/lit/ - Literature

Dante's Inferno is public domain. If a publisher chooses not to offend minority groups, it's their right. Go suck Chridtopher Hitchens' dead, rotting cock you teary eyed milkmaid.

Based

>>18701527
If OP want's to make a thread about it it's also his right. What exactly is the point of this type of thinking?

>>18701544
Why are you mad?

>>18701527
>Dante's Inferno is public domain.
>implying that the only issue here is one of copyright

>Dante's Inferno is public domain. If a publisher chooses not to offend minority groups, it's their right. Go suck Chridtopher Hitchens' dead, rotting cock you teary eyed milkmaid.

>>18701552
Because I just noticed I put an apostrophe in "want" desu

>>18701527
Brown hands typed this

>>18701569
Suck my cock

>>18701569
Tranny hands*

>>18701577
Clean your room, tranny.

I'm not a Muslim, but I do consider Muhammed to be an enlightened individual who was genuinely a messenger sent by God. I don't get why Dante was so antagonistic towards him. If he had put Muhammed in the "virtuous pagan" group that would be one thing, but he put him in the 8th circle and had him tortured and stuff. It seems very sick to me. Now, should the translators change it? I don't think so, but they should note that it is wrong.

>>18701527
It is their right to do so, but that doesn't mean it's a good thing to do.
Considering the constant paranoia about censoring of old books, now /pol/ finally has real proof of it happening. Not bad.

>>18701596
>they should note that it is wrong
Why? Do you think the readers are morally so confused and stupid they can't judge the ethical content of the book by themselves?

>>18701516
Why is the Netherlands such a woke hellhole?

>>18701607
/pol/ is full of imbeciles that can't cope with the fact they have to live in squalor in their day before eternal night and resort to projecting their fears onto the world until it takes simulacrum dimensions

this doesn't personally affect me, I can buy Dante's Inferno from a million different translators, why should I be mad it's made accessible to muslims and friends who don't want to read about their personally most important figure being torn apart in Hell

>>18701622
I went out with friends, read Lolita in the park, fed geese and pet a dog and no Sharia jihadists came to buttrape me or behead any blonde women. Maybe you shouldn't try to educate people on a country they live in. We had and still appreciate Pim Fortuyn, his statue is still in the middle of the city unlike the US and UK where statues of historical figures are taken down.

>>18701527
Sick I can't wait to publish my edit of the Holy Quran where I replace Muhammed's pronouns with she/they
>>18701596
>I don't get why Dante was so antagonistic towards him
You don't have a single clue as to why a medieval Christian would put MuHAMmed in hell?

>>18701622
Have you noticed what all these insufferable "woke" places have in common? They're all Protestant countries. America is a turbo-Protestant country. So is the UK. So is the Netherlands. Protestants are the ones driving this bullshit, it's not taking hold at all in Catholic countries. Fuck, some Catholic countries, like France, are passing laws banning this shit. They sure as hell wouldn't censor the Divine Comedy, which even Pope Francis put out a letter praising on the anniversary of Dante's birth this year.

>>18701652
There aren't a million translations in Dutch.

Butchering a masterwork because one detail offends you is childish behaviour and misses the point.

>>18701665
Give it time, dutchbro. They will come for you, too.

>>18701669
Go ahead. Blasphemy isn't illegal here.
>>18701673
Stop being fussy, it's their editorial right. If you disagree so much you should start a crowdfunding campaign to publish your own Inferno in Dutch where Muhammed (pbuh) is tortured double as hard. Vote with your dollar, not with your seething on a Texan horseriding forum.

>>18701527
how about this? fuck you.

>>18701652
I don't think you should be mad. But those Muslims won't read Dante, they'll read a fake, and they will build a false view of history. Maybe they should grow some balls if they wish to explore the history and culture of nations that didn't think highly of them, otherwise why even read Dante if you don't want to be exposed to his cultural values? I have no problem reading old texts that criticise me or my nation, Dante would send me to hell too, yet I don't need a translator to hide that fact away from me.

>>18701681
I don't know broski, I feel pretty safe here. A crime journalist was assassinated recently, but the cleanup of minorities refusing or incapable of integration has started.

>>18701682
Peak bugman thinking. Unsure why you're here. You don't sound like a male at all.

>>18701684
>:(

>>18701688
>but the cleanup of minorities refusing or incapable of integration has started.
I would be stunned if a Western European country was doing this.

>She

Ofc

>>18701527
I'm going to make a new translation where Muhammad gets raped by pigs in hell.

>>18701688
>integrating to a woke culture
whoa so hard. muslims are not the only foreigners btw.

>>18701652
Sounds like your friends and the Muslim readers are a bunch of cry babies.

