/lit/ - Literature

>>18355056
Hegel was the greater mind by far but Schopenhauer was still interesting.

>>18355056
Schop had more bite and is more enjoyable to read. Hegel is just an obscurantist who gave us communism and wokefags.

The final redpill is realizing that all non-theological philosophy after the fall of Rome is totally, utterly worthless in every sense

>>18355056

>>18355056
hegel is utter bullshit, but he sure believed in himself

>>18355056
One gave us Marx, the other Nietzsche

>>18355105
Schopenahauer it is.

>>18355117
Yes, Schopenhauer is also great in his own right. To me all of philosophy comes down to Schopenhauer vs Nietzsche and I think either choice you make is largely due to your psychological disposition

>>18355128
Psychological Bloomer = Nietzsche
Psychological DoOmer = Schopenhauer

>>18355128
>is largely due to your psychological disposition
You mean like if you're feeling negative= Shopenhauer and if you're feeling positive=Nietzsche?

>>18355056
Hegel is Reddit
Schopenhauer is 4chinz

Hegel was more of a serious philosopher while Schopenhauer is merely a literary curiosity.

>>18355153
Schop's philosophy covers epistemology, ontology, aesthetics, and ethics, so I'm not sure how he isn't a "serious philosopher".

>>18355149
>negative= Shopenhauer and if you're feeling positive=Nietzsche?
I don't like to use the term negative or positive in this instance, it implies that either is good or bad.

Nietzsche tells us to affirm life; to say Yes! in spite of suffering that exist in this world. Schopenhauer says that suffering is bad and we should negate life by denying our will (which to Schopenhauer was the source of suffering)

Both ultimately hold the axiomatic belief that the most fundamental fact of life is suffering. How you relate to this fact (embrace or negate) determines if you're more of a Nietzschean or Schopenhaurian

>>18355177
Schoppy is seriously a joke.

>>18355197
you're a joke

>>18355197
I hope I didn't hurt your feelings by this: >>18355202

but calling Schopenhauer a joke is a bit immature, he was a great thinker

Sadly, Schopenhauer was more influential.

>>18355197
how?

>>18355223
not even close

>>18355223
Thankfully*

>>18355214
have sex

>>18355223
Hegel gave rise to both Marx (Communism) and Gentile (Fascism) which utterly dominated the 20th century. Schopenhauer influenced Nietzsche which in turn influenced some obscure french thinkers

>>18355244
why? you're either a femoid or a tranny, either way YWNBARW

>>18355237

Without Schopenhauer there would be no Nietzsche, and without Nietzsche there would be no Heidegger, no Derrida, no Foucault, Deleuze, Adorno, no feminism etc etc etc

Unfortunately Hegel hasn't spawned many disciplines who can carry on his imposing legacy. How beautiful would it be if we got an updated Logic or Philosophy of History!

>>18355258

see this: >>18355247

>>18355247
>Marx and Gentile utterly dominated the 20th century
Maybe in little shitholes.

>>18355260

I won't comment on Marx and his dubious legacy. As for the rest names please.

>>18355265
are you joking?

>>18355056
intuitive clear thought vs obscure nonsense

guess who is better

>>18355276
No. The US, the UK, France, etc. remained unpolluted by commie faggotry.

>>18355301

If you mean by this all the Wittgensteinians then I've got bad news for you: the (((man))) was very much into communism.

>>18355324
Source?

>>18355328

He even tried to emigrate to the USSR. That's how much communism appealed to him. You didn't know that? Also, since you mentioned "faggotry", Ludwig was a homosexual.

>>18355333
I meant in the colloquial way, not in the literal way, though.

>>18355258
You would have none of those authors (apart from Foucault) without Hegel too. Heidegger's starting point is Hegel, when he talks about metaphysics he assumes that it has been perfected by Hegel. Deleuze studied Hegel his whole life, and Deleuze fashioned his philosophy so that it could be explicitly anti-Hegelian. And do I have to say anything about Adorno?

>>18355149
I took Schopenhauers philosophy to be more positive despite it seeming pessimistic. The idea of the will doesnt give you a personal reason for life but it does give a reason why you exist. which is to be a tool for the will to work through in a sense. I cant exactly word it right.

>>18355056
Hegel was an intellectual Caliban.

>>18355258
so basically what you are saying is that it's Nietzsche the one that is influential and not Schopenhauer, thus refuting yourself. Hegel's philosophy is a world-changing event.

