/lit/ - Literature

is the book of enoch kino or gay?

We need an Apostle Paul 'Yes' Chad to quote the Epistles, alongside that of Jesus for the Gospels which already exists.

king jimbo version is outdated and should no longer b used. uses unreliable erasmus texts. it's been out of date for 200 years.

>>20195752
There is no "outdated" Bible.

>>20195759
There are outdated and inaccurate translations which use textual manuscripts with errors. king jimbo had a place in history but textual scholarship has shown it to be highly inaccurate in the current form.

it's also very dangerous that these inaccuracies could mislead people in the faith. the KJV should be suppressed, and I'm not joking.

>>20195752
>>20195770
so what bible do you recommend?

>>20195770
No, if a text was capable of edifying the church and leading people to salvation then it fulfilled its purpose and still does as long as anyone can understand it. I'm not a KJV Onlyist or any such thing (I use modern versions) but you should not be so quick to grovel at the feet of secular textual theories.

>>20195784
And theories is what they are. Many are reasonable but ultimately the endeavor of textual criticism is speculative. Even if your supposition is reasonable it could still be wrong because there is no way to ever prove it.

The KJV Compromise:
One formal, standardised translation for church service, and one for private use and evangelisation in plain, contemporary English.

>>20195783
I recc. a NT translated from NT27 or UBS5 and an OT translated from the RH LXX.
>>20195784
>>20195788
I agree that any text can be useful per se but textual criticism is not speculative, it was used by the Fathers to assemble the canon. We continue their lineage of Jerome today with modern scholarship and document findings. The old, outdated must be discarded. The KJV no longer serves a purpose.
>>20195811
already existed, it's called the Revised Common Lectionary translations

>>20195821
>I agree that any text can be useful per se but textual criticism is not speculative, it was used by the Fathers to assemble the canon. We continue their lineage of Jerome today with modern scholarship and document findings.
No you most certainly do not. Modern textual criticism is based on the premise that the texts of the Bible are to be treated as any other book. There is nothing divine to be considered. It is just like any completely human work and subject to the same human forces and there is nothing else to factor into it. The endeavor is fundamentally secular and has no religious or spiritual capacity. Much ado is made over things like the mental or psychological states of scribes, why they might have done this or that, all of which is utter speculation and can never be proven in any way. Even if you think your speculation makes sense, history does not necessarily follow the most sensible course. You could make the best possible theory, based upon the available evidence, but still be wrong because the evidence that would disprove you has been lost to time. It is not provable.

>>20195831
The secular and the religious, when teleologically aimed the same realization, cannot conflict as the stem from the same source.

We use technology to build the kingdom. We use modern tools, given to use by our God created wisdom, to refine the texts, as the Fathers did. Inspiration did not end with the Council of Nicea, far from it.

Christians believe in the continuing action of the Holy Spirit, and God guides our textual criticism. We have a divine mandate to take the texts ever closer to the truth.

>>20195847
>Christians believe in the continuing action of the Holy Spirit, and God guides our textual criticism.
Where do you derive that God guides the suppositions of textual scholars? There is no reason to believe such a thing. You also did not address any of my arguments about mental states, lack of evidence, etc. And of course, because you can't. Where do you derive that God has necessarily provided us the requisite evidence for our modern methodology to accurately ascertain the truth of the matter? Again, this is made up ad hoc.

>>20195855
Where do you believe God gave the Fathers the correct textual methodology to assemble the canon and compile texts? Did God guide their suppositions? If so, when did he stop doing so, and why, and where do you have evidence from God for that?

We have evidence from Jesus that "he will be with us always". We pray for the Kingdom to come on earth. With divine inspiration, and modern tools, we are building the refinement of the Kingdom on earth as Jesus commanded us, day by day. That includes getting the texts as accurate as possible using the same divine inspiration as that which assembled the Bible in the early Church.

>>20195864
The canon is a set thing, an ontological category. It isn't an amorphous entity that changes every few years based on archeological evidence.

>>20195879
You do realize the canon was assembled gradually over 500 years using textual criticism methods and archeology, right? It wasn't even fully established after Jerome's time, and he discarded 1000s texts in Old Latin as inaccurate and not trustworthy in creating the Vulgate. It wasn't until the 600s that the Canon was finalized in the Christian world.

Textual refinement is an ongoing process, the same way it took 600 years to finalize the canon.

>>20195887
Is the canon divinely inspired? Is it θεόπνευστος, God-breathed (2 Tim. 3:16)? If so then it exists in a separate ontological category from every other text in the world. It was set the moment it was completed, regardless of human recognition.

>>20195887
btw there were vast textual inconsistencies between the Greek, Latin, Ge'ez, Coptic, Arabic, Gothic and Aramaic translations even after that for 1000s of years.

There's never been *one set text* for each book. In fact, in the past, it's likely 2 people 1000 miles apart in different languages would read vastly different versions of the Gospel, if they could read at all. That's assuming no scribal errors.

Modern textual criticism corrects these errors today, for the glory of God. Anyone who is against this is very dangerous and not to be trusted.

>>20195894
Actually I didn't express this clearly. What I mean is that the texts of the canon are θεόπνευστος. The set of texts that are θεόπνευστος is the canon. Being θεόπνευστος is the ontological category.

>>20195894
How was the canon established? Did God or did God not use human authors and textual methods to assemble it? The same way God was incarnated, the same way he uses human methods to establish and refine the texts.

When was the canon completed? When did divine guidance with regard to God's word stop? Give an exact date and cite a source that God's guided refining of the text stopped on that exact date.

>>20195900
What is this refinement of the text that you refer to? Will it be completed? Will you at some point arrive at the true text? When do you expect that might be?

>>20195897
Scholasticism was a mistake.

>>20195202
> be upstanding roman horse seller
> tether colt to post
> return to see some disheveled jew untying it
> "what the fuck are you doing"
> retarded jew mutters something about "the lord"
> approach him but get beaten up by retard jew's friends
> tfw

>>20195932
>roman
You done goofed.

>>20195921
By the way I'm not trying to antagonize anyone's faith or anything, but I think that one should not put too much trust into this sort of methodology, that's all. Especially when it leads you to start saying that older versions should be suppressed and other such nonsense.

>Morning in Europe - Americans asleep
>/lit/ is 10x more active
Why?

Im interested to know which Bible/s you use daily?
For me it’s the KJV Bible to take on commutes and The Didache Bible for study and to read the books that aren’t in the KJV.

Do non-protestant denominations discourage personal interpretations of the Bible? It doesn't sit right with me that I'm not to interpret the word of God for myself.

>>20196361
Define interpretation

>>20196390
The process of extracting meaning from a source

>>20195202
How can I honor my Mom if our relationship is strained? I don’t know where to start because their isn’t really that honorable.

>>20196465
*Their isn’t anything that honorable.

>>20195949
NTA but there's a difference between older and less accurate. Often the displacement of the "old" translation is because the new translation is being translated from an even older text that was not available when the previous translation was made. I haven't followed the debate to the letter but that's why *some* newer translations are better than the KJV.

>>20196361
People can make some wacky interpretations based on motivated reasoning. It's good to have a safeguard against that.

Can anyone itt recommend me a good book about Tabernacle? I'm writing a term paper on it rn, any suggestion would be helpful

>>20195530
Surprisingly both

>>20196040
For me, it's the Didache Bible and my 1914 printing of the Douay.

>>20195784
>I'm not a KJV Onlyist or any such thing (I use modern versions)

>>20196509
Nice. Any pictures of the DR?
I’d like to get a Douay to take with me but the pocket is too small and the regular is a bit big to travel with.
This KJV is my favourite Bible, it’s in the sweet spot between large and small and the money has gone into making the print amazing instead of flashy. You just get the Bible no images or references which I like a lot.