>>18701687
Again, I understand your perspective and I probably would look for the original text but from an editorial perspective it makes sense to release literary works that convey the story and theme while omitting naming names and specific dated lines of rhetoric. If Hamlet had a 10 page essay about killing Jews and how much Jews should be murdered and gutted that didn't have much else to do with the story, removing it wouldn't really change much.

Try to picture all your favourite books as having ten page essays about sodomizing boy infants and skinning them alive and editors just having cut that out, it wouldn't change much. Besides, unless if you're reading the original version in the original language you're already reading something else. No translation of Inferno is by Dante, but by the respective translator.
>>18701692
Thank you for your reply

>>18701709
>>18701711
>>18701716

>>18701622
CAP I TAL ISM

>>18701722
Abridging for length reasons and butchering for political reasons are different things. I'm not sure why you chose this false equivalence as a argument or who are you to say those sections need to be removed entirely. It's not an "essay" in the middle and yes, it changes the work. Either you translate it all or you don't.

>>18701738
I feel like if you stub your toe you blame it on capitalism

>>18701752
Only if it’s at work.

>>18701527
>If a publisher chooses not to offend minority groups
Then they need to fuck off out of my country bitch. This is no longer a free country. We're going authoritarian and there's no room for pansy faggots or libertarians. The state decides what's right and what's wrong, and "not offending muh minorities" is wrong. Prepare your ass faggot the next decades will rip you a new one.

>>18701722
You probably skipped the list of ships in the Iliad. Shameful.

>>18701596
Mohammed was a child raping desert bandit

>>18701516
This is the translator btw. Say something nice about "her"

>>18701596
He put Muhammed in the circle for those responsible for religious schism and discord

>>18701779
>We're going authoritarian
Assuming you are a Dutchie, you literally live in Western Europe. There will never be an authoritarian government in that part of the world again (except perhaps a Houellebecq-style Islamic takeover)

>>18701516
Dutch? More like Douche lol

>>18701820
>le end of history
You'll have a wake up call soon loser

>>18701794
Humbert Humbert is based but Muhammed is cringe. What gives?

>>18701820
>There will never be an authoritarian government in that part of the world again (except perhaps a Houellebecq-style Islamic takeover)
HAHAHA

>>18701835
well nobody built a religion around HH

>>18701722
>Try to picture all your favourite books as having ten page essays about sodomizing boy infants and skinning them alive and editors just having cut that out, it wouldn't change much.
It would change a lot, unless you think sodomising boys and skinning them alive is no big deal, or that Shakespeare would've been a raging antisemite. I very much would care to know about such elements of the texts that I'm reading and their contemporary cultures, I don't like lying to myself. Maybe you do, but then you're a retard.
>unless if you're reading the original version in the original language you're already reading something else
Here's the difference - a translation will have to look for slightly different words, syntax and rhymes than the original, making various compromises, but overall it will represent the ideological stance of the original text. What we're talking about here is, however, not a compromise, but active and drastic modification for ideological purposes. The division of people in the afterlife is literally how Dante expresses his worldview, and this "translation" intrudes into such an elementary level of the work.
You're defending the indefensible, with weak arguments. I thought that the times when translators skipped the homoerotic poems from the antiquity are bygone, but now we have the exact same threat from the woke crowd, and you're defending it. Considering how little you care about truth, how morally spineless you are, I don't even see why you entered this discussion in the first place. Why not just let others decide the truth for you, why complain about anything?

>>18701846
There is. The High Church or Cunnysseurs of which I'm the Archdiocese.

>>18701863
Remove it and put a foreword where you discuss the scene and its historicality and the decision not to include it in the main text. That's a good compromise imho

>>18701833
>>18701841
Cope all you like. I'm not saying history has ended for the world, but in Western Europe it has.

>>18701820
The French military literally threatened a coup a few weeks ago.

>>18701910
Ok retard

>>18701910
History never ends, faggot.

>>18701596
>I'm not a Muslim, but
Ok, Muhammed

>>18701920
kek

>>18701516
Based. They should also move Judas from the bottom of hell to the ninth sphere of heaven.

>>18701516
im dont think i prefer leaving out a verse like that but translators have definitely taken more liberties in the past, its a translation explicitly meant for accessibility to a younger audience so who cares.
the removed verse doesnt particulary add a lot, and kids dont usually have the know-how to place that sort of stuff in a historical context.
its similar to the way they use abridged versions for moby dick or don quichot or whatever, its mostly just meant to present the work to people that otherwise wouldnt have read it.
there are still better, more scholarly/literary translations out there for those interested in it so its not like the book is somehow being 'censored'

>>18702098
>its not like the book is somehow being 'censored'
It seems like the definition of censorship has been informally changed to make censorship of books easier. Censorship is supression of parts of media that are considered undesirable. It doesn't matter if they're different translations to read its still censorship when you redact parts of a book.

