/lit/ - Literature

>>18231407
What literature do you want to read? Your question is retarded.

>>18231407
Second: Latin.
Third: English.

>>18231407
I understand at least four languages and I only read in my native tongue :(

Assuming you're English-speaking, pick two between French, Spanish, Russian, Italian and German.
Chinese, Arab and Urdu are probably too alien to understand withing their cultural context anyway.

Stop trying to make pýccкaя пcoвaя бopзaя a meme.

>>18231442
>accents on Russian
Chto?

stupid anteater dog

>>18231420
i am not sure. but i want to read most lit in the native language it was written in.
maybe it was a retarded question
>>18231442
no disrespect its just a really interesting dog.

French, Russian, German. You obviously already know English.

>>18231465
It depends on what lit you want to read. Asking this questions means you don't know which lit you want to read.

>>18231407
The only three languages that matter
>English
Literally ALL scientific research is in English. Yes, at worst you have a translation, but it's still in English.

Now if you still have a hard on for a second language, then German. German has the best scientific research, which is still all translated into English, so again, it's only if you have a hard on for a second language. (You can also learn French, but this is only for job opportunities. French in itself is useless if you already know English and only exists as a relict for certain government jobs).

The third language is Japanese.
Yes, it is the hardest language and yes, it is completely useless for literature if you know English. But Japanese is the only language on earth which is actually used in businesses. Even though it's very restricted to Japan, literally EVERY other country uses English in business talks or in literature. For example if a Chinese business man doesn't speak English, you shouldn't even bother, the only exception is Japanese. Japan is the only country on earth where English is completely optional for business. Even the French who jerk off to their language 10 times a day are all speaking English if they are working for a big company and are actually worth talking to.

>>18231407
Probably Latin and Greek but I'm biased towards the classics.
Really you should learn a language that's adjacent to your native country (spanish if in USA, French if in UK, German if in France etc) then learn one of the classical languages I listed above (Latin is easier)
If you think you're hot shit go for Mandarin or Arabic as that will open up a lot more types of literature or Japanese was recommended as well, that's a good one as is German I suppose.
If you're in the US though do Spanish and Latin, you can use Spanish in your day to day life and Latin will come easy if you have people to practice spanish with

>>18231860
>scientific research
what the fuck are you talking about, who cares about scientific research

French>English=German

>>18231860
>it is completely useless for literature if you know English
Japanese loses a lot in translation, what the fuck are you talking about?
>But Japanese is the only language on earth which is actually used in businesses. Even though it's very restricted to Japan, literally EVERY other country uses English in business talks or in literature.
This is categorically not true and just stupid. Putting aside the ridiculousness of a group of native non-English speakers holding a meeting in shaky English for the benefit of nobody, how do you explain works needing to be translated into English from non-Japanese languages?
>if a Chinese business man doesn't speak English, you shouldn't even bother, the only exception is Japanese
what? why?
>Even the French who jerk off to their language 10 times a day are all speaking English if they are working for a big company and are actually worth talking to.
The entire benefit of being fluent at a foreign company is so that you can actually speak with everybody without needing to go through an informal interpreter/middle-man for any non-basic communication, and so that people don't just ostracise you because it's a constant effort to speak a non-native language for the benefit of a single expat.

>>18231407
You'd probably be best off learning languages difficult to translate into English. Mandarin, Japanese, Hungarian, Arabic, probably German.

>>18231407
>>18225519
Nothing great, But A few months ago I wrote a shitty little short story about a wereborzoi on /tg/ kinda based on the idea in this picrelated. Were they were breed by the church or the gods or something from werewolves to hunt werewolves.

Not high art or anything, but it was fun:
https://ghostbin.co/paste/6f2dak

>>18234311
also this pic

>>18231407
French and Latin. Every other answer is wrong.
>>18231428
>>18231860
Russian and German are not important literary languages. The Italo-Hellenic languages, along with English, are really the only serious literary languages. Even Portuguese is better than Russian and German.

>>18231407
Classical Latin and Ancient Greek.

