/lit/ - Literature

I don't write

I'm going to write the best lit-rpg series and save the genre from the timelooping, cultivationist, hugbox trannies and there is nothing you can do to stop me!

>>20134933
REAL. You're gonna make it.
You probably will if this is serious, ngl.
>>20134929
because u havent written a litrpg yet

Coetzee’s Waiting for the Barbarians movie adaptation was a flop. It was a shit movie too. I remember our professors hyped it up for little to no justification.

>>20134957
I feel like what's his face always plays the same sly asshole in sunglasses in every movie.

Sketch I wrote not long ago

Any and all instances of the word 'janitor' will be replaced with 'janny' in my manuscript.

>>20134929
You don't *read, there is a new meme now

>>20132507
After reading the living armor narrating it's thoughts and the not by choice virgin little girl, I know you are going to be one rich motherfucker.
It's also obvious you can easily write a chapter a day so get to posting.

>>20134933
>save it from timelooping, cultivationist, hugbox trannies
I guess the question is, what's the next potential big litrpg trend that you should be pushing to get in on this side of the wave?
1. A good litrpg will always have power progression. This is a big part of cultivation novels.
2. It has gimmicks. Timelooping is a great example. Cultivation techniques are also a sort of gimmick.
3. Its location occurs in a fantasy/urban fantasy/sci fi environment.

I'm thinking the way to go is a portal novel. Dr. Who, Rick n Morty. That kind of thing. Build it like the old tv show Sliders where your mc and his plucky friends want to try and get home. This is a great way for creating a neverending episodic story that can go and go and go and it can be in whatever location they want. Add in a group of antagonists who want to rule the metaverse or something that they run into early on and keep clashing with. Power progression is a combination of scifi gadgetry they find as well as, why not, magic they learn while in the different worlds. They start with an unreliable means of going from world to world but eventually they get a ship they can do it in. It runs on magic beans or something.
The story is basically 100% character driven so the toughest part is making your ensemble cast endearing and fun.

>>20135185
This anon is fucking good. His story, if he ever finishes it, and puts in lets say 18 solid chapters, it will be a great success.

What he needs to do now, is disassociate himself with the rest of us morons, and start a reddit account. Then mingle with the redditors so he stays in the good graces of publishers.

>>20135240
He is going for a royalroad patreon scam.

>>20135252
His story is too complex to be a RR patreon scam. There are way too many references, zero litRPG elements, not enough Anime styled conversations, you can't self-insert into any of the characters.

"Do you understand what you're even doing?"
>She said as she stared him down, the wind causing the trees to rock and the cloth adorning the armor of both to flutter slightly
"I'm not very knowledgeable on the subject, but whoever this guy is, it looks like you know him considering how determined you are to find him"
>He wordlessly squinted at her, to which she rolled her eyes.
"You think you can beat him? The sheer carnage I've seen him enact is nothing short of sobering, and you believe your body not being made of flesh and blood alone is going to give you enough of an edge to beat him?"
>He straightened his back and continued to walk towards her
"Do you want to know how many people I've seen die? I can't even count. And that was just the people I knew and interacted with. It wasn't all at once either, it was a slow process. I've woken back up after around a millennium, and now I find more like me.
>He gripped the hilt of his blade. The moment she was done blabbering, he'd slaughter her for standing in his way. He had to defend this country at all costs. Death was a matter of when, not if.
"And what do they do? They throw themselves to their deaths nearly every day for individual reasons I can't even begin to understand. I've seen enough already, so I have a proposition for you."
>She reached to her side and drew her blade. It was like the polar opposite of his. It was rough, dirty, massive, and dull. It made him somewhat fearful, for the size alone made it look like a direct clash would snap his blades like twigs.
"Prove you can overcome him. If you can keep up with me for 3 minutes, I'll let you pass. Otherwise, I'd advise you to leave.
He'd need something better for this job. Sheathing his swords, he pulled out his Naginata. She wasn't of Japan, but this was something much more suitable for her foreign weapon.
"Well? I'm ready when you are"

Good buildup?

>>20135305
Basically, Samurai vs Knight

My story is about a woman giving birth to the biggest most evil tyrant in history. She goes back in time and decides if she should abort him so she is able to save the world from hardships and death.

>>20135325
Man, she's a terrible parent

>>20135325
>aborts the kid instead of trying to be a better mother this time around
women, amirite?

>>20135353
It's a timeloop story. After thousands of times, she then decides if it's better to abort him or not.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/11f4QBB86vwNEMPVKaWLIwgszLMlUNW6kkYLKaTOq3Fs/edit?usp=sharing

>late stage capitalist industrial mega hell
>protagonist is a pervert who dies in a freak accident and is offered a plea deal
>turned federally-employed succubus, becomes basically his own dreamgirl

>>20135372
>late stage capitalist industrial mega hell
You're writing to the wrong crowd.

This whole Oscar thing has me wondering about how to properly write an uncomfortable and awkward scene. Enough to give the reader second hand embarrassment. Any ideas?

>>20135372
WHAT

>>20135361
>is a shitty mother not once, not twice, but thousands of times
>and then it takes her thousands of times failing to get it through her thick skull that maybe the kid's just a bad egg
women, amirite?

>>20135361
>goes for the abortion instead of just not having sex in the first place
women, amirite?

>>20135389
>>20135391
>>20135361
>>20135353
The premise is now perfect.

>>20135378
I find the term a bit of a meme, but it does feel like the most apt way of describing the setting without calling it "Cyberpunk". In a future where wealth becomes increasingly more and more concentrated at the top the powers that be aren't going to put up gigantic neon billboards just to make the suffering more "aesthetic". I'm trying to capture something a little more grounded and brutalist in that regard.

Does /wg/ considers the Hero's Journey an overrated formula?

>>20135372
>still no smut in your smut story
>still no real degradation, sexual or otherwise, in your turned into a succubus in "late stage capitalist industrial hell" - the setting is literally hell - story
I'm disappointed. She should have had a fat load busted on her face 10-15 pages in.

>>20135421
>consider*

https://files.catbox.moe/uqj7uk.pdf

>>20135435
not bad.

>>20135425
Is it really bad that I'm going for more set up here psychologically and emotionally? My aim is to build an investment in the character via a slow burn so that the inner machinations mean more, that and it sets it up for more episodic stuff later on.

>>20135435
Don't know if you wanted feedback or not. One thing I'd recommend is to start with only dialog and then fill in the description where absolutely necessary to understand what's going on. Then with the description set, do the same for the dialog. (You can also do it the other way around). It's an easy way to get to the snappy prose that's so in vogue right now.

>>20135435
>Starting with a large paragraph like that
It's not a good way to attract attention from a reader.

I'd start your story with...
>Kerak had always enjoyed stealing.
There. Now we are the reader are instantly engaged. Why does he enjoy stealing? Did he just stealing something?
Always keep us asking.

ALso write a litrpg

>>20135421
I try to make it something weirder. Instead of a sole "Heroes Journey" (Although there IS a central protagonist) it's the combined journey of every character

Legit question about publishing: How good is RoyalRoad? Read up the tos and faq, but I'm not sure how worth it it is to post my stuff on there. If not there, then where? Tradpub's a dumpster fire and I can't afford an editor so I'm not sure if selfpubbing is an option, so if not RR, then where, and why not? sry if blogpost

>>20135485
>I can't afford an editor
get a beta reader at least. You shouldn't be self pubbing wihtout one.

>>20135450
Its bad because the setting doesn't feel like hell. It doesn't feel late stage capitalism dehumanizing at all. You should kick your mc around a lot more and then Amara can come in and *act* nice. Only to be sent out on her first job. She comes back exhausted and is told she needs to find lodging for herself and is directed to some shady place and, predictably, bad things happen. As a succubus she loves it when its happening but afterward kicks herself, only to find herself sucking some junkie's dick on a cigarette butt covered men's room floor.

I like your premise but I think it demands meanness, but you do you. When my current project is done I think I'm going to write an episode or two of it.

>>20135448
thanks fren
>>20135453
I've tried starting with dialogue countless time but I never like the way it feels
>>20135456
>I'd start your story with...
>Kerak had always enjoyed stealing.
very good idea, will flip it around
>ALso write a litrpg
it will be of sorts, but more like a litSRPG

>>20135498
What I'm looking to do with the character is similar, but is meant to be less obvious. The protagonist falls in love with her new life, and is both aroused and distraught by the nature of her success being tied entirely to something she could have never attained as her old self. Everything about her quality of life increasing is tied to her donning this other form and relinquishing the archetype of what would have been 'his' dreamgirl to other men. The thought of how badly she could have fucked things up horrifies her. The thought of fucking up somehow and losing her station or the body and status that come with it horrifies her.

>>20135485
Royalroad is a sea of piss and the crustaceans living there survive solely on a LitRPG diet. At the very least you should select more than one platform to publish at the same time (like Scribblehub) if LitRPG isn't your main thing.

>>20135450
for starters:
smut writers make depressingly high amounts of money. it's a huge market and if you break into it you can make an extremely high-paying career out of it. just make sure to use a penname.
smut books are almost entirely read by women, so the hook of them is stringing the woman along. think of it like foreplay. it's common for there not to be sex until halfway through (or later.)
setting up psychologically/emotionally and a "slow burn" is exactly how you write for women, yes.

>>20135536
>Scribblehub
SH is the same as RR because it's basically an offshot of novelupdates

>>20135542
>novelupdates
This site is known for its abnormal nippon suprematism when it comes to what fictions are allowed in, but i know quite a few western authors who managed to fool the verification process and cheat their way in.

