/lit/ - Literature

>>19329179
There is no deep difference between natsoc or any other modern political movement, so the question does not matter

sorry

probably the massive improvement in standard of living in such a short time

>>19329179
>doubling down on terrible threads

>>19329185
i kind of "get" this from a philosophical standpoint but i can't really bring myself to agree

>>19329187
where is the other?

>>19329186
is that not a bit too dull?

>>19329179

Unless you're the epitome of a retarded normie, you should have well cultivated public and private selves. You shouldn't let one totally undermine the other

>>19329179
Heidegger - bought in to the volkisch propaganda, thought that NS would be a total philosophical renewal of society able to overcome the technoscientific forgetting of being embodied by anglo-american capitalism and bolshevik communism, and thought that he could play court philosopher to it. was disappointed by how mediocre and ultimately trivial NS turned out to be.
Schmitt - careerism, he was anti-nazi up till March 1933. after 1936 he became a pariah because the SS distrusted him. also really hated communism and anglo-american capitalism, for reasons vaguely similar to Heidegger's but more inflected by catholicism, so NS seemed like a good bet under the circumstances
juenger - was never a nazi. he saw what they were from the outset.

>>19329179
Jünger was never NS. He was in the German military but he was deeply critical of Hitler both publically and privately, he knew he was untouchable as a war hero. He even wrote allegorical books about Nazism and how shit it was. He may have had a spot in the plot to kill Hitler and he refused a seat in the Reichstag on multiple occasions.

The answer to your question, when it isn't 'they weren't,' is 'because they were well-off German men in a totalitarian era and didn't have much of a choice.'

Stormfags leave the premises

>>19329214
Wrong. He was a Nazi but chickened out when it got too tough.

>>19329213
thank you very much!
im not so sure about the jünger part though

>>19329217
That's complete and total bullshit. He was a national conservative and a reactionary, the last of an aristocratic breed. The national conservatives were also anti-Nazi, even from the beginning.

Stormfags will never understand nuance and still see things in terms in left/right politics. Just because he wasn't a commie doesn't mean he was a fellow travelers of Stormfags.

>>19329233
He wrote most of the national socialist philosophy and was personal friends with Hitler.

>>19329185
now that is a hot take, surely you plan on elaborating

>>19329251
My guess is that he's a Traditionalist

>>19329213
What ideology or philosophy best encapsulates Heidegger's ideal world?

>>19329179
>Nevertheless, with the calamitous founding of the Reich in 1871, the devil stole a march on the Germans, dangling before them the tempting bait of power, aggrandizement, national arrogance. Thus they were led to imitate their prophets and to take their words literally, but not to understand them. And so it was that the Germans allowed themselves to be deluded by these disastrous fantasies and succumbed to the age-old temptations of Satan, instead of turning to their abundant spiritual potentialities, which, because of the greater tension between the inner opposites, would have stood them in good stead. But, their Christianity forgotten, they sold their souls to technology, exchanged morality for cynicism, and dedicated their highest aspirations to the forces of destruction. Certainly everybody else is doing much the same thing, but even so there really are chosen people who have no right to do such things because they should be striving for higher treasures. At any rate the Germans are not among those who may enjoy power and possessions with impunity. Just think for a moment what anti-Semitism means for the German: he is trying to use others as a scapegoat for his own greatest fault! This symptom alone should have told him that he had got on to a hopelessly wrong track.

>>19329213
Junger said Hitler would loose because he wasn't brutal enough.

Don't try and moralise his position into some liberal faggotry.

>>19329295
also Jung

>A collective attitude naturally presupposes this same collective psyche in others. Thus it is a quite unpardonable mistake to accept the conclusions of a Jewish psychology as generally valid. Nobody would dream of taking Chinese or Indian psychology as binding upon ourselves. The cheap accusation of anti-Semitism that has been levelled at me on the ground of this criticism is about as intelligent as accusing me of an anti-Chinese prejudice. No doubt, on an earlier of of psychic development, where it is still impossible to distinguish between an Aryan, Semitic, Hamitic, Mongolian mentality, all human races have a common collective psyche. But with the beginning of racial differentiation essential differences are developed in the collective psyche as well. For this reason we cannot transplant the spirit of a foreign race in globo into our own mentality without sensible injury to the latter, a fact which does not, however, deter sundry natures of feeble instinct from affecting Indian philosophy and the like.