>>18234311
What's that pic from?

>>18234324
>Russian and German are not important literary languages.
Bait

Cute couple though

>>18234458
have no idea

it was posted in the thread.

>>18231407
english, french, german, russian and spanish are the most lit languages desu.
Just pick three of then.

Russian and Japanese.

>>18234460
It's true though. Russian has a handful of novelists that are barely worth reading in translation. German is superior to Russian by far and mostly because of Goethe and Heine. But still nothing close to any Romance language.
>inb4 German philos*phy
Yeah, literally don't care. If you learn languages for philos*phy, you're retarded.

Classical Arabic

>>18234677
What the fuck are you talking about.
Russian is the single most literaturely overloaded language there is.
Even the most accomplished western writers don't even come close in expressiveness and themes that some random shmuck in russia has written a month ago.

>>18234810
>Russian is the single most literaturely overloaded language there is.
Yeah, you can't even write English. Every pathetic opinion you utter can be discarded. Maybe try taking Dmitry's cock out of your mouth before you try to type again.

Russian literature is pea-soup garbage. A shabby ripoff of the French in most cases, downright trash in others.

Sebastião laughs at you from the grave.

None of you have ever learnt another language if you truly believe it's worth it for reading. Understanding nuances in language takes years. It takes serious effort and years to actually understand the language, especially difficult literature. Doing 5 minutes of Duolingo every day wont prepare you for literature

>>18234826
Not my fault English lacks basic words.

>>18234863
Russian has about 130,000 words, English has 170,000.

>>18234978
He doesn't know. Nobody tell him about conjugation.

>>18235036
>having no syntax is a good thing

Maybe

>>18235042
It is though? Sentences rarely get confusing in Balto-Slavic languages, word order doesn't matter at all.

>>18235036
It's literarily over saturated.

>>18234677
>It's true though. Russian has a handful of novelists that are barely worth reading in translation
...Wasn't OP point exactly what languages he should learn in order to read in original language?

ITT: Angloids coping

>>18231407
I always read in my language (Polish) if possible. It's a beautiful language, great for literature. One simple statement in English can be poetic in Polish.

>>18235060
>word order doesn't matter at all.
Basedskye blondinke
>Sentences rarely get confusing in Balto-Slavic languages
Oh, they do, trust me bro...

>Oчи чёpныe, жгyчнe плaмeнны
>И мaнят oни в cтpaны дaльныe,
>Гдe цapит любoвь, гдe цapит пoкoй,
>Гдe cтpaдaнья нeт, гдe вpaжды зaпpeт.

>>18235189
Some time ago I used to listen to random words in google translate. "Future" was beatiful, it was something like Prziezwoscie

>>18231407
Greek and French

>>18235252
Lenktini peiliuka miske as radau
Peiliuka lenktini radau as miske
Radau as miske lenktini peiliuka
As miske peiliuka lenktini radau
Lenktini radau peiliuka miske as

I can't be arsed to put proper Lithuanian letters in there, but all of those are completely grammatically correct and it wouldn't be weird to say any of those.

>>18235189
pziserowksi duzerghis batolizobis phaski !! :ddd

What are the literary benefits of learning French?

Arabic and Persian, for poetry and philosophical treatises

>>18235378
I was looking into learning Arabic, but their TV is all so garbage I can't handle inputting it into my head.

>>18231860
good bait, surprised you haven't gotten more replies

>>18234810
other than 19th century russian lit, they have nothing else of worth that would reward learning the language

>>18235322
none, learn it if you like french literature. there are no "literary benefits" to learning any language

>>18231465
so you want us to tell you what you should read too? maybe you should read more and form your own tastes before trying to learn a language. You will just give up since you have no clear goal.

>>18235501
I mean what are the best writers of the French language

>>18235285
What do they mean? Gtranslate is telling me some strange stuff

Also
>pic
Blondinka...

