/lit/ - Literature

>>16704751
>new thread
That's my signal to write 500 words. See you in an hour anons!

>he writes in present tense
Please tell me none of you do this.

>>16704780
>he wrote in present tense
please told me none of you did done this

1k words today after being a lazy piece of shit all weekend
you're making progress, too, aren't you anon?

>>16704780
You will write in the future tense and in the second person.

>>16704826
>dolphin porn

>>16704780
I write in present tense.
Explain why it's bad.

>>16704765
>>16704826
Wrote over 700 words the past hour and looking to finish strong tonight after a week long rut of anxiety of how to write this chapter.We ARE going to make it bros!

>>16704780
I write in first person AND present tense, fight me

>>16704765
>>16705063
I'm back! Exactly 500 words and I think I'll do it again in an hour. Another 1500 words and I think this chapter will be wrapped.

>>16704780
It's funny, of the three books I've written, two started out in present tense before I abandoned it 2k words in. I don't know how people do it, feels like I'm writing a script and not a proper story.

>>16705063
>>16705099
How do you wrote so much so quickly?
My problem isn't quantity. I can write 5k words a day easily. My problem is doing it in a reasonable time. I can spend like 10 hours (with breaks) writing 5k words which is obscene.

>>16705135
Not them, but outlining helps a ton. Knowing the layout of what you're going to write before you sit down is great, helps the process feel as smooth as possible

>>16705135
I couldn't tell you even if I knew so myself. As the other anon said, outlining the plot of a individual chapter helps a lot. I had a few ways of going about it before I settled on something that I cooked up in the wagie cagie over the weekend. I'm also the kind of person to write like 1k over a 9 hour period, so don't feel too bad. Discipline and making it a habit of not clicking away from your word document of choice goes a long way.

>>16705135
Outline so you know what direction to drive in. Right now I wrote a scene where the main character recovers from what was basically a car accident by being quickly patched up by strangers and then has to hustle to work where his boss threatens to fire him until he rips off some bandages to make a point. So the task of writing was just me describing the accident, adding an ejected passenger, his injuries (body horror is a theme here), the daze of being on the ground, not knowing exactly what happened, the mannerisms of the facelsss strangers that help him, pushing out through the crowd, getting his bike back, and showing up at tue parking lot for work where his boss is waiting for him. Then I wrote the discussion they had and going to the bathroom to get the first aid kit. All this happened in two pomodoros.

But my outline notes basically just say "the accident happens" -> "main character goes to work to see his boss". I was able to write quickly because I knew where I was going.

what do you think?

>>16705483
Why can't any of you fuggets looking for critique just write like a normal, functioning person instead of trying to ape "the classics" with garbage purple prose?

>>16705483
Needs to be condensed of course, lots of unnecessary words. Once you've cut it down by half come back and I'll give a more extensive opinion.
>>16705594
This clearly a rushed draft done to meet a word count goal, probably for nanowrimo.

Almost time to do it again boys. A thousand words a day. Exciting!

>>16705594
>>16705657

I should probably tone it down, thanks.

>>16705723
No, the descriptive prose is fine. I said you need to condense it. Make it shorter without altering your imagery.

>>16703272
>Why not Wattpad or Penana or even Fanfiction?

Probably because of the audience. Wattpad is geared more towards YA romance and coming of age stories. Not many anons write shit like that. Even the top-ranked fantasy stories there have pathetic view counts compared to RR. I've never heard about Penana before, looks like some crappy erotica hub. And fanfiction is—surprise—for fanfiction. Why would you ever post original stories there, even if it's technically allowed? No self-respecting writer touches fanfiction, or goes near people who read fanfiction.

>>16705483
Shit's so purple it's turning black. Also, stop abusing your poor comma.

>>16705594
One of the biggest problems /lit/tards who are trying to be authors have. This board apes nothing but the classics and dismisses any new work. I'm guilty of this too. However what these types of writers don't get is that trying to emulate works from 100 years ago is either going to leave you with shitty purple prose or something that's presentable but isn't never going to go anywhere because somebody a 100 years ago has done it way better. I don't know. Fellas you're not going to be James Joyce or Homer or Gogol or Pynchon. Please really think about this deeply.

>legitimately want to have a career in writing because it's the only creative endeavor that makes me feel fulfilled
>basically required to move to C*lifornia because that's where all of the industry is
It really was rigged from the start wasn't it

>>16705995
>legitimately want to have a career in writing
I found where you went wrong.

>>16706039
I just want to make people happy and entertain them with good stories man, I don't know what else to say to that.

>>16706047
So write them. Build it and they will come. You don't have to move to California to do that, you can write anywhere.

>>16706053
Yeah but from what I'm seeing all the best opportunities are in places like LA where all the big names operate.
I don't have an issue with slaving as a WPA for a couple years but I would rather die than move there.

>>16706062
>I would rather die than move there.
Why? Terrified of liberals? Worried you'll be seduced by a spunky hispanic trap and lose your purity? Spit out your thoughts man.

>>16706073
Besides the general drug addicts leaving needles and feces everywhere and there just generally being gross people there it's just unlivable there now with how high cost of living there is.
I'm an AZ fag, I've had enough of them shitting up my home state as it is. I'm trying to move farther away from the southwest in general if I can manage it.

>>16706087
So you're scared of cities and have decided to let that fear control your life is the gist.

Why don't you just write and submit screenplays from your basement if it's that repugnant to you? You can do that literally anywhere.

>>16706098
Like I said, there's no job opportunity to be had from just writing and posting screenplays. And definitely no way to network with people already in the writing industry to make a name for myself.
I don't fear cities either. I'm just tired of living in them.
If it were possible for me to make a living from home like that it would be worth it.

>>16706111
I guess you're just shit out of luck like I originally implied then. Woe is you.

>>16706120
I mean you didn't really have any good input from the beginning, so you just sound autistic for trying to be so snide.

>>16706129
There's no good input to give someone who is unwilling to try. Do you expect the industry to move to Oklahoma? No? Then cry alone in the dark.

>>16706143
Your "advice" just boils down to
>dude just do it lol
With nothing else to expand on that. It's just retarded to think anyone can derive anything useful from that.

>>16706153
My advice was actually that you go whine by yourself about your dreams that you are unwilling to follow.. That's literally the most useful thing I can tell you. You don't seem like the type who would consider an alternative like Atlanta or New York because all those probably spook you too. So what am I to tell you other than to fuck off?

>>16706163
>So what am I to tell you other than to fuck off?
Just not reply and ignore the post instead of making yourself look like an angry spastic?

>>16706165
Why would I if I can endlessly heap abuse on your cowardice for my own entertainment? Throwing away an entire "career" because you think California is full of poop deserves to be laughed at.

>>16706169
>Why would I if I can endlessly heap abuse on your cowardice for my own entertainment?
Abuse would imply that I'm upset by anything you've said when in reality you're just trying to talk down on someone on an anonymous message board using language of the fedora-tippers of yore.

>>16706179
You seem upset to me.

>>16706181
I mean, you're free to believe whatever helps you sleep at night, bud.

>>16705995
It honestly doesn't sound like you want it bad enough. Have you written anything that you can show?

>>16706198
I'm still writing as mainly a hobby but I know that I have so much passion for it that I want to make a career out of it.
I'm still researching alternative paths to get into the industry but I've been playing around with some ideas to get myself at least some presence in the writing world.
What I'm most passionate about is cartoons honestly, especially how characters are written. I've been slowly making plans in my free time to see if I can start doing video essays on modern cartoons and the industry itself and highlight the successes and failures from both. If that ever takes off I'd love to move onto a podcast and do interviews with people in the industry too and pick their brains about their experiences as well.
So I'm not flying by the seat of my ass here, but it's definitely something that I have to carefully plan out so I don't bite the dust early on.

>>16705967

Is there room for a movement of writers who grew up on the internet. The appeal of something like Joyce to me is being able to immerse myself fully in the mind of someone from that time and by proxy learn philosophies and modes of being. I'm interested similarly in the mind of men now and not to turn away from it and embrace the fact at this point humanity is a screen addled mutation of itself.

>>16706211
>cartoons
>video essays
>podcasts
>hasn't published anything
peak /lit/

>>16706250
He's in the right place though. This is /eceleb/ general, right?

