/lit/ - Literature

>>17242894
Dialectical Materialism and Marx

>>17242894
Marxism unironically

>>17242900
>>17242904
No

>>17242900
>>17242904
Brainlet take. Materialism as an ideology is hostile to religion, by definition. Not to mention Christianity is against the idea that the ends justify the means, he would find the idea of a violent revolution where thousands of innocents suffer and die in hopes of a secular utopia to be abhorrent.

Definitely Marxism

>>17242934
>Materialism as an ideology is hostile to religion, by definition.
Implying it doesn't ALWAYS devolve into cult of personality or devotion to the Party.
>against the idea that the ends justify the means
Unless done by/in the name of God.

>>17242894
in his light, they all seem empty, don't you think?

Kant

>>17242970
>Worshiping atheist dictators = worshiping God
I'm starting to think you might actually have a room temperature IQ

>>17242987
this. Christ is the Truth.

>>17242987
Thanks

>>17242900
>>17242904
>>17242934
>>17242937
>>17242970
>>17243043
Remimder that Marx is literally Satan

>>17242987

>>17243153
see >>17244061

>>17242894
Bump

>>17242894
The Parmenides would have been his favourite dialogue as philosophy has never so intimately flirted with the truth, i.e., Christ himself, since.

None

>>17242894
The one which unfold in your quiet time and prayers. Amen.

>>17242894
The one which unfolds in your quiet time and prayers. Amen.

>>17242894
Kant. Marx and Nietzsche in some regards but absolutely not in others, the others would make Marx and Nietzsche the devil. Marx would be a well-intentioned devil, critiquing everything Jesus supported for reasons that are ultimately on the same wavelength, an example of being led astray but not desiring after wickedness. Nietzsche on the other hand would be the seductive devil who has a really good form of godliness but is actually most opposed to it, on purpose. His closeness in other regards are why he's dangerous.

>>17242894
>"It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter heaven"
>"The meek shall inherit the Earth"
>“The last shall be first and the first last”
100% Marxism

>all the marx shills itt
read hegel already, that nigga actually understood christianity.

>>17243153
Friendly reminder that Satan is the one who granted us free will, had it been left up to God, we'd be unthinking drones. Satan is unironically the hero of the Bible.

>>17244676
humans chose free will, as paradoxical as that sounds.

>>17244692
Had Satan not intervened, humans would not have free will.

>>17242894
obviously Kierkegaard

>>17244705
This is incorrect. Eve had the choice to, and in fact disobeyed God even before she ate the fruit. She did not acquire free will by eating the fruit. It was the choice, born of her free volition, that led her to eat the fruit.

He didn't say most of what is attributed to him. He's a meme.

>>17242900
>>17242904
>>17242937
Thinking Jesus would like Marxism is such a blatant sign of knowing nothing about him or his teachings whatsoever that it's almost laughable/horrific to think that the people who wrote these posts might actually think they're intellectuals

Aquinas, Augustine, Bonaventure, Duns Scotus, Boethius, some Plato, Aristotle, etc.

NOT MARX

>>17242894
Nietzsche

>>17242894
first, Jesus has open heart chakra, he does not use word "to like", unless as a joke. he sees.

second, philosophers are stupid faggots, blind, that is why they argue living in the same reality.

and, unironically, the only man of that kind who could be my disciple was Nietzsche, he was very honest, and brave. Eine gerade linie, ein ziel, this is exactly what I, Krishna, Castaneda taught: impeccable action. it cures shame, guilt, doubt: sin. surrender to your decision. anger overcomes psychological block. unbending intention.

and the rest are stupid faggots, you including, virtue signalling morons.

>>17242894
Ellul and Girard

>>17242894
John Ruskin

>>17242987
keyed and locked

>>17244774
No. They didn't even know what was going on. They ignorant before the apple. Also the existance of a god implies determinism. Thus, free will cannot truly exist if god exist

>>17245546
They were*

>>17242894
If Christ lived 400 years after Aristotle why didn't he talk about how he was right?