For me it's simple KJV reference bible and the commentary from the ESV Study Bible.

>>20196040
A paperback Douay Rheims. Sometimes I use my Weber-Gryson Vulgata when I want to feel like a big brain

Thoughts on this?

>>20196808
Maybe the older cohorts were taught to never question the Pope, or lived during the time of the best Pope in living memory?
It is pretty strange.

Where my fellow Presbyterians at?

I am not a Presbyterian. I do not believe in Calvinism.

>>20196689
Blessed.
>>20196808
Completely irrelevant to Christians. The "Holy Papa", that is. Call no man "Father".

My dad and I have been watching Jay Dyer videos. We are not Orthodox but we like the videos and find them interesting.

>>20196895
>We are not Orthodox
Praise the Lord, you are not Satanic Babylonian pagans.
>My dad and I have been watching Jay Dyer videos. we like the videos and find them interesting.
Blessed to be doing things with your Dad, and good that you find the content to be interesting. Unfortunately it takes 2 hours of listening to Jay Dyer to get 2 minutes of actual point, but he does indeed speak on interesting topics from time to time. Everyone has different informational needs though. I found him some time back while looking up discussions regarding Weird Scenes Inside the Canyon.

>>20196937
>Praise the Lord, you are not Satanic Babylonian pagans.
Is this satire?

So did the serpent have relations with Eve?

>>20196688
>Nice. Any pictures of the DR?
1/3

>>20197028
2/3

>>20196953
(For those who may not know, Theotokos is "Mary")

Crossing the waters as on dry land,
In that way escaping
From the evils of Egypt’s land,
The Israelites cried out exclaiming:
To our Redeemer and God, now let us sing.

Most Holy Theotokos save us.

With many temptations surrounding me,
Searching for salvation,
I have hastened unto you;
O Mother of the Word, and ever-Virgin,
From all distresses and dangers deliver me.

Most Holy Theotokos save us.

I ask you, O Virgin,
From the dangers deliver me;
For now I run to you for refuge,
With both my soul and my reasoning.

Now and forever, and to the ages of ages. Amen.

Diseased is the body and the soul;
Deem me truly worthy
Of divine guidance and your care;

A protection and shelter,
I have with you in my life,
You, the Theotokos and the Virgin,
Pilot me towards your port;
For you are the cause,
The cause of that which is good,
Support of the faithful,
The only all-praised One.

Most Holy Theotokos save us.

I entreat you, O Virgin,
Disperse the storm of my grief,
and the soul’s most inward confusion,
Scatter it far from me;

With most serious ailments,
And with the passions so dark,
I am being tested, O Virgin,
Come and bring help to me;
For I have known of you,
That you are without fail
the endless treasure of cures,
Only all-blameless One.

Deliver us,
All of your servants, from danger, O Theotokos;
After God, we all flee to you,
For shelter and covering,
As an unshakable wall and our protection.

Turn to me,
In your good favor, all praise-worthy Theotokos;
Look upon my grave illnesses,
Which painfully sting my flesh
and heal the cause of my soul’s pain and suffering.

>>20197035
3/3
Sometimes a page's text is printed a bit crooked (on less than 10 pages and all in the early OT), but thankfully I never lose any text. See pg. 45 here; page 46 on the other side is the same. I think the occasional oddities/imperfections like this give an old volume charm because it feels less "manufactured" in an assembly line sense.

>>20197041
>(For those who may not know, Theotokos is "Mary")
But all Christians know this, otherwise they wouldn't be Christians. For those who may not know--apparently (You)--Christ is the "Messiah."

>>20197041
Still don't see any Satan or Babylon. Meds.

>>20197052
>To our Redeemer and God, now let us sing.
>Most Holy Theotokos save us.
As they say, the devil is in the details.

>>20197058
>I can't see any Ishtar in that crypto devotional to her

>>20197063
>>20197066
>Source: It was revealed to me in a dream.

>>20196037
The Judaic consumption of the American spirit is more advanced and has destroyed many of my countrymen's ability to think critically or to seek out conversation.

>>20197086
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=To+our+Redeemer+and+God%2C+now+let+us+sing.++Most+Holy+Theotokos+save+us.&t=fpas&ia=web

>>20196465
I'd advise you to attempt to reconcile as you can, but intrinsically you'll know when such a time is natural versus when it would be forced. I would recommend keeping yourself open to reconciliation as often as you gently encourage it.
>>20196808
I'm torn on Catholicism, I respect the weight of tradition and history it carries but I feel like it is being attacked at the highest levels (and thus where it derived so much of its strength) by Satan whereas Prots which had less of a focus on rigid hierarchy and tradition is being attacked through the absence of such rules and boundaries. (see: fag churches)
The amount of evil in the many institutions of Christendom is staggering.

>>20197063
>After God, we all flee to you,
Yes I agree.

>>20197145
Even the "conservative" Southern Baptist preacher, John Piper, is saying that all Christians should get the covid vaccine (a forerunner of the mark of the beast).

>>20197171
There is no *after* God.

>>20197181
The Evangelicals were the most redpilled on the vax, which is kind of embarrassing.

>>20197197
After God is the church.

>>20197198
Were they? I have only seen Orthodox Christians speaking out against the "vaccine"!
Like I said, John Piper, a southern baptist is pro-vaccine.

>>20197235
I saw a poll somewhere, they had the lowest percentage of mRNA lab rats.

>>20197145
>The amount of evil in the many institutions of Christendom is staggering.
So what's the solution?

>>20197254
*Who
“Who” is the solution.

there is no excuse for not owning the 1611 edition, the best bible.

>>20197181
>>20197198
God gave me a mind to understand the insidious, it's a gift that has served me well because while I'm not a smart guy otherwise, I can look at stuff and see where I'd drive a knife if I wanted to cause the most harm:
The point in saying such a thing is that the very honorable and devout aspect of someone obeying their (presumably) faithful teachers and 'fathers' would be the best avenue to attack if you wanted to skip external influences and go straight into their hearts.
Satan is a lover of subversion, he enjoys perverting something holy and making it his own, his envy of God knows no bounds...if I wanted to drink evil vintages I would use the humble trust and faith man has in God as a means to chip away at his physical wellbeing. Corrupting those who are supposed to be shepherds to the Shepherd? It's a classic ploy.
>>20197254
The easy answer is to reject modernity embrace Bible
Yet that is insufficient as it insulates Christians from each other and abandons our seats of social and political power (few that there are). I might say to form 'grass-root' Biblical brotherhoods, though again that creates a million teams who all speak slightly different languages and would shatter many as Church remains their sole comfort in this world...

If we live in the beginning of the End Times, if this corruption of Christianity is indeed the slow turn of the knife that brings about unspeakable evils under the false interpretation of God then as uncomfortable as it seems, this decay is God's will. It is foretold many times over in the Bible as well.

However if not, I hope God will forgive our struggle against evil, even if it is His will that such things come to pass. I would say to combat these things we (Christians) must thoroughly educate ourselves in the Bible and the history of Christianity as a whole.
If by whatever means the Bible itself is corrupted, then we are all lost and may God preserve us from the howling dark.
Find a Church that is based and redpilled (to take an explanatory shortcut) and resist the teachings of modern tolerance and fairness as they are not there to make you a better man but a weaker Christian. Trust in the righteous anger in your heart when you observe evil, trust in Christ to arm you for the battles ahead, trust in God to work all things to His will, and trust in your brothers in Christ to stand against the tide.

>>20197181
I thought he was a Yankee feller.

>>20197181
He's a Converge Baptist, whatever that is.