>>16706250
>>16706259
Bad bait

>>16706271
Go make your podcast, there's no reason for you to be here.

>>16706276
>there's no reason for you to be here
Fuck I guess you're right, why come to a place called Writing General to discuss making a living out of writing and analyzing other popular works?

>>16706062
>Yeah but from what I'm seeing all the best opportunities are in places like LA where all the big names operate.

>be a complete beginner
>go to the place where the fiercest competition on the planet is concentrated
Might as well just neck yourself now, dumbass

>>16706291
You're under the impression that I'm just going to drop everything and move to another state with no research done whatsoever.
I know there's a myriad of retards on this website but you are really jumping to conclusions here.

>>16706294
>no research done whatsoever.
How do you think this magical "research" will help you?

>>16706296
>how do you think having knowledge about a particular field of work get you into that field of work?
lmao

>>16706298
Okay, so you actually have no idea. As I thought.

>>16706296
I don't know but he might figure out he can do everything he described without moving at all. He's just incredibly spooked by the idea that he could actually take responsibility for his own success.

>>16706303
And yet you've offered no real rebuttal whatsoever and are just trying to shitpost, so your input is worthless either way.

>>16706307
They eat idiots like you for breakfast there, but it's really none of my problem. Do whatever you want man

>>16706283
Bruh, the people who write about and anlyze cartoons are over at /co/ right now. They could give you way better input and way less shit.

>>16706305
And I did describe how I had some plans to get to that success >>16706211
You're just trying to act superior and not actually give any real input.
>>16706313
ok retard

>>16706315
I did make a thread on /co/ and they did support the ideas I had, I just figured that /lit/ would have more refined thoughts on it that I could get and discuss. Since it is a board specifically about writing and all.

I have this idea for a story where people are on board a space ship returning to Earth. The reason for their journey and their return is not really fleshed out, but we assume they were sent on this sugoi-desu-ne space journey at some relatively romantic time in humanity's past (ie, the world was happy and people were optimistic) and are returning due to some kind of failure.

During their return journey they encounter the news of everything that has befallen Earth as they get closer and closer through like, TV broadcasts and the like. They hear about disaster after disaster and basically the downfall of the great visage of humanity they left behind. Throughout all this the crew members themselves engage in fierce debate about all the politics and problems they hear about.

I haven't thought about how it should end. The reason they 'get ahead of' the news broadcasts will probably be explained away with like wormhole magic or some shit.

>>16705483
>he did this
>she did that

redpill, your ebin idea and worldbuilding mean nothing, it's all about the execution, plot and characters

>>16706336
Not really a unique story concept but theres lot of room to play with it. Literally reminds me of the future Godzilla cartoon on netflix where humanity tried to escape Godzilla by leaving the planet for a while only to find he literally went nowhere lol

>>16705483
A lot of telling and not showing.
For example the first two sentences can easily be rewritten to better help the reader imagine the scene:
>(Wife's Name) felt the arms of her husband wrap around her in a brief wordless embrace, and as he released her she felt her hair being lovingly teased and she turned to watch him move to the window.
And then you would describe his features in the following sentence.

>>16704751
>writing genre shit
>need name for my world/planet
>what's a good word for planet/earth/etc?
>Geo!
>Too obvious.
>Gea!
>Much better, but too short.
>How about "all of gea"?
>Great, what's a good prefix for "all of"?
>Pan! Oh, I like pan!
>Pangea!
>FUCK!

What do I do now? I'm stuck, spitefully, on pangea and everything else I think of sounds stupid and I hate it. Ideas?

>>16706531
Terra Obscura.

>>16706531
What a bind, the International Geological Society might sue you if you use Pangea like fucking hell they will

How is the writing going today fellas? What's your word counts so far?

Arm was feeling better this evening. I wrote 300 words

>>16704751
Would writing be a good way to channel negative emotions? My melancholy has been getting worse to the point i'm half considering just offing myself

>>16706892
You'll likely just get even more depressed. Writers aren't exactly famous for their mental health. Pick up some simple sport instead.

>>16706892
Honestly, you never get over that shit. You just get better at dealing with it.

>>16706767
zero
i don't know what the fuck to write about. probably just gonna go back to writing scenes again and hope they go somewhere

>>16706933
>>16706949

So I wanna write a side-character who constantly quotes other pieces of media (non-public media)
Can I get in trouble for that?
Or do I have to go out of my way (footnotes?) to clarify that the character is quoting a copyrighted work?

>>16707639
It's fine. And if it's not fine we can all just go to hell tomorrow.

>>16706892
It can be helpful but the main thing is for you to find something that actually makes you feel happy. Everything else is just therapy to get you to that.

I've made a deal with a friend of mine who also likes to write; we are to exchange short stories or chapters and review them so that each of us can learn something and improve. I'd like to be as effective a helper as possible; what principles should I never forget when offering criticism?

How's this as an opening scene?

Pretty good.
I like the use of alliteration in the first line.
Shouldn't punctuation go outside of the quotation marks though? Or is that just a British thing?

>>16708580
Trying too hard and you don't know how to punctuate dialogue.

>>16708613
Im not too sure, I need to revisit all the scenes to get the grammar in order. Can you critique this scene please? Love to hear your thoughts

>>16704780
past tense chads rise up

Any books on overcoming the feeling of your premises/stories being fucking stupid and nothing but wastes of time?

>>16708635
>Starting sentence with 'But'
I do not like this.
>"and the sharp that cold had felt as snow had left and the sun would melt"
This feels like a bad, drawn-out sentence, with too many uses of 'Sharp'. I do like the attempt at making it poetic (smelt, melt, felt), it just needs tightening up to create a smoother flow.

Overall, it's pretty good. You should feel proud with what you have written, and stick with it. Obviously it will need to go through a few edits to just smooth out the few kinks here and there, but for a first or second draft(?), I like it.

>>16705121
I feel like, in a way, past tense feels correct. If it's first person, then the narrator is recounting experiences they had already experienced. It doesn't make sense for the reader to be there as it happened. Same thing with third person, but that another party is recounting the story. It doesn't make sense for the reader to be with the narrator again.

>>16708700
Premises matter very little; execution is what matters. Think of an idea, not a plot related idea, but a thematic idea. What do you want to say? Do you want to make some commentary on human existence? Do you comment on the novel as a medium? Do you want to tell a fun story about a buff fantasy dude who drinks beer and fucks princesses? Don't expect a brilliant premise to come to you like an epiphany; think of what to say and then come up with an excuse (i.e, premise) to do it.

Is it against the rules to show and criticize works written in any other language than English?

>>16708732
No.
It's just harder to get a discussion going on an English image board when no one can understand it.

>>16708740
I don't know anywhere else.

>>16706531
Omnigea.

>>16708580
Opening with a run-on sentence is always a terrible idea. The second line seems to be missing words. Were you drunk when you wrote it? It barely makes any sense and is riddled with mistakes.

>>16706892
Like the others say, you just get better at dealing with it, but it marks you for life. Suicidal ideation is damnation. Writing, at least, is a productive outlet. I also recommend taking walks. Outside dulls the crushing nihilism since you're not just a closed loop of thoughts, but have external stimulus.

>>16708580
am I having a stroke

>>16708769
"The rattles and ringing and ruckousing mishmash of pots and pans and metalworks straddled the floor. A pristine path was left between the galley door and I."

Better?

>>16708800
"Straddle" is not a word I'd use for a "mishmash of pots and pans" on the floor.

>>16708816
Littered?

>>16708822
If you write "littered the floor", it suggests the objects are stationary, which contradicts the "rattling and ringing and ruckusing", which indicates they are presently in motion.

>>16708843
I see what you mean. So the pots and pans should be bouncing around before the silence comes and they settle?

>>16708851
Logically, yes.

>>16706531
The world of jenpan

>>16708718
"That wit that felt as sharp as the slickest of silvers smelted by swordsmiths, that burnt at the crisping snow that left as the sun would melt, and sliced at the tick-tocks that passed us as we'd talk till the sun had slept"

Is that getting better?

>>16708882
*smelt not smelted

>>16708882
None of this makes any sense, it's like you're just stringing together random words that sound good to you. Wit like slick silver? What burned at snow? Crisp snow? Sun melts? Sliced tick-tocks? What the everloving fuck? A lot of confusing fluff and wrong tenses just to say the characters talked until nightfall.

