/lit/ - Literature

>>19566156
where would you put The Silmarillion? B4?

I'll just carry on the post from the previous thread here so it can gather replies here as well
>>19565997

>>19566142
repost the list again and again every few days at different hours until we get opinions from lots of different people

i repeat that both Black Company and Dragonborne Chair deserve B, and I'd probably put Dragonborne at A. Earthsea i think it's very good but not sure about S, would need to read it again because it's been a while. if you are considering the whole series for sure it's not S

>>19566198
>>19566193

>>19566156
Feels good to see some original OPs for once, ngl.

>>19566198
Sorry you suggestions didn't make this round yet, but I'll try to take them into account.

>>19566168
Any opinions of The Silmarillion?

Beyond Apollo B5
Dying Inside S2

>>19566198
mah nigga
>>19566224
>Any opinions of The Silmarillion?
S4 or A4, Simarillion actually has an abridged version of the Children of Hurin, but is is more dry since it is presented more as a history book

Voyage to Arcturus to S5, BotNS to C5

>>19566212
>introducing artifacts by upscaling the original template
AAAAAHHHH

Long Sun S3
Short Sun S4
Lyonesse S2
Wallet of Kai Lung B5

And while Foundation isn't difficult to read, the pages and pages of two or men sit in a room to discuss a problem isn't easy to get into.

>>19566242
shouldn't silmarillion be 5 then? it's either that or lower Hurin to 3

I am actually a Europoor so I'm going to bed now, expect no updates for at least 10 hours.

>>19566267
honestly I wouldn't even split Hurin and Simarillion and put both as one into S4 since the overlap between the readers is close to 100%.

>>19566224
>Any opinions of The Silmarillion?
It's like reading the Bible, but in a good way.
Difficulty would definitely be a 5, and I'd say S or A.

>>19566272
thanks for all you hard work anon. I'll go back to my web novels now
But I cant wait to see the finished start and start with reading that stuff.
Seems like my first book should be something like Eragon then and work my way up, yes?

>>19565949
I think that if you want to criticize something, it's easy to just look at something in a bad light and list off everything negative about it while ignoring all the positive, or even twisting some positives to negatives. I think that you don't actually offer much substantial criticism here, I imagine that instead you didn't like it while reading and so just listed off a bunch of surface-level complaints.

>At it's core it's just tropes being pushed around for the sake of it, with some spins.
You can reduce basically anything to tropes if you want to, TV Tropes is a massive compendium of tropes where autists do just that. Whether you like it or not, the stores we tell as humans are cyclical and follow patterns - we like wise old sages, we like heroes rising to challenges, we like conflict and ultimate victory, etc. There is no escaping this, and trying to explicitly subvert it is really no more intelligent or insightful than embracing it. Having a stupid old sage and heroes failing to rise to the challenge is really not any harder to write than the opposite, and if you've written these things exclusively to be subversive, than they have no more value than that. Robert Joran was concerned neither with subverting or denying the patterns of our stories. Instead, he tells a story about that pattern and lets the details of his worldbuilding bring all the value he needs. For example, the hero in Wheel of Time is being corrupted by madness, and Rand's conflict with this is interesting in its own right even if we know the overarching pattern his story will follow. Hell, there's even a character who can literally see the pattern and spoils future plot beats far, far ahead of time. Because it's not the tropes that matter in the wheel of time - it's not the fact it's following the pattern - it's the details, just like in any other retelling of the Hero Monomyth. You say "at its core", but that's exactly seeing it the wrong way. The Core is indeed the Hero Monomyth, as is the core of many many many stories, but the work itself doesn't focus on the core, it focuses on the details.
>The characters are flat as pancakes for the first half of the series
I don't think you could substantiate this. It feels like something said without meaning. What is "flat" about them, exactly? The fact you can assign a single attribute to them - Stubborn Rand, Rogueish Mat, braid-tugging Nynaeve - and then ignore everything else? The characters in Wheel of Time feel suitably fleshed out to me. They each have histories that are referenced, they all have lots of thoughts about different things, different taste in women, different struggles, etc. They feel suitably like actual human beings to me, and the only thing that I can see would inspire someone to call them flat is that they are indeed people rather than fill-ins for some philosophical idea or another. I do see that people tend to think a character is only deep if they symbolize some great philosophical idea.

>>19566311
No, pick something from the ”1” column and as high tier as possible like Earthsea or Hobbit. Perhaps not Eragon. Even Mistborn is whats ahead of it.

>>19566284
I read the Silmarillion so I figured I didn't need to read Hurin. Is it actually justifiable to read on its own?

>>19566343
>>19566311
Read some couple of books from 1 and then move to 2 etc

>>19566311
I really wouldn't bother with anything in C or D unless you're really bored and scraping the bottom of the barrel for more stories to consume.
I agree with the other anon that B1 is probably your best starting place.

>>19566311
B tier easy reading is probably the best place to start. The shit on the bottom is shit you get tricked into reading by a pleb or of special interest if you really like the topic it covers. C is for people who like fantasy in general. B and up is WHY we like speculative fiction, some of it is too heavy for novice readers but not a bad place to start either.

>>19566156
>>19566193
>>19566212
Drop Malazan to B
Drop Stormlight to C
Drop Mistborn to D (it is definitely Eragon levels of bad, don't know what the fuck people are smoking)
Raise Name of Wind to C and move it to 3
Put Discworld in A2
Raise Hobbit to A
Drop WOT to C
Is Lovecraft really that hard to get into? Is it the old timey prose? Because if that's the case, something like Frankenstein is an A4

>>19566316
>the endings of the first two books make zero sense in view of future world building.
The ending to Book 1 is certainly clumsy, nobody will disagree with that, but it's hardly a black mark on the fourteen-book series as a whole, and is easily understood in the context Robert Joran wasn't sure if any future books would ever be published. That said, saying they make zero sense is a vast overstatement. You can nitpick them at most, and not in a way that's a first-time reader will notice and not in a way that's actually a substantial knock against the narrative.
>Lots of literal filler content during the infamous slog.
I feel like filler is kind of a buzz word. The infamous slog arc is indeed a problem if you want to talk about being bored, but I think RJ's sin with it was simply getting too invested in his world and therefore showing too much. I don't think this is actually a meaningful criticism of the work itself, and I don't think any of it was "filler," in the usual sense of the buzz word. It's all stuff that many enjoy, and it's all stuff that works in the narrative. The problem is just those who are uninvested or care more about other things running the risk of being bored. That's more a personal problem with readers than an actual criticism of the work itself, unless you want to criticize it for not meeting the desires of every reader, which is not necessarily how I would criticize media myself.
>Terrible romances
I don't think you could substantiate this. You may not like them for one reason or another, but I don't think there's anything wrong with them or their execution. The main problem is kind of Nynaeve and Lan falling in love off-screen in book 1, which certainly feels sudden, but their relationship otherwise makes sense. And I mean, really, people fall in love at first sight or for other dumb reasons all the time in real life anyway.
>Hateable and stupid women everywhere.
Now this is definitely just personal opinion. Wheel of Time is filled with strong, opinionated women for sure, and I can see how someone wouldn't like that. But it says nothing regarding the writing quality. I for one quite like that it's a fantasy series where both genders are extremely prominent and have conflict with one another. It's always nice to see. I think "stupid" was kind of a generic insult used without meaning, since they seem to be as intelligent as the guys in general.
>Perrin basically never interacts with the rest of the story and might as well be cut out and put in his separate fantasy series for those who like that kind of thing.
It's kind of the point that the three ta'veren have their own journies. Not liking Perrin's isn't really a criticism of the writing.

