/lit/ - Literature

>>1981536
Jon isn't gone. You weren't paying attention to the prelude. Jon is a warg and has the innate ability to take over the bodies of animals and potentially even people. He will jump into someone or something else and his story will continue. That much is obvious.

Pay attention.

Did you read the same book I did? Bran was one of the bright spots there.

Oh wait, you probably missed him whispering Theon's name in the trees and him meeting Children for the first time. He's becoming a deity ffs!

Ugh, and the book kept getting better towards the end. Especially the final Jon chapter.

DwD is underrated. Mainly because morons have shit attention spans. It's a great book with some weak points fucking Dany man and some absolutely fantastic POVs dat Theon, dem Frey pies.

Finished this morning. I think your relief is misplaced, main characters don't die that easily.

Tyrion really annoyed me in this book, but Theon's chapters were...entertaining.

>>1981598

Fuck you and your spoilers.

>>1981600
>Tyrion really annoyed me in this book

He went through a rough patch. At the end of DwD he is pretty much back to his own self. I expect great things of him in WoW.

>>1981600
Honestly, Tyrion would have annoyed me if Daenerys wasn't absorbing all my hatred.

I can't believe some people believe Tyrion is a Targaryen. This isn't how Martin writes.

Tyrion has always been an annoying little shit.

Who is the real Ghost of Winterfell?

Jon will come back as Ghost.

I should have realized he'd be removed as soon as they mentioned he was Wall Commanded 999

I'm really hoping the Stannis situation isn't true though.

>>1981635
>I'm really hoping the Stannis situation isn't true though.

It isn't. Atleast the letter isn't the whole story.

>>1981635
Its true. Sad I know. But evil wins.

Is it true they're not casting Mark Strong as Stannis in season 2? I heard they were getting Gerard Butler and oh god I don't think I can take that.

Also Did anyone else feel bad for Kevan? Shit way to go. I enjoyed Cersei getting some Karma though, dat walk chapter.

As usual the Dany chapters were marred with just how bad she is, Selmy was awesome though.

>>1981640

I basically forsee EVERYONE being killed by the time the book ends, maybe Bran lives the same manner of life as his uncle (great uncle?) but I see the walkers just plowing through Westeros and Dany being too thick to effectively get back on the proverbial horse and sort her shit.

Only one Jaime chapter, lame.

If I had to rate the books though:

Storm of Swords > Clash of Kings > Dance With Dragons > Game of Thrones > Feast For Crows.

>>1981645

Stephen Dillane is Stannis Baratheon

>>1981632
My money's on Blackfish. Though it's strange how the chapter names should refer to the pov character and the initial thought is to think of whoever the killer is as "the ghost". It might just mean Theon's way of walking around Winterfell unseen but some of the more crack theories suggest he's losing it and he talked to himself in the yard (and killed the Walder).
>Is it true they're not casting Mark Strong as Stannis in season 2?
Yeah Stannis is played by the dude who was Jefferson in John Adams. The deal with Kevan is pretty typical Martin, he tricks the reader into believing the realm isn't in such bad hands now and then undoes it all. I really liked his character development too, he wasn't a thoughtless subordinate even if his immense respect for Tywin made it seem that way. The smackdown he lays on Cersei was one of the highlights of AFfC.

>>1981655

That's good, he's got the talent and the face for it; and he can really pull off the unpleasant charisma of a lobster.

>>1981645
>Gerard Butler
I doubt that'll happen, unless they decide they want to pay for him for multiple seasons. Sean Bean was Eddard because he dies in the first season. Everyone else they've been picking up have been either stage or minor TV actors.

>>1981632
The killer? It's confirmed the spearwives killed everyone but Little Walder.
For him I peg Big Walder. No motive that I can think of, but http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/53845-adwd-spoilers-winterfell-murder-mysteries/page__st_
_160__p__2600630#entry2600630
Good thread there, all around.

worst book to date. i thought ffc was a bunch of filler crap with irritating characters... hah, dwd made it actually seem decent.

>>1981664

Look fellas it's a mongoloid. Wonder how it figured out how to turn the PC on.

>>1981659

Is Blackfish even relevant to the story anymore? He basically fucked off into a river, there's no way he's skulking around Winterfell killing people. I figure he'll basically show up as part of some other lord's host at the most.

No way to tell though.

>>1981670

Waiting six years for this crap would put me in heavy denial as well.

>>1981536

He's not dead, he can skinchange.

He'll go into Ghost and marysue the next two books.

>>1981677

I didn't wait six years. Also AFFC is possibly the best book in the series.

>>1981664
The second half of DWD was better than all of FFC and the first half of DWD combined.

>>1981680

Not the dope you're replying to but how do you see Feast for Crows as the best book in the series?

>mfw the Sam chapters.

I liked it, but the cliffhangers made me angry because now I have to wait a million fucking years to find out what happened.

Also, Dany is horrible. And not enough Jaime and Arya.

>>1981675
He still has many, many possibilities.
It's likely he could head to the Vale, to the North (maybe even the Wall if he was misdirecting Jaime), or somewhere else in the Riverlands (like BwB). Hell, he might even have made off with Jeyne Westerling.
Of course, we'll probably never have resolution. Woo.

>>1981675
If GRRM doesn't want to use a character anymore he'll just kill them. He's a guy with immense hatred for the Boltons and Freys and we were told in this book that he's a stubborn guy who's not gonna get tired of fighting and go farm potatoes. The actual issue with the theory is whether it's possible to get from Riverrun to Winterfell in that time.

Top Tier
>Theon Greyjoy
>Victarion Greyjoy
>Bran Stark

Great Tier
>Ser Davos Seaworth
>Ser Barristan Selmy
>Melisandre

Surprisingly Awesome Tier
>Jon Connington
>Varamyr Sixskins
>Ser Kevan Lannister

Good Tier
>Jon Snow
>Arya Stark
>Ser Jamie Lannister
>Asha Greyjoy
>Quentyn Martell

Meh Tier
>Cersei Lannister
>Aero Hotah

Shit Tier
>Tyrion Lannister
>Daeneyrs Targaryen

It's strange.

The Tyrion chapters were the worst in the book, I was honestly struggling with myself to get through them; Penny needs to die off immediately, Jorah was pretty limpwristed too. The Quentyn chapters were hilarious And then he realized he was on fire, and his first thought was OH.

>mfw everytime someone gets a gentle tap they spit up teeth.

>>1981687
I read a really good post this morning that said the quality of Martin's writing is the same, but the cliffhanger endings in Feast and Dance bring it down. Obviously the original sounded better, sorry. But that's my sentiment as well.

>>1981691

>Bran and Theon over Barristan and Jon Connington

>>1981703
Theon's over everyone.

>Brienne and Jaime hardly even getting a mention.

GODDAMN IT I'M NOT WAITING SIX YEARS FOR THIS.

>>1981684

Introduced some of the best POVs in the series (Cersei, Victarion, Damphair, Brienne)

Didn't have Tyrion or Daenerys

Sansa chapters got better than ever before

Most of the book dominated by god tier POVs (Jaime and Cersei)

Don't get me wrong, I HATE Samwell as a character (he should've died a billino times already but nope) yet even he gets more tolerable in AFFC simply because he goes to a very interesting place

Arya chapters are as good as they've ever been

Dorne chapters are awesome

Pros of ADWD
-Theon's entire arch, his fall from the top and his struggle to shred Reek and find Theon hiding somewhere down there deep down.
-Mance "Solid Snake" Rayder.
-Victarion "I will slap your cunt with my fire arm" Greyjoy
-Wyman "Would you like Frey's with that?" Manderly.
-One Targaryen can actually get shit done.