>>17244797
Actually, I'm just playing a little bit with the other retarded anons who actually think Jesus would be a socialist. Fuck them honestly.

>>17242900
>>17242904
Not materialism but he would be inherently socialistic

>>17244774
The apple literally gives the knowledge of good and evil. If you do not have that knowledge, you cannot make choices. In fact, it's pretty nonsensical of God to hold Eve and Adam accountable for disobeying him when it's made very clear they did not know good from evil at the time of the "choice". A servant of the Lord told them it was okay to eat it, and they did.

>>17245618
>"Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.""
He directly calls for those who own things to sell them and improve the conditions of the poor. This is his general message to everyone: don't own possessions, help the poor and follow Jesus. This is honestly pretty much pure communism.

>>17242894
Communism / Anarchism

>>17242894
Stoicism has enjoyed extreme popularity with Christians for a long long time. I personally think he would also have enjoyed Lao Tse's passages about youth.

>>17242900
>>17242904
People don't tend to think so, and indeed Christ wouldn't have liked everything Marx had to say, but Jesus could end up siding with Marx on a few things that would surprise them. For instance, a deeper understanding of Christ shows a very anti-metaphysical man, willing to challenge common tropes about God. Although Marxists have done horrible things to Christians, Christians often say that being saved isn't about filling big shoes, but fitting your life into something that feels too small at first. In this sense, Marx's insistence upon dialectical materialism might seem to hold out promise for Christians willing to bend a bit of orthodoxy in the name of humility. But on the other hand, dialectical materialism tries to fit everything into one paradigm (materialism). Jesus would hate that, because the central part of his philosophy is that there are two paradigms the spirit, and the world, so nobody has to just blindly accept the world's paradigm because it's not the only one.

Overall, I think Jesus would approve of few philosophers; the very idea of making definite statements about human life, makes life cheap and less sacred.

>>17242894
Ellul

>>17244676
wtf I love Christianity now? Fuck free will

>>17242894
Heidegger

>>17242904
>Jesus Christ would've liked a philosophy that denies the existence of God, providence and Logos in favor of historical materialism and dialectics
Christ taught to love and obey God in all things. Why do you think he'd find a philosophy that rejects God and literally attempts to rebuild the tower of Babel through Human power alone appealing?

>>17242904
He couldn’t be socialistic because it doesn’t allow the individual free will. He would be for the free market 100% but of course it only works with righteous people who don’t abuse it

>>17242894
Christ definitely read Plato.

gnosticism.

>>17246614
yes the guy who who said to sell all your belongings and to hate the world would be a free market demiurge meat eater

fuck off hylic shill

>>17246666
“For it will be like a man going on a journey, who called his servants and entrusted to them his property. To one he gave five talents, to another two, to another one, to each according to his ability. Then he went away. He who had received the five talents went at once and traded with them, and he made five talents more. So also he who had the two talents made two talents more. But he who had received the one talent went and dug in the ground and hid his master's money.

Now after a long time the master of those servants came and settled accounts with them. And he who had received the five talents came forward, bringing five talents more, saying, ‘Master, you delivered to me five talents; here, I have made five talents more.’ His master said to him, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant. You have been faithful over a little; I will set you over much. Enter into the joy of your master.’ And he also who had the two talents came forward, saying, ‘Master, you delivered to me two talents; here, I have made two talents more.’ His master said to him, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant. You have been faithful over a little; I will set you over much. Enter into the joy of your master.’ He also who had received the one talent came forward, saying, ‘Master, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you did not sow, and gathering where you scattered no seed, so I was afraid, and I went and hid your talent in the ground. Here, you have what is yours.’ But his master answered him, ‘You wicked and slothful servant! You knew that I reap where I have not sown and gather where I scattered no seed? Then you ought to have invested my money with the bankers, and at my coming I should have received what was my own with interest. So take the talent from him and give it to him who has the ten talents. For to everyone who has will more be given, and he will have an abundance. But from the one who has not, even what he has will be taken away. And cast the worthless servant into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

>>17246690
metaphor
he hated money
read the bible shill
he said hate the world

>>17246586
Being a slave/sheep is a core aspect to Christianity.

