/lit/ - Literature

How can I self-publish when I have no completed manuscript? And guides on finding other writers to murder and then passing off their unpublished works as your own?

>>20437979
>incomplete
Post it on RR, or some other "serialized" web-fiction site.
>murder
Sounds more like a question for >>>/b/ .

>>20437989
By incomplete I mean zero pages, zero paragraphs, zero words.

I'm monolingual english and still don't know when I should be including or dropping the conjunction 'that'

I'm gonna break 200k n second bookerino today lads!
Wish me luck.

>>20437966
Does this sound like a real interaction between Australians?

>>20437998
If you don't write, then why are you even here in /wg/ ?

>>20438005
That seems like a weird issue. I don’t think I’ve ever had an issue with that? Can you tell me more about it?

>>20437998
Don't give up.
Don't allow sadness to crush your spirit.
Strive to make the art that will change it all.
Push back against the failure of culture to maintain its strength.
Drag it kicking and screaming with you, if you have to.
Feel pity if you must. Feel sadness, feel rage, feel hopeless, and feel fury. Then write.

>>20438032
If you do write, why are you in /wg/?

is there any reason for submitting to RR prior to publishing? is it possible, by some fat chance, to score a deal from there?

Schizos rule

>>20438059
Er...because that's the point of this thread?
Let me guess...you're one of those "no one in /wg/ writes", despite the copious counterexamples.

>>20438036
You might think that it's a weird issue, but every time I've felt I was safe to drop them from a sentence, I get told that I need to include them, but when I start adding them in everywhere again, someone else tells me I need to cut them.

>>20438005
Anon, the same as all other usage rules, like preferring the active voice and never ending a sentence with a preposition. Make including "that" 100% of the time the rule, then consciously decide when to break it.

>>20438016
No. Here are some samples of typical bogan speak.

https://youtu.be/9QCgqQdmr0M
https://youtu.be/d2KwazWUa20
https://youtu.be/KgGSWGdSfnM
https://youtu.be/968yNvFiVH0
https://youtu.be/sb3nZhPk0Qo

>>20438016
kek

>>20438087
I like to know there's an audience rather than shooting into the dark by self publishing with advice from /wg/.

>>20438087
Better to post on RR, and get some readers, than not to post on RR and get no readers.

How's my cover I made from Canva?

>>20438248
It's so blurry

>>20438087
The only deal you could possibly get off RR is from Mountaindale Press for litRPG.

>>20438404
At least directly.
Other publishers may look at your other work and decide to make a deal.
...you DO have other work, don't you, anon?

Tell me all your cheap tricks. Anything you've employed in your own works. I don't want any generic 'show don't tell' bullshit either. Share with me the specific devices you've discovered. Pull back the curtain.

>>20437966
Does "Jaglavak" sound like a masuline or feminine name?

>>20438248
I can give you actual advice.
I’ll namefag until you’re done with questions and answers.
Do you plan on making this an e-book, yes or no? This will change my advice.

>>20438479
Every time I get stuck I read a book unrelated to my story, then adapt a scene there to mine.

>>20438521
Doesn't matter I can't use this cover anyways. Because
>>20438263

>>20438529
Impressive. Actually very creative.

>>20438059
Because I want to become the next F Gardner.

>>20438577
Shut up guy posing as Gardner to make him look bad.
No one is this level of retarded, except Chrischan.

>>20437966
I don't feel like criticized heavily but this is an old piece on why narcissism gets a bad rap

https://pastebin.com/6pCSc8va

Is plagiarism only a sin if you are trying to get published? Not word for word, or reworking individual sentences or paragraphs, but taking a writer’s general themes, thoughts and ideas and putting them through your own lens and just letting the pen flow?

>>20438479
A good writer borrows, a great writer steals. Yoink what you like, sprinkle a bit of your homemade spice on it, and badabing badaboom you've got yourself a scene.

In the finishing stages of editing my (science fiction) book. In what cases do you or do you not want to get a professional editor? Is it worthwhile or a scam?

>>20438591
That’s not plagiarism.

>>20438582
Except you’re forgetting Gardner IS at Chrischan levels of retarded.

>He is a character in his own books as a beloved and famous author.
>One of his books (Jigoku) is a Pokemon rip-off
>religious beliefs to the point of unironically believing the earth is flat
>gets angry at “trolls” and is incapable of accepting criticism.

Both his ego and lunacy matches the same level and the amount of content he pumps out is even greater. It makes sense why someone would want to achieve the same level of notoriety just for the publicity alone. Anons are always talking about marketing tactics here so it makes sense to want to replicate that.

>>20438591
>>20438625
Yeah that's not plagiarism. By that logic almost all fantasy plagiarizes LotR.

>>20438625
Yeah, thinking about it more, it seems closer to “ripping them off”. I just find my writing is heavily influenced by a writer and my ideas and even writing style mimic them naturally

>>20438629
You can’t replicate it. Gardner is genuinely insane. If it’s copied people will be able to see it’s just an act.

>>20438629
But F Gardner technically is famous kek

>>20438629
>He is a character in his own books as a beloved and famous author.
>One of his books (Jigoku) is a Pokemon rip-off
>religious beliefs to the point of unironically believing the earth is flat
>gets angry at “trolls” and is incapable of accepting criticism.
How am I missing all of this? Where is he posting his faggotry?
Any screenshots?

>>20438479
I base characters on real people and steal things I remember them having said, thus creating the illusion of me knowing how to write realistic dialogue.

>>20438666
I’ve watched some YouTube vids about the books. Jigoku is literally just edgelord Pokemon and he has a book called “Call of F Gardner” (yes, really) where he’s one of the characters.
I don’t have screenshots of him getting angry but I’ve seen other anons post them before. And his flat earth beliefs he talks about in a interview. I can try to find it if you give me a minute.

>>20438666
>>20438691

See

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HsLfrpEAfB8

can we please not have another thread full of fag gardener arguments? it has nothing to do with writing.

>>20438666
Gardner’s in the /lit/ discord. He’s always going on about how he doesn’t think outer space is real.

>>20438703
But those are fun.

>>20438716
What does he think is up there? This could make a great schematic for a fantasy universe.

>catch up to my monthly quota three days before the month is over
Everything I write over the next few days will be going above and beyond the call of duty. Kneel before me, worms.

>>20438738
It’s the plot of one of his books. I kid you not. He incorporated his delusional personal beliefs into his work. He thinks there’s a dome up there.

>>20438752
Could it be that /lit/ is confusing Gardner's fiction with his actual beliefs, as happens with many authors?

>>20438155
>https://youtu.be/968yNvFiVH0
young milo

>>20438769
No. He talks about it in >>20438696
Plus I’ve seen screen caps of Gardner sperging about Flat Earth shit before.

>>20438794
W-what's beyond the dome, then? I don't want to watch his videos for fear I might become a cultist.

Why are we talking about he who “should not be named”? Let’s move on. That was a stupid era in lit and he shouldn’t be mentioned in a thread about writing. Pick any writer and they are better

>>20438716
That explains it.
I refuse to use discord, so this explains why I miss these things.

>>20438798
No idea. I don’t get how anyone could believe in flat earth nonsense.

>>20438816
That era is history now. For better or worse. The era might only just be starting ever since Reddit started discovering F Gardner. For all we know the Year of the Crocodile could be upon us.....

Joking aside though that’s like saying don’t talk about Infinite Jest or Waldun. Just ain’t gonna happen on this board.

