/lit/ - Literature

>>17369822
>What is essential anti-consumer literature?
Epicurus & Lucretius

>>17369822
This is literally everyone here but with books instead.

>>17369867
Hey man, I’m like 2 of these at most

>>17369822
I read some minimalist books, I found most of them to be extremely obnoxious and full of themselves.
One japanese minimalist book was a literal macfag, he was boasting about how he likes apple but it got worse and worse, I recall he mentioned he like to show off his apple products to show everyone else that he is a consoomer with good aesthetic choices or something like that. Fucking hell

>>17369822
>he wouldn't eat bugs
Lol you guys are all spooked out. Fried locusts are delicious.

>>17369958
Fumio Sasaki, no doubt.

Im a minimalist and found it very cringe

>>17369995
>Im a minimalist
youre white anon, have kids. minimalism isn't real.

>/lit/, how do I consume more to be anti-consoomerist

>>17369998
Keep buying into the life crafted for you, trad cunt

>>17369999
Your quads don’t make you any less of a retard for that comment

>>17369999
Based. Kys you posturing faggots

>>17369822
Walden

>>17369958

Minimalism is peak consoom? I think once they could start talking about their objects they already a consoumer.
It's funny, that not like I don't care about my appearance but the opposite. I care about my image more than other, even somewhat narcissistic. But because I can't afford 'real' objects that equal or above that of people around, I preserve myself by using an image where I'm not purchase anything at all, then I actually care less about objects, then I just dodged the consoom bullet.

>>17370008
"Minimalism" is also a crafted and marketed lifestyle

>>17369822

>>17370123
To some extents maybe, but it’s never marketed by corporations, because it’s directly against their interests. To consoom is to live for products, minimalism says there’s more to life

Stoicism

>>17369984
This. So long as they're the crunchy kind and not juicy grubs I'm not above entomophagy. 80% of the world's nations do already to some degree, all extant ape species do and humans have for thousands of years.Western bias against bug eating literally owes itself to Jewish kashrut dietary proscriptions against that sees eating "things that creep" as unkosher.

>>17369822
we. there's no we, shill. you don't consume, others enjoy their free will.

>>17369832
Baudrillard

>>17370095
To dodge consumerism, limit your purchases to those required by function.

i find the anti-consumer comes in two forms: the resentful poor guy who can't afford to consume so turns to slave morality to make not-consuming a virtue, and the spoiled rich guy who feels guilty for consuming things he knows he didn't earn and so projects this displeasure on everyone else. if i create value for society, damn right i'm going to consume the fruits of said society, deal with it.

>>17370397
american hand wrote this

>>17370397
This. It's pure virtue signaling.
>LOOK GUYS IM NOT A CONSOOMER LOOK AT ME IM NOT REDDIT DID I MENTION I DONT CONSOOM AND DONT COOM

>>17370320
>Consuming is free will

They got you bad

>>17370397
>i find the anti-consumer comes in two forms
What about people who are disappointed by the absence of sincerity? It's hard to know what someone believes or who they really are because of the many layers of consumerism that they adopt.

From Baudrillard's The Consumer Society

>What is shared, then, is no longer a ‘culture’, the living body, the actual presence of the group (everything which made up the symbolic and metabolic function of the ceremony and the feast), nor is it even knowledge in the proper sense of the term, but that strange corpus of signs and references, of recollections from schooldays and intellectual fashion signals known as ‘mass culture’, which we might term lowest common culture (LCC), the way one speaks of a lowest common denominator in mathematics. This is also akin to the ‘standard package’ which lays down the lowest common panoply of objects the average consumer must possess in order to accede to the title of citizen of this consumer society. The LCC lays down the lowest common panoply of ‘right answers’ the average individual is supposed to possess if he is to win his spurs as cultural citizen.

How are we supposed to honestly engage with our fellow man if we don't want 25 Marvel movies and post about how some Harry Potter character is LITERALLY ME? If you don't engage in modern consumer culture, it forms a massive barrier in terms of interpersonal relationships.