Cons
-Actually have to read Reek chapters ;_;
-Words are wind.
-As above, far too many repeated phrases. (grease ran down his/her chin, where do whores go, the biting of one's tongue, etc.)
-Tyrion Lannister.
-Daenerys Tagaryen.
-Too much fucking Essos.
-More unfinished stories than Feast had.

>>1981702

How many were there?

Yunkai'i throwing corpses into Mereen when Selmy is about to fuck shit up and send out a rescue mission
Dany found with a dragon by a khalasar
Jon killed[/spoiled]
Kevan Lannister killed, leaving King's Landing in imminent AW SHIT SON

At least, right? That is too many motherfucking cliffhangers.

>>1981702
Yeah he doesn't just doesn't adhere to the usual RESOLUTION WITH SOMETHING TO LOOK FORWARD TO with sequels but leaves everything in the air by throwing the last few chapters to the next book. I'm not even mad about Jon but the Winterfell battle would've really belonged in this book. And I must truly wonder what the fuck exactly Penny's purpose is.

Goddamn it Varys you little bald faggot, we were finally going to get some shit done and you had to go and shoot the only nigger who could do it with a crossbow.

Fuck you you little bald eunuch faggot.

Entire next book needs to just be about Victarion.

>>1981716
Not only those, but the cliffhangers at the end of most chapters.

>>1981721

Yeah but Kevan was going to get shit done for Lannisters, and Lannisters have yet to be shit on as much as Starks.

>>1981723
>REAVAN
>BED-WARMER FUCKAN
>BITCH CHOKAN
>SACRAFICAN
>DRAGON TAMEAN

VICTARION GREYJOY GENERAL UP IN THIS PIECE!

>>1981728

Lannisters have been shat on plenty, and most of them are pretty badass, just because Cersei is a total cunt doesn't mean they're all going to fuck up Westeros.

Bitter nation is bitter. Tywin would have been a better king than anyone else in the book.

i don't get why everyone loves victarion. he just seemed like some angry guy (with, albeit, a badass arm). and I usually like barbarian types.

>>1981721
Kevan was the only competent man in King's Landing, and he may have pulled the place out of the shit Cersei threw it in. That's a bad thing. What Cersei keeps doing is entertaining.

>>1981738

Jaime can and should avoid being fucked up further, but Cersei needs more terrible in her life, I feel.

>>1981739
Mostly I like him because he got shit done. Same reason I like Griff/YG.

>>1981739

Because his culture is much more interesting than anything else the book has to offer, plus he's as you said an angry guy with a badass arm.

His chapters are also about him actually accomplishing stuff instead of standing around being full of self doubt and crying. I cannot wait for him to land and destroy the Yukai.

>>1981739
Because the book was mostly children, a fucking midget, some queen sucking a sellswords cock, and one-off chapter after one-off chapters about people and places we don't care much about, always followed by cliffhangers. Victarion was the most efficient character in the book. He's setting out what he began in Feast and isn't bullshitting like everyone else. He's on his fucking way to Dany, but unlike Tyrion his story is being kept brief and is entertaining as all hell.

>>1981746

And that is why there need to be more (non-leveling-up) Arya and Jaime chapters.

>motherfuckers who get shit done

>>1981739
I think the ironborn are a bunch of fags but there's just a certain humor to his chapters, cursing monkeys and throwing male whores into the sea in chains.

So uh, Darrio is probably one of the corpses launched by Catapult yeah?

>Mfw Strong Belwas lived.

>>1981751
>>1981750
These really. He's been getting the most shit done in Dance in such little time, and he's just a pure badass. He doesn't fear much, but isn't just a raving barbarian-type. Why, in fact he's quite holy, earning himself the favor of two Gods.

>>1981758

If he dies we will be treated to a whole chapter if not two of Dany crying about it, and all of her subsequent chapters will contain the phrase "where do sellswords go"

Is that what you really want?

For some reason I just picture Victarion doing some boarding and laughing while he swings his axe around lopping heads off and splitting skulls. Like he's the Heavy of ASoIaF or some shit.

>>1981751
>Implying Jon Snow isn't the most efficient character in the book
>Implying anything matters if the Others take over

>>1981767

>isn't just a raving barbarian-type

hmm maybe that's why I don't care about him.

>>1981758
Personally I hope he's turned on her, but dead works too. She'll bitch the whole book anyway.
Was I the only one who loved that they returned Hizdahrs hostages alive and none of Dany's?

>>1981774
>Implying Victarion isn't Azor Ahai reborn and won't smite the others with his flaming arm of death.

>>1981772

Anything that makes Dany more miserable I encourage, I'm seriously hoping the series ends with her in ruins/ dragon food. Instead of her becoming Queen.

>>1981788
I hope all the prophecies are massive red herrings. There are lots of fairy tales in their world, why should this one matter just because its believers dabble in clairvoyance?

>>1981788

You don't really believe this.

>>1981788

He's not.

GRRM is really tongue in cheek in response to fans trying to make sense of his prophecies. Basically if it was even the tiniest bit true he'd just kill Victarion off to piss us all off.

And I would laugh.

>>1981794

All of Melisandre's have come true so far, barring Stannis being Azor Ahai, so. nope.

>>1981788
>implying Victarion cares about anything besides himself and spiting Euron

>>1981794
I'm thinking it's not a red herring, but rather, someone is going to use the fairy tale to their advantage to rally troops or something... which, I guess fulfills it.
Or, GRRM's had enough subversion and decided fuck it, prophecies are always true.

>>1981801
Yeah but what I mean is that their abilities might be completely irrelevant to the validity of their religion and it just might be something they've tacked on to the practice. After all, the forest children surely are just as magical, have they heard of Azor Ahai? How about the Faceless Men? I guess I just feel a savior prophecy, even if it turns out to be just one referred to by many names, and guessing which of our favorite characters it is makes the story take a turn for the stupid.

Tyrion improved during DwD. He started drunk and hung over, wallowing in self-pity, and ended up riding a pig and pimping himself and his companions at the slave auction. All the while throwing witty one-liners. He also managed to persuade Aegon to beeline to Westeros.

WHAT MORE CAN YOU ASK?

My thoughts of DwD:

Pros:

-The later half of the book, where shit actually happens.
-All Selmy chapters.
-All Theon chapters.
-Basically everyone had good chapters except for Dany and Tyrion.
-It wasn't Feast for Crows and some shit actually happened.
-Jon Snow got stabbed by his pals.

CONS:

-Tyrion and Danerys chapters were boring.
-Brienne and Jaime were shoehorned in to create another cliff hanger for no good reason.
-Nothing from Feast for Crows was answered
-Zombie Gregor was only put in at the very end, and Cersei's chapters may as well have been in the next book.
-Pycelle was killed, because fuck Varys.

Good book, but way behind Storm of Swords Clash Game of Thrones and dare I say Feast for Crows.

>>1981822

Oh, I see what you're saying. In that case I agree, but the non-religion-influenced prophecy might be as simple as "some guy with a red sword is going to fuck up the Others" and they're just calling it Azor Ahai or whatever. Regardless, I don't think GRRM would have put in Melisandre looking for Azor Ahai and seeing only snow for no reason at all. Dany and Stannis are already red herrings for that.

So fellas, how long will GRRM take to write winds of winter? 6 years like DoD? or god forbid 10

>>1981845

>mfw I'm 40 by the time the next book comes out.

10 years, calling it now.

>>1981828

>Tyrion
>witty

Pick one.

>>1981831
>CON
>Pycelle was killed
pick one, it was about time we got rid of this weasel

>>1981845
According to GRRM in a recent Google Books Q&A session, he has 6 years to write 2 books.

>>1981853

I guess I should elaborate, I wanted him to suffer a little more before he was killed. His death was just kind of "Oh and by the way Pycelle died too." I would have liked it to be a grander affair, because he deserved real punishment.