>>20438832
Come on, I hate all 3 of those “writers”, but one isn’t like the others

>>20438832
I know a lot of TradCaths that buy into it and geocentrism wholesale. Its not as uncommon as you think

Is it ok for me to be editing only one chapter for a very long time?
I've been stuck on a chapter (medium sized) for basically a month now, but it's not like I don't know what to do: I keep writing and writing, and it's getting better and better, but it's really unusual how long this is taking compared my normal.
I'm just wondering if there's some mental harm in doing so (like if it would be best to focus on different chapters for a while and come back to it later).

>>20438087
Most trad publisbers refuse to publish anything that has been published before, in any medium.

>>20438248
Amazon or RR? Because RR couldn't give two shits about a blurry cover

>>20438479
My most successful writing trick was getting up every day at 6h, dragging myself to the laptop and not leave until I had 2000 words (usually a 2h endeavour)
Second best was making a 5 min outline of what I wanted to write that day.

>>20438741
Happy for you, anon. Do you think monthly quotas work? I'm afraid I would chill for 25 days then try to shit out 50 000 words in the last 5, fail, and cry

>>20437966
Is it a good idea to keep on writing when you don't have a good idea of how the book should end.

I'm currently just making shit up as I go, but I'm worried about not having a clear goal in mind

>>20438964
Yes, of course you should move on. If only to gain some fresh perspective and stop spinning your wheels

>>20439097
Are you publishing as you go? If so, yeah, try and plan out a natural stopping point. If not, it's not as dire, but you should still think hard about where it's all headed to. This is not to diss pantsing, which is my preferred writing method too, but to counter pne of its natural weaknesses.

In A Clash of Kings there is a sentence in which it is said:
>Tommen was all of eight.
Clearly, this means that he was eight years old. Is this just some fancy way of saying the same thing or is there more to that?

>>20439142
Inches. Soft.

>>20438012
i did it you turd burgers! now there is but 2 chapters to go.

>>20439089
Not really, it was just to see if I could maintain a specific output over an extended time period and so far so good. I'd write the same with or without it, probably.

>>20439089
Daily quotas of hours, not words. A successful day is one in which you sit down for the allotted time and gave it your undivided attention.

>>20439256
So you sit on your computer for an hour doing nothing but staring at a blank page?

>>20439260
>So you sit on your computer for an hour doing nothing but staring at a blank page?
Of course! This is the meditation general, isn't it?

>>20439268
Then why not have a quota of words?

>>20439271
Because focused time spent on improving your craft and practicing is superior in all cases than is a marginally larger amount of words' progress towards a static goal. Incentivize the concentration and practice rather than being physically present for the physical activity of typing out words on a keyboard. Unless you're already a master (you're not) it makes more sense to prioritize improvement over progress.

>>20439307
Uh-huh. So what do you ACTUALLY do during these hours?

>>20439268

“Show up, show up, show up, and after a while the muse shows up, too.” – Isabel Allende

It's actually good advice. Habit and consistency lead to output. Sit down to write at the same time each week, regardless of output, and output will increase over time. Of course, you have to sit down with the intention to write and actually try to put words down, but by being consistent and habitual about when and how you do that, your output will increase.

>>20439317

You write you fucking dolt. You just don't write to an arbitrary word count

>>20439328
Okay but how has it worked out for you so far?

>>20439317
Word quotas prioritize the number of words. By focusing on quotas and gross output, you get better at fulfilling quotas and improving gross output. By focusing on present and interactive practice, you get better at writing. Your QUALITY of writing improves, rather than just the quantity. It's not rocket science, dreckshoveling-kun.

>wow he's such a great writer... he writes ten thousand words a day!!!

>>20439338
>>20439341
So you're just upset that people are actually able to write instead of just thinking about writing?
I'll leave you to it, then.

>>20439348
No, nobody's saying that, retard.

Do you write about the most profound and universal part of the human experience?

>>20439256
I tried this before, but it didn't work. I find it's best to focus on the word count than the hours, since the first ticks up when I work at it and the second ticks down without my interference. Consequently, going by word count results in considerably less staring and indecision. If I'm only free at 2k, then I'll try hard to reach 2k.
>>20439307
But you are improving as you put words on the page, especially if those words are part of a larger whole and not a self-contained creative writing exercise. You're experimenting with rhythm, description, action, chracterization, and getting more experimenting done per session than the guy who's carefully weighing the pros and cons of using rapidly instead of quickly.
>>20439338
Still unconvinced. How many complete works have you produced using your method? How long has it been in place?

>>20439331

I now average 3,000 words a session. But it is variable. This week I only managed 2,400. When I started I would be lucky to do 400.

>>20439408
>this week
You only write once a week?

>>20439407
>How many complete works have you produced using your method?

If short stories count (I'm guessing no, but its all I write because its what I am most interested in). Then I average one a fortnight, including editing up to third draft. So since giving up on word count chasing last year I've finished 33. I only finished 3 the previous year (but a lot more that were abandoned).

To be fair, it's what works for you. If word counts get you writing more and you prefer the output then keep doing that. But its not the only option.

>>20439407
>Still unconvinced. How many complete works have you produced using your method?
You're still unconvinced that focusing on quality isn't better, so... you ask for derivatives of the quantity-metric (how MANY works) to prove that focusing on quality is better than focusing on quantity? This makes no sense.

>>20439416

No. I write twice a week. 7am to 9am before the kids wake up on Saturday and Sunday

>>20439341
This is actually something people say about BrandoSando. Everyone shat and came and collectively decided to give him 15 mil when they discovered he'd written 4 books in a year.

>>20439425

I admire the mans graft, but not the actual results.

>>20439425
4 extra books on top of all the other stuff they knew he already did

>>20439425

Mormon productivity

>>20439419
>>20439424
That's really good anon, congrats. And even without focusing on word count you manage way more words per hour than I do. I'm actually surprised that you count 1500 words/hour as focusing on quality, because that sounds very fast.
Have you tried marketing your short stories? I've just started looking into it; sounds like a good way to make a name in writing circles and build a body of work.
>>20439423
I wasn't going to be more surprised if you told me you'd finished a 24-book epic about hindu superheroes (I mean, I would, I definitely would), I just wanted to know if you'd finished something with that method. Like you said, whatever works, but if you're not finishing novels, short stories, whatever, then it's probably not working.

>>20439407
>Consequently, going by word count results in considerably less staring and indecision
Many, many authors could probably use a whole lot MORE staring and indecision. Given the quality of the shit that often gets posted here, and of what gets published, many people aren't spending enough time rape second-guessing themselves, playing devil's advocate. It's very trendy right now to breeze through half a million words a month, but at the same time, the average book is of a decreasing quality as years go on. Doesn't seem like a coincidence to me!

Sure, the quantity mindset works for some people. That said, these people are probably serializing on RR and need to keep the low-quality, unedited diarrhea flowing as long as possible so they can hopefully make $500 a month and feed their fifteen children in Biblistan or whatever.

It's just important to contextualize these things. In this general, you have people who are writing litRPG for RR debating people who want to write serious, literary fiction. Everyone thinks they're right.

Problem is, I actually AM right, and the RR dreck-shovelers are wrong and contributing to the slow death of literature just so they can stop being engineers and salesmen.

>>20439427
Exactly. 10 000 words is still 10 000 words, even if most of it is anime fights and brooding.
>>20439428
Sure, yeah, 10 000 words a day covers a lot of ground.
>>20439428

>>20439445

We are two anons. I am the first one you replied to. I should say I do edit in the evenings, because I can do that when more mentally drained.

