/lit/ - Literature

If that anon who talked about "tongue side preference" is still here, can you elaborate on that idea a little bit? Or at least drop the name of the book you got it from? I've been thinking about it a lot but I'm having some trouble grasping it and differentiating which sounds come from the front and which come from the back. I've looked at a couple of those IPA pronunciation charts and everything and I'm still just not getting it

I want to read some stories, convince me to read yours.

>>20141066
Contemplative time.
>He lay there and stared up at the light beaming from the surface, the water rushing around him and the sand beneath him being like a sort of cushion. It relaxed his body, but his mind did not feel the same way.
>He didn’t understand any of this. He had this awareness of his situation for a majority of his life, yet it still felt alien to him. Like something unnatural was going on inside his head, something else beyond his basic thoughts. What was it? He was free to contemplate that question.
>His body was also something he had for basically his whole life, and despite the fact that he had never known anything different, his body didn’t feel like something he belonged in. Like he just wasn’t supposed to be like this. Aware of his own thoughts and able to do many things… That wasn’t right

>>20141172
Why? You know we don't write here.

I sat on my porcelain throne, aimlessly flipping through the countless number of soulless individuals that occupied my electronic screen. The object in front of me tickled my arousal, yet for the life of me, I could not remember her name nor face. I have become as soulless as the every other individual that used their time on Tinder. My one respite in all of this? The shit leaving my colons provided me more pleasure and endorphins than any woman could.

>>20141089
Not at all.
From what I've read, bard and cleric are really strong classes in 5th edition.

>>20141209
Piss water splashed my ass as my GOMAD shit plunked into the bowl. "These girls all smell like shit." I said, out loud. Just a few more matches and I could send a batch of my latest copy-pasted opener which reads, "If we were both boxers would you let me hit?" Out of the group one single mother would end up actually meeting up on a date, wherein we consume cheap wine and then I make her eat my ass (at home). When their ex comes back they will ghost and I will want a girlfriend, and when I have a girlfriend I'll want to be alone.

>>20141215
Bard's a solid class I think in every iteration. I was talking more about stylewise what it would mean for the character. A Bard as opposed to a Warlord. But then again it may give the whole prodigal son feel and nobles would look down on it as a mere tavern entertainer. As an mc Bard is an extremely strong choice. Bit of this bit of that for every situation and it really shines in a group.

I want to write a story about an exile. I like to read myths about similar subjects before I write, but searching for myths about exiles mostly just points me to Jewish stuff. Anything else notable I can read? Preferably about individuals rather than groups.

>>20141332
Odyssey

>>20141332
Oedipus

>>20140935
>I want him to be both a really hardcore guy but also want him to be a good strategist and commander.
>I like the DnD Warlord class for a template but I'm yet to figure out the lore to decide how rare and strong that would be, or even if I want to settle on it.
I don't know how flexible you are on using other classes outside of D&D but give him a class with a bad sounding name like logistics expert and make it so that nobles never realized the class could be used as warring class.
If you do something like that you can also give the summoned heroes bad sounding classes that they used to their full potential with modern knowledge. It also explains why the noble daughters of the hero's houses don't think the MC is trash. They learned from their houses that there is no such thing as a useless class only useless people.

>>20141346
Hmm, I think I read through Antigone in college, but I don't really remember it too well so maybe I'll do it again.

At what point do you give up writing a story? I wrote 9 chapters and looks like I need 33 more. This is daunting

>>20141385
Finish everything you start, no matter how much it sucks. If you quit, it means you're NGMI

>>20140900
That's exactly what "you idiot" implies, you idiot.

>>20141390
Is it possible to edit it until it's good? Or are some stories just not salvageable?

>>20141398
I think the average trad published book is written twice.

>>20141398
Who knows? Maybe you will, after you finish it and then start editing.

>>20141393
Or, hear me out, the guy is just rude. Speaking of which.

>>20141437
Holy fuck dude go to reddit you cockgobbler

Holdin stronk on muh 1k word average.
I keep thinking i am almost done but then i remember all the shit i have to do before the finale.
>Looks like volume 2 is gonna be 150k

>>20141458
wow rude. I hope you get raped by a pack of niggers

>>20141472
How complex is your story to have 150k words?

>>20141483
>i'm not sensitive see i can be racist
ebin

>>20141511
It's linear, but with multiple pov's and side plots that play off the main characters development arc.
If I knew this is what it was going to be from the outset, I would never have even written the first sentence.

>>20141332
>>20141339
>>20141346
You better not write my idea for a Western that blends the Odyssey and Oedipus Rex before I do. I'll get around to it...eventually

>>20141539
Relax, I'm too busy with my own ideas. I'm so busy I can't even write 'em! AHA! AHA! AHA!
No respect I tell ya, I get no respect around here.

>>20141528
Hope you're not doing what the song of ice and fire did. Where 1/2 the chapters are pointless, filling in some vague storyline but honestly can be cut out. Hell I remember completely skipping entire chapters in the books because it was boring or the plotline went nowhere

>>20141539
My vague idea is a postapoc western, influenced by McCarthy more than the Greeks though. I just need something more adult to write while I edit my book for kids.

>>20141555
Nein. Aktion all the way baby!
There are also no prisoner or spy chapters.
Though i did include some minor political machinations, racism and comedy for variety.

The air bites at my weathered hands. Twilight had fallen on the sickly green grass of the small park, bouncing across a pearlescent lake. A warm glow, a wisp of smoke, and the third page tonight to be torn from my notebook.

The boy sits upon the wall upon the tall hill at twilight. In the valley below twist byways and cut-throughs traversing shaded intermittent banks of oak and acacia whose leaves dance on the breeze, fall, and flutter amid the deadwood fenced pastureland and the fields of tall wild-oat grass whose golden shine awaits its next tousling breath from the newly-setted sun. Slow chirps from septendecennial cicadas buttress an easterly autumn wind that sets hair at nape and thigh to ends, and below the smattering cars bark muffled into the humidity of the night and paint pale yellow cones' light coaxial the roughshod thoroughfare. Windows begin to one-by-one light as day’s broad underbelly goes tits-up to the sky and leaves what clings corpuscular at its body, with shallow-rooted and hooking tendrils, to fend momentarily for itself beneath stars in sinister flicker against a vast and unknowable dark.

Papa comes and grabs at the boy’s shoulder. Don’t fall! he says, although he’d never let him.

Hey papa, the boy says. Can we stay a while longer?

You know we can’t. You’ve got to get home. Mama’s gonna be worried.

But papa… I just wanna watch a bit longer. Can we?

Maybe a little, papa says. He throws a leg astraddle the low wall. They watch together at cars’ tail-lights in silence as the wind keeps blowing through the oak and the acacia in the slim moon’s light and time hangs still and ceases its glacial creep across the things men make, but only for a while.

Alright, papa says. It’s time to go, he says with his rise. Papa grabs the boy beneath his arms and lifts him gently up, sets him on his feet.

I don’t want to go back to sleep, the boy says.

It’s not so bad, now, says papa. You sleep and then you wake up.

But….

It’s time, papa says again gently. Mama’s gonna be worried if we don’t get home soon.

Okay, papa.

>>20141784
I really like the vibe of whe whole story, good job on nabbing my attention. The dialogue is great, no complaints there.

That said, your sentences run way, way too long, and they all feel like they have the same rhythm. But thats alright, I have a pretty similar problem, what you need to do is get some variety in your sentence length and rhythm, spice it up a bit! Other than that, I personally really like the prose, I love the use of complex words and the painting of vivid, pretty imagery, but I can potentially see other people viewing it as a tad bit purple.

>>20140555
Thanks for the feedback! It's sorta my intention to leave the prologue vague, and leave people asking those questions. As for the breathe thing, do you reckon I should cut a few of em out from here, or limit how much I use it in the future? If its the latter, I intend to use it only two, maybe three more times for big action scenes.

>>20141846
>>20140281

Yeah, no, it's actually worse than the original.

You found an organic, effective way to give the protagonist's name, but that was the only improvement. Otherwise, the scene is way too drawn out for its content and repetitive, and I actually found myself wishing you'd rather write about the weather. The breath thing, cut all of it. It breaks tone, bad.

I was thinking about one-upping Lucas and writing my own version of the Star Wars prequel trilogy and posting it on RR as fanfic. On a scale of 1-300, how dumb is the idea?

>>20141833
>your sentences run way, way too long
This is nothing. In the work from which this is excerpted, I routinely write 300, 400 word sentences. I don't agree that the rhythm is the same, though. I feel like I've spent a lot of time and effort on rhythm, flow, and prosody in general. Could you explain more about why you think that we have "the same problem"?

>>20141947
Fan-fiction belongs on /trash/. Like, unironically. It's not /lit/, and if you fags start posting it you're gonna get the whole thread nuked.

