/lit/ - Literature

Infinite jest was convoluted shit.

Reading modern fiction is like eating out of dumpsters.

>I like reading about quests and dragons and medieval settings, and I don't feel the need to pretend I'm above them.

so it's genuine when you like them but not genuine when you don't?

no one cares about your faggot rant

>>2028537
Nowhere did I come close to making that argument.

What if you feel the main problem with genre fiction, particularly fantasy, is that most authors substitute fully-fleshed out and realistic characters for spectacular settings and bizarre races. Generally, I find fantasy to be the Michael Bay subset of literature.

>>2028551
A large number of fantasy I've read has both. Though, yes, most fantasy does focus more on world-building than other genres. I hardly think it's fair to compare this to michael Bay, who relies on a few action set pieces. Crafting an elaborate world take imagination and attention to detail.

And why is realism so desirable?

Anyone who uses the word trope incorrectly on a literature board should be shot

>>2028523
Unless you know where to look

>>2028562

Realism in the context of characters making believable decisions and realistic actions. They can be as unrealistic with their characters powers, the world itself and so forth but if the characters are not realistic in the sense as understandable and believable people then the piece is usually extremely flawed.

I actually find that genre fiction is closer to classic literature than contemporary "literary" fiction, which has degenerated into incessant navel-gazing.

>>2028575
That's because you're a stupid child who doesn't watn to think about what he's reading

I enjoyed American Psycho more than Crime and Punishment.

>>2028574
I've never found fantasy to have a disproportionate lack of believable characters compared to other segments of literature.

>>2028583
Modern "serious books" don't give the reader much to think about besides the author's coming of age in suburban ennui.

>>2028592
That's because Franzen or whomever is the only author you read

>>2028601
I'd say the reason Cormac McCarthy is as good as he is is because he knows the power of writing within a genre.

Michael Chabon is boring.

i tried to read neuromancer but gave up after about 80 pages, it is nearing unintelligible to me and just plain dull.

i enjoy the work of bill bryson.

I don't like transgressive fiction. Ballard, Ellis, Palahniuk - all of them can suck my balls.

Naked Lunch is like someone got a novel then turned each sentence into a fridge magnet. Then they rearranged the novel in a totally random order and sold it to people.

>>2028608
I'd say you should read more criticism.

>>2028647
I have an BA in English. That killed any love I may have ever had for contemporary literary criticism.

I like Jonathan Franzen

Dostoevsky is a poor storyteller and a mediocre philosopher at best but quite decent at parables. He rewrote the same novels and characters again and again until he got in right in Brothers Karamazov.

Raymond Chandler's mysteries are only good as uniquely-styled noir novels. As mysteries they are convoluted messes.

>>2028650
>I have an BA in English
I lol'd

I really love reading children's literature but I hate young adult novels. I don't even know myself where the divide really is.

I could care less about the genre fiction vs. literary fiction rivalry. I read a little of both, probably a lot fewer of the former, but not because I think any less of it.

I have gotten into a habit of only reading books less than 300 pages and I feel like I'll never be able to read a long novel again.

Sometimes I look at what I'm reading or have just bought and think to myself, "Damn, I am eclectic and cultured." I never express the feeling to anyone else, but I'm probably getting a big head over it.

there is no god

I like to eat cheese and read books about mice that solve mysteries.

I like to eat mice and read books about cheese

I think Ellis and Palahniuk are quite talented.

Comic books should be considered literature.

Did not care for Neuromancer at all. In fact, it soured me on cyberpunk literature in general. I would rather watch Blade Runner or Minority Report.

I used to think John Steinbeck was really good.

>>2028385
You're thread is already dead

I feel an epic thread is in the making!

>>2028708

>implying Steinbeck didn't spit the realest shit spoke i ever heard put on paper ever

>>2028709
I think Cyberpunk works best in visual medium.

Watch Bubblegum Crisis or play Shadow Run on the SNES.

Fantasy was born and died with Tolkien. Everything afterwards is derivative escapism and not worth the time of any serious appreciator of literature.

Wallace was a pompous hack and IJ is an impenetrable mess of boringness.

>>2028752
Read Lord Dunsany, or George Macdonald, who came before Tolkien.

>>serious appreciator of literature.

Fucking wanker.

>>2028745
Definitely agree that the genre is greatly enhanced when visuals are applied. In addition to movies, video games, and anime... the comic books Transmetropolitan also has some fantastic cyberpunk imagery. It also has shades of Gibson's bright yet grungy Tokyo, which was the best part of Neuromancer IMO.

>>2028745
>Watch Bubblegum Crisis or play Shadow Run on the SNES.
>Watch
>play
>SNES
>Bubble Gum Crisis
There was so much fuck in what you said.
>Implying Bubble Gum Crisis was a worth watching show
>Implying Bubble Gum Crisis can be considered cyberpunk
>Implying Bubble Gum Crisis can be compared with any of the brilliant cyber punk stories out there
>Implying you can compare watching or playing things to /lit/

>>2028769
>implying you aren't a faggot.

>>2028769
Get off Bruce Sterling's cock.

If Cory Doctorow can be a successful sci-fi writer, anyone can.

>>2028757
I like only having art in my cyber/steampunk books........................
The only Cyberpunk movie, that I feel like has worked, is Blade Runner.
The movie is widely credited for creating cyberpunk.

>>2028385
Everyone should be more tolerant and if you disagree you will be mutilated.