>>17244676
t. Promethean spirit
Fuck off demon

>>17246133
nope. you stupid faggots got all wrong.

Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's

>>17245546
God knowing the outcome of all possible choices and paths does not in any way mean that you aren't free to make those choices or walk those paths.

>>17246061
Both Adam and Eve were already aware that disobeying God wasn't a good thing, hence their reluctance and Eve's questioning of the serpent before taking the fruit. The knowledge that the tree provided must have been some kind of gnosis, bc even before she ate the fruit, Eve implicitly thought it was good, bc she clearly thought that living forever was a good thing and Gen 3 clearly states that she saw that the fruit was good for food and found it a delight to the eyes and found the wisdom it would grant her.

Gotta go with Marxism here for sure.

>>17246614
>He couldn’t be socialistic because it doesn’t allow the individual free will.
?? ???
for the love of God do not tell me you think the free market is the same as moral freedom

This >>17242987
But also the Lord loves all his creations so he would love all philosophers.

>>17242987
Yes, though they're still necessary to read.

>Communism is just Christianity, but "BIG"
>Marxism is just Christianity, but only the ethics
I don't understand how someone can be a reader and not learn to think.

>>17248537
Jesus would convert to Marxism is he was alive today

>>17249246
No, you'd literally have to be retarded to believe this.

>>17249262
Says the Christian

>>17249277
Says the Marxist.

>>17249277
Kek'd and check'd

>>17244676
No, since Adam and Eve chose to eat the fruit. If they didn't have free will to choose, that means God would have led them to eat the fruit, and them receiving the knowledge of the good and the evil was destiny, which calls the whole ''freedom'' into question, since it means God crafts destinies of the world. Idea that Satan gave man free will is Gnostic/masonic idea, and its completely retarded.

Isaiah Berlin

>>17249314
Mate, I had just as good a statement and dubs as he did (if not better), where is my "kekked and checked"?

Actually, I did have better, because I had dubs two times in a row in this thread.

>>17249277
>>17249300

>>17249314
Mate, I had just as good a statement and dubs as he did (if not better), where is my "kekked and checked"?

>>17249553
christcucks get no check

Hey /lit/ any anons that have spent a long time away from religion(Christianity/Catholic) and came back later how did you do it? I' don't remember most of the etiquettes and prayers like the rosary etc. Any books to prepare yourself for your return?

>>17249882
the rosary and worshipping mary isn't christian, it's good you forgot it

>>17242894
Osho

>>17244669
pretty retarded take
neck yourself

>>17249482
well.... what do you think of the myth of prometheus which is in essence a more archaic version of lucifer.

>>17250707
Different myth of a different religion, gods and characters are so different that similarities are only on surface.

>>17248206
>The tree of the knowledge of good and evil
>B-but they... uhh they already kind of had it...
The mind of the apologist never ceases to amaze me

>>17249482
You're beginning to understand how retarded the concept of "Freedom" or "Free will" is when you consider the entire rule structure and starting point were created by an all powerful deity.

>>17250700
Jesus would not like your post, anon :)

The fact that people mentioned Plato before Pascal and moralism in general shows how 90% of anons have read nothing beyond what /lit/ told them to.

>>17251419
from my understanding of things american education is too focused on technical/scientific subjects so a large number of people here don't really have an idea of much of western thought. I think that a good battle american /lit/erati could fight could be aimed at the introduction of philosophy in high school. I would even go as far as proposing a more european approach to secondary school but I don't really have the pros and cons in my mind rn.