God will cut down all of you idolators itt

>>20197909
I hope He will have mercy on the Catholics and "Orthodox™" having been fooled into Satanic Babylonian paganism by Ishtar.

>>20197959

>>20197999

I worry less about the idolatry of certain pieces of Catholicism and Orthodoxy, I am certain they would be able to answer honestly if they as an individual are taking it too far, but rather the implications of the hierarchy being consumed by Satanic influences.
This is equally concerning regarding Prots etc etc, but the authority of one Prot church is less likely to trickle down and affect another one.
The consequences of the Catholic Church being diseased to the point of true heresy and apostasy would be world shattering. I don't mean just the accusations (even if sincere) of idol worship, but all of Christendom would be put on a dark path were something like that to happen.

I am ignorant to the extenuating contexts of "...and the gates of Hell will not prevail against it", but what guarantee is there that the once greatest institution on Earth is immune to the temptations and forces of sin? Pride ought not to blind us to the vulnerability of the Church, and it should not blind us to how good the Church, historically, can be.

I say this with good intentions, as always I loathe the divide between Christians of any kind.
Proverbs 6:19

44.42188233335195, -71.24999965394035

>>20198225
>"...and the gates of Hell will not prevail against it"
This refers to the true ekklesia, the congregation of the called out, which consists only of individuals with authentic inner faith, not one member less nor more. These individuals are also a part of many institutions, including Catholicism and "Orthodoxy™", but far from limited to those. There are also many members who are not a part of any institution. Together they all form the Body of Christ. and are attuned to inner instruction from Him, doing His bidding in ways both conscious/unconscious, overt/covert, obvious/subtle. God needs members of His Body in every possible situation and context. The lack of specific institution is part of what prevents the gates of Hades from prevailing against it. You can't stop that which you cannot easily identify and control.

>>20197860
He is from Tennessee.
>>20197874
He is called a Baptist but he also mixes in C*lvinist doctrines such as predestination.

>>20197999
Roman Catholics always like to talk about how the Russian church is KGB and what not but they ignore how badly the Vatican is compromised with Satanists and globalists and extreme liberals such as Francis. I am not Orthodox but it seems to me that the Roman Catholic church is at least equally as compromised if not even more so.

>>20198361
Well yeah, both institutions split from a single one that began as part of the Roman state subversion of the true ekklesial movement.

>>20198382
So do you think that in for example the Middle Ages and so on, there were always genuine and sincere Christians within these insitutions despite the leadership being corrupt

>>20195202
imagine unironically reading the bible

>>20198399
>>20198317

Why has evangelicalism in America become so effeminate and sissy
It's all about mushy feelings and like some hipster pastor sitting in a downtown coffee shop with a Macbook in front of him talking about emotional stuff with gay little piano music in the background.
Of course aesthetics are not the important thing, but at the same time, you have to admit it is understandable why many young zoomers are drawn to trad cath larping because it had much cooler and more masculine aesthetics.

>>20198462
(((Scofield))) and his (((fellows))) serve Satan and are weakening the faithful to make room for sin and the coming darkness

>>20198399
I think many people are not fit to handle the intricacies of faith and politics, naturally I assume there are plenty of people who simply wanted to live quiet lives, love their family, and honor Christ.
I can only be faithfully optimistic that God knows many people sought Him even if they were led astray at times by false prophets...still that is no excuse to an extent, I think mainly women and children would be more likely excused as it is a man's job to interpret the faith and act as the spiritual head of the family.

>>20198240
>44.42188233335195, -71.24999965394035
You want company, friendo?

I know each generation has likely had it's students of Revelation, but I wonder if this era will be the one that really kicks things off, I almost hope for it as I don't want my children to endure the seriously bad times...

Revelation can easily be celebrated but I think the bad times will be so bad even Christians will fear the tormenting eye.

>>20198777
Black israelites are on the rise too

>>20198777
>students of Revelation
what do you mean

>>20195202
The penalty for false prophecy was death in the old testament, so not surprised he would do the same.

>>20198814
People who place a tremendous amount of time and energy trying to decipher if the world is entering the stages of apocalypse outlined by Revelations in the Bible, and how obscure those signs may be.

Wannabe prophets, in a sense

>>20198777
CHECKED Holy Sevens
I am a decades long "student of Revelation" and consider 18:4 to be among the most important aspects, and something of a summarizing "pillar point" of the entire Holy Bible. It applies to all aspects of Babylon, and not just a single one like a particular institution or such.

This book does a good job in proving atheism, pantheism, and gnosticism objectively wrong.

This book warned of many things such as the alien UFO deception (they are actually demons) and the liberalization of the church.

>>20198842
https://youtu.be/XKWcAsT8Sqc

This man knows

>>20198814
Those who seek to know the last truths of this material world, which will be the return of Christ and the ending of reality in a sense. That's how I'd see them at least.
>>20198842
>wannabe prophets
Eh more devout students of the Bible as it has yet to be.
>>20198845
It's both scary to think of living through these times but what's worse is having children endure the lead up...of course let God's will be done, but dang.

I posted a few days ago asking about what to get my wife who wants to read and a few of you recommended Word on Fire so I got them in the mail today. Thanks again

Feminism is not compatible with Christianity. Paul makes this clear in the Bible. Furthermore many Christian philosophers wrote about the role of women and showed that they are to be subordinate to men.
Also they do not teach you this in school, but here is an interesting fact. When the early feminist movements, womens' rights movements, and womens' suffrage were happening in the 19th and 20th centuries, did you know that many of those women practiced witchcraft? It is true.
https://youtu.be/o_2088aX2XM

>>20198882
Yes, my own son is in his 20s and I warn him that he will likely face the coming AI/robotics counterfeit God and the Neualink (or similar) interface chips. The AI "God" will self manufacture things that we can barely conceive of, including nanotech that it will inject into us and overwrite our organic image of God, and remake us in the image of machine. But even before that point it will take over all decision making, economic, educational, medical, etc., to start with because "it can see and understand all of the data better than us and make the most intelligent possible determinations and fix every aspect of society".

Anyway, yes, quite terrifying, but at the same time, the more of these things I understand, how that all ties in with the original spirit of Babylon, and Satan's constant attempts to counterfeit the works of God, the more comfort I gain from seeing that the Holy Bible is actually true and I can put my faith in the God who inspired it.

>>20198997
This has already begun with the so-called "vaccines" for covid.

>>20198997
is he a good Christian?
have you shown him 4chan? better not have

>>20198997
how old are you

OC

>>20199039

>>20199045

>>20199053
V2

>>20198462
In the same vein of this, how do modern American evangelical churches come up with their names?? It makes total sense to me why Catholic/Orthodox parishes are called "Sacred Heart", "St. Joseph", etc., or similarly protestant churches also named after a saint or by their denomination. But how do people get "Elevation", "Counterpoint", "Fireplace", "Impact". Do these names actually mean anything? Also why do they never actually say what they really believe, i.e. are they more Baptist, Reformed, whatever. I am a baffled Catholic struggling to understand the minds of trendy prots.

If you go to one of these churches I would love to hear from you.

>>20199019
I showed him 4chan years ago, pointing out how many of the sicknesses of humanity manifest themselves in particularly clear manners when anonymity and low moderation allow such relatively free flow, but that it also allows for some genuine communication, expression, insight, etc. He had no interest and prefers to interact only with his real world friends in group chats.

I taught his Sunday School class at church for a while, but limited that to the materials that were provided, not wanting to risk getting pitchforked for actually teaching the Bible beyond the usual "safe" lessons, but he got the full real deal at home. He's presently going through a period of doubt due to all of the things he's learn from rather deep studies into "science". I know that his heart has been set on a pretty good course and trust that God will lead him back to Him, just as I had my own period of wandering.
>>20199031
Nearly 50.

is this correct?

