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20947799 No.20947799 [Reply] [Original]

Is without a doubt the best introduction to Guenon
I have taken the time to transcribe all the important quotes from each chapter so you don't have to read the entire book. (ur welcome)

>inb4 discord server invite

>> No.20947802

Chapter 1 - The Dark Age

The Hindu doctrine teaches that a human cycle, to which it gives the name of Manvantara, is divided into four periods marking so many stages during which the primordial spirituality becomes gradually more and more obscured , these are the same periods that the ancient traditions of the West called the Golden, Silver, Bronze and Iron Ages. We are now in the fourth age, the Kali-Yuga or “ dark age,” and have been so already, it is said, for more than six thousand years, that is to say since an epoch far earlier than any known to “ classical ” history. Since that time, the truths which were formerly within reach of all men have become more and more hidden and inaccessible ; those who possess them grow gradually less and less numerous, and although the treasure of “ non-human” wisdom that was before the ages can never be lost, it becomes enveloped in ever more impenetrable veils, which hide it from men’s sight and make it extremely difficult to discover.

>> No.20947806

>>20947802

It will doubtless be asked why cyclic development must proceed in this manner, in a downward direction, from higher to lower, a course which will at once be perceived to be a complete negation of the idea of progress as the moderns understand it. The reason is that the development of any manifestation necessarily implies a gradually increasing movement away from the principle from which it proceeds , starting from the highest point, it tends necessarily downwards, and, as with heavy bodies, the speed of its motion increases continuously until finally it reaches a point at which it is stopped. This fall could be described as a progressive materialization, for the expression of the principle is pure spirituality .

>> No.20947808

>>20947806

In point of fact, as we have already indicated, two contrary tendencies are to be traced in everything, the one descending and the other ascending, or, to express it differently, the one centrifugal and the other centripetal , and from the predominance of one or the other tendency result two complementary phases of manifestation, the one a departure from the principle and the other a return towards the principle, two phases often compared symbolically to the movements of the heart or to the two phases of breathing. Although these two phases are usually described as successive, the two tendencies to which they correspond must, in reality, be conceived as always acting simultaneously, although in different proportions, and it sometimes happens, at moments when the downward tendency seems on the point of prevailing definitely m the course of world development, that some special action intervenes to strengthen the contrary tendency, so as to restore a certain equilibrium, at least relative, such as the conditions of the moment allow ; and this causes a partial readjustment through which the fall may seem to be checked or even temporarily neutralized

>> No.20947811

>>20947808

It is true that the word “philosophy” can, in itself, be understood in quite a legitimate sense, and one which without doubt originally belonged to it, especially if it be true that Pythagoras himself was the first to use it: etymologically it denotes nothing more than “ love of wisdom ” ; it implies then, first of all, an initial disposition required for the attainment of wisdom, and, by a quite natural extension of this meaning, the quest which is born from this same disposition and which must lead to knowledge. It is therefore only a preliminary and preparatory stage, a movement, as It were, towards wisdom or a degree corresponding to an inferior state of wisdom.

>> No.20947815

>>20947811

For us, the real Middle Ages extend from the reign of Charlemagne to the opening of the fourteenth century, at which date a new decadence set in that has continued through various phases and with gathering impetus up to the present time. This date is the real starting point of the modern crisis . it is the beginning of the disruption of Christendom, with which the Western civilization of the Middle Ages was, its essence, identified : at the same time, it marks the origin of the formation of “ nations ” and the end of the feudal system, which was very closely linked up with the existence of Christendom. The modern period must therefore be put back almost two centuries farther than is usual with historians , the Renaissance and Reformation were primarily results, made possible only by the preceding decadence , but, far from being a readjustment, they marked a much deeper falling off, consummating, as they did, the definite rupture with the traditional spirit, the former in the domain of the arts and sciences and the latter in that of religion Itself, although this was the domain in which it might have seemed the most difficult to conceive of such a rupture.

>> No.20947818

>>20947815

There is a word which rose to honor at the Renaissance and which summarized in advance the whole program of modern civilization this word is “ humanism.” Men were indeed concerned to reduce everything to purely human proportions, to eliminate every principle of a higher order, and, one might say symbolically, to turn away from the heavens under pretext of conquering the earth

>> No.20947825

>>20947818

These lower forms of knowledge, so worthless to anyone possessing knowledge of another order, were bound, nevertheless, to be realized, but this could dark night of the soul ” is only an application of it to the spiritual development of the being in its ascent to higher states , and it would be easy to indicate many other concordant applications not occur except at a stage where true intellectuality had disappeared. This research, exclusively practical in the narrowest sense of the word, had to be undertaken, but It could only be carried through in an age at the opposite pole to primordial spirituality, by men so embedded m material things as to be incapable of conceiving anything beyond them. The more they have sought to exploit matter, the more they have become its slaves, thus dooming themselves to ever-increasing agitation, without rule and without objective, to dispersion m pure multiplicity leading to the final dissolution.

