/lit/ - Literature

why isn't the bible #1 in /lit/'s top 100?
it doesn't even break the top ten
I knew you were all godless heathens here
https://www.26reads.com/list/77231-lits-top-100-books-of-all-time

>>20277664
I remember reading John in NKJV when I was a kid out of those Spirit-Filled Life Bibles.

When I became an adult and actually interested in the Bible I started reading KJV because that is what everyone else used.

>>20277664
Reminder: if you put any church tradition, ritual, doctrine, or dogma over the teachings of Christ, you missed the point of Christianity.

>>20277897
>its okay to contradict Christ because at least you aren't being controversial
You are mistaken.

Proverbs 27:15 A continual dropping in a very rainy day and a contentious woman are alike. 16 Whosoever hideth her hideth the wind, and the ointment of his right hand, which bewrayeth itself.

What Bible websites do you use to help read and understand parts of the Bible? By this I mean explaining the cultural context of certain parts and also explaining parts that have layered meaning.

>>20277919
I don't get it.

>>20277919
Kek

>>20277924
4chan.org

>>20277924
biblehub helps, by having a few commentaries and the original (about specific verses)

>>20277924
Bible Hub. Each verse has its own page of parallel translations. At the bottom of each of those is an original language breakdown. Click on any word in the breakdowns and see every other instance of that word in the original languages throughout the Holy Bible.

Click on a particular translation (KJV, ESV, NASB, NLT, LXX, NRSV, YTL, etc.) and just start reading the Holy Bible. There are commentaries, and a library of books. It's the overall finest Holy Bible resource ever. The main things I miss from its offerings are 1) accounts and saving verses, making notes, etc. and 2) audio of the Holy Bible being read. That one is actually in the works, as part of the Berean Bible projects.
>>20277897
I looked up that book on YT and found this fellow. I am interested enough to perhaps read a bit. I still have a good many of these videos left, but the first two are jam packed with worthwhile information/considerations.

>>20277998
Forgot to include the link to the YT playlist:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLK1gOYgViC5DIS-6aFofqCb7yNFEUxDaV
Also, while I'm waiting for the countdown:
>>20277925
>doesn't have much direct experience w/ women

>>20277599 #
Yeah at some Baptist churches it's just that.
It varies.
Baptists are hard to pin cause they are so apt to try and be as independent as possible

>>20278081
That other anon is describing Pentecostals.

Bible bros, I have a question... Pardon my following ignorance.
I (A non-believer) just picked up a KJV knowing nothing of the bible. Do I just start reading? Is this the first step to take into Christian cannon? I just want to understand more of Christianity and all /lilt/ says about the bible. Am I in too deep?

>>20278428
>Do I just start reading?
Yes, if you know anything of Western art, literature, culture, it should resonate somewhat with you.
However, if you want to get the most out of a Bible I would highly recommend getting a study Bible that explains some of the more obtuse passages.
Personally, I use The Didache Bible with commentary based on the Catechism, but if you do like the KJV translation (and despite being Catholic I don’t think I will ever think there’s anything wrong with it, it was the first one I read and it’s still the word inspired by God regardless) I’ve heard very good things about the Thomas Nelson KJV study Bible.

https://youtu.be/wZlc0k1Ewpo

>>20278428
>Do I just start reading?
Yes.
>Is this the first step to take into Christian cannon?
That could arguably be seen as perhaps either Matthew, or John. Heck, sometimes even Luke or Mark depending on certain foundational particulars being differently prioritized by various types of individual approach. For instance, I think John is by far the most effective, concentrated introduction to the greatest depths that Christianity holds, in terms of the "mystical". And, in fact, I myself tend to advise towards John and Revelation being the first reads altogether, then maybe Genesis on ward into the OT, while simultaneously alternating for relatively short NT sessions. At some point you'll start getting a personal feel for where you want to go, sequentially.

But then there are others whom suggest, for instance, starting with Mark as it is considered by "scholars" to have been the earliest Gospel. So, perhaps *it* should be "the first step in Christian canon". See what I mean?

But then, one must not neglect to bow before Luke and Acts together, being the source for most of the "story narrative drama novelization" material, since it is essentially "the sequel to the 4 gospels", in quite the sense.

It's a lot, what you have ahead of you, and takes some *serious* time to even *begin* to...*understand* any of it, even though a great many have certain arrays of pride and ignorance in their self and "God" views, and *think* they are understanding things just fine and that it's all just a bunch of ridiculous nonsense. They will not see God (Matthew 5:8).
>KJV
Already beginning with wisdom. May ye be blessed in ways unexpected.

>>20277897
>be a real christian
>don’t get baptized

WHAT?!

All joking aside. This is a glow shill divide and conquer post.

These filthy godless commie liberals are trying to empty our Churches out!

Are there any Anglicans here? I’m trying to find a Church to go and worship at.
If it helps, I’m English and have been looking at either Anglicanism or Catholicism, I’m not baptised and am looking to further deepen my faith.

Protestant nations are richer and more prosperous the their Catholic counterparts. Really makes you think...

>>20278745
>baptism isn't part of Jesus' teachings

>>20278787
That's because it costs more to be heterosexual.

Is there a better alternative to e-Sword? I'm happy with it, I just want to see if there's anything better for somebody working toward fluency.

>>20278787
>worldly standards
Meaningless

>>20278842
Try living without them, and then report back.

>>20278842
then why is the vatican so concerned with the fiscal polity of the holy see, would not the church's outreach ride on the merit of its morals alone? why the penny pinching?

>>20279060
This, why were the investing in the production of the Elton John movie and apparently many others through a vatican bank program for profiting off of Satanic Babylonian filth?

>>20278812
What are you even saying

>>20279216
Well, Catholic places are less economically successful because there is less drive for it, because being homosexual costs less. To be heterosexual requires living in a place that is prosperous and advanced enough to create containment zones called "cities", and then the heterosexual can afford to buy a nice piece of land far enough away and start beefing up defenses in case of attack. All the other side needs is makeup and hair products, which is far less expensive on the whole.

>>20277281
Christianity and science coexist perfectly well.

>>20277924
Biblehub and the ESVSB.

>>20278773
There are a few of us. The main difference between the two is that Roman Catholics believe in the infallibility of the Pope, at least until the last 50 years. Either church will be happy for you to rock up and learn more.

>>20278428
Keep track of what you've read so you can read it all.

>>20278428

>>20277812
>why isn't the bible #1 in /lit/'s top 100?
It is.

>>20278787
>Satan bribes you with wealth and then leads your countries to atheism
>this means revolutionism good
The meek shall inherit the earth.

I just realized that according to the Bible, the first murderer was a Jew

>>20279493
News flash: according to the Bible, the first everything was "a Jew".

>>20277924
https://www.blueletterbible.org/

>>20278831
I haven't actually used that yet, is it any good or worth using?

>>20279493
Where was Cain called a Jew in the Bible?

>>20279505
The word "Jew" or "Jews" isn't even present in the first 11 books of the Bible.

>>20278787
>greed good
KYS

>>20279493
>For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: but he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
>Romans 2:28-29 KJVAAE
https://bible.com/bible/546/rom.2.28-29.KJVAAE
>For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.
>Philippians 3:3 KJVAAE
https://bible.com/bible/546/php.3.3.KJVAAE

>>20279722
>KJVAAE
Is this like LGBTAAIPQ++, where you just keep extending the acronym?

>>20277664
I'm currently using a Thomas Nelson translation study bible, however, I definitely prefer the KJV for liturgy

>>20277664
>what was the first Bible you read and which is your favourite translation?
Guess I'll actually answer op.
First bible I ever read I guess technically was those picture bibles with the summary of a story from the Bible for kids
First real Bible I ever got was KJV (looked at it the other day, could've swore it was NKJV). Have always used a kjv since though I do sometimes open up an niv if I'm having trouble understanding a verse.
I read kjv for the poetic language, but I have also not found one that I think is any better translation wise.

