/lit/ - Literature

The Satanic Verses - Rushdii

Bump

The Quran and some middle eastern history books

>>17448549

>>17448549
Quran and the Riyad us Saliheen

>>17448549
>tfw no Indonesian wife
I suffer....

>>17448814
NOOOOOOOOOOOO YOU CAN'T FUCK LITTLE GIRLS AND OWN SLAVES THAT'S WROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG

>>17448814
>may Allah kill me right now if he exists
what a fucking midwit

>>17448549
The Arabs in History, Bernard Lewis

It's a good intro

>>17448856
>See? Nothing.
Holy shit what a redditor

>>17448882
>The Arabs in History, Bernard Lewis
Not OP, but I bought Tim Mackintosh-Smith's 'Arabs'. I skimmed somewhat through the .pdf before and it seemed like a good book.

>>17448889
I dont get it, if I can taunt your god with no repercussion, why would I ever fear or worship him?

>>17448824
choice picks

>>17448937
Why would the repercussion be immediate?

>>17448937
>Heh. Where is your God now?
Go back 2 Reddit

>>17448549
Hagarism, by Patricia Crone

>>17448952
>>Heh. Where is your God now?
This but unironically. I'm openly mocking him, why isn't he stopping me?

>>17448949
Why wouldn't it be? Why would an omnipotent being need time to smite me?

>>17448937
Lol, trust me, this arrogance will come back to bite you unimaginably. Most are allowed some lenience to mess around in their life, but all of your actions are being taken account of, whether you believe it or not.

>>17448962
because you'll be tortured for all eternity haha

>>17448962
>"god is only real if he does things on my terms"

>>17448977
I'm omnipotent too but I'm not going to bother to show you. Bow down and worship me

>>17448977
Who are you quoting? All I'm saying is, why would I put any stock in a being who says "disobey me and I'll smite you" yet here I remain unsmited in my disobedience. Seems like that's all the proof you need that they're not real.

>>17448962
I know you're trolling but I'll bite for fun. Your logic is flawed as you project human assessments onto a divine, incomprehensible being. Your point is as sensible as saying "I just made a sandwich with bread and turkey, why doesn't my cat do the same thing?". You don't expect a cat to operate with the same nuances as a human, so why would God, who is far above humanity, subscribe to our inclinations? Keep in mind that any anthropomorphic descriptions of God in religious text are for the sake of accessibility for mankind, it is not an encapsulation of the divine essence.

>>17448988
God doesn't say "disobey me and I'll smite you", read the Qur'an, He says multiple times that if you choose not to worship it is your own loss, and that He has no need of you to worship Him. You seem misinformed on the nature of religion and man's relationship to God, so I am open to questions if they're sincere. But foremost you should understand that worshiping God is for the benefit of mankind, not to God's benefit.

>>17448997
This cuts both ways though since if god is incomprehensible he's just as likely to punish you for obeying him as to delay punishing me for not obeying him.

>>17449009
I'm confused then so god won't punish me if I don't follow him? Then why not be an atheist?

Start with the Bible. Then read quran with tafsir ibn Kathir.

>>17448549
Mohammed: 40 introductions

>>17449027
Are you actually confused or just being obtuse? The punishment comes in the afterlife

>>17449043
So god will punish me in the afterlife and >>17449009 is gibberish. Religious people are literally retarded

>>17448997
Aren't you the one trolling in insisting that your imaginary dad will come after me?

>>17448549
Read the Quran and listen to the Quran.
Read Tafseer Ibn Katheer. Full English translation is available online for free.
Read an explanation of Usool al Thalaatha by Muhammad Ibn Abdul Wahhaab.
Read an explanation of Kashf al Shubuhaat by Muhammad Ibn Abdul Wahhaab.
Read an explanation of Kitab at Tawheed by Muhammad Ibn Abdul Wahhaab.
Read an explanation of Aqeedah al Wasitiyyah by Ibn Taymiyyah.
Read an explanation of the 40 Hadeeth of an-Nawawi.
Read The Sealed Nectar. This is a book about the life of the Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him).
Read Al Fawaid by Ibn Qayyim.
Read Riyad as Saliheen by an-Nawawi.

These books will introduce you into the core aspects of true authentic Islamic creed. They are a very solid base for someone who seeks knowledge in Islam.

>>17449009
>so I created the world and it would be really cool if you worship me but if not that's cool too it's your choice I'm just saying though it's to your benefit and all, benefit being that you won't suffer from consequences I am also the originator of but it's not compulsion haha just do you

>>17449021
God as revealed books to mankind detailing some of His qualities and expectations for us. We are also born with an innate capacity for faith and connection with Him, so we may be guided even without a book. But a book from God is truly the best guidance. The incomprehensibility refers to our capacity for knowledge of him, for example, a botanist can know more about a flower than any human about God through any intellectual faculty. But He does make guidance simple for us to grasp, hence the constant references to His being "Most Merciful" in the Qur'an. And as for >>17449027 you certainly will be punished for disbelief, but the "why" of that is hard to explain to someone who is already reluctant to it. It's not that He needs you to worship, or that your worship of Him is mutually beneficial (as it only benefits you), but that the immense arrogance of disbelief is likely enough to warrant such a fate. That's my opinion at least, I don't actually know why disbelievers are punished, I just know it's a transgression and it is what it is. But don't dwell so much on that as how building a relationship with God will benefit your life gorgeously.

>>17449091
You're over-complicating it. I won't respond any further, I think I've given enough information for anyone who is sincerely interested to understand the point. Deliberate obtuseness is a weird trait to hold to.

