/lit/ - Literature

https://voca.ro/15uJgd6TgiSR

>>16439871
ur a faggot. im right wing and ur a faggot. stop larping.

>>16440354
Based.
Most fascist on 4chan are larping faggots who look like pic related and haven't read a book in their lives, and I say that as a fascist sympathizer.

>>16440370
It's not wrong to be weak, but it *is* wrong to stay weak when you could train yourself.

Also I really like Giovanni Gentile, any recommendations from him other than the usual ones?

>>16439871
Reminder that Fascism is a stunted form of true Traditionalism.

>>16439871

The Anatomy of Fascism is the best intro academic work I've ever read on the topic. Most of the work from the last decade or so is shit because of biases and current events.

>>16440595
Shit chart. Least of all stage four should be describing capital T Traditionalism rather than monarchist larp.

BAP book semi-ironically

Fascism is essentially the Bronze Age Mindset applied to a unified people, rather than political wonkery. It should be a spirit animating a nation rather than fapping over economics or geopolitics imo.

Though desu I think vitalism is a much better name for this, fascism has been totally tainted as a term by now

>>16440886
>Fascism is essentially the Bronze Age
No it's not.

>>16440620

Paxton is a fag and presents the subject negatively.

>>16440370
>and I say that as a fascist sympathizer
dangerously based

>>16440620
Gay. Paxton's is a fag, read Gregor.

>>16439871

>>16440354
You sound like one of those conservative cucks that are afraid of power. "Nooo we can't crack down on rioting niggers that would just bring us down to their level."

>>16441255
>Before his execution, Bombacci shouted out “Long live Mussolini! Long live socialism!” After his death, he was hung upside down at Piazzale Loreto in a public display, along with Mussolini, Clara Petacci, the head of the Republican Fascist Party Alessandro Pavolini, and others.
I hope all the communist partisans burn in hell

>>16441039

The thread asks for novels that are on fash. Not "novels that are on cash and don't hurt my feelings".

>Mussolinis Intellectuals
>Mein Kampf
>Fascism Viewed from the Right
>Imperium
>For My Legionaries

>>16440595
swap stage 2 and stage 1 and you have my political development, I never made it to stage 4 though because I'm not a christcuck (I'm kinda stuck between 3 and 4)

>>16439871
If you want to understand fascism as a modern ideology, you have to understand its relation with the modern idea of a philosophy of history.

As prolegomena maybe read up on Vico, Herder and Kant’s early formulations (New Science, Outlines of a Philosophy of the History and Man, The Idea of a Cosmo-political History) then the impact of the french revolution and then the meat and potatoes with Hegel’s ‘Lectures On The Philosophy of History’ and ‘Philosophy of Right’.

Both communism and fascism are hegelian in origin and this is the basis for understanding. There is also a common heritage in people like Sorel, Le Bon and Nietzsche (see ‘Uses and Abuses of History for Life’). For commie stuff, read left hegelians like Feuerbach, Engels, Stirner and Marx and their later disciples, for fascism read Croce, Gentile, Mussolini (which is Gentile ghostwriting), Hegel and Gentile really are the dudes to understand if you want to know ‘traditional’ fascism. Heidegger might be interesting too, see Dugin’s book on him for a fascist interpretation of Heidegger’s philosophy of history. For new ‘neo-fascism’, see Gramsci and Benoist. Here again you will see an overlap and kinship between commie and fascist concerns, cause they are both post-hegelian.

For the liberal response see Popper’s worls on the Open Society and Historicism. For the conservative alternative see Burke’s letter on the french revolution and Oakeshott’s essays on history. For the ‘traditionalist’ alternative, see de Maistre’s work on the french revolution and Evola’s books on fascism viewed from the right and riding the tiger. This is a modern politics 101 rabbit hole. Too lazy to make a chart.

If i’m a degenerate why should I support fascism? Can anyone tell me

>>16441271
Starace had a similar reaction to Bombacci upon being shown the executed.

>>16441626
So you can stop being degenerate
>>16441343
Actual good list

>>16441626
>>16441678
Fascism doesn't have anything to do with fighting "degeneracy" unless that "degeneracy is a lethargic weakness.
If you're a fag or if you sleep around or do drugs, it's not the same thing.