>>20279785
>I'm currently using a Thomas Nelson translation study bible
They have their own translation now? What's it called?
Seems publishing houses are developing their own Bible translations more and more frequently

>>20279774
Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.
Titus 1:15 KJVAAE
https://bible.com/bible/546/tit.1.15.KJVAAE

>>20279794
The Thomas Nelson translation is the NKJV, is it not? From back in the 80s?

>>20279815
Ah it seems so, didn't know it was them.

>god

>>20277281
Anon if you ask me I think you're being acted upon by evil entities trying to keep your natural desire for God suppressed. Can't be too careful in this age of apostasy and evil.
>>20277664
I like KJV, but any translation that keeps the richness of the older tongues is nice. I imagine God speaking with "ye" and "thou", so thematically it helps me center and focus on the material.

Figured out why Christianity is dying lads - there are literally no good non-Evangelical online resources related to it. Fucking lazy stuck in the stone age churches. I can find more comprehensive information and discussion about hand-drawn fetish doujins and random pre-internet sportsball games than the 2,000 year old church of 2 and a half billion people.

>>20277664
>no Pidgin bible
Absolute heathen pleb.

>>20280501
Agreed, the online resources for Catholicism are weak compared to counterparts. EWTN is the closest thing to it but they aren’t officially “The Church”. The best thing is so attend mass and read physical books I guess.

How do I begin the conversion to Catholicism? My parents took me to mass for a year when I was very young but before I ever did my RCIA or got baptized they left the church and took me with(probably 4 or 5 years old). Now I’m 27 and want to go back.

Translation based on the Gottingen Septuagint when?

>>20280655
Talk to a priest. Drop by a local church during daylight hours, or look up your diocese's pastoral center (or whatever its called in your area). They should have someone on staff to direct you, and most likely a priest to welcome you. If you were been baptized a Catholic, and if you desire it, stop by your local church on Saturday -- check its website/newsletter for days/hours, but most places do Saturday afternoon -- and go to confession. You only need be baptized, of sufficient age (you are), and repentant of your sins. A good confession needs only be: number of sins, and kind of sins. Look up what mortal sins are, you should absolutely confess those. Don't be ashamed, God loves you. A typical confession may look like:
>On two occasions I lied for personal gain.
>On one occasion I consented to an abortion.
>On many occasions (if you don't know, or there's too many) I committed a sin of lust (ie, objectification of a human body part, ie consuming pornography)
>On many occasions I committed the sin of drunkenness.
Etc etc. The important thing is you are actually repentant for all of them, even the ones you honestly can't remember. You don't have to confess if you don't want to, but you really should. If you don't like the priest you don't have to. If he asks you to confess to him face to face in an open room, that is not legal according to the code of canon law. Go to another priest.

Good luck anon, and God is with you.

I should add: yeah, you'll go through RCIA.

Kids don't, they go through a much longer catechism process before being sacramentally confirmed around age 12-13.

So exciting anon, I hope you come back.

>>20280667
>Gottingen Septuagint
Always sounded like a meme to me. The Rahlf's isn't good enough for """scholars""" but it's good enough for the German BIble Society to sell it to the laity alongside the NA28 which apparently is also for """scholars"""?

>>20280688
>>20280694
Thank you anon. I have so many sins I’ve lost track of them. So lost that there’s sins that have become second nature I it doesn’t even register to myself that it’s a sin…

>>20280706
If you have not been baptized, set that up ASAP. Like today. Now if possible.

>>20277664
bump

>>20280706
Forgive those who have sinned against you.

>>20278467
Is the Thomas Nelson translation the most popular? I seemed to have grabbed that one by accident so thats good ig. Will look into study bibles thank you.
>>20278717
Thank you brother. Glad to have now at least a vague direction rather than be put off by stumbling around through it. Your words do not fall upon deaf ears.
>>20279343
I should keep track because I'll be skipping around, not reading in order right?"

>>20281222
Thomas Nelson is just a publisher. Yeah they're fairly popular. My wife has one of their bibles and it seems well made. I believe the same company that owns zondervan owns them (and iirc its news corp)
If you decide to go the study Bible route just be aware all notes regardless of what you choose will have the author of the notes' biases. Just because they say a verse means something doesn't mean it's unanimous agreement amongst all Christians (prime example Romans 8:30). That said study bibles can be very informative/helpful as well as can the cross references in the margins. Just gotta pray and be sure you're reading the Bible first not second to the notes

I've heard people say that the ancient jews only believed in sheol (which sounds like purgatory).
Not heaven or hell
If this is correct then why is Elijah said to have been swept up to Heaven, and Enoch translated? Is it just modern revisionism? Seems like sheol is simply a reference to the physical body's grave, not the Spirit's. Or do I got it all backwards?

>>20281222
No, because you'll forget what you've read. You know how our minds play tricks, you'll end up reading Matthew chapter 1 over and over.

>>20280501
> Figured out why Christianity is dying lads
It’s mainly because the end times are drawing near. Jesus said the love would grow cold and there would be mass apostasy. The modern man thinks himself to be god and the highest authority. He is too proud to humble himself before God. It’s only going to get worse. Buckle up

I'm a christianlet, thus far I thought Christ was literally God in human flesh, but then I got to the passage where his disciples ask him when the Day of Judgement is coming, and he plainly answers that this only the Father could possibly know.
I don't get the Trinity bros. My impression was that even if Christ wasn't really God, his link to the Father was absolute. All the Father knew the Son would've known as well.

>>20277664
We need a christfag containment board.

>>20281488
The very Gospels people quote to say that Jesus isn’t God because He doesn’t know the hour, ironically, prove that He is God via the things He says and does that are prophecies from Isaiah, or passages that refer to the Lord (Yahweh) quoted and applied to Jesus. The debunk doesn’t work. There are several explanations. One is that Jesus is basically telling them not to even ask Him about the hour, since it is not for humans to know. This is supported in Acts when someone asks the disciples when something in the future will happen:
> Then they gathered around him and asked him, “Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?”
>He said to them: “It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority.
It’s also been said that the Son did not know of His own, but derivatively from the Father, whose will the Son always follows, and from the Father the Son gets everything He has as only-begotten Son from the Father. Read John 5 to see an example of Jesus deferring to the Father in everything. We can also see Jesus doing things like reading minds, forgiving sins and being accused of making Himself God in the Synoptics—because He was the Son

>>20281488
Christ is God.
In the flesh He is "giving up"(subjecting it unto the Father) the omniscience part.

Yeah the trinity is really hard to understand. Best way I can think of it is, God wears many hats. The father, the son, and the Holy Spirit
Kinda like how a grandpa is a grandfather and a father at the same time. Still its hard to understand
>Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father? Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake.
John 14:8-11
I think that it's something we can't fully grasp because we are human, not God. As it says his ways are higher than ours. We can't really even understand his love for us.
>For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.
>But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Romans 5:7-8
And if we can't even understand his love for us due to our own imperfections, how can we know how he is as a being?

>>20281533
Meant for >>20281488

>>20281533
Why the differentiation between the Father and the Holy Spirit?
The unpardonable sin is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.
My layman understanding is that the Holy Spirit symbolizes the truth of the Word, and people who know it but still deny it have committed the unpardonable sin. That's what I gathered from Mark 3 at least.