>>20141943
Fair enough. I'll try again in a bit, maybe make it more compact and ad a teeny bit of flair back, to balance it out.

If I'm still struggling to get it done, might just scrap the whole thing and start from scratch. Thanks anyway.

>>20141953
Because in an earlier thread I posted an excerpt from my own work where I have entire paragraphs made up from 2-3 sentences, each around 100 words long, and the most scathing criticism I got from that is that they all run too long, that's why. Rhythm is closely connected to sentence length, when a sentence runs overlong it becomes monotonous. If you vary your sentence length a bit it would probably eliminate this issue for me wholesale. That's just how it comes across to me.

>>20141953
>I routinely write 300, 400 word sentences

>>20142020
>the most scathing criticism I got from that is that they all run too long
Be careful with that. Criticism should always be taken with a grain of salt, because sometimes when you step back and evaluate, you find that oftentimes people will just be repeating what others have said to them. Don't mistake a confidently stated opinion with an opinion made from good taste. Scathing criticism can be insidious because it's the mechanism by which words begin to have that creeping "truth feel" via emotional impact rather than being truthful themselves.
>Rhythm is closely connected to sentence length, when a sentence runs overlong it becomes monotonous
You're working with these abstractions as if you're fitting together Legos to construct a building. A sentence is, after all, nothing more than the syntax of declension. It's a grouping of words arranged at an arbitrary place upon the hierarchy, larger than a word but smaller than a paragraph. It's got some nominal rules, like that the first letter is capitalized and that it terminates with a period. It is an easy, definitive way to establish an unambiguous rhythm, but it's not the only way. The rise and fall of consonants, vowels, their segue into and out of one another—these things can have a rhythm of their own. To an extent, they require trusting your readers to do the work of appreciating it themselves, but it allows for far more intricate internal structures than just varying length.

I'm probably not explaining this, but the point is: don't take what you read here as gospel. If something like that "scathing criticism" has had this much of an influence on your philosophy, you must be pretty new. Pretty much everyone else here is new too, and without developing the ability to evaluate for yourself the things you're told, you're just going to be another entrant into the human centipede accepting one fissured turd of infinitely-digested mediocrity before shitting it out directly into the mouth of the next dude who's got his lips pressed to your sphincter.

any good writing apps without all the extra shit? I tried scrivener and theres too much stuff in my face I just wanna write and move my writings off google docs just in case

Do all characters have to constantly have arcs and change all the time whenever they're being featured in a story, and then be set aside whenever they're not having arcs? I see this mentality a lot in TV writing and I feel like it makes caricatures out of characters to constantly force new arcs on them in new unplanned greenlit seasons even though they completed meaningful changes in previous seasons, instead of making them feel like they're constantly growing, it makes them feel like they never grow.

I'm wondering can you have a e.g. side character that completes their arc say 1/3 of the way into the story and then remains as an unchanging element until the end, but still with meaningful presence?

>>20142092
Google d.. I mean try your phones notepad

>>20142098
I suppose its better than nothing

>>20142110
I just use notepad.

>>20142069
Very well said. This is the first time and place I've ever gotten criticism for my (creative) writing work, so you can see it kinda hits me hard. I'm trying to learn to parse criticism better, but for better or worse, it still impacts me quite a bit.

>>20141199
*We don't read. Plenty of us write. Learn your memes

>>20142212
I think I went through a similar process initially. I'd post something, get critique, adopt critique (lack of confidence in my own tastes and preferences) summarily. Then, I test out the principles of that critique on others' work to see how it feels in the mouth, how it tastes. Often, I'd end up spitting it all back out and wondering why. These days, I just trust myself. I know what the dogma/doctrine is, of course, whereby sentences can become almost objectively "too" long, too purple, etc. Ultimately, I just disagree with it.

I still entertain and value critique, of course, and I do my best to do so from a position of genuine and open honesty with myself and with respect to what I've written.

Your skin will get thicker, eventually. You'll learn what you love and hate about certain facets of writing, and with that you'll develop the confidence to recognize and accept philosophical differences where they pop up.

>>20142092
Word unironically

>>20142231
True, I imagine that with time and experience I'll learn to better handle critism and gauge how much it should impact my writing. I know that in the end there's always somebody that's gonna dislike what I write, and that's fine, just gotta learn how to accept criticism, and figure out how much of it I value, and which of it matters.

>>20142296
Yeah, I've been posting here a little and my thought was that the criticism of others too can hopefully hone yourself to be a better critic of your own work. Best of luck anon.

While the narrative that I am about to pen may appear fictitious, I would urge you, fond reader, not to merely disregard this as a fantasy imagined but perhaps remember the words of a man known sane by his physician; however, I hope God himself played a horrid trick on my eyes for if my story is true, then the terrors that roam in the dusk are vastly more disturbing than anything any of us could envision.
I am to be hanged on the morning of tomorrow, persecuted by the courts and the people for a horror I did not perform but did, unfortunately, attend. I am transcribing this to immortalise the ghastly memory so those who peruse this may heed my warning. I have made peace, dear reader, that I shall not survive another day now and, after discussing the events of that night, I fear my reckoning will surely come sooner than even the community hope.
The subject which I refer to is the disappearance of the gentleman named as Nathan, or Than as he preferred. A man that rescued me from the heinous residence that I inhabited. You see, dear reader, I was not permitted a childhood. I was abandoned by parents that did not want me, nor cared enough to find me a home where I would be nurtured. Instead, I was left outside this building, cowering below the large metropolis that now watched me work every morning.
During my infancy, I spent most of my time outside and the small critters that lurked in the nooks and crannies were my only friends; a participation prize that life had granted me, I supposed at the time.
I rarely saw the light of day beyond that of early morning where I worked cleaning the yard. Growing up in darkness makes a man feeble, dear reader, but for me that was not the case, I prospered somehow in that orphanage, growing into the person I am today, even if that does not seem like anything to be proud of. I mention my vitality, not to boast, but to explain the harsh environment that I grew up in and to express how difficult it was for me to feel terror as my years grew.
The patron of the orphanage was not a kind man. He held himself as a deity, running the place with fear; so, nothing surprised us more than when he fell sick one evening in my teenage years. I had never known such weakness in the man when I was standing at his side, watching the once self-proclaimed god of their small world begging for us to help him. Let me tell you, dear reader, that the thought, even now, is incredibly sobering.
His eyes were blood shot, liquid was running from his nose and mouth, and he was trembling. I remember that moment clearly, for it was then I decided that I would take the opportunity to witness the world outside these walls for the first time. I remember that moment clearly because it was the first time I had truly grasped something that I wanted.


i wrote this a long time ago, i don't remember when. LMK if i was as trash as i am now

>>20142381
>LMK if i was as trash as i am now
If you think it's trash, why should I feel any different?

>>20142381
i literally don't even know what to say about this piece lol post something new and we can compare

I am rp with a girl from reddit
Can you pls check my text and make it a little bit better

>Dima felt the blood drained from this face, he became sick and dizzy. The axe fell from his hand as his legs gave out and he sank to the floor. "He just cut her arm off and it grew back. I definitely lost my mind." Dima slowly and cautiously held out his hand toward the limb, like it could jump and grab his neck again, then touched it with his index finger and very quickly pulled it back. The skin was smooth and cold, and under the skin laid thick muscles, which made the woman so strong. No, it was not a figment of his imagination, not an illusion, not some sick joke, it was all real.

>Several minutes he was sitting on the floor, rubbing his face trying to get over his shock. After he calmed down a little he looked at the women who was peacefully washing her in his bathtub as if nothing had happened. In spite of his state, he couldn't help but notice the woman's beautiful body. He had never seen a naked woman before, let alone in his own house. The girls had never had an interest in the shy, lonely guy who preferred spending time catching crickets and dragonflies for his gecko, rather than drinking and putting his hands on drunk girls at parties. The only time he got a kiss, was in 8th grade, when a classmate kissed on his cheek in gratitude for doing homework for her. After he catched her eye, he immediately looked away in confusion. She had just tried to kill him, but he still felt awkward seeing her naked.

>Dima didn't know what to do. He was so tired and exhausted, he had no strength to run and call the police. And it probably won't work, because she'd probably get to him in a jump and break his neck. He was sitting there quietly awaiting his fate.

it took me more than 2 hours to write that

>>20141109
Therde is no escape for me but I'm more than happy to rambe about my theories, so keep firing any questions. The book I'm cribbing off of is 'The Horse, the Wheel, the Language' by David Anthony, I believe it was the second chapter specifically where he talks about several different linguistics concepts that were used to estimate how the daughter languages of IE drifted, which they used to estimate what the "original" language sounded like. Definitely an enjoyable read (skip the forward) and the concepts are way easier to grasp than their obscure word charts.

