/lit/ - Literature

>>20019046
Thread theme
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KabAJhlB8w

Translating Ion atm. My first big boy text

>>20019100
Point me the direction for ancient Greek proficiency please

>>20019105
No clue man, spent about 5 months working through Ponten's Grekisk läsebok which only has about 40 pages of isolated Greek sentences, passages from Anabasis, edited Aesop's Fables and other short stories. I guess it made Ion pretty manageable but my phase is still very slow. It'll probably take about 10 days to get through.
As far as a point of direction for proficiency goes the Italian Athenaze seems to be one of the best ways to learn Greek. I also used Alexandros to Hellenikon Paidion and LGPSI as supplements to my dry textbook.

>>20019044

Oh whoops i did indeed reply to the wrong post! I don't have many tips beyond what everyone else said (knowing German would be extremely helpful). There's also dual language editions of Beowulf out there since I'm guessing that's why you're learning.

>>20019046
>- instead of —
Pathetic. Cursed thread.

quid?

>>20019217
I have a basic knowledge of German from 3 years in high school, but I plan on going back and becoming fluent. I do have an interest in Beowulf, but my main reason for learning Old English is to become familiar with the fundamentals of our poetry. I will also be looking at Middle English, but my interests are in Germanic and Celtic poetry, not French. Do you think I can focus on Old English now and then German later, since I want to learn both of them, or do you think it must be done the other way around.

>>20019265
Numerus servorum meorum est centum.

>>20019265
>[Erai-raws] Non Non Biyori Nonstop - 07 [720p][Multiple Subtitle].mkv_snapshot_14.41_[2021.02.23_17.23.06].jpg
87 KB JPG

>>20019303
Nōn! Tu meus servus es.

>>20019317
はい?

>>20019270
Oh yeah I should have clarified I don't think German is a prerequisite at all, it's just useful. The fact it uses Germanic vocabulary was my biggest hurdle. The underlying OE grammar really isn't that much different than modern English, since it used a lot of helper verbs to make different grammatical constructions. There's gender and declensions sure but usually they are attached attached to the same particles we use now.

I did a similar poetry exercise, there's some excellent poetry in OE that make it worth the work. When I finally started middle English it was one of the most jarring experiences in my life. Middle English drops in french words into Germanic grammar and suddenly everything is easily readable.

If you want a good overall history this is a great book

Started reading the Thebaid yesterday and I was filtered more by the mythology than the actual Latin.
During the first 6 lines in which Oedpius curses his bloodline and gives the reason why, by going to the beginning of his family's curse, so I spent like an hour reading up on the backstory and following the rabbit hole to different areas. I will now unload my autism:

Agenor, Graece Ἀγήνωρ, filius Neptuni et rex Phoeniciae fuit. Cum Iuppiter Europam, filiam suam, raperet, Agenor filios suos, ex quibus unum fuit Cadmus, eam invenire iussit sed hoc facere non poterunt; mortalis enim voluntatem Iovis pervertere numquam potest. Qua de causa, Cadmus iussum patris non iam exsecutus est at, necandum draconem divinum Martis, novum regnum condidit: Thebae. Sed, pro dolor! hoc factum, Mars Cadmum proles suos maledixit! Nunc, maleficentia in sanguine suo incoluit et mala fortuna super Thebas regnabit.

Genealogia
Agenor -> Cadmus -> Polydorus -> Labdacus -> Laius -> Oedipus -> Polynices, Eteocles, Antigone, and Ismene

>>20019592
>Mars Cadmum proles suos maledixit!
Oops, meant "Cadmum et proles suas"

>>20019592
maledicere takes the dative. Otherwise bene fecisti

>>20019660
gratias amice, if I may ask a question, how would you phrase this gerundive phrase?
>necandum draconem divinum Martis

I was trying to say, "by killing the divine dragon of Mars" but I do not know the proper way. I know it is bad Latinity to use the English construction gerund + direct object, i.e. "necando draconem," since the Romans preferred using the gerundive in that case. Nevertheless, I don't know the proper way to write it so I just stuck it all in the accusative case. Would it be better to write it all in the ablative to get the sense of "by", e.g. "necando dracone divino"

Why were the Romans so violent?

>>20019815
Were you an only child?

>>20019789
don't overcomplicate it. Even a present participle - Draconem necans - would have been alright, had you used the historic present. if you want to use a gerundive phrase in the ablative it would be something like - horrenda mala (the curse) haec sibi ipsis Cadmus (in) draconem necando intulerat

>>20019789
Not the one who replied, and also far from an expert, so I have no idea if this is correct, but what about an ablative absolute here?

>dracone divino Martis necato, novum regnum condidit

The divine dragon of Mars being killed, he founded a new kingdom

Or does this not sufficiently attribute the killing of the dragon to Cadmus?

>>20019961
>Or does this not sufficiently attribute the killing of the dragon to Cadmus?
it does not, unless you added an ablativus auctoris, which would be clunky within an abl. abs. at any rate an abl.abs. often expresses an action subsidiary to the principle action, i.e. Troia deleta Graeci domum ierunt, oratore laudato senatores applauserunt etc. what's important here is that the greeks went home, that the senators clapped. i would suggest either a present participle, provided the account is written in the historical present, or ger. abl., see >>20019948
t. classicist

Need some recommendations for books, courses, & resources for Eastern classical languages like Sanskrit, Classical Pali, Old Tamil, Avestan, Old/Middle Persian, Classical Tibetan, & Classical Chinese.

Anyone want to volunteer their experience and advice?

>>20020258
I have no clue on any of that stuff. Maybe, OP knows something, given the title pic. Are you the guy who always is asking about Classical Tibetan?

>>20019100
How much time does it take you to translate a page?

>>20020284
>Are you the guy who always is asking about Classical Tibetan?
Nope, first time asking. I'm studying Western classical languages, but I'm just trying to shift the conversation away from you-know-what before the thread gets derailed again.

But I'm also genuinely interested in starting Sanskrit some time later this year.

>>20020293
About 2 hours. I feel like 2/3 words on every page are new.

>>20019948
>>20020004
Gratias, docte amice. I should strive to be syntactically simple first before trying more complicated structures (at least for me) kek.
>>20019961
Gratias tibi quoque, amice. It's good to keep in mind that there is more than one way to skin a cat.

retarded frogus posterus

>>20020327
σπεῦδε βραδέως, o amice.

>>20020335
Vae tibi, crūdēlis inimice. Iuppiter immani mentula te pedicet.

>>20020258
Lexicity has pages for three of those. Archive.org might have something.

Si qui anones fabulam de rege, qui etiam linguam Latinam adultus discedebat, legere volunt, propono "Vita Karoli Magni."

(If any anons want to read a story about a king who also was learning Latin as an adult, I reccomend "The Life of Charlemagne.")

>Erat eloquentia copiosus et exuberans poteratque quicquid vellet apertissime exprimere. Nec patrio tantum sermone contentus, etiam peregrinis linguis ediscendis operam impendit. In quibus Latinam ita didicit, ut aeque illa ac patria lingua orare sit solitus, Grecam vero melius intellegere quam pronuntiare poterat. Adeo quidem facundus erat, ut etiam dicaculus appareret.