>>1981845

He will die of too much pizza and football and no one will get any closure

>>1981852
>Trying to be witty and failing.

>>1981859
There's no way in hell the series is finished in two books though. In the end of Winds Dany will still be over in Essos dreaming of Dothraki dicks this time.

Victarion is great but because like da Griffon he gets shit done, which no-one else in Dance seemed keen on (herp derp lets have a boring time not getting to our destination).

Sadly, like the horn supposed to bring down the Wall I'm not too sure I buy Victarion's dragon controlling horn either.

>>1981875
Or hopefully, she's dead while Aegon mops up Westeros. Problem?

>>1981875

She's going to die, she doesn't have the dragons anymore. She's basically useless now, unless they Deux Ex back to her.

>>1981880
>not too sure I buy Victarion's dragon controlling horn either
The joke is you have to have the blood of the dragon to not die to blowing it.

>>1981881
No problems here.

>>1981885

She has one out of three, and it's the biggest one.

>>1981875
I thought it was official he'd upped it to eight books?

>>1981898

Source?

guys, let me just quickly ask... Benjen Stark. Is he dead or is he coldhands (ranger that lead bran to the three eyed crow)? i think hes going to make some appearance soon. also, where the fuck is Rickon and that wildling bitch? there was some clue given when lord onion knight/ sumugler/ kings hand bloke was asked to find him, but i didnt catch it.... someone fill me in please.

>>1981885

As if they won't remember their precious Mummy.

>>1981907

>>1981907
Nothing is known of Benjen though he's a very very obvious candidate for Coldhands. Rickon and Osha are in Skagos. I think the cannibalism over there was talked about in a Sam chapter in AFfC.

>>1981907
Nobody knows what happened to Benjen, he may or may not be Coldhands.
Rickon and Osha are in Skagos, land of unicorns and cannibals.

>>1981885

Why would you want Dany to die right now? If she does, then GRRM has trolled us reading hundreds of pages for practically nothing.

No, I say Dany is perfect villain material. She has an enormous sense of entitlement, she's delusional, she's impulsive and most of all, paradoxically the more impulsive and worse she acts, the better the results!

Just think about it. Every time Dany plots something and tries to do the right thing, everything goes to shit (Meereen). Whenever she lets IAMTHEDRAGON loose, shit gets accomplished (funeral pyre and the dragon eggs, the Unsullied).

She's just so fucking perfect as a self entitled, creepy, crazy dragon goddess villain who is convinced she's the Mother and everyone who denies her must die.

Really all it takes is a tiny push from GRRM to make her spiral into Targaryen madness. She'll be roasting men in their armor in no time!

>mfw the Mormonts are fucking everywhere.

Seriously, one was the commander of the Wall, one is a she-bear helping Stannis, and Jorah is hanging around with Tyrion. They're goddamn everywhere.

>>1981930

When you put it like that I endorse it.

But I have the creeping suspicion that GRRM is just going to make her Queen heroine and la la she brings peace to Westeros and everyone is happy LOVE DANY PLEASE YOU GUYS.

So, who are all the possible Azor Ahais? We've got Stannis, who is pretty much not Azor Ahai... Dany, or at least some people think it... Victarion and his manly fist? Who else?

>>1981941

Jon is the most obvious besides Dany based on prophecies and how much gurm loves him.

>>1981926
And didn't the mother of the she-bear go off into the swamps to look for the bogmen? I'm pretty they're up to some serious shit. We're going to have to see Howland Reed at some point.

>>1981941
Gregor Clegane

Red star bleeds = Death of Oberyn Martell
Darkness gathers, born out of salt and smoke = weird necromancy shit

>>1981963

Aw, shit, I didn't even think of that...

And Jon? Seriously? Dear Lord, no. Don't give more power to him...

>>1981941
Jon.

"When the red star bleeds and the darkness gathers, Azor Ahai shall be born again amidst smoke and salt to wake dragons out of stone."


Smoke rose from his wounds, Bowen Marsh had tears in his eyes while stabbing him (salt), and Ser Patrek's sigil was a star, all bloody from Wun Wun's attack.

The only part of the prophecy that hadn't come true yet was the waking dragons out of stone part.

>>1981975

Yep.

Red star bleeds = The guy the giant was tearing apart had a star sigil.
Darkness gathers, born out of salt and smoke = It was dark I think, and also the Others or whatever, and his wounds were smoking and Bowen Marsh was crying.

Furthermore it's extremely likely that he is Rhaegar and Lyanna's son, which would make him one of the heads of the dragon, and Melisandre can revive him: hence, reborn. Plus there was something else about her "seeing only snow" in a fire, and obviously the literal meaning is precipitation, but it'd be GRRMy to use that.

>>1981958
I think Howland Reed will play a big role in revealing Jon's true parentage. He was the only one besides Ned that survived at the Tower of Joy and knows anything of the events there.

>>1981981
The stone refers to a cold dead stiff body. When when mel raises him the prophecy will come true.

so what outcomes are we hoping for then? personally i say fuck everyone westeros, bring in danny with the dragons and fry everyone. [spoilers]i dont for a second think thats going to happen tbh, i dont think shes even going to make it to westeros[/spoilers] Not that it matters anyway because the nights watch pretty much has to be destroyed now. i mean, jons seemed to be the only one keeping peace at the wall, now hes dead/dying/not in commmand anymore, remaining nights watch are going try to erradicate wildlings south of the wall, they are outnumbered ridiculously and will get the shit kicked out of them, causing the end of the wall, then the white walkers are going to break through and destroy the world.

>>1981988
In her POV she says she sees Snow. To Jon she says snow.

>>1981999
Assuming he's a Targaryen, anyway.

>>1982008

Oh wow, that's even more obvious than I had thought. Well then.

>>1982012

Has there actually been anything solid to back this up, or is it more supposition and circumstantial stuff?

>>1981981
>>1981988

Not sure if I'm buying the whole "salt is Bowen's tears" thing. Vistarion is Azor Ahais: he's gonna bleed his big red star of a black wizard, his burned hard is smoking and salt duh he's ironborn.

You can do this for almost anyone: Victarion is

>>1982020

Nothing outright, but I sure as hell won't be surprised if it happens. Interestingly, it's implied much more heavily in the HBO version.

>>1982028

>salt duh he's ironborn.

And Jon was born on Dragonstone.

Victarion is a red herring.

>>1982030
>Interestingly, it's implied much more heavily in the HBO version.
How come? As I recall they barely mentioned Lyanna and spoke nothing about Rhaegar.

>>1982035
>Jon was born on Dragonstone.

>>1982038

The way Ned talked about it, iirc, was much more "this is not my actual child." I have no idea of actual quotes, but it raised my eyebrows when I watched it.

>>1982043
He's supposed to be handsome but I'm glad they cast this creature as him because it just makes him that much more hatable.

>>1982045
Me too, but only because I've already read the books and knew about the theory. All non-book readers didn't see anything odd.

>>1982054
*all non-book readers I know personally
Sorry 'bout that.

>>1982054

That makes sense, now that I think about it, yeah.

Not related but I hope Aegon doesn't get a bitch death as a result of not being an obvious prophecy shoe-in.

>>1982062
His situation reminds me of Catelyn/Robb.
So chances are good for a bitch death.

>>1982020
Nobody says outright "jon is lyanna/rhaegars baby" but its heavily implied and all the rhaegar and lyanna flashbacks would make zero sense if jon weren't there son. specifically lyanna lying on a "bed of blood"(birthing bed) and saying "promise me ned" which we can safely assume that she wanted ned to raise jon like his own son.

>>1982043
God damn. Why did they make Joff so ugly?

His looks were pretty much his one good trait. After she gets to know him, it's the only honest thing Sansa can think of to say about him without insulting him. It was why Sansa, with her head full of stories, had trouble thinking of him as bad.