>>20135538
Thank you for the advice, and that's sort of the inclination I had. May I ask where you think what I'm going for would have the most success?

Does this sound sort of satisfying?
>Villain of the story constantly toys with other characters, both physically and mentally. He treats every fight like a game of some kind. Our protagonist is someone he sees as almost a "Friend" because they've fought multiple times.
>The hero slowly realizes that he needs to "Play the game" with this guy.
>The villain continues kicking everyone's ass because he sees everyone as a toy. Dreams are crushed, bodies are broken, and he gets away scot-free.
>Eventually, the villain just kills the hero and basically goes "Aw man, I broke it." And then he continues rampaging around, with many of the characters acting as his unwilling lackeys
>Suddenly, the hero returns!
>Except he hasn't. At least not really. He's much more powerful now, but is now also a semi-rabid kind of undead husk of his former self that seems to be solely focused on killing the villain.
>The villain initially treats it like the usual game, only for the hero to start spamming his best attacks nonstop, with such aggression and cold pragmatism that the villain slowly starts to realize
"Oh shit, he's not playing around, he wants to kill me and is now fully capable of doing so"

https://litter.catbox.moe/ggz1tz.pdf

My shitty LitRPG. I smell a million dollar patreon subscription already

>>20135581
Not him but if you're writing for women I would not have it a gender bending story. I'd change the mc to a mousy book reading nerdy woman who did all that online shit but never did it in real life. Turning into a succubus then becomes the ultimate wish fulfillment for her - and simultaneously the reader. Basically a cinderella story.

She can still have doubts later about all her success only being due to her newfound sexiness and looks. Everything, of course, ends up just fine.

Does anyone have something like "Babby's First Guide to Writing Characters" lying around? I'm trying, but I keep turning them into milquetoast carbon copies of myself.

Every novel I crack open seems to start with rich worlds full of different personalities bouncing off each other like angry billiard balls. Every thousand-word opener I write starts with one or two people doing boring shit. For some reason this is a really hard habit to break even though it's obvious what's wrong, because I don't know how to produce what's right.

>>20135607
Right now the way I've written it is that the predecessor, who last held this exact position was exactly what you've described. She couldn't handle the keys to her new sports car so to speak and royally screwed up, hence the recruiter taking a massive gamble on the main character.

>>20135619
Do you believe in God?

>>20135627
Not yet, but I'm willing to tape my eyes open and read G. K. Chesterton's collected works five hundred times over then crush the bible into powder and snort it, if that fixes the problem.

I've completely forgotten how to write. The past several months have thrown me through a loop and it's as if I've had a stroke and need to learn how to walk again. At first I was distraught over this loss in literary ability. I genuinely despaired over it. Every day I would be haunted over my empty-headedness, nettled by the utter ineffectiveness of the written word to rouse any aesthetic feeling from me at all. I always prided myself at being good at writing and was always told so. I centered the core of my identity around being a writer since almost before I hit puberty.
Now I see this vision of ruin as an opportunity. It means I can start over. The whole contraption of my past writing life, with all its compacted layers of habit and half-baked techniques can be discarded. Little shitty habits that were instilled years ago and which shaped everything I henceforth did will no longer bias my trajectory. Unburdening myself of the delusion that I knew how to write was the best that could've happened to me.
I can happily say: I don't know how to write.

>>20135644
But imagine there was a version of you that believed in something like that. What unique thoughts would he develop with that mindset? What would be his course of action based on that belief? Congrats, you developed an one-dimensional character

>>20135536
>>20135496
Publishing / advertising is always the part I dread when it comes to writing, so thanks for the advice frens

>>20135619
One place to start is to just write a basic argument: write dialogue in which two characters never agree. Another idea is that it's not so much the characters that are the problem but the lack of contrast between them. I think it's described as "orchestration" in one book. You can have two cliched characters (say the prostitute with a heart of gold and the bullied kid at school) and put each into high relief by their interaction. In other words, it can be more fruitful to focus on unique relationships than unique characters (e.g maybe the kid pays the prostitute to be a kind of surrogate mother/therapist). The last trick is to create depth through irony. e.g a surgeon who is afraid of blood is more interesting than a surgeon who is arrogant or incompetent.

>I let out a breath I didn't know I was holding in

>their tongues battled for dominance

>it was a diamond dozen

>>20135274
It has a great cheeky tone, but it did feel like it was playing for time with the mom bit. If you read this wizard anon it's not too late to polish it into a charming Pratchett-esque romp.

>>20135435
This is very promising, interesting plot and generally very well written. My challenge with it was I felt the descriptions got a little too granular (describing bars, height of walls, gaurds appearance) and repetitious (repeating how abandoned the village was).

POV choice seemed 3rd omniscient, was there a reason for that? 3rd limited or 1st might connect us with more sensory experiences (smell, feel, taste, less visual)

>do my best writing just as my writing session is coming to an end
Why is it like this?

>>20135787
>I felt the descriptions got a little too granular
This critique I'd especially agree with. The reader will have a better time imagining the details without each and every color spelled out in detail and every stone and arch described. As an example I'd recommend changing the one paragraph to
>The streets of this little village were paved in gray cobblestone. The houses all dark and quiet – a thieves haven, under normal circumstances - beneath a turbulent sky. With the rains’ intensity becoming painful the wardens spurred their horses on through the empty streets. Kerak jogged to keep up, he noticed no lights or signs of people inside the windows of these gloomy homes. It unsettled him.

>The great manor loomed large in the storm, its arched roof sharply pointed and its candle-lit windows the only points of light. The entrance, an eight foot black iron door, lay closed like the mouth of a sleeping beast.

>>20135664
Are you me, bro? It feels like I have to re-learn the basics too.

>>20135664
Did that shitpost break you back in?

Do people on Royal Road read amatuer stories?
How good does my story have to be to get readers?

>>20135937
Good? No.
>litrpg
>wish fulfilling
>funny (aka reddit self aware humor)
>very consistent (at least once a week, more is preferred)
>shilling

>>20135947
what do you mean by "shilling"?

Picked up the pen for the first time in a week or so. It's surprising how much I can hew and edit from my old stuff, and how much I picked up on mistakes from my former drafts.

>>20135957
Shill your story however you can.

How good of idea is to upload on ao3 as you're writing? It seems genius to me. Get some free feedback and chapter to chapter comments. Once you finish your story, delete, edit, and reupload to RR.

>>20135847
>>20135849
>too granular and repetitive
I agree with this, I'll work on correcting that issue and attempt to avoid it in the future.
>POV choice seemed 3rd omniscient, was there a reason for that? 3rd limited or 1st might connect us with more sensory experiences (smell, feel, taste, less visual)
3rd limited is something I have trouble with, I always envision my stories being told long after they had passed and in this instance, by a narrator who wants to distance himself from his own character within the story. I don't believe that came across very well, so I'll work on that also.
Thanks for the critique m8s.

>>20135997
fug meant to quoth >>20135787

>Have all of these ideas
>No energy to write it, or the confidence
What do?

>>20136018
cocaine or meth

>>20136018
write terribly until you get even a little bit better

>>20136027
Not an option.

>>20136028
Perhaps. Uncertainty is a real killer, if I was at least confident that my attempts suck that gives me room to do better.

>>20135937
Yes they do
Upload at least 6 times a week for the first 2 weeks to get in trending.
Makes sure it's a lit-rpg, Isekai or fantasy book

>wrote 1000 words today after starting off really slow and clunky (I'm relearning how to write narrative)
>got up to max good prose by the end
>now settling in to read Moby Dick before bed
Who here living the lit lifestyle

I understand why it's hard for GRRM. I don't even have 100 followers on my story and I'm still struggling to write a satisfying ending. Imagine if you had the expectations of millions of people to satisfy. It would be terrifying.

>>20135674
Right, and build a character out from one aspect to break the task down into simpler steps. Thanks, anon.

>>20135688
Think I might try breaking down other novels with an eye to irony and the relationships between characters for a day before writing some exercises.

Just flipping through the opening pages of the books nearest me: Homage to Catalonia, which I didn't think had much of either technique, is full of examples I've never noticed before. Master and Commander has more obvious relationships, but many of the little ironies I'd also missed until now.

>>20135997
>in this instance, by a narrator who wants to distance himself from his own character within the story
Interesting and it could certainly work - I was legit asking and not saying "you gotta do these POV". It could be a good piece for an unreliable narrator.

>>20136142
Gay ass nigga reading about DICK‽‽

>>20134933
>cultivationist
What is this?

>>20136155
Literally just plan it from the beginning and you never have this issue. I'm planning out the final volume of my story right now from a basic outline and the hardest part is making sure I put enough space for detail.

>Spends over 2 months creating an amazing city I had in mind for a long time
>Tries to google a few images for inspiration
>There's an image that looks 100% like the city I have in mind
>It's from the LotR, which I have never watched or read
Tf do I do now? Change everything? Nothing against Tolkien, but I don't want people to think I tried to copy him to create this city.

>>20136452
eastern martial arts/meditation where they gain powers. dragonball is probably a really good example. regular dragonball not the one where they're flying in space, but maybe that one too

>>20136409
Got his ass

>>20136478
they won't even notice

> Have an idea mulling around for a while in my head
> decide to finally get off my ass and start outlining the story
> halfway through the outline I realize it's YA
Goddamn

>read wheel of time series
>Simple sentences with an occasional unique word
>1 - 3 long sentence to 8-10 short sentences
So this is prose.

