/lit/ - Literature

>>>/trash/

>>17276393
fuck you

false dichotomy

>>17276386
You don't have to choose, anon. People are unironically retarded. That is why I hate fucking logic. People overuse it in a wrong way to get into stupid 'true' conclusions.

Stop thinking like a highschooler

>>17276433
wdym u lowkey deadass

one can do both

>>17276386
I've spent a great deal of time with normies, whole thing is overrated. Experience is as hollow as imagination, sometimes moreso.

The real endpill is that there isn't any point to anything ,we simply exist as creatures that feed our innate biological needs. Some of us benefit more from social interaction and seek it out, others abhor it.

There is no virtue, we simply are. Nihilism is a sign of an ascendant sentient species, science allows us to strip the universe down to its fundamental truths and foremost among them is that the only purpose of life is the propagation of life itself, however one chooses to live it.

>I get high at parties therefore I have virtue
Now I've heard it all.

>>17276493
im afraid of life itself. So they are virtousous

>>17276386
no king ur fine

Kinda true I have a normoe friend ended school beginning of high school the guy quotes books I read almost to the letter just buy spit balling random shit while playing coop. I do think you need balance between the two or your going to end up limited

>>17276386
Based and Nietzsche-pilled

>>17276386

We yearn for the Other, even though the gap in between can only fade away through death - it is unending in life the distance we have from that which is not us. You could go out and live a supposedly fulfilling life, and yet it would still be missing inside your heart the moments of introspection and bookkeeping you hate so much at the moment.

Intelligence might be overrated, but so will be everything else, as long as you do not acknowledge and acquiesce your fundamental yearning.

You are not going to get anything special out of drinking and getting high either.

>>17276386
Experiencefags play with fallacies. Experience doesn't give you the knowledge nor wisdom, since it's your pathetic individual ego the one who is interpreting the experience. The way of philosophy and literature is changing the way of interpretation by replacing yourself with the perspectives of several different people, giving you a wider interpretation framework.

>>17276661
i will get experience
>>17276673
midwit cope

>>17276661
>>17276673
KEK reading about something vs experiencing it. Read C. S. Lewis a Grief Observed and draw your own conclusions. I would quote the book, but it is reasonably short.

>>17276685
And this is unironically something that feminists kinda get it right. It is quite different. Not to a point that you are unable to talk and reason about it, but you shouldn't have radical opinions about most things without checking them with your own experience.

>>17276673
What's the purpose of knowledge and wisdom?
The more you know the more afraid you get

Why is everything so extreme on this website? Why isn't it possible to do both? Why can't you read in your free time and experience life?

>>17276683
>>17276685
Midwit cope is thinking that your low IQ brain can examine a given experience with the same deepness of analysis as some of the best minds that have ever existed. Your experiences are useless. It doesn't matter if a gibbon does a worldtour in bicycle if the experience's perceiver remains a gibbon.

>>17276727
>What's the purpose of knowledge and wisdom?
To train you for death.

>>17276762
Because the faggots here are all shut-ins, which makes them think it's an either/or thing.
Also autism.

>>17276765
Written word has its bounds too, anon. Now you are being silly.

Go out and party if you want to OP, just don't fool yourself into thinking it's "virtuous" or that you're too good for books.

experiencefags are just coping because they're too lazy to read

>>17276765
Tell me about colour red in such a manner that it would be superior to actually experiencing it

>>17276865
Let's suppose you experience the color red. Ok what's its nature? how is it formed? what are his repercussions? is it a simple color or composed? etc.
See, your experience is useless, you cannot take any output from it more than an empty record in your memory.

>>17276865
R
RED
D
Red red red red red red red
Think about the color ( call of OR)
This is the front end psycho stimulation that you should be interpreting in the recreative wire

>>17276648
based and lacanpilled

>>17276493
>The real endpill is that there isn't any point to anything ,we simply exist as creatures that feed our innate biological needs. Some of us benefit more from social interaction and seek it out, others abhor it.
>There is no virtue, we simply are. Nihilism is a sign of an ascendant sentient species, science allows us to strip the universe down to its fundamental truths and foremost among them is that the only purpose of life is the propagation of life itself, however one chooses to live it.