>Artes liberales studiosissime coluit, earumque doctores plurimum veneratus magnis adficiebat honoribus. In discenda grammatica Petrum Pisanum diaconem senem audivit, in ceteris disciplinis Albinum cognomento Alcoinum, item diaconem, de Brittania Saxonici generis hominem, virum undecumque doctissimum, praeceptorem habuit, apud quem et rethoricae et dialecticae, praecipue tamen astronomiae ediscendae plurimum et temporis et laboris inpertivit. Discebat artem conputandi et intentione sagaci siderum cursum curiosissime rimabatur.

>Temptabat et scribere tabulasque et codicellos ad hoc in lecto sub cervicalibus circumferre solebat, ut, cum vacuum tempus esset, manum litteris effigiendis adsuesceret, sed parum successit labor praeposterus ac sero inchoatus.

>>20020521
*discebat
*recommend

>>20016663
In principle, but there are some individual words that may require a paragraph of explanation to adequately express in another language because of the cultural gap.

>>20017034
It's not that we can't memorize them, it's that just brute force memorizing them out of context isn't a very effective way to learn them.

>>20017135
>modern concepts like transsexuality
Priestesses of Cybele, anyone?

>>20017338
So basically the orthography is extremely archaic/outdated like English?

>>20017366
That's not how it works. Human languages have been around for hundreds of thousands of years; if they tended to only simplify, we'd all be speaking in grunts by now. They become simpler in some ways, but then they also become more complex in other ways through grammaticalization. For example, Chinese is starting to develop something like conjugation. Plus, there are modern languages that are as complex as Latin, or more so.

>>20017379
Latin happens to be more inflected, but there's nothing intrinsically special about the languages of 2000 years ago compared to the languages of today; human brains haven't changed.

>>20017638
Num in /lit/ sinetur?

>>20018234
If native speakers from the period we take as model using a construction doesn't make it right, what does? Grammar doesn't come from grammar books, it comes from the usage of native speakers, and grammarians attempt to describe it.

>>20020868
>Priestesses of Cybele
Castrated men =/= troons
they were freaks

>>20020258
Aside from Lexicity and the Internet Archive, Lexilogos has some resources for Classical Chinese, and r/classicalchinese has some links to resources (I'm a mod there so feel free to recommend any additional ones.) I've also heard good things about Classical Chinese for Everyone.

>>20020926
https://sacred-texts.com/cla/luc/motc/motc09.htm

>>20020934
>some dude wrote a play about a dude crossdressing to fuck a woman
>therefore the ancient greeks had political ideologies that Jews made up in the 1960s
huh?

>>20020954
You didn't even read it, it's about someone who we might recognize as a trans man today. Obviously the particular understanding of gender identity is a modern thing, but the underlying medical condition of gender dysphoria has always existed. Take the written records of Elagabalus- even if we assume that this specific case is slander, the fact that Elagabalus was recorded as doing things like demanding to be called a woman and offering any doctor who could successfully provide sex reassignment exorbitant rewards suggests that the author was familiar with the existence of people that we would recognize as gender dysphoric in the modern day.

A exercise for /clg/
This is an excerpt from Juvenal's Satire X, lines 346-366, and one of my favorite passages in Latin literature. Post your translations and see how they compare with those of others.

Is anyone here learning multiple languages at the same time? I'm learning Latin and wondering if I should start another language yet.

How much does Ancient Greek differ from modern Greek? And what are some good books that were originally written in Latin?

>>20021666
In my experience starting two at the same time can be flustering, much better to stagger them. Say 6 months to a year of Latin then start Greek. Of course you can do both at once and some even have success at that.
if you really want to learn something then go for it

>>20021680
How much does Chaucer differ from Dickens?
>good books that were originally written in Latin?
this question is so broad as to be virtually unanswerable. What are you interested in?
Aeneid
Metamorphoses
Cicero
Bede
Augustine

>>20021721
>How much does Chaucer differ from Dickens?
I'm retarded and I've only read Dickens. I'm guessing not so much that I couldn't understand Chaucer if I understood Dickens?

>What are you interested in?
This is just for myself when I'm done studying Latin. I'd say:
>in Latin
>not heavily reliant on outside material (i.e., no sequels to the Odyssey or Illiad, nothing that requires me to know everything about the tragedies - I'm not too well read, so this would make my life easier)
>part of the canon, or actually useful - so not an ad for a Roman burger joint

>>20019046
I'm very sorry by polluting your thread by a question that has probably been asked already but how long would it take to learn Greek? My sole goal is to read philosophy.

>>20021732
I've heard people say 2 years.

>>20021732
There are way too many factors to give you a proper answer like
>level of industry
>amount of hours available for study
>discipline
>if you can study everyday
>is your memory dogshit or genius tier
>numbers of languages already learned
>level of knowledge for grammatical jargon/concepts
>experience w/ inflected languages
>level of pattern recognition
>level of logical thinking
etc etc etc

If you are Scaliger level of genius and already fluent in Latin in both the passive (reading) and active (writing) sense, you can do it in a couple of months if all you do is Greek from the time you wake up until bedtime.
If you are an average mental pleb, 2-6 years.

Are there any textbooks from the ancient world written in Greek still extant? I’m trying to read Iamblichus’ De Mysteriis and am getting filtered really bad. On the same note, what books would help me get a good grasp on what Iamblichus is saying? I’m reading him because I spent a year studying Kant and realized the futility of pure reason in metaphysics so I think Theurgy could be a way to actual metaphysical knowledge.

>>20021395
Poetry is fucking exhausting. I'm missing large chunks, but this is all I can do for now. I've been reading more poetry lately, but I'm still just thinking of it as prose with more difficult word order. It still doesn't seem like poetry. Neat to see mens sana in corpore sano, though.

>Nil ergo optabunt homines? si consilium vis,
>permittes ipsis expendere numinibus quid
>conveniat nobis rebusque sit utile nostris.
Was nothing then pleasing to men? If you want advice,
allow yourself to weigh out by nods of approval that which
may come together to us and things may be useful to us

>nam pro iucundis aptissima quaeque dabunt di:
>carior est illis homo quam sibi. nos animorum
>inpulsu et caeca magnaque cupidine ducti
>coniugium petimus partumque uxoris; at illis
>notum qui pueri qualisque futura sit uxor.
for through pleasant things being reached and those things which the gods were giving:
it is dearer to this man than to themselves.
We, led by the push of souls and great blind desire
seek marriage and to bring forth a wife;
(something about known to those who might become wife to a boy?)

>ut tamen et poscas aliquid voveasque sacellis
>exta et candiduli divina tomacula porci,
>orandum est ut sit mens sana in corpore sano;
so that however you beg and swear at sanctuaries
divine organs and white things and pork sausage
are to be prayed for so that a sound mind might be in a healthy body

>fortem posce animum mortis terrore carentem,
>qui spatium vitae extremum inter munera ponat
>naturae, qui ferre queat quoscumque labores,
>nesciat irasci, cupiat nihil et potiores
>Herculis aerumnas credat saevosque labores
>et venere et cenis et pluma Sardanapalli.