I have published in print lit mags, but I'm not super interested in publishing a short story collection yet. I think I'd like to get a larger body of already published work before collecting it, but I am too lazy with applying and I need to expand my horizions outside of the four places I usually submit.

>>20439449
>everyone thinks they're right
>I actually AM right
Without seeing your work I absolutely cannot tell if you're better than the average RR author.

>>20439451
>10 000 words is still 10 000 words, even if most of it is anime fights and brooding
This guy has drawn 10,000 of these with only minor variation. His skill has never improved. Are 10,000 of these worth the paper they're scrawled on? Are they worth more than one Mona Lisa?

>finally reach a point where I'm able to write consistently
>/wg/ decides that doing so is worthless and you should just git gud immediately

>>20439458
Hey, that's cheating. Is it wordswordswords in the morning and quality in the evening? That's a hybrid method, buster.

>>20439463
Maybe I'm not. I'm not a master, or even a great author. That much, at least, is certain. But I am right regardless.

>>20439464
I find that very strange. Is your friend mentally deficient? I'm sure you can hardly swing a pickaxe 10 000 times without the final swing being techincally better than the first, so 10 000 identical drawings are either a a genius at work or autismo.
In any case, I'm not defending Sanderson's prose. Just saying that 10 000 words per day (and I don't actually think he does that every day) is an impressive number for a professional, successful author.

>>20439468

No, I make notes about what to write and what I don't like about what I have put down. What to bring more attention to etc. I can't create words worth reading after midday

>>20439475
If pure word count is all that matters, then my posts on 4chan count as well. Do you think posting on 4chan composes good, solid practice for an author? Or is it kind of just shit you can breeze through because the words are low quality?

>>20439467

Ignore /lit/. It's the intellectual quality of chimps flinging shit. Everyone is bitter and pretending to be someone they aren't.

Keep writing anon. Do it for yourself, not for /lit/. Fuck /lit/

>>20439486
>Everyone is bitter and pretending to be someone they aren't.
Except you, of course.

>>20437966
Hey guys, I’m new to writing. I thought I’d get a Maestro Class from none other than Alan fucking Moore. Has anyone tried it?

>>20439481
It's a kind of practice, obviously. I'm ESL and I find that posting on 4chan forces me to change my normal prose (adapted to fiction) and adopt a more conversational tone that doesn't come as naturally.
Do I think shitposting on 4chan makes you a better fiction writer? No, not directly.

>>20439498
Eh. I saw that, and considered it, but remember that Alan, while an amazing storyteller, may not be a great teacher (no idea if he is or not, but it's a shot in the dark).
You're better served by the beginner books in the OP + Techniques of the Selling Writer.

>>20439500
>Do I think shitposting on 4chan makes you a better fiction writer? No, not directly.
Therefore there must be something that is more important than just the number of words you write. If the context matters, and if there exist certain specificities and nuances and lessons to be learned in specific ways, the word count doesn't matter. It's the interaction with all of those things that matters more to a developing artist (which we all are) than it does the count of how many words you can type per minute.

>>20439498
Why does Moore keep getting shilled? Surely no one here is interested in writing superheroes for Marvel/DC?

>https://youtu.be/hb5QaCfm7bg
This guy is analogous to the literary Word Count Fan. He knows the rules and due to his diligent and mindless focus on producing as many notes as possible per lesson he can play a bunch of them really fast. Like the Word Count Fan, he's involved in a kitschy subgenre oriented towards people who have lower standards for taste. This is analogous here to RR/litRPG. Do you want to be this sideshow freak? Keep going, Word Count Fan. You'll get there.

>>20439548
You can't make me stop, not matter how much you cry and whine.

>>20439498
>Hey guys I'm new to writing so I'll get a writing class from an elderly capeshit writer that hates capeshit
bruh moment

>>20438716
Where is this so-called place... (link please)

>>20439514
Yes. Obviously. I feel like you had ignore most of my post just tie your neat little bow, but yes: to write fiction you need to practice writing fiction. Writing the word 'ape' repeatedly for 2h will not result in ou getting better at anything except typing the word 'ape' and possibly zen meditation. The argument was never that shitting out words as fast as humanly possible for 2h makes you a better writer, the argument was that setting out a word goal works better for me, and I imagine for other people, than a time goal. The reason being that I'm lazy.
However, the quality anon above (can't tell if it's you) writes 1500/hour. If that's the speed at which people write quality prose, I really have no argument at all.

>>20439560
>cry and whine
This is how you interpret everything you disagree with. I'm guessing that if you can paint someone as crying or whining, it's easier for you to dismiss things. Dismissal is probably a habit of yours, I'd imagine. You'll probably dismiss this post too, if you respond.

>>20439548
cope and seethe nigger, my worst daily writing is still better than most of your overwritten shit

>>20439585
Post it

>>20439583
>stop dismissing me waaaaa
No, I will continue to ignore you. I will continue to write. You will continue to grab the ankles of others and try to drag them down to wallow in your depressed inactivity, but I am already beyond your reach.
Cry, little crab. Your tears couldn't possibly make you any saltier.

>>20439548
>waah nooooo don't be productive you have to agonize over one paragraph for days like meeee wAAAAAAGH

>>20439602
>>20439606
You're pathetic. Do you honestly think you can use the quantity of your shitposting to drown out legitimate criticism of your methods?

>>20439611
There's no need to "drown you out", if anything your crab in bucket screeching deserves to be elevated so you can more efficiently make a fool of yourself
We're just pointing and laughing as you rightly deserve

>>20439611
There's no point. Even when you call your shot, as I did (>>20439583, "You'll probably dismiss this post too, if you respond") they kind of just truck along under the weight of their shitposting.

>>20439622
>>20439611
next time you try samefagging at least bother to change how you type, retard

>>20439623

>>20439548
>>20439560
>>20439583
>>20439585
>>20439602
>>20439606
>>20439611
>>20439616
Please don't let the need to shitpost get the better of you. We were having a nice discussion about two seemingly opposed writing methods. One that boiled down to 'do whatever works'. Don't let your dumb egos shit the thread.

>>20439627
Yes yes, I also know how to inspect element.

>>20439630
>Please don't let the need to shitpost
I made a very specific and considered point with the Batio video. He exemplifies the kind of tasteless focus on technique that many artists—even technically competent ones—subscribe to. There happens to be a pretty poignant parallel between the approaches. Batio plays passages at lightning speed that are devoid of expression, emotion, any sense of feel for the instrument. They are clinical and precise passages. This is also the goal of the focus on word count, which wants to present clinical passages with only trappings of a facsimile of emotion, expression. It's not my fault people shitpost in response.

>>20439635
On my phone? In (precisely, check for yourself) one minute and twenty-three seconds? There's a word for your approach here: solipsism.

>>20439640
How many words do you write per hour, on average?

Should I post my novel's story outline here, on a pastebin link?
It is 5509 words. It is not edited well, and it is repetitive. I pasted it in the Hemingway program, it is a Grade 6 reading level.
I have not received serious writing feedback before. My family only flatter me. So I seek to hear a different perspective.
I wonder if this work will come off as raw or naïve. I am nervous but excited.

