/lit/ - Literature

>>17938222
retarded

>>17938222
Anarcho-primitivism isn't ooga booga tribal warfare politics you uneducated dip

>>17938222
Stupid joke of an ideology that ironically is only kept alive today by internet poisoned zoomers.

Which is worse
Wojack posting or doge posting?

>>17938239
Yes, but we are the future and the other generations after us will be more similar to us so where’s your point?

thinking that it's somehow possible to "go back" is a very modernist sentiment funnily enough

>>17938253
What? Zoomers are just annoying is all. I hope to God anyone who seriously identifies as an “anprim” will grow out of it or just go to the woods like Ted.

>>17938222
It’s where the reactionary right will gravitate to (oh wait, they have already) and that’s fine if they just leave the rest of us to transition into permacultural agriculture

>>17938315
Lol

>>17938222
pointless degeneration of proper primitivist thought.

>>17938315
>permacultural agriculture
Butters I see you posting some anarchist books a lot, Ecology of Freedom by Bookchin arrived for me today and I’m wondering who else I should look into

>>17938285
Ted denounced anprims

>>17938242
wojack

>>17938222
a childish ideology for the weak and immature

>>17938222
There’s not one good argument against it ITT, just people who know nothing about the ideology disavowing it

>>17938421
I haven’t delved too far i to the farming aspect yet. Bill Mollison’s (and David Holmgren’s) Permaculture intrigues me. I hate the idea we have to pack people into giant cities, but how can we spread out everywhere? The primitivists wish everyone short brutish lives and a massive thinning through various ways. Parish the thought they should get a hold of a nuke.

I’ve a list of a bunch of them, but Mollison’s and Stamets Mycelium Running are what I’ve downloaded and will be reading fairly soonish

>>17938430
What are his plans/hopes for the future though?

>>17938421
Here’s another. Popular with at least one other anon

>>17938481
>>17938489
Many thanks for these suggestions. I’m starting to build my deep-ecology based philosophy after reading Carson and Naess and needed some political theory in there.

>>17938238
BORING

>>17938315
yes but first we need to destroy long nose tribe and brown tribes all over the world
then we can have paradise on earth

>>17938481
>but how can we spread out everywhere
in anprim society or modern society?
in the former it would happen naturally since cities could not support their population densities for long after the ending of industrialized supply chains
in modern society? there's no interest in it, its represents a technical inefficiency in the system and we will continue to see pressure to urbanize from both economic and cultural angles. only the wealthy, the disenfranchised, and tolerated belligerents like permies will live outside cities

>>17938222
>What are your thoughts on anarcho-primitivism?
Nothing is there. The only model for anarcho-primitivist society is current spear chuckers, like the sentinelese etc. and they are degenerated races not 'primitive' races.
Going back to 4000-10,000 BC we still find civilizations. Not rock smashers.

>>17938315
The reactionary right gravitates towards nothing except the status-quo

>>17938530
Might like Derrick Jensen too.

>>17938554
Skin color isn’t why your life is shit. Remove state capitalism and things can improve.

>>17938567
Good points. I was just wondering about how to slow and reverse the encroachment into the wilds to something reasonable

>>17938222
This thread is not literature-related.

Are these the delusional bastards that think primitive man was egalitarian and didn't have to work their ass off for food?

>>17938882
>primitive man was egalitarian
in what sense? i think the argument is more that primitive society is more innately egalitarian than neoliberal power structures
>and didn't have to work their ass off for food
no, though most would claim that the work for sustenance is more fulfilling or the like than 9 hours of microsoft excel a day

>>17938930
Sounds reasonable.
William Morris idealized the medieval period more. Reimagined without monarchy and megalithic churches... just thinking out loud.

>>17938430
He denounced anprims because they often portray an overly idealistic and simplified image of primitiv life. People saying Hunter gatherers only work three hours a day and spend the rest of it singing and dancing. And the Full anprim will not be achievable unless people invent some kind of religious taboo against agriculture and animal husbandry because that knowledge won’t be forgotten even after industrial civilization collapses

>>17938972
Why the medieval period specifically?

>>17939042
There were a couple of independent cities that had a enjoyed some autonomy from king’s taxes for a time or two. I believe Kropotkin mentions them in his work. But generally it’s probably just his favourite aesthetic

>>17938278
This is the general line of thinking for anti-civ anarchists, in their critique of @P.

>>17938315
Tripfag doesn't understand the trend of the reactionary right nor @P, who is surprised?

>>17938421
Ditch the Bookchin, but pick up The One-Straw Revolution.

>>17938489
It is entirely vulgar to equate Ted K's romanticism with either mainline @P (Zerzan, Tucker, Camatte, Perlman). Oh wait, tripfag again.

>>17938637
Derrick Jensen is a TERF and fetishized indigenous people. Oh yeah, tripfag.

>>17938882
Anthropological studies suggests hunter-gatherers work much less than 40 hours a week. Truly primitive man probably was relatively egalitarian -- as Zerzan points out we have very little evidence of pre-domestic societies or cultures, even the most so-called 'primitive' people domesticated dogs.