>>19329277
I don't know, and ultimately he himself didn't know. He knew that Anglo-American liberal capitalism definitely wasn't it, and Bolshevism neither. For a few years [1933-4] he thought national socialism was it, but it ended up just being another vector for Machenschaft. His political trajectory terminated in quietism. Hence his resignation in the 1966 Spiegel interview. Whatever political form is appropriate to the essence of modern technology, he is "not convinced that it is democracy." But aside from that nothing else seems to work either. Only a God can save us now.

>>19329464
He was never an Ideologist, he just saw a great potential in National Socialism, since it's intimate connection with a German destiny was undeniable.

>>19329297
No moralising here. Juenger was correct. He saw very early on exactly what the Nazis were - petit-bourgeois mediocrities infested with a sickly political romanticism, too interested in writing their own tragedy - too saturated with Wagnerian fatalism, nihilism, to be remotely equal to the forces opposing them.

>>19329475

It's funny you mention nihilism, because romanticism and nationalism seem to me like genuine attempts to form a solid foundation for life in the modern world with its terrible truths easy and open to see. How much longer will normies, especially men, put up with society and believe in its illusions before they realize we're stuck on a big rock floating in space and doing nothing but gratifying appetites until we die and your sons and grandchildren do nothing but eat, shit. breath, and coom again and again. When normies no longer believe in colonizing space, or science fiction utopias, or human progress, etc

>>19329179
Junger never was a National Socialist. Other, better examples of intellectuals sympathetic to Fascism would be: Ezra Pound, Louis-Ferdinand Celine, William Butler Yeats, George Bernard Shaw, Knut Hamsun, Salvador Dali, Gottfried Benn, Gertrude Stein, Wyndham Lewis, Henry Williamson, etc. the list goes on
>>19329217
>>19329243
>>19329297
Junger and his brother resigned from their veterans organisation when it kicked out all the Jews

>>19329490
Have you read Schmitt's "Political Romanticism"?

>>19329475
Internal analyses of Hitler and National Socialism are all very well and interesting, but sometimes you have to just take a look at the exterior. Hitler has much of the markings which make a great and admirable leader in history, to simply reduce him to a small man with an inferiority complex says more about someone's own person than Hitler. It's the same, but to a lesser extent, the 'movement' of National Socialism.

Is its criticism of Jews, or any other renowned part of its ideology, something entirely fictional, entirely caused by the inner? No.

>>19329213
>he saw what they were from the outset.
Which was...?

Why did Jünger dislike the Nazees?

>>19329214
junger's reasons for rejecting NS were gay as fuck though

>>19329682
>junger's reasons for rejecting NS were gay as fuck though
What were they?

>>19329719
>I want to return to an organic, authentic society
>noooo not like that though that's populism/petit-bourgeois!!!

he also thought they were too pro-technology or something (like communism and liberalism weren't?)

>>19329736
>populism/petit-bourgeois
What's the other option? Aristocracy?

>>19329741
yeah. this isn't a criticism unique to junger, its basically the same reason figures like spengler rejected NS despite wanting many of the same things as them

New lit rule. Let jungerfag make the threads from now on.

>>19329937
>First 10 posts are greentext quotes that no one actually reads
lets go for something in between instead.

>>19329251
Literally read the Junger threads
>>/lit/thread/S19163687

>>19329940
Based. Filter out the retards like you who don't read

>>19329956
dude drifts off into ramblings too often.
Too often not pertinent enough imo.

>>19329213
>Schmitt - careerism
>become arch-jurist for nazi germany
>nazi germany is in a permanent state of exception
That is cucking on a spiritual level right there.

>>19329277
Ancient Greek pastoral poetry

>>19329179
>was it authentic or opportunistic?
false dichotomy

>>19329965
You do this in every thread. Sore loser

>>19329277
Spiritual national socialism
Anarchist völkish communes on the countryside
Agambenian pagano-christian anarchism
Nietzschean great politics (the dissolution of the political)
Gelassenheitian distributism a la Eckhart
>>19329970
Indo-European poetocracy

>>19329998
so true evil.
got it.

>>19329998
Nietzsche would hate rejection of technology and living like some peasant in a commune.

>>19329956
>Friedrich Georg Jünger ironically describes National Socialism as 'a child's song of intoxication without honour'.
Based

>>19330023
Heidegger didn't reject technology

>living like some peasant in a commune.
bitch ass would be forced to like it

>>19330026
Why would he say that though? The overwhelming majority of the NSDAP and former SA were ex-servicemen.