>>17370538
>don't want 25 Marvel
watch*

>>17370411
>>17370538
pretty much

>>17370493
There's no such thing as free will.

>>17370397
There's nothing bad about having material possessions. For me I just think that basing your identity around the things you buy and what brands you prefer is simply pathetic.

Minimalism is actually a form of consumerist repackaging in the digital age. It promotes a new form of our usal flow of goods, services and currency (i.e. exchange) more suitable for an almost completely virtual economy.
Minimalism has two tenets: a) only own what is absolutely essential; b) you must be intentional in your consuming habits.
These two axioms have several corollaries and entail several theorems, sub-theorems and lemmas, but I'm just going to focus on one: if you don't own anything, you have to rent (either equipment or people, usually both). This leads to an economy in which access to goods becomes a service instead of a normal transactions: companies provide access to objects/services and, this is the crucial point, it becomes easier to cut people out from this flux of goods and services. Not owning anything (this only applies to an industrial society, by the way, neolithic people [although they have nothing] cannot be minimalists) means always being on the brink of having your access cut to something. A man who owns a hammer can use it at his will, a man who rents a hammer needs to forever keep his popularity TM rating above 4.7 or else he won't find someone willing to rent it for him. This also means that you become a hostage to subscription services and, what worse's, to private normativity. Just look at steam: if your account is blocked, it's forever, you can lose thousands of dollars worth of games (licenses of games) due to one fuck up. Now imagine this is your entire life. The second tenet entails that you will have to pay an insurmountable amount of attention to the objects you do own. You become even more of a consumercuck, because if now people already think "should I buy this jacket? will it convey to others that I am a cool, adventurous person?", imagine if the itens you own are not easily disposable? Minimalism is a complete trap. You either become an anarcho-primitivist or accept this living hell.

>>17370605
>These two axioms have several corollaries and entail several theorems, sub-theorems and lemmas

>>17370538
i heard some parents write here on 4chan that they dont want to take their kids to church theyll just show them marvel movies.
Thats why hollywood keeps pumping out that shit, its some half baked religion nowadays.

>>17370397
poorfag here, does saving up for something better count as making not consuming a virtue?

>>17370634
Cope

>>17370605
I literally buy black T-shirt’s because they’re simple and I don’t care about fashion. I think you’re looking at it too deeply and lumping all minimalists into this trope of being more consumerists than consumers, which is fucked thinking when you think about it.

>>17369822
The Society of the Spectacle

>>17369822
>anti-consumer
cool basis for an identity. hope nobody tries to sell it to you.

just live your fucking life retard, healthy people do not fall into these traps and do not need to consciously reject them

>>17369822
The Bible but unironically.

>>17370721
Based enlightened poster

>>17370538
If you think not watching movies is a serious barrier to forming friendships i suspect you have no friends. Baudrillard is correct though.

>>17370709
You're probably in college, this post isn't for you.

>>17369822
marcuse and adorno

consumerism is a meme

>>17370745
>If you think not watching movies is a serious barrier to forming friendships i suspect you have no friends.
I do have friends but I stand by my point. If you opt out of mass culture then you lack many points of small talk that can be used to break the ice.

I'll give an example. Four strangers including myself were at a social meetup. Most of the discussions were about things such as the latest marvel movie, covid, some popular netflix show, and some popular podcast before it veered off to someone talking about photography for ages. At various points in the conversation it did divert into more personal topics that I could engage in but for the rest of the time you're effectively excluded because you can't discuss a scene from a movie that you haven't fucking seen.

You're essentially forced to derail the conversation to have a hope of joining it.

>>17369822
Uncle Ted's book I guess, IDK

>>17371191
so don't chill with pop culture chuds, i can't remember anyone i know talking about marvel movies

>>17371191
>Most of the discussions were about things such as the latest marvel movie, covid, some popular netflix show, and some popular podcast

This is just NPC chat topics. I only have those with people you interact with on a surface level. Very American style of chat. Removing pop culture will not improve that, it will just be replace with some other surface-level topic.