>>18235599
Nobody will ever agree on that, there are literally dozens who are superfamous and yet I couldn't name one single work of them
Rabelais, Chateaubriand, Corneille

>second
Latin by far
>third
French I guess

>>18235760
>>18235501
This guy is a retard. French is a good language to learn because they have great poetry (can only be enjoyed in the original language) and good literature spread over multiple centuries. Russian only has good literature in the 19th century and a lot of it in the same style. Germany has philosophy, which you don't really need to read in the original language unless you're autistic (Germans often read Kant and Hegel in English anyway) and their literary canon is quite thin for how big they are.

>>18235824
>(Germans often read Kant and Hegel in English anyway)
I've heard other people here on /lit/ say that, really? How does it make sense?

>>18235824
>Russian only has good literature in the 19th century and a lot of it in the same style.
That is very wrong. Best Russian poetry was written in the XX century.

>>18232543
get a load of this guy

>>18235824
>Germans often read Kant and Hegel in English anyway
Wtf any germanons want to confirm this

>>18235411

That's the trick, get into books with it. The Quran has countless classes where you can learn the grammar, it's worth it even as a non-Muslim. Its vocabulary influences the entire Muslim world

>>18236566
>The Quran has countless classes where you can learn the grammar
>Get indoctrinated into a Bedouin death cult
No thanks

>>18237003
Idk dude, I don't think that a couple youtube videos can turn me into a Muslim.

>>18234677
>No German literature
>Holderlin
>Rilke
Shut the FUCK up you idiot

>>18231407
French and Italian easily.

>>18237225
>Italian easily.
Pourquoi

>>18237204
this two are literal whos for the average /litfag/

why are dogs so much sluttier than cats?

>>18237446
Wtf

>>18237340
Ever heard of The Divine Comedy?

>>18231860
This is right for business.
For literature the following
-French
-Spanish
-Japanese

Maybe a Russian and German. Latin if you want to go to the classics. Greek if you want to impress some old school professor.

>>18237769
>Greek if you want to impress some old school professor.
My middle school teacher was impressive. She knew 8 languages - Italian, French, Spanish, English, German, Latin, Greek and fucking Sanskrit.
But another teacher at my friends' high school was even crazier, that dude knew a certain dialect of Sanskrit which just a handful of people on Earth studied.

Modern Lit? German + French

Overall? Latin, Greek (Attic is fine), French, German, Spanish, Italian, Russian, Hebrew, Arabic, Sanskrit, Japanese, Mandarin—in no particular order.

If you don’t have a rudimentary understanding of all these languages you cannot become a fully fledged heroic artist.

>>18237990
How many people in the world you think have a rudimentary understanding of all these languages? Genuine question

>>18238044
Not that anon but
>heroic artist
Probably a very little group of people. I’ve know one or two very old professors within the arts field that could speak a bunch of languages. I’ve heard my current manager speak German, due to my company he has to speak at least French and English. So I think he knows at least 4 languages.

>>18235737
I'm glad that machines can't decipher my obscure language.
All of those say "I found a switch-blade in the woods"

>>18235929
This is nothing but a wild guess: Kant’s German is old and outdated so your average Hans is more in touch with the English used for translations than they do with the German in Kant’s original work.
I remember reading about someone who learned old German because she was a philosophy major, some sort of expert on Kant. When she went to Germany everyone looked at her weird because of the way she spoke.

>>18237769
I will never get over the fact that such an awful sounding language, fucking French, is so important for literature. It upsets me deeply.

>>18238044
It was exaggeration but my point still stands. Learn as many languages as you can and that’s the only way you can become a truly new literary artist.

>>18237003

No need to be weak-willed about it. Much of the book asks the listener simple questions, like this one:

> Have you considered the seeds you sow in the ground? Is it you who make them grow or We? If We willed, We could make it [dry] debris, and you would remain in wonder, “We are burdened with debt. Rather, we have been deprived.” Have you considered the water that you drink? Is it you who brought it down from the clouds, or is it We who bring it down? If We willed, We could make it bitter, so why are you not grateful? (Qurʾān 56: 63-70).

