/lit/ - Literature

>>19983250
War. That's the thing you should be writing about. That little critter of yours (canis lupus familiaris) is just trying to warn you of an alien invasion.
These aliens are foreigners with ill intent.

>>19979137
FUUUU
>I had coom brain all day because of that pic and almost didn't make my 1k word quota

>>19983250
very good new op

>>19983263

>200k words into first draft.
Almost there brothers.

>>19983288
No book needs to be this long. If you've gone over 60k words you're already writing just for the sake of having more pages.

>Many of the Scourge Hunter’s stories told of their struggles against fiends larger than life itself. They who called upon the heavens to smite and shake the world. They who resided in the furthest depths of the world and burned man’s skin with corrosive bile. They who stalked on four legs yet laughed like humans, living out of sight.
Does this read fine or should I try to mix up the word usage?

>>19983299
its going to be split into two books, probably about 120-130k long each. Been holding off second draft till i get all the timeline, characters,places and things consistent.

>>19983250
I have a good idea this time around. I'm happy today

>>19983356
The idea is a strange one I don't know if I could pull off, it's a tale about a fictional Cromwell-Esque figure dooming himself and suffering a terrible fate.

>>19983309
The use of the word world twice is a bit off. You already have the rule of threes with "they" so I wouldn't recommend a lesser repetition. More importantly the first line
>They who called upon the heavens to smite and shake the world.
clearly has the greatest import and should most likely come last. If I was to rearrange, it would be
>Many of the Scourge Hunter’s stories told of struggles against fiends larger than life itself. They who stalked on four legs yet laughed like humans, living out of sight. They who resided in the furthest depths of the earth and burned man’s skin with corrosive bile. They who called upon the heavens to smite and shake the world.

>>19983416
I'm actually a little miffed I missed the "world" repetition. I know you should avoid using the same word too often, I was curious if it could work if that was the intent. Thanks for the advice

Another story I'm working on (still haven't finished the other one yet).

>>19983263
feels like ages since I've seen this meme

https://pastebin.com/HR4wdkE2

https://youtu.be/7fEUUnXDnbk
I missed the writing music post last thread

>>19984190
You should have missed it! This is /lit/, not /mu/!

>>19983263
>tfw the little critter was a Ukranian spy

>>19983588
Fellow notepad draft brother?

I understand that your description of all the reasons he got off the hook are said as if the lawyer was spouting them in quick succession in the middle of the trial, but although understandeable, some parts took a bit longer to grasp. If these are the first paragraphs of your story, I'd advise you to cut on the extra details like the intricacies of the camera footage or stuff like that. You could simply mention them with the summary of what they mean in the voice of the lawyer, so you can quickly go back to "John Anderson killed those little girls, and now he was ashamed he got away with it"

Now that I think about it, if he wanted to be punished for the murders, couldn't he have just plead guilty?

Can you have a penis

>>19983745
I was going to suggest you some changes regarding the way some things are said, but after reading it through I think it fits just fine - and maybe could be done further.
That was a fun little read

>>19984318
no

>>19983745
That actually is pretty good.

What's the point of these threads? Nobody here writes and if they do it's just shitty genre faggotry devoid of any artistic merit because it lacks craft and soul. It's a miserable thing to ASPIRE to be the next Harry Potter or Song of Ice and Fire.

>>19984598
I write for political reasons, not for fart sniffing.

Is it possible to care about someone if they're not a blood relation or somebody to bang?

>>19984598
Oh it's you again

>>19984628
WW2 veterans say yes. No stronger bonds than those forged in war with those beside you.

>>19984643
Yeah but weren't they gay?

>>19983299
don't listen to this fag. there's usually fat you can trim, but books are as long or as short as you need them to be. did tolstoy give 2 fucks about some arbitrary wordcount when he wrote war and peace? fuck no.

>>19984650
That's different. He was a genius. My teachers told me so. You're not a genius.

>>19984655
your teachers gave great head, especially that slightly chunky one. a little desperation to keep a man around must have given her the inspiration.

>>19984690
Okay? You're still not smart enough to write an overly long book.

>>19984321
>>19984415
Thank you, I am glad you liked it. I have taken the time to do a new draft. Any thoughts on this? I felt some things needed elaboration. I think it needs a better title too.

https://pastebin.com/knCQYXXn

Does anyone write short stories?

>>19984771
I tried but I'm too long-winded.

>>19984771
I'm working on a 600 one at the moment, have the drafts for a 1200 word one, and I did a 5000 word story a week ago

>>19984763
I think every change you've made has been for the worse. If I had one complaint about the previous version, it was that you barely described the smells--despite that being the focus--however you did explain where the smells came from and that was adequate. It was enough to get me think of what those smells would be, and since this was clearly someone not all there it had a good, unsettling quality to focus on smells yet while simultaneously not describe them.
In this revision we now introduce time as an issue, which immediately breaks the hyper focus on smells which worked so well before.
Even something like the interaction where "needles bored from my eyes into his" I think is weaker compared to the original draft, where there were no solid interactions between the narrator and boarder (up until the murder) which heightened the madness of it. The boarder was just someone who flitted through the place, cleaning shit up, with some recollection of him saying "no man should live like this" but not a face-to-face confrontation.

>>19984779
What do you do with them?

And do you have any recommendations for improvement?

>>19984787
That's a shame. The original did present some problems I thought needed fixing. The opening line, for instance seemed a little clumsy to me, and it needed shifting to past tense too, though I can see now that it may be punchier than the new, longer first paragraph. The second paragraph I moved the realisation to the outside, as that made more sense to me, to notice the strong smell gone before you reach the source. And yes, I needed more elaboration on how this hoarding was manifested, more things, more smells, but without overloading the sentences. I think the detail of mapping the house that is in the second draft is a nice touch, and how the stranger is now a part of the map and a part of the house. I am not sure about him being a lodger. I was thinking of a social worker. But perhaps naming him at all just makes it too ordinary, and he should just be a stranger almost doing as he wishes for no explainable reason.

>>19984791
I offer them as "custom fit stories" for, usually, people that want their kids to get off the tablet.
If you're making a small story, fist come up with a concept and write the story from it. 600 words can mean 3 to 5 paragraphs if you make them meaty enough, so handle your pace as you will.

>>19984836
Do you sell them or just give them away?

>>19984820
>I was thinking of a social worker.
Maybe build from there with smells. Like the social worker lets himself into the house initially, and the hoarder seeks him out because his cologne just doesn't belong. From there it's a quick exchange about how the social worker wants to help and then detail how he replaced the familiar natural (rotting) smells with the cloying, artificial bleaches and air fresheners.

>>19984858
Sell them, albeit for cheap

>>19983745
>>19984763
Version 3. Some small changes. Playing with new title.

https://pastebin.com/Nve1Z5d5

I feel like I am looking at this too much now. I should probably do something else. I seem to become blindingly familiar with a work not long after writing it. I wish I could forget it immediately so I could work on it with some distance.

>>19984868
Liking the idea of talking about him less rather than more desu

>>19984598
Dude shut the fuck up, just let people write what they wanna write, there’s nothing wrong with Fantasy. “Genreshit” literally anything you could ever write can be categorized into a genre.

>>19984940
Sorry that I'm trying to bring a little legitimacy to this otherwise shit general!

>>19984598
>What's the point of these threads?
Criticism.

>>19984953
No you're not. You want attention.

Neither of the reading lists have Lajos Egri yet, despite me saying so a dozen times. People just repost the same shit they haven't read over and over.

>>19984598
Why do people get salty over genres?
I get that one might not be your thing, but to write something it is going to be in a genre.
So unless you don't write, there is no way to avoid genre writing.

>>19984995
You hit it. He avoids being pigeonholed in a genre because he doesn't actually write.

>>19984995
>but to write something it is going to be in a genre
You don't read enough books.