>>16708882
Those silvers sure are slick.

>>16708947
No, the character is describing why he likes the direct way his love interest talks

>>16708882
That wit is sharp - silver sliver
Smithed at Smith weather
Slick under your skin, recognize? Never.

>>16708978
I don't understand any of this

>>16708978
Sick rhymes

>>16708947
Ok, how about this

"That wit that cut like the sharpest silvers smelt by swordsmiths, and charm that burnt through snow that crisped as the sun would melt it and had us talk away the tick-tocks that passed till the sun had slept"

>>16708882
>That wit that felt as sharp as the slickest of silvers smelted by swordsmiths, that burnt at the crisping snow that left as the sun would melt, and sliced at the tick-tocks that passed us as we'd talk till the sun had slept

She had a wit about her. It would bite like a sword crafted by the slickest of silversmiths. It was as if the very forge of of those smiths would melt the hours away as we walked and talked until the sun had set.

Is this basically what you're trying to say? I feel like I'm leaving out an extra line of thought also I can't stop laughing.

>>16709057
They're not walking and talking, they're resting, See >>16708635

>>16709049
Well, as a sentence, it's still like a squirrel left under a truck, but at least the core point can now be gleaned without involving the entire cryptology department.

>>16709057
I don't like it, it has no rhythm to it and no escalation. It's too flat.

>>16709080
Focusing a lot on minor details. The original sentence is nonsense and the rewrites haven't been any better. It doesn't need to be picked apart word by word, it needs to be rewritten entirely. >>16709057 is the best version of the line so far.

>>16709122
That version is too cold. It sounds like a 40 year old man describing his 40 year old wife. And "forging" and "crafted" don't convey the heartbeats that rise when you're about to confess to the woman you've been eyeing. From that I'm getting the image of some husband describing his wife as the rain pours

>>16709142
But at least you're getting something from it. I would really recommend getting rid of the sentence and starting it from scratch. Using what you have now as a basis and rewriting it a hundred times will only result in something that is "better than before" but not actually good. Just try it and see how it turns out.

>>16709177
Ok, I incorporated the ideas

"Her wit that cut like the sharpest silvers smelt by swordsmiths, and charm that burnt through snow thay crisped when the sun would melt. That same charm that had us talk away the time that passed until the sun had slept"

>>16709187
>Her wit that cut like the sharpest silvers smelt by swordsmiths, and charm that burnt through snow thay crisped when the sun would melt. That same charm that had us talk away the time that passed until the sun had slept

She had a wit that cut as if it were a sword smelted by the finest of silversmiths. She had charm that was radiant like the sun and could have melted the snow from the earth if she fancied. It wasn't long before time escaped us and the sun had since been to bed as we spoke together before the glint of the silvery moon.

>>16709244
Idk why I had to shoehorn the moon thing in there now that I think about it. Kind of silly to say silversmiths and the silvery moon? Idk.

>>16709244
I like it now a lot better than what you had >>16709057 but it still suffers from the fact that the character is opining between a break in their conversation before trying to confess his love, and not chatting and walking away the time
But it is getting better

>>16709266
Ok I see.

>ended up not writing for a week again

>>16709260
maybe she's a werewolf. her claws are razor sharp, the heat from between her legs is warm like the sun, and when fucked doggystyle she bays at the silvery moon. idk too much purple prose, too much telling. why not have actual dialogue showing a bit of their rapport, and then say they talked until moonrise

>>16709348
I love that word. Rapport. He should definitely use that.

>>16709344
Are you in the middle of writing something or did you not start it yet?

>>16709387
I've written like two pages. I'm definitely gonna write now though.

I hope

>>16709401
You got this.

>>16709401
took me like a full year to hit 10k words. knew where the story was going to go down the line, but needed setup to get to that point. didn't make a habit of writing so it didn't get done. you know how I pushed through? forcing myself to dedicate time to writing every day, and pushing through. most days now, writing is a pleasure. it still can be a chore, but its enjoyable, even when I'm at points where I'm struggling here and there. make it happen anon

>>16709348
>why not have actual dialogue showing a bit of their rapport
I already have dialogue, I just wanted those few sentences fixed, I think you're focused too much on that one part

>>16709498
I think you're right. I also think you're trying to have too many descriptions in that sentence when the dialogue should have already spoken for itself. Are the important points that she's nice and smart? No. This was shown through earlier dialogue. The important point is that they spoke for an extended period of time. How about.

Her wit and charm captivating and, before long, time escaped us. The sun had descended during the late afternoon, gone to bed, and by the time we finished our conversation, it was under the glint of the silvery moon, high in the night sky.

>>16709588
But they aren't talking for long, just shooting the shit on the ship while they wait, and the MC starts to work up the courage to confess to her. I wanted to portray the emotions rising in him regarding her before the lines come out, but I get what you mean

>>16708843
>>16708947
>>16709083
>>16709122
>>16709177
>>16709588
Between all the shitposts I wanna thank you guys for helping me clean up that text. It's hard to smell the flowers when you've glazed over your own writing a hundred times

>>16709611
oh. in that case drop the moon entirely - I seriously thought the point was they had been talking for hours - and focus more on imagery with the setting sun.

>consider buying laptop so I'm not stuck at a desk all day
>$600 for shit specs
>$2000 for low-to-medium specs

Never mind then.
I guess I'll just stay stuck in forever.

>>16709722
I legit bought a Chromebook for writing. You're stuck with Google Docs and they're definitely spying on you but it did wonders for my productivity since the lack of ability to do anything but write kept me focused.

>>16708700
Every writer either thinks this and pushes through anyway, or is so egotistical not to think it at all.
Just keep writing.

>>16709948
What's the best writing software? I'm thinking of just going back to pen and paper, feel more in control and organized.

I've done it, /wg/. I've finally started writing my novel. 700 words in an hour. Thank you guys for keeping me motivated. I hope that I will have something to share with you soon.

>>16709981
anything free. libreoffice, openoffice, vim. pen and paper gets incredibly unwieldy with anything over even a small length, and editing is a nightmare. for trad publishing editors don't want to read you chickenscratch and self publishing you'll be doing it online so you'll have to type it anyway.

>>16709981
I'm a shill for Scrivener. I really think it has the right approach in making it really easy to outline and sort your writing. I usually make a board of story beats for a chapter and then literally fill them in one by one for example. Then I can keep snapshots of my past drafts as I edit, easily add comments, link within the documents, use a full screen "focused" mode etc. etc. It is to other word processors like photoshop is to paint, at least in my opinion.
[Spoiler]it also makes it really easy export to compile and publish an ebook[/spoiler]

Everything else is pretty much "just a word processor" to me. Pick something with auto-backups so you don't lose progress and move on.

>>16710042
Good to hear anon, you can do it. We can do it. Everyone can do it. Never give up!

> check it out:
The sky is clean and the wind is so insistent that the moon seems to be pushed by it. Indigo figures swim across the field of tall black grass. The wind makes waves which as a rule push in circuitous yet wide motions. These paths seem made by mysterious feet and roll gently past my window. The manor sits at the bottom of the vale, between the parallel hills that force the sea gales through the vale to the vacuum of the open plains.

I might make out stars, but it is impossible to be sure. I know I should return to my covers, to real darkness, and wake up on the other side of day.

>>16710568
>> check it out:
>The sky is clean and the wind is so insistent that the moon seems to be pushed by it.
Dry and soulless, mixing simple vivid words loke sky and wind and moon with technical words like insistent
>Indigo figures swim across the field of tall black grass.
Huh?
>The wind makes waves which as a rule push in circuitous yet wide motions.
What does that word even mean, and "yet", so does that mean its congruent to wide motions?
>These paths seem made by mysterious feet and roll gently past my window.
Again I feel like you're trying to weave poetics into the passage but you can't wax and wane with small words and then drop "mysterious" in the middle of the sentence. Also it doesnt feel like there's any tempo so far, the pacing jumps all around.
>The manor sits at the bottom of the vale, between the parallel hills that force the sea gales through the vale to the vacuum of the open plains.
Vale sounds disgusting repeated in such close proximity to the first occurrence. I like what you were going for with "Parallel hills....gales...vale" but words like "force" and phrases like "of the open plains" break whatever tempo was established earlier in the sentence.
>I might make out stars, but it is impossible to be sure.
This means nothing in the context of the last sentence.
>I know I should return to my covers, to real darkness, and wake up on the other side of day.
This is bad, but its the best sentence here.