In terms of how I'm trying to use it I keep it sloppy - I think it applies to whatever sounds of a word gets the emphasis (and that often is the first word sound which is why I also call it "loose alliteration"). The heart of it is realizing that all consonants are either Front Mouth Consonants or Back Mouth Consonants, and trying to keep words dominated by those two categories segregated with each other in sentences when it's reasonable to - remember this idea is a current to guide your word choice, not an iron rule to follow at all costs and risk hurting clarity of your prose. Also I do this during editing, but not during drafting when just getting ideas out is key.

So as an application say I need to describe a character making golden jewelry. I would consider "golden" a "back mouth word" because as I say it aloud now the "g" sounds feels most prominent, so I would prefer not to say the golden thing was "made", "manufactured", (both "m" heavy front Mouth feeling words) and would favor using "crafted", "created" (heavy on rear mouth "k" sound) if those words made sense in the context.

So on my edit of my draft I may change something like "Father made golden jewelry in his workshop for wealthy ladies." To "He crafted golden lockets and chains for the towns richest women." Notice how I even divided the sentence into a rear mouth heavy beginning and front mouth heavy end in the example.

https://voca.ro/1ngKDGVGmSNl

>>20142416
>Spending 2+ hours to write some bullshit just fap
>With a reddit tranny at that
You need to go back

>>20142542
I spent so much time because english is not my first language

>>20142094
You don't even need dynamic character arcs. You can have what's called a "flat character arc" where the character is pretty much stable as they are, but circumstances change. They're typically correct off the bat, but aren't really allowed to be, so it's more the circumstances alter to allow the character to be their best. Holmes is a flat character, for example, though he's a poor example, being a recurring episodic character rather than a long-running single story thing.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/11f4QBB86vwNEMPVKaWLIwgszLMlUNW6kkYLKaTOq3Fs/edit?usp=sharing

Been giving a once over to the first dozen or so pages, also made some progress toward the tail end.

>>20142542
The last verified biological female who ERPed with me would literally only reply with variants of "make me bounce," so I would be shocked if trannies didn't do a better job.

Non-native English speaker here: Please give me another word for "to 'make' a threat".
I wanna say something like

Government A "made credible threats to..."
But I think that there is a verb more appropriate than "make".

>>20142608
There's nothing wrong with "made credible threats". You don't really need to change that.

I've started writing a play, or perhaps a libretto.
I don't know jack about metre or anything like that though. Since it's not a poem, I think I can be loose... no?
>see picrel for excerpt

>>20142608
You an just use "threatened"

>>20142612
Okay, it just sounded a bit too colloquial.

>>20142624
It depends on the context, admittedly, but it's a perfectly valid phrase.

>>20142608
Best way to find out the most common wording is to google the term in quotes and see what comes up most. If there are no instances of your usage, it's properly not right (generally I mean, you're example is fine)

>>20142608
Are you looking for official-sounding weasel words? Could try "Government A cautioned Government B against future encroachments on the Contestedistan Peninsula, warning that it would uphold the sovereignty of Puppetgovernmentia."

>>20142094
>Do all characters have to constantly have arcs and change all the time
Why do you think support characters are called support characters?

>>20142381
wow

>>20142565
You need to just scratch all of this and completely rewrite. Every single sentence I've read needs to be rewritten.

>>20142565
Seriously just use a name, it's way harder to read ____ instead of just a placeholder name.

>>20142094
They all have interlocking stories that, while they vary in terms of importance to the overall narrative, do tend to develop

>His eyes weren’t right at all on closer inspection. The whites had become black, and it looked like everything had shrunk, like the iris and pupil. Those innocent, large green spheres used to be full of life, as befitting of their status as the windows to the soul, but now?
>With him, there was nobody on the other side. His thoughts were gone. His memories were gone. He was gone.
>And the only thing in that body now was a single driving force: Hate
How is my prose?

>>20143001
Eye-related clichés:
>describing them as spheres or orbs
Check.
>saying they're windows to the soul
Check.

>>20143001
>as befitting of their status as the windows to the soul
That's almost always a bit much unless you're in the perspective of a deliberately flowery character.

>>20143014
What would you rather have me say in order to communicate
>This one innocent character has basically lost his fucking mind and is now on the warpath

>His eyes weren’t right at all on closer inspection. The whites had become black...
It wouldn't require close inspection at all to notice something this freakish.

>>20143032
You’re right.
How does this sound?
>The first thing that struck him was the way his eyes looked. Even from a distance, the change was noticeable.

>>20143042
That's fairly solid. "On closer inspection" should only really be used for non-obvious details, and somebody's eyes changing that much should be obvious.

>>20143026
That's your job, not mine. Consider reading books. You know, BOOKS. Not anime or video games, but books.

>>20142810
Thank you for the constructive feedback.
>>20142819
Initially I set out to have this read as an opportunity for a self-insert on the reader's part, I worried that defining the name prior to the protagonist choosing their new name would remove that aspect. What do you think about a serial number maybe?

>>20143067
If you want self-insertion to be a 'thing', just do first-person and somehow dance around giving the protagonist a name (maybe give them a title).

>>20143042
It's still unnecessarily filtered. If you are writing in third person limited it is already implied the things you describe are noticed by your POV. You can just describe his eyes, you don't need to specify that someone noticed.

>>20143070
I was potentially going to do a chapter in first person at some point. I thought it would be fun to show the shift in perspective of the protagonist and the way in which her new life has altered her personality. I thought about having it address the audience in a way, but maybe that's a bit too cheeky. Something to the effect of criticizing the reader for having judged her, going on about how they would have done the same thing in their shoes.

>>20143087
Alternatively, bite the bullet and give them a name, because the name doesn't matter eventually. Or just ignore the name, just avoid using it. Have the protagonist forget it, even.

>>20143067
>constructive feedback
What's the point? I tried giving you constructive feedback a week or two ago on this exact same piece. You're building a world. I get it. The problem is, nobody gives a shit. You have mistaken your own enthusiasm for the super cool dinosaur robots or whatever with the idea that it is actually cool enough to cause literally anyone to overlook the garbage, irredeemable quality of its prose. There are uses for constructive feedback. I like to give it when I can, but that presupposes a foundation upon which something can be built. The idea that every single sentence needs to be rewritten is an inherently destructive one. It says unambiguously that you must destroy everything you have written and write it again. This is completely intentional. Your philistine attitude towards writing itself will preclude your vision from ever coming even slightly into focus unless you get realistic with yourself about the quality of what's written. Not how you can make the IDEAS BEHIND what's written better, but how you can enhance the quality of the writing itself.

>>20143053
This better
>His movements weren’t right, at least for someone like him. He used to move with more uncertainty and hesitation, especially when confronted with any sort of threat. But now he moved without any emotion at all, like a machine solely programmed to move in one direction. That, along with his eyes lacking anything resembling awareness of his surroundings, led him to an awful conclusion
>Whatever was standing in front of him was NOT the confused and innocent thing he knew before. That individual was gone. Not dead, but gone.

>>20142810
Shit advice, give him a couple concrete actionable ways to write differently.

>>20142819
I endorse this

>>20142565
Just way too much of a visual movie. We get loaded with all these minute physical details and movements of what could be summarized in on swift stroke -e.g. just call the guy a "potbellied demon" we and mention in passing he tugged his stubby horn and leave it at that.

Remove all instances of "almost like a" "sort of like" as it weakens your comparison

>>20143107
Maybe use "boy" instead of individual, it's a clunky word. And you don't need to add the "not dead but gone" part.

>>20143107
>He used to move with more uncertainty and hesitation, especially when confronted with any sort of threat. But now he moved without any emotion at all, like a machine solely programmed to move in one direction
You are dictating to me these things, which I assume are important, where I should have been directed towards these realizations myself in prior passages. You're skipping the foreplay and trying to jump to the half-chub starfish. If these are important character traits, actually MAKE them important. Don't tell me that they're important and traits that he has. Flesh your character out such that this disparity between how he's moving now versus how he moved in the past are self-evident.

>>20143067
That's actually an interesting idea, on paper. How well it might do in practice, I don't know. What I do know is, literally anything is better than ____. , at least in my opinion. The blank just feels like it disconnects from the intensity of the scenes you've written, which I quite like by the way.

>>20143042
Maybe something like
>The first think he saw were the man's eyes, their whites now black as coal.
Might be my purple-prose-prone autism talking, but I think there might be room for a tidbit of flair in that sentence.

>>20143026
Maybe something more like this:

>His eyes once so green and full of life, were black from iris to pupil. His thoughts gone, his memories gone, everything gone. Only hate remained.