>>20281553
>Why the differentiation between the Father and the Holy Spirit?
Because Jesus refers to it as its own thing, specifically as a He
>And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
John 14:16-18
>But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
John 14:26
>Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
John 16:13

>>20281533
In general, those sorts of analogies tend to be sort of Modalist. There is a better one describing the sun, being made up of the substance of the sun, the Father, the light of the sun, the Son, and the heat of the sun, the Holy Spirit.

>>20281586
That's a pretty good analogy.
Hadn't heard that one before

>>20277897
idk about his pic but the text is right:

1 Corinthians 10-15

10 I appeal to you, brothers and sisters,[a](T) in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another in what you say and that there be no divisions among you,(U) but that you be perfectly united(V) in mind and thought. 11 My brothers and sisters, some from Chloe’s household(W) have informed me that there are quarrels among you. 12 What I mean is this: One of you says, “I follow Paul”;(X) another, “I follow Apollos”;(Y) another, “I follow Cephas[b]”;(Z) still another, “I follow Christ.”

13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized in the name of Paul?(AA) 14 I thank God that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus(AB) and Gaius,(AC) 15 so no one can say that you were baptized in my name.

We Christians gotta stick together even across confessions

>>20277897
Does this book name the jew

Once a Son, Always a Son. But you are not born a Son, you must become a Son.
>And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.
>Galatians 4:6-7 KJVAAE
https://bible.com/bible/546/gal.4.6-7.KJVAAE

>>20281636
Yeah Paul in 1st Corinthians says "For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified" because that's what matters and it is a reminder that regardless of our differences what is truly important is our belief in Christ and his death for us

>>20277664
So I finished the entire bible recently for the first time. Some unsorted impressions:

>Solomon is a gigachad
>what even is the Song of Solomon?
>most of the Torah is very boring
>pretty much all mysticism comes from Ezechiel, his visions are really extreme compared to the other prophets
>a lot of well known stories like Jonah are just a few pages
>Book of David is page for page the most interesting book even if I like Samuel 2 more because of Solomon
>Jesus story is much shorter than I thought
>There are quite a lot of prophecies hailing Jesus coming of which many were quite specific
>Proverbs was my least favourite book, some of the proberbs really didn't seem to have much to do with God at all
>Ijob is a very complex book, A LOT of points brought up by Ijob before he repents are very good criticisms of God, God's response which convinces Ijob is very short
>Chronicles is another very boring book
>Absoloms story is pretty cool

I definitly feel like it brought me closer to God, would recommend doing it even if it is a long and sometimes painfull process reading the entire thing.

>>20281488
Three persons. One substance.
Three whoms. One what.

>>20281679
You are ahead of 99% of Christians. If you read it again, even moreso.

>>20281679
How long did it take you, btw?

>>20277664
>First
KJV
>Favorite
Robert Alter's OT translation
New testament is garbage desu

>>20277664
What’s the point of having so many bibles? Why?

>>20281686
Thank you, although I think virtue, fairness and honesty is more important than scripture itself. After all there is Romans 2:14
For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

I will definitly reread it one day, for now however I will read some other books. I couldn't really enjoy other books as much while reading the bible, as I always had the thought in my head that I could be reading the living word instead

>>20281689
2-3 months. I started just reading the Matthew Evangelium, and I was surprised at it being only 30 pages and a very light read. I recommend everyone starting that way.
Then I read on, 30 pages on each workday, 150 pages a week, until I reached the end of the New Testament, then I continued reading at Genesis. I don't think I would have made it through the Torah had I started at Genesis, Book of Numbers has filtered billions.
I made a bit of a sprint when I reached the 12 minor prophets at the end, reading them in a day.

>>20281730
Different manuscripts with variant readings, different translations of the same manuscripts, there is no consistency and the bible has been heavily edited over time.

>>20281679
Congrats anon. Reading the whole Bible is tough. And >>20281731 congrats on getting through it so quickly. Took me years as I tended to only read a chapter or two a day (sometimes more but not often).
It's a shame more Christians haven't done it but it is also very big and the old testament tends to be more difficult I think than what some expect because it's not chronological

>>20281731
>Romans 2:14
>For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
That is interesting. Christ is the only one that can save, but that verse along with Daniel point to something other than the popular doctrine about judgement:
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
Daniel 12:2 KJVAAE
https://bible.com/bible/546/dan.12.2.KJVAAE
>2-3 months
That's very impressive.

Is it worth getting a septuagint to compare my KJV to? I know there are some differences in text

>>20281776
I guess a better question, is the septuagin heretical? If not is the mosretic? Or does it literally not matter because the differences do not make or break the over all message

>>20281747
>>20281753
After reading longer (Journey to the West) and tougher (Gravity's Rainbow) books I had a really strong urge to read it, as if it was disrespectfull to not read the living word now that I was able to get through it in reading speed and comprehension.
>>20281753
I don't think it necessarily contradicts popular doctrine, it just lead me to a more indirect interpretation where you can be saved by Jesus even without having ever heard of him, through receiving his gospel directly into your heart.
It solved a lot of questions I had about uncontacted tribes in the Amazon and such before.

>>20281776
>>20281780
I bought these 2 Septuagints on Kobo for 99 cents each iirc. If you turn to this passage (Jeremiah 45) in any English version (Baptist, Catholic, Orthodox, etc) youll see the subtle difference.

>>20281793
>you can be saved by Jesus even without having ever heard of him, through receiving his gospel directly into your heart.
I believe that would be considered heretical among at least a few churches I am familiar with (NIFB types), but I don't remember how they expounded Daniel's "many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth" verse

>>20281803
So why is it ch 51 in septuagint? Different numbering or does it legitimately have more?
Wording seems same in kjv, minus the last line about this whole land
>Thus shalt thou say unto him, The LORD saith thus; Behold, that which I have built will I break down, and that which I have planted I will pluck up, even this whole land.
Jeremiah 45:4

>>20281780
Neither.
the only issue are a few MTs where they tried to remove prophecy (Psalm 22:16 specifically in most cases).
still, comparing them between each other gets you truth, if anything were to be off.

Today I am meeting with the pastor to talk about getting baptized.

>>20281843
Congratulations anon. I take it you are saved then?

>>20281854
Yes I believe in Jesus Christ who is God the Son and He died and rose from the dead to save me from my sins.

>>20281857
I'm happy for you anon

>>20281823
The "land" bit is pretty significant when you consider the circumstances of the Septuagint being written (they had to present it before a King that had just conquered them). As far as the numbering, I'm not sure, but there are massive passages completely missing. The "land" part is such an accute omission that it stands out among the other changes. This chart is a bit confusing, I don't really even understand how to read it, but I believe it shows most, if not all, the changes/omissions.

>>20281895
>they had to present it before a King that had just conquered them
So would you say more often than not it's the septuagint that's missing stuff than the masoretic?

>>20281961
Yes.

>>20282003
What a sicko wacko that man was. I know he changed Genesis 3:15 to support his own sick sub cult too.

>>20282036
What was it originally

>>20282003
>>20282036
So the vulgate has stuff added? Then do prot bibles have those additions as well?

>Realise I need to find a local church near me to be closer to God.
>I like the idea of the tradition of the Catholic Church but abhor the papacy
>Me being English in England, I think I should check out Anglo-Catholicism
>Do research online of various churches
>Pretty much all the ones nearby are progressive and globohomo affirming centres
Im so tired, mates. I just want tradition, worshipping, and no anti-white politics (and no vaccine fear mongering -that was another thing I found)
Count yourself lucky if you found a good conservative church in this day and age

>>20282075
Orthodoxy or small Protestant groups that actually take Scripture seriously are your only options

>>20282075
>Count yourself lucky if you found a good conservative church in this day and age
Yeah it's harder than it used to be. Took me a year to find the right church and I am blessed to have found it.
Though I'm in the US and am Baptist (which tend to be more conservative in regards to "social issues" anyway).
Are Anglicans really that progressive?

