/lit/ - Literature

Do R.C. Waldun and F. Gardner ever post on here?

How sharp would a Medieval sword actually be?
Could you catch one in your hand, or would it slice right through?

>>17139439
>Any progress on your novels?
I finally decided on my setting and the structure of my story for a web novel I am planning to launch after New Year's. I am dreadfully exhausted right now since I haven't slept in forty hours, but I'll start work on it as soon as I wake up from sleep. I'll write a bunch of chapters to have in reserve. Hopefully, I can make some patreonbuxx - I am too lazy to hold down a real job so I'd love to make my cash this way.

How to write an existential book without sounding like a tryhard?
I showed some fragments to my friend and he says it sounds like I'm tryharding too much, like it's a bit cringy, like gibberish, that's exactly what he said. But it doesn't look differently than for example Hesse. I don't know what to do with my prose, I want it to sound nice but be easy to follow.

>>17139568
Through your hand? Bro, palms are like a couple of centimetres thick. It'd slice through it like butter.
>>17139677
There's two questions in your post. First, about "not sounding tryhard" or "edgy" etc. - you can not rely on other people to make that judgement for you. Good taste is rare and whilst that might apply to you, it applies to your readers as well. If you want to know if your story and its themes are overly bombastic or not, you have to develop your taste. Read terrible, garbage writing of all kinds and then compare it with good writing. Figure out what makes something good and what makes it bad. Use your brain and keep a clear mind as you analyse your work. Be supremely impartial and see if you are just using themes and elements for show or if you find them to be truly meaningful.
As to your question about language, personally I lean towards purple prose. What I can advise you is to try and see if you are "putting your writing on display", so to say. No matter how elaborate or beautiful the language, if it is constantly being displayed in a careless and overbearing fashion, it will be the text equivalent of a flashy and flamboyant whore rather than a classical beauty. You (probably) want your text to carry within itself a sense of dignity and pride that is beyond seeking constant exposure and approval from others. Think of a beautiful form that contains nothing more than what is necessary for it to be perfect, free of all extrinsic orientations and attempts to court attention - that which is superior not only receives attention without trying, but is not concerned with attention in the first place, as it is above the need for it.

>>17139944
>It'd slice through it like butter.
I was unsure of whether it would cut through, or just break the hand.

The information around seems to vary wildly, from some places suggesting that Medieval swords were 'cheaply made mass produced garbage' and 'about as sharp as a broom handle', while other sources say they were razor sharp due to soldiers being forced to sharpen them regularly as part of their training.

>>17139439
I'm just trying to push through. I've written 6 short stories over the past few months and have submitted them all across the hundred top lit mags. Plenty of personalized "we took particular interest" or "please submit to us again" responses, but no bites yet. It's been highly demoralizing, being on the cusp like this and yet not converting.
I'm tired of praise. I want results. The only reason I'm trying to get short stories published is to help me get my novels published, which have all been the same story (figuratively): "wow your writing is so good and I love the idea but it's just not for me." Fuck you.

If I had to introspect, my greatest weakness in writing right now would be my characters. They tend to merely serve the plot, and very rarely feel "alive." Anybody have good sources for developing this aspect of my craft?

>>17139568
It would not chop your hand off, most likely, but you'd get severely cut up. Medieval blades were not dull by nature of their time period--men back then still shaved, skinned animals, butchered meat, etc. with sharpened blades, so why would swords be different? Perhaps the only circumstance would be an old or low quality blade made of iron instead of steel. Everything requires sharpening.

From a physics perspective, it would also mostly depend on how the blade is caught. If you think of the typical ball throw, there is an arc--the vertical velocity is greatest at the point of the throw and the catch, but totally absent at its zenith. What causes a cut is not the contact with the blade itself, but the friction between the blade and the skin (A puncture wound, in comparison, would require more force than a tossed sword would have). If someone were to catch a blade at the height of it's arc (assuming the blade is thrown straight up and without angular velocity), it would be as if you were merely plucking it out of the air. Relatively easy to catch without being cut. It's when there is motion parallel to the blade that serious damage would occur.

If you're writing a scene where this happens (action scene? comrade tossing a weapon to an ally?) I would just have the character catch it by the handle, which is the kind of hand-eye coordination they would not find challenging if they were trained in swordplay. Do you have further context than just "catching a sword"?

>>17139973
Your question is kind of bad, because the quality, form and standards of swords varied through time, region and social class. Whether a sword would slice or break through a hand is far more difficult to say than if you can just grab one, however. Some swords might just mangle and split it. I think generally it's more likely for a sword to cut through.

I have so many stories in my head and I cannot contain them. I have ideas for so many books, so many novels.

I must write.

Chapter 28. The End.

https://awfiction.wordpress.com/2020/12/28/engine-zero-zero-chapter-28-the-end/

Thanks to anyone who followed along. For anyone struggling or uncertain about writing my advice would be to just quit. Western civilization is over and books as we know and appreciate them are dead and never coming back.

>>17140168
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYRYI0NRgo4
Is that you?

>>17139973
>I was unsure of whether it would cut through, or just break the hand.

It's a matter of how the force is transmitted on contact and depends on the angle in which you catch the sword (and the shape of the weapon, of course).

A straight edge isn't optimal for cutting. If you receive a blade on your palm against the direction of the motion, it is unlikely to cut through, because the whole hand and arm receive the force at the same time, and it doesn't focus on any specific point. But if the contact is at a, say, 45 degree angle, then it will cut through easily enough, because the initial contact area is much smaller. A curved blade like a scimitar or a katana will cut easier for this reason

>>17139439
Reading atomic habits to help me get through it. Nothing groundbreaking, as advertised, but I guess most of the advices are sound, even if written in insufferable prose.

>>17140168
We're in an economic nosedive. But economies are replaced and have high points. During those times media will be consumed because people will have time for it. Anything you write now could have its day during that time.

>Wish Mountain follows the adventures of Hress Dunter and his companions as they journey up a mysterious mountain. Legend tells whoever reaches the heart of Wish Mountain will receive one all-powerful wish, but nobody in a thousand years has been able to get there. The kingdom needs a hero, but they'll have to settle for Hress Dunter.

https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/37998/wish-mountain

>>17140388
You wrote this?

>>17140474
Yep

>>17139467
Gardner does sometimes. He was giving his books out for free on here a couple of months back.

How do you guys plan out a story? I just write and write and write, until once eventually forms.

>>17140520
Where doesn't that faggot post?

>>17140557
I use my tried and tested method.

At any time in a story one of three things occur:

Time Engagement: (= routine, boring stuff)
Character Choice: (=character makes a decisive choice)
Turbulent Change: (=something unexpected and exciting happens)

Together they make a story unit and I plan out my stories in units. This method helped me overcome so-called 'writer's block'.

>>17140520
Gardner's kind of inspiring. Makes me feel like I can finish the manuscript I've been working on for years. I don't know how he does it so fast.

>>17140185
Yes.

>>17140248
I think the economy is part of it. But we're also evolving out of physicality. In the future we won't even know what it means to get up and cross the room, let alone rob a bank or climb a mountain or love anyone--all those things stories are about.

>>17139993
Start with the character and then, think about the conflict/plot.

>>17139439
https://www.deviantart.com/uthp/journal/The-Legend-of-Twilight-Zelda-Princess-part-I-348420007

Is it weird to feel guilty about turning the story I'm working on into erotica? Feels like the characters wouldn't approve

>he publishes serially
>he does this because he wants to imitate isekai garbage WN writers from Japan
>he does this because he has a fantasy where he'll make the American Re:Zero and have it pull him out of NEEThood or his McJob
>he does this because isekai and LitRPG are rightfully seen as a laughing stock by agents, and he doesn't have the literary palate to make anything but that
>he does this because, deep down, he knows that he needs more than a decade's worth of experience before he'll be up to the level of trad publishing
Never gonna make it.

>>17141355
are you just posting this gay shit every thread lol

>>17141490
No, someone else does it too.

>>17141640
uhhh based?

idk shit about writing, is this dialogue okay?

As we were driving I couldn’t help but notice the smell of peanut butter and that she kept throwing quick glances at me and holding back her smile.

“How long have you been a hikki?” she asked with great intrigue.

I paused. “I’ve been alone at home for about six years now. What about you?”

“Just two. I’m but a rookie. I don’t see my status changing anytime soon though.”

“Got kicked out of a love hotel too?”

“That’s right. Couldn’t stand that place, too many obligations and no personal space. I didn’t even want to find love. The men stank.”

“That’s tough luck, getting just low T’s. I had the same, just a rex after rex. They didn’t even shave their armpits. Jumped out just three weeks in and broke my ankles.”

“You live with your parents now? Or in one of those rag communes?”

“Tharents. I plan on moving out in the near future, I found some work to do.”

I registered a puppy in my peripheral vision running across the road right in front of us. It was too late to brake or turn away. We heard a loud thump and a hint of bones cracking under the car.

“Wha--”

“Just a pup.” I cut her words.

“Ah, good riddance.”

“One of those pests found a way to our shithole, gave a good scare to my thommy. She ran out and actually sharted on our expensive rug.”