>>20136516
clarity of meaning is the bare minimum. simple sentences help with clarity and occasional longer ones are added for variety. making everything longer and more complex will inhibit clarity. the next step isn't to increase the length of each sentence, its to make your prose musical. a few short sentences are followed by a much longer. then a sudden stop. rhyme, assonance and consonance add to this.
jordan's prose is perfectly serviceable

I'm writing coomer bait involving a teacher and 4 students at an all girls academy. Together they form the 5 man band. Advice?

>>20135581
no clue, i don't know what sites host smut. you'll need to find your audience.
write it entirely, post chapters weekly, make a patreon and sell custom stories.
eventually amazon.
there's certainly an audience for genderbending work. though again, if that's what you're targeting, you'll need to find it and work up.
and make your penname a woman's name or otherwise describe yourself as a cis female.

>>20136549
The teacher fights off the harlots because he is a honorable married man

Is this even remotely funny?
>Why was this happening to him? He hadn’t seen anyone in a while now, but of course that quiet got interrupted not by a face he’d be remotely happy to see, but by a swarm of bees.

Someone asked me to think of why I want to write in the first place. An image that comes to mind is a windless body of water people mistake for a sea because of its breadth, that comes alive with glittering lilies every now and then, their light bright enough to illuminate the heavens (It's been decades since the last sighting). No one really knows why it happens or when it'll happen again, but that sort of image is why I want to write and do it justice.

>so afraid my mc will be a Gary Stu or Mary sue
>Make Love hem fail, have to get advice from others, don't really do shit themselves
>Now MC is a complete useless retard
Well then... I should have made him perfect instead

>>20136709
no, not really
>lel so random xd

>>20136809
In context it makes more sense.
One of the protagonist’s allies is unknowingly the sole guy who can actually set things straight at the moment, but a swarm of murder bees is sent to stop his progress

>>20136709
Not really, but not every joke needs to land.
I read Antkind by Kaufman recently and that book has up to 20 separate jokes per page where you casually read past half of them without a single chuckle.

>>20136709
Stick some buildup in there. Prime us to associate buzzing with a drone or a magical instrument, use it a couple of times, then break the pattern with actual bees. You can probably get at least a sensible chuckle out of someone.

>>20136856
Is writing an unfunny comedy really something you should set out to do?

>>20136709
It needs some kind of strong contrast, what you have now is just 'guy sees bees' when you could go for a description that makes the audience physically react once he finally sees them.

Is anyone here good with constructive criticism? Working on this.

>>20134933
trannies seized the genre?

>>20135583
It's a fairly simple variant of "the fight happy nemesis realises the protagonist actually just wants them dead now", which is a pretty tried-and-true story beat, so nothing wrong with it. You can typically swerve one of two ways with that, have the villain shit himself with fear or have him just be insanely giddy about something he didn't expect.

>>20136865
Kaufman has been making a living off of it since the early 90’s.

I want to make a character that must consume a ghastly amount of calories to fuel their regenerative powers. This character is female. Is this just going to come off like I have a feeding fetish? How can I avoid this?

>>20136891
DO you have a feeding fetish?

>>20136891
Preface each and every chapter with a denial of your feeding fetish.

>>20136895
No not at all. Ideally I'd like to make it kinda gross but I'm worried that will come off as MORE fetishy.
>>20136898
>Dear reader: my cock was limp as a wrote this next section

>>20136902
Then, honestly, skim over the details. Mention broadly the huge amounts of food she's eating, don't dwell on the eating all that much.

>>20135199
No.
I plan to give the attention deficit kidlets a real fucking story and make them feel internal angst they cannot swipe away from, whilst I point and laugh.
By the end they will beg me to stop posting it but I wont.
I.
Will.
Not.
They will one star and downvote me out of impotent rage at what i will have put into their feeble minds.
After the dust has settled and i have become a milkshake duck, i will still laugh at the inception i've wrought upon the clickbait generation...its is coming...oh it is coming....

>>20136902
I've got the Nikocado Avocado Onlyfans Mega if you want it.
For research only of course.

>>20136925
why do you have it anon?

>>20136872
very good.
>pink taffies
"pink taffies" i find interesting. it's incorrect as-written, but something about it almost sounds appropriate. are you trying to evoke, say, the memory of seeing candy as a child? you could elaborate on that more. otherwise "taffy pink"
>He walked through the placement of the rooms
"walked" works but people will read it and think he's literally walking through the house. if that's your intent, omit "placement of"
>well-placed
feels slightly out of place. i'd just find a different way to describe them positively

>>20136948
Based editorbro.

>>20136948
Thanks, these notes are really helpful. I'll study them and work them into the next bit of writing. Appreciate the time spent.

>>20135538
>smut writers make depressingly high amounts of money
Wait, you mean my god-tier ERP skills are going to waste right now?

marketing self pub is literally hell on earth, im on the edge of allowing some subcontinental to scam me on fiverr in the hope that i can avoid continuing this

>>20136948
fucking hell that's terrible editing.

>>20137337
another little loser with no ear and no understanding of english.

>The horizon left itself long over the blue sea. . .
sentence reads better as "left long" over "left itself long"
"blue sea" the sea is blue.
>Wonder what else. . .
who wonders.
>curvature of the earth
curve > curvature
>He turned instead. . .
instead of what.
>teal blues
redundant.
>pink taffies
"pink" modifies "taffies"
a house wouldn't be painted in "pink taffy" unless you're a pedantic cunt specifying how "pink taffy" is the exact name of the paint. it would be painted in "taffy pink." if the author was trying to evoke the character's memory of taffy, "pink like the taffies. . ." would be appropriate.

>rattled
"rattled" is not an appropriate verb for playing strings.
>A weathered collection. . .
the two sentences should be rewritten. "He stared himself dumb at a weathered collection. . ." reads better.
>further
implied
>the festival
since the family being at a festival is not specified until that point, "a festival" is better

>began to arrive
you don't "begin" to arrive. you arrive. an "arrival" can be begun but "He began his arrival" is shit. "He arrived at spaces" might be better, not great.
>recollectable
"at spaces recountable" isn't great but it matches the sound better than "at spaces recollectable."
>that/which
if you don't understand this you aren't qualified to comment (already knew this.)
>walked over
over is redundant
>that had grown infected
verbose. "overgrown" accomplishes the same.
>It'd been a long time since he'd come back
dissonant with the rest of the writing.
>Upon reaching
"On" better.

>newly dead widow
"newly" mismatches somber tone.
>it glew with light
i'll note, writer takes liberties. not a problem.
writer intends a contrast of owner just died/warm and nice. they should expand on that slightly. not excessively, but the unintentional lightness of "newly dead" clashes with intent.
>The setting shine from the sun
"Sunset" accomplishes same
>fell easily through the well-placed windows
i've come around to this part of the sentence.
>fell . . . onto the rich floorboards
onto rich floorboards > the rich floorboards
>rich floorboards which had been set neatly
"rich floorboards set neatly" better
>lobby
houses don't have lobbies
>He let himself. . .
"He let himself settle a moment and took stock between childhood memory and present reality" reads better
"took stock" implies "of the difference"

>Like the seafront and train journey in the house held
"in" should be omitted
>he walked through the placement of the rooms
already explained
>after him and his sister
incorrect grammatically.
>had moved out
fine as-is.
>still persisted
still is redundant
>amidst the rooms
unnecessary
>It blended with the smell of warm wood into a chemistry of incense
"chemistry" inappropriate word choice.
gone back and forth on "into incense" or "into something like incense." the latter slightly better.

>>20137560
Faux somnolent.

>>20137638
Oh yeah? Well at least I'm not FRENCH. What do you think about that, baguette boy?

>>20137560
A real editor would immedicably swap back half of these.

Hello frens. I'm in desperate need of criticism, so any would be greatly appreciated. I'll keep it short. I'm trying to write out a big story that I've been planning in my head for a good long while, and this is the prologue I came up with to nab people's attention. Tried to start off on a high note, then try to maintain it.

>>20137560
Not my writing and I don't have an argument with all of it, but
>>curvature of the earth
>curve > curvature
"Curvature" is not an overwrought synonym of "curve" in this context. "Curvature of the earth" is an established term for a particular concept that "curve of the earth" expresses more clumsily.
>>the festival
>since the family being at a festival is not specified until that point, "a festival" is better
Strong disagree, that gives a different emotional charge. "A festival" makes it an interchangeable event, "the festival" adds to the sense of being overwhelmed by something larger than yourself.
There is, perhaps, a problem of clarity, something that could confuse the reader (though I think cotton candy and caramel gives context enough). But "a festival" is worse.

When will we see a transexual fantasy hero that melds thier female and male counterparts defeating the white lord?

>>20137803
Best I can give you is a hermaphrodite defeating a space alien posing as a Chinese man

>>20137667
This features a common failing among first person narratives. We're following the private thoughts of a person, but it still reads like neutral, uninvolved third person narrative.
The character is murdering someone but spends most of the time waxing lyrical about the weather. It comes across as absurd and unintentionally comical.

You try very hard to compose these epic, poetic sentences, but the imagery is generic, stilted, and detached from what is happening, and more importantly, why it's happening. I'd recommend rethinking your approach and starting over.

Here's an excerpt from when I introduce one of my main characters. I'm still trying to learn how to be more descriptive and I wonder if it sounds like something someone would wanna read.

>>20136709
I laughed but that's probably because of the lack of context.

>>20137560
I didn't think it was as bad as you think.

