt to craft an argument or framework using the words of Marx to apply to a framework in an intelligible way, they will simply dump his words and pray that others do the legwork for them, or simply concede in the face of unnecessary complexity. They understand that they are out of their depth and wielding words and concepts beyond their comprehension, but as they are evangelical by necessity, they must continue to preach.
It reminds me of arguing with Christians / republicans in the early 2000s, where bible quotes and official government employee statements were treated as valid arguments on their own, without need for expounding.

>>21066401
I find it highly likely that I am more successful than you financially, spiritually, in my personal relationships, in my love life, physically, and emotionally.
I also find it highly likely that you will continue to cope and seethe until your self-loathing overwhelms your survival instinct.

>>21057512
>>21057541
What you're describing is the schism between Stazis who embrace fascism in all but name as a means to drive socialism and pursue communism, and Anzis who oppose hierarchical authority even by a communist party and promote feral majoritarian rule as a highway to communism.
>>21058605
>>21058642
Contemporary thinkers fail to separate socialism, communism, and bolshevism; as well as nationalism, fascism, and chauvinism.
>Socialism
Populistic statism. A state to serve the people, and the people to serve the people's state.
>Communism
Civilization without institution. A hypothetical order in which everyone owns everything and everyone works for everyone.
>Bolshevism
Staunch left-wing populism. In-groupers bad, out-groupers good.
>Nationalism
Conviction to pursue the interests of your country, be it due to egoism, patriotism, or philanthropy.
>Fascism
Militant collectivism. The group is the basic unit in which people are pawns of a hive, and anything that opposes the hive is an enemy to be destroyed.
>Chauvinism
Staunch right-wing populism. In-groupers good, out-groupers bad.

>>21065843
Man how are they Marxist Leninist. Don’t they have the second highest number of billionaires in the world? Very Marxian bro

>>21066434
Do you realise how pathetic you sound?

>>21057382
Pretty sure Marx regime wouldn't approve of the gays.

>>21066446
Are you capable of saying anything that isn't an attempt to discredit social value?
Seems like an odd avenue of attack to pursue for a materialist, but what do I know.

>>21066434
>Another aspect of arguing with Marxist that I find odd is their tacit acceptance of their midwit status.
This is funny cause it's maybe true.
Thing is everyone is mediocre. It's just reality. The concept of heroes and exceptional people is a fallacious meme that has never been true. Philosophy suggesting otherwise is the sound of people sucking their own dicks. You can talk all pretentious and superior but we can all see through it which is fine, it's kinda funny we're all just here to shitpost.

>>21066455
Because I have nothing to prove to someone who quickly demonstrated to me that they are both retarded and a loser? You wrote a reddit tier manifesto to convince me of how fucking smart you are and how much of a midwit I am yet up until that point your only argument was that you lived in China. You followed this by telling me about how successful you are a relative to me. So, based off how hard you're trying to prove otherwise I think I'm right that you are both retarded and a loser.

>>21066301
You live inside a bubble. Speaking as someone from outside the West, the American culture of inclusivity and woke news you’re speaking of does coke from there and is spreading worldwide but plenty of the people in those countries you mention have memories of racial hierarchy with whites at the top, pro-white ness, etc. Plenty of the white Western elite who are into agriculture, industry, etc. likely have racialist views. Racialism is a threat because the business dealings of the world has more non-whites at the table who would hate you just for holding those beliefs. The elites of those countries are now politicking with whites and jews — still firmly under their thumb, but with more leverage for better or worse.

>>21066460
>Thing is everyone is mediocre.
This seems meaningless and depends entirely on your frame of reference. If I was the best short-distance sprinter in the world, I am not mediocre at that activity by any interpretation of the word unless you expand the sample size to a frankly ridiculous degree.
>heh, compared to a Cheetah, you're just second-rate
Okay, but literally who would attempt to compare me to a Cheetah, unless the point is specifically to call me mediocre? It's nonsense.

>Philosophy suggesting otherwise is the sound of people sucking their own dicks.
Either you are not communicating your point well or your point is so retarded that it manages to fly underneath my understanding. What does this even mean? Which philosophers?
>You can talk all pretentious and superior but we can all see through it, it's kinda funny we're all just here to shitpost.
Of course, we're all retarded.

>>21066487
L
After losing an argument (because you literally could not make one, even to save face) you proceeded to squirm around and name-call. When responses are made to your name-calling, you use the mere fact of responding as proof that your name calling was correct.
Cope, seethe, dilate, touch grass, etc

>>21066505
When responses are made to your name-calling, you use the mere fact of responding as proof that your name calling was correct.
Yes, and?

>>21066509
see >>21066247
If someone hits too close to home when they make fun of you, it's better to just leave the thread than it is to continue cryposting repeatedly.

>>21066513
What exactly do you think you 'hit close to home' on? lmao you talk like such a loser

>>21066520
see >>21066247

>>21066505
Lmao for a retard you're pretty funny bro.

Philosophy for example like Objectivism man. Rand is sucking her own dick elevating fellow grifters and conmen to hero status. It's not just her. Great Man Theory is a joke. I don't mean to denigrate or say everyone is equally retarded, but the dumbest slumdwelling nig and you are not really so far apart in reality. Nature loves trending to the mean, as sure as entropy. The universe is mediocre and so are you. This isn't an especially Marxist philosophy but it kinda is so I thought your observation was funny. Statistically we are all at or near the mean and that's just how it is.

>>21066530
>Lmao for a retard you're pretty funny bro
thangs :DDD
>Philosophy for example like Objectivism man. Rand is sucking her own dick elevating fellow grifters and conmen to hero status. It's not just her. Great Man Theory is a joke.
Oh yeah sure. As we all know, early childhood trauma is more important to making abnormally impactful people than any kind of innate special-ness.
>the dumbest slumdwelling nig and you are not really so far apart in reality.
By what measure? If we're still talking re: great man theory then sure, my parents neglected me and now I shitpost on 4chan, their parents neglected them and now they aspire to hip-hop fame. It's all the same shit.
>Statistically we are all at or near the mean
If you need to speak statistically, then there are individuals who have higher relative distance from the mean to necessitate use of statistics tho.
Idk. I think that the idea of average of normal people is ridiculous and doesn't exist, while your observations have led you to the opposite conclusion- all humans are average or normal.

>>21066556
Yeah I guess that's it. I think Marxism does have this underlying assumption of man being mediocre, more or less interchangeable. As maybe an aesthetic choice. Marx despised the elites and also the lumpen. Nasty parasitic outliers from the wholesome productive mean the universe tries to produce. Like the universe loves lukewarm tepid water it likes mediocre humans. A composite average of a bunch of different faces is the most beautiful to human perception.

It's fascists and maybe folks like Rand or Nietzsche that try to push this concept of man that asserts himself about the tepid pools but it's kinda fake and gay, right? Like me and you are probably handsome and smart and generally better than everyone else yet here we are.

>>21066585
I don't have anything worth replying but you're a cool dude, thanks for sharing