I could go more in depth with these I guess but I'll leave it at that. It's funny to me that a series so blatant about how so much it does is misunderstood by people who proceed to call it bad writing simply because it didn't pander to them.

>>19566377
>Is Lovecraft really that hard to get into?
I'd give him a 3 at most

Just a heads up that this is either 1C or 2C.

BCD5 are impossible to fill because nobody finishes a bad book that is also difficult

>>19566413
That's not true and you know it.
But even if it were true it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing. Column 5 should be sparsely populated anyways.

>>19566413
That's pretty much the pure autism bracket, so there's bound to be some experts on the subject matter that visit this general every now and then.

>>19566444
There are a number of experimental works that left absolutely zero impact upon me other than that I could place them there. I don't even remember the names but they were mediocre as they were dense.

>>19566385
Sounds about right. Frankenstein should be a 3 at most as well. If anything, I was actually pretty impressed by how it didn't feel super dated in terms of its style. People really over-exaggerate "old" styles of writing and their difficulty.

>>19566487
I remember being 12 and struggling with parts of Agatha Christie, I've always assumed that's how poor readers feel about everything.

So, Titirga was not only a master of the Gnosis, but also a Water bearer.

This fucking series.

This chart could use some more sci-fi. Unfortunately I haven't actually gotten around to that many yet, and the few I have are already included.
Here's some stuff I've been recommended at various times others could rate:
>Rendezvous with Rama
>Enders Game
>Quantum Thief
>Ringworld
>Left Hand of Darkness
>A Memory Called Empire
>Stranger in a Strange Land
>The Man in the High Castle
>To Your Scattered Bodies Go
>Anathem
>and various stuff, both sci-fi and fantasy, by Lois McMaster Bujold

>>19566604
>Stranger in a Strange Land
This makes me want to do a chart with a Schizo spectrum, and put this novel off the charts.

>>19566604
>Rendezvous with Rama
B2 - Simple prose with simple strong ideas. Boring at times.
>Enders Game
B1 - fun and easy to read.
>Quantum Thief
B or C2 - Good but not great. Throws a lot of ideas around. Not quite serious SF but a step or two above pulp. M John Harrison would sit in a similar place.
>Ringworld
Haven't read
>Left Hand of Darkness
A or B 3 - not difficult, but tackles complex themes in a way that's sometimes dry. Beautiful at times, insightful at times, at others dry and blind.
>A Memory Called Empire
C2 - Passable modern sci fi meant mainly to entertain.
>Stranger in a Strange Land
D3 - hippie drivel
>The Man in the High Castle
Haven't read
>To Your Scattered Bodies Go
Haven't read
>Anathem
D4 - Overlong, not worth the effort, the few interesting ideas it presents are laid out at face-value and hammered to oblivion. An effort to read from front to back. No fun at all.

Redpill me on "purple prose".

>>19566156
How is name of the wind hard reading? It's bad but it's not like it has particularly hard to red prose

>>19566971
Highly descriptive writing that I don't like.

Once and Future King and Gormenghast are S tier. Perdido Steet Station is better than The Scar.

>>19566971
Victorian, paid by the letter writing.

>>19566971
Cope from people who's brains are too melted to read prose more complicated than YA

>>19566212
Black Company in B1? B2?

I like how this couldn't be done elsewhere as feelings would be hurt and persistent identities get in the way of honest opinions.

>>19567069
Can't shit post against that, can I?

I have come to the Conclusion that Water is of a very important significance for the story of the Second Apocalypse series.

I'm I wrong in this assessment? Because the most holy and climatic moments seem to mention water as the ultimate savior. Not only to life, but to Salvation.

>conan
>b
kill yourself

>>19567364
It's not his opinion.

>>19567375
conan mogs tolkien (a hack) in every measure

>>19566377
>Drop Malazan to B
Hard to say. B+/A- is where I would put it.
>Drop Stormlight to C
Probably.
>Drop Mistborn to D
Yes.
>Drop WOT to C
100% Yes.

>>19567388
He doesn't mean that, this is literally based on the opinions that people are posting. I've never read conan and don't like tolkien myself, so I can't really comment.

Never seen harry potter. I know this is lit but i respect u guys more than tv. I tried reading it but hate the style. 8 fucking movies. Im an old man. Is this shit worth watching without the nostalgia?

>>19567401
Harry Potter is decent/good for kids. The movies are alright, I guess.
Have you seen what other series have gotten as an adaptation? We shouldn't bitch too much about the TERF's story.

>>19567407

I tried watching WoT. Never read the books. The show was shit I made it 1.5 eps

>>19567388
Except success

>>19567401
Why are you watching Harry Potter if you don't care about Harry Potter
Go do something better

>>19567414
The books are trash, man. Don't stress too much about it.
The Witcher TV Show wasn't great either, but still better than WoT.

Like what?

nb4 read bakker

>>19567421
I agree. At least a few episodes were pretty good. Ill give the second season a shot

>>19567424
I meant to quote >>19567416

>>19567438
Memes aside, have you read Bakker? If not, you should at least see what the fuss is all about. You're missing out.

>>19567443
Ive read the first book and just started the second last night. Im glad you fuckers memed me into it and I look forward to completing the series so I can do the same to others.

Is baker even good? His essays are shit but I’ve never read his books and I’d believe you if you said he’s a better fiction writer than philosopher

>>19567447
How I envy you, man. Enjoy the ride, don't rush it.
You'll have 6 more books of pure KINO ahead of you.

>>19567449
I am >>19567447
I really enjoyed the first. I'd recc it. Way better than most fantasy I've read.
>>19567458
I thought only the first 3 were good and the second trilogy was shit?

>>19567462
>I thought only the first 3 were good and the second trilogy was shit?
There are 4 books after the first trilogy. Book 4 and 5 can drag for a bit, but the pace picks up quickly by 6 and culminates in absolute KINO by number 7. Shit's going to eat your brains alive. Kellhu's kids will also be incredibly entertaining to read.