>>19984995
I think it's more about the distinction between genre fiction and literary fiction, even though literary fiction can also be divided up into genres.

I get the strong sense that writers can be divided into two genres:
>Those who write
>Those who like the idea of sitting in an arm chair and being asked about writing, yet don't actually write.

>>19985025
Why is this general so fucking obssessed with the image of not writing? Just reply to those who post their writing and shut the fuck up otherwise.

>>19985031
How I about I fuck you in your ass so that your red blood leaking from your rubbed raw sphincter mingles with my white hot cum and when I pull out there's a fine pink slurry that keeps us connected, stretching from your ass to the head of my cock and I tell you to lick me clean. I bet you'd like that, wouldn't you, you disgusting faggot?

>>19985060
It's trying to be de Sade, but there's no class. Harumph.

Hi guys, I just finished my second novel today. It's a thriller novel about a version of Sherlock Holmes who gets kidnapped by agents of Nyarlathotep, leaving Watson behind to hunt him down and get him back.

I'm very aware that I might as well have designed this book specifically not to interest people on here, but I've always lurked these threads and it'd feel wrong if I didn't post it here. Hopefully some of you get some enjoyment out of it, even if it just in laughing at it.

https://archiveofourown.org/works/32961346

What do we think of Lindsay Ellis' body of work? A top internet commentator, she broke into the sci-fi world with the breakthrough hit Axiom's End a couple of years ago. The third book in her trilogy is expected to drop later this year.

>>19985148
>>>/lit/sffg

>>19984598
Oo, oo, me, me! I write! I write!

Please understand that these are 2000+ pages deep into a story, so there will be details omitted that were already touched on.
Also, I write with my hands because I like it more than typing. Simple as

1/3

>>19985161
Dude, fucking stop with the asterisks.

>>19985161
Why the change in color?

>>19985161
2/3

I posted these in a crit thread just before it 404'd. But what's the main difference between /crit/ and /wg/?

>>19985131
Why must it be in present tense?

Vela, Andromeda and Lacerta are african triplets.
Anyone knows what X-L, X-EL and X-WA means?

>>19985148
Kinda happy she got off twitter and social media and stopped.

I like to think she's healing and focusing on her new dreams.

Tbh she was never a good youtube commenter. She was ok, Some good vids some not. I feel it was time for her to stop and move on to better things.

and i'm glad for that hope she never comes back and followers her dreams

Also from my understanding people think the book is bad? I haven't read it not my taste but I think social media was just making her unhappy. so i'm glad for that

>>19985171
>But what's the main difference between /crit/ and /wg/?
One is called /crit/ and the other is called /wg/

>>19985171
Crit is dedicated solely to critiques. Wg is for the discussion of the whole writing craft, which sometimes involves critiques.

>>19985184
>Haven't read the book
>Let me contribute with gossiping about internet drama
Fuck you.

>>19985167
Ok. What should ido instead? I see in just this image alone I used then like 4 times. Never really noticed how often I use asterisks, and I am happy you pointed this out to me before I took this to anyone in real life and had to hear the same thing from them. It would have been a much harder blow there.
>>19985168
Because I think it looks cool. I also have between 80-100 pens so I cycle through the ones I like the most.

3/3

>>19985201
Asterisks are a way to artificially force emphasis in your writing. It's a crutch, like bold letters or using ?!?!?!?! to make a yell louder. You need to get better at writing until things are intense by their own merit.

>>19985201
I thought the asterisks were just placeholders for italics, which would be fine, many authors use them. Still you should try to use them sparsely so they don't attract attention to themselves.

>>19985175
I prefer present tense to past tense, it feels more dynamic to me.

>>19985235
Do you only read novels for teenagers?

>>19985241
No, I just don't really like writing an entire novel in past tense.

>>19985235
Present tense is what I wrote my first three novels I'm. I say it forced me to break lazy habits I had from middle school, but in reality I was just copying Homestuck in the beginning. But then I made it my own and my style developed further from then on. So, present tense is a way to go.

>>19984953
>unironic exclamation mark on a 4chan post
I think I'm going to be sick

Do I absolutely need to have a self-insert to find any type of success on Royalroad? I'm not sure if I can do that.

>>19984977
qrd pls

>>19985523
Oooh tough guy!

>>19984298
Nah, I just convert it to plain text so I can take a screenshot of it. I write in gdocs. And thanks for the feedback, will take it into consideration for the next draft.

>Now that I think about it, if he wanted to be punished for the murders, couldn't he have just plead guilty?
Exactly.

>>19985538
It's the same old bullshit just repackaged in an annoyingly Socratic,1950's boomer style. Literally just Techniques of the Selling Writer if you want that, it's less pretentious.

>>19985552
That has nothing to do with Lajos Egri. Why are you pretending you read him?

>>19985625
The Art of Dramatic Writing is filled with annoying boomer dialogues between an imaginary student and Egri. Have you actually read it yourself?

>>19985687
Yes. There's nothing pretentious about its simple prose and how is it anything like Techniques when one is geared towards novels and the other towards plays?

>>19985700
The pretension is his insistence on his narrow viewpoint and the invention of all his unnecessary terminology. It's pretty much identical to Techniques in its old-timey boomer style.

>>19985717
>narrow viewpoint
He is wrong how?

>>19985720
His whole shtick is a gross oversimplification of how long works are actually constructed. You really think Shakespeare sat down and wrote Macbeth with the "premise" that "Ruthless ambition leads to its own destruction"? Really? It's exactly how a critic thinks a writer would write and what's worse he insists that this is the best way--the only way, at some points--to write good plays.

Now, I will say that I found the section on rising conflict pretty useful, but Techniques covers it as well and its not enough to get riled up over. Maybe you can talk about what you found particularly insightful.

>>19985749
>You really think Shakespeare sat down and wrote Macbeth with the "premise"
Stopped reading there. This is one of the false "premises" (lol) that Egri debunks in his very book.
>Maybe you can talk about what you found particularly insightful.
I don't have to. Point still stands that the hundreds of people posting OPs with those reading lists are just regurgitating other's opinions because they haven't read any of those books. I'm merely suggesting an addition from the place of someone who read one.

>>19985758
What the hell are you talking about dude?
>Macbeth and Lady Macbeth, in their ruthless ambition to achieve their goal, decide to kill King Duncan. Then, to strengthen himself in his position, Macbeth hires assassins to kill Banquo, whom he fears. Later, he is forced to commit still more murders in order to entrench himself more securely in the position he has reached through murder. Finally, the nobles and his own subjects become so aroused that they rise against him, and Macbeth perishes as he lived -- by the sword. Lady Macbeth dies of haunting fear. What can be the premise of this play? The question is, what is the motivating force? No doubt it is ambition. What kind of ambition? Ruthless, since it is drenched in blood. Macbeth's downfall was foreshadowed in the very method by which he achieved his ambition. So, as we see, the premise for Macbeth is: "Ruthless ambition leads to its own destruction."

Literally from chapter 1.

>>19985790
>What the hell are you talking about dude?
Not what you posted, for sure. I'm not contesting Agri believes in premises, I'm saying the complain that "Shakespeare didn't sit down thinking of that!!!1111" is one of the questions Agri answers.

>>19985758
>>19985790
Re-reading, I guess you're talking about the bit where he says an author need not necessarily start from the premise. Fine, but the point remains. I doubt at any point in writing Macbeth that Shakespeare thought to himself "I better make sure I have a premise". This is just not how plays or stories are written in the real world.

But you know what? If it's helped you so much, post your work. That should be final arbiter after all right? Put your money where your mouth is.

>>19985800
I've been published in three countries. I'm not showing your crap. I do post sometimes anecdotes about my writing classes, where I teach Egri's theory. You're welcome to pay for them.

>>19985802
Sure you do bud. I guess LARPing on a writing thread on a chinese abacus enthusiast forum is just a side gig. I feel bad for your students.