>>20282100
>Are Anglicans really that progressive?

>>20282100
>>20282110

>>20282110
That's sad. If a church is following the policy of the world rather than following scripture, at what point does it cease to be a house of God?

>>20282036
I believe Jerome was bad, but not for sticking to the Masoretic. If you read his stories, like "The Woman Struck 7 Times with an Axe" written to the pope, he is clearly just lying and trying to make a name for himself.

>>20282074
There are 2 Vulgates. The 1st Vulgate was the Septuagint translated from Greek to Latin. The Latin Vulgate is a mishmash of the Septuagint and the Masoretic. I'm pretty sure all I've said is accurate, but it's confusing.

>>20282110
Justin Welby also works for the World Economic Forum.

>>20282075
Saint John Chrysostom would not like having his name associated with this putrid Satanic filth.

>>20282036
Here's another book by Jerome talking about Half-Human, Half-Horse hybrids.

>>20282146
It’s almost like these were real in the past given the fact everyone talked about them. Even John of Damascus wrote about dragons.
https://classicalchristianity.com/2011/12/31/st-john-of-damascus-on-dragons/

>>20282164
Dragons are real. That is what "dinosaurs" are. Saint George and Saint Patrick both fought dragons.

>>20282164
Dragons =/= Half-Man, Half-Animal hybrids
The latter goes against Scripture
>And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
>Genesis 1:25 KJVAAE
https://bible.com/bible/546/gen.1.25.KJVAAE

>>20281488
Nice digits
I've always interpreted Jesus as being bound (by his own determination) to his mission, which meant that naturally some of the divine presence of God was restricted in him.
He could have shed these bonds at any moment, and called the hosts of angels to his side and destroyed mountains with his faith and so on, but to do so meant not abiding as the incarnation and unity of God/Man.

Christ had a choice I think, to submit the half of him that was man to the trials that culminated in the crucifix or to as the onlookers taunted "get up off the cross and walk away".
By choosing to embrace the half of him that was man to the will of God, he had to teach and walk in both worlds, the divine connection to God and the fleshly burdens of this existence.

To specifically answer your question, I think the earthly part of Christ answered that only the Father knows the Day of Judgement, for as men this is the answer we should tell our brethren, yet it could be entirely possible the divine part of Christ could've asked God and would've been told if it was relevant knowledge at the time.
It might seem confusing, God telling the part of himself on earth about knowledge He already would know, but I think it's okay if we don't have big enough brains to comprehend the causality and 4th+ dimensional stuff.

>>20282185
>Dragons are real. That is what "dinosaurs" are. Saint George and Saint Patrick both fought dragons.
Wat

>>20281793
>>20281816
It's part of the coverage for the unheard as well I think. If in the coming dystopian future there exists a generation that has absolutely no way of being taught the Gospel, but that generation lives according to the difficult standards set by Christ, it is hopeful that God might "cover" for them. Or at least give them a fair shot on judgement day.
After all if, if He didn't then people who just never heard the good news are screwed no matter how they behaved.

Those of us who are fortunate enough to directly hear the Gospel are expected to see it as truth and adhere to the more direct lineage of it, you know? Learn it, teach it, believe it and that is because the whole package should be learned when it can, rather than just doing what feels right and winging it as a pagan/gentile/nonbeliever (I say these lovingly) in the wild might.

>>20282227
Precisely what you just read.

>>20282227
The Giant dragonfly called Meganuera would not be able to exist in today's atmosphere, the giant brontosaurus could not exist in today's atmosphere, Adam could not live to 930 today probably for the same reason. Before the flood, there must have been much more, or much less, Nitrogen in the atmosphere, allowing Lizards to grow to giant sizes. A shark will grow only as big as its tank. A crocodile never stops growing until death.

That’s a good point, they’ve been finding more dinosaurs with preserved soft-tissues lately, which points to more recent origins.

>>20282261
Meant for >>20282185

>>20282250
I've heard of dinosaurs being fake. I've heard of the bones being put together incorrectly
I have heard that they lived with man
I have not heard that early Christians fought them and specifically dragons.

>>20282240
These verses incline me to believe Final Judgement is different from what is normally preached behind the pulpit
>we are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
>2 Corinthians 5:8 KJVAAE
https://bible.com/bible/546/2co.5.8.KJVAAE
>and they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
>Revelation 6:10 KJVAAE
https://bible.com/bible/546/rev.6.10.KJVAAE
>And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
>Daniel 12:2 KJVAAE
https://bible.com/bible/546/dan.12.2.KJVAAE

>>20282252
I agree creatures were different. I'd say the world was too.
Typically in the Bible when God takes an action against man he uses a "natural" phenomenon, pestilence, famine, earth quakes, meteor shower with Sodom and Gomorrah(?)
Thus I assume there was some natural occurrence that shortened man's life span and made creatures smaller. The earth is definitely different before the flood since a mist comes up from the ground rather than rain bringing water
It's definitely weird to think about

>>20282057
Read very carefully. The Douay-Rheims is based on Jerome's Vulgate. The Catholics kept that reading all the way up until recent decades.
https://www.biblehub.com/genesis/3-15.htm
>>20282252
Fascinating, this nitrogen/atmosphere thing.

>>20282269
Haven't you heard of Saint George slaying the dragon?

>>20282308
No

>>20282327
huh that's weird

>>20282350
Eh I'm not catholic and my knowledge of early Christianity is very minor

>>20282381
I learned about it from Orthodox not catholic

>>20282287
>>20282301
ICR is a pretty solid website. They have an article for just about everything you could think of relating to this topic.

>>20282287
>>20282301
ICR is a pretty solid website. They have an article for just about everything you could think of relating to this topic.

https://www.icr.org/article/squirrel-gut-microbes

>tfw only 4 and a half more books of the Bible to go

>>20282433
>pic
Thank God those things are dead

Next week.

>>20282433
What is that

>>20278773
Anglican churches tend to be divided into two main groups: Broad/Evangelical/low church and High church/Anglo-Catholic. Most churches will prominently display which tradition they are a part of. I go to an Anglo-Catholic church which is focuses on maintaining the traditions of the Roman church with a Protestant theology, the "Middle Path" between the two so-to-speak. An Anglo-Catholic/High church will have high mass with traditional liturgy and probably hold daily office, with services like choral evensong. Broad churches are a mixed bag, and might have (in my experience, Anglican Church of Canada) a traditional BCP mass early on Sunday before the low mass service with hymns, sunday school, et al.

It'll be a lot of research since Anglicanism is very varied but most will be upfront about the orientation of the church and it'll be up to you.

>>20282452
I am proud of you anon.

>>20282469

So a kinda random question. I have some souvenirs from Greece in my room, one depicting Prometheus. Prometheus is technically a Titan, and thus a sort of god.
Do you think this is idolatry and I should take it out?
I havn't really found a satisfying answer in scripture, since keeping around a figure of a foreign god purely for decorative purposes is not a problem one had in antiquity.
I found a few passages implying that specifically the worship of an idol is the sin part, but I got the gist that God is a jealous God, especially when it comes to idols, so I thought I'd ask for other opinions.
I also have a small Yggdrasil figure, which is technically holy to an extinct religion aswell.

>>20282564
I'd say look at Romans 14.
With some stuff it's up to how you think God is pulling you.

>>20282452
>It's a big deal to read an entire book on /lit/

>>20282075
Is there an equivalent to the Anglican Church of North America in England?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglican_Church_in_North_America

If you want a traditional theology and can bear not being part of the Anglican Communion look into a "Anglican Realignment" or "Continuing Anglican" church that broke away because of liberal doctrine.

