/lit/ - Literature

>>20306056
>Retards on /lit/:
>>Nietzsche was actually a Christian

Newfag to this board here, is this place like /x/ but for "refined" schizos?

>>20306056
Wish Nietzsche could have read Bloy. Christianity is based, but bourgeois Christianity is a blight.

>>20306056
that's from the anti-christ not twilight of the idols but ok. here is some related commentary actually from twilight:

>A drive to find causes is powerful in him: it must be somebody’s fault
that he’s feeling bad . . . Even his “beautiful indignation” does him good;
all poor devils like to whine—it gives them a little thrill of power. Even
complaints, the act of complaining, can give life the charm on account of
which one can stand to live it: there is a subtle dose of revenge in every
complaint; one blames those who are different for one’s own feeling bad,
and in certain circumstances even being bad, as if they were guilty of an
injustice, a prohibited privilege. “If I’m a lowlife, you should be one too”:
on this logic, revolutions are built.—

>>20306084
Refined schizo is a sizeable faction here

>>20306087
What are you on about? Nietzsche would have hated Bloy so much. I mean, I really like his Disagreeable Tales but have you read some of his non-fiction?

>>20306084
That's the entire website

>>20306056
Wow Op, radical take.

read antichrist #32 you faggot, he respected jesus, but didnt like the church. Learn how to read

>>20306056
>Nietzsche was actually a Christian
Such peoples' Christianity is typically limited to sexual morality, respect for tradition and deference to authority, like most right-wing e-Christians. The problem for e-Christians is that these elements can also be found in Islam, ancient polytheism, contemporary Hinduism in certain forms, Buddhism, and more. They fail to acknowledge that which is unique about Christianity, namely, its concern for victims (I am following Girard here). In fact this is precisely what they rail against, in many cases. But railing against concern for victims is a hard sell in a formerly-Christian society especially after the moral event(s) of WW2 and Civil Rights/Decolonization.

>>20306187
>he respected jesus, but didnt like the church
are you sure about that? cuz in one of those aphoristic books i'm pretty sure he talks about how great the church and the ottomans are because they're hierarchical power. a lot of nietzsche's problems just come from issues with his protestant dad and being sent to that military academy as a kid. not that he's wrong about anything.

>>20306056
Schopenhauer was transgender
Hegel was Latinx

>>20306204
do the fucking reading nigger, open the book, cite the aphorism, i gave you one and you are too busy trying to psychoanalyze.

i’ve never seen anyone say nietzsche was actually a christian

>>20306187
Jesus has nothing to do with Christianity to Nietzsche. Christianity is a Pauline subversion of Jesus and Plato.

>>20306084
Yes. /lit/ is essentially as twisted as /pol/ when it comes to its internal logic.

>>20306056
>Retards on /lit/:
>>Nietzsche was actually a Christian
literally no one has ever said that here

>>20306264
sorry dude i search and searched but couldn't find it i guess i imagined it but i swear it's in anti-christ or twilight of the idols somewhere. i think the context was that he liked the renaissance church cuz they didn't gaf about morality or something

>>20306204
>issues with his protestant dad and being sent to that military academy as a kid
His father died when he was 4-6 and he loved the military and would have pursued a career in it if his health permitted. Nietzsche's issues with Christianity come from his philological studies. Once he discovered Theognis of Megara, he realized that history was not what it seemed, that there was an ideological war being fought throughout it, and that the sentiment of the ancient nobility had been obscured out of resentment.

>>20306102
He would have taken a fucking knee to Bloy. He respected Dostoevsky, but he would have become a full blown trad Catholic if he'd read Bloy.

>>20306196
Real Christians have concern for victims, just not in a retarded SJW way. If you really read Girard you'd know this. Nietzsche crying about the pony is right-wing Christianity.

>>20306301
Read his letters to his Christian friend of his. Nietzsche actually had a tremendous respect for Christianity and his whole philosophy is just an edgy LARP.

Syphillis.

>>20306474
Respect for a church-going friend =/= respect for the Jewish cult designed to destroy Rome

>>20306459
Now I know you're baiting.

>>20306470
>>20306459
I love reading /lit/ posts :D

>>20306474
Can you show us any of what you claim? I don't remeber anything in his letters showing respect for Christianity.

>>20306635
Rome was gay as hell. I'm glad Jews mogged on that degeneracy.

