/lit/ - Literature

First for yapps.

I received my first Biblical filtering at the hands of the Tabernacle chapters in Exodus. I jumped forward a few pages to see when it ends and he's still ranting about cubits.

>>19911115
Just read the New Testament anon, it's the heart of the Bible and all you need

>>19911160
>tfw no Christian sect which disregards the OT

>Need to fap
>Look at statue of Mary on desk
>Turn it around to face the wall

>>19911160
No, I'm going to read the whole thing front to back. And it's been enjoyable so far.

>>19911177
Cyproterone acetate anon
Don't defile your body with masturbation

>>19911181
>become a tranny, it's what God wants

My face when someone isn't reading the KJV

I bought a KJ Bible after seeing all the threads on this board and wanting to read it for the historical significance. Honestly such a shit book. I did enjoy the now politically incorrect verses though.

There are so many more books that we have written which can enrich you in such deeper ways. If you must repeatedly read this book for whatever reason, try limit your use.

>>19911211
Go away Satan

>God's face when he sees you on the computer at night with the door closed reading the NRSV

>Ask a Protestant to explain the Trinity
>They don't know the difference between a Hypostatic property and an Essential property of God

>>19911241
In my experience the Trinitarian dogmas are not terribly important to Protestants. They think the Trinity itself is important, I'm not saying they are non-Trinitarians, but I think that they conceive of the details as primarily an academic matter that has minimal relevance today.

>>19911246
Even their academics aren't so good at Trinitarian Theology. James Whites "The Forgotten Trinity" is just appalling and you can forget getting anything cogent from Macarthur or Piper. A large part of the problem is that Protestants are very unfamiliar with Eastern theology that informs the non-Augustinian viewpoints of Trinitarian Theology that rounds out the roughness of some of Augustines positions.

>>19911241
>talk to the one Catholic I know, an Irishman
>he says he's a non-Trinitarian

>>19911253
Those are popular writers and not academics. You'd need to go to their actual systematic theology and dogmatics texts, Bavinck, Berkhof, Hodge, etc.

>>19911270
I have Bavinks 4 volume Reformed Dogmatics and Hodges Systematic Theology and desu they're not that great either. Hodge is ok but only because he steals most of his best theology straight from Aquinas.

>>19911296
I get the impression that Protestants write about it just because they have to in order to keep some kind of historical continuity. All of the careful theological distinctions to ensure that Christ is fully God and fully human, etc. don't seem to really jive with Protestant thought since they perceive God as disconnected from the physical world. Like their general perception that the sacraments do not do anything in themselves. Everything is functioning on a mental or intellectual level.

>>19911310
Yeah that's the feeling I get too. They keep the Trinity because it's too deeply entwined with "real Christianity" despite not really respecting the authority of the Council that dogmatized it and it not really fitting into Protestant theology neatly. It's the same reason Protestants keep the Filoque despite not really needing to because they don't recognize the authority of the Pope to unilaterally change the creed, it's part of the western tradition they were part of and they just take it for granted that it's biblical and true.

In many ways the massive overfocus on Paul, and the Epistle to the Romans in particular, has withered most aspects of Protestant theology that don't relate directly to Soteriology.

>>19911001
Posing my Bible set (Septuagint + NT + OT/NT Apocrypha)

I've given up on /cg/, btw, it was exhausting to bump and remake it constantly. /his/ is dead until the moderation changes. There's no reason a slow board wihere the vast majority of threads only get a few replies needs 15+ pages worth of new threads every day, most of which are bait or /pol/ shit anyway. If someone else wants to make it I'll join in, but I don't see it as feasible with the current state of affairs.

>>19911329
Is having the Septuagint better than having an interlinear bible?

>>19911326
I agree. This disjunction between how they look at the Trinity and the importance which the early church placed on the Trinity was one of the things that started my journey out of Protestantism. Regarding their emphasis on Paul, I think one thing that aggravates this is the Calvinist/Arminian divide. On one hand you have Calvinists who can, on the face of it, make a convincing argument from within their own operating principles. And then you have Arminians who can tell that this is wrong, but as Protestants, they're forced to use the same operating principles and thus can never mount an effective defense and just kind of tear themselves up trying to deal with the problem. So your main controversy ends up as a centuries long brawl over what Paul means.

>>19911334
As long as this thread keeps going we don't really need one over there, so I think it's okay.

>>19911241
Imagine needing to put fancy words to things instead of just understanding them with the Spirit. I'm sure Peter and even John, plus their brothers would have agreed with (Me).

>>19911326
Never seen a Prot that holds the Filioque as true.

>>19911241
>asked Ms. Oldsworth who never read theology and goes because she grew up going

>>19911582
Our definitions have had to become more precise in order to refute error, not simply for their own sake. Read a history book.
>>19911584
Every Protestant denomination that holds the Nicene Creed includes the filioque. Show me a single one that holds it without it.

>>19911326
>being Christian is all about having a head full of of philosophical constructs
Most Protestants are more about just trying to spiritually attune with God and listening for His will, *walking* in faith. Sitting around in monasteries coming up with mental constructs and going on and on about them on YouTube isn't the meat of what Christ commands. God is Spirit,

>>19911593
Oh weird, I don't recall Christ teaching to refute theological errors in the Good Samaritan story. The Samaritan was a heretical Jew and the Levite had a head full of "correct doctrine". It seems He was trying to tell us something with that story but maybe there's some fancy word I don't know that makes me not get it.

>>19911605
You can do that because the ancient heresies were vanquished by the Catholic Church. You simply assume all the things that the ancient church fought for and then sit back and spit on them for it. You are a disgrace.

>>19911593
The church does not reflect its members. Ask any prot if they believe the filioque. They probably don't even know their church "follows" it.

>>19911611
If you are not commanded to refute theological errors then kindly shut your mouth and stop trying to refute the errors you think we are committing.

>>19911617
Indeed, they likely don't think or care about the things that are in their confessional documents, I agree.

>>19911614
No, all that was needed was preserving Scripture, now we can all just read it and it tells us what we need to know. There was no need to go around looking for heresy boogeymen everywhere like McCarthy over minor points and killing them.

>>19911611
Luke 17:3
>Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him.
Nice scripture twisting. That ironically refers to being good in heart instead.

>>19911618
These aren't theological errors, these are (You) lacking the Christian Spirit.

>>19911584
https://youtu.be/FQ4oovwaEWQ

>>19911620
I'm in quite a pickle.
Can't go Cath because saint prayer. Nor Ortho because icons and the usual Marian things of both. Prot is a flimsy stand because i get piled up with a number of purely heretical doctrine "churches".

>>19911625
>not having just the right mental notion of the trinity is sinning

>>19911622
>>19911627
I am not going to reason with an anti-intellectual. Go tell Pastor Billy Bob you won an internet argument and drink your grape juice.

>>19911634
Get saved and born again, become Christian.

>>19911631
Prayer to saints is not wrong. They are alive in heaven and equally part of the mystical body of Christ along with us. If God wills it (and he does) then they can receive our prayers and pray for us in turn.

2 Timothy 2:14
>Remind them of these things, and charge them before God not to quarrel about words, which does no good, but only ruins the hearers.
Why is this general purely bickering?
Let's have a quality sprint.
What books are required reading for every Christian?

>>19911632
Are you implying belief in the Filioque could be correct? It's not a even a Trinity in that case.
I am in error for that quote though, yes.

Christ was truly the only christian.

>>19911639
Doesn't sit too well with me. Along with the numerous verses of "pray to God alone."
I would need some pretty great and deep exegesis to get that one in.

>>19911646
The issue of the filioque is not a theological one, as Orthodox accept it as well, as it is not taught that the Spirit is generated by the son in some way. He does not proceed from the son in the same way he proceeds from the father. The issue they have is whether Rome had the authority to modify the Creed.

“What was formerly merely sickly now becomes indecent : it is indecent to be a Christian today.”

“Christianity is religion for the executioner.”