If you have your answers to these questions lined up and your young ass is oh-so-read in your theology, then why would it bother you to heard them asked, is that indoctrination? Sure there's the parts about the wives, muh dont bother me in my apartments, and muh kufr, but you already know what's bunk and what isn't right? Why feel threatened? It's like a preacher wrote his sermons down in the Quran, many parts go off in tangents, or change subject for no reason. Regardless, the language in it is sublime, the sentences succinct, and the poetic verses at the end of the book interesting. Take it from a student of the language, and from a culture whose whole lifeblood to Muhammad's time and into this day is oral poetry. It's the richest a Semitic language has to offer, especially when its lexicon melds into an Indo-European language, it's absolutely sublime.

>>18235824
the point was that if anon is asking what are the benefits of learning french, he probably isn't that interested in french literature since he needs someone to tell him why it's worth it. If you are not interested in the literature of a particular country or language, there's no point in learning that language even if some retards like you tell them how great the author of that language is\

>>18237204
Good writers, but German poetry is pretty pathetic when compared to even a minor Romance language like Portuguese. Compare it to Italian, French, or Latin and German is absolutely piss-poor. German isn't one of the great poetic languages. Russian is even worse.

>>18235599
Tons of poets from the 19th century including Baudelaire (his poetry is godtier but gets lost in translation), Verlaine, Rimbaud, Mallarme, Lautreaumont, the decadent novelists, Flaubert, Maupassant, Proust, Celine, Balzac, Stendhal, Dumas, Victor Hugo. Montaigne, Rabelais and Moliere too but they are older. There's also Camus and Houellebecq but I don't particularly care about them.

>>18237340
if you already know french and/or spanish, there's no reason not to learn italian. It has tons of great writers and imo is more beautiful than french.

>>18238380
that's why I only care about reading it

>>18231860
Don't listen to this guy. I learned all of them and by now I still only use English for reading almost anything. German is useless for reading unless you really like some specific author. Translating Japanese into English directly is very hard and you'll likely lose 85% of its meaning by translating so it's not useless by any mean to learn them for literature. What the hell are you even talking about in the end? Wtf?

>>18231407
Russian
French

>>18231407
Based
>>18231442
Cope. Big nosed dogs are cute.

>>18237674
Even modern day Italian speakers find it hard to read it though

>>18238471
How long have you been learning Arabic anon?

>>18231407
since the question is in english i assume english as a first/already mastered language
for classical works: greek and latin
for modern literature: french and spanish
for philosophy: german and greek

>>18239912

Seven years, about three of them intensively. It's a rigid language, but the meter is highly affected, it's Latin's counterpart. What I'd suggest is to learn the IPA, learn the pronunciation, then the root system, then the measure system, and then go into grammar for real. We learned from news sites to begin with, and I'm still shit at listening to it.

>>18238471
Mashallah

>second
french
>third
russian

what is the longest language?

>>18240830
>what is the longest language?

>>18231407
>latin
>French
>German
This is it

Rusfag here. To me, it's German and French.

Personally, I'm not a huge fan of Russian literary classics because a great deal of it remains so incredibly relevant that it hurts. Quite often, having finished a book, I find myself thinking that decades and centuries flow by but nothing really changes, and probably never will, at least in my lifetime.

Rusfag here. To me, it's German and French.

Personally, I'm not a huge fan of Russian literary classics because a great deal of it remains so incredibly relevant that it hurts. Quite often, having finished a book, I find myself thinking that decades and centuries flow by but nothing really changes here.

>>18242649
How do to learn français?

>>18234311
I really want the source on this art

Which is better, spanish or italian? I hate pompous french culture with their schizo women and hyper masculine pseudo-philosophers.

>>18243134
>hyper masculine pseudo-philosophers
What’s your problem with Camus?

>>18231407
my friend is learning french so I've started too as it's cool to learn a language with another person, but I legitimately can't stand french, it sounds so fucking gay and psuedy, I want to learn German personally but then I'll have know one to talk with unless I move there.

