/lit/ - Literature

>>20498373
Because it’s so obviously fake, there is 0 archeological evidence that Jews were enslaved in Egypt

>>20498451
There's 0 archeological evidence for anything in Genesis but I still enjoy that stuff.

>>20498373
because starting front to back is not a good order.
the Pentateuch(first five) is literally history and law, and without any background you don't understand anything.
start with the NT. helps you understand the OT prophecy later.
Everything in it is historical by the way; and there is quite a bit of stuff that points to Exodus, for example a manuscript of some high position egyptian describing the plagues.

>>20498373
ask in the Bible thread also. might get better and more answers.

>>20498610
I understand it, it's just not enjoyable to read.

It has crap prose most translations. Read the D-R for the OT and KJV for the NT. Kino and well written.

>>20498373
You're so fucking boring.

>>20498616
you start to understand it and link the OT and NT when you know both. it's quite great, but going in blind like that is bad.

>g straight from the top of my dome as I rock rock rock rock rock the microphone
Fuck you for reminding me of this, I hope you read Numbers

>>20498691
People read it without the NT for centuries.

Skip it. You're not reading the Bible the way it was designed to be read. There's a yearly cycle of readings. Right now it's coming to the close of Acts and John. Only the Pharisees and priestly class would read the nitty gritty of Exodus like you're talking about. My suggestion is to read the Gospels and the New Testament. Paul's letters will give a proper understanding of the Old Testament. If you're reading for spiritual edification this would be infinitely more valuable. If you want to read it as an academic then you'll never understand it because you're dissecting it like a frog on the table when the Bible is still very much a living tradition with a cultural context.

>>20499022
O. K.

>>20499022
>the Bible is still very much a living tradition
el oh el

>>20498373
the Old Testament literally cannot be read without commentary that puts everything into perspective. Otherwise, yea, it's freakin boring a lot of times and makes little sense why we *have* to read it.
here's an example, it's lengthy, but only because it's so detailed. Highly suggest reading it for all people interested in wanting to understand the issues of the Old Testament. The link is about King David, though extends a little before (Omri and Ahab) and a little after (Absalom, Jehu, Solomon)
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-gSYCPPKnwzHnEiBndgB-ZPUHXEduOziDoQFhTxSPCs/pub

The bible is a short book all things considered. Just sit down and read a few pages a day and you'll be done in no time

Everything in the Bible has a permanent value but the passages in Exodus and Deut. about the specific temple dimensions are way too obscure for the average reader (myself emphatically included). Focus on the story of Israel.

>>20499410
Houston Stewart Chamberlain in his "Foundations of the 19th Century" talks about why the dimensions of the temple and all whatnot were included. The Hebrews were imitating the religious texts of nearby cultures in many ways, and then just changing the names to their own language. (in this case, iirc they were imitating the Hittites, but don't quote me on that part, could have been Phoenician or something else).
This isn't to say only the Hebrews did this, everyone was doing stuff like this, it was a melting pot of culture, and the Hebrews were a late-comer to the region and didn't have much culture of their own (they were nomadic and more warlike in the beginning, not cultured city-dwellers as they later became)

>>20499000
and when the prophesied Messiah arrived they knew He truly was it.
working backwards makes it easier to get all said prophecy, because you already know Jesus Christ, who is the conclusion of it.

>>20499494
assuming that is true, I believe that everything in the Bible has some providential or mystical significance. Even if the raw material was a quick and dirty rip-off of other local tribal customs, everything which is taken up in God is transformed, purified, and made glorious.

>>20498373
Wait til you reach Leviticus

>>20498373
ngmith

I'm impressed with anyone who can make it through the high-powered autism that is the line of descendants in Genesis.

>who begat who begat who begat who begat who begat who begat who begat who begat who begat

In any other book it would get flamed for being needlessly pedantic worldbuilding.

I do love Ecclesiastes, though. That and Job. Books where people actually meaningfully struggle with their faith.

Just do it. Have a beautiful female voice narrate it to you when yo uare bored like Captain Kirk would.

>>20499939
>has never read any epic

>>20498373
You remind me of a friend of mine that gave up on Crime and Punishment because nothing was happening.

Also, reading the entire Old Testament is a bad idea, reading Numbers will make you commit suicide.

>>20499939
check the meaning of the names in the Genesis 5 genealogy.

>>20499907
i wasn't posting that as a negative against the Bible. So they acquired their religion from other cultures, that doesn't mean religion is false or made up, just means that everyone recognized God in some form or another.
but yes, it's true. The Hittites (even the Canaanite/Phoenicians/Egyptians) were prior to the Hebrews, and there's plenty of evidence that their religious practices and culture were well underway before the Hebrews began their culture. (I bring that up because others have tried to say that other cultures stole from the Hebrews, but that is simply laughable and not true).
Osiris cult, for example, was long established in Egypt, and made it's way into Hebrew culture (golden calf, etc.). David revived this practice, which prompted Absalom his son to rebel against this fertility cult religious reform his father was trying, he allied himself with the traditionalist crowd (anti-city folk, basically, the rural people) of the previous Saulite faction. There's a really great essay about all this, very detailed and thorough, showing and proving how David introduced the Osiris/Dionysian cult to Israel.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-gSYCPPKnwzHnEiBndgB-ZPUHXEduOziDoQFhTxSPCs/pub

>>20498451
Egyptians intentionally destroyed all records because they were so humiliated.

