/lit/ - Literature

>>18526629
Everyone i know who’s read it said it was just laughably badly written but in a boring way but is interesting if you want to learn about the history

>>18526629
dunno but I got it so I'mma read it soon

>>18526629
Yes you should, as it provides insight into not only Hitler's motivations, but the country/society which he found himself in which help form his opinions and motivations.
For being one of the most important time periods in recent history, Weimar Germany is criminally under represented in Western study.

>>18526631
Undoubtedly because of poor translations.

OP read the Stalag edition if you're going to, it's the only official English translation that was authorised. I'm a yahtzee so I like it, but I read it before I was one and I enjoyed it regardless.

>>18526631
I dont think they have actually read it, that's just the thing people repeat about it. The writing is not particularly good but it is in no way 'laughably bad', it never distracts or impedes comprehension. There are even several passages that have become memes because they're memorably written, eg. The 'Gradually I came to hate them' paragraph.

trust me its barely readable even in germany. even if you were to be an antisemite dipshit it's laughably bad

>>18526712
I think you're spot on. Most people wouldn't dare hold the book for fear of ostracization, much less read it

>>18526629
>Is this book worth reading even from a neutral standpoint?
You can understand Time's 1938 Man of the Year and why he was so driven. This is pretty much the only reason to read it.
Why would you ask such a stupid question? Were you trying to do a "subtle jab" at it? It's not a very well written. It was just a biography and explaining why he holds the positions he did.

>should I read a book written by the last European conqueror
Whether you’re /pol/ or /leftypol/ or something in between you can’t deny Hitler’s importance (not to say greatness).

>>18526670
>For being one of the most important time periods in recent history, Weimar Germany is criminally under represented in Western study.
Well, otherwise, how are you going to justify le evil mustache man caricature?

>>18526712
This. Anyone who tells you it’s badly written is either incapable of evaluating it from an objective standpoint or just hasn’t read it and is repeating something they heard. His writing was perfectly adequate for an amateur writer

>>18526780
Even though he lost, I think he fits the definition of a “Great Man”
Regardless of the morality of his actions he left a mark on history in a way that can only be compare to Jesus, Caesar, and Mohammed

>>18526629
Sure, it's a historically important book.
>>18526686
Stalag is the worst translation, very inaccurate. I don't know why people keep memeing this. Go for Mannheim or Dalton.
>>18526631
It's not badly written, not great either, just neutral. Pretty much what >>18526712 said.

>>18526815
And Napoleon

>>18526629
Do you want to know what led to Donald Trump? If yes then this book is it.

>>18526631
The prose of the book is fine, even quite good in some places. The people who say it’s “badly written” either didn’t read it or are just virtue signaling.

>Do you want to know what led to Donald Trump? If yes then this book is it.

>>18526833
Excellent bait

>>18526815
>>18526821
These men all had the same lightning, only differing in sun.
>>18526816
>Stalag is the worst translation
It's the only translation approved by Nazi Germany.
>>18526833
This is, unironically, the most delusional shit I've seen all day. I'm going to claim Poe's law on this one.
>>18526841
Technically, learning any bit of history can be said to lead to any specific event. I just wanted to give the guy some pilpul ammo so I could watch you defend your point of view.

>>18526629
Yes, it should definitely be read. It certainly isn't "laughably badly written", as some would claim. It could have done with a little editing, perhaps, but you could say that about a lot of well-regarded books.

>>18526629
>even from a neutral standpoint?
no, only useful historically if youre into that

>>18526738
but you haven’t read it, have you.

>>18526833
I wish

>>18526629
it's shit but iconic, read it anyway

As everyone has said, it's not badly written. There are some passages that seem a bit deranged, but this is actually good writing because it accurately conveys the author's mindset.

>>18526860
>It's the only translation approved by Nazi Germany.
So? It's still the worst translarion out there. The nazis weren't cer6 proficient at English apparently. It's a bad translation, Manheim and Dalton are much more accurate.

>>18526629
>book worth reading
he is one of the most famous and important historical figures of planet earth.

of course it must be read by everyone.

if Alexander the Great wrote a book, it would be read by everyone even if it was not exceptional.

Imagine reading a book written from Napoleon. He wrote some stuff;

1795 - Clisson et Eugenie. It is a novella about Clisson, a soldier who sacrifices his life in battle when he finds out his close confidant had an affair with his wife Eugenie. It is very autobiographical.

>>18527161
You either get a shitty translation or you get a potentially corrupt translation. This is the general argument. I'm not arguing for or against it, only explaining to you the thought process.

>>18527203
Dalton has a dual language edition, you can compare it to the original text. The thought process is flawed , Stalag just isn't an accurate translation.

>>18526670
>For being one of the most important time periods in recent history, Weimar Germany is criminally under represented in Western study.

Can't have people concluding it was a hive of degeneracy that deserved to be overthrown, the reds would have if the Nazis didn't.

>>18526841
i fail to see the issue

>>18527281
Actually no.
The Reds tried repeatedly in German, and all those attempts failed, and resulted in the reserve happening.

>>18526629
First half of the book is very interesting, especially if you're interested in history. Hitler was a man of his time in every way, he was the "common Frontschwein" in the war and as such has a perspective that you can read, particularly in his time in Vienna, that was surely not alien to his experience alone.

The second half of the book is mostly where he lays out his vision, and this is where people commonly say its "badly written". I have never read the original German, but typically the English translations are rather poor (I believe the Manstein translation was purposefully poor). That being said, the second half is more ideological, it lays out his vision etc. If you're interested in politics its worth otherwise skip it.

tldr: the first half is worth reading and the second half is optional.

>>18527281
>the reds would have if the Nazis didn't.
The "reds" were trying to coordinate a joint revolution with Soviet aid. It would have spelled total disaster for Germany internally. Not even the Spanish wanted it.

