/lit/ - Literature

To return to the issue of the narrator...

I don't know what bothers me more. The fact that /wg/ is almost impossible to make memes for, or the fact that /wg/ doesn't seem to need memes at all.

I'm losing my hair. Can baldlets become authors?

>>19762143
whenever i have to resort to using a conversation to reveal needed background info i feel ashamed. i have a trauma against info dumping from reading so many writing guides.

Can political writers even make art? I feel like the vast majority of it sucks profoundly because it doesn’t try to be aesthetically pleasing first and foremost.

>>19762199
Infodumping bad. Exploration of character through dialogue good.

I hate modernity so much, how do I make money off that feeling?

>>19762217
You don’t. Do you seriously think people give a shit about whatever bullshit you can string together before you’re in love with the project at hand?

What's the point of these threads? Nobody here writes, those that do write poorly, and those that don't actively discourage those that do. Not that anyone does.

>>19762199
Do it another way, as in not via conversation

>>19762245
This thread exists, in part, for the purpose of giving YOU something to bitch about.

>>19762126
Hey I was on that little islet, it's supremely comfy.

>>19762260

>>19762203
i've usually not revealed character through dialogue. action is always better, so you can show what choices they actually make.
>>19762245
you're welcome to post your daily wordcount.

>>19762280
No. Fuck you, nigger. You can go rot in hell along with the degenerates and the retards!

>>19762154
/wg/ has some memes.
>no one on /wg/ writes
>no one cares about your stupid idea, it’s about implementation, I could write a dog discovering aliens and it could be good.
>anime writers are the only writers on /wg/
>has anyone read the books in OP? (Hint: no)
>incorrectly stating the name of fellow writers work

>>19762303
>>no one on /wg/ writes
No one does.

>One day I'll write and shut /wg/ up!

>>19762293
>doesn't write
>complains that other people dont write
>just here to crab and meerkat

>>19762322
They'll never admit if anyone here wrote something good. Just a bunch of assholes looking to known down others' efforts.
Also nobody here writes.

>>19762329
Fuck you, you nob gobbling prick! I wrote but then you assholes told me I was shit so I gave you. YOU'RE THE REAL CRAB!!!

Nobody here writes, but what else would I expect from 4chan?

So does my Burgerpunk writing not count as writing? Please explain.

Metapost. Metapost. Metapost. Metapost. Metapost.

>>19762331
If I win in a writing contest or (inshallah) get my book published, I will let all you motherfuckers know

It's MLK day so what's the best writing you've seen about niggers? Also should I get fried chicken for lunch?

>>19762369
Psh. Your dreck would never be fit for my perusing eyes. Pah! Get it out of my face, little pleb.

>>19762388
:( why r u so mean

>>19762386
>MLK-ULTRA day

What is anime writing? Is this that lit rpg thing I here about or something else?

>>19762406
that gif is wonkers

Post your writing ideas.

>>19762432
I got bored of writing my book about a religious cult so I added in a subplot of Elvis Presley and Saddam Hussein running a fast food restaurant in the same town.
They need a third man for a heist though. Who should they get?

>>19762126
I need help anons.
Does anyone have the /lit/ dialogue chart with the correct formatting for using quote marks in different sentence types? I never did bother to learn it and now I want to download the chart but I can't find it.

>>19762444
Someone from an Asian or European country. How about an aging Adolf Hitler or Pol Pot?

>>19762455
Hitler would be way too old for one more job at this point and Pol Pot could just stay in Cambodia like the rest of the Khmer Rouge did.
But if it's an Asian, I'm thinking Yukio Mishima.

>>19762444
F Gardner. DO IT!

>>19762432
I've always wanted to write a good girl/bad boy romance. Except the bad boy is a genocidal maniac. It takes place in a sci-fi setting where earth has recovered from war with an alien species and the bad boy is using the advanced technology to get revenge on the aliens because he feels they got off too easy after slaughtering billions of humans. The romance was only him playing her to get access to some technology he later uses to kill a whole alien colony and the rest of the book is about the girl trying to catch her former boyfriend and stop him from eventually crashing the aliens' moon into their homeworld.

>>19762474
But I can't write F. Gardner, I have no idea what he's like.

>>19762478
Think "retarded faggot."

How good does your writing have to be in order to get supporters on patreon?

>>19762496
I'll stick with Mishima. Also I have to figure out how to incorporate Hussein's poetry.

Unbind your soul. It is my soul mate and you are my soul’s beloved.
No house could have sheltered my heart as you have
If I were that house, you would be its dew
You are the soothing breeze
My soul is made fresh by you
And our Ba’ath Party blossoms like a branch turns green.
The medicine does not cure the ailing but the white rose does.
The enemies set their plans and traps
And proceeded despite the fact they are all faulty.
The enemies forced strangers into our sea
And he who serves them will be made to weep.

>>19762506
Interesting question. I was about to say what if I set one up to test it out and let y’all know but then I’d have to actually do that.

how do ytou keepe wiorting when youj have to go to the bathroom

>>19762432
This is more of an exercise idea but I've been thinking about describing a random love-interest girl through the eyes of a professional chef.

>>19762444
Trips checked!

Dealer’s choice:
Hunter S Thompson
Fred Rogers
Bob Ross
Al Capone

If i post my writing, are you actually going to read it?

>>19762780
no this is the writing general

>>19762780
Yes I will try. But if I post my writing will YOU read it? And tell me if it sucks?

>>19762780
Anons do actually read others writing here. At least, they read mine sometimes.

>>19762126
How do i deal with the voice of my inner critic that shoots down my ideas and qunches my inspiration? Meditation? Is there a way to shut it down at will?

>>19762832
yes.

>>19762780
Maybe, maybe not. I wouldn't bet on it too much. This IS the writing gen, not writing+read other anon's work and hope for feedback.

>>19762889
You write through it. Even the best writers have that inner voice, perhaps an even more convincing version as it's backed up with knowledge.

How many stories do you guys have on the go at once? I've just realised I write one at a time and if I'm not feeling like writing that one story then I don't write... how have I been so stupid?

>>19763215
one, and I've been in a terrible slump writing it since November. Couldn't possibly imagine trying to serially write another simultaneously

>>19763223
I don't write enough for anything longer than flash fiction and short stories right now, so maybe my question is more applicable to that.

>>19762406
No its like naruto or bleach light novel tier, lit-rpg writers often write like that though, also xinxia and wuxia. Seriously fuck cultivation.

>>19763215
>one regular novel
>one sustained series in its first of seven novels
>one flash fiction every week, usually Friday or Saturday night
I'm trying to be more dedicated to it this year.

>>19763282
Is it difficult coming up with a flash fiction topic every week?

>>19762126
https://worksbrief.blogspot.com/2022/01/metamorphosis.html

>>19763308
Not that anon but there are tons of writing prompt books, websites, and posts on /wg/ to keep you engaged.

did you remember to brush your teeths today anons?

>>19763315
I only read the first chapter, but I already like Holden Caufield v10.482

>>19762126

I just finished the third draft of my manuscript and sent it out to lit agents

how long do i need to / should i wait before i start on another book / project?

>>19763387
i dont drink sugary drinks like a girl so no i did not brush my teeth because i didn't need to because if you put good food into your body you never have to take care of it like a damn woman

>>19763404
Whenever you start to feel the longing grief of the previous project start to fade. Hold onto it.

>>19763427

>>19763462
right now i feel more restless and antsy. is that the longing? i should just keep holding onto that?

>>19763308
Not really. I try to start with a simple idea or theme because I don't have a lot of space to fully develop characters and plots. When I get stuck I use prompts. For the last one I did, I'd just seen Ballad of Buster Scruggs so I wrote a short Western. I was just in the right mood for it.

To the guy who challenged me to cut my word count down in a re-write, i changed the whole scene with an attempt to liven it up.

This is completely unedited.

hmm, struggling to put pen to paper today. maybe I'll just do some worldbuilding.

>>19763799
don't worry about it. you can always get to work tomorrow.

Does anyone here have depression/anxiety? Do you feel like writing helps you? I try to write because I like the escapism of reading and it seems that writing offers something similar, but I just feel so down that it's often near impossible to write, feeling much easier instead to do something mindless.

Is this cruel enough? I feel like I should have Emily be bullied more.