“Fuck that, that reminds me that I need to buy more pup poison.”

to be cont'd....

>>17141863
I've seen better Harry Potter fan fictions written by teenage girls.

>>17141863
Make the characters do more stuff, make gestures, interact with what they got in their hand or the stuff around them. Gives them more character and builds the scene, instead of just making them look like they're talking in a big white box.

>>17139677
Lmfao, imagine showing your book to the people around you. Of course they wouldnt understand. Theyre idiots. Especially when they read the dialogues you write, they will probably laugh and be like, WhERe dID yOU GeT THiS!

They wouldnt understand anon. Because they think that you cant form conversations in your head. They need other people to talk to! Thats what conversing is for them. It is what conversing is.! But theyre idiots! Existentialism novels require people constantly talking. Dont show it to em.

>>17141894
Roger roger!
>>17141885
You will never be a woman.

>>17141917
Here's a small thing of dialogue from something I wrote recently. Not saying it's good but this is the first thing I could find with gestures and interactions just as an example.

>>17141863
>>17141917
You will never be a writer

>>17141974
Don’t give feedback ever again on dialogue. That text was sinfully dull

>>17141974
I hope you realize how awful this is and are going to edit it later.

>>17141974
Thank you.
I was doubting in myself but comparing to you I look like a top-tier author. I am going to make it.

>>17141974
Nigger really watch the queens gambit and thought he’d write fanfic about it

>>17141974

I might have fucked up.
I'm finding the lore of my project to be impossible to work with whenever I try getting into the nitty gritty of its world and this might be inherent to its very nature unless I try to refocus on things that I fear could get the focus away from things I wanted to say through it.
I wish I had more people to talk this about to be honest, other than anonymous posters on the internet because I feel kind of stupid when I have to explain to people who don't know me why this dumb idea is so important to me.

The characters in my supernatural mystery script keep doing this thing where they explain something that just happened to them, things that appeared in the movie, to someone who wasn't there. I really hate this; it does nothing but cover old ground, immediately rehashing what the audience saw themselves, completely fucking up the pacing of the film.
The thing is, it's completely natural and make perfect sense that they'd explain things. If I just plain-old cut out the lines, things feel stilted and awkward.
How do I fix this?

My main character has severe depression. I know how to write one because I was extremely depressed in the past. Right now it comes back once a few months for a day or two but it's nothing serious, I'm not looking at the wall for 24/7 straight like an empty shell.

But writing this makes me feel weird. Like I'm starting to feel what my character is feeling. It's not safe for me to write that in the long run.

>>17142060
>>17142098
>>17142099
>>17142126
What exactly is wrong with it? Since I'm apparently terrible at writing dialogue I'd like to know how to improve

Do you guys ever need to take a long break from writing fiction? Like a few months? Is that normal?

>>17142267
Bland. Boring. Uninteresting.
You see how I used three words that mean the same thing and there’s a hint of tedium after read them? Well, that’s the fruitless nature of your writing which lacks any sense of direction/meaning.
You can write unlikeable characters, but something has to be interesting to happen between them setting them up to change the reader’s opinion; you seem to lack the talent to do either with your mundanity

>>17141974
Did I misunderstand something or are these characters meeting for the first time? If so, why the hell are they talking to each other like this?

>>17142267
>mundane (look up Room flowershop scene)
>ungrammatical, not in a way that makes us think you're tinkering with the rules, but just don't know them

That was the day I met her. The Satele I've known for a week. This long lost planet in the depths of the universe snatched her, and she possessed that which we could not decipher; this fruit falling far from the tree across space was quite unlike anyone I've met before, and in fact anyone who had come to Earth now or long ago bore no close resemblance.
Robots never sang, never danced, never had any manner of sensibilities which transcended electrical impulses, except for Satele X-2, who was a deviation nobody could dismiss.

"Are you okay?" Satele chirped, looking straight at me. I must have been staring, riveted by her display glowing like sunlight, the hundreds of tiny blue electronic components embedded across her surface glinting in yellow.
I reckoned I wasn't, somewhat.
"Are you criss-crossed lost in thought—Oh?" her antenna ears perked up again, "WE WITNESS THE EXPLOSION OF OUR LATEST ROCKET... AGAIN." She shook her head as the errant transmission waned, "aww, that's sad! How'd it malfunction?"
"The fuel ran too short, I think," I mumbled, "this is the 6th failure. We just don't seem to improve."
She tilted her head, her cathode-eyes were bright, warped with technicolor, the static crackling against the busy radio spectrum. "Why are you sad? The research is still a blast, you learned a bit more about fuel in your last attempt, too, there is always room for a new plan to fire up," her antennas took up the pause and spun, listening for more signals, "don't you think?"
I didn't know how to respond, my brain was still full of flame and smoke.

>>17142444
Circuitry tinkered, supplies checked, fuel level signs read, combustion engineers grumbling with nobody's approval as their final efforts come down the execution chain.
All for what? Another ball of fire? With our resources diminishing, twenty years of supposed progress whittled down to nothing as the wheels of space and time spun ever faster, momentum restless in our rush to attain distant planets.

"I love these thingies! What do you call them?" her lo-fi voice misted through my haze, sounding clear. She was holding a pop-up hologram device showing the blurry, monochrome model of a flying insect I have never seen in person, for it has been long extinct.
"They're called butterflies, Satele," my reply came to me slowly.
It flitted and faded away as its animation left the device's range.
"You have to show me more of Earth, I'd like to see the flying butters, falling waters... yah ok?"
"Not much of it is worth seeing, these encyclopedias are the gold standard," I closed my eyes, "Earth is a dead planet."
"You are living, are you not?" she asked, not in jest but in a curious manner.
"I don't know anymore," was my florid response after a second of thought, another one of my recurring walls to hide behind.

Her antennae twizzled, "ghosts are faster than light," she said as her screen face warped and distorted, her circuits abuzz, "I learned this while exploring Gliese 667Cc, the Tw'nak wraiths are hyperspace things. Blue, fast and such. You don't look like them. You look like an Earthling: fleshy, solid and roundish."
I might have smiled, Satele fascinated me in a way, her alien knowledge told through messy data, snippets of knowledge with confusing simplicity.
"Don't you feel happy to be—oh! Channel 335855 Hz is showing Angry Explosions Of Rocketsnakes again! I love this show! Wait wait wait, here comes the disaster shot! Ohhh!"

Maybe Satele is the Earthling who sees the greens of the forests and I'm the one lost in space.

>>17142267
Aside from being riddled with conversational cliches, your characters don't seem to be talking like actual people. It's never necessary to make your characters talk naturalistically, but dialogue should at least feel real.
It also doesn't help that I can't tell what they hell they're talking about- which is a possible sign that you can't, either. Good dialogue is always rooted in what the character has to say. Make sure you're very clear on what that is before you put any spoken words to page.

>>17142444
>>17142450
Put it in a pastebin faggot.

Someone posted a link a while back of a guide on how to give feedback and why it's bad to be brutally honest. I think it was a fantasy site but could have applied to any genre. Anyone remember that/got the link?

>>17142483
>firstly say what you liked
>then say what you didn't like
it's literally that easy

>>17142483
>it's bad to be brutally honest! you'll hurt someone's feel-feels :(
grow up

>>17142483
I’d rather people be brutally honest with me. It probably comes down to the fact that soft sois will literally stop writing because muh feelings hurt

>>17142483
the path of ambition is the path of struggle
faggot

Halfway through editing, what rute should I take in attempting to publish?

>>17142589
Paste your novel to the wall of your local city, you've got a higher chance of getting it read there than getting it published

>>17142557

I think he means giving feedback to normies, who if offended may flipout and cause trouble at work or in your social circle

>>17142552
>>17142557
>>17142582
No comment on the content or the rest of the article, I just wanted to know what the site was. Christ, you faggots need to get over yourselves.

>>17142623
People like this will never be good.

>>17142629
>posts
>gets mad when someone responds without answering their question
No wonder youre looking for a soi-site bro, vegans be chasing your ass

>>17142589
Tradpub, accept no alternatives.

>>17142674
Was I mad? Seems like everyone else is mad about an article that hasn't been posted with a premise that nobody has said they agree with. Wild.

>>17142629
>you can't reply to me with mean comments! you hurt my feel-feels :(
grow up

>>17142725
>g-grow up :(

>>17142763
>n-no u :(
grow up

>>17142717
What if every publisher rejects it?

How do I make money off erotica with taboo subject matter? (example: teenagers, bestiality)

- Dialogue.
"Dialogue."

Thoughts?

>>17142808
>- Dialogue.
what kind of faggot even writes like that

>>17142795
You can always come back and give shitty advice on /lit/.

Wish we could make a writing/publishing collective but I'm afraid of making people cringe with my writing (or realizing how cringe the rest of you actually are).

>>17142845
Im worried that the beginning of my book will throw people off. The ending is the most important part while the beginning is intentionally messed up/wierd

>>17142866
Is it something you're willing to share? I understand if not, I would never post anything I wanted to get published here.