>>20439648
I wouldn't. For the reason that no one cares about novel outlines (it's the idea without the execution, there's no technique behind it). Of course you're excited (you should be!), but I would wait to post here until you have actual chapters. Posting the first page would be helpful, for example, and I'd be happy to tear you a new one/sing your praises depending on the case.
However, 5000 word seems huge for an outline. Did you get carried away a bit?

>>20439644
It varies. I write for two or three hours, five days a week. Sometimes I write a lot, sometimes I allow myself to work through the process of figuring out why a given sentence or passage doesn't work the way I want to. Contrary to how it's presented by others, I don't believe this time to be "wasted," because I don't see it as an impossible problem. It's an opportunity to grow and learn as a writer, even if by objective metrics it is unproductive. Sometimes objective metrics don't tell the whole story.

>>20439663
Give an estimate. How much did you write yesterday? The day before that? Or the day before THAT?

>>20439668
400 or 500, probably. About two years per average, novel-sized draft.

>>20439640
I think there's a disconnect here. The point of wordcount isn't to write as quickly as possible to reach some arbitrary goal (unless you're doing NaNoWriMo or something dumb like that). You're still there for an hour or two, you just give yourself an extra drive to not sweat the small stuff. If on minute 27, word 432 you type
>Giggling, she looked away shily.
and are filled with a nagging sensation that something is not quite right, you have two avenues:
1. Ignore it, keep the momentum, come back later
2. Spend a few minutes tinkering, changing things around, trying to ascertain if you're overusing -ing verbs, trying to remember if adverbs are cool this year or not.
In my view, both are worthwhile processes, but 1. is writing and 2. is editing. The two should be kept separate.

I just wanted to see if I could maintain a certain level of productivity over an extended period of time and now everyone is trying to kill everyone else over it.
I'm sorry okay? I'll never write over 500 words day again, so please just stop the pointless shitposting about wordcounts.

>>20439690
Death to the wordcucks, timechads will inherit the earth

>>20439685
>The point of wordcount isn't to write as quickly as possible to reach some arbitrary goal
But regardless of the goal or the point, that is inevitably what the process incentivizes, isn't it? If you're a carpenter and the goal is to produce a high-quality table, do you tell yourself you'll finish fifteen chairs a day and just kind of hope you become really good at creating works of art for which people will pay a bunch of money? Or does it—at a certain point—make more sense to slow down and really pay attention to detail? This is, in my mind, what the continuum is: focus on working as quickly as possible versus paying attention to detail.
>The two should be kept separate.
Yes, this is doctrinal. It's what you hear repeated everywhere and by everyone on writing forums and in creative writing classes and from big-name writers who sell a billion books a picosecond. My point is that this specific philosophy is subservient to an ideology which emphasizes the (very postmodern) idea of get it done now, worry about it later. My point is that, judging from the average quality of work these days—and yes, I realize this is subjective—that this philosophy towards writing never really materializes the "later worrying" stage. And I think that sucks. I think it's worth a vigorous counterpoint.

>>20439705
>>20439708
Anons pls I never wanted this

Another challenge. I will r8 everyone's attempts at improving the following simple snippet:
>A woman sat in a hotel bar, watching the door. Her appearance was neat and tidy: white blouse, fair hair tucked behind her ears.
Word counter or time minder, may the best writer win.

>>20439661
Thank you for your reply

It is long because it has different sections, not just the plot line, but other things also:

Title
Hook
Place
Time
Setting
Themes
Characters (5 main, 2 minor)

Plot [broken into Kishōtenketsu]
Ki (Introduction)
Shō (Development)
Ten (Twist)
Ketsu (Conclusion)

>>20439714
A woman sat at a hotel bar and she watched the door and her appearance was neat and tidy and she wore a white blouse and tucked her fair hair behind her ears

>>20439708
Aren't you quoting that ceramics quantity vs quality thing but taking the wrong lesson from it?
I'm sure that many RR writers never actually get to the worrying part. I'm equally sure that all serious writers go through a minimum of 4 drafts per work, slowly sculpting the raw matter of the first into something worth reading. Personally, I find it easier to be dionysiac when writing, apollonian when editing, so this method pairs very well with my natural inclinations. Yours, from my observations of workshop colleagues, is the most common, and it also leads to a lot of paralysis.

>>20439714
Simple is fine for that. She's a woman at a bar. Context justifies detail

>>20439725
Abd have you started writing it?

>>20439714
The businesslady sat perched in a high-end hotel bar, eyes watching the door, like an eagle in wait. She had a cold and aloof appearance, with a crisply ironed white blouse, black blazer and pencil skirt, and fair hair neatly tucked behind her ears, pulled into a stern bun.

>>20439736
This may maximize words typed per minute, but it changes the sedate, composed nature of the original passage into a breathless beat poem.
4/10

>>20439749
Ngmi

>>20439748
This doesn't change anything except making the woman more definite in uninteresting ways.
4/10

>>20439714
At the hotel bar, a woman in a white blouse sat watching the door. Her hair was neatly tucked behind her ears, her appearance the very image of tidiness.

>>20439757
Better, but the last section, image of tidiness, is more convoluted than the original. If it has advantages, I can't find them.
7/10

>>20439757
>neatly
Adverbs are an automatic 0/10

>>20439782
Dogmatic and Stephen King-pilled

>>20439782
find a book considered a "classic" that contains no adverbs, nigger

>>20439789
Stephen King said something fun about how he hates pronouns in On Writing but I don't remember what it was anymore

>>20439792
>the author of It hates pronouns
I remember him saying he hates -ly adverbs (and sure, there's the point that sometimes you can switch 'verb adverb' for a better-suited verb), but I can't recall anything about pronouns.

>>20439714
>A woman sat in a hotel bar, watching the door. Her appearance was neat and tidy: white blouse, fair hair tucked behind her ears.
With wild eyes barged Chuck into the hotel lobby. With each sloshing step of his bare-socked feet, he left prints of muddy rainwater en route the bar. At the bar sat a woman, and from under her fair hair was visible the white of her averted eye.

"There's a nigger outside," said Chuck.

Her head turns in rigid, jerking movements. She looks at Chuck's forehead.

"That's very—"

"No!" says Chuck, grabbing her by the shoulders. "There's a nigger! He's marking in perfect diligence his objective metrics. He's carefully cataloguing his accomplishments and cross-referencing them with the time spent thereupon. He's looking at cost-benefit analyses on dollars per impression, follow-backs per follow, and his erection is growing. It's massive now—a huge, throbbing nigger cock—and he's chosen you."

She stares at Chuck.

"Look!" he squeals. "There he is now! Look out the window, there! His name is (You)."

Nigger.

>>20439714
>A blonde sat at the bar.
Simplicity is perfection.

>Hemingway universally grades any and all excerpts from my work as 9-12
not sure how to feel about this

>>20439820
7/10, fix the tenses

>>20439864
Yeah i caught that too once i hit post. I rarely ever write in anything but present tense (and first person as well) so i think as the shitpost processed i regressed back into what's comfy. Cheers

>>20438016
>I was going for bread, because I needed some but had none
Isn't that always the case? You buy something because you need it and don't have it?