>>19567479
Well now I know he lives thanks for spoiling it dickhead

>>19567449
>Is baker even good?
Yes.
>His essays are shit but I’ve never read his books and I’d believe you if you said he’s a better fiction writer than philosopher
I never read his essays, but the Second Apocalypse series is hardly a work of philosophy in any way, shape or form. It has very little of it, in fact. Bakker wisely opts for aphorisms and a measure of psychology to scatter around and create the ambiance.

>>19567488
You do know that the second series is called the Aspect Emperor, right? I you browse /sffg/ and haven't picked up certain things by now, I don't know what to tell you. Also, how do you know that he's alive just because he has kids?

>>19567499
I try very hard to avoid spoilers. I try to skip over all bakker discussion besides laughing at people getting triggered over the shilling. Whatever Im excited to start book 2.

I like drusas a lot.

>>19567449
People who post here and haven't read Bakker are the ones being memed on.

>>19567516
I downloaded the pdf off libgen, I just need to finish my other reading first

>>19566272
>Imagine having the luxury of sleeping for 10 hours.

What do you guys think about Soldier in the Mist by Wolfe? I don't ever see it mentioned here, but it sounds like a cool concept. I loved The Book of the New Sun and Urth of the New Sun but want to read something else before reading Long Sun and Short Sun. It seems like Wizard Knight is more popular, maybe I'll grab that first.

Where would you put Piers Anthony? I used to love his Xanth and Blue Adept stories growing up. It's easy to read but not much depth.

>>19566212
Here's some sci fi you could add:
>I, Robot- A or B 1
I read it and really enjoyed it when I was 15 or so. This one got me into reading sci fi
>Childhood's End and 2001- B2
A bit dry but I like the ideas and I found it fairly interesting
>Three Body Problem- A3
>The Dark Forest- S3
>Death's End- S3
This is my favorite series I've ever read, but it can be slow and boring for those not interested in the "classic sci fi feel", or the focus on ideas over plot or character
>Annihilation- somewhere
I liked it but don't really remember how difficult it was. Very short. Authority and Acceptance as well but i haven't read those.
One could argue it's not even SFFG, but I think it's close enough
>The Martian- B or C1
It's fun and the science is solid, but oh god the writing
>Murderbot- C or D1
Similar to The Martian, but with predatory monetization (each novella is like $18)
>The Expanse- 1 or 2
I've only read the first one, seems good though. Does it drop off after that?
>Hitchhiker's Guide- S or A 1
It's as easy to read as modern sci fi but it's actually well written

Changes:
>GOT up to A
I think it's a lot better than this board gives it credit for
>Dune down to 3
There's no way the 70 or so pages it takes to get settled in with Dune is any more difficult than the couple hundred pages it takes in LotR. The prose is a lot simpler too.
>Foundation up to 2
It's way too dry and action light for an average 1 reader
>WOT up to 3
But only if it takes into account the sheer length of the series. That's certainly why I haven't started it.
>Hyperion up to S
I just really like it

I like this chart a lot overall, though.

>>19567416
>Except success
capeshit is succesful doesn't mean it's good you entry level tolkien fanboy faggot

>>19567719
>I, Robot- A or B 1
>I read it and really enjoyed it when I was 15 or so. This one got me into reading sci fi.
Agreed, don't remember much of it but it was fun.
>Childhood's End and 2001- B2
>A bit dry but I like the ideas and I found it fairly interesting
C, it's kinda shitty and the "oh my God they're demons" bit really doesn't hold up.
>Three Body Problem- A3
>The Dark Forest- S3
>Death's End- S3
>This is my favorite series I've ever read, but it can be slow and boring for those not interested in the "classic sci fi feel", or the focus on ideas over plot or character
Kek no, D2
>Annihilation- somewhere
>I liked it but don't really remember how difficult it was. Very short. Authority and Acceptance as well but i haven't read those. One could argue it's not even SFFG, but I think it's close enough
It was interesting, I'd say C4
>The Martian- B or C1
>It's fun and the science is solid, but oh god the writing
D
>Murderbot- C or D1
>Similar to The Martian, but with predatory monetization (each novella is like $18)
Agreed
>The Expanse- 1 or 2
I've only read the first one, seems good though. Does it drop off after that?
>Hitchhiker's Guide- S or A 1
>It's as easy to read as modern sci fi but it's actually well written
It's a B, Sheckley is an A
Changes:
>GOT up to A
> I think it's a lot better than this board gives it credit for
B is fine
>Dune down to 3
>There's no way the 70 or so pages it takes to get settled in with Dune is any more difficult than the couple hundred pages it takes in LotR. The prose is a lot simpler too.
Agree
>Foundation up to 2
>It's way too dry and action light for an average 1 reader
Agree
>WOT up to 3
>But only if it takes into account the sheer length of the series. That's certainly why I haven't started it.
Agree
>Hyperion up to S
>I just really like it
It's a B

>>19567755
>C, it's kinda shitty and the "oh my God they're demons" bit really doesn't hold up.
You're probably right. I tend to lump CE, 2001, and Rendezvous with Rama together in my head when I consider stuff like this, but Childhood's end is definitely the weakest of the 3. 2001 is still a B though, and I agree with >>19566954 on RwR
>Kek no, D2
It's an S for me, but judging by how it's been talked about here I'd say the consensus is it's a B at worst.

>>19567719
>There's no way the 70 or so pages it takes to get settled in with Dune is any more difficult than the couple hundred pages it takes in LotR. The prose is a lot simpler too.
You must be forgetting the sequels. Dune by itself could be a 3, but Dune the series, including Children and God Emperor is a solid 4.
> WOT up to 3
> But only if it takes into account the sheer length of the series. That's certainly why I haven't started it.
Agreed

>Hitchhiker's Guide- S or A 1
> It's as easy to read as modern sci fi but it's actually well written
I'd agree on putting it in A1. I quite liked it at least

An S of course, but where?

>>19567816
>You must be forgetting the sequels. Dune by itself could be a 3, but Dune the series, including Children and God Emperor is a solid 4.
It's not difficult on the outset though. The scale is "Hard to get into", which implies that if you've made it to books 3 and 4 the scale no longer applies. Difficulty as a whole, I 100% agree.

>>19567833
The idea of "hard to get into" is meant to represent "hard to read" in general, or at least that was the general intention when the chart was being discussed. So I get that you're technically correct at face value, but for the spirit of the chart representing how difficult a book series might be as a whole for a reader may be more important than keeping to how easy the beginning of the series is.

>>19566156
>name of the wind
Is it really that bad?

>>19567018
>Once and Future King and Gormenghast are S tier.
Agree on Once and Future King. The endings to parts 3 and 4 are among the best endings I have ever read.