The best I can offer with what you've given me is that there's a fine line between a hook and a total disorientation. Does your beginning (first 5 pages) do the following?
>Introduce the central protagonist?
>Introduce the central conflict (or hint at it in a theme-ish kind of way)?
>Indicate the genre or otherwise establish a reasonable expectation for the reader regarding what kind of book this is?
>Have a coherent set of events?
Ideally, you'd do the above in the first couple of paragraphs or sentences. I know it's lame, but half of my shit is sight-unseen-unpublishable because I refused to cut my "artistic" openings in favor of genreslop hooks.

Look at me, a failed novelist giving advice. I'm just regurgitating what agents and editors tell me. I do think it makes a certain amount of sense given the market. I hate the market.

>>17142943
>>Introduce the central conflict (or hint at it in a theme-ish kind of way)?
Kind of. Thats good advice because it indicates the conflict but not necessarily the theme. It starts with an action sequence which slowly reveals the setting

>>17142824
James Joyce

>>17142943
>I hate the market
I agree, coming from a movie buff background I try to write a blend of arthouse and blockbuster. Think James Cameron, Scorcese, or Tarantino. Audiences want sex and violence

>>17142990
The theme can be much more subtle than the conflict, especially if you're writing genreshit. What matters is that you're putting the conflict on the first pages (even if it's only a secondary conflict that eventually leads into the primary conflict) Take a look at the first paragraph of the first Jack Reacher novel. This was probably all it took to nail the agent and publisher. That first line.

Now realize that even this opening would not cut mustard in today's tradpub world. The conflict itself is not particularly interesting. It doesn't make the retard reader go HUH? and want to keep reading. Getting arrested is relatively boring. Jack Reacher himself is not particularly interesting. People like him as a character, but agents and editors (if you don't know the type, you will by the end of your querying journey) wouldn't be interested if you showed them this today. The writing style, at least, is in line with what the average reader can handle in term of complexity.

>>17143033
Worse than the audiences are the tastemakers. What "audiences want" is mostly determined by a select number of people within the industry.

>>17141640
This is getting out of hand, Now there are 2 of them..

>>17143104
>>17142943
I hate this so much. I published only one work and I had to cut my beautiful opening with the mc's inner thoughts and characterisation. They wanted hooks and action and I had to rewrite three first pages.
It was much better before.

Could I get feedback on this short description the MC gives himself?

>>17143193
reads like something out of YA fiction

I know we all do edits all the time, but how often do you guys do ground-up rewrites? I've only done so once, with the first project I ever completed. It was pretty terrible before and it felt like I needed to start it over. I think I was right since it came out great after that.

>>17143193
Like that anon said, YA fiction. Looks like taken from light novels. What are you writing?

>>17143235
>>17143193
to add: this may or may not be a bad thing, YAs might be the audience you want to shoot for. Depends on what the book's about

>>17143193
>There is nothing interesting about me but let me go on for a hundred words about it xDD
But I see what you're trying to do. Some pointers:

The milkshake bit is contradictory to what the character is saying. Bland people don't describe themselves as cannibal milkshakes. Unless it absolutely jives with something in the plot, cut it.
Are you trying to be funny? Deep? Cuttingly satirical? Aloof? Figure it out.
The job bit that sandwiches the milkshake bit is repetitive. If it's so interesting, make it SOUND interesting. Tease it. You should only ever be boring in service of a better payoff.
Your descriptions are redundant. Again, this is evident in the milkshake bit (the fruits and milk part really rubbed me the wrong way). Shit or get off the pot, nobody cares about these details.
Adding onto that, your character is insecure in his thoughts and it's annoying as fuck: "It's not like... from how I see it... Maybe you'll... what people consider..."
Your language is pretentious. "If one were to put a body part of mine..." but at the same time half-assed "...in a blender"
Your tenses are inconsistent. "If one were to... you'll tell a change... it won't change... a cannibal would..."

Your structure is good, though. Curiosity >>> Leadup >>> Punch
Should go something like this:
>If it weren't for my job, I'd just be another Joe Blow
>I don't speak up. I order the same takeout every night. I read the license agreements before clicking 'accept.'
>Hell, I'd make a coma patient seem compelling if I somehow wandered into his ward.
>But what I do for a living? What is my special role in this economy that nets me two hundred grand a year? I jack off pandas.
>Call me an environmentalist. They don't mate in captivity, you know.

>>17143246
When I feel like something is wrong fundamentally. When it reads like teenager's work.

>>17143348
Not him but the character could very well only think of himself as bland while not being bland at all. I agree with your other points tho

>>17143391
>think of himself as bland while not being bland at all
You reminded me of all those coomer character descriptions like
>she knew she was hot but she pretended she's not, her tits........
etc
Seen it a few times. I don't know why people write like this. It's dumb.

Thoughts?

I begin my story with an event from the time when I was ten years old, attending the local school in our small country town. I can still catch the fragrance of many things which stir me with feelings of melancholy and send delicious shivers of delight through me - dark and sunlit streets, houses and towers, clock chimes and people's faces, rooms full of comfort and warm hospitality, rooms full of secret and profound, ghostly fears. It is a world that savours of warm corners, rabbits, servant girls, household remedies and dried fruit. It was the meeting-place of two worlds; day and night came thither from two opposite poles.

>>17143391
Responding to you because I'm sure that anon might latch onto it.
>The character could very well only think of himself as bland while not being bland at all.
If there's a contradiction between a character's thoughts and the character's reality, it needs to come out through gradual action that reveals the narrator's delusions. It can't come out in that character's specific thoughts, especially not right at the starting description. The reader will be pissed and think the writer's a moron, which is a one way ticket to getting put back on the shelf.
If we really want to believe this character is thinking about cannibal milkshakes and yet perceiving himself as normal, that's a much heavier lift of character development than what a "short description" is going to be able to accomplish. In that case, only seeing this paragraph is useless to us as critics. If this is all we get, it's all we can operate upon.

All that being said, I don't really believe that's the case, as anon would have given us a bit more backstory or content to critique. I hope.

>>17143409
>don't know why people write like this
I actually read Danielle Steele's latest romance, "All that Glitters," and it literally does the "hottie that doesn't know she's hot" shit right on the first page. Pic related.
Not that you should expect literary ingenuity from either Ms. Steele or the Romance genre. In either case the "oblivious beauty" is common.

>>17143521
>I begin my story
I shiggy diggy. You're obviously beginning the story if it's the first line so why the fuck are you telling me. I'd have closed the book.
Also, why do we care? The story's conflict needs to be here or literally in the next paragraph or you'll lose the reader.
>When I was ten years old, attending the local school in our small country town.
>I can still catch the fragrance
Is he currently there or not? Add "when I visit" or something if needed. You're not allowed to float about on the first page.
>All that imagery in the second and third sentences
Bretty gud, you have a clear vision and that's a start.
>it was the meeting-place of two worlds; day and night came thither from two opposite poles
Not sure about this. It would work if your narrator spoke of this memory in terms of an eternal dawn or dusk (get a gist of this from "Dark and sunlit streets"). Right now it's poetic for poetic's sake, and not for the story. It works as a topic sentence, but not a conclusion for the paragraph.

>>17143521
Why are you stealing the pictures that I post in this thread.

You're even stealing my filenames, fuck off you basterd.

>>17143703
>>17143521
Anon17143521 x Anon17143703 fanfic when?

>>17143634
Perhaps when I wake up tomorrow I can guve you more snippets of the character's thoughts

Give me the premise of your book in one sentence. Sell it to me.

>>17143978
Sex

>>17143978
Ragtag southern family has to transport the mother’s rotting corpse to her ancestral burial plot. Hilarity ensues.

>>17143978
A starry-eyed 17-year-old girl, named Victoria Happ-Schwarzenberger, follows in her father's footsteps and enlists in the Metropolitan Space Navy in events that will change her course forever.

>>17143978
>Sell it to me.
So you want the premise or the elevator pitch? Here's the pitch-
>(title) is the tale of young actress, Rose, after a dreamlike encounter with a mysterious cult. She awakens in a dark, unreal shadow of our own world, devoid of human life and cloaked in an endless night. She meets three strangers. Each one of them claims to know just as little as her. Each one has something to hide.
>They encounter dangers. A huge, ungodly beast with hooks for hands bent on slaughtering everything it finds and a coven of blindfolded cannibals. It slowly becomes clear that there is no food to be found anywhere. They must escape this horrible place before death claims them, by murder or starvation.
But the premise is much more simple. It's about survival. Base, primal survival.

>>17144163
Why does the metropolitan need a space navy?

>>17144336
In the 29th century, most of humanity has been unified under a political entity known as the Federation of Sol. The past 200 years oversaw humanity become interstellar and both terraform and colonize a portion of the Milky Way. 'Metropolitan' in this case refers to the star region known as 'Metropolitan Sol' which includes Terra as well as some other fictitious bodies, who wield considerable power over most of its colonial regions. Being more or less the Federation seat of power, it is implied that Metropolitan Sol is uneasy about its colonial governments having naval forces of their own—who do it anyway citing de facto rights, especially the vast Ruthenian colonial star zone which challenges Metropolitan authority—and have decidedly created a force of its own to combat issues of rising piracy among political motives.