>>19985810
Which is it? I'm LARPing or I have actual students you feel bad for?
You can't roleplay online, by the way. LARP stands for "live-action". I guess you're just another regurgitator of terms.

>>19985816
LARPing about being published in three countries. There's no point in responding to you any further. You're clearly disingenuous and just here to start shit. Lajos Egri is no better than any of the other boomer writers in the OP (and is many ways worse) and you haven't said anything to justify why he should be on it other than whining that he's not and maintaining an air of superiority and pretension when called out on it. I mean for god's sake, you can't even say why you like him.

>>19985845
How is being a boomer a bad point when the best books are the classics? Learning from modern crap will only produce modern crap.
I don't defend him because I don't care about educating the anime writers here. My SIMPLE point is maybe we should include books users actually read instead of reposting a list off Google mindlessly just so that every newfag comes here and posts "What do I read?" anyway.
Again, you can't LARP online. That's called plain roleplaying.

If you read literary fiction, regularly, in 2022 you are a rare breed. If you write it too, then you are truly a rare breed. How many people in your city, or your country, do you think are actively writing literary fiction? Not very many.

If you look for company in the form of another literary writer, you will probably be disappointed. How many like souls are there? Of course at first you may try the regular internet forum points, reddit, discord, googling 'fiction writer group' a few times. You'll be disappointed at every turn. Even here on /lit/ where people like to pretend all they do is read dense philosophy and nothing but the Western Canon, the asshole of the internet where the rejects and outsiders congregate outside of regular society, if you enter the writing general here you will see fan fiction writers, people asking how to make money with erotica, and how to write a multi-volume fantasy series that will sell well on Amazon.

If you write literary fiction you are on your own.

>>19985915
Speak for yourself. Me and my friend group have a pretty good time.

>>19985852
Are you seriously trying to make an argument based on the original definition? LARP has been common lingo around 4chan for at least a decade. What's next? Are you going to complain that people don't physically touch the threads when they "bump" them?

>>19985927
There is no "new definition". LARP is an acronym, idiot. My whole point is that people regurgitate shit in the OP, yeah no shit I'm gonna complain about regurgitating a term mindlessly.
>for at least a decade
Newfags are truly precious.

>start browsing various online writing forums
>95% of posted fiction is middling fantasy, sci-fi, horror, or erotica of a very poor technical quality and with little (but commendable) creative spark
>4.xx% is utterly flaccid literary fiction with okay grammar but no actual grasp of language, no rhythm, no theme, no genuine emotion, no enthusiasm, no sincerity, no voice, with nothing memorable or interesting or unique about it at all - that reads like it was generated by an AI
>one or two stories are absolutely brimming with S O U L, show a masterful understanding of the beauty and the mechanics of prose, have all sort of interesting wordplay and imagery and metaphor, unique narrative and syntactical structure, a strong voice, a great style, and a presence such that you're left thinking about them days and weeks and even years after reading
>scroll down to the comments
>it's literally just copy after copy of this Sőyjak going REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE PURPLE PROSE REEEEEEEEEE SENTENCE FRAGMENT REEEEEEEEEEEEEE THAT WAS PROBLEMATIC REEEEEEEEEEEE TWO METAPHORS IN ONE SENTENCE REEEEEEEEEEEE YOU NEED TO FOLLOW THE RUUUUUULES
>you can literally see the author's soul shatter as they apologize and vow to stop being interesting
>click on their username
>last posted two years ago
>google their story
>they never even published it
It's over.

>>19986100
Is it over? Or will their graves inspire you to keep writing?

Her green eyes stared at me, with a distant look in her eyes. There was a cold disdain in her expression. She stood there holding a parasol in one hand and the edge of her wide brimmed hat in the other. I was stopped five feet away from her, paralyzed where I stood. I didn’t know what to say. What could you say to the woman you’d married and run away from fifteen years ago? Selfish, as I may be, I was also a coward. I couldn’t face the consequences of my actions. I look away from her gaze ashamed. For a long time we don’t say anything.

“Well? Do you plan on standing there?” She says, interrupting the silence.

>>19986194
>another retard who can't format dialogue and doesn't know how basic punctuaction works
Why do you even post here?

>>19986210
>who can't format dialogue
Explain?

>>19986210
That could easily be fixed with an editor and tells me nothing about your reaction to the content of the short.

>>19986220
Open a book sometime, inspect the little words.

>>19986221
An editor will never look at the content of your short because you can't even grasp the basics. This is "bare basics" stuff. You even mix past and present tense.

>>19986225
Why post here if all you do is complain and shit on people?

>>19986225
It's so basic you refuse to elaborate or provide any helpful input to anyone. And yes I'm aware of my tendency to look over the tenses.

>>19986233
Are you suggesting stories shouldn't be criticised? I mean, a hugbox sounds tempting.

>>19986240
I'm suggesting you leave if all you are going to offer is "youre bad".

>>19986194
>Her green eyes stared at me, with a distant look in her eyes.

Really cliché. You also completely depersonalised her character by giving the impetus to her eyes instead of her.

>There was a cold disdain in her expression

So you tell me. What does that actually look like? How is she standing, what is she looking at? This is telling.

>I was stopped five feet away from her, paralyzed where I stood

I was stopped ... where I stood. Also, were you really paralyzed? I doubt it. Another cliché.

>What could you say to the woman you’d married and run away from fifteen years ago?

That's a lot of exposition. Summarisation is often not good for your writing.

>I look away from her gaze ashamed

Melodrama.

>>19986246
I suggest you don't post stories if you don't know how commas work.

>>19986120
I'll always keep writing, anon. I've got a few publications so far but when I see shit like this it breaks my heart. These people poured their souls into something and it was actually good and it was actually unique. It was the kind of writing that lights a fire in you and makes you want to shake their hand and vow to write something even better. It makes you excited for the fiction of tomorrow. Just fantastic fucking writing. And what did they get for it? Completely fucking shit upon by these seething hivemind NPC drones who are terrified of anything remotely new or genuine or different and who will almost certainly never write anything good in their lives because of it. They're the reason literature looks like this today. Nothing stands out. Nothing has soul. Nothing requires any effort to read because it took no effort to write. No respect for the language. No respect for the art. No respect for the reader. I hate modern literature.

>>19986100
share their work here, post the forum link or something

>>19986305
This. I'd love to read the kind of stuff you're talking about (if it indeed lives up to your hype).

>>19986296
>They're the reason literature looks like this today. Nothing stands out. Nothing has soul. Nothing requires any effort to read because it took no effort to write. No respect for the language. No respect for the art. No respect for the reader. I hate modern literature.
Seeing books like that do remind me that they are a dime a dozen. The last book cover I recall truly standing out to me was Hurricane Season.

>>19986296
I posted something I put a lot of effort into the prose and was told "gee this has great prose, but it's BORING". It was only the very first paragraph.

It's like this because you guys do this to yourselves.

How to write a guilty conscience?

"The ride to the carriage is silent. It isn’t that there’s nothing to speak about, surely, a great deal has changed in both of our lives in the past fifteen years, however, there is no desire to breach the topic. How would one even start the conversation without getting over the obvious elephant in the room. I ran away from her. There’s no two ways about it. I am a coward who deserves to rot in prison, not for the crime I am accused of, but rather for the all crimes I have yet to answer for. "

>>19986352
Were you the anon who wrote the "guy collapsed in the cold and snow wearing the jacket Dad had bought him" piece?

If so it was really good, I didn't comment at time as joined that thread way later. Have no fucking idea what that guy was talking about regarding "slow". Regardless half of reader advice is dead wrong/retarded even when well intentioned.

>>19986194
>Her green eyes stared at me, with a distant look in her eyes.
stopped reading
you proofread this paragraph presumably several times and in the end still decided "yup /lit/'s gonna love this one"?