>>20306647
Now I know you're semi-literate.

>>20306673
Imbecile that you are. I hate sharing this board with midwit zoomers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXOW2V7fI5w

>>20306675
based, fuck high IQ straight white males

>>20306056
Nietzsche was quite clearly Christian brah. He said the bible was the best German book eva lol

> For there is no shortage of reasons why it's precisely the German who rarely, and almost always too late, achieves a proficiency in speaking. It is appropriate therefore that the masterwork of German prose is the masterwork of its greatest preacher: up to this point, the Bible has been the best German book. In comparison with Luther's Bible, almost everything else is mere "literature" - something that did not grow in Germany and hence also did not grow and does not grow into German hearts, as the Bible has.

>>20306635
dude, what nietzsche never figured out is that christianity was a greek psyop to undermine rome and shift power back to the greek work. idk why he couldn't see that.

Every claim about Nietzsche can be supported or contradicted by at least one passage from his writings. The true retard is the one who doesn't see this and goes around saying Nietzsche was or was not x.

>>20306728
Nah Christianity was a Roman psyop that went horribly wrong

>>20306728
He was too busy chasing that skank Salome or whatever.

>>20306681
Christ only came for the poor, the rich people live off the blood of the poor! It is absolutely just to enjoy each death of the bourgeoisie in the Opéra-Comique fire! The evil exists and it governs the rich's soul!

>he showed a tremendous respect for Christianity in his letters!!!!
>can you show an instance of that?
>delivers a 50 hours blathering video

>>20306470
>Real Christians have concern for victims, just not in a retarded SJW way
Right, but the problem is that at least among the intelligentsia no one actually believes that Christianity is true, so all they have is the concern-for-victims programming radicalized by WW2 without any dogma to stop, for example, "math is racist" from being a widely-held viewpoint.

>>20306351
there you go, this some somewhat nietzschean

>>20306351
>there was only one Christian and he died on the cross

Nietzsche was a pascalian

>>20306956
aka Jesus is unrelated to "Christianity" as it is currently known

what does master slave morality mean

>>20306754
>Romans were so based, so based that they get wrecked by poor Jews

you self-own every time you make this argument and don't realize it

>>20306826
Beside the point. People have guilt because Germans went insane. Nietzsche pretended to be Polish because he knew Germans were insanely cringe.

>>20306056
For me, its the Nietzschean Christian Anarch.

>>20306056
>Retards on /lit/:
>>Nietzsche was actually a Christian
im a retard and i dont think that

Test

>>20306187
There was only one Christian and he died on the cross.

Don't know how he exactly comes to the conclusion but it's a cool quote.

>>20306056
He hates on it so much he must kind of love it, or at least be obsessed with it. Christianity is weakness, perversion etc etc. And on and on.
He's not a secret Christian, but he has the tendency, just like the Christian, to see Christianity in absolutely everything. The Christian claims Christianity is behind every single good invention that ever happened in the West. Nietzsche says it's behind every bad thing. He has the same retarded mindset as the Christcuck.

>>20306056
>The weak and the failures should perish: first principle of our love of humanity. And they should be helped to do this.
>What is more harmful than any vice? - Active pity for all failures and weakness - Christianity .

>>20308046

Nietzsche was a big time loser who benefited from the pity of his mommy and sister.

>>20306196
In practice it seems like Christians have varied quite a bit regarding extending tolerance and compassion to non-Christians.
There have been everything from pacifist Christians like the Anabaptists to Christian fascists.
Or everything from Marxist Liberation theologians ..... to Christian nationalists.
How much concern for victims is unique and intrinsic to Christianity given this variance of beliefs? And if all of Europe was for centuries overwhelmingly Christian, then how do we know when an idea is inherently caused by Christianity?

>>20306056
Yeah I'm thinking Ellul was based

>>20308076
>kept him alive far longer than he personally would have wanted
>took pictures of him during this abominable phase
"benefited"

>>20306793
christ lives off the blood of the poor

>>20306056
The trouble with Nietzsche is he is thinking but he wants to say he is not thinking. He is reasoning to make his case but he wants to say reasoning is for naught. He is doing metaphysics but he wants to say he is anti-metaphysics. The trouble is that there is no method, criteria to evaluate what he has to say. This is a critical flaw of the entire project, not a successful feature as his followers often say.

>>20308083
Ellul is everyones based grandfather. The levels of based he achieved while maintaining a catholic identity are to be lauded. lauded, I say.