>>16440901
Futurism =! Fascism

>>16441283

Presenting fascism in a negative light is an emotional position. There are no logical arguments against it.

>>16441716
It is a lot closer to it than whatever bronze age pervert's philosophy is.
Marinetti authored the 1919 fascist manifesto.

>>16441678
Why should i stop being degenerate? serious question

>>16441697
Why do fascists hate fags and druggies and sluts so much then

>>16441697
are you retarded?

>>16441750
>Why should i stop being degenerate? serious question
You only should if you want your life to actually have meaning and depth. Otherwise, keep on doing what you've been doing.

>>16441750
>Why should i stop being degenerate? serious question
What do you mean degenerate? That doesn't mean anything. How are you a degenerate?
>Why do fascists hate fags and druggies and sluts so much then
It's not exclusive to fascism, and it isn't a requisite.
Most people who brand themselves as fascists don't know what fascism is.

>>16441758
no i think you are retarded and never read a fascist book in your life.

>>16441781
You'd be wrong then. Might try and actually read one for yourself before posting retarded takes.

>>16441767
My life does have meaning and depth, i do degenerate things but that’s not all i live for, you know? I’d get what you’re saying if i was a heroin addict with no friends living under a bridge but that’s not it

>>16441772
I do drugs drink smoke and have casual sex. moderately

>>16441796
Ok smarty pants tell me where in Gentile or any other fascist philosopher is critical of homosexuals and people who use recreational drugs.
Fascism is against passive lethargic weakness that leads to self destruction. It's not an inherent quality in anything contemporary so called """neo-fascists""" deem as degeneracy.

The first political party to have a cross dressing dyke as it's head was fascist

>>16441832
What drugs. Having casual sex is damaging to society but the damage is already done. It'd have to gradually be stopped.

>>16441857
speed and weed

it’s damaging to traditional societal structure but i don’t care for the society i live in right now and we’ve all already been atomized anyways

>>16441886
It's damaging to any type of society and it explains the current violence and incel epidemic. If you think it's bad now it will only get far more worse in the future. Womens lib was a mistake.
>speed and weed
If they inhibit you from exercising your will you should stop. If you just use it to wind down, it's whatever.

>>16441832
>My life does have meaning and depth, i do degenerate things but that’s not all i live for, you know? I’d get what you’re saying if i was a heroin addict with no friends living under a bridge but that’s not it
For the record, the logic behind the anti-degenerate stance is that it undermines your inner strength. You may pledge your mind and body to this or that, but specific desires will always have a certain level of control over you. That's the problem of the degenerate.
>>16441832
>I do drugs drink smoke and have casual sex. moderately
Most of those are bad for you, but it also depends on the manner of how you engage with them. Evola for example was ambivalent on drugs because he thought that under certain specific circumstances they could be used to the benefit of the spirit. He also disapproved of the Catholic-tinted bourgeois sexual morality of Italian fascism.

>>16441969
Drugs are tools, they should be used correctly. Evola wasn't fascist.

>>16441980
>Evola wasn't fascist.
Yes yes
"I'm not a fascist, I'm a superfascist"

>>16441927
But i don’t care about incels i’m fine just killing them all off or letting them kill themselves. Not to be edgy but it’s not my problem

>>16441980
Fascism changed a lot in italy from 1919-1945.
What elements was he critical of?
>>16441969 talks about the bourgeois sexual morality evola was critical of but that wasn't really part of the doctrine until Mussolini took a more reactionary approach, much to the dismay of other early fascists.
Has anyone read pic related? Thoughts? Worth the read?

Very highly recommended
please read it

A very deep going view into the world-view of nazism from their own eyes. Not being "pro-nazi", but still accepting all that they say in writings, articles, books, speeches from legitimate intellectuals and educated people responsible for these, both well-known and obscure, to "get" the thinking behind it.

>>16441997
>put on trial for being a fascist in a time being a fascist was illegal
>somehow gets released
Superfascist is a mistranslation. He said he was a "supra" fascist meaning over or beyond.
>>16442008
In the corporate state, everyone is your problem. Everyone is connected. We are all part of an organic system the same way the cells in your body are.

>>16441997
t. peabrain that has also never read evola

>>16442034
>thread about Fascism
>posts nazi shit
I like nazis. They're not fascists.
Nazism is romantic, fascist is modernist.