This really should've been its own thread rather than a /sffg/ threads.

>One cannot raise walls against what has been forgotten.
Bakker literally hooked me from the first line. Based.

>>19566193
So only 30% of /sffg/ consider bakker their favorite, while 70% don't. Based. Knew the Bakkerposters were just a vocal minority.

>>19567736
I don't like Tolkien or Conan
Neither are very good

Since Malazan was mentioned in the last thread I have to ask how do warrens work exactly? I stopped at Memories of Ice but is an explanation ever given? They're conduits for power but at the same time also empty marshes and desserts or random stretches of land, and wizards can feel soultaken in them but not the humans who constantly move around in warrens? Its mentioned that the warrens are the blood and arteries of an elder god but Jaghuts had warrens long before he existed and again some warrens are just random pieces of land.

Also, the Pannion-seer Domin is fucking retarded, it doesn't matter how many bodies you have if everyone of them is basically a corpse, all Erikson did when he had the archer infiltrate their army was prove how dumb it was. Just because your soldiers are starving cannibals doesn't make then better than the regular well fed man, in fact its the opposite.

>>19568040
Anon, this was a poll of 12 options including "every other author combined" as one of the options. It's not 1 vs the rest, it's 1 v 1 v 1 v 1 (etc). A single author getting 30% doesn't make them a minority, it makes them the majority that wins the battle royale. And 1/3rd of the thread is hardly much worse than 1/2 of the thread.

>>19566212
I would bump Black Company up to A or B. Yeah, book III on belongs in C or even D category, but the first two are excellent.

Snowcrash is a popular one that seems to be missing. I'd say B2. Revelation Space too, I'd put that at A4.

Shadow of the Torturer I'd bump down to A maybe.

Ender's Game at B2, I'd throw Red Rising in at A1 for being fun, but the first book is definitely just a B so it's tough.

>>19568124
>>19566212
Shoot, I forgot Vurt. I'd throw that in A5. You don't get a lot of good, really fucking weird sci-fi like that.

>>19567719
I agree with GOT up to A. Book three is excellent. The show coming out got the contrarian all riled against, and the author dropping it, it but it's quite good at what it does well.

>>19568162
It's a B at best for the character profiles but the rest of the series is a runny C.

>>19566212
Fuck, and Witcher down to a B. Last one I read that I disagree with to a large degree. Honestly think a ton of Tolkien is just first mover advantage, but I'm not going to bother arguing that.

I take it this is only for stuff published as genre fiction, right? If we allow fantastical lit, Kafka on the Beach, Slaughterhouse Five, Borges' stories then you're going to need SS and SSS tiers to differentiate.

>>19567585
Soldier of the mist is excellent, especially if you have any interest in ancient Greek history. Plus the memory issues of the protagonist make it a very satisfying read, much like Wolfe's other works, when you figure out what is actually happening.

>>19568037
That's actually a really stupid line. If you raise walls for any reason, you raise them against everything, even threats you've forgotten. That's just how walls work. A better analogy would have been like, I don't know, keeping a weapon trained on them. And the book starts that way? Awful.

>>19568193
It gets an A for not being terrible and going heavy with the slav folklore. Let's just collectively ignore the last series if need be.

>>19568227
no

>>19567585
If you want something much easier, Wizard Knight is good. If you want something a little easier, Soldier is good. If you want something much harder, Peace is the best.

>>19568251
The only worthwhile thing Wolfe wrote was The Death of Doctor Island, and that was clearly an accident.

>>19568193
>Witcher down to a B.
How about no. It's a really good serias all things considered

>>19568262
Yeah, I liked it. Hence a B. I didn't think it was one of the best I ever read. I wouldn't put it on par with Neuromancer or Hyperion.

Now one that might belong up there is Red Shirts, but I'm not sure. The shitty writing contrivance takes a bit too long to develop into the actual point of the book. At first I could not understand how a book that read like it was written by a high schooler had won awards.

Is Clockwork Orange sci-fi? That'd be an S.

>>19566156
The Girl with All The Gifts, B1. Best zombie story I ever read. Fun, read, not too much going on, but had good twists.

Ilium, the other Dan Simmons sci-fi. C3. Cool ideas, no real coherent ending after two massive books.

Foundation - B2-3.

Prince of Thorns - B/C 2. It was ok, not bad but not recommendable IMO.

My personal S would be Hyperion, Dune, and The Darkness That Comes Before. Haven't read the one in S1 though. Would drop the others a grade.

Bakker's first effort, Neuropath, deserves a slot diagonal from SA at A3.

>>19566212
You know where to put it

>>19567069
>>19567968
So the threads were better before? For the love of God Almighty we wouldn’t want people to discuss various books instead of shitposting and false flagging. It’s almost like this good discussion is trumping all chances of chinkshitters to do their squatting.

>>19568681
I do indeed. The lower D series is looking quite empty still.

>>19567018
Agree with Gormenghast being an S tier series (especially Titus Groan) but I'm not sure if I would classify it as fantasy

Alright, another round of update. I will keep to the 5x5 chart size and will have at maximum six books per slot. As you can see, there are some slots that are already full. If you want to suggest a book or a book series, and the slot that you want to put it is full, you'll have to either recommend moving something from that slot to somewhere else or otherwise explain why your book is more relevant to take over some other.

Some (directional) explanations on the classifications:

D
>Low literary merit
>Unoriginal
>Uninteresting

C
>If you like fantasy or sci-fi you'll probably like reading these
>Solid books, nothing out of this world
>Original works

B
>This is why people read speculative fiction
>Books that almost everybody can agree are good

A
>Trend-setters, Trailblazers
>Better than B tier but not worthy of S tier

S
>Books that change the way to look at the world
>Everybody can agree these books are amazing works of fiction

1
>Easy to get into
>No previous reading required
>Middle-schoolers can easily understand

2
>Probably should not be your first choice to read if you are a novice but its doable
>Will increase in complexity in story, characters, or setting compared to 1
>Some thinking is required on the reader's part

3
>Complex prose or books or a long series
>Complex setting
>One may need to look at dictionary

4
>Challenging works to read at times
>Dictionary may be a friend for ESLs here
>Many things shown in the books is not explained and will be up to reader's interpretation

5
>Most times require intensive reading and rereading to understand
>Checking online wikis almost a necessity
>Have your dictionary at hand

TL;DR
>Help me make the chart better
>You may also want to give a better description of the classifications

>>19568857
is this a troll list

>>19566156
Goodkind should be in S5. His books are more than just fantasy novels. A lot of people talk shit about him because they aren't educated enough to understand the deeper meaning.

>>19568857
gonna beat you up for the Dying Inside placement, other stuff looks good though

>>19568867
Excellent bait.

>>19568865
Go back to sleep, Moogy.