>>20439896
No, that's not always the case lad. I've got drinks at home but I'm going to buy some more, not out of need due to a lack of but out of a want for more

>“Look at me, Stan.”
> He grabs my chin with fat, greasy fingers, angles it towards him.
> “Who’s my tight little unit?”
> His face looms like a fat, bearded moon. Devoid of expression.
> “Fuck you,” I say.
> Expressionless, he fortifies his grip upon my chin, and with the other hand deals three quick, heavy strikes with open hand. My head swims and my face alights with pain.
> “Who’s my tight—”
> He seems to dislike something in my expression and hammers home another three strikes. Hy head held in place in his grip, it cannot give with the blows; each lands solidly. My head is hot iron between an anvil and pneumatic hammer. Eyes watering, I feel hot fluid drip from my ear. My arm wanders weakly up to his face, to grab hold, to gouge an eye, to do anything. Bucksneed swats the hand away, which falls loose and wooden to the side. His expression never changes. Another hard slap; a backhand follows.
> “You cannot do this to me.”
> “Do what?” he asks. A closed fist impacts my mouth. The taste of blood. “This?”
> He rears back another blow. His face is slowly twisting. A gleeful rictus in whose dark and beady eyes I see myself cower.
> “Wait!” I say. “Wait!”
> Punches fall.
> “What are you, Mr. Howl?”
> “I’m your tight little unit, doctor. Please. Please, doctor. Don’t strike me again. That’s me. I’m your tight little unit. Please.”
> Bucksneed pauses. His expression slackens, blanks, cracks a wide and genuine grin exposing yellowy and chipped buck-teeth. I am coughing and spitting blood.
> “That’s right, little guy. That’s alright now,” he says, stroking my hair, cooing now. “That’s alright, you’re a tight little unit, aren’t you?”
> I want to agree. I want to. I truly want to be Bucksneed’s tight little unit, if only it will stop the beating. I cannot speak above a low gurgle. Bucksneed presses a fat finger to my lips, cooing again.
> “That’s alright,” he says. “Quiet, now. Take your medicine.”
> I struggle.
> “Take your medicine,” he says. His tone is sharp and iron. He pries open my mouth with one hand, and with the other forces foul-smelling tonic down my throat. Black and bottomless sleep threatens immediately. I don’t know what will happen when I fall asleep. I do not want to fall asleep. I am afraid. I don’t know if this sleep is one from which I will awake
Hello frens. Any input would be appreciated. Does it get bogged down during the violence? How weird is the gay/dominant overtone throughout? I want it to be weird.

>>20439464
She cute.

>>20439491

I’m am pretending to myself to not be a /lit/ degenerate, even though I am

>Show writing to my mom
>She says its perfect
It's the little things lads

>>20439097
You can always chop it up in a second draft. It's best to keep going.

>>20439968
My mom has not commented at all on the last 5 pieces I've sent her. My brother on the other hand did say I wrote a very good description of a "sociopath criminal father", which was my aim so I'm happy.

>>20439980
That's great to hear, anon.

>>20439987
Yeah, my brother is a much more reliable source than mom anyway. Mothers praise their babies for anything.

>>20439989
>Mothers praise their babies for anything.
True, but my mom's honest on anything she doesn't like. So her saying it's pretty much perfect today makes me happy.

when writing alien races, do you need to have them grotesque weird shit like that one sci-fi novel? Or is that too pretentious?
Are humanoid aliens okay?

>>20438404
Aethon, as well.

>>20439968
>>20439994
Bless your mam, lad

>>20438016
I have never interacted with aussies to answer your question. What i can say tho is that this paragraph was enjoyable. I like this character already. Sounds like a proper autist who made it out of 4chan and struggles to blend in. It is probably not a good thing to ask, but please do share a few more.

>>20440025
Do whatever your narrative and themes need.
>Are humanoid aliens okay?
Yes. Only socially dysfunctional nerds who don't understand that all stories are fundamentally about humans pretend to disagree.

>>20439833
My take with more flavour:
>Bar was, alone blondily

>>20440025
All aliens should be greys and they should seek to probe anuses for reasons that are never revealed to the audience.

>>20440025
No. But you should have them do things that would be odd for humans. Like placing a utensil at the top of the plate instead of the side. Or their women's preferred sex position is raping men. Or they tie their hair in ponytails. It's the little things that make their culture

>>20439714
>A woman sat in a hotel bar, watching the door. Her appearance was neat and tidy: white blouse, fair hair tucked behind her ears.

A woman waited in the hotel bar. She kept her back straight, her white blouse tightly buttoned to the neck, and her eyes fixed to the entrance. She tucked a stray lock of blonde hair behind her right ear and took another sip from her Shirley Temple. It was exactly one minute past six o'clock.

>>20440080
2/10. Adds meaningless detail, completely unattached to any impression of why anyone should care about that detail.

>>20439714
A woman wearing a white blouse with her hair tucked behind her ears sat in the hotel bar watching the door.

>>20440086
The ! And ? Made it unrobotic like as well as the cursing. Give more hints to the reader it's a robot during the dialogue.

>>20440103

I wanted it to seem more like a recording than a synthesized voice - thank you though, that is helpful. This is just a smaller part of a bigger piece

>>20438585
The biggest problem to your essays is there isn't a thesis. It just reads like a giant ramble from some edgy 14 year old. Your philosophy offers no new insight except it gives the impression you're a psychopath. In one sentence you go off in 5 different ways.

>>20438248
The font is shit. I can't see the blur from my phone, but the font needs to be much better. Find something that'll make it pop out more

>>20440083
Boo. You're bad at this.

The rigid back and tightly buttoned blouse imply 'neat and tidy' without stating it bluntly, as does drinking a non alcoholic drink at a hotel bar. The time is to imply she's impatiently waiting for someone.

This general has turned into blog posting. I wake up, 100 replies and zero drafts posted. What are you people doing here?

>>20440130
Why should I care if she's neat and tidy? Why should I care what she's drinking? Why should I care who she's waiting for?

>>20440136
There's a couple posted throughout.
>>20440086
>>20439914
>>20438585
Okay, I was expecting to find many more, but that seems like it's it. You're right.

>>20440139
Why should you care about anything in the original sentence either? It states she's neat and tidy. It also says she's at a bar. Why should you care about that?

>>20440136

If you're gonna be here for a bit I got some drafts.

>>20440149
You shouldn't. If you're adding detail, it's implicit that you also need to give a reason for that detail. I'm sure this was unintentional, but that "exercise" is a landmine. It's a trick question.

>>20440136
Procrastinating and not doing what they should be doing.

>>20440152
Post it

>>20440136
The most replies any piece I've posted has been TWO (2), and one of them was in fact a blogpost of someone telling me about their job. Do tell why I should post anything here?

>>20439338
>>20439341
Love the seethe this generates from word churners

>>20439425
>>20439427
The thing is that Sanderson is just part of a corporate book producing machine now so directly comparing his capacity to some dude writing in his spare time doesn't even make sense.

Sandersnoy has a team that supports him, and I guarantee over the last year that's included a ghost writer he revises off of or a "very active editor" that turns word vomit into Sanersonain workmanlike prose. Sanderson will die and his popularity holds they will be putting out books by him Tom Clancy style for 20 years "based on his notes" and supposed incomplete manuscripts they paid some nobody 5k to write

>>20439725
>Plot [broken into Kishōtenketsu]
Yikes.

>>20440178
How many times do you give other feedback? Nobody gets critique anymore because nobody GIVES critique anymore. We're all too tied up with our gay little drama and hating the pseuds, Bucksneed, Gardner self-shilling, tangential blogposts about what you did today (but never the thing itself which you ostensibly did), word counters, hour counters, advertiser's acolytes, earnest Reddit immigrants who showed up here at the same time and all familiar with one another, ad nauseam. So many fags here have taken offense to harsh criticism (which used to be our hallmark—harsh but constructive) and now we're a bunch of gaybabies holding on to mommy's beltloop as we suck our little thumbs and pretend we're all a lot better than we actually are.