>>16442068
Just thought Id sneak in a recommendation here :)

>>16442017
I'm the second anon you mentioned, I've read it. It's a good read. That and Notes on the Third Reich are wonderful right-wing criticisms of the two great fascist regimes. The texts also let you get a better feeling for Evola's actual political opinions, which are less visible in his other works.
Fascism Viewed From the Right makes some very intuitive and powerful critiques that are hard to disagree with. Evola mainly targets the "reactionarification" of fascism towards bourgeois values, the dilution of the fascist vanguard party into a mass party, the lack of revolutionary fervour with the leadership and the absence of original, rigorous and truly "Roman" ideas. In regards to the last point he specifically took aim at some "fascist" institutions which were actually non-political, like the centre of Roman studies that the fascists founded, as well as the merely visual transformation of some old liberal institutions.

>>16442034
>as a nazi
ffs was it so difficult to change it to 'as a national socialist'

>>16442042
>Superfascist is a mistranslation. He said he was a "supra" fascist meaning over or beyond.
That's what "superfascist" means in English as well, anon. Also, he "somehow got released" because he was innocent of every single charge they brought against him lol.
>>16442047
I've probably read a lot more Evola than you desu.
>>16442068
Nazism has a wide range of influences and only certain parts of it are "Romantic". Is Himmler's SS "Romantic"? What about the Nazi labour movement?

>>16442123
Ok you are correct i should have not put all of natsoc under Romanticism, i just think of it that way exoterically. You get deep enough it's an off shoot of hindu spirituality.

As for evola I just thought of him more as a Traditionalist than a fascist unless you think the two are not mutually exclusive. But between him and guenon he is obviously the more "modern" one.

Also how do you define fascism? Thx bb.

>>16442188
>As for evola I just thought of him more as a Traditionalist than a fascist unless you think the two are not mutually exclusive.
Though they are not mutually exclusive, Evola was indeed a Traditionalist first and foremost. He was very sympathetic to fascism and played a larger historical role in the Italian and German movements than he is typically credited with, but he had his reservations about their populist character, which is what stopped him from joining the Italian Fascist Party.
>Also how do you define fascism? Thx bb.
The academics can't agree on any universal, abstract definition of fascism. I think the best way to put it is "social revolution from the Right". A bit Schmittian, perhaps, but also accurate IMO - it explains why so many different groups of broadly right-wing dissidents can relate and interact with fascism.

>>16441343
Thank you, anon.

>>16442120
its only on the cover, though
Its a french book originally

Does anyone know if Pierre Drieu La Rochelle's "Gilles" was ever translated into English? I read about it in Gottfried's "Fascism: Career of a Concept," and it sounded fascinating. I am a humble burger who only speaks English and some Spanish.

>>16439871
Reminder: There are no fascist arguments against lolisexuality <3

>>16442776
I don't think many people are likely to have the answer to that question, anon. Have you looked?
>>16442803
Fuck off retard

>>16439876
alright

>>16440419
Yes, Hegel.

>>16442803
you're right
>>16442854
he's right, retard.

>>16439871
A. James Gregor's Mussolini's Intellectuals
H.S. Harris the social philosophy of Giovanni Gentile

>>16442854
Indeed I have, to no avail. Maybe I'm not looking hard enough or smart enough. Was curious if /lit/ was familiar enough with it to know definitively.

>>16442897
I said fuck off retard
>>16442924
It's a very niche topic. You could try to inquire with a major library or some sort of curation office? They should be able to tell you if there is a good English translation. I know for a fact that some British intellectuals have commented on La Rochelle's work and not in a purely polemical manner, too, so I believe his work still enjoys a certain degree of prestige. He was a major author prior to the French postwar purges.

>>16442229
>sympathetic to fascism
>hate syndicalism
>reject corporatism
>hae nothing but contempt for populism and the national heroic myth
>disapprove of hierarchy/totalitarianism if it is not grounded in cosmic meme blood

>>16442995
>I said fuck off retard
you are a retard with no arguments and you're also an oversocialized faggot.