>>19568857
Is Stranger in a Strange Land really that bad? I thought it was well-regarded
Also, the placement of Three Body Problem stings, I think the series as a whole is much better than a C. Too bad there's no space left above it.
I would also add Piranesi to B or C 1. Good premise, great setting, doesn't really do much with it.

I found Bakker way harder to get into than Book of the New Sun. You only have the single character in Book of the New Sun, whereas Bakker has several. That and I Bakkers found prose harder to digest.

>>19568882
Stranger certainly belongs at least in C. If nothing else, it's an intriguing – and well-written – failed experiment by one of the greatest sci-fi writers of the previous century.

Bros... We were wrong.

>>19568857
>Silmarillion
>4
>Challenging works to read at times
>Dictionary may be a friend for ESLs here
>Many things shown in the books is not explained and will be up to reader's interpretation
I'm not really seeing it. It's certainly dry in parts, but I think going into it with the proper mentality of wanting a meal made of sides makes it pretty easy to digest on the whole

>>19568943
I made up the class descriptions 15 minutes after waking up, if you wanna modify them, please give feedback. Otherwise, we might just move Silmarillion to 3.

>>19568930
Lol the Wheel of Time is not advanced. Eye of The World is borderline ya.

>>19568930
What an embarrassing list

>>19567018
>Perdido Steet Station
Dogshit

>>19568930
books ot avoid

>>19568857
>>19568857
S is getting too crowded. It is for the cream of the crop. Ghormenghast and once and future king are not S, and while I have not read that one Zelazny book and Perdido Station I doubt their S ranks aswell.
Previous S rank was better.

Prydain to C
Sandman to A
Frankenstein to B

Also we need Farseer, but idk where.

>>19568930

>>19569131
Gormenghast is the perfect example of S tier fantasy lit. I'm sorry you got filtered.

>>19566156
It's funny how many people got filtered by Hyperion, it should be S-tier

>>19569131
>and while I have not read that one Zelazny book and Perdido Station I doubt their S ranks aswell.

>>19568857
>Simmons, Lewis, Howard, Lovecraft, Vance, Heinlein
>B or less
>China Gayville
>S
this general is composed of giga faggots

>>19569252
what do you expect from a eurogay bakkerbrainlet

>>19566156
>Eddings and Alexander in D-tier
>Hobbit in B-tier with Brandon fucking Sanderson
>Anything by GRRM above a C
>This Immortal in C
>Bakker meme
Shit list

>>19569252
Simmons is bad, but I agree with the rest of what you said.

>>19566156
Sanderson should be at the D spot. Also, there is no way that Tad Williams is in the same category as Sanderson.

>>19569259
I go by the recommendations, I have not read China Mieville. As I have have said, it is an iterative process. There is no reason to get angry, or false flag.

>>19569260
Also no need to samefag, please see the list in >>19568857

I am not sure what kind of VPN campaign Moogy has just launched. How about of instead of resorting to ad hoc you give some change recommendations.

>>19569271
Dont look at OP, see >>19568857

>>19569273
why do you assume moogy read books

China Merdeville on the same level as Tolkien, LeGuinn, Dunsany, Wolfe, Peake, are you kidding??

>>19569282
>>19569252
You've made your point already.

>>19569252
>>19569259
>>19569260
>>19569271
>>19569282
Did you expect anything else from this general of fags?

>>19569288
it's a different point

>>19569290
Go back to sleep, Moogy. Everyone can see you are VPN shitposting, ONCE AGAIN. Nothing else explains a sudden surge of false flags during a 15 minute period at 11 AM in GMT+2 time.

>>19569278
Hey guy's moggle here that's about all peice out

>>19569290
>Did you expect anything else from this general of fags?
Just a tourist from the main board. Didn't know you guys had such a lame taste.

>>19569300
>Didn't know you guys had such a lame taste.
Don't add me into it, I cringe at the list on how shitty it is.

Reminder that these replies exist in the previous thread.

HAHAHAHAHAHA JESUS THIS FUCKEN LIST MAN

>>19569337
>Poster count didn't go up by 1
Hmm

Moggy, You will never be a writer

>HE USES LE VPN TO POST AS NUMEROUS POSTERS
>ALSO LE POSTER COUNT DIDN'T GO UP
take your meds, faggots

>>19569300
Nah, just a few faggots who hijack the thread. Notice how they all blame one imaginary person.

>>19569346
Based.

>>19569346
Simple as.

>>19569217
I am the guy who suggested it for the chart at A5 in the first place. It is good, but barely even Fantasy. It is almost a screen play, with really evocative prose which gives it an interesting effect where you can imagine all characters either as normal humans, or as grotesque Jim Henson esque beings.
The showdown in the spider room, the stream of consciousness passages and the main character are all kino/kino, but if you compare it to Guin, Wolfe, Tolkien, Herbert, Dunsany it falls short by an inch.
It is not even really fantasy, it fell into the same category by accident. Seeing anything that is not the Bible in the same tier as BOTNS is just wrong

But given that A is getting crowded, by all means, keep Gormenghast in S. But knock down the Once and Future King.

>>19566156
Name of the wind is definitely not worse than mistborn but maybe it is deserving of a D considering that it'll never be finished.

>>19568143
Seconding Vurt

>>19568102
The warrens are pocket dimensions/streams in the realm of chaos/cosmos. Originally they were called holds, but K'rul created the warren "interface" so that mortals could use magic.

>>19569330
There is an interesting thing going on here. Bakkerposting made the /sffg/ so awfull that its reputation as vile shit spread throughout the entire board. Before this list the general was at its lowest, and I saw daily rants about it being atrocious in the "write whats on your mind", the Gene Wolfe thread and on other metaish threads on this site.
Now the quality of the /sffg/ has temporarily risen, but since it has the reputation off being a dump tourists come to shit in here.
/sffg/ can have arcs without needing literature for that...

Finally, an /sffg/ where I can actually post.

Sayonara, weebshits. You will not be missed.

>>19569469
It wasn't Bakkerposting that made /sffg/ bad, it played a role but it is definitely not the sole reason.

>>19569485
Based, and truthpilled.

>>19569488
But it was the sole reason

>>19569469
Bakker is the hero we don't deserve.

>>19569492
No, not really.

>>19569469
>>19569492
False flag harder, maybe?
Because the thread is literally filled with Bakkerfags and it has never been this great.

>>19569288
>>19569290
>Faggot wastes time making faggy list
>/lit/ shits on him
>"It's...it's just one guy disagreeing with me. I-I swear! VPN."
Kek what a seething bitch. I'm sure he'll respond to this claiming I'm whoever the fuck else.

>>19569503
Thank you for proving his point. Took you long enough.

