/lit/ - Literature

Dogs are pretty based ngl

>>18523869
>Since dogs love those who they know, they are lovers of wisdom
Huh?
> Thus, guardians who must be like dogs should be philosophers and lovers of
Holup

>>18523910
>Huh?
It might make more sense if you go the entire way from "loves what they know" to "lover of knowledge" to "lover of wisdom" which forms the word "philosophy" in Greek. Socrates slowly distorts the meaning of stuff until it matches what he wants

>>18523869
I promise you Plato was smarter than you or anyone you have ever known.

>>18523927
Why? It looks like he can’t even think logically.

>>18523910
i haven't even read this yet but it seems obvious just from reading the OP the implication is that dogs are more comfortable with familiar with people, familiar environment etc for obvious reasons, the more they know, the better able they are to do their job autonomously (bark and attack the right people, be friendly with the right people, know how to deal with certain threats and situations) therefore people who are guardians should seek wisdom regarding people, their environment, their existence etc in order to be more comfortable and to do their job better

christ you are retarded

>>18523927
I won't dispute that, he definetly knew what he was doing. It's just funny how he uses dozens of fallacies to make some absurd claim sound true

>>18523945
Suffice to say, you've failed to understand.

>>18523869
The original dogpill

>>18523966
Looks like you learned your method of argument from Plato.

>>18523941
>guardians should seek wisdom regarding people
Not exacly, guardians should not seek wisdom regarding those who are not citizens. They should be spirited killers, and at the same time gentle to the citizens, which seemed contradictory. That's what motivated this argument in the first place, and Socrates finds dogs to disprove the contradiction, that get angry with people they don't know but are gentle to their owners

>>18523924
So it’s all just a pun.

>>18523941
>therefore
> guardians should seek wisdom regarding people,
I don’t see this in the OP at all. I suppose it’s possibly lost in translation, but it’s also possible that you’re a prig just trying to make me feel bad.

Here's the text boys

>>18523991
>>18523975
a dog has to recognize its owners, their family, their habits and body language, their scent etc, become familiar with those they are meant to protect, and the contrast between that which is familiar and that which is not serves as an immediate red flag that instantly puts them on their guard

yes, you should feel bad butters

>>18524063
This is a fine enough point and all, but it has nothing to do with the quote. I am not feeling bad for your embarrassing attempt to “win” this

>>18523924
>>18523869
Didn't Socrates get BTFO by Diotima for trying to assert that you can love what you already have?

>>18523869
Diogenes just got BTFO by Plato.

>>18524073
good lord...
> dogs love those who are familiar and hate those who arent
>guardians must be philosophers and love learning so that the stark contrast between that which they know and shitty outsiders and their own backwards cultures and beliefs and "ways" immediately sets off alarms, and their charges, aka their civilization, can have an immediate reactionary response to people who might be a threat to it
>be a wise philosopher guardian
>see bullshit
>immediately recognize it as bullshit that doesn't belong that should be disregarded/attacked due to what you know is right

>he's a cat loving pansy
No wonder Plato goes over your head...

>>18523966
so this is the power of idealism

>>18524027
Nowhere does this say guardians should be like dogs.

>>18524131
Outsiders. Who will know things too. But “lovers of knowledge” must resist and bark at them like the fools they clearly are. It’s a stretch and doesn’t work once you’re there

>>18524211
shut the fuck up

>be white guy with family, nice white community, classical education and wisdom from life experiences etc, totally immersed your whole life in "whiteness"
>ghetto nog shows up at your door wanting to smoke crack with your family, drink some 40s, blast groidnoise etc
>i dont anything about this foreign creatures culture or ways but im an intelligent man and everything i know tells me this is clearly a repulsive specimen that should not be allowed to interact with my community
>good job you've reacted and protected your community

now the alternative
>be retard
>in your own ignorance and your curiosity about him and his ways, you show sympathy to this foreigner and let him into your house, let him interact with your family and community
>everything your family/community was is altered via his influence, all poisoned with the creatures brand of degeneracy
>bad job

>>18524211
see
>>18524235

>>18524215
Exactly. It’s terrible. Indefensible writing
Glad I never got into Plato

>>18523927
This. Although it's pretty hilarious seeing brainlets struggle to keep up with him in what appears to them as simple allegories.

>>18523937
Aristotle hadn't invented logic yet when the republic was written

>>18524245
Oh, I’m sure he was smart in some ways. The problem is he’s wrong in his assumptions and makes idiotic metaphors.
If this one is being translated right, it’s a horrible point of view. I assure you. Just because it was said a long time ago doesn’t mean it’s eternal gold

>>18524264
>butterfly
>spouting retarded shit with supreme confidence
checks out

>>18523869
Yeah there's a lot of humor in Plato, even past the usual Socratic irony.

>>18524274
>Plato
>spouting retarded shit with supreme confidence

>>18524264
You probably think he was arguing that dogs are wise because they love that which they are familiar with. Let's see if you can figure out what he was actually implying. In fact it may have already been posted in this thread, I'm not sure. Either way, it's not even overly hard to figure out.

>>18524294
look at her first post in the thread, she literally doesn't even know

>>18524211
If you are an intelligent person you will recognize intelligence in others. those who are completely foreign who defy all knowledge and wisdom are obviously not worth your time

KEK this damage control.

>>18524321
Right. Then I proceeded to speak about this interpretation anon just gave.


>>18524328
Makes sense. Really weird antiquated line. Not an easy thing to translate I guess.

>>18524354
The OP's rendition of it was pretty retarded itself, I guess I can't blame you if you haven't read the actual text.

>>18523910
Living in accord with the geometry of the cosmos (ie not being a tranny) is the pinnacle of wisdom.

Are you guys trying to imply that Plato was pro xenophobia?

>>18524354
cunt

>>18524243
Excellent ad for Plato.

>>18523869
A nice analogy that cements how Guenon was right and Evola was wrong wrt caste.

Plato was truly a bumbling retard

>>18523869
What were you expecting

>>18523924
Damn what an annoying asshole, they were right to kill him and I'm surprised it didn't happen sooner

I prefer Sextus Empricius making out dogs to be better than humans by dogmatists' own criteria of what makes a human.

>>18523924
That's not really how it goes. The whole argument is predicated on the unity of the virtues in the preceeding chapters, which you clearly didn't read you tard.

The short answer is this, somehow dogs know their people. Be it a sense of smell, mannerisms, etc. everyone who's interacted with a dog knows it has a remarkable discriminatory ability for friend and foe. That is the dog's wisdom. To the dog, it is innate. To a human, that is learned through philosophy. There are now hard and fast rules for distinguishing friend from foe for humans. Jews can be citizens of your country, but they are your enemies for example. A non-philosopher guardian fails to make that distinction and will be friendly to enemies masked as citizens.

Guardians need to have exquisite philosophical acumen to sniff out the enemies of the republic. Compare Patton to Truman if you're an American. Hitler to Churchill. Nasser to Saddat. Dong to Xi Ping.

>>18523869

>>18523869
It's not really their fault, Kant hadn't come around to invent thinking yet.