>>1982020
I'm shocked no one has linked this yet.
http://www.towerofthehand.com/essays/chrisholden/jon_snows_parents.html

>>1982062
Aegons just about guaranteed to get a death similar to Robb. He's too good of a character and was introduced too late in the series. GRRM never lets the good guys win.

>>1982078
Joff from the TV show looks like someone stuck his head in a vice. it has a squarish, small shape. I never imagined him looking like that. Cercei and jaimie on the other hand look just like how I imagine them.

>>1982020
In DWD, Bran, while looking through the eyes of Winterfell's heart tree, witnesses his father praying that Jon and Robb should grow up "as brothers," implying that they're not actually brothers.

No one survived the events at the Tower of Joy besides Eddard and Howland Reed, and Eddard doesn't even remember how Lyanna died (Howland tells him she died in his arms) - only that he promised her something that he never tells us.

Furthermore, Lyanna was held by Rhaegar for a good amount of time before her rescue, and no one but the Kingsguard (and Rhaegar) saw her during that time, all of whom died when Eddard, Howland and others burst in. Why would Rhaegar use three Kingsguard to guard Lyanna if she wasn't carrying his child? Also, from what we know of Rhaegar, does abducting a woman sound like something he'd normally do out of the blue just to spark a war?

>>1982080
Aegon looks like he'll hardly shape up to be a good guy though. Better than Joffrey and Cersei for sure but fickle and quick to anger.

>>1982082
Tyrion doesn't look much like Tyrion either, but hiring an actual dwarf was probably as far as they dared go, without hiring an ugly dwarf.

I wonder what they'll substitute for the loss of his nose, or whether they'll just skip over the disfiguration entirely.

Characters I have really liked, in order of me deciding I really liked them:

Ned
Renly
Catelyn
Robb
Oberyn Martell
Jon S.

Obviously there have been others, but jesus christ
those others better not bite it next book that's all I'm saying.

>>1982083
They're half-brothers.

>>1982087
Aegon has a sense of justice though. And being raised by jon connington did wonders. Dany was pretty much raised by viserys, who was insane(she was probably insane in the first place, got some that targ insanity, but viserys made her even crazier). Aegon is just too much of a perfect king, and I think he'll be killed off.

>>1982083

Also in one of Selmy's chapters he says Rhaegar was in love with Lyanna, I believe.

>>1982092
I've wondered that too. I'm afraid they'll half-ass it like they did Sandor.

>>1982094
They're technically cousins.
>>1982092
They could at least have had the actor wear colored contacts. Tyrions supposed to have one green eye and one black eye.

You know, I love the way martin plays is characters. I liked Jon for the uncommon hoor and the "underdog" feel he had being the last elder son of Stark blood, but it didn't matter, he died. It reminds me of real life, besides Daenerys (sp?). She seems to get a reprieve every single time she errs.

One thing I want to ask you, though, is about the Dornishmen. Do you think of them as closer to spaniards or turks? It describes them as of three peoples, salt-sprayed, desert and something else I don't know, as well as swarthy and dark-haired. I like to think a mixture of the two.

>>1982100

Jon doesn't look like he's described in the books either. He and Tyrion and Joffrey were the only ones that stood out to me, although Cat seems a little old.

>>1982099
The hounds burns are describe as horrifying but in the show they half assed that. Its barely even noticable. And the hound is supposed to have black hair, and pale blue eyes. How hard is it to get the goddamn actors to use colored contacts and hair dye?

Shit, that fatass illyrio didn't even bother using hair dye to make his hair blond.

>>1982100
>cousins
Assuming R+L, yeah. But going by Ned's cover story, they're half-brothers. So growing up "as brothers" works either way.

>>1982107
oh jesus I am drunker than I thought, sorry guys. *his, *honor

>>1982107
I think the dornishmen are modeled after real life spain or perhaps italy. There's swarthy looking mofos and then there's blond hair blues eyes dornish and everything in between.

>>1982108
Jon would look fine if he had used colored contacts.

>>1982094
Half-brothers are still brothers. It seems like there was a bit more to that scene than just repeating shit we already know, like the other scene Bran sees.

It's speculated that the boy and girl he sees sword fighting are Lyanna and Benjen. This sheds light on Lyanna's skill at arms (and we're told she was a great rider as well), so she could have very well been the Knight of the Laughing Tree, and this means Howland Reed could have very well been in her debt.

>>1982109
The burns bother me much more. My mother was shocked when Littlefinger told Sansa how the Hound was burned. She hadn't even noticed.

>>1982122
Doesn't look all that unnoticeable to me.

>>1982119

I think the Starkiest Starks, including Jon, are all described as looking pretty much like Sean Bean does (straight medium-brown hair and gray, I think, eyes). I don't care a whole lot, really, but I did notice.

>>1982122
Well you should read the book, sansa can't even look the hound in the face because the burns are so bad. It's described that half his face is melted off.

>>1982100
>They could at least have had the actor wear colored contacts.

That's such an aspie miniscule detail to complain about.

>>1982120
It's a very different situation. Jon's mother is presumably lower born, and Lady Catelyn isn't happy with that. Other bastards aren't treated near as well as Jon was, so praying for them to be like blood brothers makes sense to me.
While this whole thing imo seems to point to R+L, it could be argued either way.

>>1982125
Agreed they're all supposed to look more or less like sean bean or vigo mortenson. I think its significant that Jon and Arya are the only living starks that have the traditional stark look.

>>1982136
If interpreted that way, it's still repeating shit we already know and have known since GoT.

The visions Bran had that were described had to have some significance.

>>1982128
Uh, what? Why are you telling this to me? I said my mother didn't notice it, not that I didn't know how bad they were supposed to be...

I'm no swordsman but why not just put a blade on the end of Jaime's stump?

>>1982142
Trying to beat sense into the Jon Targaryen camp?
Not too sure on that count.
But in that case, why bring it up again at all if the circumstantial evidence has already been laid down? This is just one more (unnecessary) piece.

Also, lol if he was talking about Theon.

I took the death of jon snow very hard, because I too have a half brother. I teared up a bit and re-read the couple of paragraphs over an over again, not believing it.

I love you brandon, you may be my half-brother but goddamnit if anyone so much as bruises you I will kill him.

>>1982175

Jon is fine. He was only stabbed a few hundred times, Lady Stark took it like a champ.

>>1982157
>But in that case, why bring it up again at all if the circumstantial evidence has already been laid down?

It's admission from Ned himself that Jon isn't his son. Remember, if the Jon Targaryen thing is true, the only two people who would have known the truth about it were Howland and Ned, and this is only a hint, anyway. GRRM keeps pouring circumstantial evidence on the pile every book.

>>1982154

Well he can't choke Cersei if he has a blade on that hand.

But holy shit that would be awesome.

what jaime is the one to kill cercei ? Seems likely considering that what tyrion told him has been confirmed.

>>1982212

There's a prophecy about it, but the prophecy only says "little brother," which could theoretically be either him or Tyrion.

Or some other unrelated little brother, I guess.

>>1982193
That's what I'm saying, he doesn't say "jon's my nephew". Circumstantially, it adds to the theory, but it isn't concrete evidence of anything.

>>1982219
Doesn't Aemon talk about another prophecy involving a "valonqar" (which Rhaegar mistook for "little brother"), but Aemon believes to refer to Dany because the term doesn't specify sex, but "younger sibling?"

Alternately, the valonqar could possibly be Tommen. He's Joffrey's little brother, and the Maegi only says "the valonqar," not "your valonqar." I'd imagine Tommen might grow sick of his mother's shit.

>>1982251
Tommens like 8 year olds old. He'll do whatever the fuck his advisers tell him too. He must have been referring to jon or aegon.