>>16442995
That's a good suggestion, anon. I'll give that a try. I have seen him discussed in dissertations and books before (I already mentioned Gottfried), but I've only ever seen the French cited. It really is too bad it's so niche because of his collaborationist moniker. As you said he was a major figure, and it's a shame his work isn't more widely available. Given the Jünger revival, I wonder if there might be any similar energy towards La Rochelle. Obviously he is quite different, but they have their similarities as WWI vets who were dissatisfied with communism and democracy.

>>16441857

She is very handsome. I think I love her.

Time to actually contribute, this website is a great resource for readings about Fascism, Italian Fascism in particular.

http://bibliotecafascista.blogspot.com/p/books.html?m=1

>>16443247
Damn, that's some good shit. Thanks anon. Will get to reading.

This is without a doubt my favorite fascist literature! Written by the Nazis. Fascinating.
https://iowaculture.gov/sites/default/files/primary-sources/pdfs/history-education-pss-WWII-surrender-source.pdf

>>16443247
Good link

>>16443006
>factually sympathetic to fascism
>loved the paramilitary movement
>didn't reject corporatism
>realised the contradiction between populism and heroism, purified the latter
>thought a hierarchical state shouldn't purify its elite rather than bother with the plebs
He was also not a "monarchist" except in the historical sense. I have no idea what you're on about.
>>16443028
Fuck off retard
>>16443109
It's likely that in the right circles he is still popular in France. They have a very robust intellectual culture on the far right there, completely unlike the rest of the Western world. It's inaccessible to non-French speakers though.

>>16443333
>victorian era feminists live rent free inside his head

Nationalist libertarian here, sorry guys I just don't like the state.

>>16443404
Fuck off retard, read actual history

>>16443333
Drieu La Rochelle is still widely published in France, it's one of the few things great left to this country, french literary circles are very open to controversial works. i wonder if this is not a direct consequence of WW2 which saw so many great writers going to the wrong side, like some kind of unconscious coping mechanism developed by people who didn't know how to deal with Céline's genius for instance.
Obviously he'll never be edited in the Pléaides.

>>16443333
I think I will be learning French then lol.

>>16443458
no, you read actual history retard.
"Age of consent" is a modern liberal construct and we've been marrying 12 year olds and under for all of human history.

>>16443496
>i wonder if this is not a direct consequence of WW2 which saw so many great writers going to the wrong side
No, it's the opposite - it's proof of how enduring French intellectualism actually is. The end of the Second World War saw a total purge of all factions to the right of strongman liberalism as advanced by De Gaulle. It's one of the reasons why the Fourth Republic was a lot more stable than the Third - less infighting. They deprived virtually every right-wing person of note from his office, status or position of authority. La Rochelle was one of the more egregious examples, alongside Brasillach, also.
>>16443499
I'd love to do that as well anon, unfortunately it's a very challenging language and I am already experimenting with studying another atm. Good luck to you!
>>16443511
You are not worthy of a response. Read actual history. 12 year olds used to marry 12 year olds. Betrothals were also not marriages. What some depraved burgers may or may not have done is irrelevant to the nature of the west. Stop being the way you are.

>>16440620
>>16441235
Paxton and Gregor are both trying to create their own version of fascism by picking and choosing different thinkers based on their personal biases. Paxton dismisses anything related to economics as being a load of smoke and mirrors, and Gregor writes off Marinetti and Evola as lunatics. Both try to emphasize the importance of their favored thinkers by linking them to Mussolini, but neither focus on the man himself.
If you want to understand fascism read what Mussolini wrote and look into secondary sources on the actual policies of the Italian government between 1922 and 1943. There's way too much cherrypicking when academics try to summarize fascism in a list of bullet points.

>>16443563
>12 year olds used to marry 12 year olds
>fathers bethrotted their daughters to boys with no assets.
you're actually stupid, and not even a fascist. Just a faggot.

>>16443333
>french intellectual culture

I speak some French, how do I get into this? It sounds interesting

There's this Reconquista Press book publisher that publishes nice stuff, mostly in French though.

In English, they published among other things the testimony of an Irish volunteer in the Spanish War (Eon O'Duffy : Crusade in Spain), and a substantial work of James Strachey Barnes, with a preface by Mussolini : The universal aspects of Fascism.
It seems quite good.

Their catalogue in French focuses on the work of contemporary fascist philosophers Joseph Merel and Jean Jacques Stormay, national-socialist and fascist or proto-fascist figures such as Arcand, Drumont, Petain, Codreanu, Primo, and Italian publications contemporary to fascism about the history of fascism (Volpe, Turati) and its compatibility with Catholicism (Misciatelli).