Actual reddit take. I would legitimately not be surprised if you lifted that quote from your favourite Rick and Morty episode.

You guys all need to get over this "waah waah everything is meaningless waah waah". I swear to god every single person who is a "nihilist" needs to either off themselves or come up with something better. "life is meaningless googoo gaga". If life is so meaningless and empty and means nothing then why don't you just kill yourself?

Oh yeah every nihilist is just a loser pussy. Fuck off.

>>17276386
Nice diary entry OP, will you actually go do these things or is making a thread good enough for you?

sigh... experience means having sex right?

>>17276985
Literally 15 yo mentality right here, anons. Don't be like that.

>>17276393
ahahahahaha

>be OP
>probably early 20s realizing he's wasting his life on the internet
>make diary post on his favorite board
>realize that it's going to be hard going to parties during cov1d and having no friends
>return to normal routine after his dopamine hit wears off

read stirner. follow what the ego desires

>>17277086
Parties are annoying, anon. I never understood their appeal outside drinking and girls. Loud fucking music that is repetitive as hell, to a point that you can even talk to people, so it is as if someone is a fucking retarded stupid mongoloid that can only communicate by moves and looks. And you have to pay to enter, plus the booze is expensive. I'm ok with people liking it, but it is just not my thing. I would probably be ok being in one with people who know sign language. That seems reasonably interesting, but I don't know any of those. So it is also pointless. Yes, I'm fucking weird.

>>17276949
Let's say you have a manual describing the colour red in detail but you have lived your entire life in a black and white room.
Your overall knowledge of the colour red is 0. You would never be able to tell if something is red when you finally saw it.

>>17277114
*everyone turns into

>>17277114
And to make it worse I discovered other drugs reasonably early in life to a point that alcohol lost a good deal of its appeal.

>>17277128
You could guess it by knowing its properties. And your superficial knowledge is that of appearance, not of the essence, which is the proper object of proper knowledge.

>>17276424
>That is why I hate fucking logic. People overuse it in a wrong way to get into stupid 'true' conclusions.
Chesterton talks about this in the second chapter of Orthodoxy. Interesting that you came to exactly the same conclusion.

>>17276386
I understand your point when I translate as a conflict between rationalism and experience, but I don't see how books solely represent the former.

>>17277098
What the ego desires is often deceitful, self-destructive, and against your best interest. You can’t trust it. Read the Bible.
>The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately sick; who can understand it?

>>17276424
This
Logic is overrated

>>17276386
>>17277393
Literature sheds light on experience. When you read a book conveying the same reality you have also noticed in real life, you start making connections and deriving universal principles out of it.
Human beings have always been the same, after all.

>>17276985
>everything is meaningless
>life is meaningless
>if life is so meaningless and empty
I'm not even a nihilist and I know this isn't what they think

>>17277403
>What the ego desires is often deceitful, self-destructive, and against your best interest. You can’t trust it.
Yet you trust it enough to read the Bible.

>>17277455
Wisdom>desires of the heart.
Besides, I am not talking abstractly here. I have done a lot of stupid, self-destructive shit in my youth by following that very philosophy of “do as your heart desires”.
The following statements become obvious with age:
>what you desire is not always what is good for you
>you only truly appreciate what you have once you have lost it
>what you feel like doing is most often what is bad for you
>what you don’t feel like doing is most often what is best for you

>>17276985
> then why don't you just kill yourself?
Because death is just as meaningless as life. If you provoke it earlier than it's time it means you value death more than life which isn't the case if you think that everything is meaningless.

>>17277529
That worldview and mentality always leads men to bad paths. “Ye shall know them by its fruits”.
This is why you should never use your logic abstractly as >>17276424 pointed out.

>>17277561
>bad paths
To you maybe.