>>1982251

Yeah, but he's like ten. And I don't think he'd choke a kitten.

Basically I want Jaime to do it because it would be badass, I won't lie. I could deal with Tyrion too, but he was annoying in DWD so fuck him.

>>1982251
Tommen will die before Cersei does.

>>1982273
And if he does cercei will go even more insane and the whole lannister/highgarden alliance will fall apart if it hasn't already.

>>1982289

Varys's entire purpose in offing Kevan (fuck you, Martin, I liked that guy) was to make sure the alliance continued falling apart. Varys was concerned the alliance was going to be strengthened and repaired, so he killed the mediator. Such is the fate of the honest diplomat in Martin's world.

>>1982251
Jaime is her little brother too, isn't he?

I'm sure it was a niggling detail of her general resentment of the world that if she were male, she'd have been the heir since she came out first.

Kevan was the only good Lannister. Sucks to see him go. Varys's motives seem highly irrational at the end there. Claims he's only doing it for the good of the little people but clearly it's the small folk who will suffer the most from this war.

Also this has probably been answered before but I just finished the book like an hour ago and haven't been here since I started it. Who were the light haired children with daggers Kevan saw at the end?

>>1982312

>Claims he's only doing it for the good of the little people but clearly it's the small folk who will suffer the most from this war.

He's doing it for the good of the people because Cersei is a crazy bitch who can't be trusted with the realm.

>>1982312

>Claims he's only doing it for the good of the little people but clearly it's the small folk who will suffer the most from this war.

Just like the people responsible for every war in real life.

>>1982312

Varys' "spiders"/"little birds"

>>1982312
>Varys's motives seem highly irrational at the end there

How so? His entire plan relies on Cersei leading the realm to ruin and fucking her alliances over. Kevan mending shit up would make the impending war for the realm more even-sided, and thus bloodier and longer. The more shit Cersei fucks up, the easier it'll be to get the realm back into Targaryen rule.

>>1982319

But his plans go farther back than Cersei. He's been plotting with Illyrio for a couple of decades now.

Also at the end Varys seems to be supporting Aegon. I thought he always had his hopes set on Danaerys. Aegon's rebellion stands no chance of winning when all he has are sellswords and he can barely hold even one small fort. Even Stannis stood a better chance.

Don't assume Varys was being honest about his motives this time.

He was speaking in front of his little birds, after all. "I'm doing it all because I was an abused low-born child, and I want to make a kingdom where people like that are protected and cared for." is the sort of premise that would make children loyal.

>>1982329
>Aegon's rebellion stands no chance of winning when all he has are sellswords and he can barely hold even one small fort. Even Stannis stood a better chance.
There is a certain Dornishman with an unmarried daughter and a grudge.

>>1982335
Who needs an unmarried daughter when you have a long-lost nephew.

>>1982329
> a famously honorable company of sellswords
>an island fortress, described as extremely hard to take

oh yea

>>1982329
>Aegon's rebellion stands no chance of winning when all he has are sellswords and he can barely hold even one small fort.

The Golden Company aren't your average disloyal sellswords (they're described as extremely efficient and loyal), and they have a personal interest in taking back Westeros, having been founded by Westerosi exiles.

And what do you mean "barely hold even one fort?" They've taken multiple within their first few days in Westeros.

>>1982335
Besides, there's lots of houses that would instantly declare for a Targaryen who doesn't look to be a total joke. Of course this isn't how it'll go down and we'll find there's something funny about Aegon.

>>1982370
It turns out he's a clone, magically grown from Varys's severed genitals.

>>1982370
He's a girl, calling it now

>>1982372
He looks like a boy most of the time, but he could look down on Robert Strong when Varys is alone with his little birds.

>>1982372
>>1982379
Apparently someone is calling him a "mummer's dragon" can't remember where so people are speculating he's in fact just some Blackfyre peasant.

>>1982390
Quaithe(sp? the Asshai wooden mask lady that speaks to Dany) says that. Varys used to be a mummer, so if Aegon is his real play, that's an alternative explanation.

I'm still expecting Dany to just wander around in foreign lands for the whole series and either never show up in Westeros, or only show up at the end, completely insane and worse than Aerys with dragons, to supply an unhappy ending after everything finally seemed settled.

>>1982414
Arya, too. She ends up becoming just another Faceless Man, and forgetting her own life.

>>1982414
I don't think Martin himself knows what he's supposed to do with her. Somewhere around book 3 or so he just figured he wants to flesh out Westeros without Dany bothering everyone with dragons so we get wacky Essos adventures with Roxos zo Voxos.

>>1982426

That is immensely unlikely, because 1) she has deep anger issues (thank god) and 2) even GRRM would not do something that useless.

>>1982487
Something is going to happen that makes her unfit for a faceless man, probably the wargism. I don't think the priest just one day asks her if she'd like to go be a magic assassin while ignoring all their doctrines.

>>1982487
>even GRRM would not do something that useless.
What, like building characters up for a major role, and then abruptly having them die?

>>1982516
Who has he done that to?

>>1982537

Quentyn, among others.

>>1982537
Seriously?

Have you read any of these books?

>>1982516

Arya isn't building up to a major role though.

>>1982501

I almost wonder if Arya won't die. If the Red Priests are correct, and the Many-faced god is just one aspect of the dark god who must not be named, then Arya is in effect serving the dark god, the lord of the Others and the Cold. She would then be an enemy of Rhllor and the Light.

Of course that makes 99% of Westeros enemies of Rhllor since they serve the Seven, the Old Gods and Drowned God.

>>1982542
Every time he kills someone off, it's a catalyst to steer the plot a certain way.

>>1982560
Craster was a godly man. The last one to remember the proper worship of the Old Gods.

>>1982516
>>1982542

He makes all (or at least most) of the viewpoint characters appear like they could be headed for a major character arc, and then some of them die abruptly. It can be a bit jarring for the reader, but it's pretty clearly deliberate: he knows where he's going with this, and the major deaths that have occurred have all been signficiant to the other characters' stories. It's not like he gets bored with a character and then kills them off and never mentions them again.

>>1982564
Yeah and people like Ned stirred stuff and their deaths stirred a lot more. Arya won't die after being on the run from King's Landing since 1996. And because she's Arya.

>>1982568
>mfw

>>1982516

Ned (as likable and honorable as he was) served virtually no purpose in the extended storyline aside from being a catalyst to spark the war, and even then that was because he died.

The martell in DwD served no purpose as well, he was there to be rejected and then die.

>>1982627

Quentin was there to set the dragons free. And to be the stupidest retard to ever walk the face of the Earth.

>I can tame dragons. My distant ancestor got boned by a Targaeryn.

>>1982627

Ned's death started a downward spiral of craziness, and Quentyn's death helped fulfill a prophecy (and also he freed the dragons fullretard.jpg). Robb's death also helped shit up everyone's lives. Arya's death would do absolutely nothing. No one would even know she died.

>>1982640
Perfect reason to keep arya alive. I think she'll be one of the few who survives the series.

>>1982640

Yeah, I'm just making the case that GRRM doesn't just kill people because he's lazy or trying to be grimdark.

Arya has to have a purpose. I just don't think her purpose will be to get personal revenge. But she'll have some divine role to play. The gods will it.

I don't mind Quentyn dying because I didn't like him but I have to wonder why I had to read 150 pov pages of his.

>>1982657
>Oh.

I dont care. It was worth it.

>>1982657

I kept getting Quentin and Aegon confused. Both were traveling in disguise to marry Danaerys. Both traveled with a small band of trusted warriors from Westeros. Both hired a band of sellswords to help them.

I couldn't keep their plot lines separated in my head until the end when Quentin was the dead one and Aegon was the one back in Westeros.