Emily tried to reach out to grab the corn dogs on the sand, but found her hand pinned down by Kate’s foot. Kate stood towering over her, grinding her heel into Emily’s dorsal. Emily’s was finally freed after a few seconds only to find her face planted onto the sand. Kate knelt over her grabbing her hair and lifting up the robot’s head. She pushed Emily’s head into the nearby clump of sand and condiments left earlier. Emily lifted her caked on face off the ground trying to reach the broken up corn dog that remained just outside her grasp.
“Pathetic,” Kate said, “Let’s get out of here.”
“Not before this,” Sharlene added, “Hey guzzler, here are some more things you can suck up.”
“Girls stop, this is going way too far,” Lilian pleaded.
“Shut up Lilian! She deserves it. Nobody told her to come and be a nasty loose slut, but she did it anyways!” Kate fired back.
Lilian quieted immediately and looked toward the ground. She watched as the two other girls grabbed Emily’s bag and threw the contents across from where they set up camp. Lilian shied away ashamed by her friends’ actions but even more at her own cowardice. Emily grabbed the broken hot dogs on the ground and tried to piece it back together. She pushed a broken hot dog piece into the skewer she held; ignoring the sunglasses and bottle of sunscreen going opposite directions that a compass can point toward. Maryanne’s bag fell on the floor yards away from where it originally sat.

>>19763994
pt.2

“Tell Caleb we’re leaving. Ta-ta hooch!” mocked Sharlene.
“Let’s go Lilian. Leave the slut,” added Kate, “we need to go check up on Matthew at the hospital.”
Lillian replied without a word. Her head was turned around following the other two girls. She kept looking back until the last sight of the beach was watching Emily skewer broken pieces of food she could find. The blonde held her broken corn dog in both her hands. It could have been the glare from the sun, but Lilian swore she saw Emily smile when she placed a final piece covering the tip of her wooden stick.
The sun was finally setting across the beach. The big fireball in the sky sank into the horizon as bursts of orange, red, and yellow streaked across the pale blue backdrop. The beach was much emptier now. Crashes from the waves and the breeze of winds replaced the sounds of frolicking children and adult chatter. Yet, a single individual remained on the beach, holding a stick that held pieces of hot dog and corn bread, and picking up the litter scattered around the sand. She was accompanied by the flies and other insects that swooped and buzzed around her eating the streaks and patches of dried condiments plastered over her face and body. As the girl picked up a pair of sunglasses burrowed inside a mound of sand, a voice shot out from the distance.
“Emily!”
She looked up and saw the face she longed to see. The lens of her eyes sparkled at the site of the same receding hairline, rounded face, brown eyes, and button nose she observed for thousand of hours. The hours passed, the hardships were turbulent, but Emily finally accomplished her goal.
“Hello Caleb, I got you a corn dog for lunch”.

>>19763994
>>19764003
My question when reading this (which might be explained in another context of the story) is why doesn't Emily stop the girls from destroying the lunch if she cares about it? Is it an Asimov situation where she can't hurt humans or something similar?

>>19764187
She's a robot. She is programed to complete a task, in this case, to obtain a corn dog for Caleb. So in the senses of 0's and 1's. The girls destroying things is not relevant to a corn dog. Normally, if a person drops food on the floor, they pick it up and throw it away and get a new corn dog, because situation changed. For a robot, the floor is irrelevant to the corn dog. Robot already has the "yes" in obtaining a corn dog. Thus the next part of their programming will be "deliver corn dog". New corn dogs, old corn dogs is still a corn dog. There isn't a real concept of time.

At least that's how the context is constructed earlier.

>>19764215
Then in that case you can bully her more by having the girls kick things out of her hands or knock her over like those robot training videos I always see online. I think "going opposite directions that a compass can point toward" read cumbersome.

What are you guys working on? I'm currently in the planning stages of a novel involving campers out in the woods forced to survive while being hunted by criminals. I have insane writers block over a larger scale complex project that is the main thing I'm interested in, so instead I'm tackling something more self-contained and straightforward.

>>19764673
I'm trying to crawl my way out of an irrecoverable slump since November and get back to writing on my space opera webnovel. So far it's not panning out well. But I still do my best even if it is never enough.

>>19763621
I was the one who threw out the idea, I think this version is a huge improvement. Things move at a much better clip and the language just felt more grounded in terms of vocab (a lot less talk about diaphrams lol) and painting the scene.

I think me and the other anon's points about paragraph length and too many extraneous details still stand (e.g. does it matter if it was the bull's left or right collar bone?) lthough less severe, could use some breaking up just for flow reasons. My only main suggestion at this point would be to experience the scene through the character way more -for example in the intro you describing him shivering from the cold was way more powerful as a reader than the preceding "telly" line calling it an ominous cold. More of that.

Is anyone else getting tired of magical realism in movies and tv as a crutch to bring spice and interest to our slavishly boring world? Like, what happened to classical literature’s realism? It’s as if realism today is saved for the ultra wealthy where money basically becomes magic. Do people write the depressing truth? I feel like any level of satire just turns into magical realism again, avoiding the painful truth.

>>19764813
magic should be magical and realism should be realistic simple as that

>>19764673
the last 3 chapters of this. I just need to tie up all the side character's very minor storylines and an epilogue and I'll be done! I hope you all buy it!
>>19763994
>>19764003

>>19764734
>extraneous details
my rule of thumb is that if I read it and can't see it but wonder about it I need the details, if I'm reading details and find it too intricate without any purpose then it's extraneous.
There's a fine line, it's highly subjective and determined by the reader, maybe there isn't an explanation other than intuition.

>>19764673
Just got two active projects right now.
I've got a book I'm finishing through a final edit now before I start hunting for beta readers and a professional editor. It's been almost two years as of April since my last book so I'm eager to get a new one out there.
I've got the first book in a heptalogy halfway finished and editing through because it's two books in one, so I want to make sure the first half is totally complete and ready before starting the second where things really can kick off for the main story.

>>19765039
I've been keeping up with it, so I'll give it a whirl

>>19763404
start right away. what are you waiting for?
>>19763877
i'm manic depressive. i write well during the mania and poorly during the depression if at all.

Finally managed to crank out a couple hundred words. good enough for now

>>19765675
Blimpy, what were your words about? Are you airship guy? I just watched a bunch of miyazaki movies this weekend and they were all about planes and how they are beautiful but always used to drop bombs and it was beautiful and I wish I could make something even 1/100th as beautiful as he does.

>>19765692
just a bit of exposition about the town my protagonist lives in. It's a little infodumpy, and I'll rework it later, but for the day i've had it was enough just to get something on paper.
Miyazaki's work is great, My favorite movie of his is Castle in the Sky. I'm not an anime guy, but Ghibli works well for me

>>19765708
>Castle in the Sky.
That's sort of on the noise, isn't it?

>>19765807
That was kinda the joke I was originally making. Many of Miyazaki's movies are about airplanes or flying. Naussica, Kiki, The Wind Rises, Porco Rosso, Castle in the Sky, (Poppy Hill does the same but with boats). Pretty neat. His family made plane parts for the war so he had some internal guilt I suppose.

>>19765838
Interesting.

I'm curious, what's your fascination with airships?

Also, give me a random color.

>>19765862
I'm not the airship guy, I'm burgerpunk guy talking to airship guy about the movies I watch as a catharsis for feeling emotion that just happen to have airships in them.


Turquoise. Like my grandpa's bolo ties.

>>19765875
Oh, sorry. I got mixed up. Thanks for helping me decide what color eyes to give this character though. It's a little detail, but one for some reason I kept waffling on.

Marketing anon here. Checking to see if you're going to market your book in a healthy way.
I recommend the self publishers podcast on spotify and a few weeks of self research.
Anyways, got the idea for my first book.
Funnily enough I had begun writing the second book first about two months ago.
I'll see those of you who listen in good places.

>>19765901
shoo, shoo

>>19765903
I'm not going anywhere I do not wish.
There's a few of you that can be saved from the trad pub slavery and those of you who wish you can self publish without any marketing.

>>19765901
Can't I just pay you ten percent to do all the marketing for me?

Fine. Can you at least specify which podcast? There's more than one.

>>19762171
Yes but not successful ones.