>> No.20947828

Chapter 2 - The Opposition Between East and West

On the other hand, a civilization that recognizes no higher principle, but is in reality based only on a negation of principles, is by this very fact ruled out from all mutual understanding with other civilizations, for if such understanding is to be profound and effective it can only come from above, that is to say from the very factor that this abnormal and perverted civilization lacks.

>> No.20947833

>>20947828

Accounts of Atlantis from ancient sources indicate its place of origin; after the disappearance of that continent in the last of the great cataclysms, that have occurred in the past, there seems little doubt that the remnants of its tradition were carried into various regions, where they mingled with other already existing traditions, for the most part branches of the great Hyperborean tradition; and it is very possible that the doctrines of the Celts in particular were among the products of this fusion. We are far rom disputing this; but let it not be forgotten that the real ‘Atlantean’ form disappeared thousands of years ago, together with the civilization to which it belonged and whose destruction can have come about only as the result of a perversion that may have been comparable in some respects to the one that confronts us today—with the important difference however that mankind had not yet entered upon the Kali-Yuga. Also, it should be remembered that the Atlantean tradition corresponded only to a secondary period in our cycle, and it would thus be a great mistake to seek to identify it with the primordial tradition out of which all the others have issued and which alone endures from the beginning to the end. It would be superfluous here to set forth all the data justifying these statements; we insist merely on the conclusion that it is impossible now to resuscitate an ‘Atlantean’ tradition, or to attach oneself more or less discreetly to it; there is a high degree of fantasy in attempts of this sort.

>> No.20947839

>>20947833

The truth is that surviving Celtic elements were for the most part assimilated by Christianity in the Middle Ages; the legend of the ‘Holy Grail’, with all that it implies, is a particularly apt and significant example of this. Moreover, we think that if a Western tradition could be rebuilt it would be bound to take on a religious form in the strictest sense of this word, and that this form could only be Christian.

>> No.20947841

>>20947839

The lost tradition can be restored and brought to life again only by contact with the living traditional spirit, and, as we have already said, it is only in the East that this spirit is still fully alive. It is nonetheless true that the first necessity is the existence in the West of an aspiration toward a return to the traditional outlook, but this could hardly be more than a mere aspiration.

>> No.20947844

>>20947841

To be resolutely ‘anti-modern’ is not to be in any way ‘anti-Western’; on the contrary, it only means making an effort to save the West from its own confusion.

>> No.20947849

>>20947844

The trust is that the West really is in great need of a defense, but only against itself and its own tendencies, which, if they are pushed to their conclusion, will lead inevitable to its ruin and destruction; it is therefore ‘reform’ of the West that is called for, and if this reform were what it should be—that is to say, a restoration of tradition—it would entail as a natural consequence an understanding with the East.

>> No.20947852

>Chapter 3 - Knowledge and Action

To regard contemplation and action as complementary is therefore to adopt a point of view that is deeper and truer than the foregoing, since the opposition is reconciled and resolved, and the two terms to a certain extent balance one another. It would therefore seem to be a question of two equally necessary elements, which complete and support one another and constitute the twofold activity, inward and outward, of one and the same being, whether this be each man taken in himself or mankind viewed as a whole.

>> No.20947855

>>20947852

It is obvious that the aptitude for contemplation is more widespread and more generally developed in the East, and probably nowhere more than in India, which can therefore be taken as representing most typically what we have called the Eastern mentality. On the other hand, it is beyond dispute that the aptitude for action, or rather the tendency resulting from this aptitude, is predominant among the peoples of the West, at least as far as the great majority of individuals is concerned.

>> No.20947860

>>20947855

If the West returned to a normal state and had regular social organization, there would be many Kshatriyas, but relatively few Brahmins.*
*Contemplation and action are in fact the respective functions of the two first castes, the Brahmins and the Kshatriyas; the relationship between them is the same as that between the spiritual authority and the temporal power; but we do not propose to go into this aspect of the question here, as it would require separate treatment.

>> No.20947868

>>20947860

The Eastern doctrines are unanimous, as also were the ancient doctrines of the West, in asserting that contemplation is superior to action, just as the unchanging is superior to change*. Action, being a merely a transitory and momentary modification of being, cannot possibly carry its principle and sufficient reason in itself.

*It is in virtue of this relationship that the Brahmin is said to be the type of the stable being, whereas the Kshatriya is the type of the mobile or mutable being; thus, all beings in this world, depending on their nature, are in relation principally with one or the other, for there is a perfect correspondence between the cosmic and the human orders.