>>17276393

Bruh you can't experience everything, that's part of reading. Reading about things you may never experience or drawing parallels to your own life. No one is saying to do nothing at all like a basement dweller. What with chantards and dichotomies

>>17276386
>tfw you realize reading is a form of experience

>>17276493
>Nihilism is a sign of an ascendant sentient species, science allows us to strip the universe down to its fundamental truths and foremost among them is that the only purpose of life is the propagation of life itself, however one chooses to live it.
You have to be 18 to post here

>>17276493
Based af

>>17276493
>science allows us to strip the universe down to its fundamental truths
Lol. They notice patterns which help them determine roughly what we might be able to expect in the future. Understanding these patterns is helpful but I would hardly call that stripping the universe down to its fundamental truths.

>>17276493
>the only purpose of life is the propagation of life itself
That's the process that led to the set of goals humans have, which are often at odds with propagating life in our modern environment. The process that created these goals does not have a purpose anymore than a heavy weight's "purpose" is to reach the center of the earth.

>>17276493
>science allows us to strip the universe down to its fundamental truths
> science
> fundamental truths
Pick one

>>17277871
>>17277895
Based

>>17276386
>A person getting high and drinking every weekend at a party is more virtuous than a loner shut in weirdo.

I hate to break it to you kid but most of the hardest partying people become losers by their late twenties, and the worst thing is that they can't even remember half of their youthful exploits because they were high all the time.

>>17276386
> mindless hedonism >>>>> intellectual pursuits
- OP

>>17277892
The process that created the goal is coping with death -- at least in the context of people who see reproduction as having "meaning" or "purpose".

>>17276386

You need both experience and reflection, neither would work alone.

>>17276433
/thread
kill yourself OP

>>17276386
>he hasn't read Rabelais

>>17277035
>>17277429
>>17277529

Oh I’m sorry do babies want a bottle? A big bottle for big baby?

>>17278456
KEK unironically underage.

>>17276386
I stopped going to parties so I could stay at home and be comfy and read books, unironically. I turned down invitations to them so I could read and acquire knowledge. I eventually stopped getting invited out and succeeded in alienating everyone I ever knew but it was worth it in the end. Normies can unironically die in a fire. Also, you are not missing out on what you think. It's not some mystery festival of bachinalic wisdom, it's just a bunch of stinky drunk people stumbling over each other, thirsty retards hitting on women, awkward faggots pretending to enjoy themselves, the whole thing is a complete meme. No one even likes partying. No one. It's a sham.

>>17276985
show me something you think is meaningful ill try not to laugh.

>>17276493
Uh-oh, based alert.
>>17276985
>NOOOOOOOOO!!!! I'M SPECIAL AND MY LIFE HAS VALUE!!!!!!!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>17278485
Sticking your cock in a fat juicy cunthole. That's the only meaning in life.

>>17276386
I learned from a pretty young age that I was going to live a relatively lonely life. I never liked having groups of people around, always preferred doing things on my own. Until recently I maintained a small group of friends online (though I met them IRL) but even that got to be grating. I made a small effort in university to meet people and "have experiences" but they were all let-downs. Meeting new people, doing things with them, going to parties, having a job, etc. Even had a girlfriend for a few months. All I could think about was how much they sapped my energy. I didn't really long for their company in any capacity (beyond sex from my girlfriend). I dreaded their texts inviting me to do things with them and tried time and time again to think of failsafe excuses to get out of social obligations without causing offence. I thank GOD for covid sweeping in when it did. It gave me the perfect opportunity to decline all contact with everybody (that and I moved across the country to live with my parents and finish university online). I don't know if there's something "wrong" with me or if I'm simply on the extreme end of introversion. Books provide me with easy, comfortable, and enjoyable access to experiences that I'll likely never have. I quite enjoy READING about interpersonal dynamics and people interacting with each other and with the world at large despite dreading any such experiences in my real life- that and books are an infinitely better use of time than vidya. I am routinely disgusted by things I see in the world, so I'd really prefer to limit my contact with it as much as possible.

>>17278473
>No one even likes partying. No one. It's a sham.
I think people like outwardly displaying that they're enjoying themselves, even if they're not. Similarly to you I had people CONSTANTLY hounding me to go do things with them. Parties were largely a hellish experience for me and I don't miss them one bit.