Beg for a strong soul free from the terror of death
which places the far space of life among duties of nature
which may be able to bear any labor
may not know anger, may desire nothing and,
more capably believe the hardship and savage labors of hercules,
and come from dinner and quill of Sardanopolis

>>20021666
I'm learning both Latin and Greek, as well as (soon) German (for scholarship).

>>20021730
Ancient and modern Greek are very different. Modern speakers could get the gist of an ancient text but can not understand it without study
For Latin books how about the following
Apuleius - Metamorphoses (the Golden Ass)
Caesar - de Bello Gallico, de Bello Civili
Cicero - de Re Publica, de Natura Deorum, In Catilinam. Pretty much anything by Cicero but those are three big ones
Catullus - poetry relatable to everyone. Some poems are reliant on mythology but you can skip those
Juvenal - Satires
Livy - ab Urbe Condita
Martial - poetry on a variety of topics
Plautus - any of his plays, all comedies
Tacitus - Histories, Annals
All of those are canon and cover a wide range of topics and styles. Others below also but they aren't in line with your second requirement
Horace
Ovid - Metamorphoses
Statius - Thebaid
Virgil - Aeneid, Eclogues, Georgics
There are others i'm sure I'm forgetting. The above will give you a good starting base. Some are harder than others so beware.

>>20021823
Pretty good for a first draft. you are on the right track.
Don't have time to go through all of it but one thing that stood out is the last line
>et venere et cenis et pluma Sardanapalli
these are ablatives in concordance with potiores
>prefer the labors of Hercules to (rather than) luxuries of Sardanopolis
Sardanapalus was considered an opulent and Bacchanal place at that time, a place of leisure and fine things.

>>20020903
Ubi nisi in /lit/?

>>20020521
Quis illud scripserit dic mihi

>>20020258
>Middle Persian
Start with Introduction to Pahlavi by Skærvø, it's a free pdf
There are two flavors of Middle Persian: Book Pahlavi and Manichaean Middle Persian.
The former is a nightmare to learn to read, with outdated spellings, ambiguous letters, and Arameograms (Aramaic words that you're supposed to pronounce as Persian words). Basically you'll just have to memorize the shape of every word.
Manichean Middle Persian is written more like a normal abjad.
There isn't much to read besides some Zoroastrian religious literature (not the actual scripture which is in Avestan) and Manichean literature.

Sneak peak of some Zoroastrian Pahlavi literature:
>u-m dīd ruwān ī zanān ke-šān mēx ī dārēn andar har dō cašm zad ēstād pad pāy-ē nigūn āgust u-šan was wak ud gazdum ud mār ud mōr ud magas ud kirm ud abārīg xrafstarān pad zafar ud wēnīg ud gōš ud kūn ud gyāg ī gād andar šud [ud] āmad u-m pursīd kū ēn ruwānān ān ī kē u-šān čē wināh kerd kē ruwān ōwōn garān pādifrāh barēd gōwēd Srōš-ahlaw ud Ādur-yazad kū ēn ruwān ī awēšān druwandān zanān kē-šān pad gētīg šōy dāšt ud abāg any mard xuft ud gād dād hēnd ud gāh [ud] wistarag ī šōy tabāh dāšt ud tan ī šōy āzard
>And I saw the souls of the women into both of whose eyes they had driven wooden pegs, [and who were] hanging downwards by one leg. And many frogs, scorpions, snakes, ants, flies, worms, and other reptiles went into and came out of their mouths and noses and ears and anuses and vulvas. And I asked: 'To whom do these souls belong and what sins did they commit whose souls are suffering such severe punishment?' Srōš, the pious, and the god Ādur said: 'These are the souls of those wicked women who in the world had husbands and slept with other men and committed adultery, and defiled the bed and the bedding of their husbands and hurt their bodies.'

Which lost ancient language do you wish you could learn?

Etruscan
Minoan
Meroitic
Iberian
Hunnic
Gaulish
Brittonic
Venetic
Rhaetian
Dacian

>>20019183
Var hittade du Pontén? Jag har letat i åratal men den verkar inte finnas på något bibliotek eller som pdf och alla fysiska kopior jag hittat kostar flera hundra kronor.

>>20022939
I used the Finnish edition. Apparently Ponten was very popular in Denmark so maybe look for Danish editions. It's not the greatest textbook though and if I had to start all over again I'd go for something else. You'll also need a separate grammar book. If you can't find it anywhere that probably means that Swedish academia has adopted another textbook.

>>20022816
Oscan. Fucking Latin, why'd you have to wipe out all the other Italic languages?

>>20020877
Kind of, but the orthography is much more regular than English. A good example is the word grænn 'green'. Old Norse had grǿnn, but long ǿ shifted to æ in the 1300s on Iceland. However, there have been more changes than this, and so the word is pronounced /ˈkraJ̯tn̩/. That's a pretty substantial difference between the spelling and the pronunciation.

>Bellum contrā Gallōs parābunt
What does it mean? I thought "They prepare for war against the Gauls", but wouldn't 'bellum' have to be dative for that? This old textbook has no answer key.

>>20019819
Tought the same thing
Me and my Brother regularly beat the shit out of each other
>>20019815
Normal behaviour

>>20023641
why would it have the dative? they prepare(what? ) the war against Gauls

>>20023641
Non parant, sed parabunt.

What does /clg/ think of this guy?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4pvjbpcl-s

>>20023673
Because in English you say "They prepare FOR war" not "prepare war".
>>20023714
Yeah, I meant "were preparing"

>>20022500
Alright, thanks anon.

>>20023746
If this is the same guy I saw a mainstream news presentation on, then he's fine, but the news was absolutely retarded. He was billed as one of the very few people in the world who knows Latin. Understanding the secrets of the Romans lies in this man's hands. Plus, that guy used ecclesiastical pronunciation, which sounds stupid to me.

>>20023783
It's the same guy, but I didn't realize until this video how strong his American accent is. Some Americans can't help but pronounce foreign languages as if they're speaking English and make no attempt to improve.

>>20023773
>Yeah, I meant "were preparing"
Non parabant sed parabunt

>>20019046
Made a spreadsheet to keep track of my progress for the patented reading fluency 7-Step-Ranieri-Dowling Method (tm). It's going well so far.

>>20023808
Are you supposed to do all that for every chapter? If so you'll get bored pretty soon

>>20023803
Ah shit, I keep mixing that shit up.
So is "bellum parabant" with the accusative correct for "they will prepare FOR war"?

>>20023827
Yeah, though I doubt I'll get bored. I realize it's necessary for acquisition and it felt good to completely master the first chapter.

>>20023831
parabunt* dammit

Who's the bigger hack? Ranieri or Dowling? I mean at least Ranieri contributed something himself to the method.

>>20023929
Ranieri is the biggest hack for pasting his name on everything

>>20023799
The same could be said about any foreigner. Ever hear a Frenchman speaking English? How about a Russian? German? Chinese? Duh rist goes on. If anything, the English are worse with pronunciation of another language than the Americans.