>>20282564
By that logic classical statues would be idolatrous. Well, technically ancient Christians would've believed the statues were inhabited by evil spirits, but I digress; no, greek mythology is not a sin to enjoy or engage with, either through statues or some other means. Now perhaps idols that have actually been worshipped as part of the cult of some god, should be smashed, or else excorcised (certain classical statues have crosses carved on their foreheads, the area in which followers of Christ in the early church would apply the sign of the cross to themselves using their thumb, before the gesture evolved to cover the whole chest--likely done as to, in a sense, christen the statues for preservation), but when it comes to some factory-produced tourist gadget you bought in Greece, there is absolutely nothing about it that could be problematic. You were correct that idolatry is the worship of false idols, and God is a jealous God, which is to say He is covetous, not of what is not His, but of what is supremely His: your adoration--your worship of Him as creator--a relation of worshipper and worshiped which is likened in Holy Writ to the relation of wife and husband, hence the Church as the bridegroom of Christ and idolatry as adultery.

>>20282712
>>20282576
That's reassuring to hear. I love Romans 14. Such a small passage with so much wisdom. I certainly have to ward my heart against idolatry, I love reading religious texts from all over the world, but my worship belongs to God, and a silly little figurine is definitly not gonna change that. As such the souvenirs can stay.

I met with the pastor to talk about getting baptized. My parents went with me although they waited outside while I talked with him in his office.
I decided to get baptized.
Although I have a strange feeling anons and I am not sure if I totally agree with everything he said. He is a very nice guy but I don't know anons
Should I back out anons

Jesus regularly chose to talk to and help people that would have been regarded as disgusting by society at the time. Should we not be the same with Trans/gays/obese people?

>>20282798
>I am not sure if I totally agree with everything he said.
What did he say?

>>20282799
Thats a tall order. Remember Jesus was also able to cast out demons.

>>20282805
I don't know he said a lot desu anons.
Also he is nice but I think he thought I was asking too many questions because he said we have too wrap things up or I will never stop asking questions. He said it in a friendly joking way but I don't know anons I am sort of autistic and asked too many questions probably.

>>20282831
Well then what did he say that you didn’t agree with? You must know that.

>>20282845
Well maybe he was right I don't know desu. I asked him if baptism is only a symbol or if it is real mystical thing that happens where the Spirit comes into you and he gave a really long answer but basically he says that baptism is only a symbol and that the real salvation is when you ask Jesus Christ for forgiveness before you get baptized.

>>20282831
This is the pastor of your parent's church? There are some out there whom will probably have higher tolerances/patience for "too many questions", but any should at least answer the biggest ones you have as best as they can. You just need to read the situation and decide for yourself. On the one hand, I wouldn't let "too high of standards" keep me from getting baptized, but on the other I wouldn't let too low of standards cause me to not do it as properly as possible within your own understanding (which you were trying to build with your questions).

>>20282845
Also I said that I think the vaccines are a preparation for the mark of the beast and that big tech companies are trying to make AI which I think may be the image of the beast in Revelation. He said he doesn't know, but that may be right. He said that this doesn't sound anti-Biblical, but at the same time we can only know with certainty what the Bible explicitly tells us.

>>20282799
Read Genesis 18 and 19

>>20282873
He's sounding pretty reasonable there.

Should i get the new king james bible or the king james bible?

Based.
https://youtu.be/Bzz2Bu9IjrA

>>20283011
Authorised (King James) Version.
As a rule of thumb I don’t really trust translations with ‘New’ in the title.
I don’t like new, but that’s just me. This one could be different.

>Exodus 23:24

>>20283011
That depends, are you wanting a "bible", or the Holy Bible?

>>20282799
may God forgive you

>>20283081
That's not based, his eyes are so pussy they get "strained" from the red print. My eyes kick red print's ass and make it more readable. To which direction do you wish to evolve as a people?

>>20283247
Red letters are the product of industrialists in 1899 and thus are unbiblical.

>>20283081
You can tell by the absurd vocal fry that he's trying to make his voice much deeper than it actually is. It's why it's constantly cracking and sounds like he's on the verge of tears.

>>20283081
I mean really, that whole video sounds like a little old lady complaining about how you made her oatmeal.

>>20283281
No one is proposing it to be "biblical", but rather that those industrialists had a great idea what improved the Holy Bible interaction experience. But see, God blinds the heathens, and the red letters do not hurt my eyes in the least. Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God.

The Bible just tells you like it is, without protective gloves.

>>20282602
Nobody reads anything
You could make a Dr Seuss thread and someone would breakdown the metaphysical implications of green eggs before admitting they were just trolling you and had never even heard of the neocharlatan Sam-I-am and his occult background as a member of the Lodge of the Green Devourer before getting interaction with real Anons.

>>20283594
Is that shit in the Dr. Seuss books? I read Green Eggs and Ham back in the 70s and do not recall that, but am not assuming that to mean it wasn't in there.

>>20282873
>>20282845
That's a tough conversation to have with someone out of the gate, so I wouldn't worry too much if he didn't have concrete answers about the kind of stuff.
Sounds like he was just trying to end the conversation cordially, I say this as someone who agrees the coming famine and technical revolution will likely incite the antichrist to reveal himself.

THAT being said, Baptism is a sign of your sincerity to God and should be a deeply personal thing more than anything else. Don't go get baptized because you think the neomachine spirits will be held at bay, get baptized because you want to walk closer to and with God and believe in his sovereignty. If you are true and devoted to God then the baptism will naturally follow, just like prayer, reading the Bible, performing charity, and other good works.
I'm happy for you though anon, an adult baptism is often a sign and spiritual reaffirming of walking the path of a Christian, make sure you record/remember the day because it's a beautiful thing.

>>20282799
I agree to an extent, but you need to be aware that some people have truly given themselves over to the point of no return to the evils of this world.
I would not withhold the word from anyone, and try if you can to reach people but do not let yourself lose your pearls before the swine. Trust in God to sprout the seeds.

>>20283609
No I was saying someone would sooner pull that stuff outta their ass for the purposes of derailing a thread than talk about the simple children's book lol
I have no idea if Dr Seuss was an occultist or anything honestly

>>20283636
Oh well, there for a minute it was sounding like I had really missed some interesting stuff from those books. Thanks for the build up and let down, faggot.

>>20282075
I couldn't care less about its politics. I'm not going to sacrifice my eternal soul because my pastor believes in gay marriage.

>>20283648
no problemo

What's best about the bible is how the translations evolved. Check this out:

https://www-levangile-com.translate.goog/Comparateur-Bible-10-12-31.htm?_x_tr_sl=fr&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=fr&_x_tr_pto=wapp

There is a sharp change in the meaning at some point. Can you help me figure it out ?

Ah yes I remember it from the Book of Matthew
>love thy neighbour as thyself
>unless thy neighbour is a poof, in which case be certain not to receive the sacraments from any minister who will treat him with humanity

>>20283705
The King James has things going full heavy metal right there. Very different in the ESV.

How do you discern which church is the correct church?
I believe in Christianity but I'm not currently part of any particular church or denomination. I've ruled out all of evangelical protestantism and have basically narrowed it down to Catholicism, Orthodoxy, or Lutheranism. How do I determine who is correct?

How often do you pray though all of the Psalms?

>>20283863
Research early Church history. You will end inevitably end up having to choose either Eastern or Oriental Orthodox as a result.

>>20283989
>Eastern or Oriental Orthodox
You misspelled "Independent Fundamental Independent Fundamental Old New Original Last and Final Baptist" or "Pentecostal Holiness Full & Total Gospel with Snakes & Poison", because either of those are more Christian than anyone since the Romans killed all of the Apostles and hijacked the movement for control and profit rather than God's will and prophet. Mighty nice racket the Caths and Orths had there for a while though, eh?