>>18355223
>>18355237
>>18355258
>>18355371
>>18356434
Ahem....

>Those who have cited his influence include philosophers such as Friedrich Nietzsche[26] and Ludwig Wittgenstein,[27] scientists such as Erwin Schrödinger and Albert Einstein,[28] psychoanalysts such as Sigmund Freud[29] and Carl Jung, writers such as Leo Tolstoy,[30] Herman Melville,[31] Thomas Mann, Hermann Hesse,[32] Machado de Assis,[33] Jorge Luis Borges, Marcel Proust,[34] and Samuel Beckett[35] as well as composers such as Richard Wagner,[34] Johannes Brahms,[34] Arnold Schoenberg[34][36] and Gustav Mahler.[34]

>Influenced
Anjos, Assis, Bahnsen, Beckett, Bergson, Borges, Brahms, Brouwer, Campbell, Einstein[9], Fet, Cioran, Dilthey[10], Freud, Gray[11], Hardy, Hartmann, Hesse, Horkheimer, Huysmans, Jung, Reve, Kraus[12], Ludovici[13], Ligotti, Mahler, Mainländer, Majorana[14], Mann, Maupassant, Michelstaedter, Nietzsche, Proust, Rank, Reve, Rilke, Ryle[15], Santayana, Schlick[16], Shaw, Schoenberg, Schrödinger, Solovyov, Spengler, Tolstoy[17], Vaihinge,r Volkelt, Wagner, Weininger, Wittgenstein, Zapffe, Zola.

>>18355293
Based

>>18356530
god, imagine that

>>18357476
You don’t have to, it’s true

>>18355077
>Hegel
>non-theological

>>18355088
Based and this.

>>18355056
Hegel, but Schopenhauer was a great writer.

Hegel was a sorcerer and the Left and Right being lobotomized bastard children of Liberalism and Conservativsm don’t get this. He advocated for a supreme divine state much like the Reich or the USSR’s plans for Europe and so you can take his insights and use them to justify extreme statism or some kind of techno-socialist autarchy. Right Hegelians focus on his dealings with Spirit, Leftists focus mostly on the Dialectic itself and try to secularize that as some type of silent-pneumatic machinery that drives history towards class conflict and communist statism. They’re both insane and Hegel’s phenomenology is a form of memetic psychoactive agent that binds the minds of everyone who reads it. Its venom, pure necrotizing linguistic magic. He was a genius for this reason. Also if you’re not an autistic retard he basically shows you how the techno-alchemical engineers of civilization are transforming humanity into a sacrificial killing field for otherworldly forces but that’s not interesting to rightists or leftists because they’re castrati golem creatures who only exist to poke holes in the barrier between man’s conscious rational awareness and his subconscious cthonic realm. If you wait long enough Hegel’s name will come up in most discussions by these groups. He’s the root of all their lunacy.

>>18360974
Good post

>>18355088
who?

>>18360974
>he basically shows you how the techno-alchemical engineers of civilization are transforming humanity into a sacrificial killing field for otherworldly forces but that’s not interesting to rightists or leftists because they’re castrati golem creatures who only exist to poke holes in the barrier between man’s conscious rational awareness and his subconscious cthonic realm.

yeah its comic book shit like this and marxism that make me think hegel's a waste of time

>>18361285
Gefährlich basiert

>>18355077
>doomer poster

Discarded.

>>18355056
Hegel is indisputably more profound and better argued, but he's also a fucking autist.

>>18360974
What would even be his motivation for that?

>>18355197
>Schoppy

>>18355247
I can tolerate Fascism, to a degree.
But Communism? Unacceptable.
Hegel is a faggot

>>18362010
autistic screeching

>>18360974
Are you sure the things doing the terrible things aren't human?
The horrible thing in life, that all people must come to, is that the most of the suffering in life is caused by humans, and their innate desire for their more. More pleasure, power, wealth, bloodshed.
Hegel is the means from which the madmen in power justify their actions.
Does that rule out the possibility of the otherworldly influence entirely? No, not entirely. But as presented currently, this the truth, or the closest thing to it.