>>18702094
Honestly based. I'd like to name my son Judas.

>>18702209
Jewdas.

>>18702215
Hail Moloch, death to the Christ.

>>18702149
how is it suppression if its only "censored" if you actively have to buy a new copy of a new translation you dont like to get mad at when the work has been in the public domain for decades, can be published by anyone in any shitty translation they like, and can even be read for free online if you so desire (http://www.online-literature.com/dante/inferno/).). thats the absolute opposite of censorship you fucking clown.

>>18702094
heaven is sorely missing LGBTQ+ representation, change it #bigotryisnotcomedy #lessversemorediverse

>>18702237
it's censorship.

>>18702224
ok pedo

>>18701820
completely delusional. western europe is going the way of lebanon

>>18702251
its not.

>>18701527
cringe.

t.muslim

>>18702237
textbook censorship

>>18702237
This particular edition is censored. Censorship doesn't mean you can get other editions elsewhere.

>>18701919
It does when those in power commend so, faggot

>>18702237
This particular edition is censored. Censorship doesn't mean you can't get other editions elsewhere.

>>18702280
No, it doesn't. No one is in control.

>>18702291
Proof? Source on this claim? Peer-reviewd study detailing this claim?

>>18702313
https://www.britannica.com/science/chaos-theory
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaos_theory

>>18702331
A finely tuned argument. I have been defeated. I will now believe no one will ever have the will or resources to be in control thanks to www.wikipedia/chaos_theory

>>18702237
Look up what censorship is. If I were to make a video where I sweared, I could make two videos.
One where the swearing stays intact.
One where the swearing has a beep over it.
The one where I beep the swearing is objectively censored and anyone who says otherwise is playing dumb for laughs. This book has been translated to censor out Mohammed and it doesn't matter if their are a billion translations of this book it is still censorship.

>>18702367
There are 135 sources as well as a solid list of further reading.

>>18702427
Youve read them all?

>>18702452
That's for you to read, bro. You asked for sources. Read on.

>>18702460
How can you be sure they're relevant when you yourself have not read any?

>>18702505
This is what you asked for:
>Proof? Source on this claim? Peer-reviewd study detailing this claim?
Now you're just moving the goalposts. The article has already selected the relevant aspects of the cited works.

>>18702517
>This is what you asked for:
>>Proof? Source on this claim? Peer-reviewd study detailing this claim?
>Now you're just moving the goalposts. The article has already selected the relevant aspects of the cited works.

Source on any of this? Need one from a quality journal on this one brah

>>18702367
Having the will/resources to be in control is not sufficient to hold on to that control in perpetuity. Basically, you're saying winning once, or having a long winning streak, means defeat is impossible.

>she reworked one of the main passages
>she

Of course.

>>18701670
Ultracalvanist is a Moldbug idea from a dozen years ago. The world's moved on sweatie.

>>18701798
That ratio

>>18702721
Their name is "Lies"? A little on the nose.

>>18702761
kek

>>18701652
why don't Muslims put themselves in other peoples shoes? maybe view the world from someone else's perspective? oh wait, that's the job of the western man only.

>>18701670
Aren't the Catholics pretty infiltrated at this point? Look at the fag priests in Germany, aand Francis banning the Tridentine Mass.

>>18702969
Yes they are, only a minority of Catholics (maybe 10-20% of priests and laity) are based at this point, and very few of the high level hierarchy are.

>>18703018
In Germany maybe, but it's hard to imagine Latin America and Africa are ok with it. Since they are the majority, maybe we'll get an anti pope soon.

>>18702791
Im sure plenty of muslims get mad when westerners make shitty picture books about their religion, even if it is in a 'positive light' (from the perspective of the westerner making the book)

>>18703128
One misrepresentation and deformation of a culture does not give any legitimacy to an another deformation of a culture. They're both to be justly criticised.

>we'll take out Mohammad
>all the bits about his hate hard on for the pope are cool though
The dude literally wrote it to piss off an entirely different religion. This is like the time that David Icke had clearly had a psychotic break and started talking about lizards, and everyone assumed he was a sane hateful man talking about Jews. Because obviously he's not a crazy man talking about lizard aliens, that would just be weird of him.

>>18702721
Why are white women like this? It's getting so difficult not to despise them. What do they expect when Muslims are a majority, that they'll do the same?

>>18701527
The Koran is public domain as well

>>18701596
>but they should note that it is wrong.
why is it wrong?

