/lit/ - Literature

tell your friend he's a pseud

>>17568096
i don't know anon, he's honestly a really smart guy. Literally all he does every day is reading greeks

>>17568076
You won't miss out on content unless you're reading something which manipulates the limits of the Greek language itself, like Parmenides' proem or Plato's eponymous late dialog. You will, however, miss the swiftness and intense clarity, logical rigour and nuance (expressed through particles) of the language, all manner of literary devices are null and void in translation as well (hyperbaton etc.). Trust me, I am insanely based.

>>17568113
thanks, you do sound extremely based

>>17568096
I am a based Chad philologist who fluently reads and writes Ancient Greek, Latin and Hebrew and speaks German, Italian and Russian. You are a cringelord Anglo pseud. YIKES.

>>17568107
>Literally all he does every day is reading greeks
Sounds like a pseud. You can finish all greeks in one year. The fact that you can't identify a pseud means you're stupid. The Greeks are lost on both of you.

>>17568149
>unironically saying stupid shit like this

>>17568154
Cope

>>17568162
You do know that scholars literally spent their lifetimes on analyzing the greeks, right?

>>17568169
Classicists are the lowest IQ academics because they're selected almost exclusively from private schools where they teach Greek and Latin so it's only posh rich kids who were forced by their parents to study to get into Oxbridge and allow them to brag to their friends. Most classicists only write feminist, marxist, and critical theory interpretations of the Greeks. They spend their entire lives parasiting the Greeks not analysing them.

>>17568193
Only classicists in the Anglosphere are leeches. We German-speaking countries maintain a clean philological tradition beginning with figures such as Möllendorf, Ritschl and Lachmann. We've been able to ward off the Anglo-American disease you've rightly mentioned.

>>17568214
Last post, best post. I appeared, claimed the thread as my own and look -- no more posters. This issue is settled once and for all. Only pseuds read translations of Greek authors. μὰ τὸν Δία! edepol, I am so based.

>>17568076
I'm currently studying Greek through Keller's Learn to Read Greek. I think it's the most fitting textbook for beginners.

>>17568343
Philologist, how do I learn Greek? Latin is rather straightforward, but six irregular principal parts for every verb is just unreasonable.

>>17568348
Firstly, thank you for having contacted the Based Department. Secondly, here: https://humanities-web.s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/classics/prod/2021-01/luw.pdf..
Start with a regular verb like λύω or παιδεύω. Closely study the endings in the indicative (primary endings -- o, eis, ei; omai, e, etai etc. --- and secondary endings (impf. on, es, e(n); omen, ou, eto, etc.). Memorise the latter. Learn about the sigmatic aorist (epaideuSa- I taught, began to teach) and verbs with a strong aorist (ballo, ebalon). Find a list with main verbs and their principal parts. It will be much easier to learn and memorise having learned what I've suggested. The subjunctive mood always includes a vowel lengthening (o mikron to o mega), the optative mood includes the diphthong oi (present) or ai (aorist). The latter two and their functions can be best learned by elementary close reading, i.e. Stobaios, speeches of Lysias, or the Apology.

>>17568346
Anne H. Groton's from Alpha to Omega is also a decent introduction. If you can read German, the only course on gottwein.de is also good, likewise the book Kantharos.

>>17568193
>Classicists are the lowest IQ academics
I know for a fact more men take up such positions than women so that can't possibly be true.

>>17568214
>>17568343
>>17568392
>>17568446
The only academic I've found on this board that I trust. Good stuff anon, thanks for helping us autodidacts out, when the academies burn I hope you'll be spared.

>>17568507
It's supremely easy for the arsonist to spare himself.

>>17568392
Thank you, Based Department. I suppose that there is some regularity to this kind of thing.
If you wouldn't mind, I'm a bit confused by how λαμβάνω plays into this. Its second principal part is apparently λήψομαι, which appears (to my untrained eyes) to be middle voice. Is this similar to semi-deponent verbs in Latin?

>>17568501
>I know for a fact more men take up such positions than women
Source?

>>17568214
Germany is the kikery pest hole. Are you even allowed to study Heidegger/Schmitt without a million disclaimers that they were bad nazis

>>17568343
you sound like the worst sort of autistic

>>17568542
Your intuition is correct. Take for example the verb βούλομαι, to want or desire, which appears in the medio-passive form in all tenses (βουλήσομαι, ἐβουλήθην, βεβούλημαι), yet retains an active meaning; others are semi-deponent, like βαίνω (to go, proceed), which has an active meaning in the future, yet retains a medio-passiv form (βήσομαι). This is common and must be, unfortunately for the learner, memorised. If you want to understand the reasons for this phenomenon, you'd have to ask a historical linguist of proto-Greek, which I am not.