>>19329179
Not only did they subscribe to it. They hated that Hitler basically bastardized the ideology.

As Heidegger said - I won't apologize for being a nazi, I would want Hitler to apologize to me for not seeing the inner greatness of nazism.

>There is no doubt in fact that Heidegger's hostility to the grand masters of Kantianism, especially Cassirer, was rooted in a profound incompatibility with their alien habitus: 'On the one hand, you had this dark, athletic little man, an accomplished skier, with energetic but impassive features, a hard, difficult man, totally committed to setting and solving problems with the deepest moral seriousness; and, on the other hand, a white-haired man, Olympian not only in appearance but also in spirit, with his open mind and his wide-ranging discussions, his relaxed features and his indulgent amiability, his vitality and adaptability, and, finally, his aristocratic distinction'.
>We can quote the words of Cassirer's wife herself: 'We had been explicitly warned about Heidegger's odd appearance; we knew about his rejection of all social conventions and also his hostility towards neo-Kantians, especially Cohen. His penchant for anti-semitism was not unfamiliar to us, either... All the guests had arrived, the women in evening gowns, the men in dinner suits. At a point when the dinner had been interrupted for some time with seemingly endless speeches, the door opened, and an inconspiciuous little man came into the room, looking as awkward as a peasant who had stumbled into a royal court. He had black hair and dark piercing eyes, rather like some workman from southern Italy or Bavaria; an impression which was soon confirmed by his regional accent. He was wearing an old-fashioned black suit. For me, what seemed the most worrying thing, was his deadly seriousness and his total lack of a sense of humour'.

fuck cosmopolitanism

>>19330031
He wasn't American.

>>19329277
IRL?

Basically the iranian revolution is based on his notion of Heimat. Dugin eurasianism also takes from him.

>>19330039
And what does that have to do with them having no honor?

>>19329965
Literally every good Jünger thread is because of his posts.

>>19330031
>>19330042
How does fighting in a war excuse all future action?

>>19330051
>How does fighting in a war excuse all future action?
How do they have no honor?

>>19330042
What is "honourable" about shooting defenceless women and children? Or killing Jews who fought for Germany in WWI?

>>19329940
Like pretending Junger was a nazi?
>>19329490
I can see why you don't like him.

>>19329998
>Spiritual National Socialism
no
>Anarchist volkish communes
Heidegger was not an anarchic thinker at all
>Agamben pagan-christian anarchism
This is an idiotic appropriation of Agamben and I'm almost certain you are trolling at this point
>Nietzschean great politics
the same ones he critiques in his Nietzsche seminars in the 30s?
>Indo-European poetocracy
yes

>>19330171
>not an anarchic thinker
Why did you ignore Gelassenheit?

>>19330180
Heidegger wasn't a Christian, but if you read Eckhart in a purely mystic fashion abstracted from the concrete reality of his religious contexts, sure.

>>19329475
>Wagnerian fatalism
>implying this isn't based

>>19330187
You do know that "letting-be" and "releasement" are key concepts for late Heidegger? As is the problem of the closure of being, which is where Agamben builds his political theory

>>19330026
>let me just sit here in paris and pontificate while millions of men fight to defend their nation from world finance and bolshevism
jungerfags are contrarians

>>19330058
>What is "honourable" about shooting defenceless women and children?
Did the NSDAP personally shoot women and children on their march to power? You are describing shit which happened in wartime as a result to the changes in modern warfare, where the line between civilian and soldier blurred. This has nothing to do with the NSDAP itself.
>Or killing Jews who fought for Germany in WWI?
https://www.haaretz.com/jewish/.premium-when-hitler-honored-jewish-soldiers-1.5254336

Junger was not a Nazi.
>>19330057
Because they weren't fighting for an honorable cause; they were committing genocide and when they started to lose, they decided they would kill Germany with it - like a bunch of subhuman narcissists

>>19330203
>Defend their nation
They literally provoked a war by invading Poland and the Soviet Union. They didn't care about "world fiance and bolshevism" you fucking loser. They only cared about Germany, and they were willing to send the world to hell for it
>>19330207
Imagine being such a degenerate you have to just lie about what Hitler did. Just be honest, and stop making excuses. I'd respect you more if you owned up to what the Nazis did instead of lie about it. Stop trying to treat people here like we're stupid.