>>17142824
I-I do :< is it really bad?

>>17144096
I can see this getting picked up and made into a really funny Coen bros flick

>>17144437
uh bro i think you might wanna look up what metropolitan means

/wg/, originally I was going to have my setting shatter and collapse into a singularity, but I just realized I can't find a way to create a happy ending from that so i'm trying to think of a way to keep the cracks, and what I came up with was the idea that an eldritch fetus is using the earth as its yolk and the cracks are blood vessels designed to slowly soak up nutrition the surface as nutrition.

does that sound better?

>>17144500
You're right, I should've gone with Cosmopolitan for extra kino

>>17144550
fuuuuuck, this doesn't work with any of my future plans...

>>17139677
We can't really answer this without a sample. Anything elaborate or distinctive might seem "tryhard" because you're perceived as some nobody who thinks he's too good to just write "normally". Then again, maybe you genuinely can't pull it off. How much do you value your friend's literary opinion?
Idk, just keep working, study different styles, get more opinions, and look at your past output with a critical eye

Can I get some feedback on this? It's the first time I've tried any creative writing. Please be harsh and honest.

Excerpt. Thoughts?

>>17144732
I would probably rephrase something and drop out the words "dude, stop!" and "motherfuckers"
You don't need to be so specific
>it's been half an hour...
Not relevant. Tell us why you are going to be in trouble instead. Don't give exact times like half an hour when that type of accuracy is not necessary. Readers can't tell how long something takes or count time from text
>this didn't protect his ribs, stomach, crotch, legs
Not relevant, just say they were kicking him all over his body
The violence part didn't convince me. Too many cliches and poorly described

It's a good start but needs editing and rewriting. Some parts just don't work and some sentences and words are unnecessary.

>>17144934
Thank you very much!
>poorly described
Can you help me with this one? Dialogue aside, I think description has been the hardest thing so far. Any books or examples would be greatly appreciated.
I was uncertain if the swearing would make it too juvenile and amateurish. It seems like it would be better to avoid it.

>>17139439
Just passing by to say that I wrote a draft for a wastelander isekai
>https://docs.google.com/document/d/e/2PACX-1vTYXTCND_nQbbRQ5KttQ4ZJ-Jf3E_Z7c40alH8utYtRJO-RrYk07tn-0HEM7-fCtsDBpL6Z9LEU0TtX/pub
We are currently busy making a game amd I just made this as a side project. I honestly have no idea what to actually do with it
The idea was just stuck in my head. Would probably do illustrations for this after we are done. Probably

Not really an isekai in a sense but a solemn love letter to physics and philosophy.

>>17145082
tl;dr
Wastelander searching for survivors
However, she got isekaid in a magic world of 4 elements.

First arc was meeting an aspiring wind dancer. She declared they be quarantined out of fear of cross-mutation. Wastelander got sick and almost died
Confessed that they made the nuclear weapons and were overcomed with guilt over their actions thus decided to spend her days searching for survivors in the nuclear winter.
Wanted to return back to the wasteland because she believes that there are still survivors on the tunnels and it's her way of self-redemption

Second arc: they met the Princess of the sky kingdom who revealed that the wind dancer is from a clan of cowards.
Aspiring wind dancer failed her test and wastelander instead thought her the full potential of her powers far beyond just using wind slashes
Days after, demons attacked and city was locked down
Princess tried to lead an interception to kill the demons before they got to the city but things went awry and they had to retreat
They met the wind dancer and the wastelander who destroyed all the demons using a "possitive lightning"

Princess asked to learn how she managed to do it
Wastelander refused until wind dancer asked that she be taught
Wastelander agreed but only if the Princess would work as a cleaner because "those who wanted to know power must also know powerlessness"
princess was humiliated but passed and was taught by the wastelander

The two learned how to charge the air and perform lighting strikes and St.Elmos Fire

Later on, a Crawling Fort was seen heading towards the city
Wastelander taught the two how to create a railgun using just steel bars, a steel cannonball, and their lightning
They destroyed the fort in 1 shot hundreds of km away
Wastelander warned never to tell anyone because they would be the target of politicians. The arrow was mystified by civilians as a holy strike from heavens

Unfortunately, the royal investigators found out, told their superiors and they became a major threat.
To be continued

>>17145082
>another r*etard who can't write dialogue tags

>>17145054
Keep in mind that your readers are not retards, they have their own imagination.Suggesting something will invoke their imagination.
>I was uncertain if the swearing would make it too juvenile and amateurish.
Swearing makes you look like a Mormon teenager who wants to say the F-word with a permission. Just avoid it, it doesn't add any value.

Also
>...felt too sore to get up. He spent a moment looking at the sky..."
I can see that you tried to express how he's on his back collecting himself and he sees the sky above him but you didn't express it in this way. Now it sounds like he is just looking at the sky for no reason. Your idea didn't fully translate to the text

>he doesn't write his dialogue in a little box underneath the character's name in all caps
cringe and non-screenplay pilled

>>17142098

Is there a spiritual aspect to your writing?

>>17145531
Everything I write is for God

>>17145541
Does God like it? What kind of books does God usually read?
I'm thinking He's a John Grisham guy.

>>17145531
God sent me to write fantasy novels

>>17145546
I hope he likes it. I think he is more of a hymn fan though.

>>17145554
Nobody likes hymns, God listens to psychill & ambient

>>17145546
He loves it, as he loves all his creations. And he's read every book

ah yeah, 47 pages done with my human trafficking in the hospital book

>>17143521
Could I ask for more opinions on this, please? I'm confused what to do after anon's critique

>>17146108
Don't use archaic words like thither, it's silly.

>>17146108
There's no point in ripping apart every line. Just think more about what you want to tell and rewrite the whole thing from scratch.

I'm technically a published author if my fanfic is up on some site, right?

>>17146507
Can I say I'm a published author if I self-published my book on Amazon in pdf?

>>17146528
I do that already

"If God exists, so does the Devil."

How do I make this sentence better?

I tell everyone I'm published after going outside and standing in public for a little while. I don't actually write

>>17146562
By leaving it unwritten, because it's a logical fallacy.

>>17146562
Therefore if we elucidate the potential of the the existence of a higher being known as a Genie, what is a specific non sequitur in the world of non-transcedental Phemonology, we also know that, on the other side, there is Devil, a scintillating Existence and Being that is-or potentially can be-on the side of us as the humans.

Published philosopher here, our work is to literally make simple statements long and sound smarter. No need to thank me.

>>17146598
>Published philosopher here, our work is to literally make simple statements long and sound smarter. No need to thank me.
I read philosophy and I can confirm this. Also most ideas I read are outdated and debunked already so it's like reading old physics where they said everything is orbiting Earth

does anybody find outlining to be absolutely suicide-inducing? I feel like I really need it to get my stories going but jesus fucking christ I hate the experience

>>17147295
I find it utterly backbreaking when I have to write the boring parts to reach the favorite parts.

>>17147295
Depends on the story really.

Sometimes I can just free write for hours with no interruptions.
Sometimes I need to outline to see where the story is going to go.
Sometimes I start with an outline, and then go rogue and start free writing.

There is no definitive way to write.
Find the process that works for you.

>>17142808
Doesn't it depend on the language? In Polish, we do - Dialogue. and in English its, "Dialogue." No idea about other languages tho.

After finishing up my last short story I thought I'd try my hand at an essay, and I have to say it's a hell of a lot easier. I suppose that's what happens when you're not making things up.

In other news, I somehow managed to get an op-ed published in one of the biggest newspapers in England, so I'm pleased with myself.

>>17147634
Congratulations!

>>17147634
well done my nigga

>>17147634
Which magazine?

>>17147656
>>17147707
Thanks anons! I was kind of leveraging my previous job role, but I'm hoping to follow it up, and even though it's non-fiction I'm hoping it's all conducive to the effort.

>>17147757
The Independent

How do I write for living? Do I have to make it and publish some books first?

>>17147802
Live in a tutorial country as a NEET and write for yourself (publishing is optional)

>>17147802
Write what for a living?
>non-fiction
To into journalism, write fluff pieces for a few years until you can become an editor with your own column and write about whatever you want
>fiction
No chance unless you're absolute top tier. Even Sally Rooney, whose second novel Normal People is now insanely popular and turned into a TV show, still has to slum it as an editor of various literary journals to maintain a safe income. Write enough novels and invest wisely enough and you might be able to do it for the rest of your life at your leisure.
>Copy
Go into advertising or marketing

>>17147929
I want to work as an editor.
I'm a nurse, how can I get into journalism with no experience or specific education?

>>17148098
That's really difficult. I have a friend in journalism, but they did a degree in English Lit and then a masters in journalism (this is the UK). They also had work experience placements and a few articles published.

If you're not willing or able to do a degree in the subject, I'd suggest trying to arrange work experience of some kind. Nothing's stopping you from going freelance - as a nurse you could easily write an op-ed, for example - but because there are effectively no barriers to entry it's more competitive. But if you got a few good freelance bits published and built your reputation you'd have more of an opportunity to segue into the industry.