>>19569488
>>19569497
This is the real reason the /sffg/ went to shit so hard:
>19557330
>The fate of generals happened. A couple nolifes use it for their autistic parody of socialization.

The general was becoming super inbred, with a core of less than 10 complete social recluses shitting out dozens of posts per thread. They were bakkerposting, and they were the problem. Not every bakkerposter is one of the autistic nolifes, but every autistic nolife is a bakkerposter.

>>19569503
Yes, that is how VPNs work.
Thanks for sharing what we already knew.

>>19569509
Nah, autistic Bakkerposting is only a reactionary consequence of weebshit.

>>19568102
The Pannion-seer was literally just taking out his own pain on the world, spurred on by the Crippled God who is also just taking out his own pain on the world. It being dumb or smart is irrelevant. It's a terrible and emotional thing.

>>19569515
This desu.

>>19569509
Think the only autistic person here is Moogy who tries to make every single OP of /sffg/, /wg/ and God only knows what else in different boards. I can't believe one man has that much time but he has. No wonder he does not read or write, instead resorting to watching virtual youtubers all day and posting anime girls.

>>19569509
Bakkerposting is the life blood of this general. Without Bakker, you would almost only have woke and weebshit.

Don't believe me? Check the archive, Bakker has been around /lit/ way before /sffg/ was even a thing.

>>19569522
>>19569515
>>19569524
Based and truth-pilled.

>>19569522
Please do note that I spoke of Moogy as a man, meaning he (male), will never be a woman (female). He might claim otherwise but the reality disagrees with him.

>Chartmaker's last post was an hour ago
>So embarrassed he removes the name tag
>>19569511 starts making the same accusation as Chartmaker, obviously projecting as he probably uses a VPN to do damage control
Holy fucking kek

>>19569509
No, the thread was dead because one autist using a VPN was fabricating posts and using old archive copy-pastas in order to keep the thread engaged when clearly no actual discourse was being held.

The future of SFF is wokeshit and xianxia. Deal with it.

/sffg/ is getting falseflagged from left and right (by one guy), meanwhile /wg/ is suddenly silent, (hmm!)

>>19569531
Cope.

>>19569522
>>19569528
There is no moogy you fucking retards, you are borderline schizophrenic and most definitly paranoid if you think that every anime OP on this entire website is done by the same person.
And with that the recluses at the core of the whole drama are identified, maybe start taking your meds?

>>19569549
Someone did bring up the fact that moody or whatever was created after Bakker spamming was dying.

>>19569549
I am moogy

>>19569549
Note that Moogy is known for using the word schizo and especially schizoid. He always is telling people to take meds because he (note! not a female) thinks this way he gets the upper hand. (He doesn't!) (sad!)

>>19569557
>Note that Moogy is known for using the word schizo and especially schizoid.
Good job, you just described more than half of 4chan users.

>>19569561
sounds like something moogy would say

>>19569557
>I keep getting called a schizo for my schizoid behaviour, it has to be this moogy character
can't make this cope up...

>Someone come up with making a book rec chart for newbies and everybody thinks it is a great idea.
>People start discussing various books
>Chart gets rounds of iterations becoming better and better (not being perfect, and never will)
>The chinkshit poster AKA moogy gets mad because the general is going to a direction he hasnt wanted
>The thread is better than it has been for a long time
It is not hard to add 1 and 1 together. Anyone who simply says the chart is a bad idea or bad is most probably Moogy

>>19569573
You should really take your meds.

this the moogy you guys are talking about?

>>19569582
We accept your (singular) surrender.

>>19569584
Most probable.

Why does moogy hate Terry Goodkind so much? Does moogy lack the intellectual fortitude needed to understand sophisticated writers?

>>19569600
I am starting to like this Terry Goodking meme. Someone might ACTUALLY try to read his books and waste his precious time. Other than that, I think chinkshitter hates every book that isn't MTL web-novel.

>>19569603
Goodkind is basically a right wing equivalent of Bakker. Both are horrendous.

>>19569605
Goodkind wan't right wing.

>>19569603
I really don't understand why Goodkind is Hated while Jordan is praised. I honestly thing Goodkind was a better writer than Jordan.

>>19569614
Because Jordan actually kept on point. Half of the Sword of Truth series is just straight up soapboxing. It barely even tries to pretend it's anything else, it's straight up author spiel.
Along with that, Goodkind turns all his characters, including the protagonists, into absolute assholes.

Well /sffg/? How does one show dragons being ableist?

>>19569617
Characters in the Wheel of Time are all the same. Robert Jordan couldn't write realistic people if someone put a gun to his head. Every paragraph in every book contains the phrase "she tugged her hair" or "she straightened her skirt". You haven't read the Sword of Truth. You read some reviews. Fuck you moogy.

>>19569629
At least it HAS characters, Sword of Truth has two dimensional straw mans of political stances the author doesn't like. The thing is, I have a lot in common with Goodkind politically speaking, but even I found him incredibly obnoxious. And then there's the huge tracts of weird BDSM bullshit he shoves in for no reason.

>>19569627
first I thought how gay reddit is, then I read on and realized its just some disabled kid who probably got bullied and likes dragons....

>>19569617
You're the guy in Moogy's discord server talking about how you want to slander Goodkind's name. You people are the lowest of the low iq.

>>19569636
You can't appreciate the sex scenes because you've never had sex. I can tell because you agree with Goodkinds cringe libertarian politics.

>>19569643
Excellent bait.
Every mention of Terry Goodkind is just a meme to bait and troll. I suggest you don't answer these posts

>>19569639
As Goodkind tells us, and I quote, in volume two of The Sword of Truth "bully that who needeth bullying for those are the ways of social darwinian"

>>19569636
>weird BDSM bullshit he shoves in for no reason.
It seems to me a common trend with fantasy.
Herbert with his Bene Gesserit, Bakker with his homosex and black seed, Jordan with his haremshit. Not to mention GRRM with his assorted degeneracies.
Are all post-Tolkien authors just coomer-nerds who write novels just to have an excuse to showcase their fetishes?

>>19569659
It's honestly something I've found myself having a problem with. Modern fantasy is just so damn focused on females. I'm sick of it, I don't want to read about women.
John Carpenter's The Thing is the best movie ever made in large part because it hasn't got a single woman in it.

I still can't believe we've got /lit/ ACK, complete with imaginary boogyman gangstalker. Where do these people come from?

>>19569659
When I go to bed at night I fantasize about me and Nyanaeve living together in the two rivers. She keeps me on leash like the good pet I am. I would do anything to please my mistress. When I do something she doesn't like she slaps my testicles as hard as she can. Even if we're in public! It's okay though because I know she does it out of love.

>>19569209
blows my fucking mind that this hambeast somehow landed a semi-successful tv show. america is a sludge pit.

