/lit/ - Literature

>>18953153
also, what are some you want to read?

i got Hegels' Phenomenology of Spirit a few days ago, i also really wanna read Either or by kierkegaard

The Antichrist. Odd since most of you’d probably consider me Christian. Had some kind of weird hallucinatory/mental experience when reading it. Sometimes wonder if N understood JC better than the apostles.

>>18953153
Nietzsche. Beyond Good and Evil. Unlike what most retards things, reading philosophy isn't about "Oh I believe in his philosophy". It's insight. It's not the same thing.

>>18953277
idk, N was very anti religion, christianity in specific, i guess he had to understand it to criticise it, havent read that one tho

>>18953153
tag yourselves anons I am Bataille

>>18953305
Very true, for me its perspective, insight and building my own personal philosophy through the education of this literature, i find it strange when people follow a philosopher like a prophet

>>18953318
im Deleuze lol

personal favorites that read great together
>eumeswil by junger
>a short history of decay by cioran
>myth of the eternal return by eliade
>of cosmogonic eros by klages

>>18953338
those sound like black metal albums im gonna check them out

>>18953153
S: Bataille, Deleuze & Guattari
A: Nietzsche, Kierkegaard
B:Schopenhauer
C: Land
D:Camus
E: Rawls
F: Evola

>>18953153
What should I read if thinking about the meaningless of life gives me a panic attack? I could spend all day in bed and not care, I don't see the point in going on...Being a degenerate does not mask the pain either. I got wasted the other night and begged for forgiveness...I'm not even religious. What do bros I am so lost

>>18953338
>eumeswil
based, not talked about enough, read the forest passage if you haven't already

>>18953474
Neitzche and Camus, Thus spoke zarathrustra and the myth of sisyphus in particular

zarathrustra in particular helped me a lot, helped me see things in a different light, that despite all the suffering, all the meaninglessness, its actually quite easy to enjoy life not so much in spite of this, but because its all meaningless, my goal is to become a true existencial hero, to fully see sisyphus happy. There's just no point or real reason to feel that despair, its just what you feel when you're not equipped to deal with that information, that was just barely hidden behind the veil of ignorance and religion

>>18953501
basic 15 year old white boy philosophy, thank you

>>18953518
if you call that basic 15 yr old white boy philosophy then idk what to tell you man, they're well known cause they're great, few will give such an uplifting perspective on life in the face of meaninglessness as these two, if you wanna be pretensious and elitist about philosophy then you're just gonna remain miserable

>>18953153
Living by philosophy is for nerds. Live by the contrite aphorisms that come boiling out of your sodden mind in the depths of miserable nights

>>18953555
haha, depends on what your objective is, some great many inspiring thoughts have come from those moments, it all depends on if you want to keep lashing yourself or actually want to find a way through the darkness

Favourite (in terms of writing): World as Will and Representation. Very easy to read and it destroys ontological arguments for skydaddy. Plus it solves consciousnesses hard problem and does not minimise the pain that 90% of the world will experience.

Currently reading: Hobbes - Leviathan

Teenage thread.

>>18953579
>World as Will and Representation
been wanting to read that one for a while, i got so many books to read tho, so it'll probably take a while

never heard much about hobbes, dont know anything about him

>>18953582
Teenage post

>>18953595
Start with the introduction. He talks directly to the reader and sums up what’s so important.

>>18953501
>enjoy life
That's your problem right there. Life isn't supposed to be enjoyed. Look around you. A satisfying life is a grand project that is worth dying for.

>>18953153
Discipline and Punish
or maybe Francis Bacon: the Logic of Sensation
I have a lot of favorites

>>18953518
>he will never know that being 15 yrs old and white is based

>>18953153
Fav book: Dilthey - Introduction to the human sciences.
Currently reading: Aristotle - On the generation of animals.

>>18953318
rn I'm Camus haha
ps kill me pls

>>18953579
>Very easy to read and it destroys ontological arguments for skydaddy
Definitely not remedied by his terrible ethics, unfortunate.

I've been moving from the Stirner-Nietzsche axis to the Spinoza-Freud axis

What the fuck is happening to this board? Are we witnessing a reddit migration?

>>18954771
Schopenhauer ended ethics once and for all

>How small, of all that human hearts endure,
>That part which kings or laws can cause or cure
simple as

>>18955178
By causing Nietzsche to become a philosopher and cause the 2nd world war? You could say the timeline was started that way.

Spheres 1-3
Absolute delight to read.

>>18953153
I have none and I'm not currently reading anything but this is an opportunity to post this funny infographic.

does anyone have that pic of kat saying she's too pea brained for philosophy?

>>18953153
My favorite is probably either Spinoza's Ethics or Heidegger's Being and Time.
Currently reading Hegel's Differenzschrift and Deleuze's Logic of Sense.

>>18955237
Nietzsche's retardation is not Schopenhauer's fault, he was just writing the truth on paper for all the world to see.

I'm surprised nobody said Meditations, by Marcus Aurelius yet.

