/lit/ - Literature

>>19739467
>slave morality is more present than ever
Why? Make examples.

>>19739479
Men alone in their cars wearing masks

>>19739467
if this isn't bait you're literally retarded. have you even read nietzsche? at least read on the genealogy of morals and thus spoke zarathustra, then come back to /lit/ and make a thread about how you were wrong

>>19739467
You're putting the cart before the horse so to speak. Religion was always a result of slave morality, a construct of it, not the other way around. There are new religions now people just don't call them that. Surely Nietzsche attacked Christianity simply because it was by far the largest and most influential of his own time.

>>19739467
You haven't read him.
>and yet slave morality is more present than ever
That's because contemporary atheism is humanist/socialist and owes more to Christianity than its exponents would be willing to admit. Nietzsche predicted this would happen but it won't last long

>>19739506
Contemporary humanism is literally Christianity with the exception of the static hierarchy and sexual autism

>>19739506
Atheism is just a religion. It's a very neat, compact system of belief. It has it's own dogmatic tenets and zealous followers. There's no reason to see or treat it any differently from the rest.

>>19739484
You're right. In fact the problem is that Nietzsche's interpretation of Christianity is tendentious. It is so tendentious that readers became accustomed to it and now they can't see Christianity under any other light. It's really amazing how this man was able to brainwash the entire Western world. The truth is that he was very ignorant about Christianity. It results that he never read the mystics, the alchemists, and he had scarce knowledge of Dante, stilnovo poets and troubadours. Anyone with half a brain knows that the real core of Christianity is about ennobling and dignifying Man, letting he know all his highest possibilities, not about turning him into a slave. Christianity is ultimately the only weapon that the globohomo élite fears. They're actually scared to death by the possibility that Christianity resurges.

>>19739518
Exactly
>>19739531
Atheism doesn't have to be a religion but most of its variants are indeed religious in their core. It's better to envision the struggle between atheism and Christianity as a struggle between two competing interpretations of Christianity

>>19739500
this x100

neesha explicitly mentions in the geneology how slave/master morality are just rough catch-all ideas to highlight a specific difference.

"On a stroll through the many finer and coarser moralities that have ruled on earth or still rule, I found certain traits regularly recurring together and closely linked: until I concluded that there were two basic types and a basic difference. There is a master morality and a slave morality; – I add at once, that in all higher and more mixed cultures attempts to mediate between the two moralities also appear"

>>19739506
You are half right. Yes, an atheistic humanist socialism is the next, and possibly the highest stage of slave morality. However no, no it's not going to disappear any time soon. I'm afraid this is it my friend. I think it's just going to be a gradual transition, and a gradual decline as we move towards becoming like China. Besides this, people would already know this if they read THE WILL TO POWER.
https://www.gutenberg.org/files/52914/52914-h/52914-h.htm
https://www.gutenberg.org/files/52915/52915-h/52915-h.htm
And before some retarded commie comes to seethe about it, dengism is Marxist Leninism working exactly as intended. Mao was the reformist.

>>19739467
"Slave morality" built a Hispano-Catholic Empire, the first Empire on which the sun never set with an amazing military power on land and sea. What Rome did well, Spain improved and increased.

"Master morality" created postmodern psychopaths and trannies. Not a single Da Vinci...

>most atheistic times in human history
Lol

>>19739538
>christianity is about ennobling man
>how?
>well, it teaches that sex is shameful and sinful, not to harm or kill, that the worries of this world are meaningless in the face of God/eternal life, that one should turn the other cheek, that one shouldn't pursue material goods
>wait, so the most noble man under christianity is a sexless, impoverished, harmless man who prays and waits patiently for the next life?
>well...
>isn't that just dignifying the conditions of slavery?
>no... you just dont get it! you're scared of christianity resurging!!!