>> No.20947872

>>20947868

Modern Westerners admit nothing higher than rational or discursive knowledge, which is necessarily indirect and imperfect, being what might be described as reflected knowledge; and even this lower type of knowledge they are coming more and more to value only insofar as it can be made to serve immediate practical ends. Absorbed by action to the point of denying everything that lies beyond it, they do not see that this action itself degenerates, from the absence of any principle, into an agitation as van as it is sterile. This indeed is the most conscious feature of the modern period: need for ceaseless agitation, for unending change, and for ever-increasing speed, matching the speed with which events themselves succeed on another. It is dispersion in multiplicity, and in a multiplicity that is no longer unified by consciousness of any higher principle.

>> No.20947876

>>20947872

The deeper one sinks into matter, the more the elements of division and opposition gain force and scope; and, contrariwise, the more one rises toward pure spirituality, the nearer one approaches that unity which can only be fully realized by consciousness of universal principles.

>> No.20947882

>>20947876

The same trend is noticeable in the scientific realm: research here is for its own sake far more than for the partial and fragmentary results it achieves; here we see an ever more rapid succession of unfounded theories and hypotheses, no sooner set up than crumbling to give way to others that will have an even shorter life—a veritable chaos amid which one would search in vain for anything definitive, unless it be a monstrous accumulation of facts and details incapable of proving or signifying anything. We refer here of course to speculative science.

>> No.20947884

>>20947882

Intellectual intuition, by which alone metaphysical knowledge is to be obtained, has absolutely nothing in common with this other ‘intuition’ of which certain contemporary philosophers speak: the latter pertains to the sensible realm and in fact is sub-rational, whereas the former, which is pure intelligence, I son the contrary supra-rational.

>> No.20947894

>CHAPTER 4 - Sacred and Profane Science

We have just seen that in civilizations of a traditional nature, intellectual intuition lies at the root of everything; in other words, it is the pure metaphysical doctrine that constitutes the essential, everything else being linked to it, either in the form of consequences or applications to the various orders of contingent reality.

>> No.20947897

>>20947894

If one were to compare ancient physics, not with what the moderns call by this name, but with the utility of all the natural sciences as at present constituted—for this is its real equivalent—the first difference to be noticed would be the division it has undergone into multiple ‘specialities’ that are, so to speak, foreign to one another.

>> No.20947901

>>20947897

For Aristotle, physics was only ‘second’ in its relation to metaphysics—in other words, it was dependent on metaphysics and was really only an application to the province of nature of principles that stand above nature and are reflected in its laws; and one can say the same for the Medieval cosmology.

>> No.20947902

>>20947901

By seeking to sever the connection of the sciences with any higher principle, under the pretext of assuring their independence, the modern conception robs them of all deeper meaning and even of all real interest from the point of view of knowledge; it can only lead them down a blind alley, by enclosing them, as it does, in a hopelessly limited realm*


*It should be noted that an analogous rupture has occurred in the social order, where the moderns claim to have separated the temporal from the spiritual. We do not mean to deny that the two are distinct, since they are in fact concerned with different provinces, just as are metaphysics and the sciences; but due to an error inherent in the analytical mentality, it has been forgotten that distinction does not mean separation. Because of this separation, the temporal power has lost its legitimacy—which is precisely what can be said, in the intellectual order, of the sciences.

>> No.20947908

>>20947902

What is true of the sciences is equally true of the arts, since every art can have a truly symbolic value that enables it to serve as a support for meditation, and because its rules, like the laws studied by the sciences, are reflection and applications of fundamental principles: there are then in every normal civilization ‘traditional arts’, but these are no less unknown to the modern West than are the ‘traditional sciences’.*


*The art of the medieval builders can be cited as a particularly remarkable example of these traditional arts, whose practice moreover implied a real knowledge of the corresponding sciences.

>> No.20947912

>>20947908

The root of this (rationalist) error, as of a great many other modern errors—and the cause of the entire deviation of science that we have just described—is what may be called ‘individualism’, an attitude indistinguishable from the anti-traditional attitude itself and whose many manifestations in all domains constitute one of the most important factors in the confusion of our time.

>> No.20947918

>>20947912
>CHAPTER 5 - Individualism

By individualism we mean the the negation of any principle higher than individuality, and the consequent reduction of civilization, in all its branches, to purely human elements; fundamentally, therefore, individualism amounts to the same thing as what, at the time of the Renaissance, was called ‘humanism’; it is also the characteristic feature of the ‘profane point of view’.