>>19329490
waoh we're just on le space rock???? epic sauce my dude thats so radical nothing matters

>>19330228
>Imagine being such a degenerate you have to just lie about what Hitler did. Just be honest, and stop making excuses. I'd respect you more if you owned up to what the Nazis did instead of lie about it. Stop trying to treat people here like we're stupid.
>doesn't offer a rebuttle

>>19330234
You're not making an argument. You're just white-washing the holocaust, general plan OST, and the unprovoked wars Hitler caused with Poland and the Soviet Union his own short sighted political ambitions. Its fucking idiots like you that ruined the possibility for fascism to be something great. Mussolini had the right idea until fucking retarded national basedcialists fucked everything up with their insane conspiracy theories and retarded hyperboean obessession.

>>19330239
General plan ost was from before the NSDAP even existed. The holocaust is attrocity propaganda when in reality it was the result of logistical failure and literal starvation of food items on the side of the Germans. Jews were suspected to be subversives the same way Japanese were in the states. Your 'muh innocent' poland doesn't apply here because even the accepted narrative doesn't place Poland as a victim. Hitler would have been fine with a highway to danzig but the poles wouldn't budge because daddy england agreed to protect them.
You are just spouting your own narrative as fact, but when I do the same you accuse me of being a 'degenerate'.

>>19330269
Nazi Germany deliberately killed the Jews; the Americans did not. You have to stop being so fucking stupid, like Stalinists, and defend everything your autistic austerian spaz did. Use some critical thinking skills here, and stop being such an idiot.

>>19330228
>>19330239
>utterly incapable of understanding geopolitics beyond the immediate, surface level
kys civic nationalist retard. Faggots that try to hide behind mussolini because they lack the brainpower or the balls to challenge the narrative underpinning modern society. Italian fascism is in the same boat you know, disavow national socialism all you want, you're just craven.
>Mussolini had the right idea until fucking retarded national basedcialists fucked everything up with theirinsane conspiracy theories and retarded hyperboean obessession.
why don't you fuck off back to /r/politicalcompassmemes? This is the kind of bogus shit that gets spat around hundreds of times over there.

>>19329179
>great thinkers such as heidegger, jünger and schmitt
lol

>>19330279
You are a subhuman, and you have no business being alive. Don't you ever try claim Junger as one of your own - you filth degenerate rascal. You have no brains - that's why you're a national socialist 2021. Get fuckin real larper, get a life. If you're over the age of 20, doing this, I suggest you commit su.

>>19330291
>"you're subhuman and you need to die, kill yourself"
>"NOOO THE HECKING BADDIE NAZIS THEY DESTROYED FASCISM BY KILLING PEOPLE"

>>19330291
I have no interest in claiming Junger as "my own", I have little patience for *ristocrats
You're not the rothschild schizo are you?

>>19330278
>Nazi Germany deliberately killed the Jews
More like the shitty food situation paired with desperate working conditions along with diseases in concentration camps coupled with the already bombed out infrastructure along with general anti-semetism at the time culminated with starvation and wartime atrocities on the deadliest front in the war?

To call it a 'systematic extermination against a group of people' is a ridiculous stretch.

>>19330291
>if i keep calling him a degenerate and acting like my opinions are obviously true and a given, i won't actually need to explain what i'm saying
i'm not even that Anon, but you're completely out of your element here and also seething like a motherfucker

>>19330283
most prominent post-war "leftist" intellectuals made their careers by copying those thinkers

>>19330312
Okay?

>>19329956
>>19330057
>>19330215
It's because they were nihilists, they exhibited all the worst aspects of the machine and bourgeoisie - the nation as property. At a higher level they offered no challenge to the bourgeois world, only a blind reaction to it which was nonetheless of the same order.
You already see the comments about soldiers and nihilism in the early writings, Copse, Storm, and Combat. And all the worst aspects of this nihilism, through technological mobilisation, came to the forefront with the national socialists. Death is an act of completion, and the Nazis fully embraced the European order of neutralisation, the death of the ancien regime.
It doesn't matter what face is given to it. It is the essential, what is inward and total. A brutal type of neutralisation is still neutralisation.