>>1982657

What >>1982658 said.

>mfw Selmy lifts up the blanket and tears off Quentyn's face.

I remember reading somewhere that Tyrion and Arya are GRRM's favorite characters. I doubt he's just going to kill them for no purpose.

Arya has had literally hundreds of pages to herself and the only major thing she's accomplished so far, in the grand scheme of things, is taking Gendry away from Harrenhal. She's the most built up character in the books and apart from Sansa the only really likable/interesting female POV. If Gurm kills her, it would mean she was almost as big a red herring as if Dany suddenly died.

>>1983141
>it would mean she was almost as big a red herring as if Dany suddenly died.

Correction: Now that I think about it Dany has actually accomplished a lot of meaningful things and even if she died, she would've had a major impact on the events in Westeros. Considering this dead Arya would be the bigger red herring.

>>1983141
Sansas not really likable. I can't forgive her for betraying her family like that to the lannisters. And she should have been smart enough to see through joffreys nice guy act the moment he tried to mutilate the butchers boy and had her direwolf killed.

>>1981635

he was 998th.

>>1983156
I didn't find her likable for a very long time either, but kind-of warmed up to her in AFfC.

I think if her character keeps going in that direction, I may actually like her in TWoW.

>>1983156

Not only did her actions not contribute to the downfall of her family (her father and Catelyn accomplished this by themselves), she was acting out of childish naivety. That naivety was systematically torn down at the end of GoT and CoK and she matured fast. Her childhood ended when her father was beheaded before her eyes.

Her character development is amongst the strongest in ASOIAF rivaling Theon's and Jaime's. She's shed everything that was annoying in her. People need to get over what she did in GoT, because she's simply not the same person anymore.

>>1983180
If only ned had followed renlys advice and taken joffrey and the queen hostage.

This scene did it for me. Melted my fucking heart man.

>>1983184
I think at that moment she realized who she was. I think that, even above her fathers death, made her and the reader realize she was a stark.

Tell me Anone. How long did it take you to catch on that Abel=Mance? how people missed that is amazing. it was pretty fucking obvious.

>>1983195
I didn't know until the spearwives abducted theon and made him escape with fake arya.

Sad to see theon reduced to such a low state though. He's described as looking like an old man with white hair. That's worse punishment than if ramsay simply cut his throat.

>>1983195
I didn't catch that until someone pointed it out here. I wondered who the fuck Abel was but just figured it would be explained somewhere down the line, and by the end I just forgot about it. Also I'm retarded.

>>1983200
And cockless too.

>>1983195

Almost immediately. I was also surprised that people missed it.

But then, some people missed gay Renly/Loras.

>>1983225
>But then, some people missed gay Renly/Loras.

I suspected but I never thought they were fags. When loras started getting creepy after renlys death, I had high suspicions.

I thought it was tasteless for the HBO show to show them in the act though. Should have remained subtle.

>>1983228

yeah I was kind of surprised they chose to put even more random sex scenes in there given the number of random sex scenes already in the books.

>>1983212
Did they actually cut it off? I listened to the audiobook of this one during work so I couldn't go back and read it very easily.

>>1983228
Seriously? Was it in any of the books at all? because I totally missed it. I was always confused about the whole renly not consummating with margaery thing but that makes it make sense.

>>1983228

he wasn't very subtle about it, honestly

>knight of flowers
>rainbow guard

it was really kind of embarrassing, glad jon connington's not so GAYYYY GAY GAY GAY HOMOSEXUAL GAY about it

>>1983236
>Seriously? Was it in any of the books at all?

Very, very subtle things. Such as loras pretty much worshipping renly.

>>1983237
Jon connington isn't a homo. From what I know he's been married before.

>>1983238
hm, interesting. Though it sucks that they ruined a potential "holy shit I didn't see that coming" moment in the tv series

>>1983240

GRRM said he is in an interview. The society in Westeros would pretty much require that a high-born dude take a wife, unless he found a way out of it, such as the Kingsguard or the Wall.

Also his flashbacks are pretty gay.

>>1983240
How did you not get how gay Connington is for Rhaegar?

>>1983237
The Rainbow Guards thing wasn't suppose to be a gay thing. It was suppose to be a Faith of the Seven thing, the order of knights the faith have know wear a rainbow cape and crystal necklace. Subconscious decision by GRRM probably but it wasn't intentional.


Connington is probably gay too, he was definitely gay for Rheagar.

>>1981701
Everyone's mouth either is "a red ruin" or their teeth "go to splinters"

>>1983256

i wonder if whores go to splinters.

>>1982426
I'm 100% certain she will be sent to kill someone she cared for from her past, like Gendry or Rickon, and she'll remember her humanity at the last second.

I think its funny that Dany has been a mover and shaker for this long and STILL no one has told her how fucking crazy and evil her father was.

>>1983275

You just don't up and tell a queen of questionable sanity her father's one crazy s.o.b., Barristan could have told her but he chose not to (or couldn't find an approriate time to tell her).

>>1983270

The Faceless men aren't stupid. Besides, she's already at odds with them.

>>1983275
>no one has told her how fucking crazy and evil her father was.

Would you tell IAMTHEDRAGON that?

Barristan tried to tell her, and has given her hints, but she was imalittlebusyatthemomentlolilltalktoyoulaterkthxbaidaaaariooowhereareu.

The most overlooked reveal so far is Ashara Dayne miscarried and that led to her 'suicide: Also it seems pretty clear Ned fucked every chick that laid eyes on him.

Jon's parentage is unimportant IMO. These fanfic L&R theories are missing hte point. The Stark children never get what they want. We'll never find out who his mother was and the most likely story is the fishermans daughter.

So the Dragon has three heads, Danaerys, Aegon, and who? Resurrected Jon? Will it turn out that Tyrion is actually the bastard son of a Targaryen? Did his mother cheat on Tywin and that's why he hates Tyrion so much?

>>1983339

Tywin hates Tyrion because Tywin's wife died birthing him, and he's a fucking ugly dwarf.

>>1983346

Or is the real reason because Tyrion is a Targaryen bastard? Tywin's wife probably banged Rhaegar or Aerys while she was in King's Landing.

I haven't read anything on this thread but I am so tempted. I just finished reading a game of thrones. I want to be part of the discussion too!

Anyway why is it so fucking hard to find the editions the op has in his picture.

>>1983339
the Targs have three pretenders.

Dany
Aegon/Griff
??/Dorne. They won't back a possibly fake Aegon and Dany turned them down. Or whatever else fits.

Tywin doesn't need another reason to hate Tyrion other than he's a dwarf and brings shame to the Lannisters.

>>1983349

But listen to this. There is evidence that Tyrion is Aerys's bastard.

>According to Ser Barristan, Aerys was infatuated by Joanna Lannister something that caused further friction between the King and his Hand.[11]

>During the Siege of Riverrun Jaime dreams and sees a woman he barely recognizes. She asks if he will forget his father like he has forgotten her. She talks about the future Tywin wanted for his children: his son a knight and his daughter a queen and cries when Jaime replies that they have indeed become that.[12]

Aerys was infatuated with Tyrion's mother. And Joanna in the dream only mentions that Tywin has two children, Jaime and Cersei. She never mentions Tyrion being Tywin's. Tywin may have been forced either by Joanna or by Aerys to allow Tyrion to live.

>>1983352
She died giving birth to Tyrion so Tywin would only discuss the twins with her.

>>1983356
Eh? That makes no sense. How does Tywin have a conversation with her after she's dead? And why would he boycott speaking about Tyrion before he knew his wife would die birthing him?

>>1983357
Still don't want a Tyrion Targaryen. Too many Targaryens for my taste.