>>20283705
The first one appears to be based on the Vulgate interpretation (chariot wheels vs harrows and knives vs axes). The Septuagint seems to follow the Hebrew more.

Hebrew text analysis for reference.
https://biblehub.com/text/2_samuel/12-31.htm

>>20283758
The ESV just kept the RSV rendition.

>>20284449
IIRC, the ESV is 1:1 identical 7 times out of 10 to the RSV71.

>>20284090
Kek

I know that Plato was not a Christian of course, but don't you anons agree that universals and essences of objects are real? Orthodox and I think maybe some Catholics except for the nominalists agree that there are essences of types of things and like universal categories sort of like Platonic forms in a way, but within the Christian paradigm of course, not in the Platonic system. And they say that even these univerals are created and they are reflections of the Logoi.
It seems that Protestants or at least Baptists don't really talk about these kinds of things from what I have seen. Although maybe some of it is sort of implied like when we talk about how man is made in the image of God for example and how nature was corrupted after the fall.
Also yes I know that philosophy and intellectualism is not what saves you but I just think that these things are interesting to think about.

>>20283863
How can you narrow it down to those but not include Anglicanism, which lies in the middle of them and contains all their perspectives?

>>20284499
That's interesting that the "Orthodox™" have some sort of teaching regarding the spiritual underpinnings and underlyings behind the objects of common tangible reality. Where would I look for some summary information on these particular views? As far as I mostly know, Protestants are perfectly comfortable just thinking it might all be holographic in nature, and other standard scientificly indicated potentials, and seeing those potentials through a Christian LORD God Almighty lens. I agree, not necessarily dependent for salvation, but certainly interesting to ponder. Some views even help one to be a more effective member of the Body of Christ while still here in Babylon.

>>20284526
Anglicans are just an even gayer and more cucked version of Roman Catholics.

>>20283741
Awful bait. It’s not loving to tell someone to persist in sin and degeneracy. Jesus rebuked sinners and told them to repent and have faith in God—this is because He was loving. Paul likewise taught to rebuke evil and to expose it. And God hates sin, and since we are to be like God (Ephesians 5:1), we are to hate sin and to expose works of evil. Sodomy is a sin that cries out to heaven for vengeance. Jesus was there raining fire and brimstone on Sodom and Gomorrah if you read Genesis

>>20284533
Saint Maximus the Confessor's book On the Cosmic Mystery of Jesus Christ

>>20284526
>dude it's like Catholicism only significantly younger, less official, and has the queen instead of the pope
pass

>>20284584
It would appear that there are Jews guarding it because there are no free PDFs. I did find Christocentric Cosmology of St Maximus the Confessor (Oxford Early Christian Studies)

>>20284628
z lib nigga

>>20277664
EVERYBODY GET LSV BIBLE!

>>20284635
No

>>20284644
This, why would I want a way overpriced celeb vanity project "bible" that doesn't even have reference versions?

>>20284634
wat
I only speak language.

Robert Barron radiates strong homo vibes

>>20284651
https://u1lib.org/book/18645464/9a2ad3
No idea if that will work
If not: jewgle z lib
click z lib
click books
enter On the Cosmic Mystery of Jesus Christ

>>20284665
>Los Angeles

>>20284672
He seems to talk about the Bible in a sort of liberal humanist way.
>it's so powerful
>such insightful literary symbolism on the human condition
>Genesis isn't supposed to be interpreted literally
He seems like he is watering it all down to appeal to normie redditors

>>20284665
>>20284672
>>20284690
k

>>20284526
Mainly two reasons
1. I think Anglicanism doesn't have a very good case from a historical standpoint seeing as how their split with the Catholic Church was almost entirely because the pope wouldn't grant Henry an annulment. This is a pretty weak basis for a church to me when compared to those other three.
2. It seems that the Anglican church (known as the Episcopal church here in the US) has basically been completely subverted. They are at the forefront of pushing the pro-LGBT, pro-BLM, pro-abortion, pro-fornication, etc. views within Christianity. They have been completely defeated by the modern world and I can't view them as the true church because of this.

>>20284690
There was another thread on pol of all things (I think at least) talking about the decline of Christianity from a neutral perspective (attendance etc) was because it had failed to properly utilize the internet to reach out and then failed to adhere to the traditional teachings and moral standards of old.

Something like: nobody knows about Christianity anymore and the people who do get hyped up at some bizarre Sunday "Jesus Camp" where a series of Kids Bob Hit Singles are played and bizarre morals are taught from aging hipster Priests/Pastors.
I'm inclined to agree, my younger self and family would've shown up twice a week if a Church had a decent online presence and read good old fire and brimstone Biblical preachin'.

>>20284666
Yes that worked fine but also got Satanic trips so that probably means it's bad.

>>20284724
>mfw

>>20284720
Jay Dyer and the others in the online Orthodox group are the only ones who are really good at this.
Churches that become liberal to try to bring in the younger crowd are ironically I think not going to get a lot of attendance desu I think a lot of young men on the Internet see through all this garbage and want to hear the truth.

>>20284707
Apparently there is a split going on right now in the Epicopal church in America between the ones who buy into all this globalhomo stuff and the ones who are conservative.

>>20284707
They subverted John Wesley's orchard of church plants too. Methodism joined with a branch of Episcopalians in the late 60s and here we are now about to split into yet another 2 branches due to the resulting worldly corruptions. The only thing that really bothers me about it is that the splits dilute the group charitable power of Christianity.

Aren't Baptists basically just Methodists except not under the hierarchy of bishops and what not?
I think I read that as far as their theology goes, they are exactly the same.

>>20284739
There's probably some contention with his teachings/preachings but the way that that old southern guy, I think Ruckman or such, speaks and delivers the Gospel is really enjoyable.
His conclusions about material may (or may not!) be suspect but I like when there's an authority and conviction in the voice of the man speaking God's word.
It's not just a regional/dialectical thing either, so many preachers are soft and gentle even when saying serious things. I want some fire in the bellies of my teachers you know?

>>20282287
>meteor shower with Sodom and Gomorrah(?)
The cities of the plains have been found, you can look into it. A real world reminder of God's judgement.

Great phone app. Airplane mode kills the ads.

Is NIV good?

>>20285314
I would put it just below middling. I don't like it but there are worse.

>>20285341
Thanks

>>20277664
>>20279403
The question is what happened in 2014/2015 that turned this board from pretentious college students to bible huggers? The Summa Theologica is in the top 30 of 2015 for damn sake, a book no one here has read, no one had read then, a book no one outside of theology students has an business of reading frankly.
I am guessing that during that period atheism got pwned because people associated it with being left and a cuck after being persecuted by radical feminists and other diversity agents. (Note that troons had no lobby back then and weren't the community shattering plague they are now.)

The reason most people on this board are christian now and tradding out hard was gamer gate (later 2014), unironically. Because gamer gate was the reason y'all go woken up from playing vidya and found to a more right leaning ideology during your youth. Imagine being played like this by fucking game journalists. It's kind of pathetic to have that little self control.

>>20285581

KJV bible that my dad got given by some 'god botherers' like 15 years before I was born
NRSV is my favourite translation
>>20285581
I hope this is a joke

>>20285598
>KJV bible that my dad got given by some 'god botherers' like 15 years before I was born
based
>NRSV is my favourite translation
gay

>>20285628
Yeah I know people hate the NRSV
Only translation that I've read the entire Bible in

>>20285598
>>20285644
It's basically a very slightly worse ESV where you can't trust literally any pronouns or references to groups of people.