>>16443687
Thanks man, getting a surprising amount of good links and such from this thread.

>>16443641
Fuck off retard
>>16443679
Look up Dominique Venner and then see where that takes you, you should be able to find a lot of other guys like him easily. You can trace this all the way back to the immediate postwar years if you'd like to.

>>16443729
>gas no arguments
Pathetic

>>16443745
Not for you. Be grateful I'm not a jannie.

>>16440595
Can /pol/ fuck off from this board. We need to ban these threads on sight

>>16443786
That's not even a /pol/ tier infographic bro it's literally just shit.

>>16443786
>we need to ban literature threads
I think there is a place better suited to you

>>16443765
Jannies are gay, and you are too.

>>16443679
Can be of help for the French New Right, even if I don't really like their neopaganism (plus they're usually frilous when it comes to actual fascism and national-socialism.
They like reprobates in a very aesthetizing, pedantic way. That's why Venner was very fond of the overly westernized Mishima (who has qualities, but isn't that "Traditional") and very superficially into the cliché of the samurai who kills himself, which led him to his spectacular (far, far from the sobriety he should have used) suicide in Notre-Dame.
http://www.archiveseroe.eu/index-c18387321

>>16443729
Thanks anon

>>16443801
I would still rather be a jannie than be you.
>>16443804
You're welcome. Best of luck with your endeavours. Try not to lean too far onto the abstract side of things, since IMO the French overdo it a bit with the culture, bless their souls!

>>16440624
>monarchism, the system which humanity lived off of for 3,5000 years, isn't the most traditional of all systems
Hmm yes you're very intelligent

>>16443789
Cope, cringe, seethe you underage Fascist LARPer.

«Today the most myopic warns that the socialist ranks contribute to bourgeois stagnation, they are the most faithful guardians of political freedoms, those freedoms that benefit no one but the bourgeoisie. The most intelligent and fittest nuclei of the bourgeoisie were already understanding the need for a revolutionary mobilization that would liberate our time from the inefficiencies of the tubercular 19th century. At such a juncture, the socialist parties - backward bourgeois - revived the demoliberal deeds, recognizing as their goal the anachronistic battle of the old century. Today the socialists are liberals of the left, nothing else, and they have absolutely lost their revolutionary capacity.»

Dare I say, based?

>>16443851
wasn't entirely monarchism. Roman Republic, Athenian Democracy, Medieval European Feudalism, etc. Idk about Eastern countries but I assume there was variation there as well.

>>16440886
At last the braindead BAPist reveals his double-digit IQ.

>>16443687
Thanks Anon

>>16443786
Cry more you little fucking effeminate bitch. Maybe the jannies will come save you from the big bad fascists if you cry hard enough!

>>16443865
>Roman Republic
In the roughly 3,500 year span of recorded history it lasted only 500 years and it wasn't anything like a modern republic, it was ruled by the aristocracy that developed organically in-step with the monarchy.
>>16443865
>Athenian Democracy
Lasted less than 200 years before collapsing.
>Medieval European Feudalism
...was full of monarchies? Do you even know what you're talking about?

>>16443851
It's one thing to be a supporter of sacral autocracy, it's quite another to want to literally restore European monarchical institutions as they were exactly before the French Revolution. That latter part is the larp. None of the intelligent Traditionalists actually made that their aim.
>>16443855
Okay retard.

>>16443880
Feudalism was very decentralized for a while, to the point where it is necessary to mark the reemergence of strong central monarchies towards the end of the medieval. The Roman Republic, Athenian Democracy, and the Medieval Feudal system were very important periods in European history in important regions so they are worth mentioning as exceptions to the rule of monarchy. Not to mention that Republics returned by the 17th century so we have another few hundred years in the modern era.

>>16443880
>Medieval European Feudalism was full of monarchies
The powers and responsibilities of a feudal king were pretty different from those of a Louis XIV-style absolute monarch.

