/lit/ - Literature

>>19722192
Aristotle

>>19722192
Having children is the easiest way to sabotage your writing career. Not to mention they might not even be yours lol.

>>19722201
no one cares retard, stay on topic

>>19722192
Freud, Marx, Deleuze and Mao

>>19722192
Derrida; Zizek; B Russell (cheated with his son's wife); Hegel

>>19722250
Marx regretted getting married though

>>19722256
>B Russell (cheated with his son's wife)
chad

>>19722192
some additions off the top of my head: Socrates, Marcus Aurelius, Descartes, Rousseau (lol), Walter Benjamin

Bataille

>>19722256
>B Russell (cheated with his son's wife)

>The pleasure I get from fucking my son's wife is greater than the sadness he experiences from his wife getting fucked by his dad
>The total happiness in the world has increased!

Based and utilitarianpilled

>>19722192
pentti linkola, if you count him as a philosopher

>>19722269
difference between chad and virgin utilitarianism - the virgin does not allow himself to feel bad about injustices to justify his pushover self-denying lifestyle while chad feels such pleasure dominating others that it justifies him pursuing all of his desires without restraint.

>>19722264
Nice, thanks. I was thinking less along the lines of Socrates and Rousseau because both were pretty awful fathers. In the Crito, Socrates leaves the task of raising his children to his friends, and like you suggested Rousseau gave his kids up to the foundling hospitals as soon as Therese gave birth, which he definitely knew had a death rate of 70%

>>19722256
Bertrand Russell was a notoriously bad husband/father. His favorite grandchild died of self immolation "protesting for world peace" lol.

Seneca had a child that died in infancy. George Berkeley had 6 kids.

>>19722271
Haven't heard of him until today - thanks. His extremism is an interesting take on the idea of whether someone being a parent influences their thinking

>>19722295
Benjamin wasn't a great father either, apparently. desu my respect for Hegel increased even more knowing the guy supported a family, loved to travel and watch italian opera in his free time, and yet he somehow found time to come up with interesting angles for his lectures and write the Science of Logic. absolute madman.

>>19722269
Said kid was a schizophrenic as well. Could never have a stable relationship either. Terrible person, a nymphomaniac clearly.

>>19722340
To clarify, last two sentences about B. Russell. A shame too.

is there a correlation between philosophers who led admirable lives and the value of their philosophies?

>>19722192

>>19722350
If there wasn't, there would be no reason to have written Lives and Opinions of the Eminent Philosophers. I'd like to think that philosophy is more than a series of discrete questions that need to be 'solved' -- the disposition and virtues of the person asking and answering those questions is helpful if we want to figure out how to live good lives.

>>19722350
I'd say I'm more like to take someone like Cato more seriously than a degenerate like Marx.

>>19722295
To be fair to Socrates, his friends were the best people in Athens.

>>19722424
he was also an old fuck by the time he was sentenced to death, so I imagine his children must have already entered adulthood.

>>19722250
Marx was scum, he killed 2 of his children.

>>19722424
>his friends were the best people in Athen
they were literal Spartaboos and traitors of their fatherland, Xenophon provides an example

>>19722192
Schopenhauer had a daughter who died in infancy.

Carl Jung

>>19722459
Schopenhauer had sex?

>>19722478
Yes, he was a notorious womanizer in fact. Also had a relationship with a celebrity actress.

>>19722192
'I’m not a good father. There is something ridiculous in asserting my dignity which I resist automatically. My teenage son identifies with this undermining of my own authority. When he was 14, I was mad at him and used a vulgar expression in Slovenian: “Let the dog fuck your mother.” He replied: “That already happened 15 years ago. That’s how I was born.”'--Slavoj Zizek

>>19722448
Athenian ‘democracy’ was an unstable mess, even Argos was better.

>>19722310
lurk moar and dont post for the next 2 years, retard.

>>19722192
Varg Vkernes

>>19722192
>>19722313
Mussolini in fact loved quoting Hegel when he said
>He who isn't a father isn't a man

Not only did Socrates have a son, but there's even a dialog between him and his son preserved recorded by Xenophon. (Not that anyone on /lit/ has ever heard of Xenophon. Not mainstream enough.)