>>20143116
>give him a couple concrete actionable ways to write differently.
There are no concrete, actionable ways. I can't insert the things I know, with all their context and nuance, into anyone else's brain. The only thing I can do here is to point out that the prose is terrible, to the point where focusing on anything else is a complete waste of time.

>>20143128
Very nice.

>>20143124
I need to probably write more outlines

>>20143107
>>20143124 is also good advice. You only need a couple pieces detailing how "wrong" this is, instead you just focus on the change itself, how he is NOW acting, not in comparison to his past.
Like, if I were to write something like this, it'd be more:
>He wasn't taking in anything else around him. His legs mechanically moved him forward in a single direction. Whatever was in front of him, it wasn't the innocent boy he knew.
I don't claim this to be good necessarily, but it's a lot less filler-y. I also can't really put much of the viewpoint character in because I dunno much about him.

>>20143146
Understandable

I've noticed something in my own writing and a lot of the stuff I see posted on here, and that's a lack of punctuality. In a bid to bring flair, pezaz or vividness to my scenes and descriptions, I make them purple or droney. I assume that this lessens the more I write and get feedback, but I still end up catching myself bloating my work with 3 sentence long descriptions of marble flooring. Wat do

>>20143139
I think writing an outline is rarely the solution to anything, but hey, whatever helps you conceptualize these things. You could, instead, write out two scenes which come before this one in which you focus on elegantly emphasizing and displaying these characteristics, so that when you come back to this current scene, you can just delete the dictation thereof and simply describe the way he is now acting.

>>20143159
There's a time and a place for sprawling descriptions, and there's a time and a place for terseness. Try to write some situations that feel better to write in a clipped, short-sentence style and see how it works out.

>>20143159
If you want to write genre fiction, or literary fiction in that very contemporary style, feel free to chop down everything into its TV-style minima.

While the narrative that I am about to pen may appear fictitious, I would urge you, fond reader, not to merely disregard this as a fantasy imagined but perhaps remember the words of a man known sane by his physician; however, I hope God himself played a horrid trick on my eyes for if my story is true, then the terrors that roam in the dusk are vastly more disturbing than anything any of us could envision.
I am to be hanged on the morning of tomorrow, persecuted by the courts and the people for a horror I did not perform but did, unfortunately, attend. I am transcribing this to immortalise the ghastly memory so those who peruse this may heed my warning. I have made peace, dear reader, that I shall not survive another day now and, after discussing the events of that night, I fear my reckoning will surely come sooner than even the community hope.
The subject which I refer to is the disappearance of the gentleman named as Nathan, or Than as he preferred. A man that rescued me from the heinous residence that I inhabited. You see, dear reader, I was not permitted a childhood. I was abandoned by parents that did not want me, nor cared enough to find me a home where I would be nurtured. Instead, I was left outside this building, cowering below the large metropolis that now watched me work every morning.
During my infancy, I spent most of my time outside and the small critters that lurked in the nooks and crannies were my only friends; a participation prize that life had granted me, I supposed at the time.
I rarely saw the light of day beyond that of early morning where I worked cleaning the yard. Growing up in darkness makes a man feeble, dear reader, but for me that was not the case, I prospered somehow in that orphanage, growing into the person I am today, even if that does not seem like anything to be proud of. I mention my vitality, not to boast, but to explain the harsh environment that I grew up in and to express how difficult it was for me to feel terror as my years grew.
The patron of the orphanage was not a kind man. He held himself as a deity, running the place with fear; so, nothing surprised us more than when he fell sick one evening in my teenage years. I had never known such weakness in the man when I was standing at his side, watching the once self-proclaimed god of their small world begging for us to help him. Let me tell you, dear reader, that the thought, even now, is incredibly sobering.
His eyes were blood shot, liquid was running from his nose and mouth, and he was trembling. I remember that moment clearly, for it was then I decided that I would take the opportunity to witness the world outside these walls for the first time. I remember that moment clearly because it was the first time I had truly grasped something that I wanted.

>>20143105
You sound like someone who wants to be seen as a lot smarter than they really are, so I'm just going to accept that you don't like my prose.

>>20143116
This I can appreciate. I'll have to address that, as I hadn't realized it was a habit of mine until you'd just mentioned it. I spent yesterday scrubbing some of the obscure references and trying to trim up the first section.

>>20143126
Thank you. As it's just a work in progress anyways the nice thing is that I was thinking if I settle on a name I can just do a quick "replace all instances of ____" with whatever name I wind up going with. I'm not opposed to having the protagonist have a name, it's just that nothing spoke to me.

I think my prose is probably not super clearly defined from a perspective point. I don't know if the effect I'm searching for would be better achieved through use first person, but I want the reader to be learning the ropes of this new place and their role in it along with the protagonist. Part of the plot, that I am attempting to built towards and hinting at currently I suppose, it just how much the offer the protagonist accepted has insulated them from the shittier and more imposing nature of Hell. This isn't something necessarily "lost on them", initially, but I want it to become a feeling that seeps in at the edges over time. That her success in this new life is owed entirely to becoming a whore with a fancier title, and that the person she was wouldn't have lasted a week here in this world.

>>20143181
>You sound like someone who wants to be seen as a lot smarter than they really are
I haven't seen anyone try to trot this one out since middle school. If I sound smart, it's probably because I am. Try being a little less defensive; it makes you seem like a bitch.

>>20141066
>archive.org/details/@_lit_anthology
what in the goddamn, this link defaults to mailto:

>>20143107
This reads a bit too dryly. Try to picture yourself seeing a person you knew to be hesitant moving without giving a single damn to any threats around them. I would try to establish a big contrast between the way the boy used to act and what he's doing now, you already have substance to work with between a nervous, innocent and wide-eyed boy and what he's become.
Here's my quick take:
>He did not recognize the boy in front of him. That boy was uncertain in his innocence, wide-eyed and wary as he retreated from any hint of a threat. This boy seemingly held no such childish concerns, moving and stopping with an empty certainty only a machine could have.
>A glance was all it took for him to realize the truth: The boy standing in front him was no one he knew - That person was gone.

>>20143195
Post some of your own writing then. When the only criticism you have is "It's bad, every sentence needs to be rewritten" it makes it sound like you're just being hypercritical for the sake of being hypercritical. At least other people offered tangible, actionable critiques.

>>20143131
>I can't insert the things I know, with all their context and nuance, into anyone else's brain. The only thing I can do here is to point out that the prose is terrible
sounds like you're a bad critic desu

>>20143212
Sure. This is the one I posted ITT earlier >>20141784

>>20143219
Could be. Criticism of actual writing strikes me as too derivative and downstream of the attitudes, ideas, and philosophies which created the writing. I prefer to address things on that level, or to try to, at least. Maybe that does legitimately make me bad at critique. I'm open to that.

>>20143229
Just offer your genuine criticism. There's only some levels of objectivity you can really offer, but a broad spread of criticism can help somebody focus in on points they may have missed.

>>20143159
My advice would be to put yourself in the shoes of the character at that moment and whether they would in fact care enough about the marble flooring to wax about it.

>>20143161
Seconding this. I have trouble visualizing the context of the scene, having a solid grasp of everything before it might help you to strengthen the contrast between the boy as he used to be and the boy in his current state even if you can't necessarily explain everything that made him snap.

>>20141784
>>20143223
Every sentence needs to be rewritten.

>>20143295
You're gonna need to get that ego under control, my man.

>>20143295
>You're building a world. I get it. The problem is, nobody gives a shit. You have mistaken your own enthusiasm for the super cool dinosaur robots or whatever with the idea that it is actually cool enough to cause literally anyone to overlook the garbage, irredeemable quality of its prose. There are uses for constructive feedback. I like to give it when I can, but that presupposes a foundation upon which something can be built. The idea that every single sentence needs to be rewritten is an inherently destructive one. It says unambiguously that you must destroy everything you have written and write it again. This is completely intentional. Your philistine attitude towards writing itself will preclude your vision from ever coming even slightly into focus unless you get realistic with yourself about the quality of what's written. Not how you can make the IDEAS BEHIND what's written better, but how you can enhance the quality of the writing itself.
You're not paying enough attention to your prose. The prose is bad enough that it deserves to be rewritten. Could I have spared your feelings a little? Yeah, probably. But did I? Nope! That's life, unfortunately, but I do stand by this. I'm not saying my prose is the best prose anyone's ever written. My writing isn't intended to evidence that in the context of this discussion. What I am trying to say is that I am someone who focuses pretty intensely on the quality of my prose.

I may or may not have written something that's actually good. Most likely, I haven't. My writing should evidence the fact that I am not just trying to tear you down for shits and giggles. I am--in my perspective as someone who cares about the quality of prose, and in my capacity as someone who has worked at it and thought about it and consider it in everything I read--you are not paying even CLOSE to enough attention to the quality of your writing.