>getting caught up because 2 sections aren't as good as they should be and i need to add another layer
>rest of book has mostly unwritten or note-format sections
>spent 3 days in agony that it isnt good enough
>just occurred to me to leave a note to go back to and fuckign move on for now, especially because the sections are insular and wont affect anything else (for the range of changes i need to make, that is)
why am i like this

>>19765862
it's not a fascination, really. I like them, and they feature prominently in my writing. I just post with pictures of airships so people know it's me talking. I'm sure no one cares, but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

>>19762361
>4chan
Sir, this is 4channel not 4chan.

>>19765951
I cared enough to ask, lol.
How have they featured in your writing?

>>19765936
The problem with marketing books is you have to spend money on rigging algorithms

>>19763994
So is it corn dogs or hot dogs?
I need to know.

>>19765964
they're the primary method of long-range transportation in the world. Since it's pretty much one continent surrounded by smaller islands, boats are essentially useless. Airships are used for travel and transport. The journey undertaken by the protagonists is onboard an airship.

>>19765901
>>19765929
Actual marketing degree anon here.
Focus on your writing before you focus on your marketing. Marketing is incredibly simple for self publishing if you know your audience. You don't need a podcast for this.
>market your book in a healthy way.
Jesus anon.

>>19766010
>market your book in a healthy way.
Yes, and?

>>19765982
A hot dog is inside a corn dog

>>19766014
I don't think
>market your book in a healthy way
means anything.

>protag in my story has been drugged at least a dozen times over the course of volume one with everything from sedatives to mild hallucinogens
I didn't plot it out to be like this but it makes so much sense that a total retard like him just can't stop accidentally eating and drinking shit that he really shouldn't. Were it not for the setting's super-healing he would have died ages ago. I wonder if people will get annoyed by this.

>>19766010
Anon, assume that I know very little about marketing. How incredibly simple could it be? Even if I don't need to listen to a podcast, couldn't learning more about it help the process anyway?

>>19766038
I think I probably would, in fact, be annoyed by this. Is his food being poisoned or is he just eating mushrooms and stuff he finds on the ground?

Can I write gay fiction without having a gay sexual experience?

>>19766042
Weird food, sometimes accidentally touching dangerous plants, one time drinking a drink given to him by a friend that he didn't know was psychoactive, being shot with blowdarts one or twice, and I guess being gassed if that's what you call inhaling toxic fumes that fuck you up and make you delirious.

>>19766048
>Need to drive plot forward
>Protagonist passes out from drugs and wakes up in next scene
>no need to bother with transitions or any stupid stuff like that
genius

>>19766069
I won't deny that I've used it like that, but sometimes he's just fucked up but still conscious and getting his ass beat. People don't fight fair in this setting very often.

What books would you guys recommend to get a good idea of modern prose writing? Not as in a guide book like in OP, but actual examples of well-written contemporary books? I read a lot but not much fiction.

>>19766014
>>19766034
Blimp anon understands. It's an empty gesture that is only there because the author believes this is what marketing is.
You see the same shit in MLM scams all the time.
>You could have a healthy and meaningful career that works for you! Tupperware sale is built from the ground up for the woman on the move who knows what she wants in life!

>>19766039
You should already know who your audience is and where they congregate. Self service advertising is as simple as owning a credit card these days.
Like I said, focus on your writing before you focus on your marketing. You're not going to game the system by listening to some failed authors talks about marketing techniques. This is not a step forward, it is a distraction.

>>19765970
Awful take. You do not have to "rig algorithms" to market a book and you certainly don't need to pay for that. The only time I would actually recommend paid algorithm rigging is in the case of the Son of the Sun author I brought up a couple threads ago. SEO could actually alleviate the main issue I see with his marketing.

>>19766078
It's a mixed bag but there is a nice variety of different prose styles in there.

>>19766078
>well-written contemporary books
... d.n.e. contemporaries are retarded monkeys compared to some barely educated scribe from the 1800s, or even 800s. the state of current literature is abysmal.

>>19766098
>the state of current literature is abysmal
I know but surely there must be something? What about that House of Leaves book I've seen meme'd here?

>>19766096
Generally I avoid Penguin but I'll look into this

I started writing again. Going to aim for a page a day, maybe more.

>>19766113
>House of Leaves b
havent read but apparently it's just a meme all style over substance. i dont think good prose alone can make a good book. after you read something like that you might pseudpost about it for clout but it leaves you feeling hollow, like eating junkfood. everything contemporary is trash as far as i've seen. no matter what i pick up it's just abysmal. i try and try and try and everything is utter vapid trash.

>>19762126
I'm in trouble my bros.
The shit is deep and i don't think i can write myself out of it.

>>19766131
Maybe I'll just read some 20th century shit like McCarthy of Pynchon, they can't be horrible for how much they're universally lauded

>>19766139
i wasn't impressed by either but there are plenty of 20th c writers who are great. modern industry is being strangled to death by blue haired agents.

>>19766078
I really don't know. Unironically, the prose from books over the last twenty years that i've found flows the best is middle-grade stuff like picrel. I haven't read a book that you'd call "YA" in years, and fiction written for anyone older has fallen into this muddy, flowery, purple style and every author writes the same exact way.

>>19766155
People really need to just accept that writing for the average person these days means writing at an 8th to 10th grade level. There's nothing wrong with simple, legible prose. Being able to make something hard to read for the uneducated doesn't make somebody intelligent, it makes them allergic to success.

>>19766182
I want to make beautiful, multi-layered, nuanced novels with tight prose, complex meaning, and characters who can't fit into a YA archetype.

Commercial success and long term literary success are two different things. I have a dayjob. I'm going to write beautifully.

>>19766192
None of those things necessitate sounding like you're jacking off to your PhD in Classical Literature while writing them. People in this general just can't understand that simple or average language doesn't mean simple or average story. When people here say "tight prose" they mean "uses words no common person uses in every sentence", which is the opposite of tight prose. In reality, bring unable to communicate a complex narrative without creating overly complex writing is a sign of low skill or deliberate elitism.

Something a little different today, boys. No writing prompt needed. Please be gentile, but also feedback and crit always welcome.

https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/36209/burgerpunk-pizza-time/chapter/826989/yesterday-i-watched-a-film

>>19766206
I don't exactly do that to that level. However, I am upgrading my prose past what common people might find comfortable. One responsibility of an author is to uphold, maintain, and further the language in which he writes. You can see this in the example of Ferdowsi singlehandedly saving the Persian language. I don't speak like I ejaculated a thesaurus and a copy of Joyce's complete works onto the ms. However, I'm not going to dumb it down--opposite, I intend to dress it up and preserve a larger chunk of the English language to fight against decay to the lowest common demoninator.

>>19766222
>One responsibility of an author is to uphold, maintain, and further the language in which he writes
Wew lad. Firstly, no, that's the most idealized shit I've heard in my life. Secondly, that task is basically impossible for one person to do. Thirdly, you're advancing or preserving nothing when you make your work inaccessible for the common person. Shit like this is why the term "ivory tower" exists.

>>19766233
>basically impossible for one person to do.
>already provided you the starlight example of one person doing exactly that
and, you illiterate mongrel, did I say i was undertaking it singlehandedly? no. faggot. I seek to elevate the English language and assist in its preservation at a greater state than the current year decline of intellectualism will devolve it into.

now eat a bowl of spicy, liquid shit and cope. i will not dumb my writing down. i will elevate myself and all of humanity with me.

>>19766266
You don’t need to dumb down your writing if that post is any sign of the rest of your work.

>>19766282
seethe and resort to such a cope that a 20 second 4chinz post is the same qualtiy i write with

Hey
HEY!
Write about that girl you had a crush on.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KFq2pU21cNU

Okay so I'm following Story Genius and there's this part right after you write the "traumatic backstory moment when your character got their misbelief set in stone", where you have to create scenes which will reinforce the misbelief. I'm having a hard time here.

I'll try my best to synthesize the context: "MC is a mermaid from a lake, part of a an elite class of singing sirens. She dreamed of finding outer waters but after her SO died (was caught by fishermen) some years ago she started to hate the idea. She has a schizo friend which insists the lake will "bleed into the vastness". There's a landslide and it actually happens. Now she's lost at the sea on a quest to find a new home."

Basically Siddhartha Gautama but in the sea.

I'm trying to come up with ideas for scenes that will reinforce her misbelief that "searching other places is foolish and dangerous and I'm stupid and weak for wanting that". Still stuck at that part, I even came up with something but all became scrap.