>> No.20947925

>>20947918

What has never been seen before is the reaction of an entire civilization on something purely negative, on what indeed could be called the absence of principle; and it is this that gives the modern world its abnormal character and makes of it a sort of monstrosity, only to be understood if one thinks of it as corresponding to the end of a cyclical period, as we have already said. Individualism, thus defined, is therefore the determining cause of the present decline of the West, precisely because it is, so to speak, the mainspring for the development of the lowest possibilities of mankind, namely those possibilities that do not require the intervention of any supra-human element and which, on the contrary, can only expand freely if every supra-human element and which, on the contrary, can only expand freely if every supra-human element be absent, since they stand at the antipodes of all genuine spirituality and intellectuality.

>> No.20947927

>>20947925

It would seem, indeed, as if philosophers are much more interested in creating problems, however artificial and illusory they may be, than in solving them.

>> No.20947931

>>20947927

In a traditional civilization it is almost inconceivable that a man should claim an idea as his own; and in any case, were he to do so, he would thereby deprive it of all credit and authority, reducing it to the level of a meaningless fantasy: if an idea is true, it belongs equally to all who are capable of understanding it; if it is false, there is no credit in having it invented it. A true idea cannot be ‘new’, for truth is not a product of the human mind; it exists independently of us, and all we have to do is to take cognizance of it; outside this knowledge there can be nothing but error: but do the moderns on the whole care much about truth, or do they even know what it is?

>> No.20947934

>>20947931

There remained but one step: the total denial of intelligence and knowledge altogether and the substitution of ‘utility’ for ‘truth’. This step was pragmatism, to which we have just referred; here we are no longer even in the merely human domain as with rationalism, for the appeal to the ’subconscious’, which marks the complete reversal of the normal hierarchy, brings us down in fact to the infra-human.

>> No.20947937

>>20947934

It is certain that all modern philosophy has its origin in Descartes

>> No.20947939

>>20947937

Individualism necessarily implies the refusal to accept any authority higher than the individual, as well as any means of knowledge higher than individual reason; these two attitudes are inseparable. Consequently the modern outlook was bound to reject all spiritual authority in the true sense of the word, namely authority based on the supra-human order, as well as any traditional organization, that is, any organization based essentially on this authority, whatever be its form—for the form will naturally vary with each civilization. This is what in fact did happen: Protestantism denied the authority of the organization qualified to interpret legitimately the religious tradition of the West and in its place claimed to set up ‘free criticism’, that is to say any interpretation resulting from private judgement, even that of the ignorant and incompetent, and based exclusively on the exercise of human reason.

>> No.20947944

>>20947939

From rationalism, religion was bound to sink into sentimentalism, and it is in the Anglo-Saxon countries that the most striking example of this are to be found. What remains is therefore no longer even a dwindling and deformed religion, but simply ‘religiosity’, that is to say vague and sentimental aspirations unjustified by any real knowledge.

>> No.20947948

>>20947944

At this stage the final products of religious and of philosophical decline mingle together and ‘religious experience’ becomes merged in pragmatism, in the name of which a limited God is stipulated as being more ‘advantageous’ than an infinite God, insofar as one ca feel for him sentiments comparable to those one would feel for a higher man. At the same time, the appeal to the ’subconscious’ joins hands with modern spiritualism and all those ‘pseudo-religions’ characteristic of our age.

>> No.20947952

>>20947948

Actually, religion being essentially a form of tradition, the anti-traditional outlook cannot help being anti-religious; it begins by denaturing religion and, when it can, ends by suppressing it entirely. Protestantism is illogical: while doing all it can to ‘humanize’ religion, it nevertheless, in theory at least, retains revelation, which is a supra-human element. It does not dare carry its negation to the logical conclusion but, by subjecting revelation to all the discussions resulting from purely human interpretations, it does in fact reduce it to next to nothing; and seeing, as one does, people who persist in calling themselves Christian even though they deny the very divinity of Christ.

>> No.20947958

>>20947952

An objection might here be raised: although it broke away from the Catholic organization, might not Protestantism, in that it continued to admit the validity of the Sacred Books, have preserved the traditional doctrine contained therein? But the introduction of ‘free criticism’ completely refutes such a hypothesis, since it opens the door to all manner of individual fantasy; moreover, the preservation of the doctrine presupposes an organized traditional teaching to keep alive the orthodox interpretation, and in actual fact this teaching has, in the Western world, been identified with Catholicism.

>> No.20948025

>CHAPTER 6 - The Social Chaos

Under the present state of affairs in the Western world, nobody any longer occupies the place that he should normally occupy by virtue of his own nature; this is what is meant by saying that the castes no longer exist, for caste, in its traditional meaning, is nothing other than individual nature, with the whole array of special aptitudes that this carries with it and that predisposes each man to the fulfillment of one or another particular function.