>>17371297
Right anon, when covid is over I'll just go out and look for the /lit/erati amongst the masses, simple. It seems like 19/20 people are those pop culture normies so it's inevitable that they're going to dominate every social event.

>>17371318
>Removing pop culture will not improve that, it will just be replace with some other surface-level topic.
I'm not saying that we should remove pop culture, but that if you don't engage with it you're effectively at a social disadvantage with everyone else and, let's be honest, many people who do reject pop culture are already at a social disadvantage with normies.

>>17371191
>normies are bland and talk about bland things
Stop the fucking presses! The worst part is that you could literally just read a summary of those movies and shows and have something to talk about, then possibly deviate the conversation into something more interesting, but you're a sperg.

>>17371337
>The worst part is that you could literally just read a summary of those movies and shows and have something to talk about
If anything this just reinforces my point that you view this as a reasonable suggestion.
>but you're a sperg.
Naturally, why else would I be complaining?

>>17371356
>>17371337
Also, imagine if that came up in the conversation.

>>Anon, remember that look X gave Y?
>Err, no. I've only read a summary of the movie so I could blend in amongst you fine folk

lol

>>17371319
>they're going to dominate every social event
tha fuck kinda social events are you going to? comic con? lmao

>>17371379
Anon, Marvel movies are normie-core. Everyone watches them.

If it's not Marvel movies then it's shit like Gogglebox. If you haven't seen it, it's a TV show where you watch other people watch TV. It's a cultural phenomenon in the UK.

>>17371379
It is pretty common in grad school. But the people in grad school are mental children, so it is not surprising. I hate it here.

>>17371393
really? ive never watched that trash in my life

>>17369822
Literally marxism, post marxism and frankfurt school.

>>17371329
Why do you wanna hang out with normies anyway?

>>17369822
classic: walden
contemporary: the life-changing magic of tidying up

>>17370397
>if i create value for society, damn right i'm going to consume the fruits of said society, deal with it.
This isn't what it means to be a consoomer. It's the same thing with coomer. A coomer isn't someone who just masturbates every now and then. A coomer is someone who lacks all self control and is addicted to cooming.

Similarly, a consoomer is someone who always buys whatever ads are targeted at him and gets upset when he's not following the latest trends. He's the reason everything is so shit, since he's the percentage of the population where "a need can be created through marketing", to paraphrase Steve Jobs.

He's the type of person who says unironically, "I didn't know I needed this until I saw this advertisement for it."

>>17371432
As I said in a previous comment, it's not like I can shine the bat-signal to find people like myself. You have to go to general social events through things like Meetup which are naturally going to be dominated by normies.

>>17370374
if you truly want to do this you have to reduce your income. money earned is always-already spent. it's just that "earn nothing day" doesn't have the same ring to it as "buy nothing day"

>>17371480
>bat-signal
Ah I get it now, you dislike the Marvel movies because you're a DC guy

>>17370538
baudrillard is referring something more along the lines of needing to own a refrigerator and stove and flush toilet

>>17370709
if you truly didn't care you'd be buying tshirts from a store that charges a flat rate by pound with no regard to color or design

>>17371534
Is there such a store that isn't just a wholesaler?

>>17371191
this is only a problem because you conceive of social interactions as a pissing contest for which you win by knowing more about a mass cultural product. in actuality most people are more than happy to tell you all about something they're interested in if you don't know about it and are willing to listen. you'll find you end up with way more friends this way too

>>17371519
>baudrillard is referring something more along the lines of needing to own a refrigerator and stove and flush toilet
In the book he develops the idea to say that it's not limited to goods. It can also be culture or even the absence of goods in certain circumstances.

Regarding your point about appliances.