>>17276673
>>17276765
Hypocrite that you are, for you trust your pathetic individual ego to tell you who are the best minds to have ever existed. All knowledge is ultimately based on that which we cannot prove. Will you fight? Or will you perish like a dog?

>>17278550
>>NOOOOOOOOO!!!! I'M SPECIAL AND MY LIFE HAS VALUE!!!!!!!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
t. no reading comprehension
His point is life has value so he does not need to be """special""" for it

>>17278634
Yes Normies want above all else to signal to over people that they are NORMAL and that they enjoy and are doing NORMAL things and aren't WEIRDO LOSERS who do WEIRD things like stay at home drinking a nice cup of tea and reading a good novel or practicing an instrument or any other simiklarly fruitful activity. Normies can't simply go to a party or do anything at all and enjoy it for what it is, as an end in itself, no, they have to take pictures of them ENJOYING themselves, so much that they spend more time taking pictures of themselves ENJOYING themselves and LIVING LIFE TO THE FULLEST BRAH that they end up not enjoying themselves, being so preoccupied with maintaining the illusion that they are in fact enjoying themselves. I hate normies so much it's unreal. They should all fucking die.

>>17278618
I don’t think your disposition is good, but damn do I find it relatable. I crave for a spiritual and intellectual intimacy I can only find in the authors of the books I read. Somehow real human beings, with their tendency to disappoint and betray, won’t do.

>>17278618
>>17278752
I don't think it's so wrong. The problem probably doesn't stem from you being weird or lonely, but you being bored af, because you're living like a king in the modern world. If you worked twelve hours a day, you wouldn't care about such things. Make sure you got other areas of your life figured out (namely, money and material survival), and you and "normies" may meet each other again at the end of the road, in the later half of life.

>>17278705
>I hate normies so much it's unreal.
While this is justifiable, I tend to pity them instead. They're squandering their finite existence worrying about how they appear to people who hate them. They scrape and claw for a scrap of attention from equally vapid and valueless people. They'll plaster themselves with tattoos and funny labels in a futile attempt to be authentic. Their entire life as a ruse. A farce. They'll live and die as spiritual nothings, which is pitiable.
>>17278752
The best way to deal with that craving (in my experience) is to fully internalize the impossibility of satiating it. I don't expect anything from other people and am therefore pleasantly surprised on the odd occasion. Better to live like that than to spend your life clamouring for something that probably doesn't exist. You have no soulmate. Not because you're flawed and unlovable, but because soulmates don't exist.
>>17278789
Boredom is currently the prime evil in my life. Certain circumstances (mainly related to covid) prevent me from pursuing other things that I think will increase my well-being and life enjoyment.

>>17276386
https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/uD9TDHPwQ5hx4CgaX/my-childhood-death-spiral

>My parents always used to downplay the value of intelligence. And play up the value of—effort, as recommended by the latest research? No, not effort. Experience. A nicely unattainable hammer with which to smack down a bright young child, to be sure. That was what my parents told me when I questioned the Jewish religion, for example. I tried laying out an argument, and I was told something along the lines of: "Logic has limits, you'll understand when you're older that experience is the important thing, and then you'll see the truth of Judaism." I didn't try again. I made one attempt to question Judaism in school, got slapped down, didn't try again. I've never been a slow learner.

>Whenever my parents were doing something ill-advised, it was always, "We know better because we have more experience. You'll understand when you're older: maturity and wisdom is more important than intelligence."

>If this was an attempt to focus the young Eliezer on intelligence uber alles, it was the most wildly successful example of reverse psychology I've ever heard of.

>But my parents aren't that cunning, and the results weren't exactly positive.

>For a long time, I thought that the moral of this story was that experience was no match for sheer raw native intelligence. It wasn't until a lot later, in my twenties, that I looked back and realized that I couldn't possibly have been more intelligent than my parents before puberty, with my brain not even fully developed. At age eleven, when I was already nearly a full-blown atheist, I could not have defeated my parents in any fair contest of mind. My SAT scores were high for an 11-year-old, but they wouldn't have beaten my parents' SAT scores in full adulthood. In a fair fight, my parents' intelligence and experience could have stomped any prepubescent child flat. It was dysrationalia that did them in; they used their intelligence only to defeat itself.