>>19722716
lol

>>19722780
>Not that anyone on /lit/ has ever heard of Xenophon. Not mainstream enough.
Are you retarded? How is Xenophon obscure? Literally the second source on Socrates we have after fucking Plato.

>>19722440
>things that never happened

>>19722488
That's not any biography I've read. The only evidence of long term affairs is his own letters, and given other's descriptions of his misanthropy, there is speculation that these are embellishments. He did fuck prosties and poor roasties though. Even Nietzsche wasn't a total incel, fucked a prostie roastie once, got VD, died from it.

I figured that was another reason Schope hated Hegel so much. Schope was a misunderstood genius, Hegel had been a beer hall chad. Schope sets up lectures at the same time and place as Hegel to best him, everyone goes to Hegel. Schope rants about women, Hegel settles down with an 18 year old at aged 40. Schope has two still born girls (maybe?), Hegel begins begetting nothing but masculine children as soon as he's married.

Nietzsche and Schope end up pessimistic, struggling against the abyss, Hegel and Tolstoy (also getting his dick wet and partying) go into death knowing they're going to be united with God.

Fucking Chad... Does everything better, even incel shit like philosophy.

>>19723624
Sad to say, most philosophers were betas. There are a lot who try to pass themselves off as sigmas, but almost none seem to actually be. Maybe Spinoza.

There are a handful of alpha philosophers. Socrates, Plato, maybe Aristotle, Hegel, Voltaire, Wittgenstein, maybe Locke since trying to kill the king is a Chad move.

>>19722201
You either
1. Got cucked
2. Were never in a relationship

>>19723031
3 of his children died because of him

>>19722250
Mao sent his child to die in a war lol
Stalin also had children, likewise Stalin didn't value his son, viewing him for his military rank

>>19723785
The Nazis tried to trade him for a bunch of shit and Stalin said no, and then they wanted a 1:1 trade, but a field marshall for his shitty son. Man of Steel isn't falling for that lol.

His other son shot himself after Stalin kept shitting on him for being a loser, but lived, and Stalin's remark on hearing it was "see he can't even do that right."

Man of Steel cannot be hurt with emotions.

>>19723819
Shut up you zoomer commie cuck.

>>19723819
didn't he hide in his dacha crying like a baby when the germans invaded

>>19723881
Speaking of cuckolding, isn't it crazy how virtually all those men in the pictures of Nazis at Stalingrad died, defeated by superior prolitariat Slavic BVLLs, and how the vast majority of their wives, mother's, and daughters would go on to take superior Worker seed?

Shame the German race disappeared though, it was good for a laugh.

>>19723781
What kind of monster would kill 4 of their own offspring?

>>19723923
he did indeed have a mental breakdown that lasted a while and in the last days of his life he was incredibly paranoid. so much for 'the man of steel'

>>19723944
5 kids died because of this man and people still call themselves 'Marxists'?

>>19723944
he refused to work and misspent engels' gibs and starved his children and died im filth

>>19723020
Number of times Xenophon has been discussed on /lit/ outside of this thread: approximately 0

>>19722192
Husserl had 3 kids, one son who died in WW1.

>>19723624
Yes, he did mostly sleep with lower class women but I don't think it makes a difference. The actress he had a long relationship with is named Caroline Medon. The relationship started when she was 18 and he was in his thirties. Look up her entry on wikipedia to have a glance at Schopenhauer's troubled mind.

>>19722295
In my Greek class, I learned a little bit about parenting because it came up in an Athenaze story. Apparently, it was common to leave your kid with a family member or someone close to you if it was to the child's benefit. Perhaps, Socrates' children benefitted from what his friends had to offer. Maybe, he knocked someone up, realized he couldn't be a good father, and let someone else do most of the fathering because he knew he would be bad at it. How much worse is what Socrates did than what modern-day parents do by putting their children in daycares and schools?

During these years Russell’s second marriage came under increasing strain, partly because of overwork but chiefly because Dora chose to have two children with another man and insisted on raising them alongside John and Kate.

HAHAHAHAHA

>>19724205
Heidegger's wife also cucked him with his friend and got pregnant. He decided to raise the cuckspring as his own

>>19724044
I see him mentioned sometimes. He certainly isn't as known as he should be. I've got these two copies of Anabasis on my desk atm, but I've primarily been using a digital Loeb. Today, I think I will relax and read the English.

