/lit/ - Literature

>>17232961
Intellectual equal that could actually enjoy life, rather than succumbing to perpetual, if not justified, edgyness.

>>17232961
It is telling that he mentions Goethe's Gespräche mit Eckermann as his favourite work. He admired Goethe as a homo universalis who seamlessly merged the vita activa and contemplativa

>>17233182
>. He admired Goethe as a homo
correct
>who seamlessly merged the vita activa and contemplativa
Goethe and vita contemplative are contradictory things.
Thats the whole joke and why Goethe hated Kant for the majority of his life.
It is a cope to say any of Goethe really was intellectual in that sense.
>>17232961
Goethe is loved because was such a great but still complex man. You will find near no great german who would object to Goethe even if he will find some of his writing overrated.

>>17232961
You mean what is it about Goethe that everyone loves so much?

Hmm I wonder.

>>17233260
Are you familiar with Goethe's scientific ideas?

>>17233141
>Intellectual equal
kek

goethe was an intuitive person and a genius. works of art came to him as they did to the rhapsodists. he shielded his inner motor from external influences - even from himself.

Both were virgins

>>17234017

>>17232961
He quoted him a bunch in his early writings and essays. Lots of agreement intellectually and admiration for his style.

>>17233141
>Intellectual equal

>>17234006
Basado. Schiller was the sentimental poet, and Goethe the great universal geniuses of naive ability.

>>17234063
>>17233967
Exactly my thought kek

>>17234063
>>Intellectual equal
>Goethe did not understand the Greeks.
That always got me.

>>17234588
>>Goethe did not understand the Greeks.
elaborate

>what?? He did NOT understand the greeks??

>>17233141
Nietzsche had the greater intellect, but they were still kindred spirits in terms of their will. A vibrant party of life surrounds both of their works.

>>17233141
>>17235182
I was willing to accept them being intellectual equals, but Nietzsche smarter than Goethe? No way lmao.

>>17235191
Plato is Nietzsche's intellectual equal, not Goethe. The scope of their influence demonstrates it.

>He did NOT understand the greeks

>>17235217
Do you mean to say all thinkers are more influential than artists?

It is just that your mind can only see the influence and purpose of the intellect, that you miss the artistic truth here.

>>17235227
>Do you mean to say all thinkers are more influential than artists?
No, but some certainly are.

>>17235182
Nietzsche was notoriously sickly and it's kinda reflected in the deliberate excess in his writings. His works are not those of a healthy, vibrant man.

>>17235182
>Nietzsche had the greater intellect
Top kek. Anglos actually believe this

>>17235233
I agree, but Goethe is an artist of the highest order.

>>17235254
Hard disagree. Nietzsche's prose is truly beautiful at its best, and at the very least still tantalizing at its worst. He's an invigorating read.

>>17235274
>Anglos
rent free

>>17234660
Have to ask Nietzsche.

>>17235285
His prose is beautiful but still obviously a attempt at dancing despair away. His ferocity is like Baudelaire's irony. Mind that there was no contempt in my post, simply an assessment. I feel like Nietzsche is often overplaying his intentions to lead the reader in the direction he wants, or under the kind of rush you feel after a temporary relieving of pain. He's more of a rhetorician and a ironist than a free-spirited savage.

Also it's worth comparing him to the French moralists of the 17th and 18th century who were his teachers in prose writing.

>>17235328
big if true

>>17235328
>He's more of a rhetorician and a ironist than a free-spirited savage. Also it's worth comparing him to the French moralists of the 17th and 18th century who were his teachers in prose writing.
He's all three. Also, I agree with that comparison — he is part of the Romantic era after all, if not the prime example of it. I disagree that his works show any sign of despair or self-blindness or anything like that, however; he wouldn't have reached the philosophical conclusions that he did had he been writing with that attitude.

>>17235357
>—
Why do people who read Nietzsche overuse the em dash? It has its uses but please stop peddling it in every sentence.

>>17235375
>overuse
Spook

>>17234660
Nietzsche said that Goethe didn't understand the Greeks.

>>17235357
You should read his diary to see what I mean when I say despair. Or see the comment he made about Don Quixote.
He certainly put up a tremendous fight against a debilitating illness and in the process acquired his own form of levity, but this was not natural to him at all. He was raised as the son of a Protestant pastor and I feel like it took him a very long time to truly escape that. I think my comparison with Baudelaire is apt enough: levity, sarcasm, playfulness, they all conceal a tremendous seriousness.

>>17235416
I'm not sure I would use words like "escape" or "conceal" when he wrote things like Why I Am So Wise, §2 from Ecce Homo. His philosophy, as I said before, also suggests an opposite attitude.

schiller war der pfeil
goethe war das ei

>>17235395
Where?

>>17236641
Read his essays on History if you can find them in an English translation lmfaooooooooooooooo

>>17235521
Fair enough, the choice of words was perhaps hasty. Let me just say that there is sickness and despair in much more than usual amount, however Nietzsche choose to address, he should not be mistaken as a naive or unburdened spirit.

>>17236652
What?

>>17232961
>What is it about Goethe that Nietzsche loved so much?
Goethe had a small dick. Incels always love vulgar-acclaimed crippled people like them.