>>20199106
No. what sort of mind could cook up such nonsense? sickening, even.

>>20199106
and Seth stands for "placed" or "appointed"
so it also lies.

As for some truth, the whole bloodline spells out the Gospel (Genesis 5)
look at the meaning of the names.

>>20199097
I don't know. A lot of times it starts with "First" as in first one in the town, such as First Baptist Church and so on.

>>20199121
it, or similar, seems to be a basis for this
was wondering how the synagogue of satan arises, if he doesn't have a "seedline" per se

>>20199106
I don’t know I feel like it isn’t but if looked at it allegorically it just seems like the “sin” was Eve knowing the serpent. Cain for some reason isn’t listed as Adams descendants and Jesus called the Jews offsprings of serpents and a den of vipers. I’d like to know what Christians at that time like irenaus thought of this doctrine. It really has been bugging me as I learned of the two seed doctrine last week and now feel like committing suicide. Also Jesus saying he’s coming for the lost house of Israel. And the Maharabatta also treats racemixing as a serious crime and adultery was the first sin in that. I’ve called on the lord before and he has answered my prayers but the arguments I see on /pol/ and christogenea just black pill me.

>>20199147
doesn't seem too much of a stretch?

>>20199157
How do we know all Europeans are apart of this? Some European tribes seem to be their own thing like the basque. Also how does RH negative blood factor into this?

>>20199060
What did effeminate mean back then?

>parents love vaccines, love UFOs, spend all their time watching TV and seething about Russia, think I'm crazy for going to church

>>20199191
faggots

>>20198997
None of that ai stuff will happen and you sound like you really have no knowledge on how it all even works.

>>20199193
Pray for them, they are under the sorceries of Babylon like almost everyone. Honor them and be respectful, be understanding.

>>20198919
I suppose one must ask the question on which rights do women deserve and which do they not.

>>20199205
I actually do know "how it all even works", and can clearly see where the progress leads, and especially how it all works together. I read daily news on AI, robotics, automation, nanotech, DeepMind, Neuralink, etc. All of what I said will absolutely come to pass.

>>20199210
Thank you, I will pay for them

>>20199223
Nah.

>>20199223
glorified machine learning will only rule those who have faith in it, and will of course be used to justify tyrannizing those who don't, but what's new there?

>>20199157
>>20199106
This whole thing seems like a huge stretch, especially considering that Christ and the Jews that He denounced had common ancestry.
Plus, if you think the real point of Christianity is that only people of a special bloodline will be saved then you're literally trying to return to Judaism. The Gospel is for everybody, and who you were born as doesn't matter next to who you can be once you're born again in Christ.

>>20199253
can you explain how this fits with John 8?

>>20199223
70% of “Nanotechnology” is fantasy. Some stuff like what they have put into mosquitoes is true.

https://wiki.chadnet.org/nano-nonsense-25-years-of-charlatanry

>>20199246
Yeah, you'll see, if you live long enough. I may even see it take over medical decisions in my own lifetime. It will become the standard to just feed problems into an AI and do whatever it says to be the best "fix", in all aspects of society. But that's all just for starters. Heck, just the other day an AI came up with I think it was 40,000 new lethal chemical compounds within an hour or few. It's all very early days yet...just getting started.

>>20199263
Jesus isn't *literally* saying that the Jews are descendants of the Devil, since both He and they are descended from Abraham. He is denouncing their hard hearts and mocking the way they insist their ancestry makes their rejection of Him correct simply by virtue of their relation to a prophet.
Remember that before his conversion, Paul was one of the same Jews who Jesus would have named the descendants of the Devil. What mattered more in the end, Paul's ancestry or his actions?

>>20199265
You're looking at what is happening right now, what "they" are capable of *right now*, but you're not looking at how quickly things advance, and what directions things flow. I've personally experienced having a dad that grew up with no electricity or running water, to having a computer in his pocket that's connected to an always on global network.

>>20199164
Freemasons call themselves 'Sons of Cain'.
Perhaps it is more adoptive than biological.

>>20199291
what if they were descended from Abraham via Esau?

>>20199164
the sin was Eve being fooled into being prideful and disobeying God.
Christ is merely calling them out on their sin and iniquity by that statement.

>lost house of Israel
Aka jews who've strayed from God.

>comparing Christianity to a point in pagan drivel
please don't.

you shouldn't even consider that nonsense seriously.
To finish it off
2 Peter 1:20
>Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

that theory is made up nonsense that someone warped Scripture to come up with.

>>20199277
the people who did not take satan's shot for the coronacoof are not going to sign up for their SmartHealthChip. and it's not like they need a super computer to manufacture poisons, if they intend to use them

>>20199277
And the first story at Slashdot just now happened to be California looking to legislate against AI hiring software. Only those blessed by AI "God" will have jobs in the future, whatever jobs are even left after the AI/robotics/automation revolution reaches its full glory.

>>20199325
>thinks it matters what you sign up for or not
They will launch microscopic bots that will fly up your nose and turn you into a heterosexual, son.

>>20199318
The descendants of Esau are the Edomites. The ancestry of the Israelite people is recorded in the OT, and the Jews of Christs' time would have been very aware of their own lineage due to the various positions ascribed to members of each house of Israel.
This 'theory' is bogus and seems like an attempt to force heterodox elements into the Christian concept of salvation by tying it to material ancestry. By pursuing it you lose sight of the message Christ incarnated to teach, that the contents of your heart and not the material circumstances of your body are what determine the fate of your soul, as He said when He told the Jews that He could raise children of stones up unto Abraham.

>>20199346
adding onto it as another anon, before the point is even brought up, the whole idea of that theory is bogus. so along with it not mattering, it's drivel.

>>20199346
the Edomites moved into Judah during the Babylonian captivity. later they took control via the Edomites Antipater and Herod and formed Judea. the theory, doesn't seem too far fetched, is that these Edomites of Judea are not Israelites (of Judah)

>>20199401
mate, how many times do we have to tell you. it is drivel.

>>20199433
you're saying that an Edomite is an Israelite?

>>20199445
Are you saying that
>being descended from Esau makes one a literal descendant of the Devil
>the message concerning ancestry repeated numerous times in the NT was just an epic prank and salvation actually depends on who your ancestors were
>Paul was actually descended from Satan
?

>>20199477
>yes
>maybe
>paul claimed to be of benjamin (ie an israelite)

Is it true we are all redeemed in heaven through God’s power?

>>20199445
i'm saying they're all sons of Abraham.

>>20199500
be more thorough in your question, if you could.

>>20199502
i thought the point was that the Esau line got mingled with the serpent's seed since he took Canaanite wives

>>20199500
>1 Cor 6:9-10 KJV
9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
What do you think?

>>20199519
the point is moot. that whole theory derives from warping Scripture.
why are you so adamant?

>>20199531
moot as in meaningless.
who thought of it having two absolutely contradicting meanings?

>>20199522
Alternatively,
Lamentations 3:31-33 NIV
"For no one is cast off by the Lord forever. Though he brings grief, he will show compassion, so great is his unfailing love"
1 Colossians 19-20 NIV
"For God was pleased to have all His fullness dwell in Him, and through Him to reconcile to Himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through His blood, shed on the cross"
1 Corinthians 15:22 NIV
"As all die in Adam, so all will be made alive in Christ."

>>20199566
Checked. Also, this explains why the Catholic notion of purgatory seems a lot more likelier than the Protestant/Baptist/Anabaptist notion than you're all going to hell

>>20199566
And how do you reconcile that with the repeated, explicit warnings that the aforementioned sinners will not enter the kingdom of God?

