/lit/ - Literature

>>19614154
Good question, just look at how everything human (love, happiness, sadness, beauty) is being reduced to mere firing together of neurons in your brain. Yes, at the end of the day it's how it works on a biological level, but if that's all there is to it you could just blow your brains out anyways since life is devoid of any meaning. Feels like many people todad view science as their new god and have lost their soul in the process of adapting to their new belief

No but mason and Dixon makes reference to the pic you posted

>>19614154
Deeply focusing and thinking about something yourself will be better than any book.
Just sit and focus every day for an hour on this subject for about 10 days and you've "read" whatever book you wanted to read.

>>19614154
That's more cultural. In science, finding out something is in the state of a gas necessarily opens up new information.
When someone says "just" then they are lab monkeys who don't think. It's more a "daddy says this" thing.

Because that is what science is.

burtt, metaphysical foundations of modern science

poincare, science and hypothesis

is water h20?

>>19614154
There is a tendency to explain everything that can be sensed in terms of smaller, unsenseable things (molecules etc), but curiosity ends around the limit of your senses, probably because the number of things requiring explanation rises indefinitely and there are usually more practical ways to use your time and energy than consider them. So you probably want to look into the neuroscience of curiosity, memory, and sensory capabilities. These are, of course, developing fields of knowledge, but this should be compatible with your stated ideology.

Eric Kandel is an important figure in memory research and apparently he wrote a book on reductionism, so that's probably a good place to start.

Feyerabend, Kuhn, NR Hanson

>>19614422
As if there is still utility in science with this crap, fereyabend. Pretty sure, he only applies to soft science.

>>19614154
Water vapour isn't that mystical. Water gets hot and evaporates, it's not a big deal.

>>19614524
Yes, but see what you are describing here is merely language, the experience of water vapour is mystical, and i see a huge fallacy in reducing and neglecting that

>>19614154
>What the fuck is "just" about gas, isnt gas as fucking mystical as if the cloud where the fucking farts of thor.
Based

In fact, you should always keep a look of wonder when thinking about scientific stuff

Remember that any element heavier than iron was made by exploding stars, some of which are necessary for human existence

>steam in the bathroom
>rippling waves
>moss
life can beautiful bros

>>19614597
https://youtu.be/_Vvdtaaprzw

>>19614154
Eastern philosophers and poets have been inadvertently BTFOing this point of view for centuries. They're always reminding us not to mistake the map for the territory, which is what these reductionists do. One author who wrote at length about scientific reductionism is Morris Berman. Check out The Reenchantment of the World or Coming to Our Senses by him.

>>19614617
They didn't really bother with the subtitles, did they?
Fuck, I wish I had followed that Russian class

>>19614154
Then you have no understanding of what science is. To look at a cloud and understand precisely why it is there and how it works, is amazing. To know that it is the culmination of an incomprehensible number of events, in a timeline stretching to before any creature took its first breath, for it to float before your eyes in that moment. The same water that makes up that cloud had been recycled through precipitation millions of times, travelling through space and time. That water was around before you, and it will be there after you die. Same as it was for the first organisms of Earth, same as the fucking dinosaurs. Same as every ancestor you have, every descendant you could have, and everyone you know. Yes, it is just water vapour. If you can't get a kick out of that, then that's on you.

>>19614726
That's exactly what im saying dude? we agree?

>>19614734
Then what's your problem? The language? That's literally just because scientists today have to work on shit at scales that make it seem like a cloud being gas is an insignificant concept. Why does the language bother you if you still see it's meaning?

>>19614726
>>19614734

Because if they jizzed their pants all the time over every observation of nature, there would be no time to get shit done.

You think Sagan and Feynman didn't love to wax poetic about the beauty of nature?

>>19614747
My problem is most people i meet's cynical attitude towards life, mostly founded in their belief that science somehow has reduced the world to a series of unprofound mechanisms. Poetry and art, has become seconded as meaningful expressions of life and seem only good as entertainment or to have a little moment of profundity and then go back to your 9 to 5. It seems that the very true experience of our inner selves have become just an illusion that yes is very amusing but of no use in the big scheme of things. i see this as why the world is in the state it is in, and i see our only way to progress is to release ourselves of reductionistic thought. Science, poetry, and magic needs to be at the forefront.

>>19614771

>>19614524
>it's not a big deal
Why not?

>>19614154
'Clouds' and 'vapour gases' do not have the same meaning, the second has more explanatory power given a modern education (clouds are made of water in a specific material state, caused by temperature and pressure).
There *is* a reason why the "just" is frustrating. Saying clouds are vapour gases is a single step forward in the order of understanding. Yet people think all the mysteries of clouds have been lifted by simply saying this.

>>19614539
>the experience of water vapour is mystical
based and soulful post

>>19614154
Unironically read Guenon.

>>19614154
For the vast majority of people it is just a phase and they grow out of it sometime in their 20s, they are just beginning to understand the world instead of just experiencing it blindly. It is a simple understanding at that point because they have yet to put it all together and realize the insane complexity of it all.

>>19614539
>the experience of water vapour is mystical
can confirm.
I was camping next to a creek last year. Morning fog was something indescribable. "Just water" caused me to have a really profound aesthetic experience.

Avatamsaka Sutra

>>19615323
>I was camping next to a creek last year. Morning fog was something indescribable. "Just water" caused me to have a really profound aesthetic experience.

Read "The Willows"
https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/11438

This is the best thread topic I've ever seen on this Ugandan Jenkum Huffing Forum all year. Here's a Bump.

>Exalted soul produces the clearest reflection of spirit, especially at rates of high engagement, when it prospirates, and floods the surrounding spacetime.