>>17449009
I couldn't say for certain whether the Qur'an says so or not, but I am certain I've heard Muslims say that infidels will convert or die and that's the will of Allah. Why is it that Allah needs humans to do his converting for him? If Allah is real, why doesn't he just make me a Muslim? Shouldn't he have that power?

>>17449043
Why would I ever believe this? Why would I devote my entire being to a way of life based on the completely unfounded fear of some kind of punishment after death. I fear pain because I've felt pain, I fear wild animals because I've seen people killed by wild animals, I fear poison because despite never seeing someone poisoned, I've heard many firsthand accounts of poisoning. I have never met a person who has gone to hell or met another person who has gone to hell. Why would I fear something nobody has ever been hurt by?

>>17449113
He says in the Qur'an that He could have made all of mankind Muslims if He wanted to, but He chose not to. I can't recall if it's stated in the passage, but it's generally understood that the purpose of that is that it is a test for mankind, I think.

>>17449113
You don't dedicate your life to God for fear of punishment, it's because it is what your heart wants in life and will be satisfied by endlessly. You're focused on the wrong things anon.

>>17449113
>I have never met a person who has gone to hell or met another person who has gone to he
You rely on people telling you poison is bad even though you never truly experienced it, yet you dismiss what billions of people, from various beliefs, tell you about hell or other forms of punishment in the afterlife

>>17449112
No it's really quite simple. If there is a single first causal creator and originator of everything and he baked into his system that failure to worship him results in negative consequences then this isn't some incomprehensible only-god-knows situation, it is on the practical level a type of protection racket.

>>17449156
You talk haughtily for someone who very clearly has a misconstrued understanding of religion anon. Humility will go a long way for you if you let it. Trust I could go back and forth all day and I’m sure you’d sprout questions like weeds, but ultimately, if you really want to understand you have to accept that sincerity and humility are the only avenues to doing so. Maybe you’ll reconsider this conversation in the future?

>>17449126
How convenient that Allah can do all these amazing things yet chooses not to. Imagine how quickly the entire world would become Muslim if he simply chose to. Why hasn't he done that I wonder?

>>17449148
Because when I ask someone "have you ever been poisoned or know someone who's been poisoned" I can get concrete answers and details about the phenomena, and many people with firsthand or secondhand accounts. When I ask people "have you ever been to hell or know someone who's been to hell" I get no such response because there is no phenomenon to speak of.

>>17448814
Do you have part 2 of this?

>>17449201
>just be humble and believe in my headcanon
Why? Are you my local warlord? Do you promise me the riches of Rûm or Ifriqiya? The entire history of monotheism is tied to materially purposive community organization and maintenance of domination. Outside of this there is perhaps a world of direct religious experience, but this cannot be communicated through scriptural authority unless that authority is backed by some orthodoxy enforcement, because for every conscious mind there is a different world cut from the manifold, and scriptures are products of such minds, removed as they are from any direct experience.

>>17449355
>The entire history of monotheism is tied to materially purposive community organization and maintenance of domination
yes and? you a marxist or something?

>>17449009
hi muslim bro, i wanted to ask and discuss a lot but looking at the state of this website i dont think we will be able to have a nice discussion here with all these people around.
so any islamic book recommendations? also what do you think of praying 5 times

>>17449438
No it's just the case that this is what organized religion does, especially monistic or monotheistic religion. There's no proof to be made for your particular god in an environment where your priests do not have power to suppress, which is why I have to be told to be more humble or be called witch, it's a hint at violence just like delayed future punishment by a non-human lawgiver is. It comes down to pure belief. The logic is all ornamental now that the debate has been democratized.

>>17449490
>, i wanted to ask and discuss a lot but looking at the state of this website i dont think we will be able to have a nice discussion here with all these people around
Just go to my site, bro. Any reasonable people and discussions are welcome.

>>17449604
>just go to my site
Link?

>>17449645
home of lit
(DOT)
com
Currently only /lit/ is working and there's a permanent sticky there.
Go to catalog to see threads and make your own.
Also, it's still a work in progress as it's a hobby project and I don't spend much time on it.

>>17449681

>>17449802
Just dew it

>>17448854
You obviously didn't read the post, didn't even mention ayesha

Start with The Vision of Islam, Sachiko Murara and William Chittick. Was written as an intro to the religion, and is meant for a western audience, explaining things in a way they’d understand. Talks about the core beliefs, the practices and the philosophy of Islam

https://b-ok(dot)asia/book/3413709/4afb85

>>17449490
Hey >>17449604 is not me, I'm not sure what he was talking about. But if you're still around then praying 5 times daily is a tremendous benefit to my life. It's hard to consider how easily we would forget about God if we did not pray to Him consistently, as well as remember him in our hearts by other means. It strengthens one's bond with God in an indispensable manner, and while there are times that it can feel like a chore, it is always refreshing once it's been done. As for books, sadly I don't have many for introduction, I suppose Sufi Essays by Seyyed Nasr is good, but I don't consider myself a Sufi, it's just an accessible, univeralist intro to Islam and I think it can suffice for everyone. But all in all if you want to take Islam seriously I recommend practicing the exoteric sects, as their guidance is more clear and fruitful. The Qur'an is not a challenging text though, so if you feel truly intrigued, you may want to jump right into it, and looking up the "tasfeer"(interpretation) of each surah (chapter) when you are confused as to the meaning and or context, as this can be instrumental for comprehending certain verses. Hope this helps anon.