Let's just post some fucking writing.

>>20440155
The reason should be obvious. The original presents a plain fact. 'She's neat and tidy'. But that's boring. So I replaced the abstract with the concrete details that imply the same thing. The reader can figure it out for themselves.

This woman is drinking a non alcoholic drink like a prude. She has her blouse buttoned to the collar, even though a bar is a place to unwind. A lock of hair gets loose and she immediately tucks it back into place. She's watching the door even though it's only one minute past the date, so she must be impatiently expecting someone. These sensory details tell us something about her personality.

In the original she's wearing a white blouse. Why not a brightly colored Hawaiian shirt or a sequined dress? Because a white blouse implies something different. Same thing here.

My version might be subpar, sure, but the purpose and meaning should be totally obvious.

>>20440206
Every novel ever written is full to the brim with fair-haired women impatiently sipping their nonalcoholic beers. This is just a series of detail. If the protagonist were walking into the bar with a hard cock, and he was there because his wife left him for a niggerdicked chimpanzee, okay; there's your context. That's why this woman her characteristics nobody otherwise cares about matter. It's why you are giving the reader detail. It's not implicit at all.

>>20440155
No, it's just a first sentence.
>>20439736
>>20439736
>>20439748
>>20439757
>>20439820
>>20440080
>>20440088
It comes from Sally Rooney's Beautiful World Where Are You.
As opposed to yesterday's exercise, which was clearly clunky and could use improvement, this one has no blatant mistake to hang a correction on. It's a simple, direct introduction. Its very simplicity seems like the easiest thing to criticise, since first sentences should, according to the books we all read, grip the reader, slap him around, and chokeslam them into the story.
Anyway, my attempt would be
>A woman sat in a hotel bar. Her white blouse was pressed, her fair was tucked behind her ears. She watched the door.
The break doesn't do much except underline the action (watching the door), and the rewrite as a whole only addresses the weakest link of the word 'neat' just telling what we're immediately shown, white blouse, hair tucked, etc. Some anons pointed this out as well. Good job, everyone, see you on the next one.

Just a generic section from what I'm writing rn

The sun shone through the glazed glass of the tower, images curated to the tastes of former Tyrants. In green and red depictions of the hunt was Retius’ addition to the tapestry of glass. A rainforest of beasts and a man clawing at the back of a great Puma. A knife ready at the throat of the beast and the hunter ready to claim the life of the beast. The panorama of colours showing the virtue and strength of a Tyrant, but to Retius a reminder of his homeland. Far away from the forests of the City Esh. Where he hunted under the stars with a party of his kinsmen. Only to come back to the great city of the Sun and Moon priests. A simple life where he stood only as a warrior and hunter of one of the hundreds of clans that clawed their way around the grand temples of Sun and Moon.

To the lowly men of society, adventure was the only way to stake a claim in that world. But to Retius it was the hunt that he loved. Hearing tales from Elders of their spoils was not enough. Saltback Krakens, Canyon Wyrms and Black Basilisks were what he wanted to hunt. Not the simple creatures of his homeland. The old Sun priest Pelus egged Retius on, the old man sponsored him and had given him a permit personally to leave their homeland

There is no doubt a bit of grammar issues here. But I'm trying to work on my more generic prose when writing. Unless I'm doing a 'set piece' I'm not sure what 95% of my writing should be like in order not to be dogshit

>>20440219
>Every novel ever written is full to the brim with fair-haired women impatiently sipping their nonalcoholic beers. This is just a series of detail. If the protagonist were walking into the bar with a hard cock, and he was there because his wife left him for a niggerdicked chimpanzee, okay; there's your context. That's why this woman her characteristics nobody otherwise cares about matter. It's why you are giving the reader detail. It's not implicit at all.

I don't even know what the fuck you're talking about now. And I'm beginning to wonder how you got on the panel of judges.

>>20440237
>I don't even know what the fuck you're talking about now. And I'm beginning to wonder how you got on the panel of judges.
Well, one would probably follow the other pretty naturally.

Just a generic section from what I'm writing rn
==========
How long could the lie be kept up? Inspiring words and brave men aren’t enough to change reality, it is only enough to cover it up behind a poor facade. Retius could not even recall the names of his doormen, all he knew was that his entire retinue fought either on the walls or in the charge. A compliment he hoped rang true.

The battle outside of the walls last week was only indicative of how weak the City had become. The last major expedition by the Tyranny was twenty years ago in order to avert an invasion of the City by the Crowned Sultan of the Way Clans.

The sun shone through the glazed glass of the tower, images curated to the tastes of former Tyrants. In green and red depictions of the hunt was Retius’ addition to the tapestry of glass. A rainforest of beasts and a man clawing at the back of a great Puma. A knife ready at the throat of the beast and the hunter ready to claim the life of the beast. The panorama of colours showing the virtue and strength of a Tyrant, but to Retius a reminder of his homeland. Far away from the forests of the City Esh. Where he hunted under the stars with a party of his kinsmen. Only to come back to the great city of the Sun and Moon priests. A simple life where he stood only as a warrior and hunter of one of the hundreds of clans that clawed their way around the grand temples of Sun and Moon.

To the lowly men of society, adventure was the only way to stake a claim in that world. But to Retius it was the hunt that he loved. Hearing tales from Elders of their spoils was not enough. Saltback Krakens, Canyon Wyrms and Black Basilisks were what he wanted to hunt. Not the simple creatures of his homeland. The old Sun priest Pelus egged Retius on, the old man had sponsored him and had given him a permit personally to leave their homeland
==========
There is no doubt a bit of grammar issues here. But I'm trying to work on my more generic prose when writing. Unless I'm doing a 'set piece' I'm not sure what 95% of my writing should be like in order not to be dogshit

>>20440246
It doesn't really grab me. I can accept one City by the Way and I guess the Tyranny too, but beyond that I'm pretty done pretty quick. This feels like a lore dump to me and I don't like being dumped on.

>>20439714
>Woman sat in a hotel bar, watching the door. Neat and tidy. White blouse. Fair hair tucked behind her ears.

I got banned so I couldn't reply to an anon's criticism of this poem which was that I should obscure the character more as he is based on the primal Dionysus. I couldn't think of how to do so without restructuring the entire thing, but I made some changes and I think I'm moving on from this unless there is something I'm overlooking

>>20440267
Delete all the line breaks and ask yourself if the punctuation makes sense and governs the flow of the poem the way you want it to.

>>20440256
I'm kind of feeling the last paragraph turns it into a lore dump rather than just a description + 2 sentences lore. What kind of part do you feel like it goes from sort of natural to being a loredump?

>>20440272
Probably the moment you started capitalizing words mid-sentence, but that might be a little unfair. I really don't like fantasy or science fiction at all, so I don't know what your target audience will think. Maybe this is perfectly okay and I'll never know it.

>>20438518
Masculine

>>20439914
anyone?

>>20440288
Nobody actually likes reading meme shit posting or erotica.

Something I started working on earlier, trying a different style.

1/4

>>20440291

2/4

>>20440294

3/4

>>20439914
I remember you posting this before.
I said I didn't understand it.
Now you say it's a gay/dominant thing.
So I guess I understand it now.
But I don't read stuff like this, nor am I interested in such things, so I can't give you any critique, except that it's (obviously) gross.