>outside the field of its objective function, where it is irreplaceable, outside the field of its denotation, the object becomes substitutable in a more or less unlimited way within the field of connotations, where it assumes sign-value. Thus the washing machine serves as an appliance and acts as an element of prestige, comfort, etc. It is strictly this latter field which is the field of consumption. All kinds of other objects may be substituted here for the washing machine as signifying element. In the logic of signs, as in that of symbols, objects are no longer linked in any sense to a definite function or need. Precisely because they are responding here to something quite different, which is either the social logic or the logic of desire, for which they function as a shifting and unconscious field of signification.

Note how he distinguishes function from use?

>>17371566
That's quite an assumption. My point this whole time has been that pop culture is used as a language by people and thus, if you don't engage with it, it's much more difficult for you to make connections with people in the ice-breaking stage.

Somehow you've taken "it's hard to connect with people, I would like to connect with people" to mean "you think you're so much better than everyone? Fuck you".

lolwat

what you idiots always fail to understand is that modern consoomers for the most part fund their consumption habits using debt
those that consoom using their own money are even worse, since anyone with half a brain would prefer to invest that money rather than spend it on trifles and baubles

of course, exceptions can be made for those with a huge income or high net worth, but let's be honest: when we talk of consoomers, we mean the type in op's image

>>17371560
it would broadly fall under the term thrift or vintage. rarely are the clothes sold actually used, they're unsold retail goods. sometimes you find them when the original store tags still attached. stores that sell remaindered clothes have to discard much of what they buy because it's sold in huge lots so many stores will offer some kind of deal where you pay for unsorted clothes either by weight or by bag filled

too much self awareness will destroy us

>>17371604
you're complaining about not being able to connect with people because they're talking about (for example) a marvel you've never seen. but that has nothing to do with the people, your connection to them is your immediate interaction. it's entirely possible to talk about things of which you know little to nothing in a fun engaging fashion, otherwise education of any kind would be impossible.
>a person is talking about their interest, you talk to them about their interest in that interest

>>17371604
I'm not that other anon but I still think you're overstating the importance of pop culture as an icebreaker/conversation-starter. Like, you can connect with someone over anything

>>17371633
In that case why not just go to a regular thrift store? I don't need a trash bag full of shirts, I only need a few. There's a place near me that sells all articles of clothing for $.25, I can't really think of a better deal than that

>>17371611
what are you investing your money if not to be able to maximize trifle/bauble purchases

>>17371652
>it's entirely possible to talk about things of which you know little to nothing in a fun engaging fashion
When it comes to movies that are devoid of any artistic merit (so you're excluded from talking about themes) then you're left with asking questions, just a fucking litany of questions. Doing that once or twice is fine but if every conversation is about the same normie shit then eventually people will get tired of you discussing shit where you have nothing to contribute.

It's easy to talk about hobbies and stuff like that for the most part, and when you finally break through to that stage it's fine. On a 1:1 conversation I can do fine. It's when you have a group of people who don't know each other, things go to mass culture immediately and it's hard to break out of that shit.

>>17371670
>Like, you can connect with someone over anything
You are right but as I said before, if the group discussing mass media to pass the time then you've got to intentionally try and derail the conversation into something with more substance.

Maybe I'm missing something but in my experience, most normies don't have deep hobbies or anything of the like. Most of their time is occupied with work or mass media, whether that's movies, netflix, or sports. Those things on their own are enough for them to interact with each other. I disagree that the impact of mass culture is minor.

>>17371686
there isn't one, my original point was that only buying black shirts is neither based on economy or disregard for fashion

>>17371704
why don't you try, i don't know, asking people what they like about the marvel and why? this leads into all kinds of personal associations and suddenly now you're talking about them. this isn't rocket science you just have to be a decent listener

>>17371704
Oh my god just shut up you pretentious bitch

>>17371723
>asking people what they like about the marvel and why?
Really anon?

BRO, BIG EXPLOSIONS XD

That's the only merit of Marvel films and the like other than the good vs evil trope which is the foundation for most normie politics.