>>20199531
it seems to be you who is adamant. scripture's gatekeepers have done an absolutely horrible job and left a lot of room for doubt
here, let's try this from the other end. when Christ says, in the Revelation:
>I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.
to whom is he referring? according to you he's talking drivel, i guess?

>>20199587
Obviously (according to you) he's saying that only white evropeans will enter heaven because Jews are literally devil-spawn.

>>20199566
>>20199512
> "For God was pleased to have all His fullness dwell in Him, and through Him to reconcile to Himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through His blood, shed on the cross"
This is what I was thinking about. Just letting the Lord settle every matter in Earth and in Heaven. Not saying I’m going to rob a bank, kill or rape anyone. Just feel like there is a very big existential component to life, even feeling nihilistic sometimes. I know what the Bible says about things of this nature but, it feels wrong sometimes. I guess the thought of it all adding up to my redemption soothes my conscience enough to keep moving forward.

>>20199586
because those are unrepentant sinners. You can't be forgiven if you don't ask to.

>>20199594
King Of Kings

>>20199587
mate, that's Scripture being warped and you say it is room for doubt.
Christ is calling them out on their actions, as i've said.
Jews who aren't, as in ones who claim to follow God's commandments and laws, and do not do so.
the ones that called God a liar and crucified His Son, for example.
Nothing to do with literally anything else.

>>20199597
or worse even, if you don't think you have to repent at all.

>>20199597
Same guy who posted this >>20199500
I think you just helped answer my question. Through repentance, renewing your mind and letting God settle all maters, redemption in heaven is possible. Thanks everyone.

>>20199649
What do you mean "in heaven"?

>>20199717
The destination after life or the immaterial realm that he controls. I know I am giving 2 answers but I feel like the concept means both, in a sense.

>>20199743
i mean what do meant with redemption in heaven.

>>20199620
i.e. the ones who are not "of his sheep", because they have the serpent's seed in them

>>20199765
not of His sheep because they're in sin.
how long will you keep insisting on that heresy?

>>20199754
I guess in the sense that if you could look at a single persons life and see their whole “story” and what it all meant, as a whole. That even if there were some things that could be considered questionable (and you did repent for them with a sincere heart) but did them anyways because well… you kind of had to. That God would redeem and accept you in Heaven and on earth because you accepted his love and light but did not resist evil at every, single, step and lived life to its fullness in a world that is wicked and backwards. Idk does that make sense?

>>20199765
you literally were proven wrong in that idiocy when you tried to posit it through Eve, and you keep trying to shoehorn it somewhere. why?

What is the proper form of worship?
Orthodox say that their liturgical worship is how you are supposed to do it and everything else is wrong.
I don't know. I am confused anons.

>>20199795
Dunno who told you that, there are Catholic churches that use the Eastern/Byzantine rite and Orthodox churches that use the Western rite.

>>20199799
What about baptist churches

>>20199788
Jesus:
>I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
the Edomites (in Judea) are of Esau, not of Israel. so their line goes back to Cain
>Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
does this just come from nowhere? why is their blood so cursed?

>>20199786
No evil you "had to" commit, really. If you do truly repent, that is between you and God, and i cannot answer.
Accepting God means rejecting evil, there's no "top of the wall" because the wall itself is evil already. If living life to its fullest means compromising with sin, it is not a good life.
Matthew 5:29-30
> If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.

>>20199816
>>20199833
If an Edomite was baptized and joined the Church, would he still be damned because he was supposedly descended from the devil?

>>20199795
The best worship is the one that you are truly engrossed in.
There are places and people to worship in and alongside, but whenever you can devote your heart entirely to Him is beautiful. I was told by a friend of mine that prayer and worship are the sweetest sounds to God's ear, and fulfills His greatest desire; to be a Father to you.

>>20199795
>1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
Rejoice evermore.

Pray without ceasing.

In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.


this is the barebones.

>>20199839
Matthew 15:
>22 And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil.
>23 But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us.
>24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
>25 Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.
>26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.
>27 And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table.
>28 Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

>>20199851
>>20199853
But what about specific things that you do? Orthodox are adament that their liturgical rituals how the Bible teaches us to worship, and that Protestants and Roman Catholics do not worship correctly.

>>20199853
should've maybe also greentexted the last phrase, makes it seem like a part of the verse.

>>20199851
A bit wrong right in the end there, if i am to be exacting.
He already is (has been and will forever be) your Father. What does delight God so is following His will.

>>20199878
that's an orthodox issue.
I'd rather we be natural in it.
you're always talking to God. do you think He'd rather prefer something genuine from the heart, or a rote ritual which you could do without caring?
mind you, they can be genuine, and i reckon most are.
i'm not very versed in orthodoxy, so take it with a grain of salt.

>>20199816
Esau is the son of Isaac, who is the son of Abraham. at no point does it link to Cain.
the Canaanites were to be exterminated for their sin; they were idolaters, and as God warned, they'd be thorns in Israel's sides, and spikes in their eyes.
they're cursed because they're sinners.
stop trying to shoehorn heresy into Scripture.

>>20199871
Got it, so ancestry doesn't matter.

>>20199836
>No evil you "had to" commit, really
I understand what you are saying, this would be a situation where you literally do not choose the evil before you. It is just a part of life.
>If you do truly repent, that is between you and God, and i cannot answer.
I appreciate your honesty here
>Accepting God means rejecting evil
Sure, I definitely reject evil but is it possible to reject it in your heart and you mind but allowing your soul to remain at peace while you commit some sort of evil? And I’m not speaking about anything heinous here, something dubious or not completely upright. Idk it seems like a difficult life to completely reject sin in practice and in your heart while still living a life that God has given you and wants to use to show others his love.

>>20199999
Checking bot here: check em.

>>20199999
>seems like a difficult life
John 16:33
>I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace. In this world you will have trouble. But take heart! I have overcome the world.

>is it possible to remain at peace committing evil
No.

The life that God gave you and wants you to live/how He wants to use you will never cross into sin or any kind of evil.

>>20199950
it would certainly matter if you were trying to unravel the history and "Jews" larping as Israelites have convinced Christians to be their gatekeepers, while descendents of Israel are convinced they're something else entirely

>>20200038
and, to clear up, i reckon anon here means "jews" as in followers of Judaism.

>>20200045
Jews as in Edomites, descended from Esau. many of them claim to be atheists, so you don't need to waste time with the "Judaism" canard

>>20199948
Genesis 36:
>Now these are the generations of Esau, who is Edom.
>Esau took his wives of the daughters of Canaan
Canaan of course was cursed. Noah was perfect in his bloodlines. so it's nothing to do with him. but there was a woman on board the ark who was of the line of Cain, and Ham mated with her. take your pick as to whose wife she was

>>20199878
They are adamant that Mary had no other children after Jesus and that she ascended into Heaven like Christ too. You should tell them "opinion discarded".

>>20200060
God wouldn't have allowed that, He was cleansing the world of sin, for starters. also literally no mention of any of that anywhere.
the whole curse was put on Canaan, son of Ham, by Noah.
once more, nothing to do with that heretical theory.

>>20200089
Cainaanites.

>>20200096
that one made me chuckle. hah.

>>20200096
if you're serious though, come on.
as i've asked before, why are you still trying to shoehorn this heresy?

>>20200089
so god resorts to flooding the entire earth to get rid of the nephilim, then noah goes ahead and creates these canaanites out of sheer pique? that's some curse

>>20200124
i will not engage further, as i reckon everyone scrolling down this has been entirely convinced of proper Scripture against all that.
keep your lies and cheap sophistry.
they'll get you nowhere, and you'd be better off turning to truth.

One of the most important factors/aspects that people do not realize regarding the coming AI "God" is that there will be a battle that drives it into being. One nation might say "well, we're not really aiming for that", but then you can bet that others like China *are*, so the drive will kick in that we'd best build the best "God" we can so that theirs doesn't take over. Either way you slice it, it's coming.