>>1983363

There's not enough Targaryens. They're an endangered species. Only two, possibly four (Jon, maybe Tyrion) left in the world. Westeros and Vallyria were doing really well under Targaryen rule until the doom destryoed Vallyria and the dragons died out in Westeros.

I really really hope the Dany chapters in the next book will follow an outline somewhat like this:

>Dany takes over Khalasar
>Rapemurders her way back to Meereen
>Rapemurders half the annoying fuckers in Meereen including Daario
>Gets her entourage back
>Gets her groove back
>Gets her fucking shit together, forges alliance with Martell
>Gets ships
>FINALLY
>FUCKING
>GOES
>TO
>FUCKING
>WESTEROS
>TO
>FUCK
>SHIT
>HARD

>>1983379

You know she won't arrive in Westeros until book 7. It's inevitable. Book 6 will be her conquering the rest of the Eastern lands, traveling to the Shadow (as the prophecy said she must), and then it will end with her preparing for Westeros just as winter is at its darkest and deepest point with the Wall being over run by Others during an eclipse (3 days of darkness).

>>1983367
Eh not really. Valyria was a pretty brutal empire, heavily into slavery and conquest. Also for every one benevolent Targ king in Westeros you had one murderous pretender or mad king.

>>1983381

And then her fleet sinks in the winter storms with all hands because words are wind.

>>1983389
I completely missed Connington being gay and the "perfumed seneschal" being the damn ship.

>>1983389

Ha Ha, Yes.

>>1983200

>mfw Ramsay cut off his cock.

>>1983225
>Almost immediately. I was also surprised that people missed it.

Especially since he already pulled the same trick, at the same place. Multiple times, I think.

>>1983409

My name is Eunuch. It rhymes with... well nothing.

>>1983410

I missed it until this thread. Looking back on it I have no idea how I missed it. The entire time during the rescue I was wondering who the hell these people were and what they wanted with Jeyne. Now I feel retarded. It should have been obvious. Guess I just wasn't paying much attention.

>>1983409

Ramsay is a little prick, man. He'd better get some form of cummupance. Being roasted alive slowly or keelhauled for days.

I don't care if the villains win, but Ramsay has to die.

>>1982560
>If the Red Priests are correct, and the Many-faced god is just one aspect of the dark god who must not be named, then Arya is in effect serving the dark god, the lord of the Others and the Cold. She would then be an enemy of Rhllor and the Light.


I'm still not convinced that R'hllor is a real god.

Of the Old Gods, we have pretty much seen they are actually real and have set forth event's in motion and sent the Stark's their Direwolves.

Everything that R'hllor has done has just been Witchcraft and heresy by a bunch of sorcerers casting spells, in no way it seems that R'hllor has actually done anything himself as an actual entity, unlike the Old Gods.

>>1983422

I have suspicions about R'hllor too. I just don't trust the red priests especially not Melissandre. I know she's done a lot to fight the Others and strengthen the Wall but I still don't trust anyone who practices human sacrifice. And her interpretations of her visions is highly faulty.

My fanfic theory is that R'Hollor and the Faceless God are the same force after all darkness is just the shadow from the light.

>>1983379
There is an anime called the 12 kingdoms if memory serves me correctly, about a girl who is taken from our world and put on the throne of 12 kingdoms and forced to learn the hardship of rule and how her modern values of caring and friendship and etc etc are worth pretty much nothing when you have to be a ruler.

Anyway for the entire series she pretty much fucks everything up (while having good intentions) and pretty much causing the empire to fall into civil war while all her advisers and stuff pretty much have been playing her like a puppet and trying to take the kingdom out from underneath her.

But damn, that ending when she get's her shit together, proves she is a chosen of prophecy and confronts her enemies where they collectively shit their pants is one of the most satisfying moments I have experienced from any medium.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HW8aXrmUAnU&t=2m30s

Video related.

>>1983416

My working theory will be the Westeros Magna Carter equivalent will be introduced with human rights laws by the Septons. Ramsay will have to stand trial and Theon will testify.

>>1983437
>Westeros Magna Carta

I would actually love this to be the ending of the entire series.

>>1983437
>human rights laws by the Septons
These the same septons that torture confessions out of people?

I'm not too impressed with the book if I'm honest.

6 years and we get, essentially, a filler book. Out of a dozen or so plot points, nothing gets any closer to resolution, and each one ends in a cliff hanger.

The Jaime chapter, seriously Martin? Seriously?

>>1983455
It was the other half of AFFC, so it was never going to be great. It picked up towards the end though, once the knot had been resolved.

>>1983455
>essentially, a filler book

Resolve is for children.

>>1983455

What exactly do you mean by "resolution"? Of course there is no definite resolution yet, the series isn't over. Tons of shit was advanced and resolved and revealed in this book (Brienne's situation, Davos' situation, Bran's grand adventure, Dany's position, Jon's position, Aegon LANDING IN WESTEROS, Arya's training moving along quickly)

>>1983462
>Tons of shit was advanced and resolved and revealed in this book
>Brienne's situation
you can't be serious

>>1983465

Again, what kind of progression are you expecting? That her whole story arc comes to and end in one way or another? Don't be silly. Knowing she is alive after AFFC and what she's doing next is a big thing resolved right there.

>>1983466

Dude, resolving one cliffhanger to immediately replace it with another doesn't really count.

>>1983484

It's ALWAYS going to be a "cliffhanger" unless she dies or something similar. The same with all other plotlines.

>>1983455

Well it's the middle of the series. Of course there's no resolution yet. That comes in the end obviously.

I think that's the one cliffhanger I most want to know about besides Jon Snow, I want to know what happened to Jaime. He just up and vanishes after one brief POV chapter. The suspense is killing me.

It's sad how Daenerys is this whiny, incompetent, stupid girl who evidently hates Westeros and loves fake Persia.

also, orientalist scholars would have a field day with Martin's depiction of Easterners (slavers, despots, schemers, gluttons).

>>1983502

Minus slavery that's how he depicts Westerners too. You can't deny Manderlay is a glutton, that Cersei is a schemer or that Mad King Aerys was a despot.

PLACES I'D LIKE TO SEE IN THE BOOK:
>Skagos

every ASOIAF fan's wet dream. Like the lands north of the Wall, only more hardcore and with cavemen riding unicorns. Luckily Davos is heading there.

>Asshat-under-the-shadow

It's called ASS HAT. Do I need another reason?

>Ibben

Hairy eskimo men!

>VALYRIA MOTHERFUCKER

He simply can't deny us this. I bet Dany will go there next.

>Sothoryos

...and then turn towards fake Africa to help the starving orphans for another book or three until dying from malaria at the end, leaving Catelyn's zombie corpse to take the Iron Throne cause Aegon had gotten infected by Jon Connington.

>>1983404
>the "perfumed seneschal" being the damn ship.

Wait a...

FFFFFF--

Finished A Dance with Dragons a few days ago, thought it was excellent but had quite a few faults. Most likely this is due to anticipation; a lot happened but not quite at the pace I was hoping for, like the much hoped Dany/Tyrion meet didn't happen yet (unless you count the joust in the pit). Some thoughts:

- Davos not dead, a huge relief. Needed more povs though. Also, "The north remembers.", fuck yeah. The pie served at the wedding feast was so fucking delicious I am still slavering.
- Drogon's arrival to the pit. For much of the series the dragons have been more of a backdrop and a political tool than actual weapons of mass destruction. I was fucking PUMPED when Dany whipped and mounted that shit. Interested to see if she makes Khal Jhaqo beg for mercy (as she promised her khalasar), or forges an alliance. Or gets enslaved. Most other Dany chapters were some of the weakest in this book.
- Too bad about Quentyn, but that plan was doomed from the start. He wasn't THAT interesting of a character anyway though.
- Theon's chapters were excellent. Best writing from George in this book was with him. You simultaneously hate and feel sorry for him, the povs were a hard read and that's where GRRM is at his best.
- Barristan the fucking Bold, when I realised it was his pov I literally shit myself from excitement. And his chapters didn't disappoint, he staid legendary even with you inside his head.
- Tyrion was excellent, even if changed, but all the shit that has happened to him will do that to ya.
- Jon dying: nope. There's a twist coming, not necessarily what people would hope for, but he's definitely not getting killed off yet. Not sure about the Azor Ahai stuff people have been tossing about. Same goes for Stannis, probably still alive. Also, Tormund the Giantsbabe is back. Fuck. Yes.
- Too few Bran chapters, but what we were shown was excellent. I was hoping for at least a few reveals about the others in this book though.