All in all I walked away from that with no imagery, no clue what is happening, no clue what the speaker is feeling, and no lyricism, tempo, emotion, or form that engaged me to read further

Is it better to write fast or write well?

>>16710737
Write fastly well

I'm going to finish up my chapter tonight, after I watch some election coverage

>>16710737
Write fast. Edit well.

BREAKING NEWS

Amazon KDP has new "series" tool that allows you to order your books in a series

What do you think would be a fitting size for the main party of an adventure story? Too many and it's hard to keep track off and give every character development scenes, there is no such thing as too few I think. But what is your preference?

>>16710829
This

>>16710962
classic dnd size. 4 to 6. meatshield, healer, rogue, magic user as base. and 2 hybrids. can swap out one of the 4 for a hybrid if staying 4, or if for some reason your setting has low magic/healing or you aren't doing magic at all in which case your healer/magic user become technical specialists/scientists instead.

>>16710962
There is no limit. GoT has how many characters? Iliad and the Odyssey as well. LoTR has like 20 characters that get good development. In my story I have the core 6 + 10 side characters I have tons of development planned for.

If you have to wonder if its possible to develop all the characters you have planned, you should rethink your story beats. Maybe you're lacking too much drama, remember you can develop multiple characters off of each other and that gives you space to hone in more on individuals

>>16710962
8. Keep a few in the background, kill some off, bring one on and have a tight core emerge.

>>16710988
He can always write a more books. GoT has a huge cast but old fat man was theoretically going to write a bunch of books that would flesh all of them out

>>16710984
I don't want to have strict "roles" in the party. As I'm writing a story where people on the run banded together to seek a new beginning by escaping the country. So it feels wrong to have a carefully built party with defined roles.

>>16710988
The problem is I'm going to flesh out the world with many side characters as well as sideplots and deuteragonists. So with already so many characters I fear adding more to the main party is going to cluster the story

>>16710991
Aka the fellowship of the ring? That's what I'm planning to do actually. Introduce two core characters first then the others ones, some will be killed of and some will leave the party, but always the two characters will remain. But what is the right number of characters in the party at the same time?

>>16711028
I dont know what kinda trip your characters will be taking but you should treat side characters as development opportunities. Since you have a fellowship type vibe, I would use side characters' entrance and exit as a chance to reveal something either to the reader about the main casts' relationships among each other, or reveal something to the main cast that causes conflict amongst themselves. That way, you can weave in their dynamics alongside the development and introduction of the side characters, and it makes side characters more memorable since their entrance/exit permanently changes the core groups' dynamics and could be impactful for the reader

>>16711069
To add on this, you can use those in-between segments where the main cast is traveling or escaping or hunting to their next destination to mull over and explore ramifications and revelations caused by side characters. It would allow readers to soak in the main party's emotions and history more, while making side characters more memorable because we can see what they fucked up/made better about the main group

>>16711083
To give an example of this, let's say Amber and Gene are escaping some military general, are good friends but fell out of touch, but will stick by each other when it matters and that's all we know about them.
Then Craig comes along and he's able to get the characters to where they need to go, but what he wants in return goes against the moral code of Gene while Amber is determined to do what needs to be done.
Maybe they have a falling out and Gene notes how much she's changed since they were younger, and this causes a bit of a rift between them, while another character is introduced that Gene latches on to. It could be a guy that seems to espouse all the virtues he looks up to, or maybe a girl that seems like Amber to him but better. Then it's revealed that really, the guy wasn't as moral as he thought, or the girl had other qualities that broke the illusion of her being another Amber.
Then Gene somehow accepts that his desire to be perfectly moral or to have the people around him be perfectly virtuous is just a remnant of his childishness that he needs to get rid of to truly grow up. He gains a new appreciation for Amber, Amber maybe realizes she has lost touch with the dreams and desires and wonder she had in her youth, and they make new friends along the way.
Then Craig gets his head bashed in by the other new character because it turns out Craig was an evil asshole all along and the new character isn't as naive as Amber and Gene.

>>16711125
Thanks for the advice anon. Not sure if I can flesh out the characters so skillfully, but Iw I'll give it a try

How do I make my prose more "economical"
It comes out so flowery most of the time, and cutting it down leaves it very bare and dry instead.

>>16711460
Choose one or the other.

>>16709648
No prob bro, that's what we're all here for

>>16709948
>I legit bought a Chromebook for writing
I once made the same mistake. Without internet connection, it was nothing but a crappy paperweight, and had too little processing power to even run the simplest text editor without stuttering. Took it back to refund the very next day and bought a real laptop.

>>16711171
>Jump, ran, fucked, left, came, went, saw.
These are simple words that push along a narrative in a meaningful way.

>Inconsolably, consequential, pacifying, magnanimous.
These words skew more to technical, but can still convey an image and push along a narrative in a meaninful way.

>Verdant, auburn, laurel, emeraldine, colorless, colossal, grandeur, twinkling, jovial, gallant
These words are vivid, they evoke hues, images, sounds and shapes but do not push the narrative forward

"Elegant" prose is reached when you're able to transcend words from the 1st group up to the 3rd group, that is- taking words that are simple and making them vivid. How? Rhythm, rhyme, assonance, alliteration, consonance, pacing and tempo.

>Auburn things had dangled from the towers coating verdant pastures.
>He left before the minute-hand had skipped over the other one, and the home was empty after that.
>Yellow wasn't colorless and laurel was not black so I had him send the wallpapers back.
>She was crying inconsolably. I would ask her to stop, but the blade had me pacified.
You can get an image from these sentences of exactly what the scene is like, you don't even need context clues. Compare that to:

>Burning auburn leaves monkey-gripped the branches above, which glued themselves to barking colossal structures fixated on pastures of emeraldine.
This sentence isnt too bad, its more wordy, and lacks the rhythm and simplicity from the earlier sentences, but it vividly paints the image of a tree on plains and carries the narrative along by traveling down the tree with each description so it serves it purpose. And then:

>Shades of burning auburn glanced themselves on roughened outstretched wooden spoons. Streaks of bark trickled jovially to a magnanimous expanse of verdant emeraldine blades that twinkled in sunlight.
This sentence is worse than above. It struggles so much to paint imagery in the reader despite the excessive use of vivid words, it actually degrades the vividness of the words used. If you think about it, you can eventually figure out it is describing a tree, but the best sentences don't require a lot of thought to decipher their meaning. It also forces more work on your tongue- most readers do some vocalization as they parse the text. There's no pacing, it all feels brushed over almost, lacking emotion or feeling, and it's noticeable because the words betray the author's intent.

>>16711460
>>16711171
Meant to reply to
>>16711620
My bad

Does writing help get hatred out of your heart?
Or does it henhance it?

>>16712192
yes

>>16711620
not him but thanks, i appreciate this

>>16705483
Your prose feels wooden and rather purple. Don't go out of your way to use "smart" words and dwell on actions a little bit longer. You want to describe things, not recount them

How did the chicken fly?
It was henhanced.

>>16712229
i hate that i started to laugh at this kind of shit ironically but i'm now really fucking enjoying it

>>16712216
Which one?

Can anyone recommend me some romance novels to take as reference? I want to write a commercial love story since it looks like it should be the easiest thing to write, but I have no idea how to describe love.

>>16712358
Anna Karenina if you love cheating whores.

>>16712370
What about fluffy love stories? Any recs?

>>16705483
The sentences feel too long. The word choice is fine but everything feels too drawn out

>>16712358
The Princess Bride
Valentina by Evie Blake

>>16712358
uhh basil and josephine?

>>16710086
>Scrivener
I would but I'm not paying and I can't find a crack, so it's Word for me (which is stupidly easy to pirate).

>4.5 hours
>150 words

>>16713272
Post 'em.

>>16712421
What's the aversion to paying?