>>19723785
Stalin wasn't a philosopher though

>>19723781
>>19724008
that is made up

we're all children of Nietzsche

>>19724271
he was as much a philosopher as Mao

>>19723785
>>19723819

Stalin was just a G.


Hitler was in WWI, but just a courier. Mao was definitely in the shit at times during the war, but as leader.

Stalin was killin niggas ever during peace time. He has some bad ass bank robberies, and did plenty of his murders himself, instead of screaming about liquidating this or that while always safely ensconced in some conference room like Hitler.

Apparently working for him was pretty shit though, because top Soviets, men people were terrified of in their own right, had to try to laugh at his jokes so as not to displease him, but you couldn't laugh too hard or he would note you were faking and might think you had turned on him, and then kill you. Which is why when he stroked out he was on the floor forever, because people were to afraid of the G to even walk into his place unannounced, and then he had murdered all the doctors in the Moscow region for frontin and trying to poison him.

Mao had plenty more kids anyhow though. Dude got real gross when he was old and started having streams of teen peasants brought to him for orgies. But I mean, if you're emperor, that's what you're going to do.

>>19723881
Stalin did the cuckin dawg. Russians cucked so hard, they still rank Stalin, a Georgian, the most greatest person in Russian history every year. Lenin is a distant second as an actual Russian. Catherine the Great, a German is the greatest woman on the list.

>>19724472
franco would never use trenches, instead he would always give orders standing up. he was very lucky, the moors who fought under him believed he must be blessed by allah due to how lucky he was
then he was dropped into being the leader (despite having been an avid monarchist in his earlier years) after the two other dudes who were doing it died in plane crashes. its not believed he orchastrated these crashes

>>19722192
>Children Good!
There is a good reason that most serious philosophers don't reproduce. And the one's who do are either Ancient or Hedonistic psychopaths. I don't think anyone who spent any real honest time thinking about the value of existence and the dread of death could come up with a logical morally justifiable reason to create more life and add fuel to this endless cycle of suffering.

>>19724529
>dread of death
Death doesn't even exist

>>19724554
>Death doesn't even exist
Judging by the look of terror on the faces of the stray dogs I have strangled to death, I believe it does.

>>19722440
>killing your own children is... LE BAD!!!

>>19723761
>The Sigma Spinoza
Unironically Sigma-male. People tried to pay him the equivalent today of $1.4 million to NOT write anything, he told them to fuck off. Someone tried to offer him the same amount of money to KEEP writing in perpetuity, told THEM to fuck off. He made his daily bread by being a glass-grinder as he shunned anyone who tried to live monetarily off of philosophy, knowing that "I sing the song of whose supper I eat," Spinoza was literally on the grindset.

>>19724529
boohoo faggot

>>19724581
>Judging by the look of terror on the faces of the stray dogs I have strangled to death
In what occasions did this happen?

>>19723936
>this is how ivan consoles himself as Dzhambul gives his wife the BIG MONGOL

>>19724635
Any good biographies of him?

>>19722310
i didn't realize the newest model had already been released

>>19723982
Imagine devouring the lives of 6 innocents of your own flesh and blood... How depraved must one be?

>>19722192
Saint Augustin had one son and was present in his life

>>19724203
Daycares are just (supposedly) secure facilities where parents can deposit their children for the duration of their work journey. It is meant to support our systems of working women.
Elementary schools are almost the same, except for the fact that children are also taught to read - something that lots of parents, even with a non-working mother, weren't able to provide.
It's shit, of course, and kids are better being off homeschooled.
Leaving children under the care of relatives or other trusted party was extremely common through history until a while ago. If the mother died, or the father died and the mother couldn't support the family, or some other situation happened by which a family couldn't support its child, a relative, usually which experience in rearing children, would take care of it. Families have had relatives like those all the time.
What Socrates supposely did wasn't uncommon and not immoral by any standards of the time.

>>19722192
neitzsche (fr fr no cap)

>to compile a list of philosophers who had children,
That is easy. Most were perfectly biologically able to, and I'd be surprised if most didn't act on one of our basest impulses
>and were present in their children's lives
That is much, much harder to find.
Most philosophers were and are deeply troubled humans, trying to rationalize their way out of their own personal failures. Intelligent, sure. Wise? Not so much.
Scratch beyond the surface of their writings and you'll find unhappy men, living unhappy lives, perpetuating their misery and immorality. Their home lives were obviously messy, corresponding to their own personal issues. It'd be sad, if it wasn't so cruel.