>>18355105
Nietzsche also had influence from Hegel and:
>In the struggle with the English mechanistic dumbing down of the world, Hegel and Schopenhauer (along with Goethe) were unanimous - both of these hostile fraternal geniuses in philosophy, who moved away from each other towards opposite poles of the German spirit and in the process wronged each other, as only brothers can

I honestly don't think Hegel or anyone who followed in his footsteps (except for Marx who somehow managed to do it) really qualifies as philosophy. His work amounts to little more empty posturing and propaganda, closer to some sort of cynical performance art than any actual philosophizing. You have to give a lot of credit to Schopenhauer for refusing to bow to social pressure and return to the Kantian standard of, you know, actually doing philosophy.

>>18355340
>though

>>18355056
>Who was better?
This isn't a game of football.

>>18363416
How it isn't?

>>18355077
I was taking a shit as I was browsing and reading your cringey ass post gave me the boost to finnish the job.

>>18361276
big forehead

Kant

>>18358803
kek this

>>18361276
Spook Man

>>18363625
>finnish
nice

>>18355088
No troons allowed in my thread

>>18364544
So leave.

>>18355105
>One gave us Marx, the other Nietzsche
To correct you, Hegel gave us Spengler and Heidegger, and at least us much as Nietzsche.

>>18364570
>Hegel gave us Spengler
Lmao

>>18356530
This, definitely this.
The only ones who say Hegel are the ones who have read neither or don’t understand Schopenhauer. Schrödinger almost switched his major to philosophy after read him and Einstein had a portrait of him in his office. Hegel is a joke comparatively.

>>18356530
Most of these people are not philosophers...

>>18355077
FAGGOT DETECTED

>>18365183
Literature is philosophy without bone dry autism.
But Schopenhauer is known as the philosopher of artists.

Me

>>18355056
schopenhauer becuase philosophy is not a serious thing, but he is a great prose writer.

People talk about the Phenomenology of Spirit being written like shit but since when was that the point, sure he was a shit writer but the points he was making clearly were not easy to be able to put down on paper, he done it better than anyone else could, it’s not meant to be easy to understand

>>18365215
Schope is knows as the retard of retards

>>18355056
"Better" in what sense?

>>18365497
(You)

Schopenhauer can actually write proper German.

>>18355056
Schopenhauer: “Nothing can hurt me anymore.”
Schopenhauer: “My life, is nothing but a tragedy.”
Hegel: “Let me Get this straight, you think invading my Jena lectures funny?”
Schopenhauer: “I do. And I’m tired of pretending it’s not. Ontology is subjective... Hegel, Isn’t that what they say. All of you, this German Idealism movement that we know so much, you decide what representation is real or not, the same way that you decide what’s FUNNY or NOT.”
Hegel: “Oh ok I... I think I... I might understand that you... did this to start a movement to... become a dialectical materialist? Like Marx?”
Schopenhauer: “Come on Hegel, do I look like that kind of philosopher that would be a dialectical materialist? I wrote those books because existence is awful. Everything is awful these days, it’s enough to make anyone crazy.”
Hegel: “ok so that’s it... you’re crazy, that’s your defense for all of this, for slandering me?”
Schopenhauer: “No. It's because you couldn’t figure out your Spirit to save your Phenomenology.”
Hegel’s Jena Audience: * Booing with anger *
Schopenhauer: “Ugh, why is everybody so upset about me critiquing Hegel. If it was me dying on the sidewalk, you’d walk right over me. I pass you everyday and you don’t notice me. But Hegel, what, because he capitalized on Fichte's ideas?”
Murray: “You have a problem with Fichte?”
Schopenhauer: “Yes I do. Have you seen what it’s like out there Murray? You ever actually leave the university? Everybody just yells and screams at each other, everyone is suffering. Nobody thinks what it’s like to be the other guy. You think your absolute idealism has done anything for someone like me? You think that we’ll just sit there and take in your teleology of the dialectical course of history like good little boys! That we won’t reject the blind and uncaring Will!”