>>20024038
At least he made all the audiofiles and spreadsheets for the grammar. "The Dowling method" is literally just learning the grammar and then reading a book he didn't write.

>The Delphin Classics or Ad usum Delphini was a series of annotated editions of the Latin classics, intended to be comprehensive, which was originally created in the 17th century.

>The first volumes were created in the 1670s for Louis, le Grand Dauphin, heir of Louis XIV and were written entirely in Latin. Thirty-nine scholars contributed to the series. The main features included the main Latin texts; a paraphrase in the margins or below in simpler Latin prose (an ordo verborum); extended notes on specific words and lines, mainly about history, myth, geography, or natural sciences; and indices. One useful pedagogical feature of this series is that it keeps students reading and working in the target language (Latin).

I'd advise all intermediate Latin learners to use the ad usum delphini series. Download the pdf and read it on a tablet or ipad for comfy reading.

https://vivariumnovum.it/risorse-didattiche/pratica-didattica/classici-latini-edizione-monolingue

>>20019592
They have one on all of Statius' work so you don't have to jump to wiki in the middle of reading.

>>20023831
Yes, "parare" is a transitive verb which doesn't take a preposition, unlike in English.

>>20023831
Sī vīs pācem, parā bellum - If you want peace, prepare for war
Literally it means "prepare war" which makes no sense in English, just a difference between the languages

>>20023831
as this anon says >>20024389 expressing ideas in different languages will often require a different grammatical skeleton so to speak.
Take for example the opening line in the Aeneid
>Arma virumque cano
vs
>I sing OF arms and OF a man
In Latin, 'cano' (I sing) takes its object in the accusative. In English, 'I sing' takes its object in the genitive.

Each language will have its own idiomatic way to express certain things. One last example of this is how you express your name in:
French
>Je m'appelle X (I call myself X)
English
>I am X
Latin
>Nomen mihi est X (The name to/for me is X)

In short, you will run into many errors and headaches if you directly translate.

>>20022739
I don't know, but just talking about whatever in Latin doesn't seem that literary. (Sorry for not saying it in Latin, I'm not that fluent yet.)

>>20023151
So it's sort of like French or Thai where the spelling is archaic but you can pretty much reliably derive the pronunciation from it?

>>20024616

Quod nomen mihi est?

>>20024655
Filius viri nigeri

Stultus et ignavus sum. Nunquam linguam latinam legere aut dicere ero.

>>20024793
Ne desperaveris. Nos omnes id faciēmus, fra.

>>20024793
But you just did speak latin dumb frog poster

>>20024955
Gratias ago
Alliquando se dubito. Pronomina demonstrativa cruciamentas meas sunt.

>>20024655
Bonjour

>>20024616
>how you express your name in:
japanese
>watashi wa x desu (as for me x it is)

>>20024624
I understand but I can't see any other board being more adequate

>>20024249
>Dolphin Editions
I would like to second this post and also point out that Paedeia Institute has been releasing physical copies of these.

So far the Aeneid and De Bello Gallico are available on their site or Amazon:
https://www.paideiainstitute.org/paideia_dolphin_editions
https://www.amazon.com/Dolphin-Editions-Caesar-Gallic-War/dp/1737400642/
https://www.amazon.com/Dolphin-Editions-Virgil-s-Aeneid/dp/1483418863/

Does there exist a torrent version of the mega link? I am unable to download using Mega without paying for an account.

>>20025051

Quod nomen mihi est?

>>20025982
Nonne nomen tuus anon est?

>>20025708
>>20024249
These seem like a great idea, but flipping through them, I'm finding a lot of these notes to be rather cryptic. THe bottom section of Notae seems helpful, but the center third of the page means nothing to me.

>>20026228
It's the critical apparatus, you can ignore it unless you are into comparing editions.

>>20025878
Why is that?

>>20026345
I think he is trying to download the whole thing as one large file, which requires an account because of download limits. I think.

>>20026228
You don't need it. It is for comparing different versions of the text from different sources. See >>20026269

>>20026269
>>20027022
It's still kind of annoying to have a huge part of the page taken up with useless text. It also throws off the useful footnotes, so they're no longer on the same page at the reference.

Duolingo Latin
Yes or no

>>20020521
Where can I find the Vita in Latin? I have an English copy and I think the language is pretty simple. Is it in Latin as well?

>>20027181
It's not wrong or bad. Just very very short and inadequate. It will give you only some very basic words and grammar concepts.

>>20026228
Is that the bibilioteca classica or delphini version?

>>20027190
http://www.thelatinlibrary.com/ein.html

>>20027233
Nvm just saw that Nepos only has the delphini version available. So far the ones I've read, mainly the poets however, don't have the critical apparatus, just footnotes.

>>20027233
That's delphini, I didn't look at the classica versions.

Athenaze 2 needs to be added to the mega. The copy of Athenaze 1 also doesn't look like the latest version.

What's the verdict on reading aloud?

I'm sure it helps with memory and pronunciation, but fuck I can't bring myself to do it every time. I very rarely do so anymore because it makes me read slower and also get more burnt out when rereading texts. I find I can stomach a chapter better on a reread if I do so silently. Am I making a big mistake or should I be fine? Studying Latin btw.

>>20027619
once a day do some reading aloud exercises, maybe one passage or for a few minutes. You can also 'read aloud' in your head, works almost as well.

>>20027476
Mega compiler here. You mean 2nd volume or second edition?

>>20027678
>Mega compiler here
God bless you.

>>20027476
>>20027678
Athenaze 2nd edition Volume 2 has been added as per your request.
Both are 2nd edition. I will add 3rd edition to my to do list
>>20027692
Thank you
Sometime in the past year the account got a free upgrade from 15 GB to 20 which means instead of skating on a razor-thin margin there are now 5 more GB of books to upload. My To Transfer folder has 2.67 GB worth so there are about 2.5 GB of space left.

What do you want to see in the Mega? Anything goes. Alternate editions/translations, authors, works, references, etc. Uploads will not be instantaneous but I will get to them when i can.

>>20027720
Mega could use some Ecclesiastical/Medieval Latin content
>A Primer of Ecclesiastical Latin by John F. Collins
>Answer Key to Collins Primer
>Dictionary of Ecclesiastical Latin by Leo F. Stelten
>Epitome Historiae Sacrae
>Reading Medieval Latin by Keith Sidwell
>Reading Church Latin by Robert Schoenstene
>Ecclesiastical Medieval and Neo-Latin Sentences by Richard Upsher Jr. Smith
pls

>>20024793
Linguam Latinam nōn tam difficile est quam putās. Surge et perge, amicē!