I don't freakin know anything about all these translations bros. I just read what is given to me

Is it true that Catholics believe that Mary became part of the Godhead

>>20285851
>very slightly

>tfw pocket Bible arrived but the cover art isn’t central
Is it just my OCD or does this look odd?

>>20286480
It's translations are generally decent aside from the gender issue IMO.

>>20286486
cover art looks cool though desu

>>20286494
I was just busting your balls about the oxymoron

Even conservative Southern Baptists these days have become very feminized and wimpy. They still have conservative beliefs on social issues and what not, but they emanate castrated cucked sissy vibes.

Why does every "contemporary worship song" sound the same?
Why do old boomer pastors from the south try to have this hipster macbook coffee shop aesthetic now?
Why do they keep talking about "wokeism" instead of calling it all what it really is: Satanism

It looks like it is central to the actual book block (the pages).

I broke and coomed after work on day 5. I should have prayed more.

>>20284752
I suppose that is one way to put it. Initially Baptists were Calvinists. It wasn't really until the mid 1700s that many started embracing Arminian theology like Methodists. There are still some Baptists that are Calvinists though, "Particular Baptists" or "Reformed Baptists".

You guys think any novel heresies will develop in the future or have we basically seen it all by this point?

>>20286694
>Reformed Baptists
Another term I've heard is hard shell baptists
I've heard Methodists used to be pretty close to baptists but things have changed and Methodists have gotten "weird" (changed their theology?). Not sure if it's just permissing women ministers or if it's something else as well

Anyway, yeah debate over predestination and election is one occurring in baptist churches

>>20286694
>Reformed Baptists
They are gay liberals like John Piper who says everyone should get the vaccine.

I have been in Baptist churches my whole life and I was never taught Calvinist heresies like predestination or whatever

>>20286762
Piper is just a Baptist that happens to be a Calvinist. He isn't "Reformed" because he doesn't subscribe to a Confession of Faith.

>>20286776
Yeah that's true for me as well but there's a couple churches in my area that have adopted "reformed" theology
Baptist church I go to, some people from one these churches have switched membership due to this and actually made me aware such a thing was happening

I read about it a little bit and Reformed theology is evidently crossing denominational lines.

>>20286787
>Piper is just a Baptist that happens to be a Calvinist. He isn't "Reformed" because he doesn't subscribe to a Confession of Faith.
They call themselves Reformed whether they subscribe to a confession of Fath or not

>>20286455
You’re not alone brother, just read and enlightenment is sure to follow

>>20286834
And Mormons can call themselves Christians all they want. Doesn't make it true or honest.

>>20286455
>>20286839
Yeah just read. There's pros and cons to every translation

>>20286560
To destroy tradition, is my estimation. Worship songs feel good but require zero effort and have no greater meaning. They are vapid words devoid of presence or sincerity.
Emasculated Pastors get to dip their toes into the water which gets them just enough brownie points from the decrepit senior citizens, who incidentally get to know they resisted social decay for 90 seconds and thus set an amazing standard for future generations (hope those kids know how tough we had it!)
Boomers get to retain the illusion of civil order and social standing as they leave this world infinitely worse than they found it, children get to clap their hands to Disney-tier soundtracks while obese neo-Christian mom and dad hide behind their church walls hoping to retain even a semblance of sanity in a "vewy scawy wworld".

This is the next set of books I'm getting, what do you all think? Read any of them before?
I have a shelf dedicated to Christian books and I think these may just push that over its limit.

>>20286796
>Reformed theology is evidently crossing denominational lines.
These heresies must be stomped out.

>>20286709
I expect the Talmudic "God is actually a woman" to get pushed a little harder.
Other than the foretold stuff in Revelations etc I'd not be surprised if each year is significantly gayer than the last.

>>20286915
Very few churches in my area still do hymns. The one I go to they intermixed "worship music" with slightly reworked hymns so that the band can actually play it.
I much prefer the original thing but I'm happy they at least sing those songs. They did blessed assurance this past week and it sounded good. Much better than an "updated" amazing grace I saw on YouTube where they tried to speed it up. It really doesn't work

Other thing I've noticed is some worship songs take lyrics from older hymns. Why I don't know.

>>20286923
300 years ago, outside of Lutheranism, Reformed theology was the norm in Protestant churches lmao. Arminianism was the heresy back then.

>>20286921
>new testament apocrypha
What is it? Is it worth reading?

>>20286937
I'm of the opinion that Church shouldn't be something you reluctantly go to for a quick 30 minute refresher course on pop songs and then 20 minutes of preaching a single chapter in the Bible.
Nowhere near me understands that, many "Christians" are just doing what they're told and would show up for 15 minutes if they got the okay from up above through Pastor McQueerbait.
"Alright I clocked in my half hour so I'm all set with God and these songs are just neat alright time to go live a sinful life for another 6 days and 23 hours"
The decay is brutal. Breaks my heart.

Sometimes church almost seems like a group therapy session these days. People talking about their feelings and how scary the outside world has become.
Church caters to women now.

It seems like some protestants have sort of an aversion to discussing deeper theology. They sort of have this mindset of "Well how is that going to help me? Is that what gets you saved? I don't need to know all that."

>>20286971
>The decay is brutal. Breaks my heart.
Yeah it's bad. I wish service would last a little longer but it is more than just 20 minutes and pastor is much more conservative than at some other churches I've gone to but he's also been there 20 years so he's a bit different

>>20287000
It definitely is. It's why there's the warship music, and it's why music takes up much more time than the sermon. I assume it's also why topics like hell are avoided

>>20286962
>What is it?
New Testament apocrypha are works that either didn't make it into the canon or were composed after the canon was set. There is a very large corpus apocrypha (far larger then even what is covered by these books). I'm actually buying these books mainly to read a relatively small amount of the texts in them, specifically:
The Apocalypse of Pseudo-Methodius
Most of the texts from the Pilate cycle
The Gospel of Nicodemus
The Gospel of Peter
The Tiburtine Sibyl
The story of Mary from the Golden Legend

>Is it worth reading?
The apocrypha? No. Frankly I would only really recommend anyone dive into this stuff if you have a specific reason to do so. None of it is light reading and typically requires a seminary level knowledge to actually understand any of these works to any meaningful degree.
Personally, I'm getting these works as I require decent translations of them to help fulfil the mission that I have been given by God.

>>20287017
>It seems like some protestants have sort of an aversion to discussing deeper theology. They sort of have this mindset of "Well how is that going to help me? Is that what gets you saved? I don't need to know all that."
In 1st Corinthians Paul says he knew nothing among the church there except Jesus and his crucifixion
Basically when it boils down to it all it is what matters most.
That said I do agree most don't bother getting into other aspects of theology.

Should a church have an open Lord's Supper or a closed one? Should baptism occurr before membership is permissed? How should the church government be organized? Etc.
I will say I think Baptists used to care more. There used to be a serious debate over whether being baptism in a baptismal or if immersion outside in running water was required

>>20287037
>the Pilate cycle
Haven't heard of that
Would you consider these documents to be wrongly excluded from the canon?
And what mission is it you have exactly

Quickly; Orthodox or Catholic and 1-2 reasons why one is the one true Church

>>20287156
Neither are in and of themselves. The true church crosses denominational lines and is composed of those who believe in Christ

>>20287156
I believe that each Church holds a truth distinctive to their own name.
Combined, they would make the ONE true church, but I think they’re all right in their own respect.
Ideally to get the most out of Churches you’d want to go to a Catholic churchgoer day, then an Orthodox, an Anglican, Baptist, and so forth.
(Except for Unitarian churches; which is in my observation a building in which gays use to subvert Christianity for their own prideful and demonic desires)

>>20287153
>Haven't heard of that
It is basically just a collection of different texts that are either about or supposedly authored by Pilate. As far as apocrypha they are not exactly the most obscure, however they are perhaps the most overlooked.
>Would you consider these documents to be wrongly excluded from the canon?
As far as traditional Christianity goes, the only text that I think was wrongly excluded from the canon was the Gospel of Thomas. These apocryphal works are important to me, but my requirements are different from that of traditional Christianity.
>And what mission is it you have exactly
Several years ago I had a divine experience. I was assigned the task of founding a church to teach the truths that were revealed to me. However the bible of traditional Christianity is not suitable for this task and thus before I can actually found my church, I have to compose what basically amounts to my denominations own bible. This bible will basically be a series of harmonies of Christian texts, divided into three distinct sections and set in chronological order. Starting before creation and ending with the prophecy of the last emperor and the final darkness.