>Nationalism and socialism, the two great ideological movements for democracy in the 19th century, converge and unite in the 20th century. The more the technological collective develops, the more this tendency towards unification is encouraged. Ideologies become indistinguishable; there is no longer any point in separating them and limiting them to subtle differences from each other, since both have become equally useful fuel for apparatus and organisation. Ideologies do not establish differences in human nature; the contradiction here is the expression of a common and unified will that discusses only methods and means. The political constructs that replace constitutional democracy demonstrate this. Constitutional democracy is the political artwork of the bourgeoisie, which holds all the levers of such a state in its hands. But this form of democracy is incompatible with the technical collective, incompatible with the 19th century principle of the rule of law. We must realise this, otherwise we will wallow in illusions.

>>19330316
>It is the essential, what is inward and total, that matters.

tradcuck analysis: >>19330316
tradcuck solutions: ...?

>>19330316
>>19330215
Is this Jünger's reasoning? Because you're using the post war narrative to explain why the Nazis are bad instead of Jünger's own.

>>19330295
>NOOO THE HECKIN NAZIS DID A GOOD JOB STARTING AN UNWINNABLE WAR !
>THE NERO DECREE WAS A HECKIN GOOD THING, GERMANY SHOULD HAVE DIED WITH HITLER!
>YOU'RE A JEW IF YOU DIDN'T JOIN MY HECKIN CUTE SUICIDE CULT AND AGREE WITH EVERYTHING HITLER DID BECAUSE HE WAS ALWAYS RIGHT!

>>19330352
bait

>>19330316
And you can see the same thing in the revival of fascism. For the most part it is just an edgy renewal of American conservatism.
No one involved cares about the essence of the problems, so you get this ugly mix of the worst ideologies, now with empty aesthetics.

>>19330336
Nazi analysis: >something something schizo Himmler hyberboean pagan synthesis - Jews did it!
Nazi solution:>shave head, do public marches, create honeypots for feds
Wow.... so this is the power of.... national socialism...

>>19330352
>NERO DECREE
>an anecdote from, and only from albert speer
>who post war, made a living writing books about how he was the 'good nazi'

>>19330336
Nazi analysis: uuuuuh jewish holoscammer made up kikes degeneracy something anime 4chan meme wars!
Nazi solution: uh support Zion Don and Zion Bannon, trust the plan! ignore all these Jews in the alt-right 4d chess ethno-state soon two more weeks!

If asked, 99% of people would deny it. But almost every against national socialism reveals just how much humans absolutely despise a loser. Context behind certain actions doesn't actually matter, if they won it would have been "for the greater good", but if they lose, its just another negative to add to the shitpile. Human beings are really that simple - no matter what either side stood for, they love winners and hate losers. Only when enough time has passed for that conflict to be of little relevance does this not hold true.

>>19330369
>And you can see the same thing in the revival of fascism
Lol, nothing even remotely resembling fascism is to be seen today.

>>19330381
Imagine saying it was Speer who made up it when Dönitz was the one rescinded it you fucking retard. I guess the Allies paid him to lie about it too?

>>19330377
>>19330390
the fact that they need to create honeypots in the first place - speaks volumes of your irrelevance. Your association between national socialism and the "skinhead" shows just how well the propaganda has worked.

>>19330377
>>19330390

>>19330347
How is the nihilism of the WWI and Interwar soldiers post-WWII?
It's the same as Jünger's reasoning and the quote is from his brother. FG had one of the earliest critiques of them, around 33 or 34, which influenced On the Marble Cliffs. And Niekisch as well.
One could see early on that the national socialists were not sacrificing themselves for an idea, they were not interested in dominion, but a destructive will for what Germany lacked. Like a blind rage rather than vengeance even.
Ernst would refer to them as lemurs, and leather and machinery forged from animal sperm. This was in WWII, but you already see it developing in the 1920s and early 1930s.
You don't even need WWII to argue against them. And On the Marble Cliffs is not only about the Nazis, it is more general, they only played a part of the neutralisation of Europe within the new world order.

>>19330401
>Dönitz was the one rescinded it
Evidence, now.

>>19330401
They thought the Americans and Soviets were going to destroy Germany anyway, so what's the big deal?

>>19330417
>One could see early on that the national socialists were not sacrificing themselves for an idea, they were not interested in dominion, but a destructive will for what Germany lacked.
That's just like, your opinion man.

>>19330395
Which is why I said the current is even worse. One can almost respect the nazis and fascists now, which speaks to the conservative nihilism, how low they have sunk to have to revive such things.