>>17568580
My intuition because I see women tend to take up more modern and socially relevant positions.

>>17568598
Your intuition is wrong

>>17568595
>you sound like the worst sort of autistic
Indeed. The worse the better. Cope.

>>17568591
Say the Anglo pseud who has probably never left his home country. YIKES. Back to >>>/pol/

>>17568633

>>17568597
Ah, thank you for the clarification. Armed with this knowledge, I WILL learn Greek. First Attic, then Ionic, then Homeric. And I'll no longer have to rely on traditori traduttori.

>>17568633
travel is cringe and reddit

>>17568650
Good. Now get the fuck off 4chan and get to it.

>>17568591
>Are you even allowed to study Heidegger/Schmitt without a million disclaimers that they were bad nazis

Well they were bad nazis? Nothing wrong with a disclaimer, as long as the powers that be don't fire you for doing it.

>>17568591
kek yes. of course.
This is Germany not America we are talking about.

>>17568597
The reason it appears in medio-passive form in all tenses is because a verb like want or desire, must take an animate subject grammatically you pseud. Rocks don't desire anything.

>>17568679
Explain ἐθέλω, pseud.

>>17568597
Nicht um unhöflich zu sein, aber
all the shit you just laid out is exactly why i personally came to the conclusion even reading the texts in the original is an absolute waste and you will never actually understand what Heraklit or Aristoteles actually meant. (Wittgenstein sprachspiel etc.)
read plato for succinct simple philosophy but why bother with anything else ancient is beyond me. Even homer and co. are out of reach. Read Nibelungenlied, Parzifal, etc and experience them through wagner; this is undeniably superior than reading Aeschylus in your room pretending you can understand the Aorist.

>>17568683
lol, I'm explaining the origin of the medio-passive in a specific circumstance, there's no rule that says language needs to be consistent anon.

>>17568690
>Odi profanum vulgus et arceo.
Imagine being filtered by the aorist. YIKES.

Fair enough. All this banter is making me a bit hot and bothered. I want to wrestle a big oily man.

>>17568076
εἰ μὴ ἑλληνίζεις μήδ’ Ὁμήρου ἀνέγνωκας μήδ’ἄλλα μήδ’εἰς ταῦτα σπουδάζεις... ἄσωτος βάρβαρος εἶ

>>17568713
Καὶ ὀρθῶς γε λέγεις, ὦ βέλτιστε.

>>17568713
ἐβαστάχθης

>>17568701
you will never understand the full nuance of the ancient greek language(s) and this fact haunts your entire studies and your existence.

>>17568392
Philolochad... I kneel

>dude Greeks are great!
>but their message only makes sense if you read it in a dead language!
this just proves that their philosophies lack universality and are therefore useless

>>17568770
Yes, knowledge of antiquity and the nuances of the language are only approachable asymptotically and this simultaneously haunts, delights and motivates me. And?

>>17568770
You'll never fully understand the nuances of any language, not even your own. What's your point?

>>17568783
The Greeks are great because they don't need to muddy themselves with English, A*glo.

I would like to call attention to how lively and interesting this thread has become -- mainly due to my influence. A shout out to the OP for rolling out the red carpet for me with his question and allowing me to masterfully demonstrate that I am irrefutably very based. Another shout out to all the anons that have participated in my thread.

>>17568676
>Well they were bad nazis?
no they weren't. Especially Heidegger. Being in the natsoc party from the 30s-40s is like being registered a republican or democrat in the US. It's just a broad formality. Saying they were Hitlerist because they were in the party is pretty much like saying every republican inherently supports bushism.

>>17568076
Of course you will miss stuff, anon, but still I think you should read a translation. The value of these works transcends language and let's be honest here, you are most likely never going to learn ancient greek. Even if you do learn, by having read a translation your appreciation of the idiosyncrasies and subtleties unique to the language will only increase. Don't deprive yourself of such amazing works of art by giving yourself excuses, just go and read them.

>>17568676
>bad
No, they were protecting Europe from Judeo-Bolshevism.

>>17569360
no problem, I love making based chads being able to demonstrate their superiority
>>17569460
thanks anon, this genuinenly seems like the best advice

>>17569360
holy mother of cringe what kind of autism is this?

>>17569360
Upboated