>>19911650
This is the trouble with these sorts of objections. Prayer to saints was the universal practice of all Christians until the Reformation. But you have decided that it "doesn't sit right with you" and made yourself the authority on these matters. Something cannot be correct unless you personally approve of it.
>Along with the numerous verses of "pray to God alone."
Such as?

>>19911640
>What books are required reading for every Christian?
C.S. Lewis - Mere Christianity
G.K. Chesterton - Orthodoxy
St. Augustine - Confessions

>>19911664
I've read the first one and downloaded the third but it looks dense as hell, I'm not sure I'm ready for non-bibkr archaic terminology.

>>19911677
There are modern translations available if that is the problem. Try to get one of those.

>>19911661
John 14:6
Am i not allowed to object? If you told me 2+2=4 i'd ask why. Wouldn't you?
Would you accept the answer "because they used it in the past"?

>>19911664
Should i leave Lewis to read in the original? Have the other two.

>>19911677
>>19911679
Look into the translations by Maria Boulding and Henry Chadwick (both are recent and use modern English) and pick whichever feels easier for you.

>>19911680
>John 14:6
"The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects" (James 5:16) As the saints are righteous we ask the saints for their prayers, and prayer is the way in which we can communicate with them. We are not worshiping them or putting them before Christ.
>Am i not allowed to object? If you told me 2+2=4 i'd ask why. Wouldn't you?
There is nothing wrong with seeking an explanation. But there is a problem in making yourself the authority.
>Would you accept the answer "because they used it in the past"?
My appeal to the past is that, as this was a universal practice among Christians, that means it cannot be wrong, or else the Holy Spirit was not guiding the Church into all truth (John 16:13).

Hello my fellow brothers who deviated to the straight Way. I want to ask you a fair question. What is holding you to convert to Islam? Is that because you dont like our religion? We failed to teach you our religion? Or God revealed the last revelation to a son of Ishmael, and you feel ashmed for that? You already coping the fact that Jesus was not of you ancestors blood? Imagine believing another one...

>>19911724
They are not masculin enough for islam, modern christians prefer a more repressed & effeminate approach.

>>19911724
Compare pic related to the Quran:

53:8 ... then [Gabriel] approached the Prophet, coming so close
53:9 that he was only two arms-lengths away or even less.
53:10 Then Allah revealed to His servant what He revealed through Gabriel.
53:11 The Prophet’s heart did not doubt what he saw.

>>19911724
Islam isn't true, in a nutshell. Muhammads "revelation" is demonstrably false and the Quran is the Old Testament paraphrased and cobbled together with some nonsensical additions from Muhammad.

>Bible study!
I know I’m under doing it, as far as translations are concerned, besides the Vulgate what am I missing lads?

>>19911735
The source of the quote in the picture is this, by the way.

>>19911746
This was released recently. OT still in progress.

>>19911685
If you can do so I would say yes. He's a good writer and it's not a terribly difficult book.

>>19911714
How were i putting myself as the authority? I just said it doesn't feel right, so i can't believe it without said proof.
Am i not the authority of my own self?

>>19911746
Looks pretty good to me. Time to start collecting some secondary literature to help your study. Here's some of my references I use.

>>19911769
>meditations on the tarot
please throw that away

>>19911735
You can say this for every messenger of God

Its not a matter of method, but a matter of traditions. I dont belive Muhammad pbuh because i think he was the prohet. I belive in Muhammad pbuh because my dad did according to islamic tradition of this generation, witch my grandfather did according to islamic tradition of his generation, and so on till you reach the first muslims who lived with the prohet, who saw his miracles.

The same thing with Jesus and Moses. Their legacy lives in the human tradition of sages of the religion

>>19911768
You certainly have the freedom to make your own choices. But having been a Protestant myself in the past I am aware of how everything is run through the filter of "myself." This is something I was never able to solve, that I had to justify every single aspect of Christianity to myself, as I were even competent to do such a thing. It's not our job to teach but to learn, I guess I would say.

>>19911772
Then they should have listened to the successors of the Apostles who could have explained to them their error.

>>19911724
No, I like Islam. It's just that it's wrong.

>>19911771
It's fine, there's nothing in there that's more unconventional than Meister Eckhart.

>>19911752
>Peshita
I know about this. Thats the abbreviated one, they’re releasing the full Syriac Bible in a multiple volume set. Good call anon

>>19911775
But it is also our job to not heed false teachings. I could not bear to let myself fall into error.

>>19911793
>to not heed false teachings
Then revert to Islam.

>>19911784
I hate it nonetheless.
I will set no wicked thing before mine eyes: I hate the work of them that turn aside; it shall not cleave to me.

>>19911793
Let me clarify what I mean. As a Protestant I felt the need for historical continuity. The theory that I came to was that of the Reformers, which is that Protestantism is in continuity with the western tradition, but that it compares that tradition to scripture to determine which aspects of it are true and which are false. This seemed acceptable to me, until various arguments I had with people forced me to face what it really meant, which is that in this formula, every iota of theology becomes subject to questioning. There are the "big issues" like the canon, but I thought of others as well. What is grace? What are works? What is faith? On and on, nothing could actually be assumed, because anything could be wrong if Scripture taught otherwise. And who gets to interpret Scripture to find this out? Me, of course. And thus I am the arbiter of all truth. If there isn't some living authority out there in the world then it all falls onto me.
>Acts 8:30-31 So Philip ran to him, and heard him reading Isaiah the prophet, and asked, “Do you understand what you are reading?” And he said, “How can I, unless some one guides me?” And he invited Philip to come up and sit with him.
Who can guide you or me? How can any Protestant minister do this when any of his teachings may be false if I can determine they contradict Scripture? I could not abide this. There has to actually be something we can rely on, or Christ has left us adrift at sea.

>>19911798
>Islam
Go read your fanfiction

>>19911808
>Go read your fanfiction
You mean Paul's letters? I don't need to read them as I follow the true religion.

>>19911769
Thats a pic of my Bible shelf only. I got designated shelves for specific topics; monastics, mystics, liturgics, commentary, life after death/eschatology/resurrection, patristics, dogmatics, desert fathers, lives of saints, all get their own shelf. And I got a shelf I dedicated to the Jesus prayer and everything I could find on the invocation of the sacred name of God. But I appreciate your advice I always tell people to catch up on their Church fathers.

>>19911199
This, unironically

>>19911807
Makes sense. A leap of faith of sorts.
I'll still hold my own judgement for the time being though.

>>19911808
lol the audacity of this fella

>>19911831
It's partially that, but more than that. My options came down to Orthodoxy and Catholicism, and I came to the conclusion that to convert to Orthodoxy would be based fundamentally on the same principle of making myself the authority. People convert to Orthodoxy because they investigate the matter and come to the conclusion that Orthodoxy was on the correct side of the Great Schism and that Rome has engaged in theological innovation, etc. So again the foundation is really just my personal conclusions. Catholicism however has a unique point that separates it from all other churches, which is the Pope. There is only one person in the world that is like this, that is a visible living head* to the Church. A person could convert simply based on this, without making any theological determinations; they could see the visible figure of the Pope, join the Church, and then learn the doctrines afterward, as would be the case in the ancient Church, where these matters were withheld and taught to those who became catechumens. So you are left with an act of will to join the Church, which is not a contradictory to my argument. By an act of will we have faith in Christ, by an act of will we enter communion with his earthly representative. I think that this solves the conundrum.

*The Pope is not the head of the Church in himself, but as Christ's vicar he is the earthly head through Christ.

Dear Orthoniggers.

Tell me to my face what you really think about the Filioque. Walk up to me and tell me what you think when you think about the Filioque. C'mon, I double dare you. Pretend that we're good friends if you must, but please just try to encounter me in person and tell me what it is that you feel about my Faith's Creed and its 'Filioque'. Don't be shy. But I for one can't wait until one of you grows enough balls to tell me what you really think about the Filioque to my face because then, I'll finally have enough starting materials to paint houses just like I've always wanted to ^_^
C'mon Orthoniggers, MAKE MY DAY!