>>18527249
Nobody in their sane mind ever makes 1:1 translations. Not a single text you have ever read whether its the Classics or contemporary literature is translated 1:1 because language does not work that way. Manheim purposefully attempted to do this because he had personal bias when "translating" the work.

>>18527305
>mfw a Spaniard tells me his grandfather fought with the reds as if that was something to be proud of.

>>18527292
based commies will always bring about their own doom

>>18526629
its funny because its a self-hating religion

>>18527396
OP directly said no bunkertranny or /pol/ faggotry.
So unless you have a serious answer GTFO

>>18527322
It's usually the descendants who think of it as "LE HECKIN BABBYY SOS" or something equally as moronic. Most of the guys who lived it moved on with their lives because it was a brutal time period for everyone.

>>18527292
Should be worth noting the Reds had already attempted several violent coups like the "Ruhr Red Army" disaster.

>>18526629
It was really bad
T. past /pol/ user now turned center-left

>>18527479
>T. past /pol/ user now turned center-left
I'm going to go out on a limb and say that you were never a /pol/ user, and that you never actually read the book either

>>18527479
>t. im a moron who bases their world view on WING
could have just said that and it would have been enough.

>>18526629
It's the best book of all time according to /lit/'s 2020 top 100 books, you tell me

>>18527520
>they HATE the poljak meme
this is objectively the most unfunny and worst meme since milhouse. Forced memes are just really lame

>>18526631
Depend on the translation. Translations made by people with the goal of (((contestualize))) his tought are doomed to be biased, and in some occasions consciously made bad on purpose
In my country a "niche" editor (let's calm it this) took the original german version and made a brand new faithfull translation at the hands of hardcore Natsoc scholars. Compared with a "mainstream" translation the difference was like day and night

>>18527520
>>18527529
whoops made the fatal error as identifying as anything. To be clear I used to really hate jews and took "redpills". I listened to about 3/4 of it while driving on normal speed, it was boring as fuck and had a lot of painfully bad takes.

>>18527531
Thats because after a few of them got doxed and exposed as actually looking like the "poljak" thing they stopped doing it.

>>18527539
>I used to really hate jews and took "redpills"
So you didn't understand the Jewish Question and instead just mindlessly consumed media and now you shifted gears and continue to mindlessly consume media only now you can post on Youtube comment sections that, "Yeah... I can't believe I was alt-right man... thank you contrapoints........" lmfao helpless man just helpless.

>>18527550
>if you were really rightwing you would have mentioned xyz!
next time I'll post a link to my memoir so you don't have to write fanfics about my life, retard

>>18527520
>4chan was leftist

Do they seriously not understand this was because the left was (on the surface at least) in favour of equality and individual rights and against censorship?

>>18527560
>still WINGism posting
keep digging the hole deeper

>>18526629
No. And that's why you have to read it.

>>18527566
Describe your political beliefs to me please

>>18527572
Ideology is a complete waste of time.

>>18527479
>past /pol/ user
Nobody ever escape pol. You will move across the spectrum just to end into a Nazbol, and thus join us again

>>18527572
No

>>18527550
>So you didn't understand the Jewish Question
>t. someone who didn't read "on the jewish question".

>>18527582
>You will move across the spectrum
What about escaping the spectrum? Political economy is garbage.
Nazbol existed, it was basically Stalin.

>>18527608
I did but you have to bear in mind that Marx was a Jew himself and trying to sell a variant of messianic scripture to the goyim and he was largely successful with this program.

>>18527578
If it means anything I don't subscribe to any ideology I just use them as a quick reference

>>18527632
The political spectrum is a prison designed to entrap you and herd you, creating ridiculous and fraudulent pseudo political guidelines that people attach to themselves as new forms of religion.

>>18527317
I make my own one to one translations of stuff by examining the text with a translation device because of how much I despise the liberties translators take. Especially i do this with poems

>>18526760
It wasn't even supposed to be well-written. It was dictated by Hitler. You try dictating a book lol. It's fine.

>>18527520
I like how 2 out of 4 of his main points are 'we have to make more poljacks'

>>18527625
>Marx was a Jew himself
No he wasn't. His mother wasn't. And he didn't go to the synagogue. I might as well be a soldier, because my grandfather was one. And even if he was, jew (he wasn't) he wrote in the jewish question that jews have been obsessed so much with money and have developped huckstering and money so much, that the only possible course for them, is to reverse it. Dialectical inversion.
> trying to sell a variant of messianic scripture to the goyim
Marx was by far not the only socialist-communist. Try Owen, Proudhon, Bakhunin (which was antisemitic), Blanqui.
Only Marx did the most precise critique, and understood something fundamental: it's useless to reform Capital, the solution is to abolish it.

>>18527625
By the way almost forgot. It's forbidden for a jew, to drink alcohol with non jews. Go check. Even today, true jews don't drink in bars or elsewhere with goyims. Marx was famous for drinking in bars with non jews, notably Engels, his drking buddy, and the young Hegelians, which reunited in a wine bar.

>>18526631
>>18526712
>>18526794

I think a lot of it is conflation with "poorly organized." The prose and the translation is fine and comprehensible. Hitler just jumps around topics a lot. So you have to read the whole thing to get an idea of his stances/solutions on specific issues.

For example, I still don't know what he was on about with whining about people with objective or subjective worldviews. I understand that schism but couldn't figure out its relevance to the several contexts he brings it up in.

>>18526629
I think it's a truly great work of literature. There's a reason Hitler rose from complete obscurity to become the leader of one of the most technologically advanced, philosophically sophisticated, aristocratic nations in history. People who don't get it are just incapable of appreciating the loose structure and frequent digressions, probably because they don't read enough.

>>18527839
>>18527865
and yet still sold the same messianic pilpul scripture.

>>18526631
I only read the first couple chapters on a pdf a few years ago. I don’t remember the writing being remarkable but it serves it’s purpose fine, definitely not noticeably bad. This is just like some bullshit people on reddit will say because it gets them updoots from people that don’t actually care whether it’s good or bad but just hate Hitler.