>>19330420
He says he did in his memiors, you dumb nigger. You idiots really don't read anything about the war, do you?

>>19330432
The Fascists and Nazis were completely different. It makes no sense to compare them.

>>19330421
Morgenthau Plan was published in 1944, retard, how could you say that?

>>19330439
>Morgenthau Plan
As a Bavarian I wish this would have come to fruition.

>>19329213
>>19329214
Quality posts.

>>19330438
If there's no difference between liberalism and nazism why would fascism be any different?

>>19329214
>He even wrote allegorical books about Nazism and how shit it was.
none of his works deal specifically with National Socialism.
That is just one part of the greater whole what is the actual issue in his middle and later works. The NatSoc being kileld off didn't change a modicum of the aspect he was addressing in those works.

>>19330316
Thread just became based.

>>19330304
"Culminating with starvation and wartime atrocities" is where it becomes a "systematic extermination against a group of people". Nobody does genocide just because the believe murder is righteous by itself - they use it's ideology to justify solving practical problems through murder.

>>19330304
Himmler-Kersten Agreement explitically stated they would stop killing Jews in concentration camps. How was it not a systematic killing if Himmler literally wrote an agreement to say they would stop doing it?

>>19330469
None of those 3 are the same

>>19330540
>Himmler-Kersten Agreement
Anon, that is one of the most fake documents ever concocted.
How gullible do you have to be?

>>19330514
>starvation
Again it happened due to food shortages
>wartime attrocites
Yes, isolated incidents occured.

It's still not a genocide.

>>19330566
Where's your proof its fake. Post it, nigger.
>>19330585
It is a genocide when you round them all up, by race, and put them in camps where they starve.

>>19330551
Your just a retarded

>>19329192
>is that not a bit too dull?
Dull witted? Yeah. It was a horrible depression, but there were other methods being tried.
Lets watch it all unfold again when the US sinks. Just how many dullards, from all walks of life and education levels, are going to follow the CIA plant into a’ merrican nationalism

>>19330585
>It's still not a genocide.
By that logic A True Genocide literally never happened in the entire human history.

>>19330615
Dacians and Native American tribes.oh yes it has

>>19330551
Explain how they are different and refute this >>19330316

>>19330619
>Dacians and Native American tribes
"It happened due to food shortages and epidemic breakouts. Yes, isolated incidents occurred. It's still not a genocide."

>>19330622
If the Nazis are Liberals in the classical sense you have no understanding of either Liberalism or Nazism. Fascism on the other hand is an explicit rejection of individualism and they wrote entire books explaining why they do.

That is all the 'proof' that I need.

>>19330640
>Fascism on the other hand is an explicit rejection of individualism
So, Fascism is literally just Bolshevism but with muh nation instead of muh class?

>>19330646
Close, the ideals of the subjective ego.

>>19330640
Terrible post.

>>19330677
>they're all just libs duuuuuuude
I'm not going to entertain stupid notions like these

>>19330682
If it's so different why'd you vote Trump?

>>19330694
>If it's so different why'd you vote Trump?
I didn't? Who are you even arguing with?
See >>19330411

I'm actually arguing with Stalinists and National Socialists back and forth. They literally just act the fucking same. They will talk about how glorious their pathetic causes are, and they never actually defend their arguments. They just use all kinds of sophistry to ignore everything that contradicts their world-view. Doesn't matter how many time socialism as failed, doesn't matter how many bodies National Socialism has under its belt in Europe - degenerates still want to defend and re-animate it. And even now, the degenerates in this thread are just opportunists calling themselves "fascists" while voting for zionist Donald Trump. You see sub-human commies do the same with groups like the CPUSA and PSL Stalinist, Marxist-Leninist groups tailing Democrats like Sanders and Biden respectively. You people are just trash, and its a waste of time to even talk to any of you. None of you people have anything to offer but the same old failures of the past. No wonder people like Junger and Evola you left you faggots alone. You offer nothing for this world.

>>19330731
What is wrong with zionism? Why can't Jews have a homeland?

>>19330731
>Evola
Evola liked national socialist Germany and agreed with their racial ideas.

>>19330640
>>19330316
How is he wrong? Fascism, socialism, and liberalism are all types of technological, or ideological, politics. The only thing that differentiates them is the geopolitical situation, extent of mobilisation, and what remains of national memory.
In regards to intent and essence they really have few distinguishing characteristics as they are but subjective means in the creation of the new democratic/leveled man.
So what is your counter-argument to this?