>>20027748
Noted, will do

>>20027720
Is the septuagint in there?

any smart way around those?
I feel some sort of patern with demonstrative pronouns, but I can't put my finger on it. I'd like to avoid mindlessly drawing those tables until I can recite it by heart

>>20029123
There is a pattern. Look at the vowels and endings, they are basically the same for everything except hic haec hoc
Gen - ius, o/arum
Dat - i, is
Acc - m/d, os/as/a
Abl - o/a, is
Your chart is mistaken in the is, ea, id category.
Dative singular neuter should be ei
Accusative singular neuter should be id
Neuter accusatives are the same as nominatives for all
Plural datives and ablatives are the same for all
Plural genitives are always the same endings
Neuter plural nominative is the same as feminine singular nominative.
hic, haec, hoc has a few twists but similar to the rest. I suggest learning is, ea, id first then the others.

>>20029123
forgot to mention m before d becomes nd in Latin, hence the singular accusative idem forms

>>20029381
>Accusative singular neuter should be id
>Neuter accusatives are the same as nominatives for all
I'm not sure how I missed that
Latin teacher at my uni calls it N146A rule.
Neuter nominative, accusative, vocative are same or all As in plural
She's been drilling that into us for around two years now lol
Thanks by the way

>>20027181
Duolingo in general doesn't seem very useful to me.

>>20027181
No
It's a joke, any method is better than Latin Duolingo

μὴ ἐς ᾍδου καταβῇς

I'm getting filtered so hard by this book bros, Cicero is hard.

>>20031740
Really? I heard it was easier than Roma Aeterna? I have both, but haven't started them yet.

>>20031740
He is at first, stick with it and he will get much easier.
I'm going to guess that the hard part is the numerous nested clauses. Cicero loves his qui quae quod and nesting them within other clauses. Keep in mind that usually a relative clause is bounded by a relative pronoun and a verb with the main sentence or clause continuing afterwards. you can almost separate them and break them into smaller pieces to get the main idea. After some practice you won't have to and will be able to keep track of everything in your head as you read.
Post a troubling excerpt if you have questions

I read an effort post 1-2 years ago about how Attic Greek is basically the hardest language to learn, that each Greek author has to be studied in isolation just to be able to read his particular works, and most Greek specialists never actually reach the skill level where they can read these old passages. Is this false? I know latin's difficulty is overhyped so maybe it applies here too.

>>20031764
>Post a troubling excerpt if you have questions
"Nasus Syrae foedus est"

What did he mean by this?

>>20031775
With both languages there is drastic variations between authors.

With Latin the variation is in grammar and syntax. Some authors have seemingly anarchic word order with no logic. With Greek the difference is often in vocabulary that sometimes appears only once in a text, then never again, or only in from one author. Greek is easier to read, but there's just so many fucking words and so many more verb forms.

At least that's what I hear. I'm retarded and can't read either so I have no idea. I'm just repeating some shit.

>>20031776
The Syra of Nose sexy is.

>>20031775
Not at all, ignore that shit. If anything Greek is easier to read than Latin once you get into real texts.
that said there are some extremely difficult Greek texts, such as Pindar, but for the most part it is quite readable. The articles go a long way towards making things clear

>>20031775
>most Greek specialists never actually reach the skill level where they can read these old passages. Is this false?
Yes. The caliber of student and professors has dropped. This is why you have places like Stanford where the language requirement is dropped so you can have ivy league brainlets get degrees in the classics by applying gender theory to 21st ce translations.
Go back 300 years and you'll have 19 year olds writing their uni essays and shitposting poems as they pastiche multiple poets in ancient Greek

>>20031776
Made me laugh

>>20031751
It's actually alright and I've been making good progress in my comprehension, but some sections fuck me up. Mostly I'm retarded.
>>20031764
"Atque haec Sappho sublata quantum desiderium sui reliquerit dici vix potest. Nam cum ipsa fuit egregie facta, tum epigramma Graecum pernobile incisum est in basi; quod iste eriditus homo et Graeculus, qui haec subtiliter iudicat, qui solus intellegit, si unam litteram Graecam scisset, certe non sustulisset. Nunc enim quod scriptum est inani in basi, declarat quid fuerit, et id ablatum indicat."
= And also it can barely be said how much [of its own desire?] this stolen Sappho [will have lost?]. For not only was it exceptionally made, but also a famous Greek inscription was inscribed in its base; which that learned man and little Greek, [who accurately judges these things?], who alone understands, if he would have known a single Greek letter, surely would not have carried [it] off. Npw what was written is in an empty base, declares what it [would have been?], and declares that it was carried off.
This is a mess, almost every tense he employs confuses me, probably the most I've struggled in the book so far.

>>20031888
Have you tried Roma Aeterna or any other readers?

>>20031952
No, but I've been thinking of getting something a little simpler. How's Roma Aeterna?

>>20031973
Too hard. I'm scared to open it.

>>20031740
Ciceros difficulty is overrated. If you want true suffering, try Tacitus

>>20031888
checked and very good, don't be down on yourself, it's a good reading.
>desiderium
neuter, not genitive. 'longing for it'
>reliquerit
remained, left behind - subjunctive past, not future. Sappho is the subject.
>who accurately judges these things
yes, in reference to the statue and the words carved
>si... scisset...sustulisset
if he had known...he would have. keep the sequence of tenses in conditional clauses in mind
>fuerit
what was (there)
>indicat
indicates or shows is better than declares here
Your translation is mostly correct. If the thief had been a Greek he would have known the value of the statue and would either have not stolen it or stolen the base as well.
A tip on tenses - future perfect is not common at all and when you see that form it is usually subjunctive perfect.

>>20032033
Thanks, that's a helpful tip regarding fut perf vs. perf subjunctive. Before starting the Reader here, when I saw a subjunctive without ut/ne/si I almost always assumed that it was jussive, but in Cicero there are a lot of concessive/deliberative/potential clauses and they can trip me up.

>>20031973
I'm going through Roma Aeterna. I don't see what makes it so hard. Chapters are long, and it throws a lot of new vocab at you, but I'm haven't gotten stuck anywhere.

>>20031801
No, he's saying "Syra's nose is a treaty"

Does that also mean "Syra est bella" means Syra is wars?

>>20032161
No, 'bella' can be either the feminine nominative singular of 'bellus' (beautiful) or the nominative/accusative plural of 'bellum' (war).

>>20032167
No....no I was making a joke about words like "foedus", "bellum", and "malum" having double meanings.

>>20032173
Oh okay, sorry.

>>20032183
No, it's okay. I shouldn't make rude jokes. Thanks for helping. Someone else might read that and learn from it.

>>20032112
That is a quibble I have with Wheelock's which i also learned from initially. Jussive subjunctives are one of the rarest usages yet they are introduced first and reinforced constantly in the exercises. When reading they are the last usage that comes to mind

Territus sum, /clg/. Canis mea aegra est. Medicus casuam nescit et eventum experientiae exspectare debeo. Amica optima est. Timeo eam perdi. Orate pro nobis.

Multās per gentēs et multa per aequora vectus
adveniō hās miserās, frāter, ad īnferiās,
ut tē postrēmō dōnārem mūnere mortis
et mūtam nēquīquam alloquerer cinerem
quandoquidem fortūna mihi tētē abstulit ipsum
heu miser indignē frāter adēmpte mihī
nunc tamen intereā haec, prīscō quae mōre parentum
trādita sunt tristī mūnere ad īnferiās,
accipe frāternō multum mānantia flētū.
Atque in perpetuum, frāter, avē atque valē.