>>19766490
Have her be brought aboard a fishing trolley where she can see the horrors her SO went through.
Any sort of misery porn would do honestly but I like this one. Reinforces her death, contextualizes it and gives MC a very good reason to keep to her comforts when she does escape.

>>19765498
I know this is beginning to stray from writing but do you take any medication for it? I was diagnosed a while ago but stopped taking the meds as I felt I could manage on my own. After a bit of a rough patch I'm not so sure anymore.

>>19766131
The "minotaur" part of the book is ok, a bit unsettling in a weird way. I liked it. The other part of the book is just complete shit and should be avoided.

>>19766487
No, as thinking of her makes me want to kill myself.

>>19764734
Thanks again for your input, I do feel it’s helped a lot. I will reread with your thoughts in mind and see how it flows to me but I do like some specifics. Since this is an excert of a larger story for exercise purposes, on a re-write for use I will write in the main character so that might personalize the tone as you said.

>>19765078
What would your opinion be, in this vain, on the piece that the guy you are replying to is referring?

Spoke to the publisher earlier today, and it looks like I made the cut. They're still sorting through some other manuscripts, but they said I should expect to be sent a contract by next week.

>>19766774
I envy you.

>>19763188
Like, writing meaningless stuff without goal and some time, at some point somehow it start to turn up being good? I never got this if you want to write just-write type of advise.

>>19766837
>if you keep practicing, somehow someday magically you get better? I never got this just practice type of advice
That is what you essentially said.

>>19766837
>meaningless
I challenge you to write something that's genuinely meaningless.

>>19766837
You people need to get yourself a coach. As in like an actual coach for sports and shit. Your problem is simple, you don't want to practice. Inside of your head is this thing called a brain. It's a muscle like any other in your body.
Motherfuckers don't run marathons on day one, and you won't write a novel on your first attempt. Start things simple and easy. Write a little bit today and a little bit tomorrow. In a few months you'll be able to write as much as you please.
If you're serious about writing you've got to put in the hours. Every single word that passes onto the page loosens up the virginal sphincter that is your brain. It's a lot easier to write what you want after you've learned how to write in the first place.

>>19766490
>Story Genius
>traumatic backstory moment
I hope the overwhelming irony of the title isn't lost on you

>>19766851
Yes, put better, or same information packed in less characters = idea /meaning more easy to grasp. You made a good point on how making the code/text more efficient is one aspect of better coding/writing.
>>19766857
Ah, yes. It’s impossible because human brain concocts meaning from everything. Even nothingness has meanings attached into it. A true Zen book would be white book without any print anywhere at all. It could be one page or hundred pages long or a paperback or a hardcover. Different page counts and formats would suggest different meanings.
>>19766872
Excellent advice. Maybe the just write thing thing is to just write in any way comes easiest. Some day it will be goofing around the boards, some day your diary, some day writing exercises and someday the big project itself. It’s easy to obsess about the big project and sit with it and call the white paper a block or a missing muse.

>>19764673
I'm working on my human x alien girl sci fi space opera romance.

Also my ongoing horror serial about haunted houses.

>>19766701
Anytime, glad it helped and appreciate you being so receptive. I was curious is the larger context of the story historical fiction or more of a modern occultism/mystery? I'm the kind of person who's already watched a documentary on Mithrism so possibly your target demo.

>>19766774
Congrats, how does it feel?

>>19767157
This is a metaphorical nightmare essentially experienced after a turning point in the story by the main character, which is essentially a modern political thriller with some vague allusions to occultism

>>19766731
The details are fine to my reading, the problem is that it's written in 3rd person but with 1st person knowledge, the narrator knows things that only the man should know (unless the narrator has some kind of omniscient power, or is retelling or something, that's fine it's an excerpt after all). This I find jarring, there's too many sentences beginning with "he" followed by some internally known only to the character exposition, it's not the details themselves but the way they are presented.
I'm not sure what to do, maybe switch tense between sentences could work like camera angle perspectives

>>19767294
Thank you for your input, I agree with the overuse of repeating sentence structures.

In terms of the perspective, being in third person while having knowledge directly in the protagonists point of view is common from books I’ve read, maybe if my structuring was better and the exert was in context it would be clearer?

>>19767318
>being in third person while having knowledge directly in the protagonists point of view
It's ok, I think if it's consistent and that's what you're going for keep at it

>>19766211
Too bloggy? Not stream of consciousness enough? Jarring jumps in prose? Needs more footnotes and citations?

>>19767318
Surely there's a bunch of ways to vary up scentence structures. Honestly i don't see any issues to this narration style except making it somewhat difficult to write scenes where your character is trying to be secretive to the audience for suspense perhaps. I've written a lot with this narration style, though one step further with the secondary character also getting the treatment.

>>19766211
>>19767537
Read it. I'm just a casual reader but it got a bit tiresome with how many short sentences were used to describe and redescribe the same thing, often the times in a row. For example "A limbo of emotional meaning. A satisfaction rarely felt. A pleasure that is based in pain." It's fine if it happens once, but it was a reoccurring thing that got a bit stale. Otherwise it was alright.

>>19767641
I knew it was something that I couldn't quite put my finger on. Thank you, anon. I will keep that in mind next time.

>>19767660
No worries anon, keep fighting the good fight!

As I'm writing my novel my mind keeps picturing what my books cover is going to look like, and what the first impression of an average normal is going to be upon viewing it. I really want that first impression to capture people into it. I'm writing a sci fi so it's pretty easy to just put some aliens on the cover i suppose. Does anyone else keep thinking about their cover art or am i just autistic?

>>19767731
Seems normal, I think. Part of it is also wondering what art of your novel would look like. Tbh I wish I could draw to bring to reality how I envision the cover of the novel I'm currently writing.

I'm trying to find a more pithy way to say "the easiest people to trick are the ones who think they're tricking you".
Any ideas?

>>19767731
I'm so far from ever getting published I don't want to daydream about it, but I'd like to go for minimalism. Just a silhouette in one color on a background with one or two colors.

>>19767731
I guess it's like fixating on what your back cover hook will be, or what quote to put on the first page. Not super helpful for actual writing, but no real harm in thinking about it.

>>19767771
It's easier to fool those who think are doing the fooling. / Ain't no one easier to fool than those who think are doing the fooling.
Those who think are the players are the easiest to play.

>>19767731
Right now I am hanged the fuck up on a title for my books. It came so easily for my first two and my third was a fight, and now I am at a near complete loss.

>>19767608
I think the issue just comes from it being unedited in a sense with the sentence structure, something that when writing hastily you don’t notice the repetition. I read Crime & Punishment recently and it seemed quite clear in using this perspective in situations where people are lying and being sneaky (I know I am not Dostoyevsky but shows it can be done)

>>19767771
I'm trying something new.
>A self-satisfied cheat convinced of his own inability to fail exposes himself to even the bumbling swindles of the amateur.

>want to write a story
>get distracted by my own fetishes
>story immediately falls apart
this is punishment for my sins, isn't it

Here is a writing exercise:
>Write a plot synopsis in around 1 minute. After you finish write a short story no longer than 5k words.
Try to share it on here, that way you can get some feedback on something you put out.

>>19767945
Sounds fun, might do it in a bit. Would be nice to have some prompts to inspire some creativity.

>>19767945
>a writer sits down, focuses on the act of writing, and allows what comes to come without constraint or regard for what others think
This is the plot of everything I've ever written. I fucking hate artificial """"plot"""". It creates the prefect preconditions for a writer to jump neatly from plot point to plot point, taking care I'm sure to meet your Daily Word Count, and thereby create a soulless, overly-formalized work characterized by order and rigidity and the living essence of artlessness.

>>19767902
write a pseudo-biographic story about a man being distracted from working by his own fetishism

>>19767999
ugh, but that's so passé

>>19767902
Learn better impulse control

>>19767997
This exercise is not meant for you to write something you would want to be published on a literary journal or something, anon. It is just a way to practice your writing, no different to the /ffa/ threads we had on here.

>>19767945
I'll do this tonight.

>>19768002
not if the man is a siamese twin and the story is written down after the death of the writer twin in the final hours of the surviving twin, who can't use the arms therefore can't write, his story is recorded in secret by a nurse who asks him questions whilst he gradually slips deeper into the morphine

>>19768028
Sounds like something Jodo would do.