>>18528022
The only one selling the messianic eschatological talmudic-zionist project, is you.
People want to be freed from commodity since it's beginning. It has nothing to do with a jewish eschatological project. This, or the Australian aboriginals or plain indians, very critique of the western obsession for commodity, are part of the jewish conspiracy

>>18528000
See I can appreciate this as legitimate criticism, but even viewing it outside the context that writing isn’t even this guy’s forte I still wouldn’t call it bad much less laughably bad. Maybe it should be expected with the constant stream of propaganda against him in the west since the 1930s but that still doesn’t make these “criticisms” valid.

>>18527865
I don't want to be that guy, but Jews tend to work around their laws one way or the other (and have done so more or less since day one). "It's against their beliefs" isn't proof enough to say someone isn't a Jew.

>>18526629
It's really not worth it. It does give insight into his mind, but other than that it's boring and poorly written, none of Hitler's orator skills carried over into writing

>>18528098
You know who are specialists at working aroung they laws? Christians.
We are supposed to live in a communal world, being all brothers, yet we are in commodity hell.
Holy crusades, spanish inquisition. Is that Jesus Christ message?
Re-read On the jewish question. Marx wants to abolish judaism. Judaism without commodity is nothing. There is no judaism without commodity.

>>18528083
>free from commodity
lmao

>>18527479
>turned center-left
Like the other anons said, you never understood the JQ. I'd also affirm that you're just LARPing.

>>18528083
You mean free from the responsibility of commodity so instead having commodities controlled by a clique of sycophants enforced by a herd of fanatics. yeah gee jews never did that before no way not once not ever in history oh nooo way... Hadrian acted in response to the Kitos War? lol no way... just a "jewish conspiracy" man... lmao....

>>18528222
It’s less Christianity being worked around it’s own laws but Christianity being adapted for Germanics, which Christianity in the first place was never pacifistic.

>>18528083
>western obsession for commodity
?????????????????????????
>aboriginals
>plain indians
nobody is preventing you from living among those people.

>>18526629
obviously

>>18528222
Both the inquisition and crusades had valid theological reasons to exist; your reverend lovejoy understanding of Catholicism isn’t going to cut it if you want to know what you’re trying to talk about.
And whether Christians follow their rules or not is besides the point, dumbass.

>>18528242
If you want to be a true specialist about jews, check about the Essenes. Or those jews don't interest you? You only like the evil ones?
In your mind, jews are archetipal evil. All jews are evil, no goyim are evil, except perhaps goyim perverted by jews.
The fact is, evil lies in your very being. It is not jewish in nature. Some jews are very mundane, and less evil than many christians.
Certain Social relation are bad. Money, commodity. Jewish participate to those bad social relationship. But they haven't the exclusivity on those social relationship, especially today.
>instead having commodities
Do you even know what a commodity is? A commodity is not an item which have use value. A commodity is an item, which have use value, which is exchanged against an other commodity, which is often money (universal commodity), in order to make a profit.
Some human commodities, like the Essenes, the current Huterrites, the early germanics, or the last primitive tribes, live without commodity.

Must be very conveninet to crystalize all the evil of the world on the jews. In your world vision, no social relationship are bad (money commodity). No individuals, except jews, are bad (except those manipulated by the jews). You, especially, are not bad. You are just a victim of the jews. It's very easy to escape any responsability. Both individual and collective. Dispose of the jews, and everything will be fine. Then you will have goyim jews (goyim merchants).
Guess what, you'll still will not be satisfied then. You'll find another scapegoat. You are incapable of finding what's wrong in yourself, or within your community. Only in others, jews, and free-masons, in particular.

>>18528222
>Holy crusades
A logical, united counter-offensive against rampant invasions by Arabs who, prior to the Crusades, had already seized the entire North African coast and had attempted rampages into both the Iberian Peninsula and Southern Italy. This is the only reason the Crusades occurred, it was the main point of axis and why it garnered so much popularity in the beginning.

>Spanish Inquisition
This is a negative event in history, but it doesn't relate at all to the Crusades. The Inquisition was far less brutal than the Communist Surveillance State for example, which engaged in routine purges for its entire existence.

>>18528222
>There is no judaism without commodity.
>ignores the kitos war
>ignores ethno-culture
Marxist applications to history are illogical. In some cases, they can be useful, but as an overall "narrative" it's glaringly weak.

>>18528369
>random sect of jews in antiquity that never made a significant percentage of the overall population
>has anything to do whatsoever with the numerous case by case basis of jewish relation to manipulation, crime, violence, etc.
>has anything to do whatsoever with the growth of the zionist movement and its subsequent attempts at infiltration and manipulation of social movements and nations
u dumb

>>18528331
>your reverend lovejoy understanding of Catholicism
I understand the new testament just find enough to know that Jesus certainly wouldn't have aproved the inquisition and crusades.

>>18528369
>A commodity is an item, which have use value, which is exchanged against an other commodity, which is often money (universal commodity), in order to make a profit.
No, that is totally over simplified and a hallmark of why Marxist theory is laughably poor to educated people and why the only people Marxist theory has ever been successfully sold to were illiterate serfs who were then immediately used to carry out purges.

>>18527582
>a Nazbol
Nah. Most of the time it's National Socialism. Some end up Fascists or Monarchists, but Nazbols are a minority of a minority.
That other anon is either A) A lying shill or B) Mindless chattel

Anybody going " meh actually it's good" stfu. The book people think is mein Kampf is theozoology, read that if you want to be a edge lord

>>18526629
>>18526631
It's a poorly written book by an amphetamine addict, but some of his points are reasonable. Decide for yourself which ones are instead of listening to the internet about it.

>>18528389
The Crusades has little to do with religion. You just keep repeating this lie over and over again.

>>18528389
You clearly don’t understand it. No worries, it’s a complex book that will go over most people’s heads. Go to a church and talk to a priest if you truly want to understand the subject.