>>18953153
Only if you actively apply these teachings to your life, not larp about it on a forum or in your head.

>>18953437
You should try actually reading Evola

>>18955375
Probably because people on this board actually read (or at least pretend to)

>>18953437
t.

>>18953501
This sounds like the biggest cope I’ve ever heard. If you believe life is meaningless and you’re suffering because of it, the only way out is to stop believing that life is meaningless - because it’s not.

>>18955495
nah, meaning is a prison, one which has no end, because if it did it wouldnt be meaning at all. Embrace the meaninglessness and become your own master

I'm reading The Denial of Death by Becker right now, though calling that philosophy is probably a stretch. He does rely a lot on Kierkegaard though. What's the opinion on Spinoza?

>>18955515
The google summary for that book calls it philosophy so, make of that what you will.

no opinion on spinoza, never read any of his stuff

>>18955375
Seneca is better

I like deleuze, i'm trans

>>18955822
>I like mentally ill people, I'm mentally ill
Wow, what a shock

>>18955375
Because it's dogshit.

It's the self help counterpart to "The art of war", and it's equally worthless and void of any practical insight.

Might as well be reading some random holy scripture and getting my view of the world from there because it would be on pair with that baseless drivel.

>>18955498
>Meaning is a prison
>Embrace the meaninglessness and become your own master
Has to be bait

>>18955498
Did you mean meme-ing?

>>18955883
And yet he was probably wiser and more successful than you.

i am halfway through Leviathan and it is my favorite philosophical read so far. It took some time to build up the foundation of his big idea but now that I have gotten to the parts where he starts talking about power dynamics among men it has become really interesting

>>18956153
>If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.
Pic related.
Plus he was an opium addict. You have to imagine him articulating the trite banality above as he was nodding off on opium that his slaves had grown, harvested, cured, brought to him and prepared.
Aurelius is a favorite among pseuds because his status of a classical author and Roman emperor gives a veneer of gravitas to the absolute banalities he writes about, which are easy for the pseud to understand.
I am willing to wager that 90% of people who read Aurelius today discovered him either through le epic genius Hannibal Lecter in Silence of the Lambs or some reading list on a blog about masculinity.

>>18956214
I don't see the problem? It's a true sentence and many people live in delusion that pain is caused by a thing in itself. If you read a whole book and learn that single thing I think you got more than enough. Pic related is a geniune example to how one dreadful thingl can complete miss a person because he does not view it as painful.

>>18953501
>The only way to be happy is to think Sisyphus is happy
What a fucking delusion. You are obviously happy at occasions without needing to check if Sisyphus is happy, right? You are happy when you eat ice cream or get a good date. Afterwards you are maybe sad, but you don't need a overall judgement to whether your life is 'happy' or 'unhappy' to be happy in the moment, yeah? Only when you consider the rope you need that judgement.

>>18956259
There is a very fine line between stoicism and complacency, and Aurelius is firmly on the latter side.
And no, not by any stretch of the imagination is it a true sentence unless you are in a catatonic state.
Pic related is the mortal sin of acedia, which remains the most potent of spiritual poisons, regardless of whether or not you take it in the christian sense.
The opium-addiction of Marcus Aurelius remains the perfect symbol of his philosophy.

Favorite: The Phenomenology of Spirit
Current: Spinoza's Ethics

Honorable mention to Beyond Good and Evil and The Birth of Tragedy for getting me into philosophy. They wore a bit thin over time though and I see now why Nietzsche and Schopenhauer were more popular with artists and lay people than philosophers.

>>18956214
Marcus Aurelius actually did get cucked by a gladiator. When he heard about it, he ordered the gladiator to sleep with her again, and then ordered his soldiers to execute him while he was doing it.
I don't think he ever got mad about his whore wife though, because it was a political marriage and he accepted that you can't fix a whore
source: I read it on /lit/ one time, trust me dude.

>>18956293
You can meditate and watch the suffering process, right now. Suffering comes after the fact, when your brain categorizes a thing as 'bad'. I assume Aurelius is not talking about physical pain, pain is pain.
I don't know about the rest of Aurelius, but that sentence sounded fine enough for me. You suffer because of how you react to things. This sentence is true - but it does not necessarily mean you need to stop thinking everything is bad. There are things which are generally known to be bad, and willy-nilly thinking nothing is bad is pure poison, but thinking that it's not YOU who are categorizing them as bad is delusion. Recognizing the truth does not mean you give up.

>>18953312
DONT FUCKIN POST IF YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT THE TOPIC YOU DUMBSHIT. YOURE CLEARLY FUCKIN RETARDED

>>18956354
You seem stressed, anon. Is everything okay?

>>18953277
His idea of Christ is somewhat similar to Tolsyoy's in his late years, which is surprising if you consider the line of thougt of both of them

I tried to read Kant, barely understood wtf he was talking about. Same with Schopeheneheur.

Ancient Greek philosophers are at least understandable. So Plato I guess.

>>18955457
Ok, so have you read it? If so, what do you think, and why?