>>16443905
>it's quite another to want to literally restore European monarchical institutions as they were exactly before the French Revolution. That latter part is the larp
Shut the fuck up you underaged BAPist retard. According to your logic you can't aim for any past ideal because that would just be a LARP.
>>16443914
>>16443930
>bro just because the king has less authority it's totally a different thing and not monarchism because there's no sole ruler except there is but there's not
Read the learned advice I gave to the poster above.

>>16443943
Do you consider England a monarchy today? Because it technically is. Absolute monarchy never actually exists, so you have to look at how much power the monarch really has in a given situation.

>>16443905
>noooo you can't think the past was good you have to keep moving forward!!
Your peabrain on fascism.

>>16443947
I don't care how much you try to cope, thinking that monarchism and feudalism are two mutually exclusive terms shows clear as day you're a fucking retard.

>>16443949
Fascism just says "you can never go back to the past and you have to move forward", not "the past isn't good and can never be an inspiration".

>>16443866
post fizeek fag

>>16443954
They're not mutually exclusive, they are separate institutions which coexisted, I'm telling you that at one point the feudal structure mattered much more than the monarchy in terms of how things actually functioned.

>>16443943
>Shut the fuck up you underaged BAPist retard. According to your logic you can't aim for any past ideal because that would just be a LARP.
Amazing how your entire response is just wrong in every way conceivable. Yes, btw, if you want to bring back a dead institution exactly as it was when it died within conditions that are far more hostile to it today, you are a larper, a retard or both. Past ideals are one thing - past forms, quite another. Monarchy can be an inspiration, but not the goal. Ernst Junger had his flaws and his worldview was rough, but he had the right idea - history only goes forward and old ideas must manifest in new forms if they want to live a new life. Consequently, his conception of the coming state was autocratic, corporatist, nationalist and socialist. He did not aim at the restoration of the Kaiserreich, which would have been completely futile and also objectively regressive.
>>16443949
You don't have to keep moving forward, but history will and it will roll over you. Same shit with American conservatives today. But muh freeze peach! Muh constitution! Muh republic! You can't destroy my country! Oh noooo, too bad, that's exactly what's going to happen and you're going to roll over and let it happen because you don't have the guts to take a stance for an idea and a political form that is both traditional and adjusted to the temporal conditions.

>>16443789
>muh redpill

Stop gaslighting me you faggot it is clearly ancient /pol/ content. Youre an underaged newfaggot zoomer who recently discovered their first illiberal thinker and believes themself to be hot shit. Boring!

>>16444198
>"y-you don't understand, it's ancient /pol/ content it just triggers me!"
Don't care, fuck off lol no one has posted that shit on /pol/ in like the last 5 years.

>>16439876
what did he mean by this

>>16439876
>https://voca.ro/15uJgd6TgiSR
Based vocaroobro.

>>16439871
Were there Arab theorists of Facsism? And do African Fascism theorists exist?

>>16441343
Forgot the Nouvelle Droite authors

>>16440595
traditionalism can never work in modernity, thats why you ended up with step 1 conservatism

>>16443333
Man, I need names of authors, magazines, books

>>16443499
Dubs will it

>>16439871
I recently read Twilight over England by William Joyce and enjoyed it. The description of the jewish-anglo elite sounded very familiar. I think I will move on to his other pamphlets next.

>>16445461
Ba'athism and Gadaffi's Green Book respectively might be the closest you'll get, but to my limited knowledge neither were implemented fully nor have any real ideological lineage from Gentile or Mussolini.

I'm a hispanic person with a Mexican heritage. Any fascist lit for me?

>>16441857
You're retarded, the girl you posted is a total degenerate and you probably are too. She was ridiculed by all the real fascists in Britain (Mosley, William Joyce) and her party collapsed like the total joke it was.

You cannot have a national rebirth without a cleansing of the soul of every loyal citizen. I'm not saying "no fun allowed" I'm saying get rid of prostitution, drugs, homosexuals (most of these people can be converted). All those things are damaging to the nation and it only makes sense to purge them.

>>16445926
Books on Falangism? Although that's Spanish. I'm not really knowledgeable about fascism in Mexico.

>>16439871
When are you guys gonna find someone who can finally beat Destiny in a debate?

>>16446323
>She was ridiculed by all the real fascists in Britain (Mosley, William Joyce)
Ok, how did they ridiicule her? What was their criticism of her?
>You cannot have a national rebirth
Not fascism.

>>16447200
It's me, I can