>>18528371
>This is a negative event in history
No

>>18528379
Sure jewish practical, daily activity, is not huckstering and money. It's praying, r-right?
The problem is, you inverted in your mind the religious and practical jew. For you, the practical jew, huckstery and money, is secondary. and only serve the religious jew. When in reality, it's exactly the opposite. The religious jew serves the practical jew. The jewish religion is an emanation of the practical, daily activity of hucstering and money. Suppress huckstering and money, and the religious jew, the jewish religion, disappear.
>>18528371
Sure, Jesus would have approved holy crusades and spanish inquisition.
By the way, neither Marx would have approved bolshevism, nor Engels. Neither did Rosa Luxemburg, and Karl Kautsky (compiler of Das Kapital voume 4), actively fought bolshevism. So yeah, the one who criticized bolshevism, since the beginning, are Marxists.

>>18528402
That's not at all what this thread is about you tard.

>>18528413
HOLY crusades?
I never said it has, but why do YOU say that Marx is responsible for Bolshevism, that's exactly the same.

>>18526631
anybody who says it's 'badly written' as never read it

To be clear, saying that Marx is responsible for Bolshevism, is as saying that Jesus is responsible for the Holy crusade and the Spanish inquisition.

>>18528461
Marx literally calls for revolution in his texts. The Crusades were counter-offensives against Arab invasions in North Africa, the Iberian Peninsula, Southern Italy, and the Balkans.

>>18528476
>comparing Marx to Christ
Now you reveal your true colors.

>>18526760
I read it... I'd say it was interesting from a historical standpoint.

I'd just like to point out to you fine anons is that that retarded "former pol user" from before has successfully managed to derail the thread.
Jesus Christ I come back from a power outage and this is what I walk into? C'mon man

>>18528497
To deny the religious element of the crusades is outright stupid. You may be right that it was started as a way to curb the growing muslim influence, but there's no doubt about the religious fervor that gripped so many.

>>18528520
The "religious fervor" was the usual saber rattling to get recruits. There was no religious objective, the entire purpose was to check the rampant invasions of the Arabs. That is the only reason why the Crusades happened. Had the Arabs not launched attacks as far into Europe as the Iberian Peninsula, etc, it's likely the Crusades would have simply never happened.

>>18528497
And the massacre of Jerusalem, was it asked by Jesus Christ?
I'll repeat my point, in order to avoid confusion.
You say Marx is reponsible for bolshevism death toll.
It is as dishonest to say that Jesus is responsible for the HOLY crusades.
Obviously he is not. But i try to make you understand the falseness of your argument.
>>18528500
Friedrich Engels compared the early christians, and their persecution, to the persecution of the proletarians of the early socialists. He draws parallels between those two populations in "A Contribution to the History ofPrimitiveChristianity"
http://slp.org/pdf/marx/prim_christ_engels.pdf

There are no true colors to reveal, or to hide. The Essenes were far closer to Christ message than the Catholic church ever was, even if it was a jewish sect.
Marx, if read and understand correctly (abolition of commodity, money wage labor), is closer to Christian message than the Vatican will ever be.
You cannot accept that the Vatican was never about living truth to Christ message, but on the contrary, smothering it.

Edit:
>to the persecution of the proletarians of the early socialists.
Reminder that the Paris commune (1871) proletarians were massacred at a number between 6000-8000 and 30000-40000

>>18528569
>Friedrich Engels compared the early christians, and their persecution, to the persecution of the proletarians of the early socialists.
That tells you how braindead Engels was and how completely devoid of historical his philosophies were based on.

>>18526629
Dead white male.

>>18528400
My trajectory was somewhat like that except it was the impossibility of cremating so many holocaust victims that sent me on the path.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/3a8y4n/italys-coronavirus-death-toll-is-so-high-that-one-citys-crematorium-cant-keep-up

>>18527638
Basically this.
The "political spectrum" is little more then nu-religion.
Your beliefs are your beliefs. You don't need to label it and clump it with others.

>>18528845
That is the general chart.
When I started on /pol/ I was a conservative.
Oh, how young and innocent I was back then

>>18528871
>you now remember your lolbertarian college days

As entertainment? No, not really.

As context for the actions of Nazi Germany and refutation of apologists trying to say that the Nazis didn't or never intended to do the things they did, then yes. He makes it very clear he wanted Poles, Jews and Tankies gone. If I remember correctly, he never explicitly states they'd be murdered, but he very much wanted them removed, and didn't really care how.

It's basically required reading if you want a genuine understanding of the war.

>>18528881
Yeah, when I actually had hope for the future?
Those times were great.
Now it's all disappointment and rage.

>a jew has derailed the conversation from national socialism to christianity bad
unbelievable

>>18527565
It was leftist because it was "cool and edgy" to shit on Bush, many posters were aged 14 to 20 living in Republican areas where nerds had nothing to do except go on the internet and play video games, and because the political right didn't have a lost cause ideology to cling to that let people society generally saw as having no value feel like they were secretly "in the know" to some secret that made them better than other people.

>>18528907
I know right?
It should have ended right when he said:
T. past /pol/ user now turned center-left
Dead giveaway.

>>18528924
The Overton window has shifted so dramatically that any assertation to "left" or "right" is innately meaningless.
The closest that 4chan was in the early days was pure chaos. The aim wasn't political, rather for the lulz.
It wasn't until later in it's life (2008-2014) that the National Socialist movement took off as a result of the political situation in the West taking a dramatic shift from the previous decade.

>>18528892
Hitler would want you to look for the best future, anon.

>>18528980
For that to happen, their needs to be a total collapse of this civilization.
Because otherwise the only thing in our future is indentured slavery and death.
I can see what's going to happen and I don't look forward to it, because of the damage that will happen when Western Civilization collapses

>>18529007
Oh fuck off you demoralizing faggot, if the collapse were ever to happen (it won’t) you’ll be a teethless cocksucker using kneepads to get food while you reminiscence about the good old days (today)

>>18529123
Demoralizing? Not my intention. I'm simply telling what I (heavily) suspect will happen.
Do not be demoralized. Get fit, gain knowledge through books, build your charisma and clean yourself up.
We're going to make it anons, but not without effort.