>No. Hear me, Daenerys Targaryen. The glass candles are burning.
Soon comes the pale mare, and after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun’s son and the mummer’s dragon. Trust none of them. Remember the Undying. Beware the perfumed seneschal."

So Tyrion and Victarion (lion and kraken) are not to be trusted?

Kraken= Victarion
Dark Flame= Stannis/Mel?
Lion=Tyrion
Sun's Son= Quentyn
Mummer's Dragon= Fake Aegon

>>1983604

Dark flame is Victarion's wizard. He's black as ebony and a priest of the fire. Dark flame.

>>1983604
>Mummer's Dragon= Fake Aegon

Mummer = Varys
Dragon = Aegon

>>1983610
Good catch. Moquorro?

>>1983404
>I completely missed Connington being gay and the "perfumed seneschal" being the damn ship.
I just finished the book.

Someone explain this to me. I completely missed both.

>He indicates that Mago, a minor Dothraki character in A Game of Thrones who joins Khal Jhaqo when Drogo's khalasar splinters apart, will play a notable role, presumably in Daenerys' storyline. Mago is killed off in the HBO TV series. GRRM told the producers that Mago would have a larger role later on but they proceeded with killing him off.

Fuck.

>>1983912
Eh... it'll be easy enough to pick another and give him the same role.

>>1983892

The perfumed seneschal is described to Tyrion as being "the fragrant steward" or something like that, but it means the same thing.

Just read JonCon's chapters again. He refers to Rhaegar as "my silver prince," reminisces about his purdy hair blowing in the wind, etc. Things you don't think about friends you're not attracted to.

>>1983942
Uh... what?

The ship Tyrion is on is called "the fragrant steward." What does that have to do with Jon Connington?

He's probably gay as fuck for Rhaegar, but what's the connection between him and the ship Tyrion, Penny, Jorah and Moqorro were on?

If the ship “Fragrant Steward” is not the perfumed seneschal from the prophecy Danny received. The ship never made it anywhere near to Danny and it was already carrying the “lion”.

>>1984347
No, but it was carrying Moqorro and Jorah. Is Jon Connington described as perfumed? I really don't get what makes him the "perfumed seneschal." He's neither perfumed nor a seneschal.

Feels kinda strange suddenly having nothing to read after finishing the 5 books over the course of a few months. I guess I should get Hedge Knight and the rest.

>>1984239

Nothing at all. I was responding to both the guy's questions in different lines.

>>1983412
> Ygritte tells john the story of BAEL the bard
>Mance tells Jon he snuck into winterfell when King Robert cam to make ned hand
>ABEL the singer
>Mance tells Melisandre he will bring six "spear wives" w/ him

you guys need to pay more attention......you know Bran spoke to theon through the tree,
and TRIED TO WARN JON BY WARGING INTO HIS CRAW AND SAYING
"Jon Snow Jon Snow"

>now I blow your mind - this is from Game of Thrones, its after they get word Bran is ok

The night the bird had come from Winterfell, Eddard Stark
had taken the girls to the castle godswood, an acre of elm and alder and black cottonwood overlooking
the river. The heart tree there was a great oak, its ancient limbs overgrown with smokeberry vines; they
knelt before it to offer their thanksgiving, as if it had been a weirwood. Sansa drifted to sleep as the moon
rose, Arya several hours later, curling up in the grass under Ned's cloak. All through the dark hours he
kept his vigil alone. When dawn broke over the city, the dark red blooms of dragon's breath surrounded
the girls where they lay. "I dreamed of Bran," Sansa had whispered to him. "I saw him smiling."

>Bran confirmed for being Marty fukin mcfly

>>1984637
I really hope none of that is new for anyone except for the GoT passage (which, really, might not be Bran fucking around with Sansa's dreams, but just a dream she had). It was all painfully obvious.

>>1983610
Dark flame is going to be an as yet unnamed descendant of House Blackfyre.

>>1984831
Yeah we sure got a lot of background on them in this book. That and everything Lady Dustin talked about which I'm sure leads to some lineage surprises and ties to Ashara Dayne somehow and all of which I find pretty uninteresting.

>>1984637
>Time travel

>>1984455
Or you know, you could just read something else.

Just putting that out there.

>>1984911
Just finished the TV show, holy fuck that made me hate lysa and sweetrobin even more. Lysa should have been fatter like in the book though.

>>1984831
He's called black flame. And he's described as being so black it looks like he was burnt.

>>1984831
I thought he was Moqorro.

>>1981678

Do you think Robb went into Grey Wind?

“Tell me, is Ser Raynald Westerling amongst these captives?” “The knight of seashells?” Edwyn sneered. “You’ll find that one feeding the fish at the bottom of the Green Fork.” “He was in the yard when our men came to put the direwolf down,” said Walder Rivers. “Whalen demanded his sword and he gave it over meek enough, but when the crossbowmen began feathering the wolf he seized Whalen’s axe and cut the monster loose of the net they’d thrown over him. Whalen says he took a quarrel in his shoulder and another in the gut, but still managed to reach the wallwalk and throw himself into the river.” “He left a trail of blood on the steps,” said Edwyn. “Did you find his corpse afterward?” asked Jaime. “We found a thousand corpses afterward. Once they’ve spent a few days in the river they all look much the same.” “I’ve heard the same is true of hanged men,” said Jaime, before he took his leave.


It does say he cut it loose and we have Freys saying they killed the wolf, but that doesn't make it confirmed...right?

>>1985249

I though the killed Grey Wind and attached its head to rob body. Even in one of Theon's dream he see Rob with a wolfs head

>>1985249

I though the killed Grey Wind and attached its head to rob body. Even in one of Theon's dream he see Rob with a wolfs head

>>1985037
Man I wish I knew what, I've never really liked reading and I came from thinking fantasy was dumb crap (before watching the show) and now I can't shake the feeling I've read the one series in the genre that isn't.

I finished the book a few hours ago, so it hasn't really sunk in yet.
Still, I think it's good. Not all the chapters were that interesting, but overall it was pretty darn good.
Tyrion wasn't at his best. Too much repeating and going nowhere. But on the other hand, he got better later on, and he really shines when he's being sneaky and diplomatic and there wasn't many chances for that early on.
Jon Snow's chapters were somewhat interesting, but only 'cause he dealt with the wildlings, Stannis, the queen and Melisandre. He isn't really an interesting character himself. I was pleasantly surprised to see him killed, though. I wonder if we'll ever hear more about his mother (aside from that tidbit of information that Davos was told).
Theon's chapters were a nice read. Making you feel sympathy for that smug bastard is a pretty neat trick to pull.
Arya, Selmy, Bran, Griff, Victarion and Cersei all had good chapters. Davos remains my favorite character, and even though we didn't hear much from him, it looks like he'll start out on his own little adventure in the next book.
Daenerys' chapters were the most annoying things about the book. Nothing really happened - the city is having problems, they talk about it, etc. Now, not every chapter has to have huge changes, but there wasn't even any character development. She closed the doors for her sick "children", but they never really mentioned it again.