How do I start truly reading this? I always get overwhelmed

>>20200842
Just read what you can, as you can, in a version you can understand. Use study Bible or commentary notations to help you when you get particularly confused.

>Bible talks about the promises to Israel
>Jewish youtube channel admits they are the descendents of Judah, not Israel and that none of the Biblical promises apply to them
Did they mess up here?
https://youtu.be/N0huH58nb0k

>>20201112
>promises to Israel
From God right?
But have they been faithful?

He forever is

>>20201099
>study Bible or commentary notations
No, no one should be doing that without first listening to our holy God inspired patristics.

>>20200072
>They
Those filthy Christians

grrrr

>>20198859
Worth reading his books on the soul after death and Genesis too. In his book on the soul he exposes near-death experiences, out-of-body experiences and their connection to the occult and demonic forces. The Genesis book is super out of print so your best option is either to read the shitty scan of it online or to borrow it from a priest like I did, though since it’s super expensive that might be tough unless your priest is bro-tier

>>20195897
> Modern textual criticism corrects these errors today, for the glory of God.

>muh Edomites
>muh Satanic Babylonian pagans
>muh Jooz
These threads are abominations

>>20201397

>>20195202
i have a ylt but i want the apocrypha, any recommendations on where to buy it?

I wanted to share my thoughts in Sunday school class this morning but I am too autistic so I just sat there in silence like always.

>>20201971
It's probably for the best.

>>20201971
You can share with us if you'd like anon, maybe get a good script together for ease of recall.

>>20201993
>You can share with us
This. Someone here might belittle you, but someone in your church might pitchfork you. You can always try running it by us first and then deciding if you want to share it in your class.

>>20196040

>>20195202
ISAIAH 55
6 Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near

7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.

9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

PSALM 103
8 The LORD is merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and plenteous in mercy.

9 He will not always chide: neither will he keep his anger for ever.

10 He hath not dealt with us after our sins; nor rewarded us according to our iniquities.

11 For as the heaven is high above the earth, so great is his mercy toward them that fear him.

12 As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.

13 Like as a father pitieth his children, so the LORD pitieth them that fear him.

14 For he knoweth our frame; he remembereth that we are dust.

ROMANS 4
3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

ROMANS 10
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

>>20195202
What biblical books do I need to read if I want crazy old testament stuff like leviathans and evangelion angels?

>>20203509
This one. Here is what the Old Testament prophesied about, shown more clearly

REVELATION 9
And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

2 And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.

3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.

4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.

5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.

6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.

7 And the shapes of the locusts were like unto horses prepared unto battle; and on their heads were as it were crowns like gold, and their faces were as the faces of men.

8 And they had hair as the hair of women, and their teeth were as the teeth of lions.

9 And they had breastplates, as it were breastplates of iron; and the sound of their wings was as the sound of chariots of many horses running to battle.

10 And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.

11 And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

12 One woe is past; and, behold, there come two woes more hereafter.

I don't buy it. I don't buy how anyone can buy it save for those with a psychological need.

>>20203509
book of revelation is where you find the most surreal out there stuff

>>20203833
You may turn your back to God, but God will never turn his back to you.
May you one day get free from those shackles of hate and resentment and find happiness in our Lord.

>>20203867
you're just in it for reinforcing your holier than thou attitude aren't you?

Was the "chariot of fire" that carried Elijah to heaven an actual UFO?

You are reading through your Westminster Larger Catechism today right /bt/?

>>20203880
no, stop projecting

>>20204129
do we believe in kinism here?

>>20204129
>>20204204
sorry anon didnt mean to reply to you

Do I read the gospels first?

>>20204280
Yeah, they're the best place to start.

>>20198769
didn't god say be good to secular people?

>>20204288
Cool thanks

>>20204303
Be good is to act as Christ would, and encourage them through deed and demeanor to see the truth.

>"Do not trust the mindset"
Is likely referring to listening to the "conventional" wisdom of people who reject and refuse the existence of God based on pseudoscience and semantic arguments.

>>20204280
Yes

It's weird how the NT makes the OT click and the OT makes the NT click.
I didn't get 'it' until I absolutely got 'it'. Then I couldn't stop getting 'it' and now everywhere I look I see 'it'.
Is that normal

>>20201960
No, I’m dead serious.

>>20205093
Too bad the Catholics don't listen to that woman.

Who wrote the book of Revelation?

>>20205099
Catholics are pagan polytheists, why would they listen to a Christian?

>>20205093
>>20201397
How do you start reading patristics? I have a copy of Holmes' "The Apostolic Fathers" but I'm not sure what else I should be reading. There are some patristic bible commentaries on this website, but there's so much that it seems overwhelming.

https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home

>>20195530
It’s great. I don’t think it’s canon, but it goes to show that a lot of second temple Jews expected the son of man messiah to show up just like how Jesus did, leaving them without excuse

>>20203509
Revelation, Ezekiel, Job, Genesis

>>20205204
John

>>20199191
That is a very good question (the term in question is more literally translated as "soft"), but a better question is what is the context of the sentence? The context is not a list of rules that all Christians must live by, but a list of practices which are engaged in by a specific community that Paul believes must be rectified in order for it to prosper. This occurs many times in the Epistles and Acts, not least of all when he circumcised Timothy - yet for some reason, that's not the one people quote why they try to push their agenda based on out of context bible quotes.

>>20199878
You should check out the Didache if you want to see how early Christians worshipped, as if there was any sort of uniformity to it or as though their cultural practices translated into mandatory for salvation. Christ said the only mandatory practices are baptism and the Eucharist - everything after that is just to help you become a better Christian.

>>20196040
>use daily?
The Bible Gateway app. I own several lovely bibles but the app is the only one convenient enough to use daily. I have it with me in the bath, on the train, at work, and so on.

>>20203509
Try reading Saint Hildegard of Bingen's writings, you can find them on any of the usual sites. Here's a good sample:
http://www.hildegard-society.org/p/liber-divinorum-operum.html

>>20203509
1 Enoch and the Book of Jasher

I give up. I've been trying my best for over 2 years now but I can't bring myself to believe. I read books by saints and doctors of the Church, I read articles and watched documentaries, and still can't find it convincing. It makes no sense to me that this world is created by and for God and yet he left no tangible proof of himself, not even a single sign that everyone could see for themselves so they have a fair chance of deciding what path to go. Not only that, he also made the world in a way that the reasonable conclusion is that what we see doesn't require any supernatural or even immaterial explanation and Scripture needs to be interpreted with a lot of charity to be reconciled with the status quo. Faith seems to be more of a psychological disposition than a supernatural gift, and the kind of people it speks to are those who would repeat after Paul that if the dead are not risen, let's eat and drink.
Anyway, now that the door of faith are closed, how should I live so that I don't get condemned, just in case? What I heard is that a vain statement that one should follow the natural law to get saved despite unbelief but what does it mean? Should I never commit mortal sin from now on? Even many catholics can't go a week without it.

>>20205923
Have you tried praying for the gift of faith? Do it. Ask and you will receive. And read Plotinus' on beauty. Take special note of his description of fire that burns and is not diminished. I'll give you a better reply in the daylight hours.

>>20205885
Those aren't biblical.

>>20205923
>It makes no sense to me that this world is created by and for God and yet he left no tangible proof of himself, not even a single sign that everyone could see for themselves so they have a fair chance of deciding what path to go.
If there was tangible proof, everyone would be a "Christian" and no faith would be required, which defeats the whole purpose. Instead, he left just enough evidence for us to realise the truth but be left with the option of rejecting it.