Every time I start working on a new project something odd happens to my brain; I start becoming self-conscious about the language I use in every day life, both in the academic realm and for my own purposes, such as this very post. Right now I'm typing as fast as I can as a way to reassure me that I'm not going to lose the ability to write. It's fucking weird, as if now that I'm in the process of creating something completely unprompted and deeply personal I fear that some divine power is going to take away my ability to realize it.
Has anyone ever experienced something like this, or am I just a special brand of neurotic? I need some reassurance, for fuck's sake.

>>16713428
Not him, but having less money than I used to causes makes me uncomfortable.

>>16713272
It took Flaubert something like 2-3 months to write one particular scene in Madame Bovary
Your pacing may and will vary

>have time and desire to write
>just finished a chapter that I'm happy with
>out of mental energy and ideas to continue

>>16713521
Take a break; you need to replenish your creative juices. However, don't rest for too long, lest they congeal too much. It's happened to me before; I was extremely satisfied with my first chapter, then took a breather and during that down time I began to grow concerned about how likely I was to let alone surpass that chapter's quality, but simply match it. Eventually I got too stressed out and quit.
Do not make the same mistake as me. If necessary, take a notepad and throw some ideas around, anything that seems like a logical continuation of what you've done so far. If one is bad, just think of another one. Eventually you'll stumble across one that doesn't seem that bad, and once you try to implement it you'll either realize that it's not going to work, or your creativity will become unleashed and allow you to keep on writing.
>tl;dr: Take a break from writing and try planning instead, then attempt to develop your plans to get your mojo back.

>>16713439
I haven't written any chapters out the past few weeks, I've just been planning/outlining
So yes I'm irrationally worried that when I sit down to write something out I will have forgotten how to do any of it

>>16713482
This. I read about that; the man was such a perfectionist and worked so hard on refining his novel till the point that it couldn't be told apart from a mirror that my expectations were so high that I impeded myself from enjoying his book.
Shouldn't have read that intro; gave me unrealistic expectations.

>>16710689
Yeah I agree tempo is bad, but you should know what circuitous means lmao

Interesting to see you misunderstand the "indigo figures" part, I was unsure of that part as well. This was my biggest takeaway.

I don't understand why I can't "drop" mysterious in an otherwise nondescript sentence?

Thanks for reading, but you seem a little angry for some reason.

Why do I always see people getting criticized for using words that are too uncommon? It's a fucking book, not the newest Avengers, there are things such as target audiences and who the fuck drops a book because they didn't know a word in it? If anything books is how I greatly expanded my vocabulary.

I'm a fucking ESL retard and most of the words I see people get flak for I'd consider maybe a 6 or 7 on the rarity scale. Do people on /lit/ not fucking read? No way in hell you've A) read books and don't know most of these words or B) read books and never encountered a word you didn't know and had to look up.

>>16713828
My guess is that those critiques stem from an idea of artificiality; that the author is trying too hard to sound wordy and give his text an appearance of greater importance or beauty. So, in essence, a complaint leveled against the author's intentions rather than the words themselves. That would be my most optimistic guess; in other cases I suppose your post would come closer to reality.

>>16712358
Romance is actually extremely difficult

>>16712358
Talk about biological reactions when the lovers are close to each other
>"his pupils dilated at the sight of her"
>"she realized she had been holding her own hands to keep them from shaking
>"his lips quivered for a second, and he hope she would not realize it

>>16712358
Why don't you write a genre you like and are interested in

>>16712358
Learn from life :)

Sometimes I think there's a bunch of genrefags in these threads and for my (or our) disgrace they seem to be the ones who mostly give and are giving writing tips. I can't afford to follow them. Look at this >>16710829. Seriosuly? Writing fast is better than writing well. I can actually afford that in english because english isn't even my first language, but but aren't these tips in the same vein as those who vomit words and try to redeem their vomiting?

I mean, how fast is "fast"? And wouldn't this approach give the writer more headaches to rewrite at the end of the project?

>>16713911
Lol

>>16713911
>Sometimes I think there's a bunch of genrefags
Well... yes.

>and for my (or our) disgrace they seem to be the ones who mostly give and are giving writing tips.
Why not just contribute with advice of your own, then?

>I mean, how fast is "fast"?
As reasonably fast as you may want.

>but but aren't these tips in the same vein as those who vomit words and try to redeem their vomiting?
I mean... yeah, that's what he was getting at.

> And wouldn't this approach give the writer more headaches to rewrite at the end of the project?
Not everyone writes or edits the same way. The "end of a project" is subjective at best; some may edit as soon as they finish a chapter and others might edit in, let's say, bulk. In which case yes, it might be overwhelming in that case. Sometimes I dread editing several chapters at once, but that assumes I decided to write several at once in the first place.

>>16713911
Every writer worth anything has to rewrite multiple times at the end of a project. The idea of inspiration is a lie, there are basically no established writers who don't admit about spending much much more time on edits later.
The idea behind writing fast is that it's the practical way to actually get into career writing whether you're in genre or literature. The biggest obstacle for most people is always actually writing. Having a rough draft provides far more to work with than not.

The romantic ideals of writing aren't dead, they've never existed except in the heads of those that'd rather think about writing than write.

>>16713788
Not that anon and I know what circuitous means but I don't think it fits in that sentence at all and it does seem incongruous with "yet".
There's nothing wrong with the word mysterious in that sentence, though I personally hate the word mysterious.
To be honest, I didn't really like it in general. But I liked the indigo figures line despite not really knowing what it meant. So it would be a shame to see that be the only thing that's cut.

>>16713954
For me, it is a very frustrating approach. I already tried it. There are vomits that are simply beyond editing. I end up in a spiral of infinite re-drafts instead of editing the first draft I made (i.e. I start from scratch several times) because there's no help to something so atrocious. I find it much more useful to make a good draft that serves as a basis for the rest. From my experience, if I write fast, and I can write fast, I write unreadable rubbish.

Anyway, what is editing for you, or how should I say, the editing process instead of writing process?

>>16713977
I'm not talking about inspiration. I'm talking about trying to write well at the first time even if without concerning yourself so much with it, and still edit to get an extremely polished work.

>>16714019
You really shouldn't have unworkable roughs if you've outlined

>>16704751
>want to write in English
>maybe feasible but I'm not on an Oxford-level
>want to write in my native language
>feels boring and stiff to read

Help a Germanbro out. In my country they say it's the language of poets and thinkers but I do not perceive it like that. I read fiction in its original language or translated into English rather than German. Did the internet spoil my brain and alienate me from my own fucking mother tongue? Do I just brute force English vocab and grammar into my brain until I can actually write a novel for a non-teenager audience? Or do I just bite the bullet and write in my own language?

Sorry for this weird question. Just checking if someone has the same fucking problem.

>>16714019
>Anyway, what is editing for you, or how should I say, the editing process instead of writing process?
Editing for me is just fixing up issues that pops up in Grammarly and Google Docs. This is mostly ranging from minor things like hypens, comma inserts, chagnging tense usage, suggesting a missing word in a sentence, and so forth. I might skim over stuff and fix sentences if they're a little off in the process. In Grammarly, once all the regular stuff is sorted out it highlights premium things it thinks isn't correct but it requires a bit of guesswork as a freemium user. Then after everything is said and done I publish the chapter.

>>16714019
I rewrite the entire book when I edit referencing the previous draft, reading out loud through as I go. Figuring out if entire blocks need to be reorganized or rearranged to make my point more clear and cutting out any words or sentences I don't like the sound of.

>>16714117
Your english is probably fine. You could always try writing the first chapter or a scene in both languages and see where that takes you. Also having another language could benefit you in the way that you can implement german into the english writing.

>>16713977
>the idea of inspiration is a lie
Well hold it right here young man. 90% of the cupcake is baked batter but it's nothing without the icing and decorations. You can be the best writer and editor in the world but if you have no original ideas it's the most eloquent bland shit you will bring to paper. I will concur with you on the need to rewrite most authors fail here because they are lazy pieces of shit which is just basic human nature I guess. You shouldn't romanticize writing but you also shouldn't treat it like a mechanical process.

>>16714168
>writing a scene in both languages
Well now that didn't even occur to my lazy stubborn black-and-white-thinking ass. I thought about translating the thing in the end when it's finished but yeah I might try that. Thank you.
>implementing german into english
might be interesting for some niche fiction. Maybe derivate a conlang from german in a fantasy setting.