>>19912221
Just fucking revert to islam and stop wasting time with this bullshit

>>19912235
>revert to islam
are you dumb? i have no connection to islam whatsoever, nigger.

>>19912245
Some muslims prefer "revert" over "convert", because, technically, all small children are counted muslim on account of their fitrah (a sort of inborn knowledge of God), before they grew up and their heads are filled with false teaching from their culture. It's kinda dumb and autistic sometimes.

>>19912264
>YOU Wuz Muzlim N Sheeeit!
These people defeated Orthoniggers -_-
How pathetic

>>19912245
Christianity its a broken religion. Your holy book is corrupted, there is no real single lenguage and all your teological problems and sect creation comes because you dont understand the definition of the concepts

According to christianity we should pray god with latin. Who the fuck speaks latin?

We muslims pray in arabic, speak in arabic, think in arabic. We live with the same lenguage of the holy prophets, of Muhammad of Jesus of Moses of Ibrahim

Imagine being monolingual in 2022.

>>19911807
As a member of the Body of Christ one has historical continuity from the beginning to the end, the Alpha to the Omega.
>How can any Protestant minister do this when any of his teachings may be false if I can determine they contradict Scripture?
A great reason not to call them "Father", for we are all brethren, exactly as Christ taught us face to face. He did not instead say "Peter, you are the Papa and are over the others and what you say must go." Nope, he told them all "you are all brethren, call no man Father". Your entire mindset is warped to think that some "priest" has authority to decide truth for you. Christ set it up for us all to be brethren, and some brethren might have better abilities to understand things and just naturally help other brethren, but the other brethren can still look for themselves and see if they agree or not, then return with "I looked at that Scripture and it seems to me it might mean _____", and then the brethren together look and see. Most of it, by far, it plain enough to not require anything more than reading.
>And it came to pass, as he spake these things, a certain woman of the company lifted up her voice, and said unto him, Blessed is the womb that bare thee, and the paps which thou hast sucked. But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it.

>>19911752
>printed in China
Hurts my soul.

>>19912461
The orthos have papal primacy right also. Not above other bishops, only first among equals

>>19912461
This is of course nonsense as you have no way to account for the utter fragmentation of Protestantism. Yes, yes, I get that the people in your local church agree with each other and a few other churches. And the same can be said for every other Protestant denomination, including the ones who disagree with you on virtually every single thing you believe. It simply does not work the way you think it does. God does not guide the Protestant churches.

>>19911801
What do you hate about it? The Kabbalah stuff?

>>19911772
Doesn't the Qur'an explicitly teach not to hold on to the traditions of your forefathers (unless of course you exchange them for submission to the one God). You're supposed to come to the conclusion that the Qur'an is right through your own reasoning, not because your father or grandfather believed it

>>19913252
Everyone born muslim, but God created us for testing our faith. The Quran its the word of God, and God telled us "obey Me and Muhammad"

It means that yes, we must follow the Quran, but also the teachings of the prophet, because they actually tell how to do things. This teachings are carried over the islamic tradition, by an historical chain of men

The same concept applies to judaism

>>19913094
>utter fragmentation of Protestantism
Meaningless, most of Protestantism by far shares the same core beliefs and most of the fragmentation by far consists of essentially peripheral non-essential details. What matters most is faith in God and becoming more attuned to hearing and following His will. God calls people into wide varieties of earthly institutional situations and ensures that each called individual is lead to the knowledge they require for doing their part in His Body. (You) are essentially an atheist who thinks only the institution itself teaches and guides people. Christ Himself said: "But you are not to be called ‘Rabbi,’ for you have one Teacher, and you are all brothers." The LORD God Almighty is our teacher and He can raise sons of Abraham from mere stones.

>>19913307
>we must follow the Quran
Which Quran?

>>19913309
>Meaningless, most of Protestantism by far shares the same core beliefs and most of the fragmentation by far consists of essentially peripheral non-essential details.
So you don't have a problem with things like infant baptism then?
>What matters most is faith in God and becoming more attuned to hearing and following His will. God calls people into wide varieties of earthly institutional situations and ensures that each called individual is lead to the knowledge they require for doing their part in His Body.
This is entirely made up by you in a pathetic defense of the complete fragmentation of Protestantism. It is not justifiable in any manner.
>The LORD God Almighty is our teacher and He can raise sons of Abraham from mere stones.
He teaches everyone different and contradictory things though but it's okay because uh???

>>19913311
Stop trolling, faggot. You are in great danger, a danger of Hell

>>19913319
>It is not justifiable in any manner.
It's absolutely justifiable by seeing His hand and hearing His voice in my own life without relying completely on a bunch of "ideas". The Holy Bible provides information that helps one to clarify and understand what one is experiencing from God directly when walking in actual faith. Actual faith is not about filling your head with a bunch of "just right" ideas/details.

>>19913328
>trolling
It's a sincere question. Which Quran? Hafs, Warsh, Al-Kasai?

>>19913375
Orthodox (right belief) is what allows us to discern whether our understanding of our experiences is correct. We experience something, our conscience prods us in a certain direction, we interpret it to mean this or that, but our religious sense must be properly informed, and ideally under proper spiritual guidance, to discern these matters correctly. You are not simply on your own to figure it out yourself, or rather you are not supposed to be. You talk to much about how we are not to call one Master, etc., but that is what you do for yourself. You make yourself the Master. Christ has provided an actual Church for us to guide and lead us, and the best thing you can do for your soul is to become part of it.

>>19913399
>You are not simply on your own to figure it out yourself
Right, like I said, there is God. The Holy Spirit is our helper. And yes, the Church is the Body of Christ. The "Church™" however is filled with "leaders" who do not truly know anything about an actual living walk in faith. I'll take God's leadership over some crypto atheist telling me what is what when he doesn't really know himself.

>>19913418
I hold that your belief that God guides you specifically to the correct belief to be spiritual delusion which cannot stand up to historical scrutiny or to the simple observation of reality. If you can't see what's going from looking at these things I don't know what to tell you.

>>19913433
It's not about being lead to the "correct belief", it's about being lead towards living His will. Apparently you fail to understand the Good Samaritan parable and a great many other things, all the while going on and on about "correct beliefs". How ironic.

>>19913394
Ok sorry then. They are all the same, with difference in pronunciation of the words. Al Hafs is the common. Peek whatever you like the most

Anons, which KJV is best?
R L Allan? Cambridge Turquoise? Schuyler? CBP?
I can't buy them all...
Also, the peace of Christ be upon you all this Lord's day.

>>19913593
Of those CBP is the only one that says "Authorized King James" without """Version""" and is printed and hand bound in the USA.

I've already finished reading the bible and I'm thinking about buying the Quran because think the abrahamic religions complement each other and it will broaden my view on these religions. The problem is that I don't know which version to buy in my native language(portuguese). And I read you can only buy a commentary on the Quran. It's forbidden to translate or something like that.

The discount's still going, so I'm going to repost from the last thread. The normally $80 Alter Hebrew Bible boxset currently has an Amazon coupon to knock over $25 off the price, and someone already compounded discounts to get it for less than $50. If you get it, be sure to check Joshua 3:15 to make sure you don't have an edition with the NYT typo. Several anons in past threads have said they had the typo in theirs, while others say it's not there on theirs; it was likely a first-print issue and shouldn't be a problem anymore, but it doesn't hurt to check.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0393292495

>>19913766
Islam is in no way "complimentary" to anything other than Satan, who went to Muhammad in the form of an angel and fed him fan fictional lies in order to sow millennia of discord in earth.

Is this a good Bible, bros? I just need a cheap one for my first read through and this seems to be the most complete version.

>>19913965
>KJV
Great Bible. Get a nice goatskin/leather one or such next.