>> No.20948029

>>20948025

The most decisive argument against democracy can be summed up in a few words: the higher cannot proceed from the lower, because the greater cannot proceed from the lesser; this is an absolute mathematical certainty that nothing can gainsay. And it should be remarked that this same argument, applied to a different order of things, can also be invoked against materialism.

>> No.20948030

>>20948029

It is abundantly clear that the people cannot confer a power that they do not themselves possess; true power can only come from above, and this is why—be it said in passing-it can be legitimized only by the sanction of something standing above the social order, that is to say by spiritual authority, for otherwise it is a mere counterfeit of power, unjustifiable thorough lack of any principle, and in which there can be nothing but disorder and confusion. This reversal of the true hierarchical order begins when the temporal power seeks to make itself independent of the spiritual authority, and then even to subordinate the latter by claiming to make it serve political ends.

>> No.20948036

>>20948030

One must guard against being misled by words: it is contradictory to say that the same persons can be at the same time rulers and ruled, because, to use Aristotelian terminology, the same being cannot be ‘in act’ and ‘in potency’ at the same time and in the same relationship. The relationship of ruler and ruled necessitates the presence of two terms: there can be no ruled if there are not also rulers.

>> No.20948041

>>20948036

This now leads us to elucidate more precisely the error of the idea that the majority should make the law, because, even though this idea must remain theoretical—since it does not correspond to an effective reality—it is necessary to explain how it has taken root in the modern outlook, to which of its tendencies it corresponds, and which of them00at least in appearance—it satisfies. Its most obvious flaw is the one we have just mentioned: the opinion of the majority cannot be anything but an expression of incompetence, whether this be due to lack of intelligence or to ignorance pure and simple; certain observations of ‘mass psychology’ might be quoted here, in particular the widely known fact that the aggregate of mental reactions aroused among the component individuals of a crowd crystalizes into a sort of general psychosis whose level is not merely that of the average, but actually that of the lowest elements present.

>> No.20948049

>>20948041

But let us probe still more deeply into the question: what is this law of the greatest number which modern governments invoke and in which they claim to find their sole justification? It is simply the law of matter and brute force, the same law by which a mass, carried down by its weight, crushes everything that lies in its track. It is precisely here that we find the point of junction of the democratic conception and materialism, and here also is to be found the reason why this conception is so firmly rooted in the present-day mentality. By this means, the normal order of things is completely reversed and the supremacy of multiplicity as such is upheld, a supremacy that actually exists only in the material world.

>> No.20948054

>>20948049

The tendency of which we have just spoken is identical with that ‘individualizing’ tendency that is represented in the Judeo-Christian tradition as the ‘Fall’ of those who broke away from the original unity*. Multiplicity, considered apart from its principle, and therefore as no longer capable of being reduced to unity, takes the form in the social realm of a community conceived only as the arithmetical sum of its component individuals; in fact, a community is no more than this, once it has ceased to be attached to any principle superior to these individuals. The law of such a community is literally that of the greatest number, and it is on this that the democratic idea is based.


*This is why Dante puts the symbolical abode of Lucifer at the center of the earth, that is to say at the point where the forces of weight converge from all sides; from this point of view it is the opposite of the spiritual or ‘heavenly’ center of attraction symbolized in most traditional doctrines by the sun.

>> No.20948057

>>20948054

Finally, there remains one direct consequence of the democratic idea to consider, and this is the negation of the idea of an elite; it is not for nothing that ‘democracy’ is opposed to ‘aristocracy’, for this latter word, at least when taken in its etymological sense, means precisely the power of the elite. The elite can by definition only be the few, and their power, or rather their authority, deriving as it does from their intellectual superiority, has nothing in common with the numerical strength on which democracy is based, a strength whose inherent tendency is to sacrifice the minority to the majority, and therefore quality to quantity, and the elite to the masses. Thus the guiding function exercised by a true elite, and its very existence—since of necessity it plays this role if it exists at all00is utterly incompatible with democracy, which is closely bound up with the egalitarian conception, and therefore with the negation of all hierarchy; the very foundation of the democratic idea is the supposition that one individual is as good as another, simply because they are equal numerically and in spite of the fact that they can never be equal in any other way. A true elite can only be an intellectual one; and that is why democracy can arise only where pure intellectuality no longer exists, as is the case in the modern world.