>>18244235
Can’t you find discords or one of those apps that pair you with a foreigner

>>18244285
I'm on 4chan, I'm fucking socially inept, I was lucky enough to befriend him when we were very young.

>>18244291
I mean it’s online so it can’t be that difficult can it

>>18244312
I get anxiety interacting in WOW, but anyway, I reckon I'll probably just stick to French, better than being monolingual.

>>18244339
I guess so

>>18235824
>French is a good language to learn because they have great poetry (can only be enjoyed in the original language)
Not really exclusively in the original, but then this would be true of Greek and Russian too.

>>18243134
if you learn one of those you are basically learning both, so just go with the one that has more literature that interests you. I would say spanish is probably more relevant to modern literature, though.

>>18244339
somehow i get more anxious when it;s with strangers over the internet

>>18231407
Japanese, Latin and French are all kino

>>18245651
>French
How do I learn it

>>18246458
You get the french learning pack from the language threads on either /int/ or /lit/. Then you read and read some more.

>>18246458
with your brain, connard

>>18246497
Merci beaucoup

>>18234850
A valid point. I'm not totally on board with the whole "not worth it" thing, but I think it's important to emphasize how big of an adventure learning another language to this level is. You can't rightly imagine the mounting work that awaits you beforehand. Especially, if you're from the US, so you naturally don't know too many bilingual people. In this case, just to give you an insight: in Europe we have English classes from first grades of elementary school. They might suck big-time, but still there's plenty of those. A few hours a week for over a decade. The final exams after graduating highschool are set up to test your knowledge up to B2. This is the level expected from you if you were in a profile with extra English hours. Something like 6 hours a week for the last 3 years. THIS is what is meant to give you B2. And B2 isn't even a level on which you can comfortably approach literature. So, after all that, the vast majority of the population can't do this.

Sure, self-study IS several times more effective, but even then you have to have some serious and concrete motivation to put yourself through all that. Otherwise, you will just lose some time. Potentially -- a lot of it.

Having said that, it was all about learning with exclusively highbrow literature in mind. If you just want to interact with natives on your vacation or whatever, you will be just fine.

>>18247138
>In this case, just to give you an insight: in Europe we have English classes from first grades of elementary school. They might suck big-time, but still there's plenty of those. A few hours a week for over a decade. The final exams after graduating highschool are set up to test your knowledge up to B2. This is the level expected from you if you were in a profile with extra English hours. Something like 6 hours a week for the last 3 years. THIS is what is meant to give you B2. And B2 isn't even a level on which you can comfortably approach literature. So, after all that, the vast majority of the population can't do this.
i don't think it's wise to take this as indicative of the actual difficulty of the task. all that is happening there are the wheels of an educational system uselessly spinning, the vast majority of what these classes make you do is a waste of time. in my experience language classrooms consistently fail and personal interest and regular exposure to the language through entertainment consistently succeeds, so that the kids whose parents send them to fancy language schools are rapidly left behind by the dorks who become fluent just by playing videogames in english every day. if you incorporate contact with the living language into your daily routine you will learn it without effort, if you don't then no pile of textbooks and flashcards will help you.

>>18234850
>None of you have ever learnt another language if you truly believe it's worth it for reading
I did it with French. Took me about 3,5 years but now I can read Houellebecq while looking up 3 to 5 words every paragraph (mostly slang) and occasionally referring to a translation (just to shed light on ambiguous passages). I have no speaking and listening practice though so I must suck at these departments. But then again, I'm learning French solely for reading cuz I'm too poor to visit France.

>>18247325
Yeah, I got the same problem with French and Japanese. I can read, but I can't speak or listen for shit. Not that it brothers me a whole lot since I wanted to use them to read, not converse, but it's possible that it could be a good idea to learn solely for my career's sake.

>>18240830
English

>>18247286
Sure, that's why I wrote:
> They might suck big-time, but

and

> Sure, self-study IS several times more effective

And by "self-study" I meant massive exposure: video games, TV series, YT videos, etc.

And by "several times more effective" I did mean "several times more effective".