>>19913766
The different versions of the Quran differce only in pronunciation, but they are all the same. The most commonly used its al Hafs. I suggest to you to install the Al Quran app, witch has the Tafsir (explanation) too. Its not illegal to translate the Quran. Its just that for embracing fully the God revelation one must learn Arabic, the original lenguage of God and the prophets.

The app has the audio speaking too. And this is fundamental because the Quran must be indulged with all our senses: eyes for reading, ears for hearing and mouth for recitating.

>>19913965
It's mostly good but is the Oxford text which is flawed. The only 100% fully genuine Holy Bible text is the Pure Cambridge edition of the King James Bible, which is what Church Bible Publishers uses.

https://www.bibleprotector.com/purecambridgeedition.htm

>>19914019
Can you get this with Apocrypha and in a nice big hardcover tome?

>Jesus, however, was fond of saying, “Amen,” before making a statement or giving a message. When used in this way, the word amen has slightly different implications. Leading off with amen not only implies that what follows is true but also that the person making the statement has firsthand knowledge and authority about it. Saying, “Verily, verily,” before making a statement is a strong claim to truth, presented from an almost audacious attitude. Speaking on worldly or secular matters, saying, “Verily, verily,” would imply that what follows is that person’s own original idea.
>So, when Jesus leads off with the words verily, verily in verses such as Matthew 18:3, Mark 3:28, Luke 23:43, and John 8:51, He is not merely saying, “Believe me, this is true.” He is actually saying, “I know this is true firsthand.” Since many of these comments are on heavenly, spiritual, or godly issues, Jesus’ use of verily, verily is part of His consistent claim of divinity. Jesus is not merely aware of these truths: He is the One who originated them!
I love this.

Also I'm reading the Oxford Study Bible in RSV for a change. The notes are kind of baffling, not just because of the atheist angle but in that they often claim that the original compilers of the canon often "didn't get things right", not "it's not really clear why this is written this way" or "we have not reached a conclusion", but "the original authors were wrong about this, perhaps they were confused". There's this weird arrogance permeating the notes that is really insufferable sometimes.

>>19914108
No, it's only the Holy Bible, not things that are not the Holy Bible.

>>19914141
It's a shame because the notes are excellent when they offer insight on Jewish tradition, or explain the meaning of an expression. The translation is a bit dry but it's very clear at least.

>>19914108
You have the option to get the standalone Apocrypha from Cambridge as well.

>>19914179
>the notes are excellent when they offer insight on Jewish tradition, or explain the meaning of an expression
Can be had in most study Bibles and commentaries, without the gaytheism.

>>19914161
When the KJV was first made it included the Apocrypha, which was removed some 300 years later.

>>19914185
This is true, but the King James Apocrypha is not recommendable as it is missing 70 verses.

>>19914161
>No, it's only the Holy Bible, not things that are not the Holy Bible.
I see, so the 1611 KJB was in error? Gotcha.

>>19914195
Yes but it was merely included and not part of Scripture. The original 1611 release also had planting almanac charts and other things, none of which was Scripture. Next.

>>19914196
AFAIK the only English Bible that has all the books is the Ofxord RSV since it's specifically made to be ecumenical.

>>19914196
Why is that? Are they not in the Masoretic Text or something?

>>19914336
Protestant Apocrypha is not the full Apocrypha, it's kind of a mess.

>>19914280
There are NRSVs available with all of them, and the ESV Apocrypha is available separate of the Bible.
>>19914336
The mss used was missing them, and weirdly enough if memory served it was due to a fire. At any rate you can Google KJV Apocrypha missing 70 verses and read about it somewhere.

>>19914406
>>19914352
Is there an ESV or NRSV with the full Apocrypha? Ideally including more recent texts such as Enoch?

>>19911115
I finally got past that. It gets a little better but does the same thing for rituals later on.

>>19913965
The best Bible is the one you actually read.

>>19914518
There's the Augustine Bible which is a Catholic edition of the ESV

What does the Catholic idea of fasting for Lent entail? I'm Anglican but I feel like "giving up chocolate" or other "fasts" aren't really fasts at all.

>>19914747
How does it differ to the Anglicanised version of the ESV? Is there a place I can check online?

>>19914747
>>19914770
It's pretty meh. Here's a list of all the differences between the ESV and the ESVCE:
https://archive.azurewebsites.net/Documents/Differences%20Between%20the%20ESV%20and%20ESV-CE.pdf

>>19914770
It has the Deuterocanonical books. That's the main difference.

My Catholic friend who I was considering to be godfather of my children just admitted he's a Socinian. What do I do?

>>19914816
Well he's not Catholic then is he? He's Protestant. You could get him the Incarnate Lord by Joseph White to help him understand how the divinity of Christ is theologically necessary. There's no point believing in Christ as a savior if he's just another created being.

Just got a NOAB, pretty excited to start studying desu

>The Racovian publications, like the Sozzinis, rejected the pre-existence of Christ and held that Jesus did not exist until he was conceived as a human being.
>tfw I am a Socinian heretic
>tfw God didn't create an autistic predetermined clockwork universe full of human failures and sins for no reason
>tfw He gave real freedom to creation
>tfw God gave himself freedom too, because He loved His creation so much that He limited His own infinite power for it
>tfw He committed a literally unthinkable paradoxical action for us
>tfw He chose to send His Son to redeem us, because our fall and redemption weren't preordained
>tfw His act of compassion has actual meaning, and wasn't a puppet show for himself

Have fun with your fidget spinner and pythagorean number worship, I will be at church thanking God for saving me

News for Catholics who use the ESV-CE: Cambridge University Press will be releasing a calfskin edition of the ESV-CE in summer 2022.

>ESVCE
Imagine being Catholic and claiming to have written the Bible but admit that you can't make a translation so you rely on Protestants.

>>19915169
I can't wait

>>19915222
>translations
Literally just learn Greek.

>>19911115
All it leads to is the people are unclean to enter the tabernacle so they need to spend a few more books explaining how to get clean to see the face of God. You can skip to Joshua or Judges and it greats pretty kino at that point.

>>19913450
You only have to complain about correct belief being wrong because your beliefs are wrong and you need to justify it somehow. It's God's will that we walk in truth, that means that we know the truth about him, which means we believe correctly.

>>19915169
>>19915222
I never liked the ESV when I was a Protestant. It felt very sterile to me and I don't think I'll ever be able to disassociate it with Evangelicalism. Since I left Protestantism I've avoided it, so it's a bit disappointing to see it gain any traction in Catholicism.

>>19915711
The NKJV is my favorite translation. I'd love if the Catholic Church could do something similar with the Douay Rheims and update the language so it's not so archaic while retaining the poetry of the psalms and hymns.

>>19915711
>so it's a bit disappointing to see it gain any traction in Catholicism.
It hasn't. It exists, but no Catholics really bought it because of bad marketing from Augustine Institute and its Luke 1:28. It's only gotten traction in the UK because they wanted to get rid of the JB.

>>19915725
Personally I use the RSV-CE (1st edition)

>>19915725
Personally I read the KJV for beauty and the NOA for deeper understanding. I have an ESV for if I need something easy to understand, like for my kids.

>>19915770
Reason for using the 1st over the 2nd: I like that the 1st includes thee/thou when directed to God (not a deal-breaker of course), there isn't any clear explanation of how the 2nd edition was updated, and the 2nd edition isn't available online anywhere so if I want to reference it on my computer I have to use the 1st edition anyway.

Why did miracles stop happening after the invention of smartphones?

>>19915935
They did not. Confer any of the documented miracles used as evidence for recent canonizations.

>>19915809
The RSV-CE is still perfectly fine. The 2CE *technically* still has thees and thous, but only in the prayers iirc. The point about updates is a valid concern, though in some wordings I've noticed the 2CE adopted the wording of the ESV; that said, sine the Bible in a Year podcast host used the 2CE and read the whole text out-loud, if there was anything weird about the translation, people surely would've heard it this past year. But that last point really is annoying, true. Sure, the 2CE is available via an app, but they really should give it to BibleGateway already. That, or I'd like someone to pull the text from that app and finally run a machine algorithm comparing the CE to the 2CE so we have a definitive list.