>> No.20948110

>Chapter 7 - A Material Civilization

Industry is no longer merely an application of science, an application from which science should, in itself, remain completely independent; it has become the reason for, and justification of, science to such an extent that here too the normal relations between things have been reversed. What the modern world has striven after with all its strength, even when it has claimed in its own way to pursue science, is really nothing other than the development of industry and machinery; and in thus seeking to dominate matter and bend it to their service, men have only succeeded in becoming its slaves. Not only have they limited their intellectual ambition—if such a term can still be used in present state of things—to inventing and constructing machines, but they have ended by becoming in fact machines themselves. Indeed, it is not only scholars but also technicians and even workers who have to undergo the specialization that certain sociologists praise to highly under the name of ‘division of labor’; and for the ‘workers’, it makes intelligent work quite impossible. Very different from the craftsmen of the former times, they have become mere slaves of machines with which they may be said to form part of a single body. In a purely mechanical way they have become mere slaves of machines with which they may be said to form part of a single body. In a purely mechanical way they have constantly to repeat certain specific movements, which are always the same and always performed in the same way, so as to avoid the slightest loss of time; such at least is required by the most modern methods which are supposed to represent the most advanced stage of ‘progress’. Indeed, the object is merely to produce as much as possible; quality matters little, it is quantity alone that is of importance, which brings us once more to the remark we have already made in other contexts, namely, that modern civilization may truly be called a quantitative civilization, and this is merely another way of saying it is a material civilization.

>> No.20948114

>>20948110

Politics seem to be altogether controlled by finance, and trade competition seems to be the dominant influence in determining the relations between peoples.

>> No.20948117

>>20948114

Our contemporaries re convinced that it is almost exclusively economic conditions that dictate historical events, and they even imagine that it has always been so; a theory has even been invented according to which everything is to be explained by economic factors alone, and has been named, significantly, ‘historical materialism’.

>> No.20948120

>>20948117

The masses are made to believe that they are not being led, but that they are acting spontaneously and governing themselves, and the fact that they believe this is a sign from which the extent of their stupidity may be inferred.

>> No.20948123

>>20948120

The ‘humanitarianism’ that is so much in fashion is certainly not worth taking seriously

>> No.20948125

>>20948123

The Gospel says ‘all they that take the sword shall perish by the sword’; those who unchain the brute forces of matter will perish, crushed by these same forces, of which they will no longer be masters; having once impudently set them in motion, they cannot hope to hold back indefinitely their fatal course. It is of little consequence whether it be the fires of nature or the forces of the human mob, or both together; in any case it is the laws of matter that are called into play, and they will inexorably destroy him who has aspired to dominate them without raising himself above matter.

>> No.20948128

>>20948125

The Gospel also says: ‘If a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand’; this saying also applies fully to the modern world with its material civilization, which cannot fail, by its very nature, to cause strife and division everywhere. The conclusion is obvious and, even without appealing to other considerations, it is possible to predict with all certainty that the world will come to a tragic end, unless a change as radical as to amount to a complete reversal of direction should intervene, and that very soon.

>> No.20948131

>>20948128

Where are to be found, even in Catholicism, the men who know the deeper meaning of the citrine that they profess outwardly, and who, not content with ‘believing’ in a more or less superficial way—and more through sentiment than intelligence—really ‘know’ the truth of the tradition they hold to be theirs? We would wish to see proof that there are at least a few such men, for this would be the greatest and perhaps sole hope for salvation for the West; but we have to admit that, up to the present, we have not encountered any: is one to suppose they live in hiding, like certain Eastern sages, in some almost inaccessible retreat, or must this last hope be definitely abandoned? The West was Christian in the Middle Ages, but is so no longer; if anyone should reply that it may again become so, we will rejoinder that no one deciders this more than we do, and may it come about sooner than all we see round about us would lead us to expect. But let no one delude himself on this point: if this should happen the modern world will have lived its day.

>> No.20948190

B A S E D
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>> No.20948199 [DELETED] 

P B U H
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H
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>> No.20948211

Why do the french versions of books always have shitty covers? I really like the english cover

>> No.20948215

>>20948131
there is one more chapter and the conclusion
but this is actually a good place to end

read over these quotes and then read the final chapter and conclusion

>> No.20948219
File: 202 KB, 312x500, Jap RoQ.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
20948219

>>20948211
Japanese Reign of Quantity is kino

>> No.20948227 [DELETED] 

卐 H 卍
卐 U 卍
卐 B 卍
H U B P B U H
卍 B 卐
卍 U 卐
卍 H 卐

>> No.20948290

It's dumb. "Metaphysical principles" aren't causing the crisis: it's the bankers and centralized powers. People have always had a lust for material things. It's nothing new. People aren't less spiritual now than they once were because they are further from the primordial tradition. They are less spiritual because they have T.V. and modern medicine which reduces the need for religions that help people cope with illness and death.