>>18529123
I'm sorry anon, I didn't mean to come off as demoralizing.
It's been hard the last couple of days.

>>18526629
One of the best primary source materials for understanding national socialism, WW2, and fascistic movements in general. If you know a little bit about history, it contextualizes the philosophical underpinnings and motivations of fascism as a reactionary faction, albeit not explicitly.
For example, in the book Hitler mentions his distaste for the Hapsburg monarchs and the damage they did to Germany for their own empire, more or less. These things will help you understand how these movements, not unique to just the time after "fascism" officially existed, manifest. But a lot of this isn't relevant to the abstract, and it won't apply to anything today (like the union of Austria and Germany). Leftists abuse this word, as they abuse most for sordid pseudo-intellectual justifications, but a good word is "reactionary."
It cannot be said that national socialism is traditionalist, nor revolutionary. The former would involve a monarchism, a return to the roots as-is, and latter an invitation to Marxism. And neither of those historically define the movement. But they're reacting to novel forces and using traditional symbols and norms. Mein Kampf shows what this looks like in action with specific historical points.
Other interesting points are Hitler's own account of how he became antisemitic or his little treatise on how to develop and grow a "movement" or a political party, which was the thing Hitler was the most talented at, though there were many other matters which he was not.

>>18529453
This is arguably the best reply in the thread.
OP, if you haven't already abandoned this thread, is the answer you were looking for

>>18527535
Is it English?

>>18529494
My guess is not.
Most of the Western academia has been plagued by an overt Jewish influence ever since the end of the second world war (it started well before, but the fall of the Reich solidified this).

>>18526629
If you care at all about WW2, yeah. You're stupid not to.

its interesting to read about his life to an extent but the ideological section of the book is pretty much what you would expect

>>18526629
>>18526686
No, read Dalton.
First read this article to understand the history of the poor translations.

http://www.inconvenienthistory.com/8/1/4033

>>18529494
Nope, Italian. Have no idea about the state of the English translations, but i suppose it's very dire
Also:

>calm
*claim

>>18526629
>from a neutral standpoint
Are you a mouth-breathing retard or just a disingenuous troll? There is no "neutral" standpoint; there is no view from nowhere.

>>18527317
Like I said then fo gor the Dalton translation with the dual language edition, you can check his translation against the original. He does not have the same bias as Manheim.

>>18530949
which translation?

>>18528500
>>comparing Marx to Christ
The origins of Marxism do lie in Christian theology.

Becoming one with the Absolute => removing all differences and inequalities as the end-goal => " a class of civil society which is not a class of civil society, an estate which is the dissolution of all estates ... the complete loss of man and hence can win itself only through the complete re-winning of man. This dissolution of society as a particular estate is the proletariat." => marxism suddenly realizing that economical factors do not explain everything => intersectionality

i downloaded the Ford translation to listen to while i work. is that translation good enough or am i just wasting my time?

>>18531120
>Becoming one with the Absolute
To put it clearer

Christians: trying to bring forth the end of the world via removing the differences (i.e. actualizing the Absolute)
Marx: "Let's remove all the differences, because... well... it'll be... GOOD. Communism, hurr durr!.."

>>18526841
Correct

>>18527479
Based former /pol/user. Ignore the /pol/fags.
>>18528240
>Like the other anons said, you never understood the JQ.
All you have to believe to reject the “JQ” is to think it’s unreasonable to believe that a jewish illuminati like organization operates as a secret global shadow government.

Yes, you ought to read it, even if you hate Hitler and Nazis (or maybe especially if you do). If you have any interest in the history of the 20th century and/or central Europe, you owe it to yourself to read it. It's like reading Marx or something. It doesn't matter if you agree or not. It's an important and formative work that transformed a nation. They happened to lose, and traces of its ideology were forcibly eradicated, but still, it represents arguments that you must come to terms with one way or another.

As for people who say it is boring, fuck that. My dad had me do a book report on it in 6th grade, and I read the whole thing. If I could do it as a sixth grader, anyone can do it. It's not badly written nor a bad book. People just don't agree with it or don't care about the background involved, but at the time I was obsessed with World War I and early aviation, and then my dad said I should read about the interwar period and World War II, so I read Mein Kampf and did a book report. Never regretted it, and have read it again since then.

Good book, whether you agree or disagree with the arguments in there. Somehow you must face them in the modern world. Ignorance leads to downfall.

My dad had a copy but idk if I want it, I might burn it cause it doesn't seem worth reading

>>18531366
>My dad had me do a book report on it in 6th grade,
Tell us about your dad

>>18531369
He worked for Lockheed-Martin as an aeronautics engineer. We lived in Nevada. He held a top secret clearance, and never told me much about what he did, but we had air force people come to the house now and then to ask us questions. Both my grandfathers fought for the allies during the war, but my father's mother's family was from Germany. However they came over in the 1880s.

My dad was a libertarian, really. Not a Nazi sympathizer. He told me how to research about Nazi occultism and Operation Paperclip and all kinds of things like that, and how the ex-Nazis infiltrated NASA and places where he worked.

He just thought it was vital to understand what had happened in that war and since, otherwise understanding what has happened within the Military-Industrial complex of Post-WWII America would not be comprehensible.

>>18531378
Are you a nazi now?

>>18531410
No, not really. Reading Mein Kampf doesn't magically transform people in to nazis. I have some sympathies with some of their more volkische philosophical ideas about the need to care for nature and live according to natural law, and to preserve the traditions of one's people and so on. That doesn't make me a nazi, though. For the United States, one would have to modify the NatSoc philosophy so much that it would become unrecognizable, or else you would have to resign yourself to forever losing.