>>20137893
That's what I was afraid of. I try to paint as vivid an image as possible, do you think a simple description about the environment, and a bigger focus on, say, the emotions of the character would make it seem less generic? One question, do you think a swap to third person would make the scene more compelling, or is a total overhaul needed?

>>20137931
Not the same anon who replied but I share his criticisms.

>>20137899
Could just be me, but I feel like I can see the image you're trying to paint but you are missing the mark.
>She was prancing all alone among the forest of lifeless, gnarled trees, swinging her weapons at empty air.
Why "prancing". I feel like I can tell what you're going for, which is some sort of blade dance, maybe practicing fundamentals of a more artistic school of swordsmanship or something, and in particular thinking maybe that she's doing so without an audience other than the forest itself. When I hear prancing I inevitably think of something more jovial because of the connotation that word carries, and I'm sure I'm not alone in that line of thinking.
>Unlike the slender green elves of Eldon that Alma was more familiar with, this woman had the features of a Hecatian red elf.
How about: "Unlike like slender green elves of Eldon that Alma was familiar with, this woman bore the features of a Hecatian Red."

Instead of "One of the other subspecies of Elves", maybe say something like "Hailing from the West/North, etc..." It feels like this is a more World of Warcraft style high fantasy setting so I feel like subspecies is a clanky term, maybe use race if you must.

You also spend an entire paragraph talking about her outfit and I still can't tell if she's meant to look like a pirate, an elf, a barbarian, or all three.

>>20137931
In the core of every story is "human". What readers care about is not snow and temperature, it's "who the fuck is 'I' and why's he strangling this guy?" You can't get away without at least hinting at the answer in the prologue. The fact that it's night and winter and snowing and so on can be indirectly shown through the main character's actions. It doesn't need to be listed.

The perspective itself isn't that important. First or third, either can work, you just have to be mindful of the characteristics of each POV. In first, the character's personality has to show. What he feels right there and then. When you're choking the life out of a guy, you won't even see the snow and you won't be remembering what your dad told you when you were a boy—unless you're a cold, collected psycho. In which case you'd want to highlight that angle more.

Frankly, I think third person might be easier for you.

>>20138013
>which is some sort of blade dance, maybe practicing fundamentals of a more artistic school of swordsmanship or something
That's the feel from other girl's perspective, yes. In actuality, she's fighting invisible monsters.
>or all three.
Yes. She's meant to be "barbarian tank" of the party but she also comes from pirate parentage.

>>20137893
This is harshly put but captures my main two issues with it - distance from the 1st person narrator and waxing watch too poetic. Some of it is solid stuff but it just goes to far for example
>the cold air singed my throat...
Very nice... now ground us in his emotions, thoughts, reaction to that, or perhaps a follow up action
>my frozen lungs clung together as if it were their last
Ahhh ya went purple.

You can slide into lyrical but it needs to be tasty treats on the path, not too frequent and frontloaded at start.

>>20138015
Mostly agree with this too, except about switching to third. I think he should focus on making his viewpoint central to the writing as a exercise at least - and that could be easier in an exaggerated form of an over the top first person character.

>>20138015
Thanks a lot! I usually struggle when it comes to the first iteration and feedback helps tremendously. I initially wanted to add some hint of the deeper story there but not clearly enough so as to leave it being 'mysterious'. Guess I went overboard with that. I'll redo it asap, thanks fren.

>>20138039
>fighting invisible monsters
Why? And wouldn't this be obvious to anyone watching? Do they not bleed or offer any resistance to her attacks that someone wouldn't be able to observe?
>or all three
Bruh. So she's a barbarian tank pirate elf warrior princess basically? And she has dark skin and white hair? I'm sorry but that feels very generic, also calling her the "tank" of the party feels very cliche, unless that's the target audience. If I sound hypercritical oh well.

>>20138049
>I think he should focus on making his viewpoint central to the writing as a exercise at least
It just seems to me that anon is more accustomed to writing in 3p and he'd have a better shot at actually finishing his big story that way. But it's up to him.

>>20138066
I like to think of stories like chains that you pass to the reader one or two links at a time. It's not always easy to tell how much it's okay to give at once, but there has to be enough for people to get a solid hold of. The MC's identity is one such link that you should seek to hand out asap. His name, if nothing else. If he's left a faceless pronoun still by the end of chapter 1, I usually drop the story there. It's boring.

Good luck.

>>20138097
Not that anon but I love your comment about a chain.

>>20138097
>>20138049
I intentionally leave him faceless only for the prologue, he gets a name and development within the first ~200 words. Still, I'll redo it with better pacing and focus. I'm a bit torn between first and third so I might try redoing it in both, and seeing which I like better, might even post it here when I'm done. And thanks again, you've helped more than you know.

>>20136891
Make it a character quirk you occasionally mention and not something to focus on. If you start listing everything she eats every time yes it will look like you have a feeding fetish.

>>20136891
>Is this just going to come off like I have a feeding fetish? How can I avoid this?
Why avoid it? On the contrary, I'd put in obnoxious amounts of autistically detailed description of all the juicy, fatty foods she eats. It'd be funny.

>>20136948
Editing here was a bit too harsh.

>>20137560
I think this is what we call editing in bad faith. You just wanted it to say it's bad, not help him.

>>20137667
Could you please share this in google docs or pastebin? I want to do a line-by-line but I'm not gonna retype your whole story.

>>20138414
Of course, here you go. https://pastebin.com/nsmCKaFS

>>20138414
Why do so many of you insist on line editing where it's not needed? Is it an excuse to not write yourself?

The anon said he is already planning a rewrite in possibly two POVs based on pretty detailed feedback.

>>20138427
>Is it an excuse to not write yourself?
Probably. Yeah I just read everyone else's comments on it. They hit all the main points. I would like to normalize sharing texts here via google docs or pastebin for everyone's sakes.

Is it a wise idea to choose a traumatic experience you actually went through as inspiration for your story?

I think I have a good idea for a story, but the plot would require me taking elements from an event in my life that gave me actual, unironic PTSD. I’m not sure if I could handle that emotionally, but I also wonder if my first hand experience could make for a really compelling story.

Would it be worth psychologically torturing myself and risking another mental breakdown for the sake of art? I’ve heard people say that writing about trauma helps with healing, but whenever I’ve tried to bring shit up, my brain either just tries to block any words associated with the memories from coming out, or I just feel stressed to the point I never want to talk about it again.

Should I add ramblings to add my third person POV story because it feels very bare compared to first person stories which have the advantage of going on and on about the subject thoughts and feelings. It feels a bit repetitive saying the subject's name over and over when referring to something.

>>20136888
Examples of this?

>>20138426
Ok, other Anons' criticisms were good. The main problem I see here is the lack of tension. You managed to write a murder scene that has no dramatic energy. I get that you're going for lyricism and detachment, but right now it doesn't make me feel anything at all, except that it's pretty.

You can improve pacing by varying your sentence structure. Look at this:
>The chill air singed my throat, as frozen lungs clung to each breath as if it were their last.
>With my knees pressed into the snow, my fingers coiled around the man’s neck as I sat hunched over atop his chest.

Read it out loud. Do you hear it? Two sentences in a row with the exact same syntax and rhythm.

and this part:

>The winds became still and silent, as did he.
>I didn't even feel myself letting go, nor hitting the soft snow behind me as I fell.
>Laying there beneath the starlit sky, the rise and fall of my chest was the only motion left, as all around me lay nothing but a sea of endless white.

Basically the same sentence over and over again. You've killed the energy completely. The moment of serene detachment doesn't feel EARNED because the entire passage is stagnant.

If I were to rewrite this, I'd divide the pacing into two halves. The first half can be frantic and energetic as the characters grapple in the snow, and the second half—after the murder is complete—can be the lyrical, quiet, release of tension. That's what I would do. But either way you've gotta rewrite it with more variation and rhythm--even the parts that are meant to be slow.

>>20138489
You can ramble in third person limited pretty well. Third person omniscient can do that too. All you need is to establish a subject who is thinking those thoughts at the beginning of a passage and never introduce any other characters during the ramble, only using the pronoun for your perspective after the name is established. It's a bit synthetic but it can work. I find there is a temptation to tell feelings and emotions too easily which can lead to uninteresting, non-poetic sections of narrative, but I think that's a fault of the perspective more than anything else. Third person seems to really excel at telling things happening to a party rather than the thoughts and feelings of a person. You can still get some phenomenal prose out of it that way, but in a different vein than you would from first person.

Lacking anything profound or worthwhile to say, I take refuge in action, in violence, in events that attempt to entice emotions of disgust, outrage, sadness or titillation.
How do I escape the juvenile Hollywood movie -tier sensibilities I'm trapped by? How do I mature?

>>20138591
You know the answer is to read more. Go do that.

>>20138489
Sure, but why not just write in 1st person? I honestly can't think of a reason to write in 3rd person limited at all. One of the great strengths of writing is the ability to get inside the characters head. Why distance yourself?

>>20138591
>the GRINCH holding a gun

>>20138602
3rd limited can get inside the character's head just fine, but has the option to withdraw from the character's mind to withhold information from the reader.

>make two teams of p○wer r○ngers, one good and one evil, for a comic script i'm writing
>no matter what i do, black and pink on both sides keep falling through the cracks and into irrelevancy
>notice that in other things i'm writing, i can't make any group have more than three fully fleshed out and plot relevant members
How do I get more slots?

>>20138637
Why not use the fall into irelevancy as a joke, or character trait? Have them get pissed or disillusioned as a result of being treated like side characters, and work it into their interactions with the others. Could make for some spicy scenes involving betrayal or drama.