He also doesn't address the fact that the traditions always get corrupted. The head of the greek orthodox church, for example, is an oligarch worth billions of dollars. The Catholic church is full of pedophiles, etc. If tradition was so powerful, why can it not defend itself against corruption? These traditional institutions have been historically rife with corruption--it's not a symptom of modernity. Remember when the Catholic church started selling get-out-of-hell free cards, i.e., indulgences? Or when kings literally starved their people to feed their lusts? We overthrew tradition because the model justified tyranny.

I read the book. He's an interesting fellow. Great imagination, but ultimately an effete intellectual.

>> No.20948300

>>20947799
Why the fuck should we listen to the doctrine/religion of people who shit in the street?

>> No.20948322

>>20948290
>they are less spiritual now because they are more distracted by entertainment and complacent with their lives due to medicine.
I agree, I fail to see how this really says anything against Guenon. If anything it is just more short sighted but ultimately in agreement.
>because they have T.V. and modern medicine which reduces the need for religions that help people cope with illness and death.
I hope you noticed how sad this statement was when you wrote it. As for modern medicine, generally all it does is prolong the torments of the suffering, and let them stew in their juices while they anxiously await their inevitable end. If anything it leads to heightened awareness of death, and even induces a sense of the absurdity of death when confronted with hospital environments (death being absurd = a completely modern invention).
> If tradition was so powerful, why can it not defend itself against corruption?
These traditional institutions are the longest lasting institutions known to history. Everything dies eventually and is then reborn. The very fact that they are longest lived is enough to cement the point though. Our entire civilizations (America in its entirety for example) are blinks of an eye compared to some of them. And they have only just now started to crumble.

>> No.20948340

>>20948290
>"Metaphysical principles" aren't causing the crisis: it's the bankers and centralized powers.
The other thing is without "metaphysical principles", this statement does not make sense. The bankers and centralized powers were caused by something else. And then that by something else, and so on. Unless you admit of principle, then there is simply an infinite regress and every answer is as good as every other answer as an explanation.

>> No.20948430
File: 999 KB, 800x606, Geryon.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
20948430

>>20948290
>"Metaphysical principles" aren't causing the crisis: it's the bankers

The Usurer is violent against God because he believes he can magically manufacture value out of nothing, whereas in reality only God is the source of value. To charge interest is thus a sort of satanic parody of God’s creation of the universe ‘ex nihilo’ (out of nothing). Karl Marx was right insofar as he knew that value had to be based on something realer than an essentially fraudulent manipulation of finances; he identified this real basis with human labor.

Canto XIV-XVII
>Third Ring in the Seventh Circle of Hell: USURY
>Punishment: Crying in a great Plain of Burning Sand scorched by great flakes of flame falling slowly down from the sky

>> No.20948571
File: 74 KB, 802x768, 1660141290670190.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
20948571

>>20948340
Centralized power is the product of mutual advantage based upon the exploitation of an out group. It's no more complicated than this. The centralized powers stick together because they prey upon others like a pack of wolves.

The highest principal is a material one: survival. We don't need to leave the earth in order to comprehend the earth. You can't imagine how stupid you look as you read this shit while others are making money and forming connections that sustains their lordship over you and subjugation of your children.

> muh metaphysical principles

>> No.20948578

>>20948571
This is merely the profane perspective, valid in its own sphere.

>> No.20948579

>>20948300
Fuck you racist. India is great nation.

>> No.20948600
File: 356 KB, 533x800, 1654987220780.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
20948600

>>20948578
> I know the secrets of the universe
> multidimensional_chess.jpeg
> higher spherical intellect
> plebs don't understand
> has no power
> posts on Taiwanese basket weaving forum
> copium maximus
> "Mom, can you make me some chicken nuggets."

>> No.20948606

>>20948579
No, it’s a cesspool.

>> No.20948616

>>20948190
fucking can't recognise garbage when you see it

>> No.20948626

>>20948571
>It's no more complicated than this
You've given me a definition, not an explanation, a raison d'être. A sufficient reason is why something is rather than is not.
>The highest principal is a material one: survival
There are different and even higher principles than that. Most people do not hoard wealth just to survive, because anyone can survive, and there are probably better ways merely to maximize survival than put yourself in all sorts of risky situations like international flights, New York City, etc. The poorest survive just as long and even produce more offspring than the richest today. Anyway, saying the highest principle is survival is similar to saying the highest principle of a computer is remaining turned on. It's erroneous in more than one sense, even in the teleological sense.
>> muh metaphysical principles
You just gave me one. Schopenhauer's entire metaphysics was based on the principle you just proclaimed.

>> No.20948687
File: 87 KB, 1024x576, 1661490790724733m.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
20948687

>>20948626
>You've given me a definition, not an explanation, a raison d'être. A sufficient reason is why something is rather than is not.

It's not a definition: it's a description of what I've observed in my experience of life.