You don't need to focus as intensely as I do. That's not my point. You do, however, need to care just a little fucking bit.

>>20143180
what about me :)

>>20143309
Your sentences are long and pretentious, your "prose" is just inserting long words where they aren't needed in a vain attempt to seem more "writerly".
>septendecennial cicadas
Who cares?
>The white snow. The round sphere.
You do some things right, but there are words here sprinkled in your sentences that are dead giveaways that you were feeling yourself when you typed them and thought they'd paint a prettier picture than they really do. Like the other reply alluded to your sentences run on way too long and could do to be split up. Your imagery is vivid but the dialogue by comparison feels weak, even given the context that it's with a child. It feels disjointed.

>two protagonists uncover a conspiracy/mystery
>one character leaves to go expose the conspiracy
>other stays to help rebuild an area that was partially destroyed because of said conspiracy
>story ends with them reluctantly parting ways and unsure of the future
>don't see the actual exposing
would this be disappointing to you as a reader? do you need to SEE it get exposed?

>>20143359
Well then you don't have two protagonists. You have one protagonist, and a side character who leaves to go on what sounds like a more interesting story.

>>20143359
sounds like the beginning of an actual story, but by itself boring and pointless

>>20143362
I agree with this. The destination is sometimes more meaningful than the journey, but in this case it sounds like I really want to follow the first character.

>>20143362
>>20143370
>>20143377
so you're saying the process of the investigation isn't enough. you'd definitely want to see the aftermath of it going public?

>>20143399
Oh, it sounded like we weren't even seeing the uncovering overall. But not having that exposing feels a little empty.

>>20143401
I should've been more clear. the story would be cover the entire investigation. but yeah it might feel a little cheap to leave it on an open ending.

>>20143181
Having placeholders is fine, I've changed the name of one of my 4 main characters like five times by now lol.

>>20143169
I write fiction, yes. The point being I tend to murder tense moments because of overdescription, especially since I write in the first person. Makes my character look like a schizo that's hyperfocusing on details and not what's around him.

>>20143252
This is probably just the right answer.

>>20143420
Two protagonists can still work in that case, though the "stay to clean up and rebuild" protagonist feels like they'd be lacking in a lot of conflict.

>>20143399
>>20143422
not exposing it is fine, not having a happy ending is fine, if the story is good.
>the story would be cover the entire investigation
well why didn't you say so? this is alright.

>>20143343
Cheers, thanks for the feedback!

>>20143399
Well, right now it sounds as if we're seeing the less cool story in the first place. Even if you don't outright expose the conspiracy you'd want to work it within the character's inner thinking and conflict.

>>20143422
>Makes my character look like a schizo that's hyperfocusing on details and not what's around him.
Yeah, if you're writing in first person that's even more reason to try and see things the way your character does. It's (Possibly) fine if your character is a legit autist who counts steps, but not so much if he has no reason to even be paying any attention to what you're trying to show the audience.

Story structure? Mine is weird as fuck, to the point where I even gave it a name; “Semi-Non-Linear Crossing”
In that plotlines are told individually, but sometimes cross over with one another for periods of time. Like so
>Character A is searching for character B
>Character C, meanwhile, is somewhere else, and realizes that character A is basically going to his death, and sets out to stop them
>They meet.
Mind you, this doesn’t happen in that order. Anything can happen before the meeting. It means I can jump between plotlines with more ease

>>20143457
You can have multiple perspectives that cross over, but having them be so non-linear can be pretty confusing. When something takes place can be one of the trickiest things to convey in books without just slapping dates at the start of the chapter.

>>20143435
>The boy sits upon the wall upon the tall hill at twilight. In the valley below twist byways and cut-throughs traversing shaded intermittent banks of oak and acacia whose leaves dance on the breeze, fall, and flutter amid the deadwood fenced pastureland and the fields of tall wild-oat grass whose golden shine awaits its next tousling breath from the newly-setted sun. Slow chirps from septendecennial cicadas buttress an easterly autumn wind that sets hair at nape and thigh to ends, and below the smattering cars bark muffled into the humidity of the night and paint pale yellow cones' light coaxial the roughshod thoroughfare. Windows begin to one-by-one light as day’s broad underbelly goes tits-up to the sky and leaves what clings corpuscular at its body, with shallow-rooted and hooking tendrils, to fend momentarily for itself beneath stars in sinister flicker against a vast and unknowable dark.

Here's how I'd edit it without taking anything away. (Genuine feedback, apologies for the attitude)
>The boy sits upon the wall upon the tall hill at twilight. In the valley below twist byways and cut-throughs traversing shaded intermittent banks of oak and acacia. Their leaves fall and flutter, dancing on the breeze amid the deadwood fenced pastureland and the fields of tall wild-oat grass whose golden shine awaits its next tousling breath from the newly-setted sun. The slow chirp of cicadas buttress an easterly autumn wind that sets hair at nape and thigh to ends. Below the smattering cars bark muffled into the humidity of the night and paint pale yellow cones' light coaxial the roughshod thoroughfare. One-by-one, windows fill with amber light as day’s broad underbelly goes tits-up to the sky and leaves what clings corpuscular at its body, with shallow-rooted and hooking tendrils, to fend momentarily for itself beneath stars in sinister flicker against a vast and unknowable dark.

The imagery suffers from run on sentences. You paint a poetic picture that feels a bit lost on the reader until you double back and try to decipher where one thought ends and where something new is being described.

So I'm going through my first draft, and I came upon this line that I wrote.
>The noise echoed like an ominous force that could only accompany the physical trudge of a resulting failure.
What the fuck was I even trying to say. This is wh you dont take a month off after finishing your first draft.

>>20143425
I was going to give him family in the area that gets decimated while the character who leaves at the end is sent there.
>>20143431
would that come off like an unhappy ending? id like it to be open but optimistic.
>well why didn't you say so?
im stupid
>>20143441
but a conspiracy being exposed just turns into court battles.

>>20143500
You can have the initial reveal of the conspiracy to the public and skip ahead to an epilogue with it being 'handled'.

>>20143180
anyone give me some feedback? :)

>>20143506
that's a good idea.
thank you bros for the feedback by the way, this general has been very helpful.

>>20143468
For example
>One of the villains shows up and starts fucking shit up, but then vanishes
>One of the heroes is introduced, and after he undergoes a sort of arc, that villain shows up

>>20143180
your calling out the reader too much. you only need to do it once or twice at the start.

>>20143538
thanks!!!

>>20143532
That's still linear sounding to me?

>>20143180
are you using peruse as it's modern day meaning (browse through something) or peruse as it's actual definition (read something with your full attention)

>>20143500
>would that come off like an unhappy ending?
the little guy fails to reveal an evil conspiracy to the world and everyone else continues life oblivious of the fact and the conspiracy goes on conspiring? doesn't sound like a happy ending to me.
>but a conspiracy being exposed just turns into court battles.
or riots
>id like it to be open but optimistic.
you can write it that way too

>>20143550
actual

>>20143359
>>20143399
Only way I can see this working while not also giving priority to one plot thread over the other is if you have dual perspectives. And writing dual perspectives, especially in the first person, can be real tough. Hell, I can barely write one!

>>20143441
Eeeeexactly. But therein lies my inner conflict: on one hand I want to vividly describe the scenes, but on the other, I want to show what the character thinks and how he sees the world around him, so I end up with this verbose mishmash. I guess brevity really is the soul of wit.

>>20143580
sorry I wasn't at all clear, in my first post I was describing the ending. the story is basically a detective story where they investigate what's happening, they eventually figure things out and part ways at the end.

>>20143489
Swap "resulting" with "resounding" and it ain't half bad

>>20143469
>The boy sits upon the wall at twilight imagining the standard literary tropes to describe the countryside and suddenly realizes that he is in fact doing so.

>>20143180
it's the 21st century bro

>>20141958
>you're gonna get the whole thread nuked
Has this ever happened?

>>20143544
I mean I can jump between plotlines and have them cross over.
Imagine knitting.

>>20143687
I just don't get what you mean by non-linear. You can have simultaneous-ish plotlines without much issue, but if you're all over the place it can be confusing to follow.

>>20143879
I mean I can tell a story without having to tell a linear path of one scenario

>>20142426
I see, I think I'm starting to get a better grasp on it. So if you wanted to make that sentence fully rear mouth it could be something like "he crafted golden lockets and chains for the city's classiest ladies" and opposite could be "he manufactured the most opulent jewelry for the town's wealthiest women." As far as determining whether a sound is front or rear mouth, is the only way to do that just to play around with it in your mouth until you get an idea?