>>20287219
>your own Bible with works that aren't in the canon
>"gospel" of thomas where they copied the Gospels to give it weight and filled the rest with gnosticism
sounds like a LDS/JW-esque cult

>>20287219
2 Corinthians 11:13-14
>For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ.
>And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.
special attention to 14. i want you to really judge if you are deserving of such a "mission".
if you answer positively, think again.

>>20287219
Galatians 1:9
>As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
2 Corinthians 11:13-14
>For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ.
>And no wonder, for satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.
special attention to 14. i want you to really judge if you are deserving of such a "mission".
if you answer positively, think again.

>>20287205
And if you don’t believe me about Unitarian churches;

What order should I read the books of the New Testament? Should I read Mark first because Matthew and Luke are based on that?

>>20287471
>What order should I read the books of the New Testament? Should I read Mark first because Matthew and Luke are based on that?
Mark is considered to be the oldest and it's the shortest gospel but it doesn't really matter if you read it first or Matthew. All should be read.
Fyi: Luke also wrote Acts

>>20287493
So should I read it from front to back?

>>20287471
Matthew, Mark, Luke, Acts, John, Epistles, Revelation, OT in order.

>>20287500
Thats what I did yeah. Definetly read acts before the epistles because acts details Paul's missions. During those missions Paul wrote his epistles.
I'd say read the gospels as arranged because at the end of Matthew the great commission is given.

>>20286962
The Apocrypha are books Christians erroneously added to the Bible because their copy of the Hebrew Bible had shit added to it. Luther realised that the Apocryphal works weren't Biblical originally and had them separated into a new section of the Bible denoting this.

>>20287471
>Matthew, Hebrews (skip if you get stuck), James
>Mark, Peter, Jude
>Luke, Acts, Romans, Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, Thessalonians, Timothy, Titus, Philemon
>John, John
>Revelation

>>20287564
>because their copy of the Hebrew Bible had shit added to it. Luther realised that the Apocryphal works weren't Biblical originally and had them separated into a new section of the Bible denoting this.
How did he determine this

>>20287593
The same way Jerome did probably.

>>20287755
Which was?
Sorry not trying to be a prick, honestly curious

>>20287593
By the Renaissance we had a copy of the original Hebrew Bible. The early Christians were using a Greek version.

>>20287852
Wait a minute. I thought that the New Testament was originally written in Greek.

>>20287852
Also I am not expert on this so maybe you anons can help me. I think I heard that the Hebrew Masoeretic text had some sort of Kabbalist or gnostic subversive stuff in it as opposed to the Greek which is the real Bible.

>>20288099
basically we had original Hebrew, which was translated into Greek(Septuagint), and also modern Hebrew(MT); the issue is some MT fellows tried to remove prophecy and whatnot (like trying to change Psalm 22:16).
modern Bibles compare between those and others and fix changes, so it works.

>>20287815
It's immediately obvious to anyone who isn't an illiterate 3rd worlder.

>>20288099
>>20288180
the OT i mean; NT is originally written in Greek already. (and you can find "hebrewisms" on it, result of the writers basically thinking in Hebrew, like Paul coining a new word based on Leviticus)

>>20288197
Some of it like Enoch is obvious yeah

>>20287205
>>20287353
>lists common values of the church
>belief in Christ is not one of them
what the actual fuck
maybe you are onto something there and Unitarian churches are work of the adversary to keep the churches divided
no way this is Christian

>>20286560
There is Theocracy and it goes so hard it even has a high reputation among metalheads who tend to be far from faith as a demographic
https://youtu.be/q1TN7V1r1hg

>>20288351
Admittedly the closest city I live to in the UK is a liberal hellscape but in which I have to travel to for work. I remember walking past this place for the first time and knew then it was up to no good. Since the first time I went past they added the gay flags and I’m pretty sure the newest update; the trans one too.
Horrible place and I’m honestly confused as to why they’d call themselves a church other than for purely subversive reasons, there is no other alternative reason I can think of

>>20288456
What kind of person even goes to these places?

>>20288464
Liberals with an agenda to fulfil. Can only be, I think.
What I know for certain is that whatever they worship isn’t what I worship.

>>20277664
>>first Bible
King James. Loved listening to Harold Camping read excerpts on Family Radio when I was a kid.

>>favorite translation
Alter OT, David Bentley Hart NT

I have ESV, St Augustine's Confessions, and a bunch of apologetics books like The Case for Christ and Confronting Christianity. Will reading these fix my life and make me feel like taking part in the world?

>>20288526
probably

>>20288063
Yes but like I said I was referring to the Hebrew Bible.

>>20288099
The MT isn't the original Hebrew text, which we didn't get until the DSS were discovered last century, but they were an important source nevertheless.

Why'd he do it?

>>20288526
i'd recommend getting Mere Christianity along with those, if you don't have it yet.
also yes, apologetics are great.

>>20288613
He probably hoped that by putting Jesus under pressure, the threat of death would force Jesus to reveal that he really was the Messiah by manifesting some sort of public miracle that would signal the restoration of the kingdom of Israel.

>>20288526
>Will reading these fix my life
I'd advise against the ESV, also pic related
https://www.jesusisprecious.org/bible/esv.htm

>and make me feel like taking part in the world?
James 4:4
Galatians 6:14

Is the OT important to Christians other than as context for the NT? How so?

>>20288659
or he was just greedy (as the account of him disliking Christ having the oil vase broken over Him shows).

>>20288677
yes.
lets you learn more about God, is full of knowledge aswell, and basically confirms the faith through prophecy and prefigurations of Christ.
the Testaments are not two separate things.

>>20288677
And, as some get it wrong, God doesn't change. all that happens is God's justice; now His justice has been executed, through Christ, who died for our sins.

>>20288677
Yes. Those who wanted to toss out the entire OT and teach exclusively the NT were deemed as heretics very early on.

>>20288376
Theocracy is the band that got me into Christian metal
Mirror of Souls is probably my favorite track from them

I was reading Colossians and came across this phrase:
"A door of utterance, to speak the mystery of Christ"
What on Earth does this mean?

>>20289295
https://biblehub.com/colossians/4-3.htm

>>20289295
>>20289450
>Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
>John 14:12 KJVAAE
https://bible.com/bible/546/jhn.14.12.KJVAAE

>>20278773
Whatever you do don't join the church that was started for the sole purpose of justifying the king's adultery.

>>20277664
Protestants give up their right to be called Christians the second they deviate from legitimate baptism. Remember this. As soon as one is declared outside the church, they are nothing more than heretics, atheists, or satanist, pick your poison, its a race to the bottom.

>>20277664
>TNIV
ultra cringe

>>20288628
Mere Christianity is indeed amazing, I used to be a sceptic before but CS Lewis paved the way for my return to faith

>>20290029
He is fantastic. I'm strongly considering making him my patron saint when I'm confirmed in August or September.