>>19915917
hahahaha

whos a good saint to read or church father who focuses on getting my act together LOL

>>19911177
Repent after the act and fight to not commit the act again, anon.
Pray for God's help and be strong.

>>19911001
What are the best books for understanding the allegorical and occult parts of the Bible? I'm thinking the word play and puns, astrological input, and folklore.

>>19911724
The deny Jesus is The Messiah. For that alone I could never be a muslim.

>>19915985

>>19911724
No real Muslim would say "convert to Islam." You "revert" to Islam because, of course, you're born a Muslim. Good bait though

>>19915986
Technically Muslims do believe Jesus was the messiah, they just deny his divinity.

>>19915970
Pic related has a lot of practical advice in this regard. It doesn't say it on the cover but the author was canonized as a saint in 2002 so it fits your request.

>>19916014
>May your behavior and your conversation be such that everyone who sees or you can say: This man reads the life of Jesus Christ.

>Don't say, "That's the way I am--it's my character." It's your lack of character. Be a man!

>Excuses. You'll never lack them if you want to avoid your duties. What a lot of rationalizing! Don't stop to think about excuses. Get rid of them and do what you should.

>Why those variations in your character? When are you going to apply your will to something? Drop that craze for laying cornerstones, and finish at least one of your projects.

>>19915970
Try the Fulfilment of All Desire by Ralph Martin. Lots of practical advice taken directly from the lives of the Saints.

>>19915955
If this is true, where is the documentation? When I google I just get dodgy sites talking nonsense.

>>19916069
This is all handled through the Congregation for the Causes of Saints. I don't know whether they keep a public repository of this information, but the miracles that are referenced are public knowledge, so you can research the saints individually yourself.

How do you cope with the knowledge that all your agnostic friends and family will burn in hellfire? Genuine question.

>>19916203
Tide goes in, tide goes out.

I didn't read any Bible last night after getting filtered by the Tabernacle chapters. I had the most horrible nightmares, is this related to my massive cheese consumption or is God punishing me for reading Henry James instead?

>>19916203
You don't. They'll learn

>>19915917
I can endure any suffering as long as I don't have to go to bed at a particular time

>>19916249
You just need to understand the Books of Moses were really only meant to be read by priests so they knew the law and the basics. The Tabernacle chapters, like the genealogies, weren't written for you, hence why they're difficult to read. You'll later get filtered by Leviticus and Numbers, and it'll be for the same reason. Not to worry, as Joshua will satisfy your ADHD.

>>19916203
The same way the Aztecs coped with you not believing in their religion.

>>19911001
>How it feels to read the Gospel of Thomas
Not in any biblical canon but regardless, I have gained some unique insights

What does /lit/ think of the Geneva Bible? It's the same bible used by William Shakespeare, Oliver Cromwell, John Knox, The Mayflower Pilgrims, John Donne, and many, many others.

>>19915725
Does the NKJV simply modernize individual words e.g. thee and thou, or does it also rephrase sentences occasionally?

All these Bible versions are discomforting to acknowledge. Every Christian subdemographic is making their own version now and getting divided further and further.
>inb4 there's only one Bible and it's the ___
Yeah this is what everyone else would say. Meanwhile Muslims or Jews use one text. The moment you start translating it's over. Christians should have learned Greek for devotional purposes but then again this is exactly why Christianity could spread so far, obviously at the cost of integrity.

>>19916472
It's an entirely new translation, it's not a revision of the KJV. It just uses the same textual source and is in a similar style. So yes there are substantial changes.

>>19916497
>All Christians throughout history are wrong and should have done blah blah
Thanks for sharing

>>19916497
The differences are an annoyance, nothing more. People who have the commitment to read the Bible know enough to check the Greek for disputed sections, and the other people don't read the Bible.

>>19916497
Eventually you'll realize that this is entirely the fault of Protestants.

>>19916381
I like it because its anti-papist:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wU7JNsU4DeM&

>>19916746
>I like it because it's heretical
Sad

My mom went on a trip to America and bought me this from the dollar store. Cute
Next to one bound by my Grandpa

>>19916586
True but the Reformation happened because of how the Vatican was behaving.

>>19917075
Indeed, Rome was not faultless, but the schism should have ended during the Counter-Reformation. The longer it continues the more it exposes through its effects how wrong it is.

>>19914141
I also have the Oxford Study Bible and it's what I'm using to read the Bible for the first time. I like it so far, other than the fact that the paper style is too thin, causing the text to "bleed" on the other side of the page.

Come now, you rich, weep and howl for the miseries that are coming upon you. Your riches have rotted and your garments are moth-eaten. Your gold and silver have rusted, and their rust will be evidence against you and will eat your flesh like fire. You have laid up treasure for the last days.
--James 5:1-3

But, when what necessity demands has been supplied, and one's standing fairly taken thought for, it becomes a duty to give to the indigent out of what remains over.
--Pope Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum

>>19916031
Oh right! i actually have this on audiobook, thanks so much for reminding me to get into it. >>19916014
This also seems based, thanks

>>19916746
I will pray for you

Is Apocryphon of John a required reading?

>>19916203
What about your Gnostic friends though? I mean the heretical ones.

>>19917088
>Rome was not faultless
that's a massive euphemism

NABRE Luke 1:34 But Mary said to the angel, “How can this be, since I have no relations with a man?”

FOOTNOTE: According to Luke, the virginal conception of Jesus takes place through the holy Spirit, the power of God, and therefore Jesus has a unique relationship to Yahweh: he is Son of God.

The fuck is with these notes?

>>19911177
I praise to God to give me the strength not to look at porn and I haven't had any desire to do so in a few days. Gonna pray again today to fill up that strength battery inside me.

>>19917324
Yeah it does have a lot of ghosting. The binding is very nice at least, feels very solid. That's on the RSV, not the NRSV edition though. No idea about that one.
I'm not too much of a fan of the translation, though. It's very clear for sure and great for a study Bible, except for the occasional dishonesty, but it's really wooden even compared to ESV.

>>19918226
Pornography is one of the most demonic forces in the world today. It is pure evil and one of the strongest temptations to overcome.

>>19918284
I hate it very much and everyone who participates in it.

Anyone own this?

>>19911241
"There is no reason for us to try to discover what has not been revealed. It is enough to know that God is God."
~ A.W. Tozer

>>19918284
Quitting smoking and alcohol was so much easier for me, it’s scary how addictive pornography is…I gave into the allure of porn quite late too, but I pray for all these young men who are subjected to it’s evilness from an even younger age. A good pornographer is a dead one.

>>19918418
Stop posting that faggot around here.
He was a San Fran Uber-Faggot with a YUGE ego and suspect death. The sooner the world forgets him, the better for everyone, most of all him.

>>19918284
Just don't look at naked women.
It is that easy.

>>19918435
Just because he was Orthodox does not mean you should slander him like this.

Just finished Matthew in the NT. I realized that the next book starts the same way so I quickly skimmed through it and it seems to tell the same story as Matthew only from the perspective of Mark and apparently this happens 3 more times? Also while skimming through it, the revival of Jesus happens differently, for example in Matthew one angel appears, rolls over the boulders and kills the guards but in the other I skimmed through the boulder was already rolled over and there were two angels inside, so which is correct now? Like I said, I finished Matthew like 3 minutes ago so maybe it is explained in the Bible itself.

>>19918435
Orthodoxy and Homosexuality can't exist without each other.

>>19918443
They don't have to be naked lol.

>>19911204
>Mfw someone isn't reading the Schlachter 2000

>>19918462
The guards are still alive and are bribed to lie, actually.
Different people wrote the Gospels. It is written how each knows it. Someone probably has a better answer.

>>19916472
Just modernises individual words and occassionally phrasing. For example changing "heareth" to "hears". Other than that it's identical to the KJV

>>19918284
>>19918418
Absolutely. Adicction to pornography is horrible and is quite easy to relapse. One should always pray for chastity and avoid things that could stimulate sin.