>>20440290
I put a lot of effort into my writing. It's categorically not a meme, shitpost, or erotica. It's none of those things...

>>20440297

4/4

>>20440300
Is it uncomfortable to read? If I hadn't said there was a gay/dominance thing going on, would you have gathered that on your own? Where do you think is the line between something that makes a reader uncomfortable and vaguely grossed out versus just done entirely?

>>20440301
The minute your character's name is bucksneed it's shit posting. Don't bother changing it now, it's already tainted and nobody is going to bother reading it. You're going to have to wait 3 months when it's forgotten in our minds

>>20440246
>glazed glass
These are synonyms. 'Glassed glass.'
>cover it up behind a poor facade
Prepositions or directional words next to each other should probably be axed. 'up behind'

Way too many sentence fragments. It almost feels like list of random stuff.

You're using 'was' as a linking verb in almost every sentence. Try to rely on other verbs.
>But to Retius it was the hunt that he loved.
Reitus loved the hunt.
>The battle outside of the walls last week was only indicative of how weak the City had become.
Last week's battle outside the walls indicated how weak the City had become.

>>20440310
I'm not going to change it, don't worry. I'm just asking for a fair shake.

>>20440307
Yes, it's uncomfortable to read.
Without you telling me, I suspected there was some sort of power-imbalance thing going on.
For me, the line is whether both sides consent, and it seems like one of the two is an unwilling victim.

>>20440314
Thank you. I feared I 'listing' more than narrating. Do you have any tips to break that feeling?

>>20440328
Okay, good. I can work with that. Maybe I don't emphasize the homoshit so much. It's just so easy to start conflating power and sex. They're so intimately intermingled. Thanks, anon.

>>20440332
Ground your information in action. Create an engaging situation such that, seemingly by complete happenstance, that information just happens to become relevant.

Did a little polishing of this section of a later chapter. Curious if the humor actually carries its weight without killing the sense of adventure.

1st person, fantasy adventure with comedy undertones (Wooster/Flashman hybrid type MC). Only context needed is that Spinner is the name of the MC's horse.

To the larping faggot from yesterday that said he had more reviews on >>20436917 are we ever going to see your book? Or will there be more larping about /lit/ harming your reputation?

>>20440332
First get rid of fragments. they're fine every once in awhile for emphasis, just not all the time.
>The panorama of colours showing the virtue and strength of a Tyrant, but to Retius a reminder of his homeland. Far away from the forests of the City Esh. Where he hunted under the stars with a party of his kinsmen.
The panorama showed the virtue and strength of a Tyrant, but it reminded Retius his distant homeland in the forests of the City Esh where he hunted under the stars with his kinsmen.

Just squish them together and add verbs. Then figure it out from there.

>>20440351
>>20440387
Awesome, thank you.

>>20439714
She sat at the bar and watched the door, tucked her blonde hair behind her ears. Manicured nails. Shirt crisp white, posture perfect. Out of place in that hotel, worn carpets permiating stale beer.

>>20439834
Prowritingaid always rates my "sticky sentences" at over 40% no matter what I do. So I've just decided that's my voice and ignore the stat.

Establish that the bad guys are bad by having characters talk about their misdeeds.
>show, don’t tell
Have a scene where the bad guys rape a little girl and then torture her to death.
>OMG WTF IS WRONG WITH YOU?!
So show, don’t tell, unless you’ll show? Why can’t people give less retarded advice?

>>20438248
looks good!

>>20438479
Work hard, nigger.
Write every day.
Write a lot.

>>20439714
>A woman, being previously described, that is, the subject of this dear story, sat, or rather, chose not to stand, for reasons known only to herself, in a hotel bar, specifically, the one that opened early in the day--and in two day's time, she would wish it only opened later--but that aside, being not the appropriate time, this woman sat watching the door. Her appearance was, as you may surmise, neat, not altogether unusual for a woman, but, alas, neat in such a way that was put-together, that is, in such a way as to imply someone special was to arrive at the perfect occasion, and she was tidy: white blouse, exceptionally cared for, as you no doubt understand of a woman in her position, with her fair hair, inherited from her mother who descended from the northern European countries, and whom, to no surprise, took great pride in her heritage, tucked behind her ears.

>>20440440
Subtly of the torture and rape. Nobody wants to read about a giant dildo jammed into an asshole giving bloody hemorrhoids.

But having said person groan in discomfort sitting the next day or the maid washing 12 pairs of bloody underwear is way more effective and still delivers the same message

>>20438964
one trick is to put what happens in that chapter in brackets
and then move on to the next chapter
after you are finished with the draft, you can come back and finish that chapter

Been writing this novel for a few years. Think I've finally nailed it. This is it, boys.

>The weather that day made me happy. It was very cheerful. Even though my relationship with my sister, Caroline, was strained, we went to some events. We wanted to feel free that day. A few times she disappointed or embarrassed me, but for the most part we had fun. She won some stuff from a carnival game. I was trying to be nice so I bought her dinner. When we got home, our mother was very angry with us for staying out so late. This upset us, and we realized we weren't as happy as we'd been pretending to be all day.


Let me know what you think.

>>20439260
half of writing is thinking of what to write

>>20439714
A woman sat in the hotel bar, her eyes riveted on the door. She wore nothing except a blouse, snow white, immaculately clean.

Post a RR link to your novel and I WILL read it.

>>20440564
https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/42627/retribution-engine

>>20440605
>COMPLETED
I kneel

>>20440532
nailed it

>>20440610
He's writing a sequel series so it's not ACTUALLY completed.

What is the ideal chapter length?

>>20440651
I usually go a little over 3k words.

>>20440511
>whom
10/10

Both happy and cheerful, I'd just stick with the weather was cheerful, all the things they do implies happy and the end will be more impactful imo. They go to "events" but mainly a carnival so why not be specific off the bat? Some of the sentences are rhythmically very similar too. But there's potential here, I think it just boils down to rearranging.

>>20440671
Meant for
>>20440532

>>20440626
Hey now
It's no less completed than the first two arcs of the Sword of Truth books, it still counts

My brain malfunctioned. Is there a fancy word for when you walk carefully between two things and try not to fall to either side? I think there was, but just can't remember it

>>20440765
Balancing

>>20440564
https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/54446/the-mystery-of-the-real-live-dead-person

>>20440774
Yeah, not that. Something like "walking a fine line", but punchier. Maybe there was no word like that

>>20440765
https://www.onelook.com/thesaurus/

>>20440795
Hey, it knows way more words than the other thesaurus. Thanks

>>20440788
straddling?

>>20440564
https://www.royalroad.com/profile/126344/fictions

I have two up at the moment. Symbiosis was just added.

Posted the first chapter of this in a thread a few days ago and you guys seemed to enjoy it. Here's the next two chapters of MAXIMUM PRICE

>>20440972
i would at least skim it if it weren't so obnoxiously formatted. you can indent or double newline between paragraphs... hell, you could even just do 1.5x spaces on newline. but you can't do neither and expect people to want to subject themselves to deciphering an ugly serif on size 12

>>20440985
irs not "obnoxiously formatted" its just not formatted at all beyond the default. but i'll throw you a bone and add indents to make it easier.
also size 13 not 12

Stuck on a romantic scene because I'm not feeling the least bit romantic. When the feeling is there its all good, but it aint there right now.

>>20440564
https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/22531/couplet

You guys need to dig a well before you’re thirsty.
Gain a following before you publish, or watch the drought your book causes.