>>16714170
I prefer my cakes and cupcakes plain desu. At parties, I scrape the icing off

Appreciate any advice on how to improve this opening. It feels flat to me.

>>16714011
Well "indigo figures" refers to the moon and wind acting on the grass, which I mentioned in the sentence before. I reckoned it might've been too far a leap, as well as incongruous compared with the plainspoken style elsewhere.

But yeah I was partial to that phrase as well.

Any of you guys write/publish web novels? Where do you post them? I'm on RoyalRoad but it's plagued by isekai and cultivation stuff, and all the other ones I've tried have been shit.

Looking for some feedback on this. When writing this I tried to make it read in a hectic and chaotic manner to mirror what was happening in the scene, while also keeping it actually readable.

>>16715239
Several dozen of us publish on Royalroad—or did, anyway. Two of the other regulators haven't updated theirs in a few weeks sadly. There's an ESL who was publishing his on Wattpad, but he gone radio silent after a few of us gave him some tough love critique.

>>16715273
Is it okay to shill your Royalroad story in /wg/ or it's generally frown upon here?

>>16715291
Also kinda curious about this desu.

>>16715291
Most of us did at some point. There's really no rule against it for the most part. But if you ask me, I think it's an unspoken rule not to post it too much because it can be annoying. I personally spoiler-tag links so people can skip it if they want to.

Is there any point in using third person limited over first person? The former is just the latter with different pronouns.

>>16715291
no reason not to shill it, here and there. people are generally interested in reading what you're writing. just don't be too obnoxious about it

>>16715333
maybe if you have a narrator voice separate from your character

Hey /lit/, I'm making a book about a consoomer reborn, and was wondering if you might have any advice for his character portrait?
Obviously the portrait will be painted with the colors of the the media he consumes, so I want to get this right. I don't need a list of everything he'll consume, but some of my sources so far are:
> comic books and superhero movies (I can do these pretty easily)
> common to semi-vague anime references (Nothing too niche, I know nothing about these beyond the most casual, I'm not a weeb)
>Rick and Morty, and other adult-targeted cartoons
>Music artists? (which music artists are consoomer? My gut says Lady Gaga, Taylor Swift, and Ariana Grande)
> Video games (I know to hone in on Nintendo for current generation and for the retro games)
> Books (Queer/feminist theory, loves marx, Foucault (because he was gay), whatever the fuck Michelle Obama and Hillary Clinton spit out this month)

Am I missing anything?
My delivery strategy is to demonstrate his magnitude and direction of consumption through the artifacts of consumption in his bedroom so that I remove his portrait from any interior personality.

>>16715738
Warhammer figurines, minecraft, magic the gathering

>>16715948
ooh. magic the gathering. That's a good one, but I might have to go with Yu-gi-oh to tie it better into his anime hobby but card collecting, that is a fantastic suggestion.
Warhammer figurines is good, but if I'm creating the ultra consoomer then he wouldn't be doing any roleplaying/strategy games on his own, he would be watching them on youtube, but that was an avenue I hadn't even considered. I suppose he could be collecting him for the day in the far off future where he finally used them
I did start to consider minecraft after my last post, and you just confirmed my suspicions. Thank you for the feedback!

>>16714921
I liked it. Maybe will come back to it later to see what can be improved. A big one you can do is not write from the POV of a woman

>>16716001
Muisc: its gotta be videogame soundtracks, top 100 charts, and whatever you find on r/hiphopcirclejerk

How do you guys feel about serialized stories? Crime & Punishment was originally serialized, right?
I've been thinking about how some of my favorite serialized stories would be better if they weren't stretched out due to their publishing circumstances.

>>16716074
Look literally a few posts above. We just talked about serialized and posting stuff here from likes of Royal Road and such.

>>16716074
>I've been thinking about how some of my favorite serialized stories would be better if they weren't stretched out due to their publishing circumstances.
of course, but it takes time to write things. beyond being able to get it out to you faster, the benefit of a serialized story is that audience feedback can be taken into account, which can propel stories in directions they may have never gone in without that feedback. the downside is sometimes shit spirals out of control

Why is "show, don't tell" such prominent advice. I don't get it. So much classic literature will just straight up tell you something to punctuate it, or to smooth over necessary but unexciting detail.

I've been doing my best to avoid telling for ages but I constantly have this feeling pulling at me that I could get a better result if I just got better at telling.

>>16716570
Dont tell doesnt mean dont say anything. It means when you're trying to make attempts at portraying things, rather than tell the reader the characters feel a certain way act a certain, show it. Dont say shit like

>Tom was tired from his basketball game so he didnt want to go.

Say

>Tom's muscles ached, and sweat pooled under his arms. "I don't feel going, man. I'm beat."

>>16716593
You can't just have your characters announce how they feel! That makes me angry!

>>16716593
I understand that. I explicitly mean, why is the first sentence considered such a problem? I feel like all I need to know is "Tom was tired" and that's all that should be written with regards to brevity and pacing.
When did "show, don't tell" become such prominent advice? If I open Hemingwary it's certainly not as if he was shy to just write how a character felt.

>>16716570
>She liked him alot.
Vs
>He'd catch her eyes glazing up and down his body during gym class.

>Tom was a faggot. He didn't think we knew.
Vs
>Tom would have guys in and out of his apartment all the time. Poor guy didn't know we had a security camera in the hallway.

>I hate cars. Like, really, really hate them, especially the sounds they make.
Vs
>You ever heard something makes you wanna rush to the nearest Home Depot, kill the guy at the counter, steal some rope, and hang yourself in a nearby field? I have. I call them "cars"

>>16716630
Its a problem because readers like to build imagery in their heads. Why is it so hard to get? Classics are called classics for a reason- theyre timeless. That doesn't mean you should put Thees and Thous in your writing just because Hamlet did, doesn't mean you have to use things like "he said." as your only dialogue tag.

>>16716641
I can understand show as a preference, my confusion is why the dominating school of thought leans so hard towards it. We have centuries of English literature written close enough to vernacular and most of them subscribe to a totally different philosophy, and they still read fine.

When did the literary world decide that tell was the devil?

>>16716653
Go re-read Hemingway and tell me with a straight face the dialogue scenes are fun to read with amazing snippets such as pic related

Again, classics are timeless. They stand as statues that are good to look at, but you don't then take away the idea to start using water and rope to cut limestone

>>16716665

>>16716674
That really is pretty funny

>>16716633
Your examples miss the whole point of "show, don't tell", which is to incorporate the relevant information in the story itself, and not step outside of the narrative to explain things to us separately in an ancient equivalent of a video game tutorial.

>>16705483
He walked over to his wife, who was a chair, without speaking. After a pause, he moved. His face appeared by some incommunicable desire, looking out through the window: the sight of men, stretched thin along crudely dlineated lines of faded dreams – the purgatory that lay beyond the reach of words.

>>16716692
>Anon's post was lengthy, and he seeked to gain relevance of his online persona by typing up a string of words that left his reader lacking
Vs
>"Here's your fucking (You)"

>>16716697
>He walked over to his wife, who was a chair

Is James Clavell a good writer to take inspiration from
I love the way he uses omniscient pov

>>16716715
>Is James Clavell a good writer to take inspiration from?
No, some other writer is, who you neither know nor love.

>>16716698
>I'm angry and autistic

Ok, cool.

What is supposed to happen in the reader's imagination when a character in the story thinks something? Off-screen narration? A close-up of the character's face? Or do we, as readers, just know–all of a sudden–what a character is thinking; without hearing their thoughts or seeing "inside their head"? Are the character's thoughts like a soliloquy? or are the words merely a representation of abstract brain activity? What is happening

>>16716821
They disconnect from the server

How far do you outline for short stories? I get the basic narrative structure down and just fill it in. Are there any more advanced, in depth constructions. Let me know soon, need to finish this or she’ll finally digest me.

The Weekend Novelist is really helping me, specially with plotting. I'm doing its exercises every night and it's really showing. In the beginning I had only vague ideas of what I wanted my novel to be about, but now I can have entire scenes are characters planned. Thanks for the recommendation, guys.