>>17139439
What's /lit/s process after the first draft is done? I know waiting is recommended, but then do you rewrite entirely? Go through sections you know have issues and clean it up? Focus on arcs first or characters or plot or grammar?

How do you stave off the feelings of hopelessness long enough to make shit? Every time I start writing fiction I get 10000 words in and then remember that even if I were to get published, I'd probably be very lucky to sell 200 copies since I'm not writing YA. What do you finishedaprojectchads focus on to ignore this? Did anyone bother to see what you made? How do you cope?

Please recommend some fantasy novel that doesn't take itself too seriously, but it's not strictly comedy.

>>17148568
Fantasy is by definition not a serious genre.

>>17148520
>lucky to sell 200 copies since I'm not writing YA
You're behind the times, YA isn't what sells anymore. So it's probably for the best that you aren't writing it.

>>17142718
>Seems like everyone else is mad
this is always the sign of someone that isn't mad

>>17148655
Deep

>>17143104
How's this
>In the middle of the Sonoran desert, Charles Owen relaxed, isolated near a youthful Palo Verde. He sat upon a red and white lawn chair where the tree’s shadow would be once it matured. Before him was the edge of the Conduit, a red wall of particles that engulfed his sight. It’s mass spread for miles over the arid land. Its name came not from the dome itself but from the strange antennae like object which emitted it miles away. His attention was captive on the dust waves it emitted. Pulse after pulse, white lines burst down the wall and into dirt. For three years they had pounded into the ground. The waves approached like a lobotomy, heading straight for his core. The booms had kept his attention, but he was getting impatient. He directed these feelings into a rhythmic finger tap on the chair’s arm. One more hour, then his replacement would come.

>>17148667
Start is good. I'd lose 'a red wall of particles...' and say '... the Conduit, stretching for miles and miles across the arid land'. Change next sentence to 'it was named not for its dome but from...'

In fact there's a few things I would personally change. Here's how you could tweak it to make it read better:

Charles Owen relaxed in the middle of the Sonoran desert, isolated near a youthful Palo Verde. He sat upon a red and white lawn chair where the tree’s shadow would be once it matured. Before him lay the Conduit, stretching for miles over the arid land. It was named such not for its domelike shape, but after the antennae that sustained it from miles away. Pulse after pulse rippled rhythmically downwards over the edge of the dome and into dirt, sending up sprays of rust-colored sand as it had done each day for the last three years. Today, the pounding of the sound wore at his nerves; his fingers rapped upon the arm of the chair. One more hour until his replacement arrived.

>>17148775
>>17148667
Oh, I made a couple of mistakes, but you get the idea. Avoid passive voice, avoid useless details, avoid trite clichés like the lobotomy comparison. Less is more.

>>17148775
Ya but it being a force field is important to the plot and setting. I do like what you did with the dust section. Was struggling to describe that

Has anyone used wargaming simulation models to write something similar to Game of Thrones?

>>17144767
Lotta excessive details

>>17148922
I've always looked for things like them but to no avail.

>>17142235

Assuming you have to bring in the new people who weren't there - just show the beginning and end of it. Instead of

>there's no such thing as ghosts
>oh yeah? well blah blah blah blah blah here's what happened blah blah blah

>there's no such thing as ghosts
>oh yeah?
>skip to scene of them after explanation
>you're full of shit, no way any of that is real

Some version of that anyway.

>>17144767
Brutal, and perhaps could do with a bit more subtlety, but perhaps that's what you're going for. Regardless, I really liked it. I think you have a fine balance in your sentences.
>came so near my own premature demise
Is a bit awkwardly phrased in comparison to the rest. This cold, violent killer would say something like 'came so close to the end', wouldn't he? I would simplify it anyhow.
>my scope... crushed beneath the snow
I would get rid of this sentence, it draws away from the narrator and I think it would flow better without it
>I gut men like fish and hung them dripping
Either gut and hang, or gutted and hung. Also seems to lack subtlety
>beasts imbibing each other
Why would this chap use the word imbibing? Isn't he a working-class conscript? Or is he erudite? If he is, why would he be in the infantry, rsther than a commissioned officer? Make sure to keep his voice even. It's much more challenging in the first person.
>last sentence
Very nice

Overall good work, anon. What's the story for?

How’s this poem come off lads?


Coming home for the first time


more lovely than the sunset on these waters
is that glimmering city seen from afar
joy and delight are the names of her daughters
for she shines brighter than any silver star
and as I come to port to its harbour bar
before my eyes the souls of the breathless bay
rise as the sounds of crashing waves, so bizarre
you can hear their voices clear even this day
“away sailor, a trap, away” they say
but the light weaves as a strange gossamer there
and the voice of rest and tiredness beg “stay”
what dwells in you city, that can ensnare
like flies men of freedom and will to power?
“i will leave” yet passes another hour

I don't want to write this shit anymore. It's tiring. I want screenplays but it has no future.
Should I write for fun or to make it?

>>17149183
If you write to make it you never will

>>17148586
So nothing sells? People sure as shit haven't started reading, even during lockdown.

>>17148568
Wrong thread

What's with all the first person present tense? Seems like every short story I read in journals these days is written in it

>>17149381
Is there something wrong with first-person present?

For gaining an audience online with writing it really has to cross the amusement barrier. There's a level of self indulgence that needs to be catered to with the very idea of a story. Such as isekai light novels, or romance, or straight up smut catering to a specific niche.

Classic books are read because they are assumed to be of a high standard, and in a way that meets the same indulgence criteria.

I wonder how one would gain an audience for a work that isn't catered to the lowest common denominator tropes. I think a lot can be said for 'word of mouth', but really like with streamers when there is a community of active fans of a thing, then it is easier to accrue more fans.

>>17149403
Not so much first person, but present tense. Probably because most of what I read and like is traditional past tense. It just reads weird to me and it seems like it's everywhere now.

>>17149308
The same shit as usual is selling. You're better off writing something else, YA is not only not selling but way oversaturated. But sure, reading is on the decline, that wasn't my point.

>>17149616
what is selling these days?

>>17149499
Present tense in third person reads off to me but I feel like is suits first person better than past tense. Maybe that's just because I find it super clunky to write first person past tense. My damage.

>>17149381
Plebs love it because it seems engaging, but they all fuck themselves over with it

>>17139439 I've been having trouble with many things. Writing characters. I keep creating these little vignettes of only vaguely connected characters' lives, but they all seem homogeneous, individual situations in the aforementioned vignettes notwithstanding. They all read to me as bland. They don't have any personality beyond this-is-the-person-we're-following-right-now, they only seem to function as an audience surrogate. Perhaps I only need to write more characters, as most of these little vignettes only feature an individual character doing something alone, but I'm not sure.
And loquacity. Extreme verbosity. It's a problem, as anyone who's read this can tell. I love writing prose and creating vivid images with words but at what point does it become hopelessly obnoxious and pretentious? In how much detail may I describe a room with a rotting corpse inside before it's too much and the reader is left rolling their eyes? I'm not very good at judging the merit of my own work, and I often look at passages I've just written, unable to determine whether or not it's good or if I'm just filling up pages in compensation for my lack of a real story. I've a penchant for prose that ebbs and flows like liquid gold, and I want to write it, but I feel as though I'm only pretending, and that the belief I had any talent at all was ill-guided.

>>17149640
My preference is third person past tense. George walked to the shop, etc. Rather than I walk to the shop

>>17148955
Meant for>>17144732

>>17142041
None of us will.

>>17149770
lol

Today, I’ve decided I’m not gonna think at all: Empty Head Day. I’m just gonna jack off and sleep until I can’t do either anymore.

>>17143634
The story's conflict needs to be shoved in that early? I would not know any stories from the top of my head that get to the point that quick.

How do you guys go about naming your characters? I generally just throw together a jumble of letters like I'm on Countdown and see what sticks.

>>17149973
That's all well and good, but make sure that it's actually an empty head day. Take some time away from the internet and general stimulation to actually de-stress.

>friend said your novel is hard to read and he doesn't care about your details
>don't know what to do with them because you don't think it's forced, but if readers say so something is wrong
What do I do?

>>17150227
>How do you guys go about naming your characters?
I use Scrinever's name generator until something good comes up.

>>17148667
I'm not a sci-fi guy but this seems workable. I agree that >>17148775 is a vast improvement. It has a better rhythm and flow to it; read both aloud and see what you hear.

Some nitpicks:
>Charles Owen relaxed
>Today, the pounding of the sound wore at his nerves; his fingers rapped upon the arm of the chair.
Contradiction here. Change to "tried to relax." If you accept this correction, I would also keep the phrasing of the first sentence as you had it in your version.
>First sentence
I don't actually think it's very strong. There's two interesting threads in this paragraph: the force field and Charles's replacement. One of them should be the focal point and therefore the "topic sentence" (and hook). Frontload it.
>Description
I agree with you that the forcefield merits description, but I'm not sure the weight here is where it needs to be. The other anon's version does the "sprays of rust-colored sand" very well.
Is the chair's color and location relevant? The maturity of the tree? I would probably cut the tree thing, it's a clever descriptor but will end up a space-taking darling. Determine the important parts, put the weight in there, and make brief and specific mentions of the rest.