German National Socialism is not really an applicable philosophy to modern America. I also think that the right-wing people commonly called "nazis" colloquially in the US are actually more anti-fascist than the antifa people in the US. It's all a clusterfuck over here. Conservatism and traditionalism in the US means the values of the founding fathers and the democratic republic and so on. That is the "root" of our people on this continent. My ancestors (my father's father's line, going back patrilineally) came to North America in the original Jamestown settlement, so our family has been here for over 400 years now. As far as white traditions in this continent, those of my family are among the oldest, and they are mostly concerned with being left alone and keeping the government responsive to the needs of the people and answerable directly to its own constituents and so on. That is, they have been pretty strong constitutionalists since at least the Civil War.

Personally I don't really care much about politics. Sometimes I call myself an anarchist because it shocks people but mostly I mean "anarchy" as in "I don't give a shit about any'archy'"

>>18531368
If this was an attempt at being edgy, it's pretty pathetic

>>18531457
It's not
My dad raised me with retarded nazi ideas and fucked my life up, it's the least he deserves (with the addition of me having ended the male line of his family by sterilising myself)

>>18531477
>be strong
>look after nature
>respect your ancestors and traditions
>protect your people and nation
>retarded

You appear to have issues.

>>18531477
So let me guess, your dad voted for Reagan in the 80s and you call this "nazi ideas" so you started taking HRT to fit in at your college because your professor said your dad was "literally hitler" and should be put on a list. Gotcha.

>>18531494
No?
My dad wasn't american and he raised me to be a retarded immature racist edgelord, also he died when I was in my teens and was an alcoholic drunk who went between treating me kindly and treating me coldly, to screaming at me drunk with a red face and getting in road rage and mocked me about being a faggot

>>18531493
To be fair, those are generally not the elements of naziism that anyone takes issue with. Those are mostly agreed upon values in most cultures through history. People take issue with the opportunistic expansionism and the violently racist policies and so on.

It's not so much naziism as an on-paper ideology that is demonized, but what it was in practice. This is exactly the same as communism, which is not usually demonized in the on-paper form (which sounds pretty good to most people) but in application it winds up being an abhorrent authoritarian dictatorship with great losses of personal freedom and so on.

>>18531497
>my dad raised me but he died in my teens
Any more bullshit you want to add to this fanfic

>>18531501
He killed himself

>>18531504
Was this after he turned you into an SS-Sturmbannfuhrer Stormtrooper

>someone makes a thread about mein kampf asking for an honest take
>thread is completely overwhelmed with trannies and assblasted leftists trying to derail
lmao rent free

>>18531511
No I didn't turn into that, I was just an edgy kid
An edgy kid who made jokes that every edgy kid did
And yes, it was afterwards, what age do you think kids become edgy?
It's like 12-15

>>18531516
So what we learned:
your dad was a drunk and you're a homo
none of this has to do with mein kampf, the NSDAP, or national socialism.

>>18531515
I only responded cause that anon called me edgy

>>18531477
>My dad raised me with retarded nazi ideas
Meaning, he told you about Carl Schmitt, Edgar Jung, and Gregor and Otto Strasser brothers?

>>18531515
>assblasted leftists trying to derail
Point them at this >>18531171 >>18531120

>>18531500
The current establishment is almost totally opposed to those values.

People don't care about authoritarianism either, most people are too stupid to notice the real problems with the Nazis and instead pretend nationalism is a bad thing.

>>18531540
Yes, because once your power has exceeded national boundaries, nationalism ceases to serve a purpose for the international elites. Had Hitler supplanted the international elites, he would have eventually done the same thing in Europe except with a more clearly German hegemony instead of a Franco-German hegemony. The intention of the 1,000 year reich was not to create and maintain a nice state within the traditional boundaries of historical Germany, but to become a hegemonic leader.

They failed, NATO powers and USSR powers took over instead, and then the USSR collapsed and basically the world has been being pushed toward a global system of governance. In a lot of ways, this was the long-term vision of the 3rd Reich. It just has played out in a different way with different people in charge, but in 100-200 years, who can say how different the outcomes would have actually been?

>>18527520
wait a minute. Class oppression is now a right wing thing? Holy shit, guess the corpos definitely won this time...

>>18531555
>>18531540
P.S. you should read the last 100 or so pages of Tolstoy's War and Peace. It wasn't up to Napoleon to win, nor was it up to Hitler, and events conspired against them so that it was a "necessity" that they lose. The will of millions was wrought in to history, and today we have what we have. That's it. Simple as.

>>18531500
>opportunistic expansionism
USA politics

>violently racist policies
https://www.persuasion.community/p/john-mcwhorter-the-neoracists

>what it was in practice
https://www.unqualified-reservations.org/2009/07/carlyle-in-20th-century-fascism-and/
"Let’s do fascism first, because fascism is easy. Fascism is Carlyle, implemented by swine. Thus, you can go through Carlyle, finding Carlylean heroes, and replacing them with swine. The result will be fascism.
This exercise is exceptionally simple for those with a progressive education. Not only do you already know everything about the crimes of fascism, how to recognize it, how to fight it, etc., you cannot conceive of a Carlylean hero who is in fact a hero, and not a swine at all. Your mind rebels against the very thought."

>abhorrent authoritarian dictatorship
https://taibbi.substack.com/p/the-sovietization-of-the-american

>>18531171
You haven't read the thesis on feuerbach, IV

>>18531441
>volkische philosophical ideas about the need to care for nature and live according to natural law
Volkkische philosophical ideas and living according to natural law in Capitalism final crisis era, with everything has to be done to counter the tendency of the rate of profit to fall, no matter the effect on social cohesion or nature.
Hitlerians truly didn't understand how this work.