> you just have to be a decent listener
That only gets you so far. It also assumes they'll listen to you as well as you do to them which I find isn't the case very often.

>>17371743
see
>>17371732

>>17371743
>learning whether they value individualism to an unhealthy amount
>learning whether they consume content ironically or not
>learning what particular character they identify with most or enjoy the most
>learning what nuances of "humor" they prefer over other "humors"

You are so fucking bitter about a shitty mass conglomerate IP that you are refusing to understand even the most basic of communication theory. I'd tell you to read a fucking book, but it sounds like you do that too much already. Go outside.

>>17370275
>ackytchually, NOT eating bugs is Jewish
>quotes Jewish internal law in depth to make this point

>>17371770
>Go outside.
I would like to. My country has effectively been locked down for about 3-4 months now.

>>17370577
did you want to write your comment, idiot?

>>17371776
An offhand citation of a dietary law that everyone who has ever read the Bible would know isn't "quoting in depth," are you for real?

>>17371779
Man, you are great at making excuses

>>17371802
Pray tell how I am supposed to meet people when there are no social events in the country and we're only allowed to meet with one other household for outside exercise.

>>17369867
Except most people here (including faggots like OP who post gay memes about internet culture) don’t read anything at all because they lack an attention span and a sense of irony

>>17370397
Man, you really think you're smart. You see through all the bullshit. Man, you read people like an open book. You were born with a sociology textbook between your ass-cheeks. The way you expertly group people together into two extremes has got me feeling all kinds of ways.

>>17369822
Brave New World

>>17372367
Unironically yes. My IQ is at least 20 points higher than yours,cretin.

>>17370093
Waldun*

>>17369822
the frankfurt school

>>17370397
o wow a "everything is a psychological projection" reductionist

go fuck yourself

>>17371191
find better people.

>>17375020
Cope

>>17369867
I pirate everything bro

>>17375685
dude have you seen the prices of books?
Its ridiculous they cost the same as a ps5 videogame.

>>17369998
>>17370008
>>17370123
>>17370139
Just buy what you need cunts. It's that simple.

>>17369822
admit: you are shill and faggot.

>>17369822
'Hypothetically', the reason communism 'didn't work' in Russia is because Russia is full of Russians. The reason Capitalism worked in America is because it is full of Englishmen. The reason consumption is disgusting is because the consumers are disgusting. The reason why other higher forms of consumption aren't is because the consumer is not disgusting in that instance. All forms head towards perfection and any deviation away from perfection is disgusting. The perfection however isn't 'perfect' in our sense, since our conception of perfection is still imperfect. Our base instincts tell us that the fat ugly consumer is disgusting because in every sense he and everything he does is fat and ugly. It is both hyperalive and hyperdead, and is not conducive to life. It reminds us of death without reassurance. It is the desperate writhing of a beast about to enter into heaven from the cleansing fires of hell.

>>17372367
You too man, is that the point? One man laughs another man cries. Was the laughing man in a fit of fearful hysteria, about to lose his mind? Was the crying man not releasing tears of joy, from witnessing an event in a concrete form? Maybe the reverse is true.

>>17369822
Dialectic of enlightenment

none of you are self-aware enough to realize what the term 'consumer' is meant to apply to here

I also read like 2 comments in the thread

>>17369822

>>17376217
Surprised nobody posted this one for such a long time.

>>17369867
Wait are my books pirated? I thought I got them legally at Barnes and Noble. Are they supposed to have ads in them?

>>17369822
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_4MWHUZdiA

>I hate CONSOOMERS
>let me CONSOOM some books about anti-CONSOOMERS

>>17369867
Theres nothing wrong with reading books as long as you excercise discretion of what you read and moderation of the activity itself.

>>17370320
>choosing to consume is practicing free will
>choosing not to consume is...???

>>17369822
The Bible

>>17375685
this

>>17375020
agree
>>17370397
agree kind of