>>19986387
>How to write a guilty conscience?
Read Crime and Punishment
>The ride to the carriage is
Stopped reading here. Present tense is for children's lit.
>It isn’t that there’s nothing to speak about, surely,
Okay, REALLY stopped reading here. Learn how the basics of writing work.

>>19986403
Yup, that's me lol. I come back here despite some of the garbo advice I've gotten, because it's nice to immediately see whats in readers minds when I write something.

Please read and critique.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rE7fR45CiN52_F9OUuaCOwCypmkOpn9yNL13enZBAL8/edit?usp=sharing

>>19986408
Nah, actually this time I wrote that and posted it without proofreading so I could learn what mistakes to watch out for.

>>19986416
See this confuses me, first someone was complaining that I keep switching the tenses up between past and present. Okay so for the next paragraph I keep everything in present tense, now it reads like a childrens novel? So what am I supposed to do? have everything in past tense like I'm reading a diary?

>>19986438
Your average reader isn't a /lit/ pseud so getting feedback from us is pointless

>>19986443
>So what am I supposed to do? have everything in past tense like I'm reading a diary?
I'm guessing your mind went to a diary because you never read a novel for adults. Try doing that, google how to use commas and come back to us.

>>19986441
Stop being so greedy. You've posted this half a dozen times. How come you never crit others?

>>19986462
I have plenty of times. Do you want me to have an ID?

>>19986469
Link one of your crits.

>>19986194
Keep your tenses consistent.
> couldn’t face the consequences of my actions. I look away from her gaze ashamed. For a long time we don’t say anything.
This can definitely be elaborated more.
>look away from her gaze, ashamed.
This sentence can be expanded greatly. Try to describe "ashamed". Have the reader try and figure out "ashamed" rather than just telling the reader "ashamed".

>>19986441
I actually sort of like the idea and was taken back a bit when the boy mentions covering them in cum. The final sentence is funny. There are a number of things I didn't like though. The dialogue feels quite repetitive. The constant use of exclamation marks really drives that home too and in general it's just a bit annoying. I wish I could leave comments on your document, I would have maybe highlighted a few things and been a bit more precise in my crit.

>>19986469
Although I haven't been paying attention to these threads much and this is the 3rd or 4th time I've encountered this same story and it looks like you haven't written much beyond this? Write more and stop looking for feedback after every single paragraph.

Instead, use the critiques to figure out how you can fundamentally improve so you can write more and rely less on constantly getting feedback

>>19986470

>>19977492
>>19976505

No more choice
a very loud noise
No more misfortune
Things are over and done

He had been there
But not anymore
All that was left
Was the blood on the floor

Baby's first shot at poetry. Opinions?

>>19986498
Neither of those are crits on in this thread.

>>19986498
wait are you fucking serious? You mean you actually read peoples shit and couldn't be assed to give something more useful than "based" or "how are you writing so much?"?

>>19986499
Fucking awful. Do you even read poetry? Why would you think your first poem would be worth sharing? Is it a joke?

>>19986509
>Do you even read poetry?
No.
>Why would you think your first poem would be worth sharing?
I wanted to share so I did.
>Is it a joke?
Sort of. I know it is not good.

>>19986499
>>19986509

ignore this guy, he shows up to shit on everything without offering any meaningful advice. Literally worthless. Keep posting your shit.

>>19986498
That anon was kind enough to write you a whole paragraph of helpful feedback and even expressed remorse at not being able to provide more. You've posted one line and two words - neither of which were even critiques. You should be ashamed of yourself.

>>19986508
I have more, i just can't be assed to find them. I did write a big long critique on someone's trucker space story, but i can't find it.

these generals suck

>>19986530
I meant in this single thread, asshole. Don't butt in here just to leave your crap without looking at anyone else's writing.

>>19986527
I don't want to be mean to other people's work.

I want to write a comedy. How do I know what makes me laugh?

>>19983588
The first 3 sentences are jumbled and does not flow well. Furthermore, you really need to do more research on how juries work. Juries do not need to apologize at all. They're the ones that determine if someone is guilty or innocent. Since the jury found him innocent, they have nothing to apologize for.
>John Anderson was acquitted of all charges and released with the profoundest sympathies of not only the jury, but even of the judge and district attorney. Only his own lawyer and officer who had arrested him, maintained a wary disquietude.
There's also something incredibly off with these sentences. I'm not being drawn in at this point. I think the largest problem is that there's too much "telling" and little to no "showing" here.

I would probably start with describing the end of the trial. Some shit like
"John Anderson faced the jury. He awaited their judgement. His pale white skin, skeletal frame, and sickly yellow stained eyes made him a peculiar sight. Strangers that first put their sight on him would conclude he was a dying man, yet, he was of a healthy stock.

BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH

>>19986509
I like how you can clock the insecure writers by how much of an unwarranted asshole they are to others.

>>19986499
You should consider paying more attention to your meter and your rhyme scheme. Your first stanza with the half-rhymes is AA'BC while your second is DEDF. I'm left wondering whether the rhymes are an accident or their lack is. Your very first line also seems one or two syllables too short - it makes for a weird stress. Your second stanza has a much better flow, and it looks like you got more of the hang of it as you went on. Keep at it, anon!

>>19986545
Comedy is the hardest thing to write, you are NEVER writing for yourself. Jokes are written for others. Thus the most idiotic, grotesque, disgusting, and ridiculous premises often work best. Despite the current bashing of anon posting his Pancake vs Waffle story for being a selfish, unsupportive asshole, the story is kind of funny.

>>19986533
These generals are fucking leagues better than they used to be.

>>19986600
>you are NEVER writing for yourself. Jokes are written for others
I read the exact opposite in a previous thread. Still, I'll take this on board. Thank you for the advice.

>>19986642
who ever wrote that jokes are written for yourself never told a joke in their life. Think about your own friends. When you tell a joke, you're trying to make other's laugh. Or Dave Chappelle, when he writes a joke, he's hoping the audience laughs, not himself. He knows the punchline already, it's not funny to him. But those that never heard the joke should laugh.

>>19986567
>I like how you can clock the insecure writers by how much of an unwarranted asshole they are to others.
Sorry you’re such a faggot you think assertion is insecurity. Let me guess: you cry about toxic masculinity a lot, too?

>>19986729
You argue exactly like a woman. You try to shame, guilty and insult your way into being "right" to show you won the discussion.

>>19986748
THIS GENERAL SUCKS! FUCK YOU!

Does anyone have any other words for "spells"? I used up magic, spell, blast, and that's all i have.

>>19986783
Charms, incantations, sorcery, enchant, ensorcell, hex, curse, jinx, invocation, conjuration, cantrip, wizardry, witchery.

>>19986729
I'm sure if you keep acting like a hysterical bitch we'll all see what a confident and self-assured guy you are.

Hey /wg/, please read this paragraph.
>The four knights blitzed the lich from the front and the back, eager to satiate their bloodlust. Darius committed to the rush and his eyes fell in sync with Reeves and Joann. His two short swords crossed together. It was simple, one sword to move the lich’s staff, the other to strike it down. Other enemies wielded smaller and more difficult items to disarm. The lich’s staff held a giant gem on top, creating an imbalance not suitable for close range fighting. This will be easy. Flanking the lich from behind, Reeves readied his blade, gripping the handle with one hand and the other on the pommel ready to thrust his steel into the back of the lich. He was followed by Joann readying her brand to strike from above. Both her hands tightened as her claymore hovered behind her shoulder. A single crescent strike has felled numerous opponents, humans and monsters alike, in one single cleave. The lich is not going to be an exception. The four knights prepared their single final blows ready to dispatch the monster in front of them. The plan was executed flawlessly as Adah turned away back toward camp knowing there was no need to watch the execution.

Would it be better to describe the battle between the lich, or just focus on Adah and leave the battle to the imagination of the readers?

The knights will all die to the lich. She is going to be casted as a "coward" and "abandoner", and stripped of all her titles until a greater evil comes along. Her own brother.