Critique needed if possible.

>>20138602
>>20138619
3rd limited is good for swapping between POV character's without the distance of a more formal narrator's voice that is typical of 3rd omniscient. But I do find I drawn towards 1st or 3rd omniscient, either someone telling you their story or a narrator acting as a disembodied storyteller

>>20138727
Is that the difference between 3rd limited and omniscient? There's a presence of a storyteller/narrator in omniscient and limited is an impartial relay of events?

>>20138668
I tried.
By working with the characters I made, I ended up with the black rangers on both sides resenting this fact and trying to overcompensate but the pink rangers didn't care about this from the beginning, good!pink because she is too humble and evil!pink because he is a psychopath; but it still feels as if it's those first three characters' story when I wanted it to be all five's, or ten's in this case.
I even gave good!pink a side plot where she is trying to cope with having been forced to work for the government's agendas when she only wanted to help the little people with her power but it feels like an irrelevant side plot at the moment.

It also doesn't fix my issue of being unable to make more than three plot relevant characters at a time.

>>20138706
>Thin golden gossamer; that which had not been burned by the sun, still coated the grass
cut this line
>their method of attendance for the day
awkward. say: They were planning on sitting on the field drinking and smoking weed for the next nine hours. [and surely they're doing something else during the nine hours, I would hope. but 2 girls and 4 boys makes for an awkward makeout session] Then getting and walking the twentyish meters...
>His personalty was in general tampered down
I think you mean tamped down - which is also the word you should use in the line before. But calling a personality tamped down is a poor descriptor. Use something else.
>Callum and Cormac moved in repetition
cut moved in repetition. say, Callum and Cormac were skating...
>As night fell toward the city
Are you saying the sun is going behind buildings? Say that. Night doesn't fall toward a city.
>the visual ability of the group was increasingly impaired
visual ability. like, I know what you're trying to get across with this line but its coming out all backwards. Say they were squinting chink eyed at the setting sun, or something, because that's what they're doing.

>>20138591
have a real vision. you should be able to summarize what your story is about to one word.

>>20138760
3rd limited is the story seen through the lens of POV characters, so it's not impartial.

But yes, 3rd omniscient implies the presence of a narrator

>>20138777
Thank you. I have made these revisions and am submitting it to a literary magazine that is accepting submissions currently.

>>20138760
No, limited you are sort of tethered to a certain character where you can get pieces of their thoughts but not those of the other characters. It doesn't imply impartiality.

Omniscient you can relay the inner thoughts of all the characters and you can jump around wherever you want. But that doesn't imply bias or impartiality, either is possible depending on the nature of the narrator.

>>20138760
3rd limited and omniscient both have elements of a narrator, but limited is basically a little brain scanning robot that lags behind the POV character - seeing what they see, feeling their physical sensations, and reading their thoughts in a way that will make sense for the reader (but never going beyond what information, sensation, thought that character has in that moment)

In omniscient the narrator has total control over the flow of time, knowledge of the future if he wishes it, and unbridled access to the thoughts, feelings, etc of every character in the world (although they can and do often set limitations on themselves around this, focusing on 1 or a small cast) that they can zoom in on as they wish to best serve the reader in understanding this story.

In both cases it is the narrator who is the filter for information to the reader, even if the writing style doesn't have a clearly voiced/stylized narrator. It is the narrator who tells you "Bob smelled shit in the street. He hated the stink of it." or "Once upon a time Bob smelled shit on the street, it would be the beginning of the most important day of his life."

In contrast in 1st person the narrator is the POV character who is electing what to tell you, and thus can be more or less reliable and can bias the story (and their descriptions) in a way that fits their character.

>>20138760
3rd limited is 'anchored' to a character, though that anchor can switch. When anchored, you typically have that character's perspectives and thoughts colouring the narration in some way, you usually don't see what they don't, etc.
Omniscient is simply you are not attached to any one character, all things are simply told as they happen. You can still get character thoughts in omniscient, but they're delivered in the same narrative tone as anything else.
You don't have to strictly be one or the other, some books drift a bit between them (I've been reading Discworld for example, and though it's largely limited, it drifts to omniscient to talk about some aspect of the world at large at times, and perspectives can often change without any clear shifting).

Sdrathe fromping hrizzuhh
tee midden;
glumnal, hierarshishishal
pishterpaw freet,
sum numnal creesyer jimes
mus praypingle kikikat vroot!

jimes: O pishterpaw freet
sum, cray
cray: pishterterpaw freet
mus yarx, jimes

shim brimbal crasiet, pree?
shumble brumbalisy crasiet,
pree: du!

https://vocaroo.com/134XdmBI0fCU

Is it plagiarism if your story has the same premise as another story?

>>20138942
It's only plagiarism if you have the same premise and nigh-identical execution. And even then it's a pretty high bar.

>>20138942
If the premise is a band of midgets, men, elves, and a wizard tasked to deliver a magical accessory to place X to defeat the personification of evil, you may run into mild problems

>>20138981
Yeah, specificity of the premise is the main thing.

I think I'm giving up my coal miner story. I just can't get it going even though the song that inspired me always gets me hyped to write it. What should I write instead in an intentionally lyrical style?
https://youtu.be/U0X_ClHofOs

Genre magazine circuit sucks so bad. None of them accept simultaneous submissions, so you have to wait for each one to reject you before submitting again.

It's been two years since I wrote my first horror short story and I have only submitted to 10 mags. I am such a better writer now it seems pointless to get it published in the first place.

>>20139086
Can't you ask them to give you an answer in 3 weeks or else you'll submit it somewhere else? I heard that's a good way to light a fire under their ass.

My prose is so much more interesting in my journals. I become boring when I have to make something presentable for others

>>20139128
Nah its a buyers market. Even online-only non-paying mags get thousands of submissions a year.

It's funny too, cause who is even buying these things?

I've started writing a short story (which is rarely finished) a day. Roughly 1000 -> 2000 words each one, I'm three weeks in. I've abandoned my previous projects and manuscripts as I think I need to upskill further before working on a big project.

Is this a good idea?

>>20139147

Maybe try a slower pace, one or two a week. Keep em short but do a lot of revisions. I did this and it improved my writing a lot. Though now I have a bunch of mediocre short stories that I have nothing to do with.

>>20139162
I was thinking one a week originally but I get too side-tracked with structuring the entire story and I find it's counter productive, I'm going for a quantity approach for once to get past my usual perfectionism.

What did your revisions look like? I'm not planning on publishing any of them, they're strictly for just understanding and advancing my prose.

>>20139183
I find all the initial phase very difficult so: 1. I just rush through it, sometimes a whole paragraph would just be "this happens here." 2. Then a round of filling out. 3. Then I broke it up into sections perfecting things in each one at the sentence and paragraph level. 4. By then I usually had better story/character ideas and would re-write like half of it, keeping any sentences I particularly liked. 5. Repeat 3 and 4 until I am sick of it and start another story. 6. After a couple weeks come back do 3 and 4 one more time and done.

litrpg is literally just self aware fantasy. Why can't zoomers enjoy something for what it is without it mocking and drawing attention to itself?

>>20139257
Aren't they all about video game mechanics and progression? "Self aware fantasy" doesn't cover that, it makes me think of Pratchett

>>20139257
I think it's just the really shitty implementations that stop caring about characters and become just "hey stats lol" that people hate. I haven't read many myself (recently read He Who Fights With Monsters' first four books and... I mean the problems with that series stems just from "why the fuck is the second book a thing".)

>>20139265
It's a hard concept to sell without some level of self-awareness. If it's the sort of LitRPG where it's just the one character has the game system stuff going on and everybody else is just as-is, you can take it a bit more straight-faced, but a world where just everybody has a game interface (that isn't an MMO or explicit game setting) is harder to take seriously.

Elevator pitch:
LitRPG that takes place in a post-post-apocoalyptic world where people huddle around megastructures left behind by the destroyed civilization. The "magic" system involves praying to old AIs that grant you control of specific "breeds" of nanobots.

This is definitely not the setting for a tabletop I half wrote in high school that I'm thinking of reviving into a litrpg

>>20139286
I expect that's true, but is the self-awareness actually the reason people read it?

>>20139294
So what, the nanobots merge with the brain or something to make the RPG aspects more visible, they just think it's magic?

>>20139298
Some do. Some read it for the power fantasy, some just like seeing game elements, some read it for the same reason as progression fantasy, some just find the concept entertaining. It's not typically something that can carry a book by itself, but it's almost always a tone-setter, LitRPGs by nature are never TOO dark.

>>20134901
JM Coetzee is not an Afrikaner you idiot.

I want to write a litrpg where the characters actually play a VR game, instead of jumping into a fantasy world that randomly features game menus and status screens.

But every time I try to get started, I end up asking the same question: why not just make it an actual game? It feels so embarrassingly contrived to write about leveling up and shit. You might as well just say "the characters became stronger yet again because the author willed it!"

How do you fantasy writing niggas cope with the fact that your fantasy cities would have sewage water all over the roads?

>>20139319
>So what, the nanobots merge with the brain or something to make the RPG aspects more visible, they just think it's magic?
Maybe? Since it was originally a tabletop I didn't have a system for how the stats would exist for the characters, since they obviously only existed for the players, but maybe something like that. I'm thinking most of the stats would revolve around the nanobots and the manipulation thereof, constitution/hp would be like the level of medical nanobots in your bloodstream or something, int could be brain enhancing ones, stuff like that. I also had ideas for "spells" that would be nanobots acting in the world, e.g a fireball would be nanobots rapidly rubbing together to create heat via friction, they could work together to lift objects as a sort of "telekinesis", etc.
All the stats would be projected to the player via a brain implant granted by the AIs.