>>20308328
His project has no basis. It is purely a critique. But this critique has pre-suppositions and shows a certain worldview hidden behind the critique. Nietzsche is hiding his metaphysics behind the form of critique, so it is ultimately hard to take it seriously. His thought has mostly wound up being used as a method of deconstruction by resentful individuals against what was the constructive, rational form of social organization. His philosophy never made it beyond that. The overman never appeared because it is a fiction created by a form of critique of something else.

>>20308046
Now watch as those seeking to define the "weak and the failures" squabble among each other and eat their own, then are deposed as said "weak failures" usurp them. In truth, there is nothing worth preserving anywhere. Even the noblest realities are just an equilibrium of insufficiency.

>>20308338
>while maintaining a catholic identity

Are you fucking retarded? How can you read Ellul and say this. Dumbass retard. He explicitly sides with Protestantism and Calvinism. You're insanely fucking stupid.

Can't believe this board is so dumb sometimes.

>>20308395
be quiet fuckface, it's not like christian denominational disputes are even relevant anymore. Point is he found a way to hold the whole Christian thing together despite all the intellectual challenges

>>20308414
You literally said Catholic. Don't talk about Ellul. You don't know anything at all. You're embarrassingly stupid.

>>20308421
where did the priest touch you, show me on the doll

Literally nobody says Nietzsche was a Christian

>>20308426
You're so stupid. Imagine reading Ellul and then saying he was Catholic. I bet you think Rabbi Schneerson is Catholic too. Absolute moron and you should be ashamed of yourself.

>>20308328
>>20308350
His philosophy was never anti-thought, anti-reason, or anti-metaphysics. He criticized these things because he was against those who promoted them to a degree of importance they didn't deserve and to re-emphasize what was lost in that process.

>>20308442
I read half of propaganda ok? why don't you confess a sin you fucking faggot

>>20308453
Why do you think I'm Catholic? I'm just pointing out the glaring error in your posts. No one with half a brain could read Ellul and say he's Catholic. Learn to read, idiot.

>>20308480
I can tell your a prot faggot based on the glee you get from scolding. I pray to god you're not some muslim fucking larp. Die in a hole fuck you

>>20308491
Calls me a Catholic now calls me a Prot, now calls me a Muslim, all because he literally can't read and went around saying something embarrassingly stupid.

I bet you think Dostoevsky was Catholic.

>>20308338
>ellul
>catholic

>>20308504
The Spirit is denied to you. don't tell me ur some sort of jew

>>20308526
i'm sorry okay guess I read that in

>>20307641
good job, you did the reading

One of the major themes of Also sprach Zarathustra was an absolute dismantling of Christianity and its morals and values.

>>20307745
>Christcuck
Seethe

>>20309048
This. If I remember, Nietzsche liked the Old Testament, but unsure how anyone who read him can consider him a Christian or even a sympathizer.

>>20306056
>Retards on /lit/:
>>Nietzsche was actually a Christian
Literally no one says this. Literally no one says this. Literally NO ONE says this. Literally no one says this. Literally no one says this. Literally no one says this.

>>20309250
There are people in this very thread arguing for it

>>20306056
>implying Nietzsche was talking about literal christianity

>>20309322
Redpill me on metaphorical christianity

Why do Christfags have to do this? No one except the trannies feels the need to subsume everyone into their club, especially when it flies in the face of reason. To read Nietzsche and to conclude that he was actually a Christian makes no sense and is in fact, cucked as fuck.

>>20306187
>read antichrist #32 you faggot, he respected jesus
read Zarathustra 'On Voluntary Death' you faggot, his respect implied, that Jesus would have forsaken his own teaching, were he to live longer. Because he was "noble enough" for that.

>but didnt like the church
read antichrist #61 you faggot, he liked it during the Renaissance.
"Cæsar Borgia as pope!... Am I understood?"

>>20306056
>Retards on /lit/:
>Nietzsche was actually a Christian
I've never seen a single poster claim this.