I don't know what to do. I recently started writing. Ever since I started writing, I have become addicted to growing my story. I enjoy when people rip on it, because it allows it to be better than it was before. Most of the time I'm writing the outline for the next chapters, fleshing out character profile details, and planning everything out before I actually add to the real chapters.
But now I don't know what to do with myself. I'm ignoring my school work, ignoring my friends. All I want to do is write. When people invite me to things, it always just feels like a distraction away from writing and planning more. When I'm with my family I always have this nagging feeling in the back of my head telling me I could be improving my story, that I'd have more fun writing than being with people. People ask me why I bring my laptop with me.
I can't even explain it to others either. No one wants to hear about your writing if it isn't published. No one I know seems to be able to understand why writing can be so interesting. I'm becoming obsessed. All I want to do is sit in front of my laptop, ignore everything in my life, and write.
Can anyone relate?

>>19986935
tell them you really really want to finish your book. Tell them it's a goal you set for yourself since you never done it before.

And yes, I can relate. I finished my book, gave it to beta readers, and have not gotten any feedback.

>>19986939
I mean I could, but I think the issue more so is that now life feels like a distraction from my book. I am obsessed. I just took a break from my family boardgame and now I dread having to return from writing back into my normal life.

>Buys book with nice cover
>Reads title and cover
>Reads a summary and video on the subject
>Criticizes people and brags about how he is a deep reader.
>Only reason why he gets away with things like that is because he can talk his way out of things.

>>19986977
>Be me
>Buy indie author book with nice cover
>Cover looks like the right kind of trash
>Book is actually not about the slut in leather
>It's about her gay brother

Covers mean nothing, I've been thoroughly convinced. I don't even trust reviews of books that don't come with disclaimers nowadays.

>>19987028
>Covers mean nothing, I've been thoroughly convinced
Wh... you've literally been judging books by their covers?

The clear black sky stretched around me in every direction. It was after dark, but only just, so the sky was rimmed with a slight glow that really only punctuated how clear and dark the night was, only a scattering of fixed stars in the sky, and seldom any aircrafts. Looking up was like glancing into an inverted bowl, the accented rim gave the illusion of being able to sense the curvature of the planet from ground level. Looking up at that dark sky, the air as cold as it was clear, one couldn’t help but grasp for a moment how they are just a lone organism, making its way through life on this rock, in this star system, orbiting the galactic core. Nights like this force one to recollect the nights of their early youth, sneaking out into similarly dark and clear nights, with plans of committing numerous firsts. It had been awhile since I had a night like that, but tonight I’m late for work.

what the fuck is prose

>>19987078
He's judging something by its most prominent and readily-apparent attribute, yeah. There's a reason authors don't get to design their covers.

>>19987119
A smooth, natural sounding tone in your writing

>>19987119
It's the way your voice sounds and how you convey ideas or feelings. Some people like the simple prose. Some people like to suddenly start fucking meandering and throwing clauses together.

Idea:
>Man keeps dying and gets reincarnated into the worst times in history
1. Caveman
2. Fall of Babylon
3. Fall of Rome
4. Romance of the Three Kingdoms
5. Justinian Plague and Crusades
6. Mongolian Invasions
7. Black Death
8. Conquista of the New World
9. Inquisition
10. Fall of the Ming Dynasty
11. French Revolution
12. Napoleonic Wars
13. World War I
14. World War II

and his curse somehow ends.

>>19987264
That's an awfully euro-centric list of world history, anon

>>19987274
You're right. I need to add in the American Civil War, Haitian Revolution, Scramble for Africa. Sucks how everything is so euro centered after 1200's

Why doesn't anyone write about incest?

Political correctness is the new punk rock

>>19986438
>garbo advice
Sometimes I give a critique, and then the author posts a revised version, and by following the advice they've eradicated the soul of the work. It's hard to tell whether the advice was bad, or whether they've over-edited and thus lost the flow of the prose, or something else.

>>19987098
someone please tell me if this is pseud swill or not

>>19986907
>Would it be better to describe the battle between the lich, or just focus on Adah and leave the battle to the imagination of the readers?
What emotional impact do you want to have? Do you want to ratchet up the tension as Adah goes about blissfully unaware, or do you want to spring it on them so they feel what she feels, or do you want to leave hints a clever reader could figure out?

>>19987186
>Some people like to suddenly start fucking meandering and throwing clauses together.

>>19987373
It's neophytic. Read more, write more. Pay attention to the particles. Use them to break up the rhythm of the sentence and direct its flow. Your use of language seems scattershot, almost random. You've got an image in your head and you're Portraying The Image. The redpill is that nobody actually cares about the image itself or the stars or how often the aircraft fly or whatever. What matters is the beauty of the language itself, and you're not paying enough attention to it.

The worst writing is exclusively subject-focused, where everything is subsumed under the context of the events that are happening. It is the calling card of the impermanent author to see language as subservient to ideas, events, characters, story, plot. To this author, language becomes a mechanical means to an end, by which people can observe his story jumping from point A to point B to point C on rails. He wants to create a theme park where readers can enter (for a fee, of course), get on the ride, and watch the Caribbean Pirates move around, listen to one liners and exaggerated laughter thrown from tinny speakers, as dry ice vapors flow intermittently from vents connected to great, industrial vats full of the stuff. He is obsessed with the finitude and discretion of the theme park because every piece of media he has ever interacted with is inspired by it. He sees fiction as an amalgamation of composites, and he searches tirelessly for the arrangement of components which satisfies him.

To this end, he doesn't see the medium at all. His standard of excellence becomes how well the theme park runs, how clean it is, how many admissions per week per month per annum. Things must be orderly, and the guests must not dirty up the wrong doorstep or lay across the rails or be rude to the employees (unless they're top tier "donors" on patreon); they must not snort cocaine in the bathrooms or sit under rides catching glimpses of young girls' panties under skirts. But they do anyway.

The theme park operator-author is, in this way, a liar and a thief and a cheat. The guest must not be allowed to peer beyond the veil and glimpse the reality it tries so desperately to conceal. The guest must ride the rails and see the sights designed for them, the Wish Mountains, the jetpacks and daughterus, the low politicking and the ideas. Because he is so obsessed with these things—with the Story He Tells—that where there could have been something that lives and breathes and pulses and seethes with humanity, there are instead tired men with haggard stubble wearing immaculately clean, full-body suits of anthropomorphic mice.

Good writing provides something for a reader to interact with, instead of a series of attractions on which they ride before going home to their hotel rooms, their flying aluminum tubes, their cubicles, and shortly thereafter: their deaths.

>>19987578
Your appeal is all well and good but let’s not drag down daughterus.

>>19983588
stopped reading at JOhn Anderosn. that name dont sound real

>>19983745
stopped reading at the 2nd word. Cant. apostrophe. Blockhead.

>>19984763

>The lodger’s time here was short but devastating. I do not remember exactly how long he stayed, but if I were to count it in terms of what he took from me–my arrangements, my collections, my memories, my smells (oh Lord, the smells! What was lost!)–it would be an unfathomable stretch of time.

just unreal and not in a good way. complicated and dumb. stopped at this point. read it out loud and realize how fake and gay it sounds

>>19984916
to knock it out of the way? he's KNOCKing his hair out the way? whuuut????

>>19985161
dude type. no one wants to read that...

>>19985915
you sound like a fart sniffy man

>>19986387
show don't tell means imply instead of saying. that makes the mind make a little jump and it's more fruitful cause the mind thinks it has discovered it on its own. what does a filthy conscience engender? washing hands. anxiety. blaming others (innocents). etc.

>>19986441
>a blue plate graced a single large waffle
stopped reading cause you don't speak english

>>19986499
the fake rhyme between misfortuen and over and done made me physically grimace. Awful!