>>20139363
Could be fun, though you probably need to do 'something' with the sci-fi elements instead of just being "fantasy world except it's based on old sci-fi". If you want it to be a little silly, you can have it be some sort of old AI system that was made to run an MMO game that went haywire and somehow hijacked the nanobats.

>>20139350
Shitting is a modern phenomenon.

>>20139346
One reason is to eliminate any sense of fakeness from the narrative. Come at it from the viewpoint of a chuuni 11-year-old: Would they want to read about some schmuck playing a VR game getting amazing powers, or would they want to read about a real schmuck getting amazing powers?

>>20139346
>why not just make it an actual game?
That question feels weird to me. What's your reason for wanting to create a LitRPG/game at all? Do you want to show off cool game mechanics you came up with, or is there some kind of story you want to tell?
>You might as well just say "the characters became stronger yet again because the author willed it!"
From the point of view of a game's story that's kind of how it goes—fate ordains that the PC grow more powerful. But from the point of view of the player it can be something they deliberately work towards and achieve.
Struggle and payoff are a story's bread and butter, so it ought to be possible to make it work. But you might have to make the system less gamey, less homogenized.
A system where you have one XP bar and everything gives XP is vulnerable to grinding and gradual accumulation disconnecting struggle from payoff. A metroidvania-style unlock system on the other hand doesn't have that problem at all. Can you strike a balance?
(I haven't read any "normal" LitRPGs and may be talking out of my ass.)

>>20139451
I'm surprised at how few LitRPGs I've seen with skill trees, come to think of it. Most skills and such are just kind of as and when.

>>20139375
>some sort of old AI system that was made to run an MMO game that went haywire and somehow hijacked the nanobats.
That actually does sound pretty funny ngl. My old notes are long lost to time but I think I did have an old full dive world in the history (that may have been the setting for yet another project I was working on :P) that was indeed controlled by an AI.
But I'm assuming that's what you mean by "something." As in make it more RPG-y?

There are many reasons people read litrpg, power fantasy and escapism probably way up there on the list, but the reason I write litrpg is to satirize real world concepts much more on the nose and it allows a much bigger list of literary references I can make allusions to.

>>20139468
When you say "literary reference" do you mean a reference to literature or just that you're making a reference while writing literature?
Is it about having a fantasy world with a protagonist from our world? Would good old Narnia style work?

>>20136872
It's very purple, overly descriptive, definitely trying too hard. Try to speak like a human. Reduce the adjectives, reduce the descriptions and get to the point.

>>20139460
I more mean have the sci-fi matter in some way. It's a neat world-building thing, but how would it factor in besides just being "gods granting magic" with a coat of paint?

>>20137667

You're trying too hard, anon. Very purple, affected prose. What's up with odd 19th century diction like "cold was the night"? Seriously? Humans of our era do not speak like that. Learn how humans speak. Get off your computer now and go outside and see how humans speak. They are not saying "cold was the night."

Your prose has to be cleaned up, simplified. Drop the affectations. Look at what's published. Is there anything out there like this? No. It wouldn't get published. This is what they call purple prose.

>>20139350
People have a sewage system, boyo. A really effective one at that.

>>20139476
I mean I can have characters, the mc in my case because its 1st person, make references to Shakespeare, the bible, etc. while they are also inside a fantasy world. Narnia style is probably my favorite style. There's real stakes and you get to see them explore a new world.

>>20138706
what's up with the first line? so out of place.

>>20139522
That's more isekai/portal fantasy than LitRPG strictly, though. Some LitRPGs are fully self-contained fantasy worlds where it's just like that.

Wait, it's not pronounced "litterpig"?

>>20139350
I'm not using a medieval setting???

>>20139534
I'll be honest isekai and litrpg are fairly analogous concepts in my mind - yeah, there's differences, one has stat sheets every now and then. I haven't read too many, desu. Are there examples of non-isekai portal fantasy litrpgs? I figured the video game concept sort of required it.

>>20139559
Well, one I'm reading right now, Full Murderhobo (it's fairly parodic), has diegetic in-universe stats and shit, but it's more explained as "our magic scientists have derived these numbers from extensive studies", but at the same time they have "Etheric Xenograft Potentia (EXP)" to level up. It's just like that.

>>20139530
It's unedited, I'm seeing how fast I can write a thousand lines. Would probably be first to rewritten on revisit.

AAAAARRRRRRGGGHHHH IF I HEAR ANOTHER GODDAMN MOTHERFUCKING "LITRPG" AND "ISEKAI" IN THIS INDONESIAN CROCHET MAILING LIST I WILL GO INSANE
CAN'T YOU FUCKS TALK ABOUT SOMETHING ELSE?

>>20139574
And the mc is just some dude that grew up there? Huh. I guess its a big genre.

>>20139580
What do you want to talk about, Anon?

I want to write about a character who was in the military. I don't think I can do pinpoint accuracy, and it'd be a bad idea anyway for my story. I want to capture the general feeling of someone who was a soldier, whether he exemplifies or subverts those stereotypes. What should I keep in mind for this? What references should I look into? In general, what's a good way to write about a character who has experience you lack?

>>20139584
Yeah. When the world is just 'like that', it's generally a bit less straight-faced than others, because by necessity it's a little absurd.

>>20139580
>not pulling in 6 figures on patreon from 13 year olds with mommy and daddy's credit cards and 30 year old aimless losers on autism disability
ngmi

>>20139590
Read up on actual soldiers. Does he have PTSD, or is he relatively unfazed by his time? The military mindset might also influence his behaviour, etc.

>>20139580
You should channel this rage into a LITRPG protagonist who is rebelling against the system.

>>20139213
>>20139183
For me I hammer out a flash fiction every weekend. Two hours max, no revisions, up on the website it goes. Between my IRL job and the books I'm working on, anytime I try to write a short story I feel I can't finish it in time. The downside to this is when I start trying to write new material on current projects, especially if I'm in the middle of learning or doing something new, my prose starts changing quickly. I'm trying to do more narrative than dialogue right now and it's directly contrasting the first half of my book that is very dialogue heavy. It doesn't help that my narrative skills aren't that strong.

>>20139590
Look up Kent from Stardew Valley. Statistically speaking, he's one of the most internationally recognized veterans of all time.

>>20139590
What do you want to know anon? I just got out a month ago from doing ten years.

>>20139514
Oh I mean there's a lot of other world building I'm leaving out for simplicities sake. A space elevator so large it contains an entire city in the megastructure that makes up it's base, furries-by-another-name created to help rebuild the world with a decimated human population (thanks high school me!), gang wars, LOTS of TLA's because I thought they were really cool in high school, a FTL system I thought was unique but then found out mass effect did it years ago, etc etc. Again, the notes are long gone and there was definitely a ton more so I'll have to rebuild, but I had a decently fleshed out sci fi world.
The original plot I think had something to do with guiding the players on an expedition south from the space elevator to meet the various tribes worshipping said AIs where they learned the magic system then back home to confront a maniacal CEO that controlled the city and wanted to do something or other with it. Maybe revive an AI? I think they were supposed to be mostly evil and hate humans? Idk. Either way the sci fi did matter

>>20139612
Oh, I hate this. This is why my stories are stuck in the planning phase in my head with numerous scenes half-fleshed out but never fully penned down. Characters are in flux, dialogue in flux, the very scene in flux. I want to stop procrastinating and level up my writing reps so I can write one down for once.

Are there any organized methods of journaling? I've written several hundred pages of journal entries over the past few years, but would like to compartmentalize my ideas. I don't document my daily activities as much as get recurring ideas and thoughts on paper and expand on them. This is for my personal use, I have no intention of showing anyone my entries.

How can I effectively journal beyond jotting down discombobulated and recurring ideas of mine?

>>20139643
I hate it too. But I'm obsessed with my books and not with writing short stories. I might be able to get better if I shelved it for another two years and only did short stories, but flash fiction scratches that itch to tell a fast story and write something "unusual" out of the realm of my books. I've done experimental stuff and tried new prose with it. It works. Right now I'm trying to get more metaphors into the mix and stop being so utilitarian.

>>20139643
I'm putting off starting it but I've decided to start writing 1000 word (no more no less) stories. To save on having to worry about creating characters I'm just gonna write fanfiction. Doesn't have to amazing, just has to tell a story in exactly 1000 words. A professor of mine once had us do this a few times and it's actually really fun and quite nifty.
Once I feel comfortable with that I'll start properly writing one of my longer projects.

>>20139680
Your professor made you do fanfiction? I actually had to force myself to stop doing it because all the cool kids said it was dumb.

>>20139687
Oh not fanfiction lol. Just stories with strict word counts. It forces you to get creative with sentence structure and forces you to trim all fat to fit the story in exactly x words. I WISH I could write school-sanctioned fanfiction.
Fanfiction is fun, don't let any of the bitter retards on this site tell you otherwise.

>>20139727
>Fanfiction is fun, don't let any of the bitter retards on this site tell you otherwise.
Too late, I got scars from over a decade ago, and I'll never be able to write something fun without recalling those painful days...

>>20139590
it's been my experience that vets have a sense of humor that I don't think I've seen civvies ever match

>>20139734
This but unironically.
t. Wrote loads of Gohan X Kiao Shin and other DBZ gay smut fanfiction

>>20139740
Gallows humour is very common among servicemen, right?