>tfw started yet another new story instead of working on the main ones

>>20143210
Now THIS is good shit

>>20143210
When I write, I listen to music that gets the "Tone" of the scene I'm going for. I used this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYCygyM4ErU

>>20143931
I think you totally got it even though rereading my examples I didn't create the best sample so sorry bout that.

The only correction I would make is to be aware that ch- sound is front mouth. And never trust the letter "c" because due to some shenanigans with early medieval english scribes it's just a "k" or "s" in disguise so it can be rear or front mouth respectively depending on the word - one of the reason reading aloud is so key!

For reference for anyone following that missed the original post:
>>20119859

>>20143931
>is the only way to do that just to play around with it in your mouth until you get an idea?

Now that you mention it I just searched and there are cool formal lists out there from speech therapists and linguists on where sounds are made in the mouth but often with really obscure terminology/weird linguistics letters, looks like the rabbit hole goes much deeper. But for my simpler purposes here is a list of how I think about placement by consonant, based on intuition and my accent at least:
Front mouth: t- d- n- sh- s- th- ch- p- y-
Back mouth: m- b- f- k- l- r- j- g- v-

But like I said, its really more of a guiding light when debating why one word may sound better than others as I line edit. Not even sure where I'd put z-, I think back?

Does anyone here post their writing on substack?

https://zuazhi.substack.com

>>20144223
Looks exceedingly cancerous

Would it trigger you if a character in a fantasy book said the word "sadist" even though Marquis De Sade doesn't exist in that world?

>>20144223
Link to another post you've made ITT to prove you're not just advertising your drivel.

>>20144467
No. Idioms and phrases that refer directly to Earth locations and such are pretty fucky, but that's just a word where the origin has been mostly forgotten, so the association is lost for most.

>>20144475
Yeah. I would have a problem if characters were saying far more specific words like Nietzschean, but even platonic is fine. Nobody has read Plato, or even remembers he exists.

I have an idea for a short story involving a human colony that can't die and have decided to reset themselves every lifetime and to trick themselves into believing that this is their first life in order to cope with immortality.
Idk what to do with it, don't know how to start it.

>>20144482
Well, platonic is a word whose meaning isn't specifically just "like Plato". Nietzschean is just "in a Nietzsche-y way", which wouldn't work. You're always sort of vaguely assuming that whatever your fantasy language is is actually being translated to English for the reader, or outright stating it like Tolkien did, so some things are fine to slip through.

>>20144467
No one would ever notice. They don't notice modern plumbing, psychology advances, or scientific explanation for phenomena. The psychology one fucks me up the most. Being able to recognize that there's an issue in your head, directly naming it, and knowing how to fix it is such a modern invention. Back in the day it was "Get over it" or "Pray".

>>20144223
Is this your blog? The website's UI looks very unintuitive.

>>20144492
On the topic of using other / fantasy languages: if my MC doesn't know a language being spoken, do I just write it as the MC thinking its gibberish, or do I write down the actual words the others are saying, or at least what they sound like to an English speaker? Not sure how to go about this, since a main plot point in a story I'm writing is being lost in a foreign land where you have no idea how the language works and have huge culture shock.

>>20144523
If the perspective character doesn't know the language, just say "X didn't know what language they were speaking" If you have some concept of how the language sounds, describe that maybe, perhaps indicate a couple repeated words that SEEM important, but you don't need to make the language a whole thing.

Question: I'm writing a super obnxious character that's supposed to be a smartass, that uses only smartass insults. Does "Lukewarm IQ" fit the bill, in your opinion? Heard it somewhere and I found it absolutely hilarious, to the point where I actually want to use it.

>>20144532
Fair enough, thanks!

>>20144597
"Lukewarm IQ" is definitely something somebody who cares about IQ would say, so absolutely a fucking smartass. I think a key thing with "insufferably smart" characters is you have to have them actually BE smart in some way. They're just aggressively obnoxious about it.

>>20141566
>a postapoc western
If it takes place in Antarctica, I'm fucking suing.

>>20144630
It does now.

>>20144632

>>20144630
>postapoc western
Why do I feel like that's just Fist of the North Star but cowboys?

>>20144467
that's why you write a litrpg where you can use real world concepts and idioms in a fantasy environment. best of all worlds.

>>20144702
That's more an isekai/portal fantasy thing, though.

>>20144702
>>20144706
People have been using litrpg interchangeably from isekai lately.

>>20144722
A lot of isekai shit does include RPG elements, so while it's a Venn diagram with a lot of overlap, they're not the SAME thing.

>>20144706
Sure back in the day it was stuff like Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe, but I thought the whole point of modern day isekai/portal fantasy was power fantasy litrpg game mechanics.

>>20144740
It can be, for sure, but it doesn't have to be. It can just be an excuse for the familiar to clash with the unfamiliar, for example.

how is it to insert your own philosophical/religious views into a setting? it doesnt seem anyone minds when battlestar galactica or lord of the rings does it but do you find it annoying or preachy? does it take a bit of the agency away from the plot since if you know the authors religious views, you can more or less guess how things will end?

>>20144748
insert other people's philosophical/religious views and then pull the ol' switcheroo at the end

I want to introduce a character to my protagonist in the beginning of the story. A teenage girl goes to a private investigator's office to ask him to investigate something for her. What kind of questions would a teenage girl ask a private investigator to investigate:

>Her parents (some sort of mystery behind her parents)
>·Her origin (real parents)
>·Her siblings (Where’s my older/younger sister)
>·Her friends (what is one of her friends up to)
>·Her Boyfriend (what is he really up to?)
What else?

>>20144820
Dirt on someone she despises.

>>20144748
When it's outright rambling about this or that, it's cancer. When its woven seamlessly into the story, or serves as a driving force between conflict, character interactions or otherwise have some purpose as plot elements. Even outright stating them CAN be done, as long as it's fitting to the context of the scene, and the larger story. So yes, while some people might find any politicizing preachy and unwelcome, I think it's just fine as long as it's handled with tact and is relevant to the story.

>>20145015
That's not bad, but I can't use that one because it sets the character up to look shallow or mean spirited

>>20145065
Have you ever interacted with a teenage girl? Of course they care about shallow bullshit, it's normal teenage girl drama. Unless you explicitly want her to be a goody two shoes or antisocial, she's gonna be gunning for that sweet salsa.

>>20145091
No you're exactly right. I'm setting this girl up to be a mysterious sweet girl who turns out to be a psycho.

>want to have an indian warrior in my isekai
>try googling intertribal wars to get some ideas on how to set up his death
>either LOTR long history books or huge tirades/"articles" on how the settlers were all big, stinky meanies
I'll just pick whoever showed more skin in combat and run with it. Browsers are fucked.

>>20145122
>how to set up his death
What do you mean? He was fighting a war and got clubbed in the head and spent the next 40 minutes on the floor slowly agonizing to death like most old war deaths.

>>20145162
I wanted to make sure if he could be executed by his own tribe for doing something post-bronze age people, but not pre-bronze age people, would deem to be noble.

>>20145114
>a mysterious sweet girl who turns out to be a psycho.
then investigating her friends is the way to go.
"i'm concerned about x, i have this AWWWFUL feeling that she's running with a bad crowd", or something like that

>>20145174
If that something displeases his chieftain I don't see why not. Bear in mind that every capable man was VERY important to the tribe's survival as even one man less meant bigger chances of someone dying next hunt and so on until there was no man and the village was effectively destroyed so it better be a really good reason for them to decide to kill instead of punishing him.

why arent u writing a lit-rpg?

Reminder, this book sold millions of copies. Don't feel too bad about your prose.

>>20145390
Is it bad prose? I've seen much worse from Sanderson. Much much worse. This looks fine.

>>20145390
Holy fuck, and I thought I was speech tag bloated.

>>20145418
It's not terrible, it's terribly boring. That's a million times worse.

What ideas did you sit too long on?
For me, it was
>Zombie apocalypse story
>Except the zombie apocalypse is overhyped and the real danger is from people freaking out about mild symptoms and going along with draconian controls
I thought it was really cool at the time but now it'll be considered passe instead of bold and subversive.

>>20145390
I get self-conscious about reusing the same words in close succession when describing dialogue, clearly some people have no issue whatsoever. I wish I could just let it come naturally instead of feeling like I have to search for new verbs over and over.

>>20145310
I am. Nobody here likes it

>>20145618
Just get rid of dialogue tags when there are two characters speaking back and forth. I don't see why sanderson is so insistent on using them here.

>>20145310
I don't have the time to do one. It would eat into everything else I'm doing just to keep up. I wouldn't be able to work on the projects I actually like writing.