>>19986907
I would simplify but I don't like fantasy so there ya go

>>19987098
>clear black sky

what does that even mean bro. like unironically. if it's black how can you tell if it's "clear?"

also

>aircrafts

stopped reading there. if you don't clean your house I won't go in it. Capiche?

>>19987274
the history of the world is white man's history. sorry toots.

>>19987264
Sure I guess

>>19987507
chad critique low key. although on the other hand he's writing prose which is more about meaning than sound. not that poetry is about meaning. in poetry meaning and sound have to coincide; in prose it's enough for meaning to coincide with Truth.

>>19987578
this is just pompous nonsense...

What's a way to consciously get better at writing? I know that the advice is "just write", but when you've finished a piece of work how do you review it and use it to improve? Is it something that can be done alone or do you really need someone else to critique the work?

>>19987798
>What's a way to consciously get better at writing?
By reading. Not how-to books or advice columns, but by actively and consciously developing your taste. Read great writing and let yourself appreciate it. Read shit writing and let yourself hate it. Don't look to other people to tell you what's good or bad about something, because at that point you may just read an On Writing book and call it a day. "Just write" doesn't work without the reading component.

>>19987806
I read a good bit, but I don't really know how to read to improve my writing. Someone once gave me the advice that when I'm reading something for the first time that it should be for enjoyment, but when I'm looking to critically read and analyse a book it should be something I've read before - but I don't really know how to read critically.

>>19987815
>but I don't really know how to read critically.
Be a schizo and rewrite every line in your head as you read it so it's better suited to your tastes.

>>19987806
>By reading.
Is there some place in particular to get pdfs of various books?

>>19987864
Go read the sticky.

>>19987871
Oh, what? That's way more straightforward than I thought.

Was there a change of frequenters over the course of three to five threads? None of these posters seem familiar, except for the odd appearance of Emily anon and Blimp anon.

>>19987783
Nigger...

>>19986296
How about you don't stand out by being bad

>>19986296
You're my kind of nigger. I sperg out sometimes, but I do it so people like you have a place in these threads and aren't completely overshadowed by the endless back-and-forth by isekai shitters giving each other that very surface'y, normie brand of reciprocal cock rubbing.

Any advice for stories taking place in settings removed from reality? I'm having trouble with conceptualizing how characters would use language and references for a place and time totally removed from our own. For example an issue as simple as how things are named creates problems that can go as deep as what thematic connections I'm intending to draw for the reader.

I'm not Tolkien here, pretty certain I don't have it in me to create an entire language and non-modern idiosyncrasies wholecloth. Like that phrase for example, it doesn't much make sense to use in a place where they don't have textiles.

>>19988009
Game of thrones and final fantasy both do a great job at this. Read them both

>>19988038
Final Fantasy is a game series, not a book.

>>19988044
Its still reading.

Fuck it I give up. I don't know. In the last two years I've gotten a girlfriend and now I'm a dopamine addict spend all my time at work or watching Netflix. No idea how this happened and I'm fucking too far gone. 13 pages into this new story I've been working on and I realised how fucking hard in have to try to even sit down and do it compared to the way I used to stay up for hours writing. I just don't have it anymore cunts.

>>19988009
How does slang develop? How are neologisms formed? From familiarity, affection, love, hate, etc. A marijuana cigarette becomes a joint because smokers love marijuana and need a shorthand. The term "hoss" comes out of the American south, a term of endearment for a strong and reliable man and derived from a linguistic corruption of "horse". Nigger comes from the corruptions of various languages' term for the color black. Movies are originally pictures that move. Newspaper: paper that depicts new events; the new's. Figure out what your peoples are concerned with. What are the daily objects their lives are oriented around? Why would they come up with something equivalent to nigger-rigging? That term comes obviously from a disdain for blacks and from the shared experience of seeing them with makeshift, old equipment they've just barely got working again. Don't create the thing to fit the language. Fit the language around the people and their shared experiences. If this isn't possible, your world is most likely generic and itself only half-formed. Work on it. Flesh it out in your head. Imagine a day in their life, and imagine the drudgery and the mundanity. The sights, sounds, smells, of daily life. Hear their voices; if not the words, then the sounds. Make it breathe and your neologisms should come more easily.

>>19987904
I dunno, I went on a beach trip and when I came back everyone was flinging shit at each other over the OP

What's the best epub reader and where can I grab it? I've always preferred physical but in recent years my reading frequency has dropped off a cliff, so I'm ready to try more digital now.

Mag alles wat vast zit loskomen. Mag vloeien wat wil vloeien. Doorbreek de sleur. Vernietig de ouderen.
"Revolutionaire ecologie." zegt Bas tegen mij.

>>19988071
>13 pages
You didn't even start

"Variatie is een vereiste." zegt Bas.
"We kunnen niet zonder." vervolgt hij.
"Het is variatie dat deze operatie mogelijk maakt."

>>19987378
I want a feeling of worry and dread. She's just going to wait for them at camp. Now that said, I'm drifting toward disappearance. So to clear her name she'll have to go out and find them

>>19988187
If you set up a battle and then show none of it, I can imagine that may be somewhat frustrating for the reader. If you have multiple povs I would cut away from the fight at an opportune moment.

>>19987496
It's actually incredibly based and comfy. I'm even warming up to it myself.

>>19987904
I think the people here have mostly stayed the same. I've been around for a while but I don't have any of my works up anonymously, so I have nothing to share.
>>19988071
You do have it. You just have to break your priority chain and put writing back on top. Even if you were married you ought to be able to tell your qt3.14 wife "I'm gonna write for like 2 hours, don't disturb me" and lock yourself in a room or go to a library or something.
It's the year of hope bro. Don't quit before the first quarter is finished.

>>19988324
How can this possibly be the "year of hope"?

>>19988335
For New Year's I made the promise to myself that my writing would take priority this year above all my other hobbies. I would write more, send things to beta readers, query traditional, and get published, either by my own hand and market myself, or by a traditional publisher who will rape my earnings but give me credibility. I wanted to have hope for a better writing future and career for myself. It's the year of hope.

>>19988346
>tfw developing a novel where the central theme is throwing away hope because it's a lie
Good endevors to you Hopebro.

>>19987578
This is well written and interesting. I read some essays about writing by Charles Baxter recently that have a similar tone. Did you write that yourself or is it an extract? It is very good.

As for the ideas of the piece, I'm not sure I agree entirely, though that doesn't matter to me as much as whether or not I enjoyed reading it. I do think that if a piece of writing isn't regularly dipping into the abstract and ephemeral then it isn't really taking advantage of the medium. Anne Dillard said she can sniff out a book that just wants to sell its rights to Hollywood almost immediately upon reading; those are the theme park books. That said, I do enjoy theme parks now and then ...

How do anons here go about designing characters? I've been trait-listing to spark ideas but it's feeling shallow at the moment. Please don't say "just let it come to you along the way."

>>19988510
I've never tried this but someone said to write an interview with your character, almost like a Q&A session.

>>19988510
Generally I don't design just one character. First I create the idea, then the world. and then a set of characters that will match the already existing flavors. The same applies for the specific characters: First their place in the world, and then the varying layers of depth

>>19988529
A good idea generally, but a lot of the concepts I have in my head wouldn't really come out in that sort of setting. Or if they did it would seem like insincere playacting.

>>19988546
The Q&A doesn't have to be relevant in any way to the plot or story, it just aids in you getting a feeling for the character and how they would act.

>>19988510
I start with a story concept and make characters that will fit it. My current big story is about two kings who go from enemies to rivals to brothers to enemies again. So I designed one king as the main character and thought about what character traits would conflict best, as well as provide enough similarities for them to appreciate the familiarity the other has.

Hows your advertising going /wg/?
Have you discovered books don’t have any success without an audience and cheap ads yet?

>>19988543
That's exactly how I began thinking about it. That is to say theme->setting->character/plot. I have roles for a few characters planned out, but I don't want plot to drive character entirely. Mostly talking about side characters here.