>>19918435
>denying a man can be redeemed
Come on, anon.

>>19918435
I'm not a fan of Rose but it's certainly plausible that someone who's been fully entrenched into this society's nihilism may wake up and argue against it the most viciously. You know how many heavy smokers quit and hate smoking afterwards?

>>19918400
I had it. It was pretty good, for awhile I thought maybe better than Calvin's Institutes. I wouldn't buy the physical set again though.

>>19918462
Mark is the basis for Matthew and Luke so it's the least interesting and shortest, but almost every chapter of all 4 Gospels has something new.

I like the idea of becoming Anglican because I’m English and love my heritage but I can’t reconcile the fact how the church was created…just because a King wanted a divorce. Ridiculous.
I feel a kind of midpoint between Catholicism and Protestantism is where I feel at home. Books for this feel?

>>19918435
Don't do this. The only thing I dislike about Rose is that he needlessly attacked Thomas Merton because of his Convertodox syndrome. Otherwise his criticisms of modernity are spot on.

>>19919871
>t. historylet
>Books for this feel?
Read about/by Thomas Cranmer.

>>19919871
Light From Old Times by Bishop J.C. Ryle

>>19913807
This discount has concluded.

>>19919871
I am in a very similar boat but am struggling with the ordination of trannies and sexually active gays. I went to a sermon and it was loaded with nuspeak. Really struggling desu.

>>19911115
cunt the tabernacle chapters are literally the most important ones for understanding the insidious and all-pervasive neuroticism of the juden. except for maybe leviticus and the temple chapters..

>>19919871
sorry bro. your entire church was cut off from the one true vine when you burnt the maiden and prophet of the lord saint joan of arc at the stake for following the will of the holy spirit.

then a few decades pass... god sends a heretical king upon you and your church is in the hands of satan. now you've got trannys and women priests and a whole bunch of other bullshit that would make the early church fathers spin in their graves. return to the holy roman church brother.

>>19911769
holy shit

>>19911769
So tell us something you've learned.

>>19920957
>Catholic priest burns a saint alive in France a century prior to the Reformation
>this is somehow Anglicanism's fault

>>19914736
This is such an excellent reply.

>>19921029
I never said it was Anglicanism's fault. Anglicanism was punishment for the sins of the English Church.

Obviously there is no "Church of England." There is only the Church of Jesus Christ.

>>19919871
>>19920320
>>19920957
>>19921029
>>19921096
I don't know about saying it's a punishment for burning St. Joan, but it is true that the "Church of England" was conceived in sin by Henry VIII's desire for divorce. The tree itself is evil, so to speak. Also a reminder to those who would consider converting to this communion, the Catholic Church has ruled that all ordinations in the Church of England are null and void. You may indeed be baptized there, but you will have no access to the Eucharist. I know that there are "Anglo-Catholics" who perceive themselves as closer to Catholicism in sacramental theology, but the sacraments are objective matters and are not determined by your belief about them. You can think whatever you want about the Eucharist but if you are part of the Church of England you do not have one.

>>19921268
Downsides of Anglicanism:
>Catholics think your communion isn't real

Downsides of Catholicism:
>have to worship dead human saints
>have to worship alive human pedophiles
>have to believe Mary was born to a virgin
>have to believe in purgatory

>>19921422
>have to worship dead human saints
We do not worship saints. We honor them for their righteous lives and ask them for their prayers. Also the Saints are not dead. They are alive with Christ in heaven and are equally part of the mystical body of Christ, the Church, along with us. We are not cut off from them, but part of the same body.
>have to worship alive human pedophiles
Are you even trying?
>have to believe Mary was born to a virgin
This is false. Mary was preserved from original sin by the application of the merits of Christ at the moment of her conception.
>have to believe in purgatory
And why would I not? How can a person who is still sinful in their being enter heaven? Do you believe that there is sin in heaven?

>>19921422
>Downsides of Anglicanism
It's a dead denomination

>Our cathedral buildings will survive, but they won’t be true cathedrals because they will have no bishops. The Church of England is declining faster than other denominations; if it carries on shrinking at the rate suggested by the latest British Social Attitudes survey, Anglicanism will disappear from Britain in 2033. One day the last native-born Christian will die and that will be that.

>>19921422
You can have your cake and eat it too. There's the Anglican Ordinariate which allows you to join communion with Rome while retaining your Anglican traditions

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_ordinariate

No guilt either, it's approved by the Bishop of Canterbury and he says good luck to you if you decide to join!

>In a letter to top Anglican leaders, Archbishop Williams said, “In the light of recent discussions with senior officials in the Vatican, I can say that this new possibility is in no sense at all intended to undermine existing relations between our two communions or to be an act of proselytism or aggression. It is described as simply a response to specific inquiries from certain Anglican groups and individuals wishing to find their future within the Roman Catholic Church.”

>“For those who wish to enter into full communion with the Roman Catholic Church in the near future, this announcement will clarify possible options, and we wish them God’s strength and guidance in their discernment,” the Anglican leader said.

>>19921491
I'm not British. Also is there any source that Anglicanism is declining faster than other denominations?

>>19921514
Yeah I discovered this the other day and am considering visiting my local Ordinariate service, but becoming a Catholic still feels funny. Like, it's not just the liturgy I like about Anglicanism/dislike about Catholicism.

But I've more reading to do about Catholicism before I truly support or condemn it. I like the idea of the continuing church which is bigger than the rest of Christianity put together and has an unbroken lineage thousands of years old, but I need to understand what new ideologies Catholics are expected to believe and what justification there is for them.

i pushed on a little with the tabernacle section of Exodus
>And thou shalt make holy garments for Aaron thy brother for glory and for beauty.
and all the following details about the elaborate dress of the priests i found interesting, not exactly like a protestant minister wearing a t-shirt and jeans
>And thou shalt burn the whole ram upon the altar: it is a burnt offering unto the Lord: it is a sweet savour, an offering made by fire unto the Lord
>Then shalt thou kill the ram, and take of his blood, and put it upon the tip of the right ear of Aaron, and upon the tip of the right ear of his sons, and upon the thumb of their right hand, and upon the great toe of their right foot, and sprinkle the blood upon the altar round about.
>And thou shalt take of the blood that is upon the altar, and of the anointing oil, and sprinkle it upon Aaron, and upon his garments, and upon his sons, and upon the garments of his sons with him: and he shall be hallowed, and his garments, and his sons, and his sons' garments with him.
honestly all the blood sacrifice stuff strikes me as a tad, or more accurately, overwhelming evil, if someone was doing this stuff in the woods nowadays while wearing strange robes it'd be considered satanic by most people
>The rich shall not give more, and the poor shall not give less than half a shekel, when they give an offering unto the Lord, to make an atonement for your souls.
and the whole bribing God bit is a little suspicious. it reminds me of the protestant opposition to the medieval catholic thing of paying to wipe your sin slate clean.
also, generally I find it funny imagining Moses getting it with all this tldr instruction by God and being like "yeah, sure, okay, I'll remember all that"

>>19911001

I cherish a memory shared with my father when I was a boy. We were flipping through the television, landing on EWTN. We saw the penguin program, the penguin leading a series of Hail Marys. We watched it for a minute or two. All of them, doing it, again and again. The Thing. One of us (I honestly forget which) eventually said "What a waste of life.", the other of us affirming the remark. The fact that we shared this observation in the plebeian act of flipping through television in no way undermines its deep truth. I thank god dad is an atheist.

>>19921769
>What a waste of life.
>*flips to next TV channel*
Ironic

>>19921753
>honestly all the blood sacrifice stuff strikes me as a tad, or more accurately, overwhelming evil, if someone was doing this stuff in the woods nowadays while wearing strange robes it'd be considered satanic by most people
Skip ahead for a moment and read Hebrews 10:1-18
>it reminds me of the protestant opposition to the medieval catholic thing of paying to wipe your sin slate clean.
Indulgences are not about forgiving sins but apply to sins already forgiven, but that's a whole other issue.