As for those points which seem to undermine my position on survival being the ultimate principle, they are merely products of bounded rationality and decadence, i.e., atrophy of the survival instinct.

Strength, and exercising of strength, is supposed to serve the ends of life. Through decadence, it becomes things like the will to climb a mountain. Reaching the summit of the mountain is perversely interpreted as overcoming a great foe. Standing in it's peak is like standing over the body of a great enemy. The madness of this decadence is the subject of Moby Dick.

Let's not pretend like God for most people is a kind of magic used to protect them from death. As soon as people live comfortably and have the means of putting death out of their minds, they leave God behind because he has no use in that context.

Here's the secret: you're unwilling to accept the truth because it places death at the center of life. It's a corruption few can bear. So you're engaging in psychic alchemy here, where you're trying to purify life of death by evaporating it away with all the flasks and bunsen burners in the laboratory of your mind.

Embrace the truth--death is the God of life.

>> No.20948853

>>20948687
What an epic way to end the book


>Those who will succeed in overcoming all these obstacles, and triumphing over the hostility of an environment opposed to all spirituality, will doubtless be few in number; but let it be said once more that it is not numbers that count, for we are here in a domain whose laws are quite different from those of matter. There is therefore no cause for despair, and, even were there no hope of achieving any visible result before the modern world collapses under some catastrophe, this would still be no valid reason for not undertaking a work whose scope extends far beyond the present time. Those who might be tempted to give way to despair should realize that nothing accomplished in this order can ever be lost, that confusion, error, and can win the day only in appearance and in a purely ephemeral way, that all partial and transitory disequilibrium must perforce contribute toward the greater equilibrium of the whole, and that nothing can ultimately prevail against the power of truth; their motto should be the one formerly used by certain initiatic organizations of the West: VINCIT OMNIA VERITAS

>> No.20948858

Didn’t mean to (You) U

>> No.20948934

>>20948853
Truth conquers all... how profound.

>> No.20948947

God tier effort dago

>> No.20949019
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20949019

>>20948853
Life is not governed by truth. Life loves lies. In the truth, we all are dissolved. Individual life cannot survive within the truth. In the truth, we see all our earthly possessions destroyed, we see our empires crumble, our loves grow grey and sickly. Who can live with the truth? It seems to me that one must be dead in order to embrace the truth.

>> No.20949033
File: 2.48 MB, 480x270, 7CE8E667-6902-4B34-B082-B7007D8B30B6.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
20949033

>>20948947
Did it mainly so it can be easily searched in the archives

>> No.20949034

>>20949019
kali yuga

>> No.20949038

It was reported that Guenon cried for an hour when he learned that one of his friends died in a tragic accident. This tells me that he never achieved transcendence. Death is an illusion to those who have seen the macrocosm reflected in their microcosm. He clearly never realized the principles he wrote about.

>> No.20949256

>>20949038
>He clearly never realized the principles he wrote about
99% who try don't

>> No.20949283
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20949283

>>20949256
Shouldn't we be reading the works of those who have realized the metaphysical principles instead of those who haven't?

That's another thing I don't like about Guenon. All of his work seems to be a diversion. If tradition is paramount, and we are serious about these things, then shouldn't we be in study to become priests of some tradition, rather than armchairing about these things from a distance? By his own reasoning, his works are superfluous and perhaps harmful.

>> No.20949321

>>20949038
what's wrong with crying

>> No.20949392

>>20949321
It means he mourned the loss of an illusion. This indicates that he was still attached to temporal things, which is incompatible with realization. In the realized state, everyone is already "dead." One would not cry for the death of anyone because it does not represent anything new. One endures every death in the ascent. There are no more tears after the work has been completed.

>> No.20949503

>>20949283
>then shouldn't we be in study to become priests of some tradition
yes, you should follow a tradition (not a random one, perennialism is cancer)
>rather than armchairing about these things from a distance?
you have to do this for a certain period of time, until you are sure about the path which you will follow, but yes, in the end this should be rejected and desu I don't understand why Guenon didn't do the same and still cared about his muh "work", he was a little bit of a larper here

>> No.20949510

>>20949503
> I don't understand why Guenon didn't do the same and still cared about his muh "work", he was a little bit of a larper here

His work was his legacy. He was still very much attached to this world. See >>20949392.

>> No.20949551

>>20949510
>>20949392
According to the islamic tradition, Muhammad (unlike Moses) was able to appear in front of the people as a regular person, discussing and doing basic things just like the others even if his spiritual state was the highest. Guenon also mentioned this and related it to what he calls descending realization. Ofc I don't say that this was also the case of Guenon but is a thing, even in hinduism there are bhaktic sages who have achieved Moksha and still cry.