>>19768028
Oh shit. No, I got it. It's the story of a man plagued by the fetishes of his conjoined twin. The conjoined twin is actually psychic, and influences the people around the protagonist to distract him whenever he tries to do anything. The story is his attempt at reaching out to people without tipping off his conjoined twin. It's all double-speak.

>>19767876
oh wow, that's the opposite of what I'm looking for

>>19767771
it's easy to trick a trickster?
I'm pretty sure I've heard that somewhere before

>>19767771
or, it's easy to con a conman?

>>19768068
I now realize I forgot the meaning of the word pithy. Carry on

>>19768005
no

>>19768092
Then suffer like the animal you are

I’ll be in and out of this thread for a bit throughout the day, so if you have questions ask them. I’ll try and reply, just depends on the amount of work I get.

I work in the industry, been published, been trained, etc etc. I don’t know everything but I know most things.

>>19767157
>Congrats, how does it feel?
It's hard to say, because I kinda blew my load last month when another publisher seemed prepared to lock in a deal before they ended up pulling out at the last second due to too many other projects. So, they sent me to this new publisher that they knew and gave me a rec to push me to the front of their line. Hopefully, this one doesn't get second thoughts at the last second too. Because of this, I'm saving the actual celebration until I've received, read, and signed the actual contract. Only then will I know for sure it's actually real.

>>19768214
Oh you're that anon? Congrats on the second guys not giving you a runaround this time. How hard do you think they're going to scalp you on royalties? Are they making you do all the marketing yourself?

>>19762126
The Solar Archetype MMXXII

You’ve woken and your conquering,
Like a lightning bolt in my mind
Your gold edged soul flowering,
Your eyes a cold flame unkind
Herald of the end, bringer of destruction
Fallen down, so Realm may rise again
Prophecy shall no longer be obstruction,
But let us return to where you begin

You were summoned, incarnate for a cause,
To hunt for devils, to clear the weak
To destroy the order, to establish divine law,
But for now you are blind, you are meek
You know not of the network, nor of the histories,
You know not of the struggle, nor of what shall be
But you shall know the truth, you shall know mystery,
For even now, you posses the Apollonian key

Who knew the Solution was born to Babel,
The world passes, it is gilded and boring
Your moods are silent, but you hate rabble,
Each day is sour, cold is each morning
Purity of blood, ill tempered aristocrat,
Without purpose, without challenge
A lost son of Ra, a lost child of Ma’at,
But though hidden, you are savage

The gold edged plain, the vast open space,
Like a sharp dream, like a sudden vision
Huge forms lumber, shaman forms race
With the prize ahead, appears a mission
To search and find, to target, and to prey,
To pull the trigger, to master gas and lead
And upon the taiga, a striped beast lay
Your now a killer, yet rest easy in bed

The crystal steppe, the white frozen hell,
Like a foggy nightmare, like a wrong turn
Machines rumble, engines drown Church bell
With the goal ahead, you are ordered to burn,
To terrorize, to topple, to ravage resistance,
To serve the Alliance, to maintain and assert
But upon the Arctic lies, your kin of distance
You feel like a traitor, you must desert

The cotton crawling skies, so blue and free,
Like a prophecy, like a utterance from God
Oceans roll below, lands come over the sea
With the duty ahead, with principle like a rod
To travel towards, to condemn, and to purge,
To serve the Sun, to secure sentient life
For the need to annihilate, is an ancient urge
You drop warhead, a cure for the Earth, but to False Teacher and Temple Builder a knife

>>19768195
What, in your opinion, makes something 'publishable'?

>>19768234
From the pre-contract discussions, the royalties are actually going to be pretty good. However, I will be doing most of the marketing after the initial pre-order rollout, so that is a tradeoff.

>>19768292
Good idea, good execution, with decent spelling/grammar.

Most publishers today don’t want to spruce up your work or go through the process of substantial editing, as it takes too much time and money. (It’s why pure substantial editors are dying out which is sad.) Instead they look for something that’s basically almost done, and done pretty dammed well. Smaller publishers might take on a more rough piece, but it depends on the publisher.

As for what makes a good idea, it’s random. Every publisher and editor has a different opinion and there’s no real way to know what will get big. That being said heavy violence/gore/sexual assault (especially towards minors) content tend to be overlooked as it won’t hit mainstream audiences as much. However there are expeditions to the rule constantly.

>>19768195
Your thoughts on "hybrid" publishers and their aims to separate themselves from the stigma of "vanity" publishers?

>>19767902
Stop being a coomer and find God.

>>19762202
If the politics are something cool like 14th century monarchs or 5000 BC cheiftains then yeah they can be cool. Modern politics is just I AM SILLY.

Do you ever feel like your soul is going to wither and die here and now? If it were a person it would be screaming and starving, begging for its life.
The world is like sand paper against me for no reason at all. Pressing against my temples are the everything and everywhere, wanting to be noticed, to be fixed.
I know there is good and true, it escapes me and then you cannot even remember the sun.
I go hungry and sleepless, for the temporary escapes in food and deathlike pit I fall into afterwards. My dreams are indeed sweet and obsessed and I'm overworked. Not knowing where to turn to get this beauty and calm. Love is just a miserable lie, and the rest is worse, a grey indistinguishable muck.
Why is it politically incorrect to acknowledge that things are bad? Not in the political or edgy sense, but in something vital missing.
Some times, all of the times, I wish for someone stronger to say that is okay and wrap me in his arms, or for some ideological or political belief to sweep me off my feet. But these are lazy solutions. I cannot trust others' judgement and have to find the answer myself. At least, maybe with others, it would not be so cold all the time?

>>19767902
Delete the fetishes and start over. Keep doing this until you stop adding them.

Aerosols though WTF is “litrpg “? I read a description in Wikipedia and I’m still not clear. It’s like choose your own adventure fan fiction?

>>19763215
>Start writing story
>Did I finish it? No?
>Start new story.
>Did I finish it? Yes?
>Start new story.

>>19767902
Create a setting where you can freely include your fetishes. I made sure my story was built around their inclusion. They’re getting added either way so this it may as well make sense.

How long can a short story be before you just need to expand it into a novel? I'm getting up to 8.5k words on one and this don't look short to me no mores

>>19768340
Fuck em honestly. I get what they are trying to do, and why they are trying to do it, but they are still too close to vanity presses to be viewed differently by me. Most of them don’t survive long term anyways so it gives you an idea of how much they are used/how effective they are.

Traditional publishing can suck at times, and I don’t like where it’s heading, but it’s a damned better alternative than the other things out there. Also small publishers beat out hybrid.

>>19768329
Thanks for the answer.
What do you think are the new trends that will are starting now that will become mainstream in the incoming years?

>>19768441
That's still very much short story territory.

>>19768458
If your asking about book trends/genres who knows. No one ever knows what will or won’t be popular, and anyone who tells you different is trying to sell you something. That being said dystopian fiction will probably still struggle thanks to the pandemic.

As for industry/publishing trends? Not sure. The pandemic proved that online book launches/online events aren’t that popular and won’t attract attention, so once things get back in person don’t expect them to continue. They might be integrated with live events (which is my hope) at most, so you can either watch online or in person, but it remains to be seen. Smaller events/small publisher events should become more popular/frequent once the pandemic is up since maybe smaller publishers opened up/found success during it. So look out for those.

Only other trend is the one that’s still continuing which is pure substantial editors getting the boot, since it’s not as profitable to keep them anymore. If you are an editor, you need all three types now.

>>19767815
God titles are the worst. Same with character names or unique names for towns, creatures, items, etc. You might be able to get one or two figured out, but the rest start to feel halfassed or "good enough" and never really grow on you.

That, or you start to get too into the lore and start huffing your own farts and make it unreadable for the average person. You end up with a sentence like "Drumion leapt off the Zayghos, and headed towards Brazicrerth, following the sun as it set over the Voissinies landscape". I feel like this only ever worked for Bionicle, personally.

>>19768441
<500: drabble
500-1000: flash fiction
1000-8000: short story
8000-24000: novelette
24000-60000: novella
60000+: novel

>>19768372
zoomer coomer schlock
it's all self published.

>>19768617
So I'm writing a novelette. Fascinating.

>another morning another rejection

>>19768817
What's your novel about

Is there a free/open-source equivalent to Word? Just got a new laptop and don't feel like spending $150 just to do final edits and formatting of my work

>>19768867
Google docs? It's pretty good.