>>19921785

pre-empted that remark, you fool.

>>19921805
>he fact that we shared this observation in the plebeian act of flipping through television in no way undermines its deep truth.
It rather means you are both simply fools, saying foolish words while doing foolish things.

>>19911241
I hate this tendency within Catholic and EO circles to jerk them off because their doctrines are incomprehensible gibberish. Christ came into Galilee proclaiming that we must repent and believe the Gospel, not that we must repent and understand the systematic theology.

>>19921908
A person indeed does not have to understand all the complexities of Trinitarian dogma in order to be saved. But these dogmas are true. You are only able to condemn these things because you have personally not had to deal with the problems that necessitated these definitions. You have had no Arians, for example, to decimate your Churches and lead many into perdition. You are a selfish child sitting in the comfort built by the labor of righteous men of the past, and spitting on their memory whenever they are mentioned. You would be ashamed of yourself if you were not asleep in ignorance and pride.

>>19921926
Talk to your "Vicar of Christ" who tells kids that their atheist dads will go to heaven because he let them get baptized about keeping heretics out of the church.

I'm not the one asleep in ignorance and pride. I have not deluded myself into believing that me and my church are some beacons of righteousness in a fallen world. I know this because I believe the scriptures for what they say. Romans 3:11.

>>19921800
>Skip ahead for a moment
I can't! I have to read it front to back. And I wanna read the NT stuff in light of what preceded it.

>>19921946
If you concede that your Church does not bear the mark of Holiness then you concede that you do not have a church. That is the end of it, really.

>>19916203
This is something that I think about every now and then, and it makes me incredibly sad each time. I've tried on multiple occasions to help specific people I care about a lot onto the right path, but they're never really interested.

I don't think there's a cope for it. The reality is just that not everyone is going to be saved. The best you can do is to try to be a positive influence on the people you care about. The rest is up to God

>>19911001
any good books that cover the theologies of synergism vs. monergism

>>19922202
i liked DT Suzuki's take on it being the difference between a kitten being carried by the scruff and a baby monkey clinging to its mother's back.

>>19922254
Not the anon you're responding to, but I don't like analogies like this because they tend to paper over the real differences between these things. In one of the analogies there is an exercise of human will, in the other there isn't, but since they're both cute baby animals then it seems like it's the same.

>>19922294
>since they're both cute baby animals then it seems like it's the same.
The whole point of the analogy is to show the difference with a simple, memorable image. For the baby monkey will is essential, for the kitten it's not.

So I figured I'm these:
Synergistic
Conditional Immortality
Future-Historical

What church do I belong to?

>>19922828
Any Protestant Church since that's where you get to be your own authority and believe whatever you feel like.

>>19922849
well that sucks.

>>19918451
>>19918606
>>19918688
>>19919928
Can a blind man lead the blind? Therefore, is it right that I should hold my tongue when a blind man with a loud mouth shouts, "I am not blind, just listen to my voice!"? Rose was a fag, larper, and most of all a Schismo. I care little about your 'he wuzzzing' excuses. He is a faggot, and confounder.

>>19918468
true

All Latin-derived traditions, i.e. Protestants, must work towards unity. We must learn to put aside our differences, at least for a century, that our energies may be put to better use eradicating the Eastern Disease from our midst -- the Eastern Disease that seeks to eradicate all that is Western, including Western peoples most of all.
Just think how so many anti-Western, "Western" elites have Eastern European surnames even, coming as children of refugees with no intention of submitting to the West but rather harboring deep within their bosoms dark black perfidy as a way to stick it to their ancestral combatants.
We are under attack from without, and most of all from within. Let us remember what history unites us, and what history likewise shows to be our worst enemies of all. It's not hard to figure out that despite our differences, we are closer still than we will ever be to the Eastern Menace, being composed of Schismos, Mohameddans and all the most abominable spiritual licentiousness one could even come upon.

>>19922987
Sometimes I think there must be some kind of disease latent at the heart of all Western civilization if it all ended up bringing us to this.

>>19922999
Silence, Schismo.

>>19911646
I'm implying that God probably doesn't care too much about what mental understanding you hold of how the trinity functions but is far more interested in your stats on following his commands and teachings. I wouldn't be surprised if He considers the "filioque debate" to be autism. No matter what the actual truth is, whomever holds it but fails in desired behavior is like the Levite (who were orthodox Jews) in the Good Samaritan. Whomever has the wrong notion but behaves according to God's wishes is like the Samaritan (who were heretics).

>>19914736
>>19921046
Leviticus 18:22

>>19923002
Interesting. So the Easterners can't keep decent behavior at the Church of the tomb of Christ, to the point of hospitalizations? Why is anyone agreeing to allow them as anything more than individual tourists?

>>19911828
Mind filling in the gap?

Anyone know what animu books Dr. Falk has in the top right corner?

>>19923407
It says Gundam: The Origin

>>19923420
Thanks. Found them. Those always stuck out to me in his videos, considering the rest of the shelf is grammar books and Biblical studies.

>>19923302
I don't know but I'll probably look into it one of these days. But I'm sure it'll only further betray their perfidy and propensity for double-dealing under their false Christian pretenses.

>>19923461
Surely, though we Protestants are transcendent of either/both, not making idols of places to fight over to begin with. Leave the dead to bury their own dead, I suppose. If it's not old buildings it's toenail clippings, scraps of wood, statues, paintings, costumes, jewelry, etc. Satanic Babylonian pagans will be Satanic Babylonian pagans.

Oh, BTW, ἀδελφοί, the Greek word translated to "brothers" of Jesus, literally means "same womb", and is thus not possibly referring to "cousins" or previous children of Joseph.

COPE
O
P
E

>>19923644
>Nooo objects can't be holy or convey any spiritual affects on people, everything is just matter!

Luke 8:42b-44
As he went, the people pressed round him. And a woman who had had a flow of blood for twelve years and had spent all her living upon physicians[f] and could not be healed by any one, came up behind him, and touched the fringe of his garment; and immediately her flow of blood ceased. And Jesus said, “Who was it that touched me?” When all denied it, Peter said, “Master, the multitudes surround you and press upon you!” But Jesus said, “Some one touched me; for I perceive that power has gone forth from me.” And when the woman saw that she was not hidden, she came trembling, and falling down before him declared in the presence of all the people why she had touched him, and how she had been immediately healed. And he said to her, “Daughter, your faith has made you well; go in peace.”

>>19923743
t. doesn't know how words work

>>19911241
Some protestants might not know all that shit but at least they don't pretent pedophiles and their protectors are representing god

>>19923743
The meaning is not that narrow

>>19923800
>Strong's
Mary had sex after Jesus was born. You can stick to praying only to God now. Become Christian.

>>19923838
See >>19923835
You are confusing etymology with the semantic domain of the word. The word has a broader usage.

>>19923847
Yes, obviously it is used metaphorically to refer to such contexts as "fellow believers" but the Biblical context for Jesus' brothers was clearly referring to familial siblings.

>>19923867
It's can also just mean relatives. You have to interpret it more broadly for it to even mean what you say it means because it would have to mean half-brothers, since Joseph was not Jesus's biological father.

>>19923875
Nah, no one says "half brother" in daily reference. My wife calls her half brother her brother. It requires special technical circumstances for it to be specified, and to the average person around Jesus' area he was Joseph's son as far as anyone knew.

>>19923838
That belief has no basis in the original Christian Church (Catholic and Orthodox, combined). Your 1500s fanfiction doesn't count.

>>19923838
I'm no theologist but in John, Jesus instructs one of his disciples (not brethren) to take care of his mother. There is no mention of all the brothers of Jesus being slaughtered. So why did Jesus instruct a disciple to take his mother home instead of one of his actual brothers? This part would make no sense.

>>19923909
>That belief has no basis in the original Christian Church
This is what people tried to tell "saint" Jerome but he Satanically power played them and got them excommed.