Anons, I like the idea of delivering good writing content. I want my readers to enjoy what they read, however, I fucking hate writing. I do not enjoy it. Perhaps because I'm lazy and I feel extreme frustration whenever my text isn't just polished enough and I end up quitting.
I want to enjoy writing, I want to feel confident with what I write. Would that be even possible?
btw I'm an ESL speaker, and my writing is in English too.

>>19988379
cheers. as with everything, the point is always for the language itself to be... well, i'd never call my own writing "beautiful," but that's what i was going for. even in something as vitriolic as that post, the vitriol should always be delivered with a certain sense for the aesthetic of language. to that end, i believe that post was intended to be something of a case-in-point when i wrote it. does that make me an arrogant, pompous, pretentious asshole? yeah, probably. but i guess that's just life, now, isn't it?

>>19988739
That doesn't change the process.
Let's come up with a side character for... a story about Pirates, wich gets you:
Adventure>Pirates>Crewmate>Captain's monkey. You can then make the connections of the monkey not being a vital organ for the ship functioning, but being entertaining or bratty and so on

Should I try to get each chapter done perfectly the first time round or write whatever comes to mind and focus on the prose the second time around?

>>19989839
Proof reads and editing are basically obligatory, so don't feel too forced to stick the landing on the first try

>>19989839
I've written stuff before that I knew was shit just to get words on the page to fix. Hell I did that today. I have an absolute mess of dialogue that made me realize a lot of things leading up to it are not fully or clearly explained, or even thought of in my head. I'd always rather have stuff to edit and fix than stare at a blank page.

>>19989635
That can only give you the idea for what position the character will occupy within the universe of the story, not what they bring to the table.

For example, say one character is a technician. That establishes what their physical role is, but nothing more. It doesn't give insight into how this character will convey the themes of the story, advance the plot, be developed by the plot, bounce off of other characters, or even what sort of personality they might have.

reply to this post if you've ever received useful criticism from these threads that led to positive changes in their work.

i expect no replies (except from soiboys complaining)

>>19989839
I think people vary depending on what they find works for them. Some just write shit out without looking back to get a "finished" first draft they can do serious rework on, others do a review pass or two before moving on (but still expect to do good bit of revision once it's all out). Nobody is expected to nail it right out of the gate.

I always do some polishing because it energizes me and sparks creative ideas, but remember that the time you spend editing the early parts of a first draft are risky as it could kill your momentum AND it could all be for naught if you realize 2 chapters later that the character you wrote a lavish introduction for is getting cut entirely.

>>19989635
I do this too but I find most of my characters bland :-( trying to find methods to improve

>>19989896
Whatever works for you, anon, but I never really saw the point of that. If you know it's not good, and you know you're not going to keep it, why are you writing it? I'd rather write 50 good words in a day than churn out 5,000 shitty filler ones that will be pointless at best and actively ruin the future of the story at worst. I treat every single word like what I'm writing is the final draft. It never is, but I find that mindset important. For me, losing direction is a death-knell.

>>19989946
I think it's happened once or twice, but I can't think of an example. I'm also barely awake at the moment.

How about an experiment?

>“Come on, haven’t you ever had a drink before?” Electronic music struck the club’s support beams like a steel drum. The rhythm pounded in the air. Dancing feet pounded the floor. Voice barely carried across the table.
>“I’ve drank before. I’m not a loser,” he said. The glass was cold in his hand. Condensation dripped off his fingers. Perhaps seconds ago, it had been sweat in someone’s hair, in the neckline of a skin-tight shirt, rolling off a girl’s curves. There were so many bodies pressed against one another, grinding and sliding, they used their sweat like lubricant. The raw stench of humans had been smothered by spilled beer and liberal application of pseudo-olfactors, glorified perfume machines. Somehow, Kyte could still smell the fizzing, bubbling draught of bubblegum pink liquor floating above… he didn’t know what it was floating on, but it was clear and smelled like paint thinner.

>>19989946
Yes
In anon's words "don't write for retards", but it taught me to put a bit more trust in the reader to get what's going on without me explaining it

>>19989948
You could also try and write their bio. Put their life on a line and take measure every 5 years, say what happens at each point and how it carries on to their older self until they're the person your main characters meet

>>19989965
I don't see it as losing direction or writing filler. It's first draft material that needs to get refined over and over until I like it. I sometimes have to really stumble through scenes to understand where it's wrong. The closest I can describe is it's like stream of consciousness. I let my brain fill in what should happen and come back later to refine it to something a little better, cleaner, what have you. It's unusual for me to write just outright crap I don't like, like today, but that's because what I was writing was predicated on stuff I knew I had to fix, but I wanted to get this scene done first because of the momentum and where it's going next. Just like I've written things that don't need any editing by the final product, I've written stuff that I keep going over and over until it's absolutely the way I want. This is especially important in dialogue, but not so much for exposition (for me). I subscribe to the "great stories are distilled" school of thought though.

>>19989946
Someone pointed out that my narrative distance was all fucked up, now I think about it in every word I type. I've also gotten help with designing my cover.

>>19989985
I've heard that idea mentioned but not the 5 year gap format, thanks anon I'll try that model. Specifically my issue is any character I relate to I tend to write too much like myself, so I need to keep some mental distance between myself and characters because it makes all the assholes more dynamic than the leads.

>>19983250
Who are the guys in the picture? Isn't this some kind of Buddhist order?

>>19990191
>Specifically my issue is any character I relate to I tend to write too much like myself
Same issue, different color. I write characters and put too much of myself in all of them. Writing characters who hold different values and beliefs than I do is hard.

>>19990201
Me and the boys

>my beta readers haven't given me a single response
>it's been 2 months
What a waste of time. I'm just going to publish my book

can someone give me thoughts/impressions/etc. on this:
https://ghostbin.com/tf12i/raw
only 1500 words. just trying to get any thoughts.

>>19984763
>https://pastebin.com/knCQYXXn

The original draft was much better. You are going the wrong way. What you were missing in Draft 1 was more about the relationship. In Draft 2, you ignored that still and clutterd it with boring details and spelled everything out like a seventh grader.

>>19984916
>https://pastebin.com/Nve1Z5d5

First draft is still better than the other ones.

It feels like it's missing the pyschosexual angle. He can't just kill the guy for moving things around. There has to be a deeper element to it

>>19987098
it's crap, anon. read more

>>19990223
>Always pimpled teens eager for any authority they can find, pointing up at me and telling me how to do my meaningless duty.
There's something off with this. When I read it, it made it sound like teenagers are "seeking"' for someone to tell them what to do. Not trying to order people around. Just write "teenagers seeking power over others where ever they can"

>>19990223
Felt like I took mushrooms and had a dizzying fantasy that I was a miserable clerk. There was some good description and effective characterization of the narrator but I found the plotting to be a real barrier - we were flying all over the place and it left me confused where/when we actually were.

Also some misused commas (using too many).

>>19990191
I just feel like 5 years is a measure you can easily manage, specially in the early stages of life which are the developing stages of someone's personality

I tried doing an exercise of it with a pet character of my own like this.

>any character I relate to I tend to write too much like myself
I guess this works for me too, since I'm not a girl, a necromancer, or 1X

has anyone tried a live write? where you write, and others put in comments live telling how shit your writing is.

>>19990323
BORING
>Chosen one
>Orphaned
>DARK LORD OF DARKNESS
>Benevolent Uncle!
>Her NEW POWERS!!!!

holy fuck man, this is just cliche and trope after cliche and trope. Let me guess, the girl is hot as shit, with blonde hair, amazing gravity defying breasts, and fucks both king and prince too.

>>19990371
Where would that be done, besides some kind of streaming service or in-person?

>>19990391
I'm thinking of just sharing my google doc link and write while you other anons bash my work or give me suggestions live.