>>19569699
A wealthy man is nothing without his health
-Sir Terry Goodkind

>>19569704
i'm not so much jealous over her success but marveling at what americans will subject themselves to just to escape from their pathetic lives.

>>19569716
americans were patient zero of S-N cycle culture, but only because their special friends with the small hats strategically infected them first

don't blame flyover farmers for what Sodom (LA) and Gomorrah (NY) did to them on purpose to make them into perma-pigvassals

>>19569731
Sweet worldbuilding dude. When are we getting your full sff novel/trilogy?

>>19569427
>Seeing anything that is not the Bible in the same tier as BOTNS is just wrong
I hope this is a joke. It's good for genre fiction , it is by no means top tier literature or even top tier 20th century literature with fantasy elements because One Hundred Years of Solitude, Beloved, Ficciones, Gravity's Rainbow, etc. blow it out of the water and are tiers above.

>>19568220
What a retarded attempt at critique.

>>19566156
>C.S. Lewis not C
>Brando Sando above D
>Tolkien anywhere near S
>fucking Sapkowski lmao

And Dhalgren is D. I really wish nothing but pain on you.

>>19569781
Kys pseudo

>>19569781
Imagine aiming to pick a book by Toni Morrison and that not being Song of Solomon.

>>19569781
It was actually a joke by me, but it completely flew over your head. I didn't mean to imply that BOTNs is one of the best books ever written, the joke was that the Bible is merely really well written but hard to read genre fiction...
For the record, I consider /lit/ to be on point for this one, with BOTNS as the best genre fiction ever written.

>>19566224
Definitely row 4, since Wolfe is the benchmark for 5. I would put it at A4, being objective, fanboying S4.

>>19569873
A number of the books above it would be considered genre fiction if they weren't considered general literature based on critical reception. Why wouldn't 2666 fit the bill, or One Hundred Years of Solitude, or Faust for the matter?

>>19569910
I mean we can slam Faust in the chart if you want, S3-4 or so?

Genre Fiction is a term for literature which is specifically made to gain a reader pool that only reads that genre. It is safer to write, because your chances of success are higher, as there are like 10 million readers who will pick up any decent fantasy book. This safety often leads to lower quality on average, the same is true for other genres, like horror, thriller, western, sci fi etc...
Given that proles reading, and thus forming genre fans, is a fairly recent thing, all genre literature has to be fairly recent aswell.

Wolfe's genius is that he takes a Sword & Sorcery story, the most pulpy and low brow substrain of the fantasy genre, and just pumps actual literature in there. It is like taking a plate of veggies and colouring them with food paint until they look like sweets.

>>19568930
>intermedite

>>19569335
that would explain why arcane is considered such a masterpiece

>>19569131
>Frankenstein
>literary classic that has stood the test of time for over two centuries
>Sandman, some solid genre fiction that is steadily being forgotten by comicbook readers and fantasy readers alike
Frankenstein is like the definition of an A; literary merit, massively influential, compelling tragedy about the nature of man. Only thing keeping it from S is that sometimes it can drag on at parts, but even those parts are contributing to overall characterization, even if they could have been done more succinctly.

>>19569931
That seems silly. If you add Faust you might as well add the Inferno or Hamlet, etc. At which point your S tier will be filled to the brim, and also not at all analogous to each other because, as much as I love Bakker, he doesn't belong in a tier with Goethe.

>>19569958
Indeed. You can't pool pre-genre fiction works with genre fiction, since genre fiction is inferior almost by nature.

Thats why I propose Phantastes as the cutoff point for fantasy. It is 1858 and widely considered to be the first book to later turn fantasy into a genre. Older books can't be genre fiction for fantasy, as there was no such genre yet.

>Novels are first and foremost about people and the human condition, "the struggles of the heart in conflict with itself." Fantasy novels focus primarily on events and setting as opposed to the (mostly) human characters at the center of their narratives, which is one reason why they are not considered as "literary" as other types of fiction.
>People who read mostly fantasy read for the interesting ideas, events and settings, while people who read mostly literary fiction read for the exploration of the human characters.
>If you were to write a novel that was set in a fantasy world and focuses on and explores the human condition, you would alienate fantasy readers (because the focus is not on the setting or the big events), and the literary readers (because it is set in a fictional fantasy world).
>It's a no-win scenario either way
The game was rigged from the start, frens.

>>19569998
I don't think that's totally true. Brave New World, 1984, Murakami, etc. have all been successful in the literary world with plots that would count as genre fiction. Arguably magical realism (Marquez, Morrison, etc.) could count to. Master and the Margarita is another example.

They weren't intended or published as genre fiction though, I think that's the main difference. Plenty of other books thread the line. Those ones just stand out because they're very good.

>>19570040
To expand, Bakker's thing about literary fantasy seemed kind of off to me because I had just read 1Q84 beforehand, and Murakami is one of the most respected authors currently publishing. But I think he has a point as far as the sort of epic fantasy he is writing, with totally unique setting. Versus works where fantasy elements get slowly introduced.

Murakami might also be benefiting for Japs having less bias against fantasy, not sure about that.

Looking back at award winners to see if I missed any books I really liked, I have to wonder if Bakker could have won a Hugo of World Fantasy if he had just cut down on the rape. The crop wasn't particularly strong.

>>19569998
Literally a dusty smoothbrain take by someone whos mind breaks at the idea of elves and sorcerers conveying real emotions. For post gen X-ers worldbuilding comes as easy as breathing and isnt something that overtakes a story by simply existing.

>>19570112
https://youtu.be/-M0uT6WhJsQ?t=478

has there ever been a time when awards weren't blatantly political?

>>19570112
I highly recommend reading Gass' essay about the problem with literary awards
>https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/books/98/11/01/specials/gass-prizes.html?_r=2&oref=login&oref=slogin

>>19570176
Thankfully, it doesn't really matter. Most Hugo's get forgotten. Most are at least solid, so it's a good benchmark, but not a sign of the highest quality. You look back and see plenty of books that totally fell of the radar, and some I thought were pretty mediocre.

Citizen Kane didn't win best picture. Plenty of less serious solid films (Fight Club, Indiana Jones, Drive, ET, Fargo, Big Lebowski, etc.) didn't get nominated. Plenty of winners go to the dustbin of history.

Cult following might be better over the long run. Evil Dead probably has one of the highest profit margins of all time, grossing millions on an absolutely tiny budget. It got finished in Rami's parents' basement and his brother had to play the females after they went deadite because the cast started quiting in part due to no money. Yet those two movies with their tiny budgets did what millions spent on big studio horror couldn't.

Making the chart was always doomed because it relied upon the conflicting input of a few anons determined to impose their agenda and a weak judge. The correct method was consensus but I agree that isn't viable due to the effort required.

>>19570176
Damn, Gass. Tell us how you really feel.