>>20139750
Depends on the country and fights

>>20139734
:(
Please try again anon...

>>20139741
Post?

>>20139629
You're exactly the type of person I don't want to hear from. Like I said, I'm not looking for pinpoint accuracy, I'm trying to get the "feel" of a soldier, a general military idea, not a proud ZOGbot.

https://pastebin.com/2Y8iaUjn
I'm curious to see what people think of this without the rest of the 250+ pages of context

>>20139325
>Coetzee was born in Cape Town, Cape Province, Union of South Africa, on 9 February 1940 to Afrikaner parents.

>>20139799
Well, think of what the character was like before, why join the military, how'd it change them, etc?

>>20139517
Jesus, this is terrible advice.

Everytime I keep writing whenever I'm on a groove I just start randomly typing "i hate niggers" over and over again

>>20139799
>proud
Did you miss the part where I mentioned having gotten out? I never joined out of any sense of pride, let me dispel that myth, though there are a few who do.
>Trying to a get the "feel"
>Not looking for accuracy
>Doesn't want input from someone with firsthand experience

>>20139609
Thanks, I'll write this.

Wait, do I need to come up with a sort of DnD tabletop game system to write LitRPG or should I just learn the ins and outs of the latest Drag*n Qu*st battle system?

>>20139843
Neither.
Make up what sounds gamey. Almost none of the people who write litRPG paid much attention to games.

>>20139843
Depends which litrpg niche you want to fill. I've read one where on average half of all chapters were basically the MC doing math and trying to optimize his character build and I've read ones where there is a RPG system behind but it doesn't matter at all and it reads as a normal fantasy book with HP bars.

>>20139843
>I wanna write Lit-RPG!
>How do I do it!
Unironically, play an Rpg, look at the stats and there you have it. Or you could have something as simple as Levels and spells.

You just have to be able to interface with something and level up.
TEMPLATES:

Basic, Level, str, dex, mana, spells, Wis, int, etc

LEVEL
SPELLS
MANA-POINTS

>>20139843
It depends how you do it. Is it a "one character interacts with the local magic system via a game interface" thing or "that's just how the world is" thing or "the game interface is a whole powerset" thing. The first tends to require a thought-out magic system that can be quantified but doesn't need to be. Second needs a bit of fine-tuning but you can play fairly fast and loose. The third can just be whatever the fuck you want, it's somebody's specific powers, make it game-y and you're good.

>>20139734
Just convince yourself you'll pitch it to the IP owner one day and call it tie-in fiction like I do.

>>20139810
Worse than terrible, it's redundant with the earlier advice from a few other anons AND it's mean spirited. Would have been a better contribution to just shit post more about litrpg

>>20139852
I suspected as much.
I always thought SAO's success was weird as fuck because of how it felt more like what a boomer exec thought a MMO was like than what an actual MMO is.

>>20139861
>normal fantasy book with HP bars
Is that enough? I like this one.

>>20139863
I was thinking of doing something like having RPG classes be part of the premise of the story actually. Something like the people who are summoned are summoned because them coming from another world gives them unique classes that don't occur naturally in their world and that give them an edge in conflicts.
I like also how min-maxing stats can be shorthand for what each character is about, but keeping track of what each spell and ability does and how much it costs seems like it would be more of a hassle than it's worth it. Aren't these things only good for business if you can shit them out every two days anyway?

>>20139868
It would two for me. I hate three and I don't feel like working with one.
Does that mean everyone gets a floating stat screen?

>>20139915
>Does that mean everyone gets a floating stat screen?
Not necessarily. You can have a LitRPG done with a bit more concrete in-world stuff, like weird stone tablets that tell you your stats or whatever. As you've mentioned classes and such, those can be a "thing", like you have to have one to get anywhere. The general route for class-focused LitRPGs is that there's something fancy done, like multiclassing, a unique class, the shitty class being used in a fancy way, etc. You don't have to quantify TOO much to be a LitRPG, really. Honestly just a class system would be enough. In your vague idea, it could be any summoned person also gets the ability to see health bars, but classes are just a thing there? I dunno.

>>20139915
>SAO
SAO is a horribly designed video game in so many ways it's amazing. Most LitRPGs tend to have really shitty game design if they're proper MMOs. Look at Legendary Moonlight Sculptor, a guy just randomly gets an ultra-powerful class because he finds a random questline. If you acknowledge in-universe that the game is kind of a piece of shit it can work, but it's still very eesh.

>>20139915
>Aren't these things only good for business if you can shit them out every two days anyway
Short term. If you want a decent lit-rpg setup, look at Void Herald's one on https://magikonline.com/sorcerycodex/
>RPG classes
Hero-type classes - Automatically given to heroes upon summoning (can include whatever bullshit you want from people being summoned from another world. Natives won't know any-better and will just consider them hero classes)
>Is this enough
Yeah, it's decent. No one except absolute pseuds will look into your book for incorrect calculations anyways
>more of a hassle than it's worth it
Nah, in reality it's honestly a quite simple lit-rpg system
See link above for info

>>20139936
>>20139946
>>20139947
Thanks, guys.
I'll look into this and see how it can help me flesh out my story concept.

Kaijuanon here. Does this sound interesting?
>1930s Louisiana
>Voodoo witches construct a massive ragdoll in order to enact vengeance on others.
>Before they can REALLY put it into action, they're killed by the mafia.
>The doll, now dormant, is left to rot in the swamp.
>CUT to modern day, a little bit of black magic goes into the doll. Just enough to animate it.
>Due to the combination of insufficient voodoo and it's creator's being dead, it's basically an aimless giant ragdoll.
>It eventually befriends one of the following; A black kid in poverty, a homeless man, or an elderly woman.
I don't know which one sounds the most interesting. And from one of these forgotten people, it learns the value of life and how to be it's own person.
>Eventually, the ragdoll is forced to fight another monster. Specifically, a giant dragon who wants to wipe out both the town and it.
>The ragdoll starts to unleash more and more voodoo magic due to the strain of combat, which makes it stronger, but also causes it to slowly lose it's identity as anything but a tool of vengeance.
I don't know

>>20139915
>keeping track of what each spell and ability does and how much it costs seems like it would be more of a hassle than it's worth
you should have a reference page for your mc so people can refer to it whenever they want. you also shouldn't autistically list hp and mp figures with each hit. that shits horrible to read and probably worse to write.

>>20139969
>Does this sound interesting?
SHUT. THE. FUCK. UP. ALREADY.
Stop asking for feedback for ideas or worldbuilding. You're a broken record. Show proof you've actually written anything or get out.

>>20139969
hey, so you've got all these monsters. what's your novel's basic plot or are you just going to string together vignettes of monster fights for people to read?

>>20139969
Does the voodoo doll take the form of a cute girl?

>>20139969
idea could use ironing out
But just write it, litbro. Never know til you try.

>>20139915
>I always thought SAO's success was weird as fuck because of how it felt more like what a boomer exec thought a MMO was like than what an actual MMO is.
Wrong. SAO was by a seasoned oldschool MMO vet, real oldschool not WoWschool like you.

>>20137667
other anon is right, prose is a bit pretentious. Nothing against 'The night was cold, and darker still.' but theres a line that you definitely crossed into victorian autism

>>20137667
>All those words
>filter'd immediately by 90% of modern readers
Heh, nothing personal kid

>>20136491
That sounds fucking retarded. Why would you put that in a book?

>put book out on amazon
>buy 3 books for myself
>go into my college library
>slide book into the shelves hidden away
>someone may pick it up
>Library tags it and puts it in their catalog
I will forever have my book in the library.

>>20140050
If you can't understand the literary merit of this I'm not sure what to say.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V010v5ihYws

>>20139994
I thought SAO was written by a 17 year old? Am I getting my LN mixed up?

>>20140054
Buy 30 copies and donate to libraries all over. Increased chances of people picking it up.

>>20140054
You know you can donate your books to the library and they will accept it and put it in their circulation right? So they can be loaned to other libraries too?

>>20139987
A+B. There's absolutely an overarching narrative, but it's mostly about the way these characters interact with one another and the world around them

>>20140130
I mean, I mean, I mean...
Aren't they just big monsters that like to fight?
Frankly there are so many monsters in your world I'd be surprised if there were cities even as large as Pittsburgh left standing. Or does everyone live in underground bunkers with the surface surrendered to the beasts?

>>20140145
No. They all have differing motivations. Some seek conflict. Others prevent it. Others avoid it entirely.

>>20136872
Salt Water Taffy ? First paragraph

how rigid is the 80k word count to send a manuscript to publishers? anyone have experience?

Hey, Lit-rpg system shill. Since you're here and you seem to know your LitRPG, can you rate my concept?

>Centuries after a group of heroes were summoned into the world and brought with them an age of enlightenment and prosperity, one of their noble houses is in the brink of collapse but its last heir decides to turn this around by marrying the heiresses of the other houses.

>>20140117
Yes, you are.

>>20140199
and in order to get their hands in marriage he needs to prove himself and go on a quest? or does he kidnap them? if polygamy is a thing in your world I'd figure they'd have suitors.
what is the conflict in the story, is what I'm asking

>>20140214
>what is the conflict in the story, is what I'm asking
Shit. The conflict, right? Uuuuuhhhhh, I haven't came up with one yet. My bad.

>>20140228
Have you ever read a cultivation novel with 1000+ chapters? The people who read those are the same people who usually read the isekai/litrpgs stories on RR so read one or two to get a feel for the genre.

>>20140246
Yeah, I should. I have watched a humble amount of isekai anime but never went for more on novels.
Actually, the quest idea sounds great. Thanks, anon.