>>20145390
Oh shit, I nearly forgot who was speaking there for a minute

>>20144111
Thanks! My thought process here regarding the goal was to create a distinction between the same boy based on what has happened to him, hence the usage of 'that boy' and 'this boy' to create mental distance. The second goal was to connect the POV character's observation from the first part to the conclusion he makes in the second, which is why a glance was all that was needed. Our POV character is supposed to be familiar with the boy, so I considered it unnecessary for him to look at the boy's eyes to know that the person he remembered is gone.

>>20144125
I do the same. That sentence was quickly written, but this is what I would have used given only the context that the kid has completely lost his mind and he's aimless: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCwgaK7dRz8 Interesting choice of music BTW, it makes me think that this kid is going to be a difficult boss fight.

>>20143210
The second paragraph is completely unnecessary.

>He never said anything ever, his actions always giving away his intentions clear as day. And that was fine. Even so, he just felt hard to read in a sense, as while one got what his aims were, but WHY he intended to do what he did was a whole other story. It was the kind of feeling you get when someone pulls a gun on you. You know he intends to shoot, but why?
>He raised his inhumanly structured arm and pointed. And for the first time, she really got it. His intentions and reasons behind them became one
"Fight me"

>>20145722
It's the protagonist after returning from a near-death state. He's just kind of mindwiped by the trauma of almost dying and is solely focused on killing this guy, to the point that he wordlessly starts plowing through his own allies.

>>20145730
Same person here, that's kind of true since the opening line already implies 'The boy is gone'.

>>20145756
I see.

What would it take for you to watch girls play hockey?

>3rd person limited
>was writing almost exclusively dialogue
>now writing almost exclusively narrative
Explain this to me, /wg/. How did I turn a 180 like this

>>20145942
some chapters there's more dialogue some chapters there's less. that's just how it is.

How long can a character go on without sleeping? My character hasn't gone to sleep in 48 hours already.

>>20146062
have him start hallucinating shit and have his world devolve into a Kafkian/Lovecraftian nightmare

You know what's such a good fucking feel? Finding a perfect word. I was writing a metaphor using gears turning and I couldn't remember the word for the wood poles that go through the middle of gears and suddenly it came to me: axle. And it just fucking made the sentence work so well. I'm so proud of me.
>>20146062
My mom is a flight attendant. Her usual limit is 40ish hours. It's really awful how much damage not sleeping does to your body. Get a full night's sleep, always.

yea, I just wrote my 2k words after my 8-5
whats your excuse anon?

>Please rate

Adrian’s eyes glowed a vicious red ‘As you wish,’. Adrian sent the first strike of magic Igrfort skilfully deflecting it onto the wall sending a tremor through the wall the ceiling crumbling.

Igrfort then tried to attack shooting a beam of light at his charging foe,Adrian simply dodged and drew his sword cutting the Igrfort on his side.

Igrfort howled in pain enraged he breathed fire Adrian attempted to dodge but still burnt his arm toppling over screaming.

Igrfort taking the opportunity sent another blast at Adrian. Adrian saw the blast flying towards him from the corner of his eye fighting through the pain deflected once again with his injured arm damaging the keep further.

‘Enough!’ Adrian bellowed flying upwards summoned multiple bolts of lightning which hit the dragon crumbling the keep in the process.

Igrfort fell overwhelmed as the great dragon’s journey came to an unjust end.

>>20146062
The longest record is apparently 11 days.

>>20146096
>Adrian
>Igrfort
sorry bro it sounds like a mexican is fighting an elden ring character and I can't take it seriously.
but other then that it sounds very dry, I can't get into it.
Although I can see how you might want the imagination of the other person to take hold, you need a smoother flow from sentence to sentence.
And also you need to learn about run-on sentances.

>>20146086
I've been diagnosed with an acute case of paperwork poisoning. Symptoms include but are not limited to the following: An aversion to black and white, high blood pressure when confronted with productive typing, fuzz for brains, inability to read and above all the drawing of blanks when it comes to constructing an imaginary world. At least I might be able to use that to write a short and funny story.

>>20146127
Have you thought about letting AI write your stories and editing their drivel to suit your style? I find I meet my daily word count every day this way.

>>20146148
why would you do this? the entire point of writing is to have fun building your own world

>>20146155
Yeah, it's kind of sad how a lot of my ideas only happened recently because I certainly didn't have as bad of a persistent headache back then.

>>20146116
oh...

>>20146174
keep it for editing later on, maybe you change it maybe you don't
It might flow with the rest of your story

>>20146062
>>20146100
And the guy was insane by that point.

>>20146148
Which AI?

>>20146197
Scary, isn't it?

>>20146206
Very.

>>20146062
>>20146100
>>20146197
>>20146206
So in order to write a person with insomnia do I need to try it out myself?

>>20146155
I'm just baiting. But AI can give you some completely absurd paragraphs that are great foundations for funny writing when you're in a real bind, since the AI can't tell when a paragraph is pure nonsense.

>>20146231
Dunno, maybe you should try reading what people say about sleep deprivation.

>>20146234
And at the very least sometimes it's entertaining to read pure nonsense.

>>20146148
why would you do this when you can just copy/paste shitposts from 4chan into Word? wham presto compile them all and publish it on Amazon, calling it "Wisdom of the Crowds" Vol. 2022 or something

>>20146244
>And at the very least sometimes it's entertaining to read pure nonsense.
Is this why litrpg makes so much money?

>>20146248
No idea, I've never read a single one of these.

>>20146248
I'll be honest with you, I have no idea how these litrpg authors write so much. I have to hand it to them, they have great stamina

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDRnJrA8CPE

Hmm.. does she give good tips?

>>20146296
Regardless of quality, I'm envious of their energy.

>>20146248
litrpg is just too much. everything nobody ever wanted. just a bunch of vidya addicts larping as authors.

>>20146312
I wonder if they have fun doing it. Certainly, having a justification for playing vidya and making money writing anything is better than what I have now.

Is it better to have a subtle foreshadow or a more obvious one?

My foreshadow is my character getting told they'll have to go to a town, then return. But after events happen after two chapters, their guide tells them they'll be heading to another town and not sticking with the plan.

Think anyone will pick that up that trouble is going to happen?

alt+0151

>>20146329
an attentive reader should wonder what's happening in the other town.

>>20146312
>>20146326
I read a lot of litrpg and don't play videogames at all. I do like vidya but I'm usually more interested in the lore and creating and optimizing builds so for me litrpg is a mix of my favorite vidya parts without me having to actually play the game.

>tfw 1500 words of narrative poetry written tonight

>>20143205
You have to stick an https on the front or it'll think it's an email address.

>>20146062
Firstly, what drugs is he using? Modafinil, caffeine, cocaine, MDMA, amphetamines, and sober sleep deprivation all have differences.

I've gone 48+ hours without sleep before, using one of the above substances, and by the third day I had visual hallucinations when I closed my eyes. They were of multicoloured tiling dwarves with pickaxes, similar to what you'd see if you closed your eyeballs and pressed your eyes, but detailed tiling pictures instead of abstract shapes. Apparently visual hallucinations are pretty common for sleep deprivation. I also started to see visual trails, like a windows 95 mouse cursor, and my sense of time was a bit off.

According to https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyt.2018.00303/full you enter full-on psychosis around the 72 hour mark, and it doesn't always resolve after going to sleep, which sounds fun.

>>20146343
This. But let me ask for context, are you saying the foreshadow is the abrupt change of plans?

>>20146387
The foreshadow is going to town A to town B and back to town A.

But upon arriving at town B, the coach now says the group goes to town C. Which never has been mentioned.

Town C foreshadow is too obvious right?

How should I sound out the rhythm of vowels, consonants, and the stresses in pronunciation if I've been inflicted with a Jap/Chinglish accent for most of my life because most of my formative years were spent in Japan/China?

>>20146436
Maybe, although I'm not quite sure that this is foreshadowing. Other anon is right though, your more attentive readers should be able to figure out something's about to happen.

>>20146436
wtf are you talking about. that is not foreshadowing. the reader should note that the plan has deviated and expect the unexpected. it would be foreshadowing if you had a little aside story about bandits or monsters or something and then those specific things showed up in town c

>>20146469
Thanks bro, I was kind of confused there too.

>>20146436
Foreshadowing is kind of like this:
>A talks about an event in the future, hoping that it'll go well
>Something that happens around that time provides hints of how it turns out
Let's say A is hoping their wedding goes smoothly and they completely ignore a couple breaking up in the background, that lets your readers know in advance that things aren't going to go well.

>>20146480
>>20146469
>>20146458
K thanks.

>>20145048
>>20144754
i dont necessarily mean just preachy diatribes, i mean like the way tolkien weaves catholic and germanic themes into his works. i guess if im subtle about it no one will mind that my works rip off zuni and zoroastrian mythology

>>20145618
This is definitely a bad example, but you should never be shy about using "said" because it's basically invisible. Action tags are generally better to create a more alive-feeling conversation with people moving around and such, but there's nothing wrong with just using "said", though given there's only two people in that particular example it could absolutely have been cut down and just had the dialogue without any tags for the most part.