>>19566156
>filtered by based KJ parker

>>19568857
stars my destination s 2

>>19568857
Stanislaw Lem - Fiasco.

S4.

Challenge me, faggots.

>>19570359
Either that or A2. Makes sense.

>>19568857
>D
>>Low literary merit
>>Unoriginal
>>Uninteresting
Dying inside does not belong here. Move it to a B at least.

>>19570112
prince of nothiing had a fair bit of hype behind it before he got cancelled, he was at cons alongisde with grmm

>>19570369
The book fucking blows
>First chapter is completely pointless
>goofy overdone premise
>prose so shitty you can tell it's bad even behind the translation

>>19570402
>First chapter is completely pointless
It sets up the protagonist and the setting. And it's mostly a very nice sequence.

>goofy overdone premise
Name three books with the same premise. Here, I'll help with the first two:
>Blindsight
>Echopraxia
>????

>prose so shitty you can tell it's bad even behind the translation
What can I say except F I L T E R E D

>>19570409
Cope

RSB, the trigrammaton, disapproves.

>>19570372
A2, it's driven by pulp and spectacle. Someone else can kick it up to S but for me it was what C tier works wish they were.

>>19568857
Make me a favour and put Sixteen Ways up in B1.
However chose that was a fag. The rest is pretty good.

>>19570430
>>19570409
Also:
>The Sparrow
>Downward to Earth
>Embassytown
>A Case of Consciousness
>Ender's Game

>>19570466
>Make me a favour
Sorry, ESLs aren't allowed to make decisions.

Do you guys like mass market paperbacks? I think they feel better to read out of and I like that I can see my progress on the spine of the book.
Thoughts?

>>19570492
Forgot pic

>>19570492
Digital or Death

>>19570498
>buying the same book multiple times
But why though? Are you collecting editions and formats?

Spoiler: ChartMaker is Moogy

>>19570505
I didn't take that picture I just found it on google. If you really like a book then I could see buying a limited edition. If I was ever in france I might buy a french copy of Submission because I think it would be cool to have.

>>19570511
That's why he didn't put Wizards First Rule in S5. He's a fag who can't appreciate good literature

>>19570527
You can just order it anyway from wherever.
>but if I'm no physically located in France it isn't the same!
Sentimental nonsense

>>19570532
No, that belongs in Z99.

>>19570224
You misunderstand its purpose. It was only ever for ChartMaker to feel good about himself and to push agendas. In those regards, it's been a complete success.

ITT: anons who don't understand the purpose of a general

>>19570538
It would be more like a souvenir. When I travel to another country sometimes I buy a book. I guess I could just buy a stupid shirt or knick knack.
I pity autistic people like yourself that can't understand sentimental value. You must live in a cold world. I bet you can't imagine the scenes in a book as you read. This picture is what I believe you might look like.

>>19570559
Souvenir are serial traveler trophies. They remind of you the places you've been. It's ritualistic. So, basically the same as serial killer trophies.

>>19570511
I believe it.

>>19570554
Please enlighten us.

>>19570567
yeah

>First 100 pages are an info dump
Bravo Martin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjCnU11COm8

I wish that was me.

>>19570591
Shit all you like on these two, but at least they don't write politics like a teenager.

>>19570578
A general isn't meant to be specifically about anything within its category. Too much of the same thing needs its own thread, a specific if you will.

>>19566156
what do SABCD mean?

>>19570619
Most generals turn into incestuous cesspits after only a few weeks. This is an improvement

>>19570624
Such A Beautiful Chart, Damn!

>>19570624
Sucking a Black Cock, Duh?

>>19570624
It's millennial for ABCDF because of participation trophies and because their parents told them they were special.

>>19570650
fucking retard

When did this general become good all of a sudden?

>>19570624
It's the Japanese tier ranking system.

>>19570624
>>19570650
Correction, it's Weeb for ABCDF

>>19566156
Wizards First Rule should be in B3.

>>19570656
It happened because you were gone. Now you've ruined it.

>>19570656
When moogy got here. Think about it.

>>19570661
Laws are greater than Rules
Therefore, First Law is better.

>>19570656
>>19570671
>>>/discord/

>>19570675
>>19570675
>>19570675

Not so fast Moogy

>>19570675
>>19570675
>>19570675

>>19570671
moogy started the moogy meme because all anons had forgotten about him. Also, you're moogy. hello, fellow moogy.

>>19570603
Game of Thrones is a story about FAMILY anon

>>19570591
>Bakker chuds OHNONONONO

>>19570658
>>19570660
thank you

>>19566156

Aw man, I didn't think Dragonbone Chair was that bad or tough. I would move it to the B section and give it a three or two for difficulty.

>>19570759
Dragonbone entered the chart at D, and has been steadily climbing since then. It is at B in the newest one, may even shoot for A.

>>19570774
And all because of a single dedicated poster pretending to be multiple anons.

>>19566156
>Conan
>B tier
Pure faggotry but what should I expect from people who put le morte de Arthur below dune

>>19570819
>>19570774
>>19570759
Post in the new thread.

>>19570823
No, you mentally ill faggot.

>>19569910
Genre fiction and literary fiction are academic constructs.

>>19570807
Hey we are at least three people!
But yeah, there are not many Dragonbone fans, thats why it started charting at D.
I have been surprised how many people (including me) were shilling for it tho, even if it was mostly to diss on Sanderson being in the same thread.

could someone post the template...

>>19570848
You're not even that.

>>19569998
One Hundred Years of Solitude is set in a semi-fantasy setting (Macondo) and it's also about human characters.

>>19570896
Yes, I am. And so are you.

>>19570689
Yes, that's why there's so much incest.

>>19570895
You're in the wrong thread.

>>19566156
The Night's Dawn Trilogy and Animorphs are my recommendations.

>>19570959
>tries to troll in a dead thread
Nice going

>>19570895

>>19570964
I was being completely serious. Have you read Animorphs?

>>19570988
And what would that be?

>>19571000
It would be you.

>>19570675
>>19570675
>>19570675
Migrate

>>19571000
It's a series of children's sci-fi books about aliens and a group of kids who are given the ability to transform into animals. They look like simple, uncomplicated little books, but there are some surprisingly deep, disturbing themes and elements to the story. I consider them hidden gems in the realm of science fiction.

>>19571020
You've lost. Surrender and we won't harm you.

>>19571015
Fuck off you dumb cunt.

>>19571020
based

>>19571032
>still posting in a thread past bump limit
lol

>>19571032

>Thread past bump limit
>Moogy finally starts posting
The absolute state.

>>19571020
Shame it doesn’t get more recognition.

>>19566156
What makes dune hard to get into?

>>19569873
Short sun(5s, will accept 5a) > New Sun(5s) > long sun(b4)