>>17150036
I was being a little hyperbolic. It's not that you need to
>get to the point that quick
It's that you need to give the reader a point to keep going (assuming you're writing to get published). Pretty prose won't cut it. Imagery won't cut it, either, unless it immediately reveals something that hooks the reader's attention. Plot is driven by conflict, so if you don't have conflict (even a minor one), you don't have a plot. You might be able to get away with not having a plot for a page or two, but the contemporary reader won't put up with it for that long.

As I said in an earlier post, I hate hate hate it, but it is how it is. You can make the art you want to make or you can make something that will get published, but rarely both.

If you're the anon with the memory opening I was critiquing, I'll tell you that flashbacks are normally not good openings. If you've heard an expression along the lines of "start your story as close to the end as possible," this is what that's referring to. Flashbacks should be used sparingly because they are definitionally antagonistic to the movement of a story (Beginning to End). A direct contradiction of "In Media Res," but you can find more creative ways of establishing exposition and memory than "I'll begin my story by telling you some shit that happened years ago."

Above all, you do need that raison d'etre for the flashback. Is the character there? Must he return there? Is he confronting some kind of regret about the place? Is the place where some terrible accident made him a different/supernatural person? Any of these cases could be established better with a single line or preluded with a different opening.

>>17139439
I wrote a 414 page 152742 word novel.
I just finished editing it and now I need cover art.

>>17150511
I'm a visual artist. I'll make your cover if you critique my work!

>>17150549
Fair enough.

>>17150552
What's your handle?

>>17150567
Ummmm Handle?
I'm new here (usually hang out on /K/ and /Pol?).

>>17150430
I am not that anon but I have a quick question on the note of flashbacks. I plan to make the final chapter after the big finale of my first volume a flashback chapter. It would be a way to wrap up the arc, in which the actions and the path my characters have taken were heavily influenced by the character the flashback revolves around. It would be out of the perspective of a person that is currently with the main crew, but who also knew him. and it would not be more than a summary of important events that would be important for the reader to know.

Is dedicating an entire chapter on a flashback fine or would that just get boring?

>>17150580
like, where can i contact you? my instagram is @worldcollegeoflife

>>17148586
Fuck, so my No Longer Human-Death on Credit knockoff is doomed?

>>17150588
d-e-harris is my hotmail.
Please don't abuse it, fren.

/wg/, I've decided to make a massive change to the scale and cosmology of my setting and I don't know if I'm doing the right thing

>>17150588
I deleted my first response, so I hope you got it.

My novel has 3 parts. Can I write part 1 in present tense, and part 2 and 3 in past tense, or will that be too jarring for readers?

>>17151103
1. past
2. present
3. future

>>17150737
sorry i went out and got pizza. can you repost it

>>17151163
Are you serious, or are you messing with me?
I have to ask because this is 4Chan and I never quite know.

>>17151288
no i went with my dad to get a pizza. we watched a little bit of 1917 and i just sort of forgot

>>17151302
So, I have been informed that I have to use my daughter's design.
I'll still critique it, tho.

>>17151354
good idea, and ty :)

what's your handle though, i didn't get it

>>17151365
D-E-Harris
That's my @Hotmail.com

>>17151392
sent a test email

>>17149626
light novels (YA for weebs)

>tfw ever mindful of dialogue tags because of tism anon
>starting to hate all dialogue I write because they have dialogue tags
Dialogue tags are a necessary evil but christ do I hate to read them

>>17151475
Stop having a shitty dialogue-action-dialogue-action pattern and weave them together appropriately instead, tag or no tag your writing will always be awkward if it's devoid of good flow.

>>17142379
>>17142423
>>17142464
>>17142267

Throwing my hat into the ring conversationally. It's something I struggle with (t. autism) and I've been putting work into it. Be brutal lads, I want to improve.

They were breathless after leaving the rest of the group. Something riding the fine edge of the autumn night's air gave rise to a primal sort of madness; clinging to them as they swam the currents of the night on aluminum steeds shaped like bycicles.

"God Jeffery--" she threw her bike to the side, running her hands along her arms, "--Fuck I'm cold,-- did you *see* Alex and Kate?" she grinned,

"They're *totally* getting together after the game."

Jeffery -- Jeff, grinned easily, some of the anxiety lifting from his shoulders. "I mean he couldn't keep his eyes off her in history. It's so goofy, shit like that doesn't happen anymore, does it?"

Veronica looked up at him, scooting her way into his jacket, her bare flesh icy to the touch. "What-d'ya mean, Jeff?"

"Oh, you know -- romance and everything. Everybody's .. you know, doing *it* all the time, but they never stay together. Shit--" here he dropped his own bike to the grass, sitting down on the curbside with a thump.

"My parents are splitting up."

Veronica stopped trying to squirm her way under his coat and into the heat of his chest, "Wait *really*? Did they tell you?"

"No, but I've seen it in how they treat eachother when me and my sister aren't watching. It's *cold*, baby, like all the love they ever had is dead. I know it shouldn't fuck with me but *damn!*"

Veronica looked aside, taking a moment to scratch a reply into her phone's screen to a text from her BFF. "Man, Jeff -- that sucks.." Her voice trailed away,

>>17150227
>How do you guys go about naming your characters?
common words or made-up semi-common words

She first introduced herself as Sophia, but now he calls her Sophie. She's almost his height, but she still has to stand on her toes to kiss him. From under her usual linen dress an olive complexion spills out, barely tan from glowing in the evening sun. A few freckles dot her cheeks, which blush over a warm smile. Two long streams of auburn hair float in loose curls, framing her soft amber eyes. Her hair was thick as she was pregnant again. At least the doctor thought so. She was not yet showing.

Most days Sophia wore her hair up with a thin white ribbon tied in a bow, a bow which Charlie often tried to pull loose. What started as an occasional tease, developed into an elaborate game, the few unspoken rules established between them over many years. This game between them was always as follows: Charlie would see Sophie and approach her like a knight lancing, but trying to keep a natural yet brisk pace. He also tried to appear preoccupied and busy to throw her off, only reaching to pull the knot loose when she wasn’t looking. But Sophia often noticed, her role being to dodge his attempt with a movement as slight as possible, only shifting away at the last possible second. More times than not, Sophia won. Avoiding him while she was hanging laundry by the river, pulling clean water from their well, or even when she swayed on their porch swing, watching the leaves of grass curl back and forth with the wind like waves.

Both Sophia and Charlie understood that he was only allowed one ‘attempt’ per day, and if successful or unsuccessful, he was unable to try again. This one chance determined who of the two would be the victor for the entire day. Charlie had sworn never again to lie to Sophia, but the couple never once uttered a word about their game to each other. Charlie convinced that he would only upset Sophia by bringing up his large lead in points.

Sophia never mentioned the game to Charlie for exactly the same reason, but was in fact the one with the actual lead in points, Sophia kept a detailed count in a small teal notebook hidden under her nightstand.

>crit me, idk, used the photo as a prompt.
>just trying to weave plot and personality into mundane character descriptions.

The liquid at the bottom of the glass had long since dried up. Little veins of residue had dried, whatever shit he'd had mixed in the whiskey now nothing but a stain. The girl was asleep against his side, her long hair a pillow that sprawled and twisted on his lap.

He twisted his mouth as he looked at her, uncouth thoughts like vermin running up and down the corridors of his mind. He didn't even remember her name, let alone who she *was* as a person. She was young enough to be his daughter and then some; who was *he* to ensnare her here, held in chains of pleasant conversation and wine.

His hand not holding the glass tingled with the thrum of her heartbeat, stroking lazy circles along the contour lines of her stomach. He felt a melange of feelings, most primal of all melancholy rise up to subsume him. This wasn't where he was supposed to be. This wasn't who he was supposed to be with.

The phone rang, the harse noise of his shitty ringtong making him wince. Beneath his crooked arm, she stirred and he felt an immense tenderness towards this nameless girl in this dingy hotel in Eames. She let out a moue of discomfort and turned over, raising her hands to cup her face as she dug deeper into his lap. He pulled the comforter over and draped it over her bare shoulders, covering breasts that rose and fell with a rhythm of innocence.

No, he thought. Not this one.

>>17151527
Correct:
>"That's right," she said.
>"That's right!" she said.
>"That's right." She nodded her head.
>"That's right!" She nodded her head.

Incorrect:
>"That's right." she said.
>"That's right." She said.
>"That's right," She said.
>"That's right!" She said.
>"That's right," she nodded her head.
>"That's right!" she nodded her head.

>>17151732
Cheers, I went through my phase of using a thesaurus for alternatives to "she said." and now I'm just trying to experiment with either doing away with that verb entirely in some contexts.

Is this plausible:
>She nodded her head, "That's right!"