>>17251126
>Retarded
Not really, not in Christian scheme of things, where God created the world to be free. If creation binds the God or the creation into some destiny that would contradict his omnipotence.
In pagan religions on the other hand gods are bound by fate, and so is the rest of the universe.

>>17252042
If God created man to be free, why didn't he encourage man to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil? How could you ever be truly free without that knowledge? And why would he punish the acquisition of that knowledge? It's all completely retarded, it doesn't even pass muster metaphorically.

>>17242900
Maybe not Marxism but certainly Utopian Socialism. Any reply screeching about how Jesus would actually be BASED AND ANTICOMMUNIST is cope

>>17244676
>>17244990
Isn't it interesting to see the new forms that the edgelord takes in this world increasingly deprived of ideas that are truly reviled.

>>17252088
By that logic its impossible to be free, and it becomes stupid to blame the God for restricting something that doesn't exist. Other possibility would be that the one free being is a tyrant because of his absolute freedom. Solution could be a hivemind, but nobody with any brains would call that freedom.
I'm not familiar how the fruit of knowledge is interpreted. Far as I know the fruit was there so humans could exercise their freedom to distance themselves from god, and feel free to see its consequences, which weren't good. The fruit itself or knowledge wasn't evil, in Christian worldview God created everything, and it was good, there was nothing evil, why Adam and Eve were punished is because they broke the Gods commandments. You could call it cruel to be punished from that, but would you be free if you can't experience the consequences of your actions.
>>17252101
Jesus would just tell everyone that true wisdom is following Gods commandments.

>>17242894

buddha
plato
confucius
schopenhauer ironically
david henry thoreau

jesus would have been a frugal living advocate

he wanted people to live like the birds and not care about food, clothing and shelter because god will take care of them.
he basically advocated for voluntary poverty which doesn't sound very socialist or communist or capitalist

if you believed the world was gonna end in your lifetime possessions don't matter and many of the early christians didn't give a shit about possessions and thought the world was gonna end soon

>>17252101
>Utopian Socialism.
That point needs to be stressed though, it is small scale voluntary socialism. It has nothing at all do with any seizing of means. I do agree that trying to make Jesus into a capitalist is even more absurd though.

the early christians were kind of socialistic

jesus was more of a voluntary poverty frugal living advocate who told people to give their possessions away(Which is not something a socialist advocates for)

socialists want to uplift people out of poverty and give them basic services

jesus wanted people to be poor(give away their possessions) and be satisfied with it

this is why jesus was not a socialist

jesus's stance on healthcare would have been "who gives a shit if you die. you will go to heaven. do not fear death"
i don't think he would have called for universal healthcare like liberals claim

>>17252631
exactly. Jesus was all about individual, spiritual change chosen for oneself, not systemic, structural change enforced extrinsically.
he explicitly declined to become a 'worldly' revolutionary when the people would have followed him to the ends of the earth if he'd taken up the sword. that by itself deboonks the Jesus would have been a Marxist meme.

>>17251111
Are you blind or are you stupid? Do you not understand the difference between gnosis and ordinary everyday knowledge?

Augustine
Luther
Kierkegaard

>>17242894
he loves everyone

>>17244676
Based, this is precisely why c*tholic "theology" is inferior to the teachings of John Calvin (pbuh)

>>17242894
Aquinas is the obvious answer here

>>17252631
he wouldn't have cared about covid killing 90 years old that's for sure

>>17242894

Unironically Nietzsche

>>17242987
Yes

>>17253728
>>17244676
What a disgusting and terrible take.

>>17246093
>free choice of charity vs state enforced redistribution
Ah yes these are the same things!

>>17254856
Ah, I see you favor being a slave.
>>17254865
Jesus clearly viewed owning property as a flaw. This is why he states if you wish to be perfect, you would sell all your possessions.

Requesting an essay about how Jesus would have been a Marxist please.

>>17254910
>This is why he states if you wish to be perfect, you would sell all your possessions.
Yah and where does he say he wants the state to force this choice on you?

>>17254910
boomer meme time