Nick Land

>>19722260
Marx loved his wife and kids (the one's with his wife at least)

>>19724667

Read the chapter on Spinoza from Will Durant's 'The Story of Philosophy,' where he recommends several top tier biographies of him written before 1950. For recent works, look up the works on Spinoza done by Clare Carlisle

>>19724685
Marx sent 7 of his children to work in the soviet mines because they didn't do their homework? Disgusting. How can anyone be a marxist today?

>>19722310
Lurk more newfag

>>19724529
If you look at this thread, you can see that a lot of big names did reproduce.

>>19724644
Masturbatory fantasies, of course. I haven't left my room in years.

>>19724271
He was a poet though.

>>19722192
This kills the antinatalist.

>>19723936
Each of them killed like 25 slavs before getting captured, now slav birth rates are fucked so slavs cant do their human zerg rush anymore. they're fucked.

>>19724529
Just shut up and reproduce. Life-denying philosophy is poison. You're killing the animal inside.

>>19722192
Marx left his boys starve and his only girl became a prostitute
Rousseau beign rich put all of his children in orphanages

That's all i know

>>19722440
of starvation in the street, the biggest irony comming from a guy that promotes giving bread to the needed

Most of the anarchists fucked

read Confucius

>>19724044
I’ve always been interested in Xenophon but the ancient Greek specialist in my phil department didn’t regard him a “serious” philosophy. I think she was generally against Straussian interpretations of the classics and Xenophon’s revival is owed largely to Strauss’s interest in him

Dostoevsky had at least one daughter who wrote about him later in her life

>>19725486
Really? Marx ate 8 children all of whom he hate, I always thought that was just bait.

>>19726880
Strike a nerve?

>>19722440
Wtf really?

Habermas had 3 kids apparently. Here's a recent ish interview from him:
https://english.elpais.com/elpais/2018/05/07/inenglish/1525683618_145760.html#?rel=mas

>>19724250
>>19728472
Xenophon is anathema to (((the modern university))) because the Socrates he portrays is WAAAAY too based, ahem, I mean, problematic.

If more people read Xenophon, how would the Democratic party even stay in business? Think of all the lost jobs

>>19724346
Gentile?

>>19722267
Also Lacan had a child with Bataille's ex-wife

>>19722350
no

>>19722195
Had a son. His name was Nichomacus. Hence, Nichomachean Ethics.

>>19723936
far more russians died than germansy tranny

John Stuart Mill, usually credited as the father of modern liberalism, was the son of influential political philosopher James Mill.

He was a child prodigy, reading Greek at the age of three, and was basically raised as an experiment by his father to try to make a supergenius.

His autobiography makes for fascinating reading for this reason.

Representative is his anecdote about asking his father about religion (he was homeschooled and had literally never heard of religion).
His father's explanation was: "All men of all ages have regarded their gods as evil. One religion eventually invented the most evil entity imaginable, one that created sentient life purely to torture most of it forever. Thus that religion became dominant."
... And then he patted him on the head and left.

>>19723785
>Stalin didn't value his son
Based.

If they are good they can make it out on their own. Needing daddy to wipe their bottoms cultivates weakness.

>>19722201
Wrong. You have no idea what you're talking about.

>>19722271
>dedicated his 1979 Toisinajattelijan päiväkirjasta (From the Diary of a Dissident) to German far-left militants Andreas Baader and Ulrike Meinhof, stating that "they are the signposts, not Jesus of Nazareth or Albert Schweitzer"

reddit

>>19732258
Interesting way to cope with your father leaving you.

>>19732334
Do you?

>>19724529
Please end your life then. You're taking up valuable resources.

>>19724529
stop quoting a literal who

>>19724356
lit, I'm totally not going to make that a part of my identity now

so in other words, you get zero bitches

>>19732258
in other words, daddy went to get milk and came back with a hooker instead

Are most childless philosophers incels or volcels?

>>19728472
>she
opinion dismissed

>>19724529
Let me guess, you're a faggot teacher with a Masters in Literature and you frequent Aushin discord. Rope yourself faggot.

>>19724529
Retarded antinatalist