>>18955809
Seneca is smarter and more classical, Marcus is more practical, I like Meditations better because it's easier to apply and isn't straying into asceticism. This isn't a criticism of Seneca, but a personal preference.

>>18955883
There is a lot to learn from a Holy Scripture, even if you aren't religious. And it being self-help doesn't discount the wisdom included in it. Not to mention that ALL philosophy is technically self-help. Just because it isn't edgy reddit nihilism or atheist cynicism doesn't mean it's at least worth thinking about sometimes. Or, if you have thought about it, I want to know what you disagree with.

>>18953474
Ecclesiastes

>>18956306
>reading Hegel before Spinoza
Wtf anon?

>>18956214
I actually found him because I heard about Nelson Mandela reading him a while back. Also, 'The situation is inconsequential, your reaction is what matters.' is in no way cuckoldry. He isn't telling you to just let things happen. He's just telling you not to let them faze you; or would you rather cry about every scrape you get while working...? Also, pic related isn't what he said. He never once advocated for making a rival or enemy happy, for letting oneself be exploited, because he was the Emperor of Rome, and that kind of weakness doesn't suit any sort of leader nor their nation at all.

>>18956293
I don't think 'Okay, something bad happened, it isn't the end of the world, let me rectify it.' Is acedia in any sense of the word beyond not being ascetic, which isn't practical if you're the Emperor of Rome anyways. If anything, being a slave to addiction is. And as for his drug addiction, most philosophers and psychologists had some kind of vice. Most human beings did, in fact. Even Sigmund Freud was a cocaine addict.

As for the whole catatonic thing, that's just unnecessary.

I want you to think, really think about what the quote means. If the semi-archaic language is confusing you, translate it to modern English. If you've ever had to continue moving through any sort of intense pain, it'll make more sense to you. Maybe you just haven't suffered enough to resonate with it? I don't know, maybe you have. But as someone who's had to stare down death a lot of times, it sure as hell makes it easier to view things through that lens. Because of it, combined with pragmatism and efficiency, I was able to become the metaphorical eye of almost any storm I found myself in after learning it.

Sickness Unto Death and Either/Or, Kierkegaard

>>18953153
Currently reading En Vino Veritas by Kierkegaard, highly enjoyable read so far. Its five drunk men talking about women

>>18956153
>probably

Even in your pathetic ad hominem retort you couldn't bother to feign confidence.

>>18957104
The fashion designer is absolutely deranged, I love that guy's speech. Good taste

>>18957098
Good taste here too. Kierkechads stay winning.

>>18956826
Yes, contrary to /lit/'s autism, you don't have to read everyone chronologically and indeed you won't in a philosophy PhD program.

I read a bunch of Spinoza excerpts in an undergrad course and then he was covered in Durant, Russell, and Kenney's survey books, so it's not like I'm unacquainted with Spinoza, but this is my first cover to cover read.

>>18953555
>Living by philosophy is for nerds.
According to your philosophy...

>>18953501
You are a teenager right?

>>18953312
That's such a fundamental misunderstanding of Nietzsche it's hard to even wrap my head around.

The whole point of the concept of the "death of God" that occurred in society is that it is a *bad* thing that needs to be understood and dealt with.

Nietzsche wasn't just like "oh shit God's dead woohoo!!! xD", he thought it was a profound issue

>>18953624
Teenage reply

>>18956826
I read Hegel before anything lmao
Phenomenology was my first philosophical read

>>18953501
This is why I really don't like Camus people; you all sound like you're one bad life event away from suicide.
Camus philosophy might as well be called "cope; the philosophy"

>because its all meaningless

To *you*
Fuck I hate absurdists with their projection.
"life is just meaningless and absurd maaan, *takes drag off cigarette*"
"I'm gonna be an existential hero maaan"


> its actually quite easy to enjoy life

You're weakness and error are exposed here. You imply that the goal is to "enjoy" life. Not overcome it, not challenge it, question it, harness it, create it. "I just want to enjoy life" yuck, you're no hero.

Picrel is your post.

>>18959156
the cope coming off of this post is strong

>>18953153
My diary desu. The author is so close to my mind and heart it's almost scary.
>pic unrel

>>18959585
learn what coping means midwit

>>18959156
What's the meaning of life?

>>18953153
Rand because she makes commies seethe and is literally irrefutable

>>18959642
pretending your life has meaning to avoid the absurd is one good exemple

>>18959783
Assuming it doesn't is just you projecting your own meaningless view. Life is meaningless *for you*, so you project that onto all of life and pretend that you embracing *your own* absurd perspective makes you superior over others or more "in touch" with things. It's pseudo edginess, babies first philosophy that is transparent to anyone who's been there, done that which is also why so many people think that >>18953501 is just an underage teen.
Camus bastardized Nietzschean philosophy and spawned a bunch of edgy pseuds larping as "existential heros"

>>18959674
Whose, yours or mine?
Looking for THE meaning is like looking for THE atom, or THE human. You're asking the wrong question.
Don't mistake the lack of THE meaning to mean there is NO meaning.