>>19768870
>Google
One of the few companies worse than Mircrodick. Absolutely not

>>19768867
pen and paper will always be there for you

>>19768880
>final edits and formating
>FINAL
You can't exactly send a handwritten manuscript anymore.

>>19768867
Libre Open Office

>>19768817
>high volume of submissions
I always feel this is bullshit when they say it 99% of the time.

>>19768887
practice your penmanship or use a stencil that makes your handmade manuscript indistinguishable from a printed one.

>>19768894
yeah, this is what I've been seeing. Thanks, borther.

>>19768897
I respect your enthusiasm, and in a sane world I would be right there with you. Alas, we do not live in a sane world, so we much suffer the realities of this one.

>>19768446
As long as you're not getting fleeced in the initial fee (by opting to do a lot of the work they would charge you for yourself), I don't see a problem with a hybrid publisher if they've been around for 5+ years and their published author list has credible-looking people/books, if only in more out-there/specialized topics. I think hybrid independents are two steps above vanity and one step above self-published. I might be wrong, but I feel you have a better chance of graduating to a "real" publisher for a second book if your first was successful from a hybrid rather than from a vanity or self. Greenleaf Book Group comes to mind as a credible hybrid publisher for business books, and it's been around for over 20 years. I actually got rejected by them once for not having enough marketability, so they clearly were selective despite being a hybrid.

anyone here actually published a novel that can give some writing advice?

>>19769010
This guy >>19768195

>>19768329
>>19768195
How 'active' should the first chapter be? Is it harder to get a foot in the door with a slower-paced opening? In my one manuscript the protagonist starts out meek and finds courage through the story's progression. In the other the protagonist doesn't appear until chapter 3, although otherwise there is a major and interesting conflict set up in the first chapter. from agent profiles it seems like they all want a grrrrrl-power mouthy active vulgar edgy and energetic character to start out kicking ass and trash-talking everyone from page 1.

>>19768895
Yes, it absolutely is. Also happens when you call into your bank or a government agency. It's just a way to justify their subpar customer support or lack of staff.

>>19768195
any advice for someone who's never been to college(so zero contacts) trying to get published? I've got a few novels written and edited a few times, but now I'm not sure what to do beyond "get an agent," which I also don't know anything about.

>>19769167
Not him, but I'm curious about this too. You can have a complex story with compelling characters, but what is the best way to get a reader into it?
Begin with a description of the environment and situation?
Some dialogue between two characters?
A huge infodump about the world and characters?
Middle of a fight scene?
Monologue by the main character?
There's so many options, my god.

>>19768195
Question specifically for historical fiction,
Do publishers want something upmarket/intellectual (Gore Vidal's Julian) or something with more lowbrow/mass appeal (Stephen Saylor, maybe Colleen Mccullough's First man in rome). The former is more tight, multi-layered, literary, and difficult for normalfags to approach if they don't have a background in the stuff because it won't hold their hand. The latter tends to be almost like genrefiction (fantasy, or game of thrones) but with a historical theme and no magic, has more base appeal to violence action etc and more approachable characters and down-written so you don't need prerequisites to read it. Which do publishers want?

Well, this metric is improving at least.

Sadly, it seems that this webnovel venture will do less to advertise my book launch that I had hoped.

>>19766538
What do you mean "keep to her comforts"?

>>19768950
The marketing they do is usually minimal.
Whenever someone says that self publishing, or even hybrid, is an option, I always ask “what’s the last big book that was self published/hybrid published?” Usually “The Martian” is the answer as it’s the only viable one.

While getting published by a hybrid opens gates for traditional publishing, does does traditional publishing. Going to smaller publishers, chapbook publishers and literary magazines to get work published is just as effective as hybrid publishing is, and it doesn’t leave you with a heap of books that won’t sell.

I agree it’s better than self publishing. And I try not to poo-pah it too much, but it still doesn’t hold a candle to traditional. Those in the industry however, do tend to look down on it however.

>>19769010
Depends on the writing advice you need. Are you struggling with maintaining a decent writing schedule? Are you having trouble with ideas? Is it the publishing side that’s difficult? Etc.

Otherwise I can only really say “rite gud” and be leaf in yourself

>>19769233
post your story ill read it

>>19769295
https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/49395/the-undying-emperor

Sure, I'd appreciate getting bumped over the 900 mark. I'm averaging like, one follower a week, which I guess is a functional trend for my purposes

I was listening to a podcast earlier, and the host mentioned the best way to get someone to buy and read your book was to already have a following from some other venture. Like an artist amassing a following via art of their story before selling someone the book, or a YouTuber getting high subscriber counts before selling them a book with a similar overlap of their channel content. Of course, that implies you've got your own second job/hobby that attracts other people.

>>19769167
>>19769192
For getting publishers interested, it doesn’t matter too much. You submit a selection of chapters/tailored piece to the publisher so having a slower first chapter won’t possibly turn them off. It can if they decide they want to fix it and it’s too much effort to fix, but by then they’ve shown interest and it might mean a different publisher might want to pick it up. So to each their own. So long as you’ve got a decently well put together book with interesting characters you should be fine. (All this being said btw, having your main character introduced in chapter 3 can be tough, especially to keep readers engaged. Getting your audience connected with your main character is important. So maybe intro them in chapter one, take focus off in chapter two, then go back chapter three kinda deal.)


As for getting reader interest, it depends on the genre in all honesty. As the second guy said there’s a ton of options, and honestly they are all viable.

>Begin with a description of the environment and situation?
>Some dialogue between two characters?
>Middle of a fight scene?
>Monologue by the main character?
Those are all viable and good openings.

>A huge infodump about the world and characters?
This is the only one I wouldn’t do. It can be done, especially in the mystery or horror genre, but it’s hard to pull off. If you do do it, combine it with a main character monologue so we get an idea of who they are.

Really what matters for a first chapter Is what you think the audience should know first. What’s important? What do you want to give away/show. Where do you like to start? Don’t worry about what’s “good worry about what you think is important. It can be ironed out later.

>>19769337
Generally true. But you can also grow it yourself through a few different ways, none of which involves shilling on Twitter

>>19769261
In my experience, hybrids are for people who can't get in the door for their niche at a traditional publisher, have zero problem marketing themselves so long as the publisher prints, but are just really anal about wanting the "publishing house" name and logo, believing it lends them a legitimacy that a CreateSpace logo just doesn't, especially in non-fiction fields. Again, see Greenleaf, which has a lot of PhDs publishing stuff with a small audience but in a way that doesn't hurt their academic credibility the way self-publishing might, but also isn't as limiting as an academic press.

It's been over half a year since I last touched my wip (43k - just under the halfway point). I received some harsh but really valid (and much needed) criticism on it. I'm low on motivation, but I'm currently wondering whether I should continue, start over, or start a new project. Thoughts?

>>19769422
>low on motivation
motivation is a false god. Discipline is what finishes books. It's simply putting yourself in the chair and working. I don't care if you spend three days in a row just looking at the blinking cursor. Spend at least an hour writing every day and you'll end up with a finished project at some point.

As for your question, do you feel the story deserves to be told? Are you still interested in it? If the answer to both those questions is "yes," then keep working on it. Even if you end up having to go back and rewrite a majority of it, you'll at least have the roadmap and know where you're going and how to reinforce the weak points the second time around.

>>19769457
>motivation is a false god. Discipline is what finishes books
I agree.
I guess I have to kick myself in the ass and get to it, then; leave the errors to the second draft. Thanks.

>>19769177
Starting with smaller publishers/chapbooks and literary magazines is always the best starting place. It gives you small connections but also shows you are actively interested in the industry itself. Also also it shows that you are publishable and able to work with editors rather well. I’d also say go to events, but pandemic has kind of screwed that.

Another thing to do is build a base. Get a twitter following, or instagram, etc. get people interested so that you can show numbers to publishers.

As for getting an agent, get someone who believes in your work. Don’t settle for less. I know that sounds big novel types but that’s what you should regardless of position.

>>19769359
What are some of the ways to grow it yourself? And what are the typical projected numbers in that regard?

I figure there's got to be a min required following count to ensure your book will be moderately successful. For example, 20k Twitter/Youtube/Facebook/etc. followers might net you 500 sales per month.