>>19739619
>it teaches that sex is shameful and sinful
Wrong. It teaches that sex is sacred exactly because it's sooo beautiful and for this very reason it shouldn't be ruined by mindless fornication with whoever falls under your eye. When you realize that being a degenerate who beats his meat to women shitting in your face on a screen is awful, and only prevents you from experiencing real pleasure, you understand Christian sexual morality. It's simply a morality that wants to avoid excesses in order to IMPROVE the experience of authentic sex, which goes hand in hand with love.

>the worries of this world are meaningless in the face of God/eternal life
You couldn't get it wronger than that. That's literally what Eastern religions say. In Christianity it's the exact opposite, God suffers when men let other men suffer and don't help each other, as well as He suffers when a certain portion of the world falls under exploitation, and ugliness triumphs. The Christian God is the only God actually concerned with beauty, and demands men to pursue it in everything they do.

>that one should turn the other cheek
Wrong. When you turn the other cheek you're being selfish and that's what God abhors the most.

>that one shouldn't pursue material goods
Right, and that's a good principle for a healthy morality. God doesn't say that you must be poor and miserable, He simply says that material richness should be the consequence of mutual aid and of an economy based on sharing rather than competition. Competition makes men superb, arrogant, selfish and ultimately causes more pain in the world, and that pain in the end devours the rich as well.

Just read more, bro. All of this is out there in the libraries. Nietzsche is like a 0,000001% of what there is to read.

>>19739538
God is dead to you as well christer, and you would use his corpse as a cudgel, against a resented elite no less! Remind me again, how Nietzsche was wrong in his description of your religion?

>>19739538
Reminder

>>19739745
>The Christian God is the only God actually concerned with beauty, and demands men to pursue it in everything they do
Yes that's why he banned visual art right? I know, I know, you're going to rattle off a list of Christian artists and talk about cathedrals, all of which blaspheme the very laws God is supposed to have given in the Old Testament. No, the love for beauty must come from outside this religion, in spite of it.

>>19739484
That's just herd behavior. Slave morality would be more like threatening to report healthy people for not being masked

>>19739822
Your picture doesn't tell me anything I didn't already know. The problem you fail to understand is that modern day Jews preach the exact opposite values of the ancient Jewish-Christian values. (Masonic symbols are to be interpreted as reversals of Christian symbols. They're essentially Satanic symbols in the sense that they teach the exact opposite of what Christianity teaches). If you hate globohomo just like me you'll soon understand that Christianity is what they fear the most.

>>19739775
I don't know if God is dead to me. I'm just trying to find some kind of truth to cling to in this horrible age. And I disagree with Nietzsche that this truth or these new values can be fabricated by man himself. I can't, for instance. And if I tried I would come up with some retarded bullshit like the vast majority of /lit/ users who believe they have something original to write in some meme book they wish to publish.

>>19739840
>the love for beauty must come from outside this religion, in spite of it
That's simply not true. And yes, I present to you the mere fact that everything written, composed or built within Christianity is more beautiful than everything written, composed or built in athetistic periods.

>>19739897
Which also happens...

>>19739905
No they literally do not fear Christianity at all, in fact they love it. Read The Will to Power

>>19739905
>everything written, composed or built within Christianity is more beautiful than everything written, composed or built in athetistic periods
wow you're literally one of those twitter aesthete catholics, just picking Christianity out of the furniture catalog as the prettiest decor, yes christian cultures produced the highest art when they did not read their bibles and when bishops and popes were just the surplus sons of the aristocracy finding ways to spend money, in the modern world the surplus has to be reinvested to keep growing instead of being spent over 300 years on a cathedral that does literally nothing but enhance the prestige of the land it sits on

>>19739948
>meme picture and a misunderstood Neetche book prove me wrong
Lol no anon, just look around. Everything the globohomo wants is against Christianity. They literally removed a conservative pope to put a fake pope on the throne in order to pursue their demented agenda and spread the pandemic fear. C'mon.