>>20144493
No one even noticed a character saying "wait a minute" in my story set in a world without our time system or clocks. Most people are barely conscious of what they read and just skim over shit.

>>20146456
Look up vids on "how to speak with an American accent for native Chinese/Japanese speakers" to start, probably.

When youthful morning ascends clouded skies,
Gold flattery stifles the infant realm;
And while bubbling brooks and lush lowlands lie:
Her fingers of rose do soon overwhelm.
Twelve sit upstairs amidst the basest rack,
While her eye victorious in its gaze;
But foreseen heaven appears at her back,
A forlorn shade over a cosmic face.
Stealing west, hiding face from dishonour,
While robes of saffron left on morning’s bed;
Her gaze I filched, my paramount wonder:
Passing away, fraught, with blue verses said.
Yet for eternity that men can breathe,
Love will be stained by the morning that leaves.

appreciate the feedback

Thoughts on an "Ascended LitRPG"? A LitRPG that forsakes the retarded immersion breaking stat-screens and ability names and vague magic system for more nuanced, traditional fantasy storytelling, but with elements like dungeon crawling, cultivation, magical items and abilities that makes it look ~like~ a LitRPG?

I've been playing vidya since I was 3, and when I heard about LitRPGs I was beyond overjoyed, but having read a few, the whole "I cast my LvL 3 Ice Lance!" is such trite. Beyond that, does it really have to be a portal fantasy / isekai? The concept was fun 10 years ago, now it's been done by everyone and thier grandma.

>>20146752
What's your opinion on using action tags as a replacement for dialog tags like "said" or "whispered" or what have you? As in, you have the dialog, and then the break includes an action like "Bla bla bla, lorem ipsum bla bla" - he scratched his nose, containing a sniffle. "Bla bla."

I use this pretty often since I really dislike seeing words repeated in quick succession, even if it is just "said".

I never leanrt to properly type and my speed is garbage. I use both hands but not all fingers, and my left hand is severely underutilized. Is it possible to fix this, and how? Whenever I apply all my fingers I go at a snail's pace and make a lot more mistakes.

>>20147445
You've made me realize I don't actually use my left pointer finger when I type. Being said, there are free typing drills online if you're wanting to change how you type entirely.

>>20147445
Practice, practice, practice! Best advice I could give is to just do it more, the more you do it, the faster you get and the less errors you do. Take your time though, get comfortable and learn the keyboard's layout, and over time you'll get faster.

Back when I had a similar issue, I practiced using TypeRacer. Maybe give that a try too, it's fast, and you can do it pretty much anywhere. I still use it during classes or work.

>>20147464
Alright, thanks a lot for your advice! Good to know there's still a solution. Now I wish I could combine this training with my college papers, but I need to type as fast as possible to get all this work done in time and I bet suddently changing my style will slow me down for a long time before I get any better.

>have dream
>feel the emotions pulse strong long after waking up
>time to write it down
>
it's incredible how everything makes so much sense in dreams yet becomes absolutely stale when you take it out

>>20147430
It's fine but don't overdo it, basically. Use it to emphasise a line a bit more.

>>20147020
I'm not really sure it'd BE a LitRPG without some clearly 'game-y' thing involved. Game-inspired is one thing. Also, no, they don't have to be isekai shit. The world can just be like that.

>>20146936
I like it!

tell pretentiousness university to send my liberal arts degree in the mail pls

>>20147792
it's not that bad

>>20147792
I'm not sure what to think about this. On one hand, I like what it's trying to do, and it does it well, but from reading wso many college papers, call me jaded, but it's a ~tad pretentious, I'll have to admit.

>>20142098
Wait, what's wrong with google docs?

>>20142620
You should publish a book about funny play scenes.

>>20145390
W-What book is this?

>>20145310
I'm writing a dark fantasy. Like hell if I'm gonna add those dumb elements to it. But god do I wanna make money. I'm also a really slow writer.

>>20147792
is the narrator meant to be a shizo? only then this would make sense.

>>20148114
A book by an author who made $30 million on Kickstarter, the largest ever.

>>20147792
The blinking cursor at the end really does it for me.

>>20148123
How? What even made it so interesting for people to want to pump so much money into it?

>>20148127
That excerpt is probably a singled-out worst portion of his writing. It's called cherry-picking.

>>20148114
Mistborn: Final Empire

>>20148141
That didn't answer my question.

>>20148167
Because people liked the book overall, or his other stuff? He's not a bad writer, he's just arguably a very business-driven one. He has some passion in his work, but a lot of it feels like he's just writing like a craftsman instead of as an artist.

>>20148167
The reason he got 30 million dollars on Kickstarter is that he's already a world famous author with like 30 books, including being the guy who finished Wheel of Time after Robert Jordan died.

>vastly more popular author reveals he hates me and always PMs people "proof" about something I did that nobody ever shares with me that causes them to drop me

hi what do I do about this
how do I beat a juggernaut
I haven't been able to get anything done in years because of this shit

>>20148244
Er, what?

>>20148401
You heard right, I'm being bullied.

>>20148430
You're a paranoid schizophrenic. Nobody knows who you are, nobody hates you, nobody is sabotaging you.

>>20148244
um proofs? if you know where he lives you know what to do

>>20148459
No, this is the problem, I have actual proof of this, I'm one of the unfortunate schizos that's correct.

>>20148486
>Unlike all of the people like me who're wrong but convinced they're correct, I am correct.

>>20148486
Then put it up, or at least tell us who it is/the genre.

>>20148486
Yeah, I'm sure this "vastly more popular author" has nothing better to do but pm random people proof about what you, a nobody, did (which is what, precisely, if you've done nothing in years?)

New thread is up
>>20148606

>>20147020
That's fine. Honestly lit-rpg's don't even have to be gamey, they just need rpg-characteristics

>>20148650
So ... fantasy adventure?

>>20146303
It's okay, but all beginner stuff. Shaelin is better imo:

https://www.youtube.com/c/ShaelinWrites

>>20148679
>someone write a fantasy book
>someone makes a game based on the book
>someone writes a book based on the game based on the book
How much more dumb can it get?

>>20147020
Check out This Used To Be About Dungeons. In a perverse feat of worldbuilding it has dungeon crawls with parties and classes and levels and magical items without feeling like an artificial video game world. It's obviously contrived on some level, but it feels as natural as reasonably possible.
No portal fantasy, no stat screens, no ability names. The world is just designed to make it turn out that way.
I'm not sure I see the point but I do like the story.

>>20149008
The point when it's "the world is just like that" is usually as a tongue-in-cheek thing, or maybe just because that sounds like a theoretically interesting world, once ruled by identifiable, recordable numbers, etc.
Honestly, that's an idea, a LitRPG where the protagonist figures out how to lie about their stats.

>>20148492
Yes, sometimes it's true.
>>20148538
>random people
It's people in the same social circle. I write for a specific audience.

>>20149093
This particular world doesn't actually have a lot of stats. It has levels (sorry, "elevations") but they don't come up much. There are mana pools but they're not numerical, they're more like real world stamina.
It's kind of the inverse of what you describe – it doesn't start with dungeon crawls and then expand from that so that everything else is governed by dungeon crawl video game mechanics. Instead it posits quasi-procedurally generated dungeons with limitations on how many people can go in at a time, and an abstract theology that justifies clerics that can do healing, and limited time travel that means death is scary but usually reversed, and dungeon crawls emerge from that. And then on the other end it goes on about the economical effects of looted magical items and the kind of organizations that'd spring up and so on and so forth.
It's not gamey, that's the accomplishment.

>>20149096
Well, go and shoot the guy

>>20149164
Oh, so it's more like "let's try to make a world where a dungeon crawl RPG system could actually arise and work"?

>>20149176
Exactly.
A lot of the worldbuilding is about shaping incentives. For example, magical items you loot are randomly either bound to you (so nobody else can use them) or not, to justify people using the cool magical items they personally looted while simultaneously selling others. If they were all bound the world would be more boring, and if none were bound the economically rational thing would be to sell everything you loot and buy everything you use. (This reasoning is never spelled out but it's obvious when you start thinking the right way.)
It's contrived, but all in service of an internally consistent world with no unfilled opportunities for munchkinry.

>>20149238
Sounds neat. I think that's a fairly solid way to make a non-parodic LitRPG that's just how the world works.

>>20149175
Better yet, shoot the guy and publish a true-crime a book about it.

>>20149575
If he writes the book and self publish it before the shooting he can write the exact date he will shoot the guy. I bet the book would become an instant best seller from this alone.