She first introduced herself to him as Sophia, but he calls her Sophie now. She's almost his height, but she still has to stand on her toes to kiss him. From under her usual linen dress an olive complexion spills out, barely tan from glowing in the evening sun. A few freckles dot her blushed cheeks and warm smile and two long streams of auburn hair flowed in loose curls, framing her delicate face and amber eyes. Her hair was getting thicker as it had stopped falling out in their shower about a month ago. She was not yet showing, but she was pregnant again. At least their doctor thought so.

Most days, Sophia wore her hair up with a thin white ribbon tied in a bow, a bow which Charlie often tried to pull loose. What started as an occasional tease, developed into an elaborate game, the few unspoken rules established between them over many years. This game was always as follows: Charlie would see Sophie and approach her like a knight lancing, but kept a natural yet brisk pace. He also tried to appear preoccupied and busy to throw her off, only reaching to pull the knot loose when she wasn’t looking. But Sophia often noticed, her role being to dodge his attempt with a movement as slight as possible, only shifting away at the last possible second. More times than not, Sophia won. Avoiding him with a laugh while she was hanging laundry by the river or pulling clean water from their well. Even when it was quiet and she swayed on their porch swing by herself, watching the leaves of grass curl back and forth against the wind like waves, she could slip his hand.

Both Sophia and Charlie understood that he was only allowed one ‘attempt’ per day, and if successful or unsuccessful, he was unable to try again. This one chance determined who of the two would be the victor for the entire rest of the day. Charlie had sworn never again to lie to Sophia, but oddly enough the couple never once uttered a word about their game to each other. Charlie convinced that he would only upset Sophia by bringing up his large lead in points.
Sophia never mentioned the game to Charlie for exactly the same reason, but was in fact the one with the actual lead in points, as Sophia kept a detailed count in a small teal diary hidden under her nightstand.

After her funeral, Charlie found the diary while his two children were moving out some furniture. Until the end of his life, he would read a few pages every night before we went to bed, making sure not to lose his place with a small white ribbon, as a bookmark.

>looking for crit, trying to embellish a character description into a mini story.

>>17147802
Writing smut commissions can give you a comfy life if you can bite the bullet.
Otherwise you have to meme yourself like Sanderson or Rowling. You write something that the mass wants, then when you make enough you can write what you want.

I'm >>17143193, that was a slice of one of MC's thoughts, but here's the way the first chapter begins, less about his thoughts and more about the environment.

>>17152002
Wew you need to work on your sentence structure. That very first sentence could easily (and should!) be split into two sentences.

Other than that, I can't critique much since it's first person and that puts me off more than anything.

>>17139439
So if I have a very short story I've polished, how do I go about submitting it to a lit mag? I don't know what the fuck lit magazines still exist.

Redpill me on good worldbuilding

>>17152229
The less you make up and the more you copy from real life the better.

>>17152278
that's one hell of an hot take. care to elaborate your reasoning?

>>17152343
"In creative writing classes in college, the professors will say, 'Write what you know.' And that's often misinterpreted to mean you should write a thinly veiled autobiography. [Like] a graduate student in English Literature at University, writing a story in which the hero is a graduate student in English Literature at University... But I think you have to interpret 'Write what you know' much more broadly than that. We're talking about emotional truth here. We're talking about reaching inside here to make your characters real. If you're going to write about a character witnessing a loved one die, you have to dig into yourself, and say, 'Did you ever remember losing a loved one?' Even if it's only a dog that you loved as a child or something. Tap that vein of emotional energy. In some ways, it's not terribly different from what method actors do.... We observe other people from the outside. The only person we ever really know inside and out is ourselves, and we have to reach into ourselves to find the power that makes great fiction real."

The same advice for characters applies to the world. Don't just make stuff up, use your real life experiences and dress them in the costume of your world.

>>17152429
cringe

I got Western Wind for Christmas, and I noticed it really wasn't anywhere online for pirating, at least any I could find anything that wasn't the internet archive, with a weird hour long rental thing.
Would you anons be interested if I typed it out and posted it here on a pastebin or dropbox? I could write the book as I read it. sort of a win-win as Ill remember the material better

How do I come up with cool and imposing names for my anime-esque evil organizations?

>>17152795
Look at patterns that are found in such names:
Names of characters? Wordplay? Euphemisms? Code names?
Take inspiration from these and then add your own twists to them

I think I've fucked up.
I have a world and a story I want to tell in that world, but there is so much backstory and then even backstory to the backstory that I'm stuck on where to begin and whether I should start with a story earlier in the world history to establish a base or to try and find a way to work it all into the original story.

>>17153040
idunno, it doesn't sound like it's possible to fit it all on one story if you want to do it justice but is it possible for you to write multiple works on different eras?

Does jacking off make it harder to write?

Haven't written anything "real" since HS. Picrelated is something I wrote for a player in a DND game of mine from their POV. If I were to try writing an actual story will I make it bros?

>>17153091
It'd probably make you tired.

>>17153292
I feel like it's given me constant brain fog. I thought I just had writers block but it takes me weeks, sometimes months, to start writing. That said, when I get the momentum I can keep going for hours.

>let MONTHS pass since i last sit down to write despite having all the time in the world to do it and being all the time in the computer
>suddenly start writing late into the night when i have to get up early tomorrow
Fuck. Why does this happen? Laziness? An unaddressed lack of faith on my work?

>>17150261
Get better friends

>>17151782
No.

>>17153419
I know this feel bro
I'm at work right now, it's 10 am here and I want to write so much I entered this general
I had three days and wrote only 1k words, but now when I'm at work I feel like I have to write or I'll die

>>17152229
"Set dressing that is immediately relevant to the narrative" is my go-to.

Almost done with human trafficking book, one more chapter

>>17154218
Do you want to publish?

Is Ivory heavier/denser than bone?
Could you have an entire skeleton made of ivory?

>>17154269
Ivory is bone though

Can I type in my CV that I'm a ghostwriter if I've never ghostwritten anything?
It's not like I can give them a proof anyway, sorry but my works are a secret lol, my clients will stay safe

>>17154529
If you lie in your CV you will be blacklisted by everyone in your field and will end up homeless

>>17154540
My point is how are they going to know that I lied
I published some things so it wouldn't be strange to do things like that and have clients

>>17154555
If you don't provide actual references they can check, then you lied. Simple as.

>>17154555
This >>17154564
They might not ask for the individual you wrote for, but they'd want to know about publishers and the like.

>>17153419
Same here bro
>brain refuses to drip any word during day
>suddenly shits out paragraphs left and right when I'm about to sleep

>>17154653
Must be nice getting paragraphs ever.

>>17154564
>>17154586
I see
Sorry bros I'm just retarded

>anon what are you doing for the new year? party with friends?
>Uh, no, I'll continue writing my book
>...oh

Chaps I'm struggling to figure out what tense to use for my novel. Present tense seems to come more naturally to me, and I've written the first few chapters in it, but I'm concerned about maintaining it for the whole story.

Can any very kind anons tell me which they think reads better-- pic related (present).....

>>17154907
... Or pic related (past)? They're both very much first draft stage.

>>17154907
>>17154913
I think you're correct that your present tense comes more naturally and it reads better on a technical level, however I can't help but be drawn more to the past tense.
It could be down to simple personal bias, I'm sorry I can't be more helpful.

>>17155024
Thanks for your feedback, anon, I truly appreciate it. Do you think you're drawn to past tense simply due to conditioning, that most novels are written in it? I feel that though present seems to come more naturally, past is 'correct' even if it takes more refining.

Last thing I want to do is get ~50k words in and realise I need to rewrite the whole lot in a different tense.

>>17155034
Present tense does seem somewhat 'odd' to me. It's like reading a screenplay. However, you should write in what you're comfortable with anon. The present tense you've provided is by no means bad and there is no need to get into too much detail because you said this is your first draft.

>>17154907
>>17154913
Nice writing anon. The past tense is more comfortable for me personally even with a few little mistakes (repeated words, etc) which I assume is due to it being a first draft. It may be more work for you but writing in past tense will make your novel more accessible and give it more longevity IMO. I know that's the opposite of what the other anon said, don't want to confuse you, just my 2 cents.

>>17148098
Editing fast becomes a soulless grind, don't do it.

>>17155082
I'm the other anon and I would agree with this take, I guess it would come down to how serious this work is and whether you intend to have it published. Past tense would definitely make that easier as it is the 'norm', so to speak.

>>17155082
>>17155096
Thanks both. I think I'll rewrite my first few chapters and continue with past tense here on out, despite present coming more naturally. It is my aim to have the piece published eventually. Cheers.

>>17155109
Good luck, anon

I spend more time on imagining success and fantasising I'm a top tier writer than on writing

>>17155401
Can relate

>>17155401
Can also relate

>>17155401
Can't relate, get to work faggot.

>>17155401
Can relate.
I imagine myself being interviewed and holding lectures talking about how to write well, when I haven't written anything for months.

>>17155584
I just want to see my book with my name on it in a store, I don't really care if it sells or not.

>>17155401
I just imagine telling people about my projects in small, intimate settings. Big success isn't comfy.

I am trying a psychological realism type thing. Please tell me what you think about this scene.