>>20499494
>(((Houston Stewart Chamberlain)))

>>20499939
>worldbuilding
Please kill yourself.

Reading the Bible cover to cover is more likely to turn you into a Kabbalist than a Christian.

>>20500547
Stfu, God was the original worldbuilder and he did it in only six days.

>>20498373
Read this instead. You can also go back and read some of the best parts of the Bible (ecclesiastes, proverbs, gospels, etc). Most of it of boring.

>>20500037
>https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-gSYCPPKnwzHnEiBndgB-ZPUHXEduOziDoQFhTxSPCs/pub
Who is this guy? I only find weird shit looking up his name.

>>20500541
lmao, no. Don't get me wrong, i agree that we gotta watch out for Jews, but no, he wasn't Jewish.

>>20500759
no clue who the author is, but I'm pretty familiar with Greek myths and was raised Christian (so had to read the Bible even though it bored and confused me), and his essay really struck a chord with me.
So while i don't know about his background at all, he's absolutely spot on with the Greek myths (at least, with the myths he references, which is mainly the ones about Cadmus and Pentheus) and how the Greeks of Thebes had borrowed stories from Phoenicia.
(which when you think about it, isn't really a super novel idea. The story of Perseus and Medusa which everyone is familiar with from the movies, takes place in both Greece *AND* Phoenicia. Which is to say there was lots of exchange of ideas between the two lands. Just as later there was interchange of ideas and a blending of Greek and Christian ideas)

>>20498373
At what order should I read the Bible? What other sources should I read in other to understand it in depth?
I don't think it matters, but I have no faith.

>>20501757
ask in the Bible thread. much better answers than you'll get here.
that said, here's my suggestion.
Matthew, Mark, Luke, Acts, John, Epistles, Revelation, OT.

any time some verse or passage sounds weird and you didn't really understand or it sounds wrong or something of the sort, search for an explanation and commentaries on it. this will be especially present when reading the Epistles and the OT, as they're complicated and quite a bit of meaning is lost in translation at parts.
i recommend Biblehub for checking the original and commentaries. gotquestions is quite decent at explaining with their articles aswell.
pray for faith.

>>20501757
also 2 Peter 1:20
>Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
let nobody sell you their own made up meaning for Scripture.
all the truth is right there in the Bible, clear to see. there are no "secrets" nor anything of the sort.
that said, i recommend Mere Christianity. amazing book.

>>20501757
as for depth, you start to build it up after a while of searching verses, learning more, and such. i even know some little bits of Hebrew.

as for even more stuff to see, Bible Project's word studies. they're a bit iffy on how they simplify theology, but the studies and such are solid.

>>20498610
>Everything in it is historical by the way

>>20501951
exactly what i said.

>>20498451
Hyksos

>>20498451
This.

youre allowed to skip the tabernacle part and in leviticus youre allowed to skim the part where its telling you where to put your hands when you sacrifice animals for different crimes

>>20499939
>In any other book it would get flamed for being needlessly pedantic worldbuilding.
Wait until you see the Talmud.

>>20498451
The Bible is not meant to be read literally. You won't get much further by doing so.

>>20500536
Yes how convenient just like my old polish summer camp did. Oh vey!

>>20503593
Exodus and everything history-related is historical though. there's more layers, but at heart it's history.

Anyone find the NT to be underwhelming? Especially the gospel accounts of the life of Jesus. I had heard passages my whole life and expected more when I read the complete work, but it was just all those little vignettes put together one after another with no rhyme or reason. There seemed to be no grand overarching narrative or meaning (unless you really stretch your reading of the text and pull in ideas from outside it), and no place where I got really deep philosophical or theological content. The sermon on the mount is the closest it comes to what I was expecting, but even that was underwhelming and vaguely worded.

>>20498373
people will actually sit there and try to force themselves to read pseudo-fictional garbage written by a race of levantine subhumans and then larp as a christcuck zealot online, telling you to repeat, instead of just dropping the foreign religion for a foreign race and embracing their indigenous identity

>>20503593
then it doesn't deserve to be read at all. enjoy your subhuman desert tribe book

>>20500536
yes, of course they did bro.

>>20500541
>someone accuses even houston stewart chamberlain of being a jew, because he criticized the origins and myths of a subhuman race of literal jews
can't make this shit up

>>20504753
>deep philosophical or theological content
Christianity as such has none. It was a hype religion for cripples and poorfags. All "Christian" philosophy is rebranded Greek philosophy and they went off from there. If you want a religion with actual philosophical teeth get into buddhism. Wikipedia has a breakdown of the basic Pali canon here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P%C4%81li_Canon#Contents_of_the_Canon

>>20498451
next you're gonna tell me Noah's ark wasn't real too!