/lit/ - Literature

>>17691355
>is sadistic/indifferent to human suffering?

athiests aren't human

yes lmfao the old testament

>>17691355
Aristotle was kinda in that direction. He didn't see any reason why the absolute creator should love you or be personal.

>>17691355
>Isaiah 45:7 - 7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.

true christians understand this stuff

>>17691355
The bible

Humans are just another one of his creations
Why should we be special

>>17691367
>>17691376
>>17691381
so you guys are telling me the bible isn't just lovie dovie christian wholesomeness?

I Have No Mouth And I Must Scream

>>17691395
Because he supposedly created us in his image, duh?

>>17691504
yes

>>17691532
you think God never suffered?

>>17691355
this helped me:

If there is a God, whence proceed so many evils? If there is no God, whence cometh any good? boethius

Mankind is poised midway between the gods and the beasts. plotinus

>>17691376
What translation is that? I've never seen the "create evil" part translated that way. It's usually "disaster" or "calamity" or something along those lines because in the Christian worldview God actually did not create evil, but evil came about due to a rejection of the good that God created.

>>17691752

KJV

>>17691752
You are correct, but it doesn't actually imply he created the evil anyway though. Look at the line before: "I form the light, and create darkness." When God said let there be light in Genesis he did not also say "let there be darkness" it's just assumed that by allowing there to be a lack of light in certain places/times that darkness now exists too. In the same way, we see that a lack of the good things God has created results in evil.

>>17691752
it's a conspiracy

>>17691752

what if man is made in gods image more closely than we think and god himself is constrained by "godly nature" the same way humanity is constrained by human nature?

>>17692012
that is the actual christian view.

>>17692012
God has been constrained by the theologians; and particularly by will.

literally everyone but self-indulgent retards say this. indifferent that is, sadistic would imply a humanness to pervert.

>>17691355
>Are there any books that touch on this topic?
What's the Bibble?

>>17691799
It's a true miracle to witness the loops your mind can jump through to justify made up nonsense to yourself

>>17692441
Interesting, I did not know that. Is there much written about this topic?

>>17691355
Gnosticism

>>17691752
>יוֹצֵר אוֹר וּבוֹרֵא חֹשֶׁךְ, עֹשֶׂה שָׁלוֹם וּבוֹרֵא רָע; אֲנִי יְהוָה, עֹשֶׂה כָל-אֵלֶּה.
רע literally translates to 'bad', while שלום is peace. So 'doer of peace and birther/creator of bad'.
You can translate it as evil or calamity I guess. רע is a bit ambivalent, though evil is רשע. Interestingly, רע is the same root as friend :)

>>17691799
>ג וַיֹּאמֶר אֱלֹהִים, יְהִי אוֹר; וַיְהִי-אוֹר. ד וַיַּרְא אֱלֹהִים אֶת-הָאוֹר, כִּי-טוֹב; וַיַּבְדֵּל אֱלֹהִים, בֵּין הָאוֹר וּבֵין הַחֹשֶׁךְ.
Literal:
>And G said, be light (let there be light is a bit incorrect, he is more ordering the light, but there's no good translation) , and there is light. And G saw the light, and it was good.and G divides (differentiates) between the light and the darkness
Idk why english translations are so bad.

>>17693328
In other words, before G divided the light and darkness there was only light. How was darkness 'contained' in light without being? Idk, I just speak hebrew I didn't study bible intensively, that's stepping into kabbalah territory.

Imagine wasting so much intellectual potential on fairy tales. There is no god, sweaty. It's just an illusion for people who cant deal with suffering and have to create otherwordly witnesses. Cope, all is but cope.

>>17691355
part of me wants to suggest Duns Scotus, but I'm not sure it's accurate to say he believed that. Either way he has an interesting view of man's relationship to God.

>>17693392
What was his view

>>17691504
lmao that's after the larper son got involved

how many times do people have to discover gnostic truth independently to accept it?

>>17693328
>>17693339
Sounds to me like there was darkness before light, and God didn't create it

>>17694125
They’ll dent it until the end of the time because they’re cucked by the church

>>17691355
There's a short story with this exact point. It's called "Hell is the Absence of God", by Ted Chiang. I don't remember in which of his books it is.

look into certain versions of gnosticism and dystheism
reading the first 5 books of the old testament might help you understand why this beliefs actually have a solid foundation
I can't talk about the rest of the bible since I haven't read it yet but it's a good start and you'll get a pretty good insight of what the God of old testament was like

>>17695082
lmfao this guy wants to talk about gnosticism without having read the bible. /lit/