>>2028774

Steven king is America's Best Living writer.

I'm tired of having to defend my love of Orson Scott card's books because he said something politically incorrect about the queers.

>>2028755
It was born as in it was brought mainstream. And what's wrong with being a serious appreciator? A serious appreciator of music wouldn't be listening to Nickelback just as a serious appreciator of literature wouldn't be reading escapist drivel.

>>2028791
It's sad that you had to make up a pompous label to justify your own taste.

Wouldn't a serious reader read whatever he could and judge it by it's own merits?

When it comes to bloging? Yes, your right. I should have stated my issues with his remark in a more dignified manner. I often despise it when others are quik to anger in debating issues, so on that note I would like to apologise to...
>>2028745
...for my brut anger, but I will not say sorry for disagreeing with you ifor the most part.

You guys know Blade Runner is based off a book called Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Do_Androids_Dream_of_Electric_Sheep%3F

>>2028791
The fantasy that OP is talking about is dribble. I could go sit down right now, write 300 pages utter adventue none sense, throw a couple of elfs or dragons in the mix, go to a main stream fantasy publisher and make thousands of dollars. For the most part, I hate every Fantasy bokk these days. They say nothing about anything.

>>2028821

Then do it. Use a pseudonym and do it.

>>No.2028819
Haha You used wiki as a source.
The blu-ray special featurs said somthin of the sort like that, so yes. Also the writer of Never Let Me Go was publicity criticised, questioned, and analyzed for copying or refereeing to the book Blade Runner was based on. I've known about the movie/book since I was Five; 1997.

>>2028826
I do plan on writing many shor/novel stories in my life time, so once or if I am somewhat recognized I will go under another penn name write a Fantasy Fart, have a huge luanch of it, have a fan convention with a little media coverage, and the expose the truth that I had created a hoax book to prove the fact that Fantasy fans will gargle down any piece of garbage and still love it.

>>2028863

Ok man, that is a fucking awesome idea! Let me have your babies please!!!

>>2028821
>>2028863
>>2028870

You remind me of this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xw2T1jx8kzo

>>2028863

You'll do nothing. Posting this idea anonymously in this thread is as far as it will ever go. You haven't the talent, focus, or creativity to take it any further than an idea. You no better than Deep&Edgy, you think you're cleverly trolling fans of a genre, writing thousands of words on 4chan, words that aren't being put to use with the actual ideas you espouse.

>>2028870
you be trollin?.....

>>2028885
if you can't tell, i don't know what to say.

>>2028819
>>2028839

Wow, you two are idiots

i miss my tripfriends

>>2028880
Ah-ha-ha I love that skit of his In honesty though your right my grammer is terrible right now. I'm posting through a PS3. I have some disabilities that enhibiet me to struggle with many thing; this includes spelling. Normaly I would be using word and spell check as well as other software to help me, but like I said I'm posting through a PS3. I'm doing my best at the moment.
>>2028883
Good Sir!,
I am a man of action. One dsy I will become a writer and my plans will take flight. "I don't need to fight to prove I'm right and I don't need to be forgiven."
No matter what you say to me at this point will hinder me from my goals.
Responding to anything else you say would be meaningless.

"Escapism" is not a dirty word, and broadly encompasses all literature.

FUCK A DUCK
2028903 here
*will NOT hinder

Infinite Jest is my favourite book

>>2028914
I do no such thing. I'm normaly on /jp/ and they all know me as Dissability-san

Whoever came up with the pretty recent distinction made between so-called 'literary' fiction and 'genre' fiction needs an epic beatdown.

I miss /r9k/

>>2028939
Agreed. Sometimes, I can't help but think that /lit/ received the brunt of the so-called "gentlemen" of r9k upon its demise. I wish they were still over there instead of here.

>>2028955
I think /adv/ has taken more of the really annoying ones. I think most of the /r9k/ immigrants on here are at least decent. It was a good board... at times... although by the time it died it was pretty terrible.

>>2028385
>I like reading about quests and dragons and medieval settings, and I don't feel the need to pretend I'm above them. I love that the same fucking story over and over and come from tweaking a few familiar themes.

FTFY

>>2028965
But that's not at all what I've meant. You've obscured my intentions rather than clarifying them.

I don't think I've ever read a book I really hated. Not like movies or music. Not sure why this is... Didn't even mind reading The Fountainhead or Scarlett Letter in HS. I don't understand how you guys can have such strong opinions about books. Particularly stuff like Infinite Jest which Wallace obviously put a lot of work into.

I feel like I've been reading just for the sake of it
Like I'm not even getting anything out of books anymore, I just read them to tell people that I've read a lot of decent literature

The last young adult series that ever got me excited to read was Abarat and I've never been able to like any other books in the age group since. The next book is coming out soon and I'm a bit worried that I might lose interest at this rate

I like David Sedaris, Jonathan Franzen, Michael Chabon, and David Foster Wallace and I think someone should photoshop all of their faces into one guy

I'm an aspiring writer and I'm trying to model my writing style off that of Japanese authors, despite being very not Japanese.

>I hate that David Sedaris's self-indulgent style has become popular.

It was kinda funny the first one or two books, but nowadays he's published once-or-twice per year in The New Yorker--in addition to his books' publishings--and it's just the most awful, contrived, stream-of-consciousness SHIT imagineable.

THANK YOU OP. FOR HELPING ME GET THAT OFF MY CHEST.

>>2029084
Which Japanese authors in particular?