>>19739948
Marxism is Christianity for materialists

>>19739745
when you turn the other cheek, you show, to the offender, that youre superior to him. Because he, by smiting you, shows that he inside is weak, fearful, angry and unfulfilled, as he got offended/disturbed. While he, who turned the other cheek, is in place with, peace in his mind and with no fear. He wont be indulged in mindless beating, because you wont offend him, he knows that that person cant help himself, is weak and lost.
Hes of higher spirit. Thats peak masculinity, but people wont recognize that because such examples are scarcely rare (it wouldnt be the same thing if you turned the other cheek out of some fear) and the term itslef has been heavily distorted

>>19739467
>we're in the most atheistic times in human history
No we aren't

>>19739948

>>19739983

>>19739992

>>19740000

>>19739959
>yes christian cultures produced the highest art when they did not read their bibles and when bishops and popes were just the surplus sons of the aristocracy finding ways to spend money
This is actually a fair point. I agree that Christianity produced the best art when popes, bishops and artists were not TOO Christian. But that's just because in those periods Christianity was somehow mingled with pagan suggestions and pagan enthusiasm, not because it was less religious. The blend was between Christianity and Paganism, not between Christianity and atheism. Atheism never produced anything of value.

And anyway, even if you fundamentally disagree with me, the central point here is that the Christian God values beauty more than any other divinity in the world. God himself is often compared to a universal artist, and Christian alchemy is entirely grounded on the idea that artistic research is inherently coincident with religious research. As in Dante.

>>19740006

>>19740009

>>19740016

>>19740027

>>19739467
He literally talks about jewism to Christianity to liberal democracy to socialism pipeline of slave morality, you dumb fuck.

>>19740036

>>19740046

>>19739538
more than ignorant, he seemed blinded by his hate for christianity

>>19740054

>>19740067

>>19740076
>Inb4 jannies

>>19739538
>Christianity is about ennobling and dignifying Man
Just a certain kind of man. Not the kind of men who are labeled evil / wicked by the religion, who look at the kind of men that the religion ennobles and think, "what a faggot."

>>19740082

>>19740092

>>19740100

Nietzsche was only tolerant of jews because he had little understanding of them.

>>19739467
>we're in the most atheistic times in human history
Majority of the populations of the West are still Christian, democracy allows that majority to vote Christians into power.

In fact atheism had a stronger influence on government when countries where still ruled by a small circle of elites

>>19739619
Time for your meds

>>19739979
>If you kill your enemies, they win
sound like a cope for the inability to defend one self, the only weak man is you being beaten

>>19740106

>>19740115

>>19740111
Because they're intelligent. Intelligence respects other intelligence, even if it's possessed by a rival / detractor.

>>19740122

>>19739897
So, again... slave morality is more present today than ever.

>>19740130

>>19740129
I said tolerant, not that he respected their intelligence.

>>19740140

>>19740151
Meh, they're interchangeable here.

>>19739965
Everything you hate about globalism was pioneered by the leveling spirit of ressentiment in Christianity. Every culture you respect, every tradition you value is just another idolatry to be overturned in the name of the transcendent master. Isn't it time that master was declared legally deceased?

>>19740153

>>19740154
No.

>>19740160

>>19740161
He both tolerated and respected their intelligence. Now stop being a dick.

>>19739484
this is silly because not everyone is switched on all the time. some people might just forget they have their mask on or not want to bother taking it off and putting it on again when the situation demands it so find it easier just keeping it on. some might like the feeling, some may prefer to hide their face, some may be used to it, some may think it looks cool. no use filtering this behaviour through some 19th century philosophy

>>19740170

>>19740007
>the Christian God values beauty more than any other divinity in the world
This is just a baseless theological claim and there is nothing to address. Pagans had "beauty" gods and goddesses who were tutelaries of arts and artists. You're just trying to out-sell those (which succeeded historically... but now your atheism towards polytheism has become another's atheism towards your monotheism)
>God himself is often compared to a universal artist
Also lifted from the pre-Christian culture, I believe the Greek here is Demiourgos

>>19740174
No.