I look at the body that was limped on the corner and examined it curiously. The man, who was still unknown, breathed in dry and shallow rhythms. His chest moved conscientiously, and on instances, he would let out a groan. His head jerked around, as if scrutinizing the environment, though because of sheer blood loss, he was always half-aware. He had on himself a stern appearance: his tan-camouflage pants were torn in every part, his combat were boots cleaved, his jacket almost threadbare, and his face, most of all, was in a surrendered look. “I am gonna die,” he’s probably thinking, “…is this where fate has concluded me?” He keeps trying to asses himself, and intermittently touches the walls, but all is banked, it seems, on the worse circumstance. The beaten appearance, however imposing, gave him a satirically deepened sense of valor. It was the kind of valor that was farce, and was only such that, a fleeting wind would be enough to blow the impression forthward. Tomas, my partner, had positioned him on an empty couch; his right arm is now covering the two wounds in his chest area, and his other arm was approximate the empty pistol holster.

“What should we do with him?” I asked Tomas, who was pacing by an agape window.
“Well what do you suggest?” he replied. I was struck at the particularity of his voice, but that instance quickly vanished as he spoke again. “We are stuck in this building, and we have this to account for.”

>>17155401
I imagine lines of shy young women asking for me to sign copies of my debut at the local B&N. Also getting royalty checks in the mail.

>>17155807
>I look at the body that was limped on the corner and examined it curiously
I don't think limped can be used here.
> breathed in dry and shallow rhythms
Rhythms can be shallow but not dry
>His chest moved conscientiously, and on instances, he would let out a groan.
Is English a foreign language to you? Not being a dick but you word choices here feel utterly alien.

>>17155871
My 3rd actually. I write mainly in my native language, Filipino and this is an attempt at English prose lol. I know something sounded off, perhaps I should use a thesaurus?

>>17155807
>>17155881
I think you need to simplify it. Some word choices come across as a real stretch to whether they're being used correctly if at all.

>>17155881
I'll try to rewrite that bit for you.
>His chest moved laboriously. On occasion he would let out a groan.
You use a lot of commas and most of them wrong, but since English is my third language as well I'm not going to risk giving you faulty advice.
Keep trying.

Is this sentence overwritten? They say kill your darlings, and I feel it's a little much, but I really like the internal rhyme.

>>17156084
The ideas are fine but the way you've structured them is a bit of a pain to parse.

>>17155807
>His head jerked around, as if scrutinizing the environment, though because of sheer blood loss, he was always half-aware.
Way, way too many commas in here. Reading this out loud I'd pause a little at each comma, which would make the sentence sound really staccato and broken up.

I agree with the other anons about your word choice. A lot of stuff is used wrong or in really odd ways. Did you look up words to use or did you just use what came to mind? In either case, I'd suggest you read more English lit to get a better feel for what goes where. There's also an exercise I've seen where you deliberately copy something you like word for word to get a feel for the rhythm which might be worth looking into.

Your verb tenses are screwy. Both past and present tense verbs are used: compare "I look at the body" to "the man... breathed." The past tense here implies that the man isn't currently breathing since the actual actions are taking place in the present tense. You could use "is breathing" or "breathes." In the next sentence, there's "his chest moved" and "he woud let out a groan" which would both be seen in a story that uses the past tense. Compare to "His chest moves laboriously, and occasionally he emits a groan." (changing out "conscientiously" like the other anon did).

>>17155871
>Rhythms can be shallow but not dry
Both adjectives are describing the breath, not the rhythm, though. "Rhythm" is also being used as a descriptor for that breathing, which lets the two adjectives work (I'd say a rhythm also isn't usually shallow).

>>17156084
The whole sentence is punctuated wrong. First comma is unnecessary and the semicolon could either be a comma or omitted. Second set of commas is I think right but seems awkward, maybe a place for the dash break that you use later. I think the best course is to separate the sentence before "Eileen," though (and change laughing to laughed of course), and eliminate those commas entirely.

Are there any successful CYOA books in recent years?
Or are they all VN and WEGs now?

>>17156084
Lose the semi colon, and its nice but westering makes it a little stilted

>>17156084
It isn't hard to understand and it isn't overwritten but the punctuation is horrid. I'm also not sure the word 'westering' seems very appropriate.

>>17155401
I imagine myself explaining the making of and ideas of my work in detail on a podcast.
It's stupid and sad but I found it to be helpful in figuring out what I intend to do with my characters and themes.

>>17155401
this is the kind of stuff that fuels my energy to write, the potential of success

>>17155401
>>17157285
What is "success" to you, even? Having money? Having strangers praise your shit? Having your dumb mug posted everywhere online? Having reporters call you every other day? What is desirable about any of that?

>>17155868
>I imagine lines of shy young women asking for me to sign copies of my debut at the local B&N.
This hurts. Why have you hurt me so, anon?

>>17157320
Success to me is creating something that people agree is beautiful

https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/37998/wish-mountain/chapter/598841/one

It's up!

Big day today. Majorly important chapter just uploaded. The new chapter just uploaded is pivotal to the story. I've linked the first chapter for haven't started it yet.

>>17157500
Nice, will read when I have the time, but I have to ask, does Royal Road accept contemporary works or just fantasy/lit-rpg?

>>17157526
From what I gather you can post anything you want. But you're not going to find much of an audience if doesn't appeal to 16 year old boys with power fantasies.

>>17157526
You can post any genre on there. The only things you can't do is sexual content like pedophilia, bestiality, or sex between minors or anyone below age of 18. Also you can't use real-world religion, politics, or depiction of real culture groups in an offensive way. If you absolutely feel the need to do any of that stuff you can always try Scribblehub, which is basically the den of degeneracy as far as I'm aware.

>>17157626
>Also you can't use real-world religion, politics, or depiction of real culture groups in an offensive way
Shit.

>>17143521
>>17143634
>>17146126
>>17146213
you know it's literally the opening of Demian by Hermann Hesse? lmao

>>17157576
>But you're not going to find much of an audience if doesn't appeal to 16 year old boys with power fantasies.
Well, that's depressing.

>>17157670
oh no no no

>>17157699
Why? Judging by your pic, anime garbage catering to 16-year-olds should be right up your alley

>>17157670
Thank god I've never wasted my time with Hesse, that was shit

>>17157670
It's funny seeing anons criticising and saying to rewrite famous acknowledged books written by top writers because they think it's some random anon's work

Who's your biggest indie inspiration?

>>17157670
>>17157968
>>17157847
It's almost as if the expectations and conventions for fiction written in 1919 are immeasurably different from the expectations and conventions for fiction written a hundred years later.
Retards.

>>17157347
Because I hope that if I share my hurt with you, we can carry that hurt together.

how long do you guys make your chapters usually? 20 pages? 30? Because mine can get as long as 50 at times and I don't know if that might be too much, too little or just right

>>17158068
Normally around 7 pages according to Google docs.

>>17158068
I usually want my chapters to be around 2,000 words, so I don't know.

>>17158095
>>17158130
light novels are not literature
gtfo from /lit/

>>17158136
Anon, having more than 10,000 words for a chapter is a bit excessive.

>>17158136
Vacuous wanking about word counts is not literature.

>>17158173
If only there were numbers between 2,000 and 10,000.

>>17147929
>even Sally Rooney

maybe that's because her book is utter trash

>>17158136
>ask a question and get answers
>get hostile when you don't hear what you want to hear

>>17149770
>r u me

Try not to dwell so much. Half the music is in the cadence; the rest is between the lines. You write well, so keep going.

>>17158273
Most chapters in Anna Karenina are literally the length of a page or two. You don't know what you're talking about.

>>17158279
Okay, but it's bestselling and has a popular adaptation. If anyone could afford to do it full time it would be her, but it's not enough. Try outselling Normal People lmao.

>>17158343
I highly doubt anon is writing Anna Karenina.

>>17157626
>you can always try Scribblehub, which is basically the den of degeneracy as far as I'm aware.
It looks like they also disallow stuff with people under 18:
https://www.scribblehub.com/content-guidelines/
Sucks, all I want to do is write my epheb erotica and get paid for it. Writing erotica between consenting adults is so damn boring.

>>17157626
>You can post any genre there
>Except...

>>17158401
kek

>>17158365
Maybe not, but I've found that when chapters are shorter I tend to finish books more quickly. If I'm up reading at 1am it's a lot more tempting to squeeze a 3-page chapter in than it is to start an 8k word marathon.

new bread when?

>>17158351
I really just wanted to shitpost about her having >no discernible talent, but seeing as you're really intent on bringing me back to the crux of your absurd argument--you're wrong. Even if she got royally fucked over on her book deal and the television rights, her next book would put any financial worries (that she likely doesn't have) to bed. The editorial gigs, I assume, are something she wants to do for the sake of doing them.

>>17158423
Personally I prefer around 4k. But I find chapters quite arbitrary anyway and I don't have a problem stopping and starting without using chapters as a marker.

>>17158501
How much do you think a book advance is, exactly?

>>17158466
Here you go
>>17158553

>>17158548
Do you know what royalties are?

>>17158068
>measuring length in pages