>>20205934
I'll have a look into Plotinus, thanks. I prayed all the time but it wasn't 100% sincere because neither was my faith. I always prayed the skeptic's prayer, you could say. "O Lord, if there is a Lord, save my soul, if I have a soul".
>>20205953
If you ask me, the only ones who have an honest freedom to accept or reject God are the angels and those who spoke with God directly or had him reveal himself. Otherwise it's a matter of believing the revelation is real "on faith" and often contrary to what everyday experience tells you, and if I was God I wouldn't require that from my creations.
It's not true that everyone would just become christian. Many angels rejected God. Saint Thomas had all the evidence he could want and still doubted. The pharisees saw Lazarus leave his tomb and didn't believe.

>>20205550
The best place to start is the ANF, ante-nicene fathers, 10 vol set, and the 28 vol NPNF, nicene post nicene fathers, which is split into 2 14 vol sets. This has been made freely available online for anyone interested.

>>20205944
Whether real or fiction these particular books are 100% biblical and full of Godly insight.

>>20205923
I can’t help you. I don’t believe in science, and religiously crusade against this disgusting age of “reason”.

>death to the world
You can’t be born again, unless you first die

>>20206043
tangible proof removes free will.
you couldn't really freely and by choice love God if He were here in a mighty throne somewhere. you'd be forced to.
there's just enough for a choice, and when you've chosen, then does God show Himself.

>>20206043
and yes, there still are miracles happening, but people try to "reason them out" and don't believe.

>>20206474
Again, fallen angels, st. Thomas and the pharisees all had tangible proof and still rejected God or didn't believe.
>there still are miracles happening
name one

>>20206474
God’s mercy works according the measure of love you have for Him. You have to make your heart His mighty throne, and then you no longer will be able not to see Him, everywhere, everything is His.

> Holy and terrible is his name: [10] The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. A good understanding to all that do it: his praise continueth for ever and ever.

>>20206560
What do they have to do with anything?

>>20206560
they had "proof". miracles made by Him, and His own word. which they chose not to believe, contrary to the blessed men who did.
fallen angels did it out of pride.
>name one
Why would i? you will doubt me.
a woman at my church has been cured. she would have had to amputate a leg and have several other operations; she now is only having to do PT.

>>20204556
i think >>20206569 is gonna help you make sense of that.
so, yes, absolutely. you get baffled at how much prophecy is in the OT when you realize.

I've reread a bit of John, and something comes to mind.
did Pilate believe? after Christ talked to him he tried to free Him. stood on his point of writing "King of the Jews".
I think he realized who Christ was, but did not act upon it to follow Him.

>>20206560
I used to be on drugs, in and out of jail, hostile, and selfish. But then I found God, so 180 on everything, started going to Church, want to go to the desert and become an unapproachable anchorite/bum/monk. Priest wants to send me to seminary instead of a monastery says “there’s nothing wrong being an Hieromonk”. So just out of obedience I’m thinking maybe I should get ordained, this is not possible for everyone.

You see, I found God and He saved my life. And that is a miracle.

>>20206279
>100% biblical
>not in the bible

>>20206918
not in *your* bible

>dad-anon posts yesterday about AI being the coming destruction of mankind
"Well that's an interesting take though I don't know enough about it t-"
>machine learning
>DARPA
>prediction engines
>defense systems
>retaliation protocols
>social behavior optimization
mfw

>>20206918
Its about the Bible. Just like this thread. Thread is 100% biblical, because we’re discussing the Bible and whatever relates to it.

>>20207002
Jasher isn’t in anyone’s. But it doesn’t violate doctrine, its just a good thing to know whats in it.

god seems like a chud to me

Is there a "backup" for the faithful who have been deceived with false teachings and practices by antichrist preachers/teachers?
I don't mean our petty squabbles of interdenominational conflicts (of which many aren't the norm for most average people) but for people who are taught by false prophets and do wish to serve the Lord but have their faith intentionally skewed away?
I ask because even in intellectual circles so many Christians have absolutely no idea what is even in the Bible, to the point of being unable to present even entry level counter-arguments for many modern questions regarding the faith, is it true ignorance born of predestination (not the Calvinistic sense) towards sin or are they simply unable to discern the truth?

>>20205923
Catholicism is false, God is true. Do not read books by "saints" and "doctors of the Church™", walk in faith, every step you take instead. Faith is not believing in some intellectual construct, it is a *walk*. You choose that walk and reject the walks of this world and talk to God constantly. He will make Himself known to you in ways that transcend all "intellectual concepts".

>>20207099
It would take extensive essays and visual demonstrations to even begin communicating enough of that to really sink home the realities of these things that lay ahead. Its abilities of self manufacture probably hold the most important key to start seeing. Think about this...self manufacturing its own means of self manufacturing...it will make improvements, *very* rapidly as it approaches full singularity.

>>20207418
The Holy Bible is our backup. You go straight to it and study for yourself. *Consider* the opinions/insights of others regarding interpretations and such, but do not ever grant those opinions/insights a status of being gospel themselves, but rather merely potentials that you consider in your own direct self study. God had a reason for giving us a codified Scripture and did not leave us dependent on trust in the institutions of men.

>>20207099
>prediction engines
BTW, that's a great insight. It's the Babylonian counterfeit of prophecy.
>>20207617
I should add to this to imagine the sheer complexity it will be capable of, dwarfing anything humans could ever achieve no matter how long we had. The AI will be able to analyze and create at astounding levels of speed and complexity, determine exactly how to actually manufacture that which it devises, then build whatever it needs in order to execute. At first it will need us to bring it the needed "ingredients", but at a certain point it will have bots mining what it needs and "Tesla trucks" self shipping to it, and we can do nothing but stand and watch.

>>20207591
>reject the walks of this world and talk to God constantly
>He will make Himself known to you in ways that transcend all "intellectual concepts".
Thank you Dionysius

humans cannot know other's souls as things in themselves, that's why God is the only legitimate arbitrator of justice.
>but human society cannot function if we do not implement practical justice
And? Life is meant to be a test. You will suffer enormously and you will turn the other cheek. You will own nothing, you will be shot and stabbed, sexually assaulted, and you will accept it all. They pale in comparison to eternal salvation.

Saint Maximus the Confessor proved atheism, gnosticism, and pantheism objectively wrong.

>>20208188
Things are not "proven" nor disproved by any amount of mental concept.

>>20208292
He showed how they are incompatible with the Bible and also are false on philosophical grounds.

>>20208292
Is that so? Prove it.

>>20208326
Proving/disproving is not within my arrays of concern, only faith. With faith, God proves Himself. Anything outside of that and its implications is but vapors.

>>20208449
The proof of God is all around us. Jesus told them that even though a man rises from the dead, they still will not believe. They had hardened their hearts. Disbelief is not a matter of evidence or lack thereof. It is about the state of your heart.
The point of the previous post which for some reason you wanted to argue against, is that atheism, pantheism, and gnosticism fall apart on their own grounds. I think you just wanted to act holier than thou and more spiritual others.

Friendly fire boys stop fighting over semantics

>>20208292
>>20208449
You are either not getting the point or you are doing what is like the Christian equivalent of virtue signalling. "Ooh I'm too spiritual for all this. Look how spiritual I am. Oooohhhh"
You are right that faith takes precedence over intellectualism but what you are doing is just a show.

What should read this week leading up to Good Friday?