>>19740178

>>19739541
atheism and christianity are both metaphysics, it's not that atheism is 'religious'

>>19740191

>>19740130
>racial suicide
Hmm
>Europe is firmly Christian for 1500 years
>comes to dominate the entire world and maintain a European hegemony on all of it
>maintains monolithic European societies at home
then...
>Europe becomes less firmly Christian in the wake of the Enlightenment and French revolution
>society becomes more atheistic, technicalistic, mercantile, amoral
>Europe destroys itself in two suicidal wars
>no longer dominate the world, no longer maintain monolithic European societies

Hmmm, so what happened here? Was Christianity just taking its sweet time to kill Europe over a period 1500 years, and just by some fluke happened to make Europe the most dominant civilization in world history? Or did abandoning Christianity cause Europe to self destruct? It seems obvious to me, at least...

>>19740197
>Hmmm, so what happened here? Was Christianity just taking its sweet time to kill Europe over a period 1500 years
Unironically, yes.

>>19739467
>but now we're in the most atheistic times in
Not actually. Read Stirner and realize we’re merely at the next phase in Judeo-Christian-Capitalism
The new Pope of the church of Scientism is Fauchi. An enduring sect known as “scientific socialism” persists. This isn’t atheism. This is why slave morality persists.

>>19740197
>europe is firmly christian for 1500 years
absolute gross oversimplification based on playing video games

>>19740188
Yes. Respect does not mean he supported or loved them. It just means he recognized their power.

>>19740198

>>19740217

>>19740207
Fauci is literally just a career bureaucrat who was too deep in his work to notice he should have resigned after Obama. If you want to be a high quality schizo you should be more worried about actual powers behind the throne than one of the least important ministers.

>>19740222

>be Nietzsche
>be concerned about slavery morality, the triumph of the lesser over the greatest, lack of freedom
>have some great psychological insights but not particularly great or well developed philosophy of mind
>get a bit at what Hume, and Indian thinkers long before him got at in BG&E with the will being divided and the soul being more a congress of desires
>drop this insight because it is a barrier to le ebin overcoming
>no real idea of how to deal with how the body and enviornment rules the intellect and will
>no real realization that the most ebin of Greek warrior conquerors could enforce their own values and still be completely enslaved to their own desires, need for recognition, and enviornment
>creates doctrine that lets people celebrate their strength and overcoming of already weakening social pressures, while ignoring the far more constructing chains
>doesn't focus on the Logos as the crucial element of freeing man from the chains of causality

Ultimately, 15 years after I started reading Nietzsche, after reading everything he ever published, I had come to the conclusion that it was a very elaborate cope, and incomplete. Also caught on in further studies that Hegel had caught a similar vision of values in the early religious writings, but saw how the ideal hero was still constrained by the legion if desires, blind to what was moving them.

Only the far more ebin truth, whole truth, of the Absolute can free you. Otherwise you don't really know why you "choose" what you will.

>>19740229

>>19740240

>>19740249

>>19740229
And this is the strategy of christfucks for a long time. Let the world go to shit.
They’re the original accelerationists

>>19740234
You never read one book of his from front to back.

>>19740258

>>19740216
My original post was something along the lines of “Nietzsche was only tolerant of jews because he had little understanding of them.“ and (You) come along sperging out over how the word respect and tolerant are interchangeable (they are not), when I never used the word respect, believe Nietzsche instead called the jews the world chandala

>>19740273

>>19740277

>>19740275
My point was that he was "tolerant" of them because they're intelligent, not because he didn't understand them. Good job missing that completely and bitching about the word "respect" instead.

>>19740234
>doesn't focus on the Logos as the crucial element of freeing man from the chains of causality
Why don't you elaborate on this if it is so axiomatic to you? Because as far as I am concerned the opposite is true, that discourse and speech create a world of this causing that and so forth, reducing us to mere things, and this is in fact the actual bondage in question.

>>19740284
You have no point.
You are arguing with yourself.
You are a fool.

>>19740292
Okay faggot.

He didn't just "tolerate" them, first of all, he had outright respect for them. Your first error.

He did understand them, extraordinarily well in fact. Your second error.

Nietzsche respects anyone who showcases a vibrant will to power and Jews showcase that time and again, both in the past and today. Your third error (for not acknowledging this).

Go fuck yourself.