>>16710988
>In my story I have the core 6 + 10 side characters I have tons of development planned for.
Glad to hear this. I have a bunch of characters who I'd like to flesh out with around 3-4 "main" ones, but they'll likely be separate a lot of the time.

>>16710988
>>16710962

>start with a small cast
>1-2 new characters are added in every sequel
>suddenly you have a football team to manage in under 200k words
Looks like the story calls for mass murder

>>16713356
>She rose when everyone had started dreaming, picked up the board, and left for the shore. The rising tide was raking black twigs and black kelp onto the sand. The moon slashed like a knife and the water was as cold, but with waves crashing softly in the distance then dissipating into foam under her feet, she felt light. Then a breeze made her cut sting with salt — once again she saw the black expanse. She did not think about coming back.

>>16714921
Still really keen for opinions/ways to improve this passage, if anyone can spare the time. I've seen some really good insights in these threads.

>>16714921
>>16717229
Okay, so it's a passage about the life of Helen. It's fairly well told. The problem is, I don't care about Helen or her boyfriend (?). There are hundreds of millions of Helens out there. Where's the hook? Why should I keep reading?

>>16717225
That's 82/150 words, anon.

Few things I disliked though;
>raking black twigs and black kelp
It doesn't do very much for my imagination, and the repetition actually detracts from it. You could always try something like "Black twigs, and blacker kelp", or "Broken black branches, kelp, and other debris/refuse". Something just to make it more interesting.
>but with waves crashing softly in the distance
"with waves cutting softly in the distance" sounds better with the knife simile in the previous line.
>Then a breeze made her cut sting with salt —
Very stilted sentence. Try dropping 'Then', it doesn't add anything but a unnecessary harshness. "A brittle breeze made her cut sting with salt" or "The salted wind blew over her, stinging her fresh/recent cut"
>She did not think about coming back.
I like this line. Short, and straight to the point, while still being impactful.

Pretty good overall, keep up the good word.
I'm proud of you.

>>16717264
thanks bro you confirmed some of my suspicions. the second paragraph is utter shit so i omitted it

>>16717252
Thanks, so I should try and get more of a hook in the first couple paragraphs?

Japanese authors' prose really proves that simple but well places imagery beat overdone long ass descriptions of western authors. And I'm not talking about contemporary one but the likes of Dazai or Soseki. They wrote in such simple way that glances over details westerners would take pages to get across, all the while painting vivid images and people with amazing realness without the need of too much characterization.

>>16717326
Yeah. I'm not talking about any major fireworks or dark twists, just the vaguest hint of a deeper thought or a tangible goal, if you could convey the reader that, I'm sure it would work better.

>>16715263
>unlicensed pistols and submachine guns
i doubt you have the time or reason to care about the licensing (or type) of firearms during a tense, heated moment. i'd write "the gangsters pulled them out and aimed at...". note i omitted "began to".
>the room was suddenly a picture of chaos, a violent struggle
classic telling instead of showing. no need to say this. just tell us how the clusterfuck looks like.

there is also quite a lot of commas which really slowed down the pace and gave me too much time to think. try reducing them. also, punctuation.

>>16715333
i do this because i'm not confident enough to write in first person. it's fun, though.

>>16715738
>music
look at billboard top 40 from early to mid 2010s
>games
mobas (e-celeb worship), ftom multiplayers and mobile games. if he's also autistic, some MMO i guess
>books
look at the NY times bestseller list, especially the self help ones

what about sports teams?

My writing style tends to be influenced by whatever author I'm reading at the moment, and as a result different parts of my work end up shifting in tone a little too much for my liking. Does this happen to someone else?

>>16717732
I don't know about my style specifically, but I definitely get ideas and character stuff from things I'm reading. It's not always conscious either and I don't straight up rip stuff but I'd say it's fairly common.

>>16717446
I've added fortnite to the list of games he plays. MOBA's good, i didn't think of that, plus I can wedge in a little of Blizzard's politics into there.
During my investigations, I don't think he'll be into any sports. Sports represent hypermasculinity (to him), and our society's over-funding of that hypermasculinity.
I may make him a fan of the WNBA but I think I'll just have him complain about how they're underpaid instead.

>>16717732
It happens. This is why I don't read every piece of shit book out there, but mainly works that are similar to what I already write. All you can really do is just keep writing and solidify your style. When you have enough routine, you won't be so easily influenced by other stykes. But something always sticks.

So I finally posted my story on RR. I promise I won't shill it too much though.
It's genre fiction but criticisms are still appreciated. Just don't expect beautiful prose and such. Spoilered to appear less offensive to some certain people: https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/37188/covenant-sinners

>>16717176
Oh anon
thats the plan

>>16717972
>Hector of house Aeronwen, a knight of the Order of Oswald and faithful servant of King Ulric III, Queen Amelia had a reputation of acting unknightly.
I hate fantasy novels that start like this. This shit is completely unnecessary and we'll likely find out all these things later anyways. If you're so married to this style,

>Hector was immoral, not knightly at all, but he hid his failings well from King Ulric III and Queen Amelia. If House Aeronwen had known about his laviscious reputation, he'd be the first headless knight of the Order of Oswald.

>>16717972
>his personal kitchen
It's already personal if it's his
>seduced the noses of hungry knights
If it seduced them, we know they were hungry
>he whispered to the stew
No, he whispered.
>the bubbling pot
Why? An angry man waves a ladle...and they're afraid of the pot too? Zero sense
>caught the tempting aroma first and the whiteness of his hair second
??? What an odd sentence
>Eva with her keen eyes must have announced herself and others of his coming
So Eva told herself that Hector was coming? Or Eva told others that Hector and herself were coming? Makes no sense either way

That's it from me, too many grammatical errors and out-right confusing sentences, along with pretty terrible dialogue.

>“It was all weird business. Maybe it was hungry. The other one wasn’t a transforming type, fortunately, and went down quickly enough. Kroger dealt both final blows.”
>“Now that is something expected,” Hector exclaimed.

No one talks like this, and you don't need all these tags when we know it's only two people speaking.

>"Well, I thought it looked hungry. Maybe the other one would've transformed as well, given some time, but Kroger would have none of that. They went down quickly enough."
>"Weird."

I'm doing a yuri harem for Nanowrimo

>almost all new books in your country are fucking crime stories about murders or other retardation
I fucking hate crime stories so much holy shit
Even most magazines are about fucking crime stories, horrors and some about fantasy, nothing else, only this shit, I've had enough, I FUCKING HATE CRIME STORIES

>>16718656
Fellow Nord?

>>16718656

>pick up a crime story
>expect some modern day sherlock holmes
>or at the very least general police work, investigations and shiet
>crimes are actually just background to some lameass single parent drama and love affairs

>>16718656
What /do/ you want?

>>16704787

I switch tenses at random without even noticing

>>16706336

>space ship

dropped

I'm trying to write a simple slice of life story about students at a magic university. It's just a pet project and not going anywhere, but my autism won't allow me to simply write scenes without understanding the setting.

To begin with, why would they teach magic at school? They don't talk about this a lot in fiction. Where would the society need mages? What kind of a job is a wizard? Does anyone need a magic plumber? Does magic have any real utility outside hospitals?

Guess war is the easiest, most engaging goal? Then who are they fighting against? Who or what could pose a convincing threat to people who can use magic? Another country with magic? Wouldn't magic work as a deterrent, like nukes? Would you really start a war with somebody who has lots of wizards? Why? Nothing seems sensible. What isn't a complete cliche? I'm really drawing a blank here.

>>16718866

Sometimes when I write I'll know full well there's a plot hole but just ignore it and hope no one thinks about the subject too deeply.

99% no one will think to ask those types of questions unless you bring it up in the text yourself

>>16718866
I wanted to give you an idea but just realised it's so smart and genius that it would be better if I leave that for myself :D

>>16718866
engineering

>>16718891
Well, with the stuff I've posted online, I've noticed readers question absolutely fucking every little thing that I didn't make completely foolproof. There's always some turbo nerd who thinks about these things and tries to act clever. I guess it's a sign they take the story seriously and I shouldn't complain.

And I hate it myself if it doesn't make sense in my head. If you leave a hole in one place, you may find the whole shit falling apart when you least expect it.