>>18701527
N

>>18701527
I don't even know what you're trying to say but new translations are not public domain dumbass

>>18701527
I'm offended by islam.
I demand islam to be erdicated from European soil

>>18701596
A literal peasent nigger from the desert that obviously plagiarized much of his stories from judiasm and christianity is enlightened.
Look at the fuckibg state of you

>>18701577
Visit /fit/ too you fucking cuck

>>18703128
They call you a unwashed stinking dogs behind your backs

So how about you guys stop sucking their mutilated dick

>>18701577
*Suck my mutilated cock
There fixed it for you Mahmoud

>>18702669
>Having the will/resources to be in control is sufficient enough to ensure that invariably someone with the same necessary talents will be in a position to hold on to that control, thus in perpetuity. Basically, you're saying winning once, or having a long winning streak, means defeat is not only inveitable, but also beliefs are not persistent

Source?

>>18701919
when it ceases to be written, it does

>>18704187
"And do not insult those they invoke other than God, lest they insult God in enmity without knowledge." - Quran 6:108

>>18702791
30% of Arabs were historically Jewish or Christian

It's really hard for me to believe that anyone could possibly defend this decision in good faith, but I seem to be constantly surprised at the new levels of retardation to which leftists manage to sink.
The problem with this site is there are so many right-wingers pretending to be deranged leftists that actual leftists start thinking that level of derangement is normal.

>>18701516
pointless thing to do. muslims are not supposed to read books from other religions anyway, in case it blows their tiny little pedo rapist minds.

>>18705534
It's obviously pointless, she isn't even a Muslim herself.
I'm half convinced that the sole purpose of these kinds of projects is to agitate Westerners.

>>18705203
An end is inevitable. That's how everything in the universe works.

> Source?

The null hypothesis here should be that a perma-regime (like perma-anything) is impossible. How would you even go about proving a regime can just prolong itself indefinitely?

>>18701516
I tried to find an English translation of Savonarola's works, they excluded the entire chapter he wrote denoucing Islam with a note stating it was a reflection of his time and not PC so they weren't going to publish it. He was too good for this world, then and now.

>>18701779
you are sitting at a computer anon, take a chill pill

>>18701516
Is there any censorship in the "generally recommended" tier?

>>18701516
this has just pushed The Divine Comedy up on my reading list

>>18701820
NOTHING lasts forever

>>18707413
Okay fine. As long as the human species exists, Western Europe will not be under a right-wing authoritarian regime.

>>18707606

>>18707606
HAHAHA

>>18704657
Fair enough.

>>18708474
Odd way of coping. There will be no right-wing regime in Europe ever again. They can't even elect milquetoast conservatives, and you think right-wing authoritarianism is on the table?

>>18708957
Belarus exists and is run by an actual dictator.

>>18708957
Wasn't Poland outlawing gays a few days ago?

>>18701596
Brainlet alert

>>18709135
>>18709144
Western Europe, not the fringes

>>18709164
France is on its way to a right wing regime.

>>18709188
A bunch of boomers writing a pair of letters is not a prelude to anything serious. Mark my words, they won't even elect Le Pen, much less see the rise of an authoritarian regime.

>>18709188
If what you say is true then why did the right wing parties lose ground during the recent elections?

>>18709269
>>18709291
France's last elections were between a center-right candidate and a far-right candidate. It will continue to be so in 2022. From there more extremism will follow.

>>18701670
Dude, chatolics literally bow to islam now.

>>18709320
The pope maybe, not me.

>>18701820
>never be an authoritarian government in that part of the world again.
You'll go to jail if you step into a bar without getting jabbed. Fucking bugmen.

>>18704187
Whiteout a family to take care of they malfunction hardcore

>>18704657
This is a valid assault of your feelings. Semites should be arrested for hate thought

>>18701516
This should be illegal. Worse than cancelling an entire author

>>18709489
I agree with this anon, this is Jewish levels of sedition against the entire Western world

>>18701516
>she reworked
>she

>>18701652
>muslims and friends who don't want to read about their personally most important figure being torn apart in Hell
Maybe don't read a book that has this content then? They might as well just read fan fiction at this point.

>>18701722
>Try to picture all your favourite books as having ten page essays about sodomizing boy infants and skinning them alive and editors just having cut that out, it wouldn't change much.
Are you implying that this is in any way similar to this situation? Completely bizarre. Dante didn't include Muhammed by some random whim. Are there many parts of the Divine comedy that you think can be cut in this manner?

>>18701527
Tranny nigger.

>>18701596
Who do you think is worse, a pagan or a heretic? The pagan simply does not believe in God while the Heretic corrupts God's message andanyone he converts. I wonder which one is the worst.

>>18701527

>>18701596
>but they should note that it is wrong.
EDITOR'S NOTICE: THIS PASSAGE FROM A MEDIEVAL BOOK IS AN EXAMPLE OF WRONGTHINK, PLEASE ONLY ENGAGE WITH THE PASSAGE TO PROVIDE CORRECTTHINK.

Yeah man, cool idea.