>>20032551
>Canis mea aegra est

>>20032551
Orabo causa tui et canis. Meus canis etiam nuper interfecit. Spero omnes tibi bene progrededi.

>>20032881
Non interfecit, interfectus est.

>>20032881
Atque progredi, mea culpa

>>20027678
>>20027720
I was first referring to the second volume. Then, I was referring to the latest edition. I just checked, and Maurice is on the 3rd edition.
Thanks for uploading the second volume. That's going to help out a lot of people who choose to study with Athenaze. Thanks also for making and maintaining this Mega.
Anyone can chime in here—I'm just curious. What else is out there other than Athenaze? I absolutely hated it but loved Wheelock. Now, I'm onto Homer, making this unnecessary for my Greek education, but I would like to have have a lay of the Greek textbook landscape. Smyth is considered the go-to grammar, right?

>>20033008
>>20027720
I just thought I should add this as well. Please include the Cambridge Greek Lexicon. By all accounts, it's replacing the Middle Liddell.
https://u1lib.org/s/cambridge%20greek%20lexicon

>>20033021
Shit. Sorry to keep bumping this thread so quickly.
This is a necessary link to add to the list. The Woodhouse is incredible when going from English to Greek.
https://artflsrv03.uchicago.edu/efts/woodhouse/woodhouse_search.html

I once used the TLG for a personal project in translating English into Greek, and I got banned. It was very sad, but then, I got unbanned, but then, the unban didn't stick, even though I didn't use it anymore. Then, I got unbanned again. In short, TLG is very protective of their product. Use it somewhat sparingly; don't open entries for hours on end one afternoon and evening.

>>20032889
Profectō nōn interfectus est canis, sed mortuus est nōnne?

>>20033008
Smyth is the best, yes
Commonly used Greek textbooks are
>Alpha to Omega - Groton
I used this in college, it is alright
>Introduction to Attic Greek - Mastronarde
If you like Wheelock this is the book for you. A bit more intense but clear in its aims
>Homeric Grammar - Monro
this is more in line with Gildersleeve's Latin. Old and fussy, by the numbers. If you like that style it will work for you.
>Reading Greek - JACT
A modern styled textbook. i haven't used this so can't vouch for it but have heard quite a bit about it.
>Athenaze
You already know this, just throwing it in for completeness

>>20033021
>>20033036
on the list, thank you

Refute him (in Latin):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZe4HO2ziAY

>>20033851
homines turpes visu falsum dicunt

Only five chapters into LLPSI and I already feel fluent in Latin. God bless the Ranieri-Method.

>>20034143
Semper ubi sub ubi!

>>20033288
De quo dicere nolo.

>>20034143
blows my mind that some people managed to learn latin before his revolutionary method

>>20034143
>LLPSI
*Ranieri-LLPSI

>>20034143
Don't forget to use the Ranieri Recall method to memorize passages and vocab in the long term. I went from zero to Cicero using this method and give orations in my backyard with ease.

>>20033851
Why would I?

>>20034211
PBVH

I'm interested in reading the Iliad in Greek and essentially nothing else. I know there are dedicated courses for learning JUST the New Testament, is there something similar for JUST Homer?

Or should I just try one of these >>20033548?

I heard Tamil has a lot of great classical literature, but I dunno if it's even possible to study classical Tamil

>>20035443
bibletranslation(dot)ws/down/Pharr_Homeric_Greek.pdf

>>20035443
>http://libgen.is/book/index.php?md5=187CE57C79A379173D5CC751278700C1
Try this one. It was written for the modern student who does not have a strong grammatical background. Its lessons are small and meant to be done 1 per day.
Personally I'm 30% done with book 1 and have been enjoying it so far.

>>20035467
Why wouldn't it be possible?

>>20035484
I'd guess it's a little less mainstream. Maybe there's resources for it, but I'd have to look.

>>20035477
>>20035479
Will look at these, thank you anons

>>20033548
Thanks for this list. You're doing a great job. On another note, you wouldn't happen to work in Classics professionally, would you? I'm just wondering what led you to become such a competent steward of the Mega.

Megaman, would you like people to upload books in your Mega to Z-Library, or do you prefer that it be contained to /lit/?

Bump

>>20035611
Degree in Classics a long time ago, it's just a hobby now. One that I particularly enjoy and would like to see grow. I have taught Latin in the past. Mega was just a way to get as much as possible in one place.
>>20035961
You can do whatever you want with the books you download. Knowledge should be free. Try to keep the Mega link here though, if it spreads too much it'll get DMCA'd and it takes a long time to upload everthing.

βάμπ

Anyone know any classical Arabic resources?

For reading Falasifa that is.

Has anyone studied Russian after/while learning Latin?

>>20037924
Thackston "Introduction to Koranic and Classical Arabic"
If it's too much for you then work through some youtube playlists first, like this based black man's: https://www.youtube.com/c/ImranAlawiye-gatewaytoarabic/playlists

>>20019815
Is this the second version of LLPSI? Does anyone have it in the best quality possible (i.e., the one they use to print the book out)?

>Nos Troia antiqua — si forte ad aures vestras Troiae nomen pervenit — per multa maria vectos tandem in oram Libyae tempestas appulit.

Help me parse this sentence. I have a good sense of the meaning, but I can't quite figure out the grammar. The main verb is appulit, but what is the subject? Tempestas? That's the only singular nominative I see. So time/storm drives us from ancient troy, having sailed through many seas, then to the shore of Libya?

>>20038841
yes, tempestas tandem nos per multa maria vectos appulit in oram Liybae

>>20038930
Thanks. My dumb English brain sees Nos at the beginning and assumes it must be the subject, then gets confused by accusative vectos and singular appulit.

For me your roaring is harsh,
O grey-headed sea which beats my chest.
This southerly noise is boisterous and fierce,
It does not benefit me that you live
While you ravish my sails,
And your rapacious hissing is vain
Which shakes the naked sky
And which throws each wave upon the cliff.
But this storm will not last but a while
As the lightning of gloomy skies.
The wind will sleep in war,
And peace will be on the ragged sea.
The wind will fall but our fame will endure,
It shall be heard on Darla's lands

>>20038958
Nos and Vos are so rarely used as subjects that you should consider them direct objects first and foremost

Mea mentula magna est.
Pullae meam grandem mentulam amant.
Mulieres meum longum penem admirantur.
Virgines meam verpam largam volunt.
Feminae meum fattum cockum suckant.
Ego based sum.
Ianitores eunt domus.

What’s the best way to learn Latin through LLPSI? I’m planning to write it all by hand.

>>20039748
I don't know if this is a good method, but this is what I did

Read through it as much as you can
>first chapter you understand 100%
>second chapter maybe you understand 80%
>third chapter maybe 60%
etc until you understand so little that you can't even read a single sentence
and then go back 4-5 chapters and you'll find that you can read it 100% rather than 80%

and repeat this until you reach the end of the book

>>20039748
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTWKpNy96EM

>>20039748
You burn it for fuel to heat you while you use a real book

>>20039748
The 7-Step Ranieri method is the only way.