>>19923930
Martin Luther, John Calvin, Henry VIII, and King James are all burning in hell.

>>19923928
He probably did that as much for John as her, but also knew John would cherish her and love hearing her stories about Him. It was likely part of the plan for deepening John's understanding of Him for writing such a unique, essential gospel. He also obviously intended James and Jude to be traveling church planters right away.

>>19923941
It makes no sense to send your widowed mother to live with a disciple if you have actual brothers who can fulfill their duties. I don't know the proper Jewish customs but I am sure this would make no sense unless one had no siblings.

>>19923953
With God it's more of a matter of purpose than duty. He had specific reasons due to specific qualities for choosing whom He did for what. I realize this kind of thinking is difficult for the crypto atheist mind to grok.

>>19923936
Imagine thinking (You) know who is and isn't where in the afterlife.

I pooped in my bible a little bit, not sur what to do

>>19921814

The nuns are wasting their lives. Grow up.

>>19923976
Literally the reason why he sent Mary with his disciple was to fulfill the fifth commandment.

>>19924348
>it says so in muh commentary
He obviously had much deeper intentions behind it. He seemed to have a close friend personal relationship with John and obviously from John's writings he had a much deeper metaphysical understanding of who Christ is, and in fact who the LORD God Almighty is. Jesus obviously knew John would be writing the most profound of the gospels and that He would be giving him His final Revelation to close out the entire Scriptural canon forever. What better way to increase John's intimacy of knowledge and relationship than to have him go live with abs care for the woman who gave birth to Him on earth and personally witnessed His entire life from infant to Crucifixion? Christ knew that that gospel and that Revelation would be absolutely crucial expressions for the benefit of all humanity for all time, and He knew how best to prepare John for their writing.

>>19911160
Wrong, even by verses from the NT and the fact that the Christ constantly quoted from the OT. By the law is the knowledge of sin (Romans 3:20), and the law is contained in the OT. Before someone says "the law doesn't matter", Christ said "go, and sin no more". And before someone says "the law is only the two commandments Christ mentioned in Mt 22" those are the heart of the law yes, but they're not the whole of the law: the word "love" especially today has taken on a twisted definition, i.e. "love" today is almost defined as blind tolerance to evil (e.g. sexual sins like adultery and fornication) when in reality that is not loving at all. Tolerating someone living in sin and not warning them to repent is rather hateful or at least ambivalent, especially if you ever claim to love them. So to understand the heart of the law and how to love someone (including how to love God), we have to know what is love {baby don't hurt me} and you have to read and study the OT as well as the NT.
We also have Matthew 5:17 if the above isn't reason enough not to disregard God's law or the prophets and remember that the Christ never sinned (1 John 3:5, 1 Peter 2:22) and he commanded people not to sin like the adulteress in John 8:11.

>>19911177
Why do you have an idol on your desk?

>>19911241
Trinity is a catholic doctrine that came from babylon.
Indulgences aren't in the bible either, neither is purgatory or infant baptism (babies can't repent or believe).

>>19911655
Ironic considering 16 Christians are martyred every day for their faith according to opendoorsusa.
I can only imagine the mass media outrage if it were talmudists and kabbalists.

>>19911714
>As the saints are righteous we ask the saints for their prayers
Christ said to pray to our Father in heaven during the sermon on the mount.
>We are not worshiping them or putting them before Christ.
You literally are when you put the words of your church's leaders over those of Christ himself.

>>19911772
God's Word > traditions
The Koran is not God's Word.

>>19913965
Just keep in mind apocrypha isn't inspired, it was initially included for history purposes but were removed because it can be misleading to people who don't understand that (or why it isn't considered inspired).

>>19914518
Gnosticism is a heresy. God is good and God never changes.

>>19915725
NKJV = Not the King James Version

>>19915935
There are still miracles, but many people scoff when they see real miracles like the Pharisees did in Matthew 12.
There are also wolves in sheep's clothing putting on shows to satiate their love of money that Christ finds more abominable than you ever could.

>>19915970
The Bible.

>>19916203
Hell is not eternal life in suffering, it's eternal separation from God through destruction of body and soul (Matthew 10:28). The wages of sin being death is contrasted against the promise of eternal life through Christ in Romans 6:23. Nowhere do we see hell being defined as eternal life even if the flames or smoke is everlasting. I refuse to believe God would be so unjust and wicked as to eternally torture and torment someone who died in sin for a finite life, it's not even logical and it's not what our court systems do either and we are made in the image of God. The worst someone gets under a humane society is either a quick and painless death penalty or a lifetime prison sentence (and life in prison is better than death, even murderers can find Christ in prison and repent, but it won't free them from their sentence nor should it).
As for your family members, we see that all of Noah's family was saved on the Ark, but Noah shared God's warning of the flood to come with them. There's also Lot's family leaving Sodom, but Lot's wife looked back. And "remember Lot's wife" Luke 17:32. The Great Flood and the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah are two physical real-world warnings of God's judgement to come and there is evidence for the great flood all over the earth and the cities of the plains have been found if you want to research either. There are a lot of apologetic videos and articles and arguments about Noah's flood and even a museum you could visit.

>>19916880
Matthew 23:9

>>19919871
The church of Christ is not a building. Seek God, not organized religion. If you find an organized religion or church that obeys all of God's commands, good but I don't think there are many left in these last days and there's only one way you can verify their teachings for yourself, that is read God's Word.

>>19921769
Matthew 6:7
7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.

The Alter Hebrew Bible is a BIG set. 9.5 inches tall, 6.5 inches in length, and combined all three volumes are about 6.25 inches in width. Unsurprisingly, any edition you buy now should not have the Joshua 3:15 issue. Mine doesn't have the issue.

>>19924548
>Mine doesn't have the issue
It still has the being fake and gay issue though

>>19924528
>Indulgences aren't in the bible either, neither is purgatory or infant baptism
Who cares? Catholics compiled the bible, and they compiled church tradition. Why draw a line between the two? Why should one be infallible and not the other?

>>19924629
>maybe if we claim that Catholics compiled the bible enough it will come true

>>19924619
It's not based on the TR, so no.

>>19924535
>Hell is not eternal life in suffering, it's eternal separation from God through destruction of body and soul (Matthew 10:28).
This is actually a complicated question and a lot comes down to translation. Eg, do you translate Gehenna as hell? What about Hades?

It does seem that suffering is involved though. Matthew 24:41 indicates it's eternal fire which is unlikely to be a comfy campfire. 2 Thessalonians 1:6–9 says it's everlasting destruction. Revelation 20:15 describes the fire as causing eternal torment.

>I refuse to believe God would be so unjust and wicked as to eternally torture and torment someone who died in sin for a finite life
Your refusal to believe is irrelevant.

>>19924768
>2 Thessalonians 1:6–9 says it's everlasting destruction
How many times can something be destroyed? Destruction of body and soul is an everlasting separation from God.

>Matthew 24:41 indicates it's eternal fire
>Revelation 20:15 describes the fire as causing eternal torment.
Are you sure about those chapter and verse numbers?

Revelation 20:14 calls the lake of fire the second death. How many times can something that is alive die?

>Your refusal to believe is irrelevant.
God is good and holy and just and righteous.

>>19924981
You're right, it doesn't say torment, I got that from an evangelical fundie site kek

>>19924768
>eternal fire
The fire itself is permanent but this doesn't automatically mean anything put into it is.

>>19923436
>popular Christian Egyptologist is also a weeb
Based

>>19925431
>popular Christian Egyptologist is also a weeb
>Based

>>19925572
Reads Gundam in the original Japanese and proclaims the Exodus and Moses as historical. I'm thinking he's based.

>>19926140
new

>>19926144
That one looks absolutely pozzed. Pass.

>>19926274
>the Bible is pozzed
Begone Satan

>>19926304
>that thread is the bible

i finally got through the OT for the first time, the prophetic books filtered me pretty hard bros…

>>19926649
What about those filtered you?