>>19990416
That sounds kinda fun

>>19990386
Considering your clever guess is that someone regarded as "the pubescent" with "a younger body ToT " has a bombshell physique, I fear your predispositions to the admitedly saturated fantasy genre fogged your reading.
Then again, those points are just cliffnotes for a character that's unraveled better in action. It helps me remember that Penelope's story is an edgier version of beauty and the beast with 50% more skeletons, and in that same way it may help that other anon come up with the notes for his other characters.

>>19990416
Could be fun, but I don't see myself commenting on someone's doc for more than 45 minutes tops. Give it a shot, but remember not to use your real google account since we can see the username

>>19990420
if that's the only counter-argument you got, your story is generic as fuck.
>NO! My story is unique because it's not a hot teen! It's a LITTLE GIRL!!!
>Said little girl grows up and fucks the king according to your timeline
LOL.

>>19990428
>>19990419
Here goes nothing.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/14IYv8u3M6g_inX_hAn2zRpZVHztW5bls2q2_ldEvB5I/edit?usp=sharing

>>19990431
My counter argument is that you didn't actually read those 50 or so stray words, either because you didn't want to, or couldn't focus for 2 minutes. I guess all thread bumps are nice, but with that other anon's experiment we won't need more bait for now. Thank you for your service.

>>19990436
Can you see the purple text? I wonder if this is readable to you or not

>>19990445
I can. This is weird. i'm typing and my document is moving around

>>19990440
What the fuck are you talking about? Your literal TIMELINE has every single trope I listed. For fucks sake, your bad guy is literally named "King of Darkness"

>>19990451
Because I'm typing in it too. It seems like writing this way would compromise your documents; I could delete it all after all as things stand. I'll try again, this time adding comments. I'll let you know when we can test it.

>>19990455
You describe BADGUY MC EVIL grooming an orphan teen as "benevolent uncle" stuff. We've discussed your reading comprehension enough.

>>19990469
>Because I'm typing in it too. It seems like writing this way would compromise your documents; I could delete it all after all as things stand. I'll try again, this time adding comments. I'll let you know when we can test it.
ya this doesn't work too well

>>19990469
>>19990451
I think I understand how to add notes without altering your paragaph . You can see the note added unto the end of the first paragraph, yes?

I've reloaded the page out of curiosity. Now I can't alter your text, but neither can I comment. I haven't checked to confirm, but I think sharing on google drive allows you to send people a link with which they can comment and view without editing

What do you call this sort of roof in a park?

>>19990512
Gazebo or rotunda?

>>19990512
Gazebo

Overall, a beneficial exercise

>>19990521
>>19990517
Thank you.

>>19990371
I've thought about streaming myself writing a short story.

>>19990501
I got to find it.
>>19990485
Yea i saw that too.

There has to be a way for you guys to just comment without changing or deleting entire paragraphs.

But that was an interesting experience. At the very least we all tested how it worked

>>19983250
Proposal for next thread OP

>>19990485
>>19990501
Thanks guys, just finished the comments. Glad someone liked the prose.

>I will write in Future tense.

>>19990702
When?

>>19990702
>future tense
>2nd person

You WILL live in a pod. You WILL own nothing. See, already you can have a dystopian future kinda novel.

Or it could be a motivation book. You WILL lift. You WILL find a girlfriend.

>>19990556
Anime is for retarded babies.

Anyone else really have trouble writing chase scenes? Action scenes are fine but I'm having trouble capturing the tension of a chase in a non visual media.

What do you guys make of dieselpunk?

>>19990764
Great. Not enough good material from it

>>19990764
I love the idea just dont copy bioshock

What is the best isekai?

>>19990764
Severely underappreciated. One of my favorite scenes I ever wrote was a guy returning to his hometown after being away at college for a while.

>>19990838
Mine.

>>19990764
I feel like war or conflict of some level is a big part of it, or at least the feeling of the genre

>>19990828
>>19990830
>>19990841
>>19990854
What are some books you'd recommend? I have never read any of it but I think it looks cool and I'm thinking of adding some of it to a story I started planning. Sorry, guys.

>>19990911
Like I said in the post you replied to, I can't think of any solid dieselpunk material. That said, you could probably do a case study off the art made of it on various websites, and inspire yourself from there

>>19990944
It's fucking awful. I love it.

>look at fantasy novels
>Everything is fucking tomes of 3-6 book series
>Most of it is nonsense arcs
Holy shit, aren't there anymore stand alone fantasy stories?

>>19990987
You just inspired me to write one. Thanks. I have one already brewing on the backburner that I was going to make into a space western until just now

>>19990527
ngmi

>>19990987
stand alone books are risky and less likely to make money

I just spent an hour or so reciting to myself the chapter I'm currently writing and editing it as I go along. I found it surprisingly helpful. Recently I've been reading to my girlfriend as she goes to sleep, and I discovered that recitation is actually both fun and educational. When you're reciting aloud, you really have to actively find the rhythm and the flow of the prose. It forces you to. Granted, I would get bored really quickly with reciting poor prose, but I think there's a surprising amount of value to reading excellent prose out loud. Did you know that Vera Nabokov courted Nabo himself with a reading of his poetry? I'd already been reading to my girlfriend for a while at the point where I discovered that, but ever since, I've found myself taking recitation a little more seriously, thinking there must be some value to it beyond just the performative aspect. I think it could potentially be an underutilized tool in the contemporary writer's kit. I feel like I've gotten a lot out of it.

>>19991618
Never thought of it but it makes sense considering oral tradition has always been a big thing in human history.
This may sound like I am making fun of your reading but I assure you I am not. Do you do voices for characters? If you do would you say it helps with relating or immersing yourself into the character and helping writing him or her?

>>19991280
At the very least series that take place in the same universe. Earthsea are stand alones

If I get my short stories published individually by different publications, will I then be able to collect them and publish them as a short story collection?

>>19991716
No. The publisher will forever own anything you make. You're only working for them.

>>19991716
it depends. when you submit to them you are entering a contract of sorts. to print them in a collection you may need their permission. sometimes they require credit if republished anywhere else e.g. first published in x magazine. sometimes their rights expire, as with anthologies, so you sell it to them for a few years then sell it to another when the rights expire.

>>19991924
>Nobody will ever write a 40-50 year old family man fighting the Dark Lord and win just to protect his family
>No chosen powers
>No special weapon
>Wins sheerly based on the power of a family man

>>19990245
>>19990258
Thanks for reading each draft, I appreciate it, and I appreciate the comments. I'm at a loss, to be honest. I personally feel the last draft is the best. It rounded out his hoarder nature and the home, and it added the mapping imagery there that also returns at the end, which I think is a good rhyming image and irony with how the stranger first fights the home then becomes a part of it. All comments so far have said the first draft was the best but I personally disagree, I think the new elements do add some complexity that is good. It's still not right though. It needs something. I'm not sure it is about adding more of the relationship. I like him as a force now, a strange invader the hoarder must conquer. I don't want to fill him out as a person.

>>19991942
I started writing a story once about two aged, estranged adventurers needing to get get together in order to kill their son who had become a tyrant (he used a magic that left only blood relations capable of killing him, so it was up to his parents to save the world). Except I told it from the perspective of the plucky young researcher who figured out the weakness and had to put them team together.

>>19987078
You don't know if it's well written based on the cover, but, fuck me, I thought the cover would at least indicate who the main character is. The cover promised fast cars and hot women and instead delivered autism and homos

I thought I made a reasonable assumption. I'm not complaining I got burned on the horrid writing (which it was) because that was a known risk.

>>19991942
Nobody writes about fat people either

>>19991942
>>19992004
>46 year old farmer/lumberjack
>wants something better to his kids who got drafted into the army to fight the dark lord
>decides to take the matter into his own hands
Pic related.

>>19991942
The most popular story on Royal Road is about an isekai-ed man who fucks off to become a farmer and find a wife, instead of sticking around at a martial arts dojo. Subversion is in vogue.

New thread >>19991999