>>20039810
Look at the top of his head
Is there any book for French that looks like LLPSI?

>>20039748
this might be controversial but maybe you could read it

>>20031775
It depends how in-depth you want to go into the grammar and autistic rules. Having a rudimentary understanding of grammar, basic vocabulary and a dual-text (Loebs probably) will get you pretty far. That said; if you aren't committed, don't bother. Have a goal in mind.

>>20040017
keep us updated on your progress anon

>>20040472
Is this a joke?

>>20040477
no i enjoy witnessing the growth of budding latinists

>finally understand enough russian to read dugin in original

I'm not even that big into Dugin, it's just neat

h-how does one say in Latin
>"I am shitting"
I can go through my entire morning routine in Latin, but when I get to the toilet I'm at a loss for words. What's the verb? What's the noun?
What did the Romans say to one another if they were going to the public toilets?

>>20040714
cacare = to shit
caco = I shit

>>20040728
Eu cago, tu cagas, ele caga. Nós cagamos, vós cagais, eles cagam. :DD

>>20039766
that sounds incredibly boring

>>20040755
Is that Portuguese? I'm always mind blown by how much has been retained for 2k years.

>>20037991
I met a guy recently who did. He said that it wasn't any more difficult than Latin and Greek. He was also gay and moved to Russia for a while. I think he enjoyed his time there too. Really nice guy.

>>20019303
It's more proper to put the verb at the end.
>>20019339
Pronouns are redundant.

>>20042162
I would think that it's easier since you have so much audio material and living native speakers on language exchange apps

>>20042355
>and living native speakers
not for long

language learning advice in a manx grammar from 1870

>>20019339
>! Tu meus servus es.
holy shit just go an actually spend 30 seconds reading about how latin works fuck me

>>20042897
It's correct aside from "es" instead of "est"

>>20042897
It says this "You are you me slave"

>>20042913
for >>20042908

>>20042913
>>20042908
Actually "es" is fine because it's 2nd person. I don't really agree that is wrong. I think you're expeceting a genitive? But it seems fine to me because it uses a possessive determiner and "est" links a subject complement, so servus is fine in the nominative. Why is it wrong and how is it correct?

>>20042908
>>20042913

>no mate saying "You are you me" is good latin
errr can you just spend 20s looking at how latin works?

>>20042974
tu - you
meus servus - my slave
es - are
You are my slave
Nigger

>>20042913
meus means "my", not "me". Meus is how you show possession.

>>20042913
Tu - Nominative singular of Tu, tui
means "you" and acts as a subject in this sentence
Meus - masculine nominative singular of meus, mea, meum
means "my"
Servus - Nominative singular of servus, servi
slave .
es - second person singular present indicative of sum, esse, fui
he should've put in the ablative but it surely doesn't say "You are you me slave"

>>20043031
>he should've put in the ablative

>>20043031
>means "you" and acts as a subject in this sentence
There's already a subject in es. That's how latin works
>Meus - masculine nominative singular of meus, mea, meum
this should have been genetive

>>20043204
Stpo posting PLEASE

>>20043204
Cicero BTFO with facts and logic

>>20043204
>There's already a subject in es. That's how latin works
Doesn't mean it's wrong to include the 'tu'. It could be for emphasis.
>this should have been genetive
No, it's not 'slave of me' (=> servus meī), meus is a possessive determiner that behaves like an adjective, agreeing with the noun, here 'servus'.

Like the other guy said, just stop posting.

>>20043204
>this should have been genetive
In case anyone is wondering exactly why this anon is wrong, see Woodcock, A New Latin Syntax, section 72, I, 1, note i, also pictured here for your convenience

>>20043248
>>20043315
>>20043322
>>20043333
All wrong

>>20042058
When I started learning Latin I was amazed by how much of its verbal morphology Spanish has retained; some forms have been reformulated, but the only inflectional category it's lost outright is the synthetic passive as far as I can tell.

Hello, I've always wondered if the Saga of Tanya the Evil titles make grammatical sense in Latin or if the author just ripped them from google translate. I've heard Deus Vult a lot but never really Deus Lo Vult. Here are the titles:
Deus lo Vult, Plus Ultra, The Finest Hour, Dabit Deus His Quoque Finem, Abyssus Abyssum Invocat, Nil Admirari, Ut Sementem Feceris ita Metes, In Omnia Paratus, Omnes una Manet Nox, Viribus Unitis, Alea iacta est, Mundus vult decipi ergo decipiatur.
Are they authentic/"good" Latin?

>>20043877
Most of those are famous Latin sayings. For example, "Deus his quoque finem dabit" is in Vergil's Aeneid I actually have a pin with this quote on it, "Alea iacta est" is what Caesar said when he crossed the Rubicon, and "Plus ultra" is the national motto of Spain.

>>20043877
The only one that's "incorrect" is "Deus io vult," which is a corruption of the original classical phrase by the addition of "io," which is an exclamation. But grammatically I don't believe it's technically wrong.

>>20043970
Isn't 'Deus lo vult' the equivalent in late Latin/early Romance? And 'Deus le volt' in early French.

Post your favorite classical idioms from any language. As for me, from Latin,
>tundo eadem includem
This is from Cicero's 'de Oratore'.
It literally means 'I am beating the same anvil' but what it really means is 'I am doing the same thing as always'

>>20044489
incudem*

>>20044489
In Classical Chinese, 磨穿鐵硯 (also used in Mandarin). Literally to wear through a metal inkstone, meaning to study diligently or generally to persevere. There's also 刻舟求劍 'to mark the boat and look for one's sword' from the story of a man who dropped his sword in a river, then upon realizing he'd dropped it made a mark in his boat for where he'd dropped it and dived to look for it but didn't find it because the boat had already moved on- hence to take actions that are made pointless by changed circumstances.

>>20044489
My favourite Latin phrase is I want to putum my cockus in her assus

>>20043563
true
here's the correct version

>>20044691
>LLPSI
That book was debunked

>>20044489
The black elk, the shambling black elk! I gave him the sheltered grassy wood and he gave me the black desert mountain.

If not Bran his brother.

>>20044489
>>tundo eadem includem
Cum duo faciunt idem non est idem

>>20044489
>οὐ φροντὶς Ἱπποκλείδῃ

>>20044489
his potius tradam adsiduis uno opere eandem incudem diem noctemque tundentibus

>>20044757
What do you mean, debunked?

>>20044419
Is it an L and not an I? If so, then that verges on not being Latin anymore since Lo isn't a Latin word. I don't know early Romance at all, but maybe that would be a better category to put that variation in.

>>20044923
I think the line between late Vulgar Latin and Romance is a bit fuzzy.

Holy shit /Lang/ Latin level is abismal
This dude doesn't know crap and is "correcting" correct simple sentences he can't understand.
Is the the infamous Scot anon?

>>20045032
>Is the the infamous Scot anon?
I also got that impression

>>20045032
Who are you reffering to exactly?