>>20441116
>dear diary, today i:
>wrote: [ ]
>had sex: [ ]
>engaged brain: [ ]
>told /lit/ the same zoomer self-promo "yo bruh u gotta hustle" spiel i tell them every day: [x]

>>20441130
Dear /lit/ today I:
>wrote: [x]
>had sex: [x]
>engaged brain: [x]
>told /lit/ the same zoomer self-promo "yo bruh u gotta hustle" spiel i tell them every day: [x]
Lol, it’s not hard to multitask faggots! Fail to prepare and you prepare to fail.

>>20437966
where the fuck is inside creative writing #4
it's hidden on the youtube playlist

>>20441116
Can't I do that afterwards? My Twitter is just being followed by bunch of grifters wanting to sell me services and teenage girls that say they read but never posted a single book

>>20441175
>You guys need to dig a well before you’re thirsty.

>>20441175
I’m curious, what are you posting to attract both grifters and teenage girls? Are you a romance writer?

>>20438100
I don’t understand why people say that. F Gardner alone has written like a dozen books and he used to post here.

>>20441224
I could write an autistic rambling about a seventeen year old who finds a treasure chest and discovers it's filled with fleshlights, then has a hot orgy with a pile of twigs. But I while I am a "writer", I don't consider myself having done anything of value.

>>20441230
I read Call of the Arcade and it was coherent. Other than the commas it read fine. The twist was honestly interesting just because of how fucking insane it was. It was like a really long creepypasta.

>>20441211
No. Girls that read dominate Twitter. #booktwts and #booktok are just a bunch of teenage girls. They want "dark romantic fantasy" but not once have I seen a book from these people. They just seem to regurgitate what some review or YouTuber said.

That anon here again. Critique is welcome, of course.
https://pastebin.com/zDEfriWG

> Among avid readers surveyed by the AP, the typical woman read nine books in a year, compared with only five for men. Women read more than men in all categories except for history and biography.

>>20441248
Have you considered that only women use the hashtag, and plenty of males don’t use then but do read?

>NYGGA

>>20441238
Do you really think anyone is falling for these posts?

>>20441163
>he wants to watch the one where Butler clicks on the Pam Anderson sextape popup
It was taken down for a reason

>write book
>follow shill here who says to market
>take up twitter because it’s low effort
>it works
I still haven’t bought any ads though.
Nearing about 140 sales.

>>20441307
>Gardner is everyone meme

You are as exhausting as Gardner himself.

>>20441405
You really, really expect me to believe that on a board full of psuedointellectual failures who try and boast how many pieces of greek philosophy they've read, some horribly written and near-incoherent "meme" story that has been forced on people through paid advertisements is actually "natural" and not a "forced shilling"?
Fuck off.

>>20438016
the interaction is good but the narration is frequently superfluous or meaningless
>i needed some but had none
>having satisfied my obligation to be sociable
should be cut
>(rare)
is awkward

>>20441403
But initially, when you have zero followers what are you supposed to do?

>>20441434
I just made interesting posts in comments. After 100 followers I just made interesting posts on my timeline. Idk how other social media works, don’t want to either. Where did shill anon go?

>>20439467
>caring

Almost 140 sales in a month pretty good for me especially for a first book. I got to my goal of sub 100,000 best seller rank. Anyways, I’m going back to writing book 2. If anyone sees the shill again, thank him for me.

>>20441417
All advertisement is shilling. I suspect there’s been that in addition to Gardner being the first author to come from here. That clearly worked in his favor.

>>20439714
A neat and tidy woman watched the door from her seat at the bar. White blouse. Yellow hair tucked behind ears.

>>20441238
Call of the Arcade is his best work other than Jigoku. Gardner’s improved a lot.

>>20441508
>Gardner’s improved a lot.

>>20441116
My plan is to get my 4th draft done at which I can submit to beta readers Ive selected. Then I will build up website similar to a published friend of mine to prepare a monthly blog. Start my 2nd draft of the next novel for 4 weeks then once I get feedback and line edit I will contact agents. Already identified about 8 men that publish what I do but if I have to find a female agent why not.
I have a friend that does marketing so I could inflate a new insta account or something else but I might talk to a publicist first. From there its just a matter of writing, letting readers know what's coming, giveaways signings interviewing other writers then blogging about the writing process or what Im reading.

>>20441512
>Two lines in, already fucking up tenses
What the fuck. This is the most successful writer this place has produced?

>>20441512
I meant Jigoku. Call of the Arcade is one of his earliest works. I just happen to prefer it to Crocodile.
Sounds like you need to study and brush up on your Gardner lore.

>>20441544
>one of his earliest works
over the entirety of his, what... SIX MONTH career as a """""novelist"""""

>>20441531
Yes. A mentally ill flat earther is the most successful writer here. Welcome to 4chan.

>>20441548
Writing 11 books in such a short amount of time is hella impressive. I don’t get what you’re on about mate.

>>20441562
I can hit a keyboard for a few hours and create 100 novels.
Shut the fuck up Gardner.

>>20441550
Why the fuck am I hanging around here then.

>>20441474
Not a single person falls for your garbage, subhuman.

>>20441531
HE KEEPS FUCKING DOING IT

>>20441594
This is somehow even worse with the tenses. The first excerpt only shifted to past-tense once, then was otherwise present-tense. This one keeps flip-flopping.

>>20441512
>>20441508
>>20441405
>>20441238
>>20441224
>>20441594
>>20441582
>>20441572
>>20441562
>>20441544
Reminder to report all this shit as off topic. Shut the fuck up about that loser.

>>20441403
My twitter hasn't sold anything...

>>20441615
Screenshot your twitter or tell us your name. Maybe anons can help tell you what’s wrong.

>>20441594
Jigoku is awesome.

>>20441291
Men don't use twitter. The 20-34 Male demographic is neigh impossible to reach. Even professional teams of advertisers have difficulty reaching them. If men want something they just need to be aware of it. And that is best through hoping Bill Gates, Elon Musk, or some other prominent male starts an AMA, and hope he notices my tweet asking him to buy and read my book. I've been biding my time for Gates to do another AMA on reddit.

If he bites, it creates a domino effect where bunch of others will also follow suit and buy it as well

>>20441403
how do you find those stats?

>>20441652
>Men don't use twitter.
Based retardbro

New thread
>>20441673

>>20441614
Reminder to report for complaining. I support all /lit/ authors. Gardner isn’t any different just because he’s the biggest fish.

>inb4 “shut up Gardner”

Stop being an insufferable crab in a bucket. Everyone here is gonna make it. Call of the Crocodile and The Shitkickers have both inspired me to finish my own book. When I am done I will follow in their footsteps and hope my book can be memed to fame too.

>>20441680
Jeez, we're chatty today.

>>20441116
Why would I care about how my first book does? I'm not going to start releasing until I have six completed. Constant new releases working the algorithm will do more to promote me than any amount of Twitter shilling.

>>20439142
It emphasizes how young he is while simultaneously making it sound like he himself thinks it's a lot. Maybe. I'd have to see the context.
It adds a tone that wouldn't be present in the straightforward version. It's not a big thing, not necessary, but it's not purely fancy.

>>20441397
wtf

>>20440788
precarious?

What's the name of that site where you can look up words by meaning? I wanted to give my characters fitting names.

>>20439040
Trad west publishers*

>>20442269
I just used this
https://babynames.com/names/search.php