>>19769567
>smaller publishers/chapbooks
I honestly know none. Is there some kind of list? I know someone posted a list of magazines in these threads a while back I have, but not outright publishers.

>social media bullshit
No. This is a "can not do" thing for me. I've always been shit with it and I do not need that noise in my life. Honestly, I was hoping to make the lack of social media a "thing" about me as a writer. The active rejection of that shit. I'm sure there's types who will glom on because of that. The most I'd be willing to do is some kind of weekly blog/journal thing.

>>19769599
Publishers always want a website for your book. Instead, make a website as a home base for you, possibly with your name, with the book as just a page on the greater site. That way you can run everything internally. Even better if you can supplement it with smaller writings, additional content, etc.

>>19769599
Not him, but I know a lot of popular writers are essentially celebrities with a writing side-gig, but in many cases the idea is to sell your book, its story, setting, etc.

Could probably do more research into it, but you can't expect your book to market itself. NGMI with that attitude. I've successfully marketed my video game, and while it's not a book, it was a matter of swallowing your ego and do what's best for your product. For me, that meant making social media accounts for my product, products videos, game development blogs, website, Discord server, etc. It wasn't me talking about myself in this marketing, but talking about my game and marketing what makes it unique and showing screenshots and gameplay.

Only once I had a large enough following of like 100k total followers across all accounts, I went into launch. If I expected my game to be a success at launch just because I was underground and indie, it would have been a disaster. It's probably similar for books.

>>19769758
>at 100 on Facebook
I'm fucked aren't I.

>>19769844
Actually, unless your primary market is boomers, you're probably fine. Despite my game having a large number on other socials, Facebook is only at 2k, and the engagement there is essentially nonexistent. It's not been a good indicator of success, in my experience. However, this is a video game and I assume gamers generally aren't going to be on Facebook, whereas readers may be.

When it comes to your following, you should probably engage them regularly. Every week/other week you need something up there to boost the algorithm and keep relevancy. Also improves your Search Engine Optimization, so when people eventually do search for your book title, it will show up as an active and healthy page with information and buy links.

>go to bed
>Ponder how to better my scene
>Dream an amazing way to rewrite a scene
>Wake up
>Can't remember anything
Fuck.

>>19769942
sometimes i write while dreaming. i can see the words in typeface and everything.

>>19769922
I post a new flash fiction every week and usually one time during the week itself I make a general post about the work I'm doing, updates, or etc. I've been trying to get ideas on how to wedge myself deeper into Goodreads and Smashwords but consistency on Facebook is the most I've managed this month.

I hope you don't write with purple prose

>>19770000
Excuse me Mister Quads, but I prefer my sentences dense, concise, and literally riddled with metaphors

>>19770000
I try to keep it to the footnotes

>>19769969
Write about why Hermit crabs steal shells

>>19770000
i've had sentences containing 12 commas before, none of them lists, and i'll do it again.

>>19769348
>You submit a selection of chapters/tailored piece to the publisher so having a slower first chapter won’t possibly turn them off.
thanks, I didn't know that was how they did it.
>>19769567
>As for getting an agent, get someone who believes in your work. Don’t settle for less.
how can this be done, from our perspective? unknowns struggle just to get any agent to accept us, let alone can we be choosy. i do read the agent's profile to make sure their tastes match up with what i have (though a lot of times they are too vague for that to be helpful), but that isn't going to ensure that they LOVE our work.

Stupid question: Does publishing entail many obligations for the writer? Say I want to publish a novel and get in touch with whatever channels are necessary. Will I be able to publish just that one novel without being forced to get into a contract that obligates me to keep writing? What if I just want to publish the one book?

>>19770429
Publishers, from what I learned, want to secure multiple books (or the potential for multiple books). This is so, if your book hits, then people are more inclined to buy other books that you've written. Also there's the whole thing of book tours and other business and marketing things.
Publishing is a business, and like all businesses, they want to make profit.

>gave ms to friend to read after he begged me multiple times to let him
>he hasn't read it
>hasn't finished even the first chapter
>wasn't even aware it was a novel, for some reason thought it was a short story or something despite my working on it for months and telling him repeatedly it was a novel
>he's had ample free time (was sick and bedridden) and preferred browing /r/all

honestly i wish i never gave it to him
>>19770429
not him but many agents stress they want an author who can write many books not just a one-off. why would you do that anyway?

>set formatting
>fine the entire time
>suddenly won't auto-indent on a new line to the same amount as previous
fuck formatting why is this shit so complicated

>>19769279
I am 15k our of 50k words into my historical novel

do you recommend building a habit of writing to a word count or for a set amount of time?

If I am struggling with what comes next, should i go super in depth plotting character arcs and scenes down to every 100 word increments, or should I just keep on writing whatever i can come up with in my head, and then do all that plotting in my second draft?

If you dont have time to answer anything, could you at least provide writing resources on scene and character arc construction that you personally use.

>>19770766
hey fren. unless you're writing YA, the minimum for historical novels is 80k just fyi. why dont you google it.

I can only write dialog, how to body language etc

>>19770819
Unironically go read some H. G. Wells. Invisible Man is short and on Gutenberg

Cranked out a thousand, thought it sucked, did it again. My protagonist acted in a way that was completely inconsistent with his character, and I just plowed on through without noticing. Bit of wasted time, but I'm happy with the second attempt

I was going to ask for beta readers here and then I realized once the book goes up my real name and face will be stapled to it so there goes that idea. But I can always participate in whatever /ffa/'s dead general does.

>>19763308
>>19768014
>>19769969
>>19771146

Just a reminder, between official generals /ffa/ still exists…and it’s haunting /wg/!

While /ffa/ is between official volumes, we’re joining /wg/ for those who want to practice writing and discussing flash fiction!

How it works:
1. Choose a prompt (full list of unused prompts in following post)
2. Write a story 1,000 words or less based on the prompt
3. Post it in /wg/ with the tag [for FFA]
4. Add a new prompt for the list

Anyone posting for the /ffa/ accepts that their work may be made available online (Creative Commons) or in print (available for purchase at lowest possible cost).

There’s only the lightest editing (typos, etc) so garbage-in garbage-out. While there are not quality/content requirements (aside from porn, extreme abuse or gore) that doesn’t guarantee all submissions get added.

Prior three volumes available for free (pdf, epub):
https://archive.org/details/@_lit_anthology

And print (low cost) here:
https://www.lulu.com/en/us/shop/anonymous-/gifts-evil-and-good/paperback/product-mgwkgv.html
https://www.lulu.com/en/ca/shop/anonymous-/rags-and-bones/paperback/product-9d7gp2.html
https://www.lulu.com/en/us/shop/anonymous-/simian-deluxe/paperback/product-y6z687.html

>>19771192
>Unused prompts
A closet full of skin suits
A dating app with extraordinary risks and rewards
The academy of Paranormal Life Coaching
This will be India in 5 minutes
What? I can’t hear you!
A first responder who summons tornadoes
A grizzled detective goes undercover on 4chan
You reap what you sow
"Please don't forget what I told you"
The location the GPS took them to seems to be a little off
A tapestry constantly being added to
Murder in the Cathedral's sanctuary
The cellar houses wine and... bodies?
Finding a one-of-a-kind book in the library stacks
A co-worker has a hidden talent
A shut-in decides to go trick-or-treating
The best way to die on a dessert island
Horrible timing for a pregnancy announcement
A game of twister at a nursing home
There is a ship museum in Utah
A librarian goes blind every Thursday
Someone crashes a child’s birthday party
POV of an alley cat in Istanbul
An unusual item at the bottom of the sea
Pina coladas and long walks in the rain
A gateway opens between hell and earth
a slasher villain's first date
An elevator that doesn't work
>A flooded castle, sinking into the mud [In progress]
Why robot teachers were discontinued
A very lost succubus
Gender Selection Day
The whales save themselves
Elevators have been portals this entire time
Seven-year-old serial killer
>A minor god trying to prove its existence [in progress]
Japanese ghost fish
The hitman hired to kill himself
What lives beneath the moss
An embarrassing phobia

>open to adding any new ones on

>>19771197
identical twin brothers marry identical twin sisters. on the exact same day, they decide to pull the "switch places and live each others lives" trope. So they're still with their original spouse, but they think they're with each others.