>>19330731
take your meds mate
lolberg fuck

>>19330755
Or political romanticism, as another poster pointed out.

>>19330731
>Doesn't matter how many time socialism as failed
This but unironically.

>>19330755
>are all types of technological, or ideological, politics.
What are you trying to say here? Everything is technological, ideological, and political. This is man's essence. Are you trying to 'transcend' the facts of life you fool?

>ameritards derailing the thread and making it about Trump and Biden
Lol

>>19330782
Why are you talking about essence when it's something you don't believe in?

>>19329213
>he saw what they were from the outset.
based?

>>19330798
it's literally one schizo mentioning trump

The jew shit is extremely stupid because even the Japanese saw it was fucking stupid

>>19330799
>Why are you talking about essence when it's something you don't believe in?
Was Fascism a materialistic doctrine you fucking idiot?
Even to the Hitlerites the national community was a spiritual creation, yet they did not even exist long enough to actually create a philosophy. The Hitlerites were entirely a political movement, they don't have theory—they had political objectives meaning they were at war.
Liberalism can be connected through Rousseau to the NSDAP, but we can hardly say what the worldview of the NSDAP was other than making German people 'wealthy and healthy'—a completely healthy and normal goal mind you.

>>19329295
>but muh Christcuckery!
>think of muh jews!
>think of muh morality!

Jünger is ultimately a huge faggot but everyone turns a blind eye due to his service in WWI

>>19330014
you worship sickness, death, and retardation

>>19330291
stay mad, subhuman

>>19330782
God damn. Is it possible to be this dumb?

>>19329214
Was the Reichstag even a meaningful body?

>>19330828
That'd Jung retard.

>>19330872
>God damn. Is it possible to be this dumb?
t. hyclic

>>19330828
>>19330885
I died

>>19330816
>Was Fascism a materialistic doctrine
Yes. Hitler was not god and ideology isn't a religion.
Now KYS

>>19329736
National Socialism and Fascism are just other modes of modernism.

>>19330922
>hitler
>fascism
Stupid fucking retard. Pick up a fucking book once in your life.

>>19330035
How did Hitler bastardize it

>>19330885
oh lmao

>>19330929
Your rejection of modernism is fueled by resentiment.

>>19330369
>For the most part it is just an edgy renewal of American conservatism.
No its not

>>19330207
>You are describing shit which happened in wartime as a result to the changes in modern warfare, where the line between civilian and soldier blurred. This has nothing to do with the NSDAP itself.
LMAO........ they literally sent police squads to unambiguously execute defenceless jewish civilians, not to mention send them to gas chambers. I can't understand coping like this. if you are going to be a Nazi don't be some pussy faggot version.

>>19330978
>No its not
What is "its"? Fascism is nowhere to be found and white populism isn't Fascism.

>>19330988
>LMAO........ they literally sent police squads to unambiguously execute defenceless jewish civilians, not to mention send them to gas chambers. I can't understand coping like this. if you are going to be a Nazi don't be some pussy faggot version.
You mean partisans?

>>19331002
Read 'Ordinary Men: Reserve Police Battalion 101 and the Final Solution'. Most of the Jews executed were very far away from any 'partisan' action. It's amazing people fall for such a patently 'Jewish' propaganda meme.

>>19331009
Okay.

>>19330922
Hitler, or some unknown retard. Who the fuck cares? It's all trash and you're just a fat American.

>>19331062
>>19330936
(you)

>>19330988
>gas chambers
lol

>>19331062
>>19331066
Your 'conservative revolution' intellectuals or Traditionalists such as Evola or Guenon do not shine a candle under Gentile

>>19329251
No need, if I was wrong you would elaborate for me. :)

>>19330989
Case in point

>it's another thread where people lament Fascism despite never having read a single work from actual foundational Fascists

Yikes.

>>19331104
If you're trying to say white nationalism is fascism you're very misguided. American white nationalism predates fascism by more than a century. The founding fathers themselves were steeped in it, as our progressive friends like to remind us.

>>19331118
>>it's another thread where people lament Fascism despite never having read a single work from actual foundational Fascists
Do you think the overwhelming majority of anon's will be able to understand it? This is extremely specialized, doctorate level shit.
You'll have an easied time taking courses for other philosophies.