>But that understanding came much later, when my intelligence had processed and distilled many more years of experience.

>The moral I derived when I was young, was that anyone who downplayed the value of intelligence didn't understand intelligence at all. My own intelligence had affected every aspect of my life and mind and personality; that was massively obvious, seen at a backward glance. "Intelligence has nothing to do with wisdom or being a good person"—oh, and does self-awareness have nothing to do with wisdom, or being a good person? Modeling yourself takes intelligence. For one thing, it takes enough intelligence to learn evolutionary psychology.

experience means partaking in the ineffable mystery of Reality.
Discursive mind/thought can never touch that height

I turned to books after I got bored with taking drugs, sleeping with women and traveling.

>>17276386
We're in lockdown, no parties taking place

>>17276386
I realised this late, but maybe just in time. I'm taking action. Be the person of action, anon.

>>17276386
Unironically true. I just moved to a new city in the middle of covid too and I have no idea how to make friends. All I do is read books and practice piano and go to work. I'm doing absolutely nothing with my life and everyday is total emptiness.

>>17276727
>The more you know the more afraid you get
That's not true. Knowledge is power. The more you understand the world the less you fear it.

>>17278485
Your relationship with other people here on earth, and what happens to your soul after you die...

I agree but you see, I'm ugly, skinny and very weak. I also live in a small town in a third world country and I have no friends and I've been bullied so much throughout my short life I've lost all interest in people and have become so cynical and paranoid I cannot trust anyone at all.

>>17276386
>Intelligence is overrated
Based. I wish I hadn't wasted so many years inside.

>>17276386
Jokes on you I haven't left my house in weeks and I also smoke weed and drink every day.

>>17278618
just fuck right off, ik would kill for the golden opportunities you've been given on a platter you fucking white privladge is showing

>>17276386
Getting fried is all well and good, but the up usually isn't worth the down imo

>>17276386
Reading a book is an experience, dummy

>>17276386
>A person getting high and drinking every weekend at a party is more virtuous

No they are not. They participate in the opposite end of the spectrum but to pretend they find any more value or experience in these acts in life is plainly false and highlights the insecurity in your own life.

>>17279892
you needed experience to come to that conclusion.

desu every time I smoke weed I go
>ohh...this again
and then wait for it to wear off or go to sleep

>>17276865
You don't need to see red to experience it. If the experience of red is not actually the color red but our perception of it being red, simply alter the perception. If you describe red to a blind person, you can describe it however you like. A blind person still has red blood flowing through their entire body, in their brain, in their eyes.

>>17277114
That is precisely the appeal

>>17279964
Yes, but you can't talk to them. What is the point, anon?

>>17276386
You can do both retard.

>>17279972
Not really. The more you read the less you want to engage in that kind of lifestyle

>>17279967
There are more ways to communicate cardinal desires than spoken word, anon. And if you don't like those types of "parties" then you go to parties that you can hear people, or that there's a patio outside.

>>17279964
As in you can dance together, but any conversation you have to be shouting shit. Then you might end up 'getting lucky' with someone and making out, but later you get that it doesn't matter because she is fucking annoying. And both are incompatible.

>>17279835
seethe

>>17276393
Keyed

>>17276424
Based and Nietzschepilled

>>17276386
Why do the jannies always delete okay threads but leave garbage threads like this up? I saw this thread when it went up and thought the jannies would take care of it, but nooooo, they'd much rather delete other shit.

>>17280532
There are worse shit than this, anon.

>>17280532
J*nnie deleted my thread about nihilism but they leave this incel garbage up. Absolute donuts all of them

>>17276386
You're wrong.

t. Worked hard and played hard from age 12 to 26 and have done nothing but read and shitpost for the last 4 years

This is the better life.

Reading is the most worthwhile experience of all if you bring enough experience and thought of your own to it.

>>17281382
Based take

>>17276683
>i will
Yeah, keep making promises for yourself. If you are not saying 'I am having experiences' then it's just cope. Not different than a shut-in.