But the point remains: a shitload of time is needed. I won't argue about the specific example.

>>18231860
Peak bugman

I’m debating between French, Spanish, or Russian for my third.

>>18247595
>French

>>18247603
Why?

I know German, English, French and Japanese. I'm thinking Spanish should be next.

>>18234850
>None of you have ever learnt another language if you truly believe it's worth it for reading.
But it is, and a language's writings are its highest expression, and its most important reason for learning the language.

>>18244235
Dude, learn the one you really want to adquire, otherwise you'll burn out. Long term it will pay off more.
Also, you can learn two languages at the same time. You can manage that.
I've been learing coincidently French and German the last few months. I began with them at the same time and had no problem with the basics. Sadly I will continue with just one of them because of time and disponibility. I hope to catch up later with the one I'm pausing.
Cheers.

So, to sum up this long and repetitive thread, the power ranking is:
1. English
2. Spanish
3. French
POWER GAP
Russian, German
Everything else

>>18247741
No you stupid nigger, if you're going to do that, at least give supporting reasons.

Japanese is up there with French, not for its anime/manga/film/tv/games, but because of its works still being discovered by everyone else.

Spanish is comparable with Latin's and German's usefulness.

>>18247610
How long did it take you to be able to read Japanese literature?

>>18247815
Seven years with about 2 hours of practice 90% of the days of each year.

>>18247610
How long did it take you to learn them and what methods did you use? (specifically French)

>>18231407
Cute animal

>>18248058
What is the threshold of knowing a language for you? Is it being able to sustain a basic conversation, to watch a movie or to enjoy literature in the language?

>>18248303
Being able to read literature and have basic conversations desu

>>18234850
Sadly true.

>>18249542
And I must add, even if you learnt the language on native level you'd still fell detached from it unlike your mother tongue, which is for a lack of better expression ''your feeling language''. There's more to literature than learning the right vocabulary, it's all about the culture as well.
That said, I still try to read in the original language whenever possible. At least it's a good learning opportunity.

>>18247815
Japanese takes years to attain a decent, novel-reading level.

This might be a stupid reason, but I've thought that it might be more entertaining to learn an east asian language like mandarin or japanese because it seems more difficult to get a decent translation from an east asian language into english. As in, more on average would be lost in the process compared to a translation between cousin languages like spanish or french to english.

>>18240830
sanskrit. because u can technically combine all the words of a sentence into just one continuous word-sentence spoken straight without pausing

>>18231407
Spanish and French

>>18231407
Sumerian. MAYBE Latin, but it's a mixed bag.

>>18231407
Why the long face?

>>18249926
No, you are absolutely correct. Sentences written in Japanese can sound natural, but if they get translated into English, they often sound very strange.

>>18235484
>>18234826
Yeah we all hear about great modern spanish literature lol
Whats portuguese and spanish have instead of few great books from 19 sentury and hordes of mutts speaking it?

>>18235257
Пpзжeжвoщчьe
Beautifull indeed

>>18234460
guy is much hotter than gal, should dump unless serious LTR

>>18234677
>1/10th of all books in the world are published in German

>>18231407
English, French, Latin. This is the God combination.

>>18253022
Why Latin? It’s dead

>>18250196
Oh yeah, I'd forgotten about that. I remember reading bout it when reading something related to xetex.

>>18252742
no one mentioned spanish or portuguese, sperg. French, German, Italian and an ancient language like Latin or Greek are more worth the effort to learn than Russian. Even then, Spanish and Portugese can be easily learned if you know French or Italian, so it's basically killing 4 birds with one stone, as opposed to Russian.
Also, taken all together, Spanish and Portuguese have a lot more literature than russians, but you seem you have some weird hang up on people from those countries so it's probably pointless aruging with you on that point.

>>18253126
why are you even on this board if you can't understand why latin would be a good language for reading literature? You should stay on /int/

>>18238925
>German isn't one of the great poetic languages
it actually is, pleb. I bet you can't even read German and are just parroting some shitty opinion you probably read on here