>>18531606
The only difference is, that Hegel thinks that you are part of some cosmic superintelligence, that is slowly remembering that it is a cosmic superintelligence.
And Marx, well, doesn't. He crudely tries to ground all these reasoning on some secular materialistic basis - but this is literally "hurr durr". The whole point of all this Hegelian shit, originally was to make the premise of you being a Cosmic Cthulhu sound coherent. Trying to turn it "upside down" and to ground it in a mode of production, merely means this insane shit ain't gonna work anymore now.

>>18531711
>means this insane shit ain't gonna work anymore now.
To elaborate further: it's akin to the High Arts situation. People grouped some random shit together (poetry, literature, paintings, etc.) based on a false premise.
Now, that premise is rejected, yet you still have ass clowns, who tries to preserve the original grouping by retrospectively pulling some far-fetched justifications for having to put up with the existence of this grouping. And most likely, not even remembering, why this whole shit even started.

Or in other words: marxism is a Christian-death-cult cargo cult.

>>18526629
I've read it and I don't regret it, but it wasn't a great book from a literary point of view. But it gives context and insight of Hitler's thoughts so I think it's worth it.
It won't automatically make you a nazi, don't worrty

There is a lot of repetition and Hitler never really gives evidence or example of his opinions, merely saying they are "facts". It does ramble sometimes and gets very boring. By the end I was sick of the lack of any sort of logical argument and the pure hatred this man exudes.

On the positive, you can really feel the amount of confidence and authority Hitler held through this book.

>>18526629
No, he comes across as a weird schizo, speaking as someone who is not a fascist/nazi, there are interesting books to read written by fascists about/promoting fascism. Mein Kampf is not one of them and what value it has is primarily tied to possible analyses of hitlers thought patterns and neuroses.

>>18531897
>schizo
Can you faggots update your toolkits already?
Fucking Christ it's the nu-Nazi

>>18526629
For understanding Hitler and his beliefs it is useful. Or any early fascist study. But no, the ideas and their presentation are not worth reading.

>>18526629
ITT /pol/ users imagining that anyone more left than center is a part of a secret raid to btfo people on a blue board of all places and refuse to believe otherwise.

>>18532531
What the fuck are you on about you stupid nigger?

>>18526631
this, its pretty badly written and really not that interesting

>>18531766
>And most likely, not even remembering, why this whole shit even started.
Exploitation. Hierarchy. A world obsessed with the material accumulation (Jesus:" My kingdom is not from this world").
>>>18531711
>Trying to turn it "upside down" and to ground it in a mode of production, merely means this insane shit ain't gonna work anymore now.
At least you have understand how it works. Turning it upside down means mostly that all mysticism find it's solution in the social relation. Which seems to be true. Why bother with Satanism, praying god etc..., when clearly, our daily living condition is mostly influenced by our social relation. Meaning, life, is not the same, in the slavery mode of production, in feudalism, in Capitalism, and the most likely incoming inferior communism. There is no need to pray the gods, or even God (which is supposed to be us). They key is the earthly family, our social relations, and those social relation are the key to the reunion with the divine.

>>18533063
>Exploitation. Hierarchy
And that is *bad* because?..

Equality (removing the hierarchy) in one context, implies imposing inequalitIES in other contextS. Absolute equality is unattainable, nor is desirable ("1=1" means complete replaceability).
And that means, that somebody gets to exploit another in some manner. You merely choose who gets fucked and in what way.

>Jesus:" My kingdom is not from this world"
I repeat, the Christian solution implied litteral end of the world. Marxists seek the Apocalypse?

>when clearly, our daily living condition is mostly influenced by our social relation
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Müller-Lyer_illusion
Because your notion of clarity is debatable.
>life, is not the same, in the slavery mode of production, in feudalism, in Capitalism,
Clearly the Sun is moving above your head, except that astronomer tells you it's actually not.

Social conditions are defined by what they are *not*. Money, for example, are just colored papers. They "work" because you forget all the intricacies of social relations and impose intrinsic value upon them (until some financial crisis happens)

What you define as your cornerstones of your "materialism" are as unreal as some pokemons in your VR specs.

>>18533063
>mode of production
Undefinable

>>18526629
It *is* poorly written. He often takes an abstract pov ("if one should xxx") when a personal anecdote would have punched harder. Still, it's only bad in style. He doesn't hide things or play slight of hand. I read it because received American history can never just say why he hated Jews. They say a jewish doctor failed to cure his mom, blinded by hate, bleh, bleh, stuff that doesn't pass the sniff test. In this book he tells you and it makes sense, agree or no.

skip it and read the table talk instead

>>18527535
>parentheses meme
>calling others biased
kek

>>18528387
It irritates me how many of you retards throw around the word "zionist" without understanding its meaning. Even after being confronted you'll ignore the conversation and each refutation and go back to your old ways.

Zionism: ideology that believes in the right of the jewish people for independence and autonomy.

Please come again.

>>18528083
are you aware that the vast majority of jews never even read 50% of the bible let alone ever read the talmud or gmara?

Even assuming they were. Can you prove that communism is a "messianic eschatological talmudic-zionist project"?

>>18535135
Wow a salty Jew.
Fuck off Moshe. You're little desert cult sucks shit and Hadrian didn't kill enough of you pedophilic scum suckers

>>18526629
no, it's garbage.
>muh history

>>18535229
Yes, muh history you fucking retard

>it's historicity means it's worth reading
Do people here REALLY believe this?

>>18535238
History has not and will not ever matter as a discipline, much less the schizo ramblings of a blathering imbecile like Hitler.

>>18526629
>Is this book worth reading even from a neutral standpoint?
Absolutely worthless, I guarantee you won't be any closer to understanding the Nazi ideology through this book. At least read well-written anti-Semitic propaganda like Celine's BAGATELLES POUR UN MASSACRE you faggot Redditor.