>>20140246
I am so jealous of how those guys can pump out chapter after chapter.

>>20140228
>>20140259
I am >>20140246 and you should read warlock of the magus world. It's kinda of litrpg because the MC has a device that allows him to quantify his attributes but that doesn't play a big role in the story besides to show us how strong he is and how far along he is in his current realm of power. It's also a lot more fantasy-ish.

>>20137667
Didn't wanna mass quote so I'll just quote my original version. I said I'd try again both in 3rd and 1st person, so here's the 1st person version, which I like more. Thanks to everyone for the feedback, hope this one's a bit better.
https://pastebin.com/HKVE4wtw

>>20140199
>>20140214
Conflict?
>Protagonist is from a minor noble house that isn't so well liked, while the heiress of other house happens to be hero-noble house
>He gets the heiress, but ends up in a tangled up conspiracy to take out enemy noble-houses
>Has to go on a quest to retrieve a lost Heroes artifact (no one believes in it, this is just to get the bothersome boy away)
>Failing to get himself a heiress, he decides to think smarter, finding out interesting ways to make more money. Ends up in conflict as other nobles don't like how he is gaining in power, and attempt to sabotage him

>>20140259
>the quest idea sounds great
now I have even more questions for you.
>1. The noble house is on the brink of collapse.
I assume this is because he is the sole heir and he maybe has a sick sister and they're poor or some shit because of reasons.
>2. He wants to marry all the sweet honeys of the other houses because why. Did he know them as children? Why them in particular.

If money is the issue is going on the quest like a 2-fer? Get treasure from the quest and prove himself to all the ladies at the same time? What happens when he meets some smoking hot babes on the quest, do they just get added to the harem? These are important questions for you to consider, anon.

Also, more important than any plot consideration, figure out his class. Make him a plucky underdog with some underutilized/non optimized magic system. This is more important than your plot I assure you.

>>20140288
Combine
>1. The noble house is on the brink of collapse.
with
>some underutilized/non optimized magic system
He is the last heir of the house and he got a known bad class so everyone distanced themselves from him because he will never be able to bring his house to wealth again so might not waste their time on him.

>these threads have devolved into garbage genre writers discussing their daydreaming worldbuilding for more genre garbage that they'll never write and the world doesn't need anyway

>>20140305
And that's a good thing. We need something to cut the pseuds out of this general.

>Yeah, uh, let me, um, get, uh, let me get, let me get sum advice on publishing short stories and uh an ice cream.

>>20140305
>sadsack pseud doesn't like funposting
you are already dead

litrpgchads making 20k a month rule this general

>>20140318
>get 12 stories you wrote
>print it as one giant book

>>20140330
LITRPG chads and monstergirl smut chads are both immensely powerful.
The question is, who is more powerful?

>>20140337
Whoever actually finishes a book

>>20140334
If he's unpublished, then that's terrible advice. How many places are going to publish a no-name's collection?

>>20140318
Take those 12 stories and sent them out to a variety of magazines or sites that will publish them. Even if half never get published, you are now a published author with six stories to your name. This will make it easier to get more short stories published. It's a snowball effect, and with enough published, you can go to one of the big five (four) publishers and give them a collection of short stories from someone who has published short stories.

>>20140357
Mr. Beezos-kun will print anything

>>20140379
Oh, yeah. But I thought that anon wanted to be a writer with some self-respect. Silly me.

Why do people even bother to add magic spells and shit into their fantasy stories? It's so trite at this point.

>>20140417
staple of the genre.

>>20140417
unironically it allows a story to be unique
>but every story has magic
yes, yes. and every story also has corrupt nobles and greedy merchants and whatever else. there's all kinds of worldshaping things you can do with magic. Take Dune, spice was simultaneously the magic and resource macguffin. The entire "world" was based on it.

>>20140463
nah there's no magic spells in my fantasy story and the nobles and merchants are actually pretty good people this time around. no dwarves and elves either.

>>20140337
>monstergirl smut chads
What monstergirls sell the most? It's lamias, right?

>>20140504
Cat girls + femdom sadly.

Please read.

https://litter.catbox.moe/7jhoqf.pdf

>>20140504
vampires by a country mile

>>20140518
Just stop posting here.

>>20140521
why? it's writing general and i wrote something.

>>20140525
We don't want you here. Can't you get a clue?

>>20140518
>debri

>>20140330
Nobody here writes that much. Great LARP though lmfao

>>20140528
Speak for yourself. I want him here.

>>20140281
The purpleness is really improved, nice going there. But still almost no connection to the thoughts and emotions of the POV char- why are they there, why is this important, why do they care if they die beyond keepin breathin' (and definitely significantly limit that kind of repetitive gimmick)

Also don't feel like you need to rush it out, writing is a reflective a solitary activity. Take yoru time in drafting, edit, edit, and edit some more.

>>20140145
I don't know, maybe because
>They don't always fight in cities
>Quite a few aren't even looking for a fight at all.

guys I accidentally found a crazy ass selfpub with 700 fake reviews on amazon, but I'm thinking of buying it just because the author is hot. what do

>>20140749
One, stop being a coomer.

guys... what the fuck

>>20140749
This just looks like the start to a very shitty ARG

>>20140749
she wrote fanfiction about herself lmao

>>20140749
>700 hundred fake reviews
would it distress you to learn those may be real reviews from simps?

I've got an unusual punctuation question, because of dialogue.
>The man askes his friend, "What's the name of the guy we're going to meet?"
>"John, you idiot," his friend answers.

Is it a comma after John? Because John is the answer to the question, and 'you idiot' is an add-on of the friend's opinion.

>>20140864
Yes, but askes isn't a word.

>>20140864
The comma is after John, but for clarity, you should add "It's" before John, since the reader doesn't know by context the name of the two men and could therefore potentially assume the friend is saying the first man's name is John and is an idiot.

>>20140882
This indeed might be a spot where realistic dialogue is the incorrect choice.

People would definitly use pauses and enunciation to make their intent clear in saying "(it's) John, you idiot." but that's not a tool a writer can use.

>>20140864
I don't know why he calls him an idiot. If its the fifth time he's told him the name he should say that. Otherwise it just comes off as unnecessarily rude.

>>20140285
I'm starting to remember why I forgot to assign it a conflict like an absolute retard; I had made these characters for a slice of life and adventure with MOTW story which I abandoned so I ended up associating them with that sort of aimless/central-conflictless story.
The first line of greentext is kind of similar to what I had in mind for my MC, except that both him and the first girl I was considering on having as his sort of girlfriend are from hero noble houses.

An important detail which I didn't include because I was being as brief as possible was that the MC is actually from two houses. He is from the aforementioned disgraced house but was adopted into a different, more prestigious house, from which her biological mother hails from, because of her dying wish after childbirth; however, he was never fully accepted into it and was always an outcast.
A possible trigger for the conflict would be when he reneges his adoptive house but in my current draft that'd be like five arcs into the story. As of now, the beginning is just him doing dangerous assignments and meeting his future harem.
Going back to what you posted, I also remembered that I have kept all main characters as part of these summoned hero houses and even though all of them married natives, no purely native character is part of the main cast. Maybe it's something I should change.
Also, there's actually a girl that's the type of person to believe in and research secret conspiracies and obscure artifacts so that'd be a nice way to introduce her into the story. There's also other two that could be relatively easy paths to accruing power with a sort of alliance.

>>20140262
I'll check it out. Thanks, anon.

>>20140288
>>20140303
>1.
As you can tell, I'm still working on the foundations but as of now it's mostly his father who finished ruining his house. I'm leaning on either them being known for an area that became obsolete or the house itself being "poisoned" by other nobles due to being considered dangerous or possibly sheer incompetence from too many generations.
As for a sister, the closest he has to one is one of the maids of his house's skeleton crew who was nursed along with him by her mother. I just liked the idea but I'm not sure if I really want to completely ruin the "obligatory" political sister slot in the harem for my audience.

>2.
Only two of them. As to why he'd pick them at all; one of them is a reliable and smart girl and they had a lot of trust in each other from when they were kids so even if he didn't love her, it'd be a bad idea to have her leave his side; the other is not as reliable but is one of the most capable people he meets. As for the other girls, he meets them during the assignments at the beginning of the story so there's the meeting smoking hot babes question, mostly, solved, for now at least.

>2-fer
I'm sorry, what is this?

>Also, more important than any plot consideration, figure out his class. Make him a plucky underdog with some underutilized/non optimized magic system. This is more important than your plot I assure you.
Sure. It's been hard because I want him to be both a really hardcore guy but also want him to be a good strategist and commander.
I like the DnD Warlord class for a template but I'm yet to figure out the lore to decide how rare and strong that would be, or even if I want to settle on it.

>He is the last heir of the house and he got a known bad class so everyone distanced themselves from him because he will never be able to bring his house to wealth again so might not waste their time on him.
In the current draft, he is seen as both a threat and a liability due to his position inside his adoptive family. He is shown to be more capable than his step brothers but his step father would obviously not want to hand his house to a bastard.

>>20140749
>benevolent Nordic aliens
Based?

>>20141066
>>20141066
>>20141066

New Thread

>>20141066
>>20141066
>>20141066

>>20140935
>2-fer
twofer. two for the price of one. two birds one stone

>>20140935
>good strategist and commander
You may hate me for this suggestion, but pick Bard.

Why is giving character trait so easy for side characters but not the MC FUCK.

>>20140864
>"John Yu Ideott? Is he dutch?"