>>20208475
>atheism, pantheism, and gnosticism fall apart on their own grounds
Were that true then atheism wouldn't be the most common modern worldview. People arrive at atheism from reliance on pure intellectual analysis of anything/everything. For every one "good argument for God" you can throw at them, they have an immediate, absolutely justifiable (from a purely "scientific" and intellectual standpoint) rebuttal. For every "God is obviously apparent in this/that" they have an absolutely justifiable "no, this/that could have arisen thusly instead". Intellectual conceptions cannot prove/disprove God, only God can prove Himself to the individual, and apparently He only does so for those who walk with Him in faith.
>>20208503
I'm just telling it like it is, your saying I am doing something for this/that reason is nothing but your own projection. I have not in any way attempted to portray myself, but am simply sharing what I have learned through my own experience, take it or leave it.

>>20208564
>absolutely justifiable
It's not justifiable. Every argument that atheists make has been destroyed by Christian theologians.
Atheists think they follow what is rational, but they do not.

>>20208700
>destroyed by Christian theologians
This sounds no different from the pigeon strutting on the chess board. If the atheist is unconvinced by whatever argument, then nothing whatsoever has been "destroyed". Once again, nothing is proved/disproved by intellectual concepts. You can come up with your absolutely atheist "destroying" intellectual concept and wave it all around the room, but if it doesn't satisfy the intellectual demands of the atheist then it is nothing but vapors to anyone but yourself and those whose bias it confirms. If you want to convince an atheist of anything at all then it must be to walk in faith regardless of intellectual concepts and allow God to prove Himself in that walk, because that's the only way that it works. Otherwise just keep spinning your wheels in the mud with endless "debates" that never go anywhere.

>>20208768
Atheists do not truly follow what is rational. They worship their own intellect, fame, and money.
An atheist saying "I'm not convinced" is not an argument.
You think that faith and the rational mind are opposed to each other but that is wrong. They work together in a heirarchy with faith in God at the top.
Why are you doing damage control for atheists who are objectively wrong

>>20208768
>doesn't satisfy the intellectual demands
Atheists are not even honest or consistent with their own demands. Their whole worldview is incoherent and self-refuting. The reason atheism is so prevalent is not because it is intellectually robust, but because people have hardened their hearts.

>>20208780
Atheists don't worship. That's what makes them atheists.

>>20208790
>Atheists don't worship.
They worship themselves and in the case of people such as Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins, their status and money.

>>20208768
Fwiw I get what you're saying and don't think too terrible for people knee-jerking in response. It's tough in today's increasingly hostile and binary world to appreciate a neutral point.

>>20208789
>not even honest or consistent with their own demands. Their whole worldview is incoherent and self-refuting
From their point of view this is Christians. Until you realize that they "have a point", until you understand where they are coming from and how it is valid in its own way, you will never win a soul from among them. It's no different than the right/left not understanding that both have good points and both have flaws in their intellectual constructions. This world is seemly set up to validate both the atheist and the Christian views, and from there it becomes a matter of choice. The difference the Christian side offers does not become apparent until one actually walks in faith.

>>20208780
>An atheist saying "I'm not convinced" is not an argument.
Yeah, it's their justification as to why they (rationally) don't affirm the truth of certain propositions.

Could God kill himself if he wanted to?

>>20208940
>From their point of view
Their point of view is wrong. Are you a relativist or something

>>20208940
>Until you realize that they "have a point"
But they don't. How are you not getting this

>>20208789
>Their whole worldview is incoherent and self-refuting
Why?

>>20208940
>>20208985
Show me the verse in the Bible where Jesus said "Well, you know, if you don't believe in Me, fair enough, I can see where you're coming from and I respect your point of view."
Or where Paul said that.

>>20209085
Do you think a statement can be true, independent of Jesus explicitly saying it in the Bible?

>>20209075
Let's start with for example a typical materialist atheist who thinks that physical matter is the ultimate substance of all reality, and nothing exists beyond that. But this person still presupposes many things such as logic, numbers, reason, truth, morality, time, identity over time, the self, physical laws, and so on. None of these things are material. Science presupposes that you can interpret data using logic which is not a material object. Truth is not material. It is a metaphysical concept. Everything requires God.

>>20209112
Nothing (little?) of what you said is entailed in being an atheist
>None of these things are material.
A materialist would obviously disagree. Either about them being material, or it being a thing that really *exist*. I don't think materialist are particular troubled with the human brain's ability for abstraction.
A materialist would just say that things like time, is a feature of reality, that reality being fundamentally material.
There are perfectly coherent secular theories of morality.

>Everything requires God.
Bereft of arguments as to why, this is not persuasive to an atheist/materialist.

>>20209128
>God is offended by being sympathetic to where others are coming from when attempting to convey the Gospel to them
>God loves it when you just blast others as being retarded for not seeing things exactly as you do

>>20209205
>t. holier than Chrysostom
Can you autograph my KJV for me? It would be an honor

>>20209266
Very Jesus-like post

>>20209266
>informing people of truths
>holier than whomever

Very in the Bible does it instruct to insult people rather than spread the word?

>>20209155
If you are an atheist then in your view you are just an arbitrary mass of particles and chemical reactions going on so it does not stand to reason that any think you think or say accurately describes reality at all.

I specifically remember Christ saying we are to evangelize through image macros and wojaks.

The whole point of trying to convert atheists is because they are our forlorn brothers who deserve salvation as much as any man. If you've forgotten that then don't put them further from God by acting a caricature.

>>20209326
Do you think that's what atheists believe? It's not like Plantinga's EAAN has universal acceptance.

If you are a theist then in your view you are just an arbitrary (designed?) mass of particles and chemical reactions going on + a SOUL, so it does not stand to reason that any think you think or say accurately describes reality at all
Maybe God wants you to have false beliefs for morally sufficient reasons.

>>20209314
What truth does your envious criticism hold?

>>20209349
>convert
>evangelize
Nah

>>20209323
Several places in the NT we are instructed to protect ourselves and keep away from the faithless.

>>20209396
Do you think that is what the apostles did? Kept away from the faithless?

>>20209396
Does faithless mean the same thing as uninitiated? Genuinely asking, I thought we were supposed to cherish and embody Christ but not throw ourselves onto swords unless we thought it would further His message.

>>20209404
They were told to “And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words: going forth out of that house or city shake off the dust from your feet.", by the Lord. Paul, Peter, and John also tell Christians to be mindful and protective of their own.

>>20209384
>believe and live according to Scripture
>Nah
>non Scriptural "tradition"
>yes plz

>>20209429
Now go read Acts of the Apostles.

>>20209430
>>non Scriptural "tradition"
Where? You’re going to have explain

>>20209419
His message is personal. Growing up secular there was no way I could ever be evangelized, any attempt would only turn me even more hostile towards God’s truth. I made the decision to go search for Him myself. And have realized that is the only way. Scripture says that He calls you from the world, not anon.

>>20209436
>for the 100th time
>across 15 diff translations
You know I will!

>>20209429
In 1st Corinthians 9:19-23, when Paul says stuff like
>I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings.

Do you think he meant to just act like he was in the in-group of the people he evangelized to? Essentially being a confidence man, a fraud, pretending to be someone he was not.
Or, do you think it was a bit of - understanding people from their point of view, going on?

>>20209521
And to Timothy he says; “Them that sin reprove before all: that the rest also may have fear.“

Anyway, you know that I know you’re right, just got my wording is all.

>>20209521
>Essentially being a confidence man, a fraud, pretending to be someone he was not.
I mean, Paul is a crafty fellow..

>>20209544
That's within the church.

>>20198403
It's the best book ever written though. Its a love letter to humanity. Tells you how to be a strong man, how to save your marriage, relationships, righteousness etc. etc.

>>20195202
No. "To deliver unto Satan" means to excommunicate.

In good faith:
"How do blacks and other races which are historically incapable of anything higher than brutality and cannibalistic shamanism fit into a Creationist standard?"
I think I know how I'd answer this question but I am curious what others think.
Sorry for the heavy topic.