>SCieNCiSTS HaVe DiSCoVeReD THaT We aRe HaPPy WHeN D0PaMiNe iS ReLeaSeD iN Da BRaiN.

>>19614195

>>19614154
Agreed. Science is the labeling of magic phenomenon and it has shielded most people’s eyes to the mystical. I know so many sad nihilists. We gotta go back.

>>19614209
This. You read actual science and these are people trying to understand the world just enough to make new and better products so they can become rich. It's a noble thing, but the media convinces people that it's some kind of artistic religious thing, because they hate scientists. I fucking love science but I hate the pop interpretation so bad.

>>19614154
Nothing to my knowledge, but good for noticing the growing phenomenon.
It's simple, really. To usher in a world of utter hellishness, I.E. technological feudalism, the entirety of man's back must be broken, this includes his spiritual one.
Scalp your nearest scientific reductionist today for a better tomorrow

Francis Bacon believed scientific discoveries to be a form of prayer. I wonder how many scientists have that attitude today.

>>19614726
You have moved onwards from 'just', you see?

>talk to redditor irl
>"the universe is literally just the result of the big bang, there's no mystery"
>he doesnt know what he means

>>19614154
>reductionistic/trivializing nature of moden science
Ironically "modern" science has been trying to move away from previously reductionist science and into emergence of complex structures and phenomena

>>19616480
>What caused the Big Bang
>"Heh, you just don't get it do you? Cause only makes sense AFTER the Big Bang happened, so it's meaningless to talk about that! This is how I am purely scientific and avoid being theological"

Yes your spooky inexplicable exploding god-spark is much less theological than Nous, the Absolute, or God being of a different order from creaturely being

>>19616471

Inasmuch as prayer brings one closer to God, scientific, discoveries/revelations constitute the geared combinations of the chronological clock, to the cordiological lock.

>>19616471

Inasmuch as prayer brings one closer to God, scientific discoveries/revelations constitute the geared combinations of the chronological clock, to the cordiological lock.

>>19617079
>Cause only makes sense AFTER the Big Bang happened
The redditor implies transcendental ideality, but call him out for it and he shrinks back, "I've been found out."

>>19614195

Actually this so fucking hard. I've found that after a 1/2 month long constant thinking of a certain question, I'll look into what other writers have said and realize I've thought or came close to like half of them. If the truth really is the truth anyone should be able to derive it with enough honest introspection and thinking. Cultivating that skill is a different matter entirely, though.

>>19614154
If you think something is ‘beautiful’, or ‘interesting’, or ‘mystical’, it is only because the atoms in your brain were arranged in a certain way that generated that feeling. Unless you’re a Platonist beauty isn’t real.

>>19614539
>>19614855
>>19615323
>>19614154
Are you idiots stoned? It's water vapour, how hard is it to comprehend?

Do you also lose your mind when someone says glass is made JUST by melting a specific type of sand?
>noooo you can't take basic chemical and physical behaviour for granted!!

>>19614377
Semantics are boring and they shouldn't interfere with practical science

>>19616480
i read this as

>>"the university is literally just the result of the big bang, there's no mystery"
https://youtu.be/QT13kk8HDDo

>>19614154
What you are describing is anti-essentialism. It is driven by spiritual wickedness or suffering. People lose sight of the inherent beauty or sacredness in the phenomena in the world around them. This has become the norm in intellectual society. They try to mask it as dispelling superstition but its really a symptom of their disease.

>>19614654
"reminding us not to mistake the map for the territory", wow that's a really good way of putting it. Never thought of it that way before.

bumpis doo

>>19614539
Any question in the world can be reduced to a conundrum. This is the classical example of the child repeatedly asking "why" to every subsequent answer you provide. At some point, you will find yourself unable to answer further. The depth at which you arrive depends on your level of knowledge, but there is a point after which the laws of physics have to be involved. It simply is the way it is, we know it is, and it is, there is no way to explain why it is, because it has no cause, it simply is.

If you ask me what water vapour is, I can simply explain to you that molecules of water hold a liquid form under certain conditions of pressure and/or temperature, and if you increase, for instance, the temperature, the water molecules will agitate and break bonds and become a gas.
Why does it happen at this specific temperature and pressure point?
It just is, I could show it to you, but at the end of the day, if we lived in a parallel universe where water boiled at ambiant pressure and at the thermal equivalent of 300°C instead of the usual 100°, people would just accept it the way it is. Because it simply is.
There are a lot of rules that are set in stone, they are, and it is why we have laws of physics, instead of decisions, they are to be followed at all time.

They simply are.

Read I and Thou by Buber to escape this reductionism

>>19619382
This. Bible thumpers talking about how we're nothing more than dust and sin are laughable.

>>19614154
>How did this cynical view become apart of most of modern science.
It's not a part of it, it's a result of it.

Much like the magic of a stage magician, phenomena loses its magic once it has been rationalised

>>19621321
It may be less magical but it can still be quite fascinating.

>>19619221
>>noooo you can't take basic chemical and physical behaviour for granted!!
Shallow, made up concepts that you take as the phenomena

>>19618459
whoa..................

>>19616123
I love your posts N E M O, I look forward to the day when you post a chart.

>>19617495
Interesting.

>>19618459
Reddit.

>>19616123
Based Nemo dabbing on mud men as per usual.

New Self New World by Phil Shepard may be tangentially related. it talks about how modern science/culture are lost because they don't take a holistic approach to understanding reality. but its not the main theme of the book

Most people don't see any issue in having a very superficial understanding on most topics, they won't investigate water vapour, they are happy if you just explain how it happens, and even there many won't care.
The very fact that people can spend hours on their phones or computers without understanding at least a bit how it works, or drive a car for thousands of miles and having no understanding of how it propels itself, that is beyond me

bump