>>20306056
>The materialistic error was probably unavoidable at first. Since the throne of God could not be discovered among the galactic systems, the inference was that God had never existed. The second unavoidable error is psychologism: if God is anything, he must be an illusion derived from certain motives—from the will to power, for instance, or from repressed sexuality. These arguments are not new. Much the same thing was said by the Christian missionaries who overthrew the idols of heathen gods. But whereas the early missionaries were conscious of serving a new God by combatting the old ones, modern iconoclasts are unconscious of the one in whose name they are destroying old values. Nietzsche thought himself quite conscious and responsible when he smashed the old tablets, yet he felt a peculiar need to back himself up with a revivified Zarathustra, a sort of alter ego, with whom he often identifies himself in his great tragedy Thus Spake Zarathustra. Nietzsche was no atheist, but his God was dead. The result of this demise was a split in himself, and he felt compelled to call the other self “Zarathustra” or, at times, “Dionysus.” In his fatal illness he signed his letters “Zagreus,” the dismembered god of the Thracians. The tragedy of Zarathustra is that, because his God died, Nietzsche himself became a god; and this happened because he was no atheist. He was of too positive a nature to tolerate the urban neurosis of atheism. It seems dangerous for such a man to assert that “God is dead”: he instantly becomes the victim of inflation.34 Far from being a negation, God is actually the strongest and most effective “position” the psyche can reach, in exactly the same sense in which Paul speaks of people “whose God is their belly” (Phil. 3:19). The strongest and therefore the decisive factor in any individual psyche compels the same belief or fear, submission or devotion which a God would demand from man. Anything despotic and inescapable is in this sense “God,” and it becomes absolute unless, by an ethical decision freely chosen, one succeeds in building up against this natural phenomenon a position that is equally strong and invincible. If this psychic position proves to be absolutely effective, it surely deserves to be named a “God,” and what is more, a spiritual God, since it sprang from the freedom of ethical decision and therefore from the mind. Man is free to decide whether “God” shall be a “spirit” or a natural phenomenon like the craving of a morphine addict, and hence whether “God” shall act as a beneficent or a destructive force.

>>20309995
>he signed his letters “Zagreus,” the dismembered god of the Thracians. The tragedy of Zarathustra is that, because his God died, Nietzsche himself became a god
Makes sense. "Zarathustra" is the closest to an actually cool scripture, that one can whole-heartedly embrace.
Definitely better than the Bible.

>>20306084
Absolutely, yes. Damn, "refined schizos". I'm stealing that.

>>20310032
>Zarathustra
>better than the Bible
Dude how old are you?

>>20306187
The only Christian died on the cross
All the rest are slave moralists
>BuT aT lEaSt hE LikEd JeeBuS

>>20306056

Consider this. 4 is a magic number. Al the pantheon are ruled by 4 Gods. We got Zeus Father, some God that we murdered again, The Holy Spirit and And you know who.
So... Some people say Xtianity is a secret cult of you know who, you are a educated person.

>>20309995
jung really is underrated, its a shame hes fallen out of favor lately due to reddit

Nietzsche affirmed Christianity by striving for its absolute negation as it is only in the nil that you can hear God speak.

God is the abyss staring back.

>>20306742
Nietzsche hated life

>>20310104
>Al the pantheon are ruled by 4 Gods. We got Zeus Father, some God that we murdered again, The Holy Spirit and And you know who.
Odin, Baldr, Hoenir and Loki?

>>20310197
odin is the father correct, but both thor and baldr were compared to christ by the norse themselves, take your pick. holy spirit is so vague in christianity itself its kinda hard to pin to any pagan deity. really could be anything. i used to assume heimdall, but he has more in common with gabriel. loki is obviously satan, surtr has some attributes of his as well, not the least being etymological. odin also shares some aspects with michael, and many times in germany he was compared with michael. its difficult to determine which of the pagan deities are angels, and which are true gods. if you really want to compare trinities, the pagan trinity is odin, ville and ve. sadly we know very little of the others, but it is clear their names form some kind of union. wotan, meaning fury, anger or inspiration. ville, will or willpower, intent and purpose. ve, a shrine, or the feeling of faith in general. those seem much more analogous to the father, the son and the holy spirit, but again, we know far too too little on this matter.

>>20310238
>>20310197
also odin shares many similarities to christ making things more confusing.

>>20306084
Based and /threadpilled

>>20306187

He literally said Jesus was an anarchist. He despised anarchists and describes Jesus as everything related to slave morality.

>>20310032
>Definitely better than the Bible.
Much better than the NT at least. The OT has its moments though (which Nietzsche agreed with) and is a formidable competitor.

>>20306084
Refined schizophrenia is what makes /lit/ great.