Anon from about 18 months ago, came to tell you negroes I made it. 67 reviews on my first book so far after only 90 days or so.
No I won’t help you, no I won’t post it so you can review bomb it.
You assholes dug your own graves by putting me down. Fuck off, hope your book is shit.

>>19771235
self pubbed or trad?

>>19771235
congratulations, anon. I hope you have a successful career : )

>>19771226
That’s a bit prescriptive for a prompt…best to keep it open-ended (twins trade places). The best prompts tend to allow the author to come up with the direction the story takes.

>>19771272
true. I've just had that idea floating around in my head for a while, wasn't supposed to be a serious addition

>>19771235
>Fuck off, hope your book is shit.
Couldn’t’ve happened to a better guy!

>>19771192
Oh thank Christ. I thought you were fucking dead.

>>19771197
I did submit a short for "What? I can't hear you!" some time back. If the guy running it has lost it, I have the copy still

>>19771312
Nah, just disheartened. Only one /wg/ anon ever finished a prompt (“What? I can’t hear you!”).

I thought /ffa/ could be slow, but anons in /wg/ seem particularly challenged to finish what they start (I suppose it’s a self-selection bias)

>>19771326
Thomas Arling and Melody…don’t worry, anon, it’s safely tucked away along with a few others from old /ffa/ threads.

>>19771351
I can do at least one of these a week. But then there may not much point in the "ffa" anthology if most of them are just from one person.

>>19769305
>>19769295
So I did tip over 900. Thanks anon

>>19771197
>A shut-in decides to go trick-or-treating
given my ass is 5'4, I could easily do this without nasty looks with the right costume.

How many curse words are allowed in YA? I think i put too many bitches, whores, and sluts in my story. I avoided Fuck, but I still think the other 3 curse words may be too much.

>>19771371
just write your story and the editor will tell you, assuming it gets published

>>19771375
I'm 90% self publishing. I don't want to find or pay an agent. I already use ASU's student helper to check for grammar.

It's great, I just tell them I'm taking a creative writing class, and the poor schmuck actually proof reads for me.

“FADE IN:

INT - STARSHIP - TRANSPORTATION BAY

AXIOM and BINARY stand in front of a WARP GATE. A large, neon circle towering above them, flickering effervescently. A holographic screen floats in front of them, showcasing an array of labeled nebulas.

BINARY
Ten Million galaxies, nothing to do.

AXIOM taps the screen, pulling up a specific quadrant.

AXIOM
How about the Super Life Festival? That could be fun.

BINARY
Which Super Life Festival? Does it have the Lineup?

AXIOM
Good question.
(Tapping on the screen)
Oh. It’s the one in the Quafūll (Pronounced: Qwah-Fool) Semi-Cluster. No wonder. I guess in their language it’s actually called the. . .something about color being a part of life and love, or something like that.
(BEAT)
Let’s see: Bubblegum Pop, Hickory Slow, ***(pronounced: “Asterisk.” x3)- Oh, those are the ones you can’t say in sound vibrations. Um - no one we’ve really heard of except that girl that seems terrible besides that one song.

BINARY
Oh, well I’m not going for her.

AXIOM
For real. I wish there was something ‘profound’, you know? Like some real Old World-type stuff.

BINARY
Could you imagine? If literally everyone in existence was just into a few specific artists? The vibe would be insane.

AXIOM
You know? They say music just sounded better on Earth winds. Something about the-

BINARY
(interrupting)
They disproved that, actually. But, I get what you mean. I feel like it was better on Earth, too. Just more ‘authentic’, you know?

AXIOM
Better than the Quafūll Semi-Cluster, that’s for sure. Oh, I finally got around to watching that “Whisper Me Your Love” movie that came out of there.

BINARY
Oh? Did you like it?

AXIOM
I mean, it was. . . good. Different. I guess if I didn’t have to read the subtitles.

BINARY
Oh, what? You’re one of those people?

AXIOM
No, I just mean- It’s so foreign with their language, it didn’t really match up well.

BINARY
Dude.

AXIOM
What? They’re just flashing colors on the screen. They don’t have bodies, I’m not used to that.

BINARY
Well, you’re really just coming at it from a Bodied-Normative mindset.

AXIOM
A Bodied-Norma-

BINARY
(Interrupting)
We don’t do that, dude. You know, there’s even people that identify as Bodyless or Unbodied, even though they were born “otherwise attached.”

AXIOM
(perks up)
I’m happy for your cousin, by the way. Same name?

BINARY
For now. I’m glad everyone’s been so accepting. Some life forms have to deal with their friends and families calling them crazy when they start talking about wanting to get amputations for limbs they “don’t need”, but now we’ve got the technology for people to just be floating brains in jars projecting their consciousness anywhere they want if they want to.
(BEAT)
And that’s super valid.

AXIOM
Super valid. Even with their shitty movies.

BINARY
Dude.

>wrote three sections only to AFTERWARDS find a much better source for info on the historical events therein
fuck me

>>19771357
If they’re good, who cares? You’re not signing your name to it, so who knows how many are one author?

In the first couple volumes, we capped it at 5 submissions per author (in some cases an author would pick their 5 best), in Simian Deluxe we got rid of the restriction and one anon picked their top 8 (out of like 16 submitted).

To be honest, I think the productivity of a few encouraged others to write more who may not have. Rising tides lifting all boats and such…

One a day would be amazing!

>>19771386
Then who gives a fuck? If you're self publishing then put all the curse words you want. The only reason publishers put limits on that shit is because they can't get it into schools and libraries and shit otherwise(at least not the way they want to).

>>19771386
Nice.

I would honestly try to just cut it all out except for maybe one or two. If you can find a way to say it using less explicit language, do that.

>>19771419
fuck that. Kids are always compensating and cursing more than anyone out there. You know exactly what I'm talking about.

>>19771407
At the very least, it'll give me something to do at work when the day is slow. I'll save the list and do what I can, maybe play with different styles for different themes.
>>19771394
Good heh from me.

>>19771351
I didn’t even know you were doing it because I don’t lurk here often but if you keep it up I’ll try to do the challenges. I’m not a published author but I have a decent amount of finished work, so I can churn something out if I want to.

>>19771425
Just my two cents, take it with a grain of salt. I think it just doesn’t always hit the mark you want it to with a kid audience. If you’re target audience is 17-30 year olds who read YA fiction, though, they’ll like it for that.

>>19771371
Depends.

Are you looking for readers to actually be YA (12-18?) or the kind of adults who like to read YA-type books?

I doubt real youths will stumble across a self-pub book and say ‘yeah, I’ll buy that!’. But I imagine there are plenty of 20s-30s adults YA-readers who would.

>>19771425
it just depends on the character you're writing. Excessive swearing is usually a sign of immaturity, as you've said in different words here, so if the character cursing is supposed to be immature, then go for it.

>>19771396
oh thank god, even though i had only fragmentary material to go off, somehow i interpreted everything correctly and the new source agrees with what i wrote. i dont have to fix anything at all. i cannot possibly convey how great of a feel this is

>>19771411
because it's amazon and my local independent store. I can't sell it as YA if there's too many curse words

>>19771445
That's a good point. I counted my curse words and there's 4 bitches, 3 sluts, 2 whores, and 1 god-damn.

>>19771434
I haven’t been posting as much, but I check every day just in case anyone posts some.

>came to /wg/ for the flash writing
>got drawn in providing crit and motivation
>now, I’m just another pseud yelling about marketing, ‘passive voice’, semicolons, purple prose, and anime tropes
Write some great flash fic, anons, and save me before it’s too late!

>>19771493
oh, that's nothing. Most YA has a lot more than that. Although I haven't read much in the last decade, ten years ago it was pretty egregious.

>>19771497
I'm thinking about bringing back "purple prose" in the sense of turn of the century style writing. My mom shouldn't have gotten me that copy of Expert at the Card Table. It's infiltrating my brain and I keep wanting to emulate it but it's such a challenge.

>>19771484
What's stopping you?

>>19771511
I respect the striped and raw prose of some writers, but I love the feeling I get from carefully crafted poet description. Obviously there's a limit, and that limit is pretty low these days by the nature of the beast, but it can still be done.

>>19771538
My limited vocabulary.

baked bread
>>19771587

>>19762126
There are 3 fucking /wg/ threads up right now. For the love of God, relax.

>>19770481
>why would you do that anyway?
I don't think I have it in me to write more than just one novel, specially under time pressure.