>>19331176
>doctorate level shit
I've meet a doctorate in philosophy and they were braindead, moronic, and had the same politics as a 7 year old girl.

>>19331118
>>it's another thread where people lament Junger despite never having read a single work from actual foundational Junger

>>19331084
>philosophy of action
>no pay attention to the ideas not the action
What were you saying about essence anon?

>>19331346
Gentile's whole argument is that thought=action

>>19331387
So he's an even bigger retard than you.

>>19331397
>(...)intellectualism divocers thought from action, science from life, the brain from the heart, and theory from practice. It is the posture of the talker and the skeptic, of the person who entrenches himself behind the maxim that it is one thing to say something and another thing to do it; it is the utopian who is the fabricator of systems that will never face concrete reality; it is the talk of the poet, the scientist, the philosopher, who confine themselves to fantasy and to speculation and are ill-disposed to look around themselves and see the earth on which they tread and on which are to be found those fundamental human interests that feed their very fantasy and intelligence.
Maybe you should try reading his work instead of being a fucking faggot.

>>19331084
He's literally just the twitter retard reading of Junger

>>19331447
Who?

>>19331442
70 IQ shit.

>>19331199
Philosophy always been sophistry; to get a phd in philosophy just means you're paid to be one for a potential government NGO

>>19331462
Hyclic

>>19331442
> is the utopian who is the fabricator of systems that will never face concrete reality; it is the talk of the poet, the scientist, the philosopher, who confine themselves to fantasy and to speculation and are ill-disposed to look around themselves and see the earth on which they tread and on which are to be found those fundamental human interests that feed their very fantasy and intelligence
Pic related

>>19331442
How is Gentile any different than Gorgias again?

>>19331527

>>19331510
What you are saying is unclear.

>>19331560
Gentile just thinks if you change the education system to adopt a specific belief system indefinitely you can bring about any arrangement of the Gemeinschaft? Words like "communism", "capitalism", "fascism" matter little - the act of thinking simply changes what the cirumstances are?

>>19331595
See

>>19331508
>memes
>thinking
Try getting off the internet sometime.

>>19331527
He is more like Heraclitus.
>>19331601
No. Read his reform of education. It's on libgen.
>>19331622
?

>>19331510
Nietzsche dumbed down for the Last Man.

>>19331633
If you can't give me a summary; I'm not wasting my time. I don't give a fuck about gentile. I'm just gonna continue accepting what I know, and tell about it.

>>19331641
What the fuck is your problem retard. I bet you haven't even read Nietzsche. First of all Nietzsche holds intellectualism in great esteem.

>>19331653
Don't read it, I don't care.

IM GAAAAAAAAY

>>19331660
You do care because you wouldn't tell me I'm wrong about Gentile. You wouldn't put the effort into posting here or making the thread. Now I see why Gentile was just shot... seeing how insufferible his descendants are - I guess we can just stick to that.

>>19331689
Okay loser.

>>19331133
I'M SAYING THE OPPOSITE NIGGER

Schmitt's case makes sense desu. If you believe that liberal democracy can't gloss over some kind of innate, eternal theological friend-enemy distinction between human beings, then just picking the side that seems likely to win is just optimal.

>>19331442
>it's the same faggot that shits up every Junger thread with his autism

>>19331750
Wtf are you talking about?

>>19331859
I'm talking about Carl Schmitt's critique of liberal democracy. Have you ever actually read his books?

>>19332015
And Schmitt says just choose a side?

>>19332222
No, Schmitt says that the essence of liberal democracy is to create an illusion that there doesn't exist incommensurable political beliefs, e.g liberal democracy creates a noble lie to hide the fact that in order for for a specific political project to be realized, other political projects have to lose, in other words, existential conflict is inherent in politics.

>>19331442

>>19329295
sauce?

>>19329475
excellent post; thank you for being on lit

>>19329179
In my opinino, Heidegger was opportunistic, Junger and Schmitt were authentic supporters.

>>19329475
They were massively outnumbered. It had nothing to do with romanticism lmao

>>19329940
why are you posting in lit if you can't skim something that short
go back

>>19332353
If you are not bastardizing jünger's thought (which I'm sure you are) then he is a brainlet.
Go to the ancient Athenians and tell them politics is as meaningless as a dung beetle rolling shit up.

They will laugh at you.

>>19330036
fuck proles

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