I've been writing for 7 years at this point and I haven't been able to find my genre, it feels like I'm just skimming the waters. How the fuck do I find a genre I like enough to just write in it?

>>16718929

Thats because when you post your stuff online you're asking for critique on it, which means people approach it with a different mindset than an actual reader who's reading for pleasure.

>>16718929
>There's always some turbo nerd who thinks about these things and tries to act clever
people like this are based
I want to be thrown into shit to git gud instead of hearing how good I am

>>16718898
Very funny. Like I said, this isn't going anywhere, though, so there's no reason why you still couldn't use it yourself.

>>16718907
I like how Mahouka handled magic, but I'm going more for the Dr Strange feel with this. More occult, less science.

>>16718940
Why pigeonhole yourself?
Write what interests you, and make it the best you can.
Or just paint-by-numbers it and create more YA-trash.

>>16718977
It's based when they have a point. Not so much when they're just trying to nitpick on shit they should've figured out on their own, if only they thought about it a little more. It sucks if I have to explain stuff I specifically didn't want to explain, assuming it too obvious for words.

>>16719021
Yeah I was talking about normal critique instead of being a retard who tries to feel better by posting shit

>>16718940
Why should you? There's no law saying you have to choose just one.

>>16719032
It may be normal critique to them. Just not everyone has IQ of 400.

Starting to write but too many ideas to pin down to a page
Less of a "so many good ideas woe is me" but more of a disorganised mess of shit I don't know what I'm keeping or throwing

Thought I could just write it but tripped over my own shoelaces so back to the drawing board

>>16719033
>>16718993
If an author writes fantasy for twenty years , how can someone who just does "everything" compete with them? Forget fantasy specifically, it's just, isn't any specialization into one area going to surpass someone who just writes everything?

>>16718866
>To begin with, why would they teach magic at school?
Maybe untrained mages cause all sorts of trouble. So rather than having wild magic going off here and there they've developed a curriculum to systematize magic, while simultaneously trying to instill virtue in the students. Cuts down on both wild mages and renegades, gives people a sense of place and purpose.

>>16719183
because fantasy is less a genre and more a location. a fantasy story will still have to have a logical plot, compelling characters, well written dialogue, etc. is it interesting to read about a party fighting a group of goblins? maybe in small doses. the real things that interest readers are the interactions between the party members, the reasons they're doing what they're doing. and their goals for the future. a romance story in a fantasy setting written by a romance author could easily be 100x better than a romance story in a fantasy setting written by a "fantasy" author.

>>16719302
That's true, you're right.

>>16705483
Cormac McCarthy is right about commas.

>tfw 42k in

The story went in a totally different direction than I expected. No plotting, I just let the chars loose in the world and it flows out like water.

I've had days where I lost confidence and pushed through until it came back together. There are some loose ends and it's a bit messy, but I will just rewrite until it's tidy and builds the theme.

It's funny how your brain works it all out for you as you push through.

GIVE ME YOUR ENERGY
I HAVE TO WIN MY DEBUT

>>16719619
No. Suffer in darkness.

>>16719537
Absolutely based, anon. Congrats on the work so far. That's the kind of thing people who sit on ideas without doing anything with them don't understand. The effort of actually writing works out a lot of the problems with making a story. It doesn't (and won't be) perfect in the first draft, and that's okay.

>>16719183
It's not like there is some "fantasy stat" that you have to level up. All writing improves writing, and someone who has written forensic drama for 10 years and war stories for another 10 might write a vastly better fantasy book than someone who has done nothing but dungeons and dragons for just as long.

>>16719230
That's one very under-explored angle that might produce interesting stories, specifically the combination of magic and ethics education. Definitely something worth thinking about.

>>16719439
McCarthy's a prude.
He's no John Updike!
I like those John Updike women. Those middle-aged, tan gals

>tfw just killed off a major character and now have to figure how to depict PTSD of the MC while the story slows down
I guess its a good thing it's been paced well so far, but fuck. I also need to ramp up the dialogue of other characters since the MC won't be speaking much. I don't feel like it writing it right now desu

>attempt to update American Psycho:

mMMMmhhhHhh... slack and limpid prose....... larping as a singer-songwriter in CURRENT yr....her sweaty THICC thighs in dark tights...MMMMHhh...FUCK....and her acne-scarred flat ASIAN face like the MOON.... and I'll be the first to set foot on those MOON-CHEEKS.........those bushy and manly eyebrows....BROWN turd eyes...pale death-tinged lips.....BIG nostrils.....FUCK I wanna cum on and inside every single place....then her hair in a tight BUN and wearing latex but not TOO slutty.....she's just so proud........FUCK and boot heel stilettos at least 10 in. HIGH and SHARP and she's standing over me....MHHHhhMmmmMmMMMM.... god letting me smell that WEIRD Asian pussy..........MPGHGHMMHhhHMPHhhHhHHh..........yeah that's just like Vietnamese hoisin FISH sauce but pungent as a pheromenic bug enters my nose only held separate from that PUSSY by nylon and LATEX..................GODDAMMIT......I'M COOOOOOOOOMINGNNGGG

After I am expended, Mitski wakes from the mist made from the dense vapours of our anxious sin. Droplets of filth glean on her skin, and trickle now and then on black latex. She is the jewel on the golden cup held by the whore of Babylon. She cradles my face within her swollen delta, the bower between her thighs, and squeezes. I am smothered, I am weak, and I struggle. But our used sheets are around all my limbs and are too heavy and I can't breathe.

Idea: what do you think of writing a short story and selling it for $0.99 on Amazon

>>16720483
I'd write more than one. Sell them in little bundles for 0.99. maybe 20-25k words per bundle.

>>16718588
If you are still here, thank you for taking your time to read my thing. But I don't quite agree with some of your point. Mind elaborate a little?
>If it seduced them, we know they were hungry
You have never wanted to eat something when you're not hungry?
>No, he whispered
?
>Why? An angry man waves a ladle...and they're afraid of the pot too? Zero sense
Uh yeah? Someone waving aldle then charing at you with a boiled pot is something I would not risk myself to take on
>What an odd sentence
They caught the smell, then turned and saw him who had white hair
>Eva with her keen eyes must have announced herself and others of his coming
Yeah agree with this, it's kinda retard
>No one talks like this, and you don't need all these tags when we know it's only two people speaking.
It's more to act as the beat of the conversation, I think it's better to overuse than under use dialogue tags. But fair point
>That's it from me, too many grammatical errors and out-right confusing sentences, along with pretty terrible dialogue.
I ran it through a grammar checking program first, but it seems there is still some mistakes. It's not easy for me to figure out though, since I though it was fine after editing. Maybe cuz I'm an esl

>>16716653
That anon doesn't know anything. "Show don't tell" became a mantra for, at least, commercial fiction because the editors saw that proses similars to Hemingway's sold more. Simple as that.

>>16716051
oh fuck. I didn't even think of lurking on reddit. fuck, alright, I got my next couple nights plotted out. thank you!

>>16717732
This exactly happens to me. I read Count of Monte Cristo and my writing improved ten fold.

How does Royal Road work exactly? Is it like Fanfiction.net?

>>16720758
upload stuff by chapter

>>16720701
Sometimes it's not so great. I read mostly old stuff which I imitated in my work (fantasy setting), then anons criticized my dialogue as "no one speaks like that" even when it's just how dialogues are in old school fantasy stuff like LoTR and such. Maybe simplicity and modernity is what sell nowadays. Reading old shit is more harm than good.

>>16720644
I don't have much more to say bro. If you can't see why your writing is trash, and I don't say that to rile you but it really is, then you need to read more books.

>>16720827
Uh okay, thanks for nothing I guess? If I already knew the reason my writing is trash (not saying it isn't) then why would I ask for criticism in the first place?

>>16720925
I gave you criticism and your response was basically
>but anon, im a good writer! I know im good! Heres why im good and you're wrong!
As I said, your writing sucks and I gave you examples of why, and you turn around and spit in my hands and try to gaslight me into thinking it's not shit. The problem isn't that no one gave you criticism, it's that you can't take it
Now fuck off

>>16719887
>>16719230
LOL no. That's just Shin Sekai Yori, literally.

>>16716001
He buys the figurines just to paint them and put on a shelf with an army he never plays.