>>20045099
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scots_Wikipedia#Pseudo-Scots_articles

>>20045356
>Over 23,000 articles, approximately a third of the entire Scots Wikipedia at that time
>"very odd" to abject gibberish with nonsensical words and spellings not present in any Scots dialect
Mater Dei

>>20045032
know-it-all Latin 101 students are frequent here

>>20044779
>she didn't fix the grave accent
OH NONONONONO

Any anons able to explain the grammar of "Tibi opust hoc qui te procures"? A translation gives "You need take due care on that score about yourself," but I can't completely map these onto each other. Plautus Curculio line 519

>>20046839
>opus est tibi
it is necessary for you, ie you need to
>hoc
subject of opus est, so this is necessary for you
>qui te procures
'you who look after yourself'
opus est sometimes takes subjunctive clauses as complements, 'it is necessary for you to look after yourself in reference to this'. More literally 'for you this is necessary that you take care of yourself.

>>20045441
Err right

>>20043563
You're a bitch nigger

>>20046940
Thanks anon, I appreciate it.

>>20046832
.

I've been reading "The Programming Brain" and it astounds me how much similarity there is between reading code and reading an ancient language in terms of cognitive processes involved.

I have no motivation to read that pos llpsi shit

>>20048233
Language acquisition is fun. Your loss.

Per deos immortales! Vos maximi homosexuales estis!

>>20048212
Got any examples?

>>20048524
Mentulam tuam nobis ostende

>>20048784
In programming, there are two kinds of knowledge when reading/processing code: text and plan knowledge.
Text knowledge = surface level understanding, e.g. recognizing a boolean
Plan knowledge = understanding the intention, e.g. knowing what that boolean is doing and why it is being used
Applying this to classical languages (or any for that matter), text knowledge = recognizing a word is in the ablative case; plan knowledge = knowing why it is in the ablative case (ablative of means, instrument, agent, manner etc) and its purpose in the sentence.

Another example would be cognitive load. Just like when reading code, you'll be filtered by Livy if you lack refined syntactical knowledge because your working memory can't handle all of the 'terra incognita' it is encountering.

>>20048950
/g/fag here. not surprising. there was a recent study (Prat, 2020) done to see what the best indicator for learning a programming language was. The students who scored well in natural language abilities (i.e. real human languages) did better and faster than the students who were good at math.
other studies have shown that the same parts of the brain that handle natural language are also activated when writing and or reading code

>>20048250
>llpsi
you mean "The EZway to Learn Latin(tm)"? It is truly miraculous that 19th c. schoolboys learned Latin at all without the hecking Lelipsi method, let alone managed to exceed any of us moderns with our inpoot books.

>>20048950
I think another thing is high literary language often contains lots of nested clauses, just like program code.
Spoken language contains fewer nested clauses.
Some unwritten languages have literally 0 nesting, like Pirahã

>>20049103
>noooo they could not speak itbor read it ahhh

>>20049051
Sounds like bullshit. CS students are all autistic and incapable of understanding humanities but it's much easier for them to do maths and statistics.

>>20049103
>you mean "The EZway to Learn Latin(tm)"?
exactly
>It is truly miraculous that 19th c. schoolboys learned Latin at all without the hecking Lelipsi method
truth is, they didn't
all they did was to dissect it under a microscope - none of them truly acquired the latin language like the llpsi students who faithfully follow the 7-step ranieri method do
none of them truly knew latin

>>20049143
>none of them truly acquired the latin language like the llpsi students
master baiter

>>20049143
lol

>>20049142
so just like humanity students cant into calculus but can understand Marxist economics? in any case, the best writers and philologists or linguists are autistic too. you can't just get a feel for a language and hope to understand what is going on beyond the surface. there is a hidden architecture within novels and poems and most of that is missed unless you have technical knowledge

>>20049142
I know lots of profilic programmers who are retarded at math, they can't stand math at all. I also hear about CS students who bitch about their relatively easy math courses.
Lots of math majors also who want nothing to do with programming.

>>20049143
Luke Amadeus Ranieri. I kneel. I genue.

about to marathon his book "lingua latina per se illustrata" using The Ranieri Method. what am i in for?

>>20049302
Marcus iratus est et Quintum verberat. Tuxtax tuxtax.

QRD on the ranieri method?

>>20049393
Everyone who's actually decent at Latin used it. That should tell you everything.

>>20049492
Actually it doesn't tell me anything about the method itself.

>>20049525
It tells you that it works. Now watch the video to answer every question you might have: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTWKpNy96EM&t=1s

>>20049538
>watch 1 hour of this narcissistic fuck
Actually I'll just continue with LLPSI because I already lost interest.

Nothing like this in latin

Ho
Le
Based

Straight away wrath flared unto the king
And he lifted his spread high
His hand trembled three times
But he too trembled at the death of his son
He ran speedily into night
To Turor's steam in the cave
Where he placed Torcil's daughter from the North
And where he put a great sword
He called on Lula's daughter of chiefs
She was on the clouds with Odin.

>>20049302
Imagine being in the military and this man is your captain

Help! I can't tell the difference between Ablative and Dative when used in sentences! I've tried praying to Lord and Savior Ranieri but to no avail!

>>20049972
>I've tried praying to Lord and Savior Ranieri but to no avail!
nah if you really did you wouldn't care about the difference and just naturally acquire it by reading more latin

>>20049993
Forgive me, for Wheelock had entered my soul and caused me to tempt the lord

>>20049972
>>20049993
>>20050021
Kill yourselves you unfunnny retarded fucks

>>20050051
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krNKKZa6VP4
LLPSI shows you how to be immortal so not possible

>>20050051
now say that in latin

>>20050051
Why are llpsi fans so smug and/or about their chosen method?
I'm really glad it works for you but what gives

>>20050100
*and/or hostile

>>20050100
can't blame them
being exceptional at latin naturally leads to a feeling of superiority

>>20050051
hoc

Why do dumbasses here seem to think LLPSI equals Ranieri? I couldn't care less about the bald narcissist

>>20050114
based
>>20050124
cringe

>>20050124
>he didn't take The Ranieri Method pill

>>20050100
Iam res non ad discendam linguam pertinet. Vere est modo 'memery'

>>20050124
by allah behave yourself and never insult Lucius(pbuh) Amadeus(pbuh) Ranieri(pbuh) in my presence again

>In today's lesson we will learn not to learn any form of language that describes forms of language

>>20050114
Case in point
You're gonna get filtered by roma aeterna btw

she cute

>>20050196
>roma aeterna btw
worthless cashgrab
after familia romania you have all the command of the latin language that you need to tackle the greats like caesar and cicero without much trouble

>>20050208
Iulius in magna villa habitat.

>>20050208
Yea go read virgil after FR lol

>>20050269
RA starts giving you Virgil pretty early.

>>20050279
Yeah carefully selected sections with helping notes on the side and after 60 pages of preparations versus you reading virgil with no help

>>20050237
Julius lives in a Magnum villa.

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>>20044616
* puture meus cockus in herum assum, anon.

>>20042888
gratia amiki