>>18535252
>schizo
HOLY FUCKING SHIT UPDATE YOUR TOOLKITS

>>18528000
>philosophically sophisticated, aristocratic nations in history.
this is what /pol/tards believe

>>18526629
I was part of a book club that studied this version, and Dalton, actually I now think too many versions come from the Jewish translation which is the first volume which describes Jews as maggots, it is not in the Dalton translation, but is in the Stalag version, which makes me think alot of them have been altered and tampered with.

Hitler first of all talkes about his childhood, then his introduction to politics and Venice, especially Venetia Jews who have controlled European banks, Veneci, for a long time. Furthermore we get an interesting detail into the life of everyday peasants and a life just exiting Republics, houses full of poor, very close to Tale of Two Cities and Please Sir can I have some More,
There is a clear line between Capitalists who fund Republic and workers looking for more rights.

Hitler also talks about his own experience at the hands of violent union gangs who force people to join thought violence, such unions would also force the workers to be part of movements through violence too.

Most of all we get a look at the Parliamentary System taken from Britain and used in Austria, Hitler does a good job of tearing it apart and showing its flaws, that all the seperated against each other, and only liars are every promoted to the top.

Very good book over all, but listen to the audiobook.

>>18527520
>dont let the incel values take hold
the truth always prevails

>>18529453
Good post. It amazes me how so many people - even people with more than a passing familiarity with 20th century politics - either don't recognize or fail to acknowledge how fundamentally progressive the various fascist governments were (especially in Germany and Italy) and how the post-war political superstructures of developed first-world nations borrowed liberally from those models of government. Fucking Japan basically just handed off their national defense to the US, put up an "under new management" sign and kept on keeping on.

>>18531378
>infiltrated
Jej.

>>18531441
"Nazis" (the self-identified) in the US, in my experience, basically come in four flavors. The first and most common are the "fuck niggers/spics/kikes/faggots/etc." variety that are the schizophrenic clusterfuck you describe and basically just confused and angry young paleocons, the second are the "Hitler was literally infallible" plastic paddy wehraboos of self-asserted German extraction who masturbate to the idea of re-naming American cities post-conquest just like in their Vicky II mods, the third are the "white homeland" type and the fourth are the WLP-ish "we need to burn this place to the ground before anything can be done" revolution-minded crowd.

>>18535135
You didn't read my post properly. It happens regarding those subject.
>Can you prove that communism is a "messianic eschatological talmudic-zionist project"?
It's not. Peasants revolts in the middle age were class struggle.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peasants%27_Revolt
People revolt when they feel exploited too much. Not because a jew conspire in the shadow and manipulate them. Now, the jew conspiring can happen. But that really doesn't mean the popular revolt wouldn't have happened anyway. Usually, the jew like to throw oil on the fire, but cannot light the fire. That's what, for example, happened in 1917 in Russia. Popular revolts happened in february 1917. Then the transitionary republican governement happened. By october 1917, social trouble still weren't solved. Bolsheviks then took power, with almost no resistance. Social circumstances, 20 years of bad political economy from the Tsar, led to the transitionary republic (1917), and then to the bolsheviks. Not a multimillenarian, all-powerful, all-knowing, jewish conspiracy.

you don't have to read it. it's just a really long political pamphlet from nearly a century ago

>>18536791
this

>>18527520
>class opression
BASED

>>18536217
>seething mulatto

>>18526629
>ITT 70+ posters show that they've never read it

>>18536883
"Fuck niggers" is not a schizophrenic stance at all if you actually live in a place that has them.

>Spare me the bunkertranny and /pol/ shit
>thread is 90+% bunkertranny and /pol/ shit
Never change

>>18526629
>is it worth reading
It's a look into the mind, life and perspective of a man who was massively responsible for the most impactful and horrific events in human history. I'd imagine it's worth reading, although I haven't read it myself.

>>18526629
>from a neutral standpoint
Fuck me

>>18531324
>believe that a jewish illuminati like organization operates as a secret global shadow government.
only schizos argue this
but you strawman other's opinions so not surprising

>>18531324
>is to think it’s unreasonable to believe that a jewish illuminati like organization operates as a secret global shadow government.
Like he said, you never understood the JQ.

>>18537884
>"Fuck niggers" is not a schizophrenic stance at all if you actually live in a place that has them.
Right; I meant that sentiments like that were about the depth of their "fascism". Like I said, they're basically just racist paleocons but because paleocons have no brand power they decide to be edgy and adopt fascist trappings.

>>18527479
>T. past /pol/ user now turned center-left

you say this like something to be proud of

>>18539853
I don't know about proud but I'm glad I cut down on my magical conspiratorial thinking.

inb4 someone comments lefty magical thinking that I don't engage in

>>18527292
Dumbass summary of the German Civil War which somehow ignores the crimes committed by the Freikorps, who were just as hated as the communists, and murdered countless innocent civilians. All this alongside esoteric proto-Nazi thule bullshit blowing around.

>>18527479
more like
>t. went from being 17 with stupid shallow beliefs to 18 with stupid shallow beliefs, more protean flipflopping to come soon

stop basing your politics on youtube and twitter you zoomer

>>18526629
You really think a neutral standpoint is possible at this stage?

>>18527479
>T. past /pol/ user now turned center-left
So you became a kinder more polite fascist?

>>18540812
No, I hate the government almost as much as I hate corporate America. Everyone in DC can kick bricks. I want guns, clean air, a stable career, cheap land, no more fucking wars in sand land, China to fuck itself, and the right to say, fuck, protest, bitch about, and eat whatever I want. Maybe ideological labels really are completely worthless because as soon as you claim to be something you are immediately liable for all the baggage that ideology has shit out for the past 300 years.

>>18535135
>are you aware that the vast majority of jews never even read 50% of the bible

Yet you all get access to the interest free loans as per Deuteronomy where Yahweh (satan) lays out his plan for his chosen to take over the world via usury, revelling in never working and seizing the wealth of others.

Nothing in nature keeps up with compound interest and Yahweh's minions have used this fact combined with a worldwide abstract monetary system, which they fought with demonic fury to protect, to ensure they own almost everything.