>>17939003
He did denounce @Ps for the reasons you describe. 'Full @P' is not a thing, even for classical @Ps (who make a whole lot of other bad assumptions.)

Butterfly enjoys anarcho-primitivism because she wants to be forcibly dominated by me :3

>>17939230
I'm not an "anti-civ anarchist", I just think it's ahistorical larping that is that is afforded you by modernity. You can look at the developments of modernity and go "this was a mistake" but that's all you can do ultimately—draw lines in the sand. it's something you grow out of ideally.

>>17939258
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/wolfi-landstreicher-a-critique-not-a-program-for-a-non-primitivist-anti-civilization-critique

>>17939359
>Ultimately, if we imagine dismantling civilization, actively and consciously destroying it, not in order to institute a program or realize a specific vision, but in order to open and endlessly expand the possibilities for realizing ourselves and exploring our capacities and desires, then we can begin to do it as the way we live here and now against the existing order. If, instead of hoping for a paradise, we grasp life, joy and wonder now, we will be living a truly anarchic critique of civilization that has nothing to do with any image of the “primitive”, but rather with our immediate need to no longer be domesticated, with our need to be unique, not tamed, controlled, defined identities. Then, we will find ways to grasp all that we can make our own and to destroy all that seeks to conquer us.

All this amounts to the same thing as the what the online nietzschean overmen or trad stoicists think. That is to say, glorified self help.

>>17938238
>>17938222
yeah these memes are retarded. like all 'labels' online no one knows what they're talking about. that's why ted gets equated with anprim. and modern politics is rarely about civil discussions it's most characterised by extreme ideology and revolution. the pretend-politics people so love online never involves civil discussions either.

>>17938239
>>17938285
i grew into it on my own. i don't think anprim is quite accurate and it's got braindead liberal humanist stuff in it like all anarchism does. i have an evolutionary and pragmatic angle. i don't mind people not wanting it, i don't want it myself but it's the truth of the matter. the root of every problem and dysfunction. it's how we were meant to be and any deviation is to painfully batter against not just your instincts but every single super-cellular structure in your body because all were built for it. there is no general mind or body much less a blank one, only an aggregation of functions evolved for a specific way of living.

>>17939423
Read Hadot.

>>17938278
It’s what conservatives always want. It’s not modern at all.

>>17939230
“@p”? At-prim is what this looks like. Stop it.
One-Straw Rev is also on the list, but I hear it’s more difficult than Permaculture.
Ted’s romanticism is different romanticism. Uh-hu. That was a question. An opportunity to clear this up.
Nothing wrong with being a TERF. “Fetishized”? He likes native American women does he.

>>17939234
I distance myself from the label. We need a tempered technology for the future, but a simpler lifestyle. (I would kill you if you tried anything)

>>17939502
do you have anything to say

>>17939508
Please. You would never do anything :3

You want my dick in your face *pushes it into your cute cheek*

>>17939508
"conservatives" are modern

You cant turn back the tides

>>17939473
also, on the political end, institutions and centralisation always lead to evil and mass suffering and confusion. and are born of this, it's hardly organic. there is no higher life or development to be found there. only mental illness and maladaption becoming the norm.

>>17939522
Tories? Statist, imperialist, orthodox ant-secularist? Nope.

>>17939508
>>17939515
I mean, in real life you most likely would not do anything.

I don't know if you'd really want me to whip it out, but you're definitely masturbating to it right now, huh?

*does laundry*

>>17939555
>>17939543
Please note she didn't do anything about the cock.

It is IN her FACE right now and she's not doing anything about it. Mentally, psychically, she has a penis in her face, veritably.

Have fun with laundry :3

>>17939508
Silence tripfag.

>>17939512
Hadot is a historian of philosophy. He describes that for the ancient Greeks, philosophy was considered a way of life rather than a body of knowledge or a method for attaining knowledge. For the Cynics, Stoics, Skeptics, Epicureans and others, philosophy was about attaining a particular disposition, that is to say, to bring about a change in the individual at the site of the individual.

I say to read Hadot because it is precisely the opposite from your account: it is self-help that is bastardized from such philosophies, not vice-versa.

>>17939543
If you think statism is inherently conservative then everyone is conservative except anarchism, which is a wild gang of retards.

>>17939543
Statism and imperialism are incredibly modern notions, and there was a modern reaction to secularity quite early one. You do not know what you are talking about.

Oh wait. Tripfag. Why doesn't 4chan bully tripfags anymore?

>>17939571
w/e, bitch.

>>17939579
what, I am not a native speaker or autistic, could you kindly explain the meaning of W/E?

>>17939578
>the Roman Empire is a modern thing
Just stop

>>17939589
>completely ahistorical projection of statism and imperialism backwards onto rome
yeah you're a retard, sorry

She's kissing it :3

>>17939589
Would have responded but it seems >>17939607
did it for me.

Google 'modernity'

I used to think I was training Butterfly for my dick, but seeing how brainless I have become I must admit, I think she has enslaved me :3

Oh well, thank you for kissing my cock