>>18365781
Hegel: “You finished? I mean there’s so much self pity Arthur. You sound like you’re making excuses for your pessimism. Not everybody, and I’ll tell you this not everybody is awful.”
Schopenhauer: “You’re awful Hegel.”
Hegel: “Me? I’m awful? Oh yeah how am I awful?”
Schopenhauer: “Talking about me, inviting me to Jena, you just wanted to make fun of me, you’re just like the rest of ‘em”
Hegel: “You don’t know the first thing about me pal. Look what happened because of what you did, what it led to. There are suicides out there. People are deciding to not to procreate."
Schopenahuer: * Laughing *
Hegel: “You’re laughing, you're laughing, the Project of German Idealism is hurt because of what you did.”
Schopenhauer: “I know. How about another thought Hegel?”
Hegel: “no I think we’ve had enough of your thoughts.”
Schopenhauer: “What do you get.”
Hegel: “I don’t think so.”
Schopenahuer: “when you when you cross a blind and uncaring will to life with a body that suffers under it and dies?!”
Hegel: “Call the police.”
Schopenhauer: “I’ll tell you what you get.”
Schopenhauer: “You get what you fucking deserve!”

Schopenhauer: * Quickly grabs his revolver and shoots Hegel in the head *

>>18355056
Schopenhauer (PBUH)

>>18365995
I kek’d

>>18355056
Schopenhauer's work seems more essential and palpable--it's about the fundamental essence of life. Hegel's is abstract wankery for the most part and he makes you work for whatever value is in it.

Because Schopenhauer is a phenomenal writer, one of philosophy's the very best prose stylists with a knack for luminous metaphors and perfectly clear sentences, he's gets his ideas across much better. Hegel loses himself in his arcane neologisms and convoluted phrasings, but like a proto-Heidegger he makes you work for it. And I'm sure that the time I've spent with Schopenhauer was by far worth it, Hegel does less to convince me.

>>18366135
Why do people simp for Heidegger so damn much while completely ignoring Schopenhauer?
What Heidegger added to conversation which wasn't touched in the Schopenhauer's work?

>>18365183
No one influenced by Hegel can really be called a philosopher.

>>18366471
>What Heidegger added to conversation which wasn't touched in the Schopenhauer's work?

dasein, mitsein, lichtung, erschlossenheit, vorhandenheit/zuhandenheit

>>18364881
Yes, Spengler was supremely influenced by Hegel if you'd actually read him.

>>18366135
You do know the Phenomenology of the Spirit wasn't the only book Hegel wrote, right? He had other lectures and books you know. Who could forget how lucid and image-full his lectures were.

Schopenhauer's aesthetics of music isn't much different from Hegel's, and Hegel has a much better view of the other arts anyway.

Prove me wrong.

Schopenhaur took the worst parts of Kant and ran with it
Hegel took the best parts of Kant and ran with it

>>18355247
Thats like saying Plato is responsible for the Holocaust

left is Logos, right is schizoshit

>>18367428
No it isn't. Hegel is DIRECTLY responsible for Marxism. You can see Marx all throughout Hegel.

>>18367466
And Kant, Heraclitus, Aristotle etc are DIRECTLY responsible for Hegel

>>18367484
And Plato responsible for those, well he recorded Heraclitus

>>18366135
This.

>>18367484
Of those, you can see only Kant in Hegel (even if the others had influence). But you don't see Kant in Marx. So it only works with one degree of separation. Kant is not responsible for Marxism, Hegel is.

>>18355088
Marxfags absolutely seething

>>18368093

>>18366471
Because Heidegger is the quintessential modern philosopher, he wants to go back to the roots of philosophy to destroy metaphysics. And he doesn't do it using the tools that positivists used, i.e. formal logic and advances in science, he does it by reinterpreting the key thinkers in the Western canon.

Schopenhauer is an "exotic" philosopher rejecting Western Philosophy for Indian Philosophy. And this philosophy is rejected by modern Indians themselves, who've reinterpreted their religion through Western Ideologies (Liberalism, Nationalism, etc).So their isn't much love for Schopenhauer. You occasionally see threads on here discussing Schopenhauer, but it's usually someone posting his essay On Women, Anti-Natalism, etc, i.e. topics that fit well with the nihilist and political Zeitgeist.

>>18368148
But Heidegger isn't even a "pure" western philosopher. He ripped off Eastern Philosophy, The Book of Tea.

>>18355056
Asking Schop's mom, I reckon Hegel was.

Go back.

>>18363625
>When more than half of these posts can be applied to pagoids

>>18368487
kek.
I knew this would be brought up at some point

>>18368148
>Schopenhauer is an "exotic" philosopher rejecting Western Philosophy for Indian Philosophy
You are no better than anons who spam On Women and Schopy pessimist memes if you actually believe this. He built his entire work on the foundations of Western philosophy, that is Plato and Kant, and he constantly praises past philosophers of the West.